ABOUT THE SPEAKER
Andrew Solomon - Writer
Andrew Solomon writes about politics, culture and psychology.

Why you should listen

Andrew Solomon is a writer, lecturer and Professor of Clinical Psychology at Columbia University. He is president of PEN American Center. He writes regularly for The New Yorker and the New York Times.

Solomon's newest book, Far and Away: Reporting from the Brink of Change, Seven Continents, Twenty-Five Years was published in April, 2016. His previous book, Far From the Tree: Parents, Children, and the Search for Identity won the National Book Critics Circle award for nonfiction, the Wellcome Prize and 22 other national awards. It tells the stories of parents who not only learn to deal with their exceptional children but also find profound meaning in doing so. It was a New York Times bestseller in both hardcover and paperback editions. Solomon's previous book, The Noonday Demon: An Atlas of Depression, won the 2001 National Book Award for Nonfiction, was a finalist for the 2002 Pulitzer Prize and was included in The Times of London's list of one hundred best books of the decade. It has been published in twenty-four languages. Solomon is also the author of the novel A Stone Boat and of The Irony Tower: Soviet Artists in a Time of Glasnost.

Solomon is an activist in LGBT rights, mental health, education and the arts. He is a member of the boards of directors of the National LGBTQ Force and Trans Youth Family Allies. He is a member of the Board of Visitors of Columbia University Medical Center, serves on the National Advisory Board of the Depression Center at the University of Michigan, is a director of Columbia Psychiatry and is a member of the Advisory Board of the Depression and Bipolar Support Alliance. Solomon also serves on the boards of the Metropolitan Museum of Art, Yaddo and The Alex Fund, which supports the education of Romani children. He is also a fellow of Berkeley College at Yale University and a member of the New York Institute for the Humanities and the Council on Foreign Relations.

Solomon lives with his husband and son in New York and London and is a dual national. He also has a daughter with a college friend; mother and daughter live in Texas but visit often.


More profile about the speaker
Andrew Solomon | Speaker | TED.com
TEDxMet

Andrew Solomon: Depression, the secret we share

Andrew Solomon: Depresija, tajna koju dijelimo

Filmed:
10,174,764 views

"Suprotno od depresije nije sreća, nego životna snaga, i životna snaga je ono što se činilo da curi iz mene u tom trenutku." U jednako elokventnom i razočarajućem govoru, pisac Andrew Solomon vodi vas do najmračnijih kutaka svog uma tokom perioda u kojem se borio protiv depresije. To ga je dovelo do putovanja širom svijeta koje mu je otvorilo oči. Intervjuisao je ljude sa depresijom da bi otkrio, na svoje iznenađenje, da što više govori, to su ljudi spremniji da pričaju svoje priče. (Snimano na TEDxMet.)
- Writer
Andrew Solomon writes about politics, culture and psychology. Full bio

Double-click the English transcript below to play the video.

00:15
"I feltosećao se a funeralpogreb in my brainmozak,
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"Osjetih pogreb, u svom mozgu,
00:19
and mournersožalošćenih to and froamo-tamo
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A Žalobnici uzvrzmani
00:22
keptčuva treadingmiješam, treadingmiješam tilldo I feltosećao se
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Gaze - i gaze - sve dok ne bi
00:24
that sensesmisao was breakinglomljenje throughkroz.
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Ko da moj um se probi vani
00:27
And when they all were seatedsedi,
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A kad su sjeli, svi,
00:29
a serviceusluga, like a drumbubanj,
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Obred je poput bubnja
00:31
keptčuva beatingpremlaćivanje, beatingpremlaćivanje, tilldo I feltosećao se
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stao da bije - i bije sve dok ne pomislih
00:34
my mindum was going numbnumb.
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Da moja pamet obamrije
00:37
And then I heardčuo them liftlift a boxbox
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A kada čuh da kovčeg dižu
00:39
and creakŠkripi acrosspreko my souldušu
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I kroz dušu mi škripe one
00:41
with those sameisto bootsčizme of leadolovo again,
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Iste olovne čizme, opet,
00:45
then spaceprostor beganpočeo to tollputarina,
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Prostori tada - stade da zvone,
00:48
as if the heavensnebesa were a bellzvono
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Ko da su sva nebesa - zvono
00:50
and beingbiće were an earuho,
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A biće, samo uvo samo,
00:52
and I, and silencetišina, some strangečudno racetrka
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Tišina, i ja, čudno pleme
00:55
wreckedUništio, solitaryosamljeni, here.
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Ovdje, brodolomno i samo
00:58
Just then, a plankdaska in reasonrazlog brokeslomio,
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Tad u Razumu puče Daska
01:01
and I fellpao down and down
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I padala sam niže, niže,
01:05
and hitudario a worldsvet at everysvaki plungeponiranje,
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Po jedan svijet zgodih svakim
01:07
and finishedZavršeno knowingznajući then."
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Uronom – i kraj znanja stiže".
01:12
We know depressiondepresija throughkroz metaphorsmetafore.
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Poznajemo depresiju kroz metafore
01:15
EmilyEmily DickinsonDickinson was ablesposoban to conveyprenosi it in languagejezik,
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Emily Dickinson prenijela ju je jezikom,
01:19
GoyaGoya in an imageslika.
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Goya u slici.
01:22
HalfPola the purposesvrha of artart
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Dio svrhe umjetnosti
01:24
is to describeopišite suchtakve iconickultni statesdržave.
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je da opiše takva ikonska stanja.
01:27
As for me, I had always thought myselfja toughteško,
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Sebe sam uvijek smatrao jakim,
01:31
one of the people who could surviveopstaju
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jedan od onih koji bi mogli preživjeti
01:33
if I'd been sentposlat to a concentrationkoncentracija campkamp.
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u koncentracionom logoru.
01:36
In 1991, I had a seriesserije of lossesgubici.
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Godine 1991 doživio sam nekoliko gubitaka
01:39
My mothermajka diedumro,
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Majka mi je umrla,
01:41
a relationshipveza I'd been in endedzavršio,
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veza mi je pukla,
01:43
I movedpreselio se back to the UnitedUjedinjeni StatesDržava
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vratio sam se nazad u SAD
01:45
from some yearsgodine abroadu inostranstvu,
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nakon nekoliko godina u inostranstvu,
01:47
and I got throughkroz all of those experiencesiskustva intactnetaknut.
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i izašao sam čitav iz svih tih iskustava.
01:50
But in 1994, threetri yearsgodine laterkasnije,
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Ali 1994, tri godine poslije,
01:53
I foundpronađeno myselfja losinggubljenje interestinteresovanje in almostgotovo everything.
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počeo sam gubiti interest za skoro sve.
01:57
I didn't want to do any of the things
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Nisam ništa želio raditi
01:59
I had previouslyranije wanted to do,
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što sam prije želio,
02:01
and I didn't know why.
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i nisam znao zašto.
02:03
The oppositesuprotno of depressiondepresija
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Suprotno od depresije
02:05
is not happinesssreća, but vitalityvitalnost,
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nije sreća, nego životna snaga,
02:08
and it was vitalityvitalnost
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i životna snaga je ono
02:10
that seemedizgledalo je to seepcuriti away from me in that momentmomenat.
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što se činilo da curi iz mene u tom trenutku.
02:14
Everything there was to do
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Sve što je trebalo uraditi
02:16
seemedizgledalo je like too much work.
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se činilo kao previše posla.
02:18
I would come home
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Došao bih kući
02:20
and I would see the redcrvena lightsvetlo
flashingBlijesak on my answeringodgovarajući machinemašina,
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i vidio bih crveno svjetlo kako bljeska na telefonskoj sekretarici
02:23
and insteadumjesto toga of beingbiće thrilleduzbuđeni to hearčuti from my friendsprijatelji,
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i umjesto da budem oduševljen da čujem prijatelje,
02:25
I would think,
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pomislii bih,
02:27
"What a lot of people that is to have to call back."
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"Koliko puno ljudi moram nazvati."
02:30
Or I would decideodlučiti I should have lunchručak,
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Ili bih odlučio da jeden,
02:32
and then I would think, but
I'd have to get the foodhrana out
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i onda bih pomislio, ali moram izvaditi hranu
02:35
and put it on a plateploča
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i staviti je na tanjir
02:37
and cutcut it up and chewžvakati it and swallowprogutati it,
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i izrezati, žvakati, progutati,
02:41
and it feltosećao se to me like the StationsStanice of the CrossKriž.
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i činilo mi se kao Križni put.
02:45
And one of the things that oftenčesto getsdobiva lostizgubljeno
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Jedna od onih stvari koja se često ispusti
02:47
in discussionsdiskusije of depressiondepresija
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u raspravi o depresiji
02:49
is that you know it's ridiculoussmešno.
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je da znamo da je smiješno.
02:51
You know it's ridiculoussmešno while you're experiencingdoživljavajući it.
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Znamo da je smiješno dok prolazimo kroz to iskustvo.
02:54
You know that mostnajviše people manageupravljati
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Znamo da većina ljudi uspijeva
02:56
to listen to theirnjihova messagesporuke and eatjesti lunchručak
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da sasluša poruke i jede
02:58
and organizeorganizovati themselvessami to take a showertuš
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i tušira se
03:00
and go out the frontfront doorvrata
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i izađe na prednja vrata
03:02
and that it's not a bigveliki dealdogovoriti,
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i to nije velika stvar,
03:03
and yetjoš uvek you are nonethelessipak in its gripgrip
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ali smo opet pod njenom kontrolom
03:06
and you are unablenesposoban to figurefigura out any way around it.
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ali ne možemo naći način da je izbjegnemo.
03:10
And so I beganpočeo to feel myselfja doing lessmanje
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I tako sam osjećao da manje radim
03:15
and thinkingrazmišljanje lessmanje
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manje mislim
03:17
and feelingosećanje lessmanje.
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i manje osjećam.
03:19
It was a kindkind of nullityništavilo.
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Bila je to vrsta ništavnosti.
03:22
And then the anxietyanksioznost setset in.
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A onda je nastupila anksioznost.
03:24
If you told me that I'd have to be
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Ako mi kažete da moram
03:26
depresseddepresivan for the nextsledeći monthmesec,
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biti depresivan sljedeći mjesec,
03:28
I would say, "As long I know it'llto će be
over in NovemberStudeni, I can do it."
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rekao bih, "Samo ako bude gotovo u novembru, onda mogu."
03:31
But if you said to me,
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Ali ako mi kažete,
03:32
"You have to have acuteakutni anxietyanksioznost for the nextsledeći monthmesec,"
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"Moraš imati akutnu aksioznost sljedeći mjesec,"
03:35
I would ratherpre slitrazrez my wristzglob than go throughkroz it.
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radije bih se ubio neko prošao kroz to.
03:38
It was the feelingosećanje all the time
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To je osjećaj svo vrijeme
03:40
like that feelingosećanje you have if you're walkinghodanje
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kao da hodate
03:42
and you slipslip or tripputovanje
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i okliznete se ili spotaknete se
03:43
and the groundzemlja is rushingbrzo up at you,
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i zemlja juri prema vama,
03:45
but insteadumjesto toga of lastingtrajanju halfpola a
secondsekunda, the way that does,
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ali umjesto da traje pola sekunde, kao obično,
03:48
it lastedje trajao for sixšest monthsmjeseci.
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traje 6 mjeseci.
03:50
It's a sensationsenzacija of beingbiće afraiduplašen all the time
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To je osjećaj stalnog straha
03:53
but not even knowingznajući what it is that you're afraiduplašen of.
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ali ne znajući čega se bojimo.
03:57
And it was at that pointtačka that I beganpočeo to think
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I u tom trenutku sam počeo misliti
03:59
that it was just too painfulbolan to be aliveživ,
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da je živjeti prebolno,
04:03
and that the only reasonrazlog not to killubij oneselfsebe
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i da jedini razlog da neko ne počini samoubistvo
04:06
was so as not to hurtboli other people.
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jeste da ne povrijedi druge ljude.
04:09
And finallykonačno one day, I wokeprobudio se up
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Najzad, jednog dana sam se probudio
04:12
and I thought perhapsmožda I'd had a strokemoždani udar,
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i pomislio da sam možda imao moždani udar,
04:14
because I layležati in bedkrevet completelypotpuno frozensmrznuto,
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jer sam ležao u krevetu potpuno zamrznut,
04:16
looking at the telephonetelefon, thinkingrazmišljanje,
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gledajući u telefon, pomislio sam,
04:18
"Something is wrongpogrešno and I should call for help,"
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"Nešto nije uredu, trebam pomoć,"
04:22
and I couldn'tnije mogao reachdostignuti out my armruka
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i nisam mogao ispružiti ruku
04:24
and pickpick up the phonetelefon and dialbiranje.
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da podignem slušalicu i okrenem broj.
04:26
And finallykonačno, after fourčetiri fullpun hourssati
of my lyinglaganje and staringzureći at it,
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Na poslijetku, nakon puna četiri sata ležanja i zurenja,
04:30
the phonetelefon rangzazvonio,
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telefon je zazvonio,
04:32
and somehownekako I managedupravlja to pickpick it up,
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i nekako sam uspio da se javim.
04:34
and it was my fatherotac,
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To je bio moj otac,
04:36
and I said, "I'm in seriousozbiljan troublenevolja.
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rekao sam, "U ozbiljnoj sam nevoji.
04:39
We need to do something."
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Moramo poduzeti nešto."
04:41
The nextsledeći day I startedzapočet with the medicationslijekovi
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Naredni dan počeo sam sa ljekovima
04:44
and the therapyterapija.
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i terapijom.
04:47
And I alsotakođe startedzapočet reckoningobračun
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Također sam počeo misliti
04:49
with this terriblestrašno questionpitanje:
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o ovim užasnim pitanjem:
04:51
If I'm not the toughteško personosoba
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Ako nisam snažna osoba
04:53
who could have madenapravljen it
throughkroz a concentrationkoncentracija campkamp,
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koja bi mogla preživjeti u koncentracionom logoru,
04:56
then who am I?
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ko sam onda ja?
04:57
And if I have to take medicationlekovi,
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Ako moram uzimati ljekove,
04:59
is that medicationlekovi makingstvaranje me more fullypotpuno myselfja,
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da li sam ono što jesam zbog tog lijeka
05:03
or is it makingstvaranje me someoneneko elsedrugo?
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ili neko drugi?
05:05
And how do I feel about it
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I kako se osjećam zbog toga
05:07
if it's makingstvaranje me someoneneko elsedrugo?
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što postajem neko drugi?
05:09
I had two advantagesprednosti as I wentotišao in to the fightborba.
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Imao sam dvije prednosti u toj borbi.
05:13
The first is that I knewznao je that, objectivelyobjektivno speakinggovoreći,
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Prvo je što sam znao, objektivno govoreći,
05:16
I had a nicelepo life,
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da imam lijep život,
05:17
and that if I could only get well,
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i ako bih samo ozdravio,
05:19
there was something at the other endkraj
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postoji nešto s druge strane
05:21
that was worthvrijedi livingživi for.
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zbog čega vrijedi živjeti.
05:23
And the other was that I had
accesspristup to good treatmentliječenje.
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Drugo je da sam imao pristup dobrom liječenju.
05:26
But I nonethelessipak emergedpojavila se and relapsedrelapsed,
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Ali svejedno stanje se poboljšavalo pa pogoršavalo,
05:29
and emergedpojavila se and relapsedrelapsed,
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i poboljšavalo pa pogoršavalo
05:32
and emergedpojavila se and relapsedrelapsed,
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i poboljšavalo pa pogoršavalo,
05:35
and finallykonačno understoodrazumljiv
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i konačno sam shvatio
05:37
I would have to be on medicationlekovi
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da ću biti na lijekovima
05:39
and in therapyterapija foreverzauvek.
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i terapijama zauvijek.
05:41
And I thought, "But is it a chemicalhemijski problemproblem
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Pomislio sam, "Da li je ovo hemijski problem
05:44
or a psychologicalpsihološki problemproblem?
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ili psihološki?
05:45
And does it need a chemicalhemijski curelek
or a philosophicalfilozofski curelek?"
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I da li zahtijeva hemijski ili filozofski lijek?"
05:49
And I couldn'tnije mogao figurefigura out whichšto it was.
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Nisam mogao da shvatim koje.
05:51
And then I understoodrazumljiv that actuallyzapravo,
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I onda sam shvatio da zapravo,
05:54
we aren'tnisu advancednapredno enoughdosta in eitherbilo to areapodručje
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nismo napredovali dovoljno ni u jednom području
05:56
for it to explainobjasni things fullypotpuno.
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da bismo objasnili stvari u potpunosti.
05:58
The chemicalhemijski curelek and the psychologicalpsihološki curelek
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I hemijski i psihološki lijek
06:01
bothoboje have a roleuloga to playigraj,
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imaju svoju ulogu,
06:03
and I alsotakođe figuredfigured out that depressiondepresija was something
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također sam shvatio da je depresija nešto
06:06
that was braidedpletena so deepduboko into us
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duboko upleteno u nama
06:09
that there was no separatingrazdvajanje it
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da se ne može otpetljati
06:10
from our characterkarakter and personalityličnost.
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iz našeg karaktera i ličnosti.
06:13
I want to say that the treatmentstretmani we have
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Želim reći da su liječenja koja imamo
06:15
for depressiondepresija are appallinggrozno.
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za depresiju užasna.
06:17
They're not very effectiveefikasan.
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Nisu baš uspješna.
06:19
They're extremelyekstremno costlyskupo.
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Veoma su skupa.
06:21
They come with innumerablebezbroj sidestrana effectsefekti.
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Imaju bezbroj posljedica.
06:24
They're a disasterkatastrofa.
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To je katastrofa.
06:25
But I am so gratefulzahvalni that I liveuživo now
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Ali ja sam zahvalan što živim sada
06:28
and not 50 yearsgodine agopre,
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a ne prije 50 godina,
06:30
when there would have been almostgotovo nothing
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kada se skoro ništa
06:32
to be donezavršeno.
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nije moglo uraditi.
06:33
I hopenadam se that 50 yearsgodine henceotuda,
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Otuda se nadam da za 50 godina
06:36
people will hearčuti about my treatmentstretmani
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ljudi će čuti za moje liječenje
06:37
and be appalledužasnut that anyonebilo ko enduredpodnio
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i da će biti zaprepašteni da je neko mogao izdržati
06:40
suchtakve primitiveprimitivna sciencenauka.
153
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2826
tako primitivnu nauku.
06:42
DepressionDepresija is the flawmana in love.
154
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4556
Depresija je mana u ljubavi.
06:47
If you were marriedoženjen to someoneneko and thought,
155
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3141
Ako ste vjenčani za nekoga i pomislite,
06:50
"Well, if my wifesupruga diesumire, I'll find anotherdrugi one,"
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3595
"Pa, ako moja žena umre, naći ću neku drugu,"
06:54
it wouldn'tne bi be love as we know it.
157
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3046
to ne bi bila ljubav kakvu poznajemo.
06:57
There's no suchtakve thing as love
158
405223
1950
Ne postoji ljubav
06:59
withoutbez the anticipationIščekivanje of lossgubitak,
159
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2644
bez iščekivanja gubitka,
07:01
and that specterspektar of despairočaj
160
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2584
i taj predosjećaj očaja
07:04
can be the enginemotor of intimacyintimnost.
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3729
može biti motor prisnosti.
07:08
There are threetri things people tendtendencija to confusezbuniti:
162
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2929
Postoje tri stvari koje ljudi brkaju:
07:11
depressiondepresija, griefTuga and sadnesstuga.
163
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3800
depresija, žalost, i tuga.
07:14
GriefTuga is explicitlyeksplicitno reactivereaktivne.
164
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3286
Žalost je izrazito reaktivna.
07:18
If you have a lossgubitak and you feel incrediblyNeverovatno unhappynesretni,
165
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2959
Ako ste nekoga izgubli, i osjećate se nevjerovatno nesretni,
07:21
and then, sixšest monthsmjeseci laterkasnije,
166
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1633
i 6 mjeseci kasnije,
07:22
you are still deeplyduboko sadtužan, but
you're functioningfunkcionira a little better,
167
430737
3222
i dalje ste jako tužni, ali sada malo bolje funkcionišete,
07:25
it's probablyvjerovatno griefTuga,
168
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1728
to je vjerovatno žalost,
07:27
and it will probablyvjerovatno ultimatelyna kraju resolverešiti itselfsam
169
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2292
i na koncu će se vjerovatno riješiti
07:29
in some measuremjeru.
170
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1449
do određene mjere.
07:31
If you experienceiskustvo a catastrophickatastrofalno lossgubitak,
171
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2751
Ako doživite katastrofalan gubitak,
07:34
and you feel terriblestrašno,
172
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1214
i osjećate se strašno,
07:35
and sixšest monthsmjeseci laterkasnije you can barelyjedva functionfunkcija at all,
173
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2997
i šest mjeseci poslije jedva možete funkcionisati,
07:38
then it's probablyvjerovatno a depressiondepresija that was triggeredpokrenuti
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2585
onda je vjerovatno depresija izazvana
07:40
by the catastrophickatastrofalno circumstancesokolnosti.
175
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2474
katastrofalnim okolnostima.
07:43
The trajectoryputanja tellskaže us a great dealdogovoriti.
176
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3632
Putanja nam govori mnogo toga.
07:47
People think of depressiondepresija as beingbiće just sadnesstuga.
177
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3358
Ljudi misle da je depresija samo tuga.
07:50
It's much, much too much sadnesstuga,
178
458439
2336
To je mnogo, mnogo, previše tuge,
07:52
much too much griefTuga
179
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1664
mnogo, previše žalosti
07:54
at fardaleko too slightblago a causeuzrok.
180
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2929
zbog previše nevažnog uzroka.
07:57
As I setset out to understandrazumijete depressiondepresija,
181
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2747
Kada sam krenuo da shvatim depresiju,
08:00
and to interviewintervju people who had experiencediskusan it,
182
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2835
i da ispitujem ljude koji su je iskusili,
08:02
I foundpronađeno that there were people who seemedizgledalo je
183
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3031
otkrio sam da ima ljudi koji se čine
08:05
on the surfacepovršine to have what soundedzvučalo like
184
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1705
na površini kao da imaju
08:07
relativelyrelativno mildblago depressiondepresija
185
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2062
relativno blagu depresiju
08:09
who were nonethelessipak utterlykrajnje disabledonemogućeno by it.
186
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3447
koja ih je svejedno potpuno onesposobila.
08:13
And there were other people who had what soundedzvučalo
187
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1858
A postoje drugi ljudi koji
08:15
as they describedopisano it
188
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1312
su opisali
08:16
like terriblystrašno severeozbiljna depressiondepresija
189
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2251
da imaju užasno tešku depresiju
08:18
who nonethelessipak had good livesživi in the intersticesinterstices
190
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2815
koji su svjedno vodili dobre živote u intervalima
08:21
betweenizmeđu theirnjihova depressivedepresivni episodesepizode.
191
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2155
između njihovih depresivnih epizoda.
08:23
And I setset out to find out what it is
192
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2685
I krenuo sam da istražim šta je to
08:26
that causesuzroke some people
193
494271
1603
što uzrokuje neke ljude
08:27
to be more resilientelastičan than other people.
194
495874
2253
da budu više otporni nego drugi ljudi.
08:30
What are the mechanismsmehanizmi
195
498127
1559
Koji su to mehanizmi
08:31
that allowdopustiti people to surviveopstaju?
196
499686
1844
koji omogućavaju ljudima da prežive?
08:33
And I wentotišao out and I interviewedintervjuisano personosoba after personosoba
197
501530
3169
Krenuo sam i intervjuisao ljude
08:36
who was sufferingpatnja with depressiondepresija.
198
504699
2175
koji su patili od depresije.
08:38
One of the first people I interviewedintervjuisano
199
506874
1951
Jedan od prvih koje sam intervjuisao
08:40
describedopisano depressiondepresija
200
508825
1881
je opisao depresiju
08:42
as a slowersporije way of beingbiće deadsmrt,
201
510706
3261
kao sporiji način od mrtvog stanja,
08:45
and that was a good thing for me to hearčuti earlyrano on
202
513967
2124
i bilo je dobro da sam to čuo na početku
08:48
because it remindedpodsetio me
203
516091
1366
jer me je podsjetilo
08:49
that that slowsporo way of beingbiće deadsmrt
204
517457
1999
da taj način
08:51
can leadolovo to actualstvarno deadnessTo će,
205
519456
2035
može dovesti do stvarnog mrtvila,
08:53
that this is a seriousozbiljan businessposlovanje.
206
521491
2004
da je ovo ozbiljno.
08:55
It's the leadingvodeći disabilityinvalidnosti worldwideširom svijeta,
207
523495
2659
To je glavna invalidnost širom svijeta,
08:58
and people dieumri of it everysvaki day.
208
526154
3030
i ljudi umiru zbog toga svaki dan.
09:01
One of the people I talkedpričao to
209
529184
1769
Jedna od osoba s kojima sam razgovarao
09:02
when I was tryingpokušavajući to understandrazumijete this
210
530953
1974
kada sam pokušao ovo dokučiti
09:04
was a belovedvoljeni friendprijatelju
211
532927
1668
je bila draga prijateljica
09:06
who I had knownpoznato for manymnogi yearsgodine,
212
534595
2018
koju sam poznavao mnogo godina,
09:08
and who had had a psychoticpsihotično episodeEpizoda
213
536613
2542
i koja je imala psihotičnu epizodu
09:11
in her freshmanbrucoš yeargodina of collegekoledž,
214
539155
1904
kao brucoš na fakultetu,
09:13
and then plummetedsu se pogoršali into a horrificužasno depressiondepresija.
215
541059
3056
i onda je pala u užasnu depresiju.
09:16
She had bipolarbipolarni illnessbolest,
216
544115
1426
Imala je bipolarni poremećaj,
09:17
or manicmanične depressiondepresija, as it was then knownpoznato.
217
545541
2643
ili maničnu depresiju.
09:20
And then she did very well
218
548184
2044
Onda joj je godinama bilo
09:22
for manymnogi yearsgodine on lithiumlitijum,
219
550228
1708
dobro na litijumu,
09:23
and then eventuallyna kraju,
220
551936
1375
zatim je
09:25
she was takenuzeti off her lithiumlitijum
221
553311
1960
bila skinuta sa litijuma
09:27
to see how she would do withoutbez it,
222
555271
1835
da bi se ustanovilo kako će joj biti bez toga,
09:29
and she had anotherdrugi psychosispsihoza,
223
557106
1975
pa je dobila novu psihozu,
09:31
and then plungedumočen into the worstnajgore depressiondepresija
224
559081
2338
i zapala je u najgoru depresiju
09:33
that I had ever seenviđeni
225
561419
1872
koju sam ikada vidio
09:35
in whichšto she satsat in her parents'roditelja apartmentstan,
226
563291
3015
u kojoj je sjedila u stanu svojih roditelja,
09:38
more or lessmanje catatonickatatoničan, essentiallyesencijalno withoutbez movingkretanje,
227
566306
3077
manje ili više katatonična, nepokretna,
09:41
day after day after day.
228
569383
2482
dan za danom.
09:43
And when I interviewedintervjuisano her about
that experienceiskustvo some yearsgodine laterkasnije --
229
571865
3217
I kada sam je ispitivao u vezi tog iskustva nekoliko godina poslije --
09:47
she's a poetpjesnik and psychotherapistpsihoterapeut
namedimenovan MaggieMaggie RobbinsRobbins
230
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3331
ona je pjesnikinja i psihoterapeut Maggie Robbins --
09:50
when I interviewedintervjuisano her, she said,
231
578413
3233
kada sam je intervjuisao, rekla je,
09:53
"I was singingpjevati 'Where' Gdje Have All The FlowersCvijeće Gone'Nema '
232
581646
3384
"Pjevala sam 'Where Have All The Flowers Gone'
09:57
over and over to occupyzauzeti my mindum.
233
585030
3210
iznova da zaokupiram misli.
10:00
I was singingpjevati to blotmrlja out the
things my mindum was sayinggovoreći,
234
588240
3135
Pjevala sam da izbrišem stvari koje je govorio moj mozak,
10:03
whichšto were, 'You' Te are nothing. You are nobodyniko.
235
591375
4490
a to su, 'Ti si ništa. Ti si niko.
10:07
You don't even deservezaslužuju to liveuživo.'
236
595865
2826
Ti ne zaslužuješ da živiš.'
10:10
And that was when I really startedzapočet thinkingrazmišljanje
237
598691
2178
I tada sam zaista počela pomišljati
10:12
about killingubistvo myselfja."
238
600869
2213
na samoubistvo."
10:15
You don't think in depressiondepresija
239
603082
1908
U depresiji ne smatraš
10:16
that you've put on a graysiva veilveo
240
604990
2137
da imaš sivi veo
10:19
and are seeingvidjeti the worldsvet throughkroz the hazemagla
241
607127
1980
i da gledaš svijet kroz maglu
10:21
of a badloše moodraspoloženje.
242
609107
1894
lošeg raspoloženja.
10:23
You think that the veilveo has been takenuzeti away,
243
611001
2720
Smatraš da je veo sklonjen,
10:25
the veilveo of happinesssreća,
244
613721
1922
veo sreće,
10:27
and that now you're seeingvidjeti trulyzaista.
245
615643
2424
i da sada uistinu gledaš.
10:30
It's easierlakše to help schizophrenicsŠizofreničari who perceivedoživljavaju
246
618067
2964
Lakše je pomoći šizofreničarima koji osjećaju
10:33
that there's something foreignstrani insideunutra of them
247
621031
1811
da ima nešto strano u njima
10:34
that needspotrebe to be exorcisedistjeran,
248
622842
2187
koje treba istjerati,
10:37
but it's difficultteško with depressivesdepresivne osobe,
249
625029
2164
nego depresivcima,
10:39
because we believe we are seeingvidjeti the truthistina.
250
627193
3847
jer mislimo da vidimo istinu.
10:43
But the truthistina lieslaži.
251
631040
2947
Ali istina laže.
10:45
I becamepostao obsessedopsednut with that sentencekazna:
252
633987
1998
Postao sam opsjednut tom rečenicom:
10:47
"But the truthistina lieslaži."
253
635985
2375
"Ali istina laže".
10:50
And I discoveredotkriveni, as I talkedpričao to depressivedepresivni people,
254
638360
2453
Kako sam razgovarao sa depresivnim ljudima, otkrio sam
10:52
that they have manymnogi delusionalsumanuti perceptionspercepcije.
255
640813
2682
da imaju mnoge obmanjujuće percepcije.
10:55
People will say, "No one lovesvoli me."
256
643495
1667
Ljudi kažu, "Niko me ne voli."
10:57
And you say, "I love you,
257
645162
1651
I ti kažeš, "Ja te volim,
10:58
your wifesupruga lovesvoli you, your mothermajka lovesvoli you."
258
646813
2522
tvoja žena te voli, tvoja majka te voli."
11:01
You can answerodgovor that one prettylepo readilylako,
259
649335
1923
To možete spremno reći,
11:03
at leastnajmanje for mostnajviše people.
260
651258
1665
barem za većinu ljudi.
11:04
But people who are depresseddepresivan will alsotakođe say,
261
652923
2267
Ali ljudi koju su depresivni će reći,
11:07
"No matterstvar what we do,
262
655190
1705
"Šta god da uradimo,
11:08
we're all just going to dieumri in the endkraj."
263
656895
2273
ipak ćemo umrijeti na kraju."
11:11
Or they'lloni će say, "There can be no trueistinito communionzajedništvo
264
659168
2203
Ili će reći, "Pravo zajedništvo
11:13
betweenizmeđu two humančovjek beingsbića.
265
661371
1653
dvoje ljudi ne postoji.
11:15
EachSvaki of us is trappedzarobljen in his ownvlastiti bodytelo."
266
663024
2576
Svako je zatočen u svom tijelu."
11:17
To whichšto you have to say,
267
665600
1849
Na što morate odgovoriti,
11:19
"That's trueistinito,
268
667449
1321
"To je istina,
11:20
but I think we should focusfokus right now
269
668770
1818
ali mislim da se moramo fokusirati na sada
11:22
on what to have for breakfastdoručak."
270
670588
1896
na ono što ćemo doručkovati."
11:24
(LaughterSmijeh)
271
672484
2185
(Smijeh)
11:26
A lot of the time,
272
674669
1669
Većinu vremena,
11:28
what they are expressingizražavajući is not illnessbolest, but insightuvid,
273
676338
2896
oni ne izražavaju bolest, već spoznaju,
11:31
and one comesdolazi to think what's really extraordinaryizvanredan
274
679234
2657
a ono što je stvarno izuzetno
11:33
is that mostnajviše of us know about
those existentialegzistencijalno questionspitanja
275
681891
2934
je da većina nas je upoznata sa tim egzistencijalnim pitanjima
11:36
and they don't distractodvratiti us very much.
276
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2290
i oni nam ne odvlače pažnju puno.
11:39
There was a studystudija I particularlynaročito likedvolio
277
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2159
Jedna studija mi se posebno svidjela
11:41
in whichšto a groupgrupa of depresseddepresivan
278
689274
1680
u kojoj grupa depresivnih
11:42
and a groupgrupa of non-depressedsobe depresivan people
279
690954
1901
i grupa nedepresivnih ljudi
11:44
were askedpitan to playigraj a videovideo gameigra for an hoursat,
280
692855
2623
su igrali video igru jedan sat,
11:47
and at the endkraj of the hoursat,
281
695478
1813
nakon jednog sata,
11:49
they were askedpitan how manymnogi little monstersčudovišta
282
697291
1651
upitani su koliko malih čudovišta
11:50
they thought they had killedubijen.
283
698942
1864
smatraju da su ubili.
11:52
The depressivedepresivni groupgrupa was usuallyobično accuratetačan
284
700806
2212
Grupa depresivnih ljudi je obično bila tačna
11:55
to withinunutar about 10 percentprocenta,
285
703018
2058
do oko 10%,
11:57
and the non-depressedsobe depresivan people
286
705076
1471
a grupa nedepresivnih ljudi
11:58
guessedpogađate betweenizmeđu 15 and 20 timesputa as manymnogi
287
706547
3545
je pogodila između 15 i 20 puta
12:02
little monstersčudovišta — (LaughterSmijeh) —
288
710092
1742
malih čudovišta -- (Smijeh) --
12:03
as they had actuallyzapravo killedubijen.
289
711834
4111
nego što su ih stvarno ubili.
12:07
A lot of people said, when I choseizabrao
to writepisati about my depressiondepresija,
290
715945
3066
Kada sam odlučio pisati o depresiji, mnogi su rekli
12:11
that it mustmora be very difficultteško
291
719011
1769
da mora biti veoma teško
12:12
to be out of that closetormar, to have people know.
292
720780
3124
saopštiti ljudima.
12:15
They said, "Do people talk to you differentlydrugačije?"
293
723904
2200
Oni su rekli, "Da li ljudi pričaju s tobom drugačije?"
12:18
And I said, "Yes, people talk to me differentlydrugačije.
294
726104
2072
A ja sam rekao, "Da, pričaju drugačije.
12:20
They talk to me differentlydrugačije insofarograničenja o
295
728176
1914
Pričaju drugačije tako što
12:22
as they startpočnite tellinggovoreći me about theirnjihova experienceiskustvo,
296
730090
2790
mi počinju pričati svoje iskustvo,
12:24
or theirnjihova sister'ssestre experienceiskustvo,
297
732880
1835
ili iskustvo svoje sestre,
12:26
or theirnjihova friend'sprijateljice experienceiskustvo.
298
734715
1774
ili iskustvo svog prijatelja.
12:28
Things are differentdrugačiji because now I know
299
736489
2292
Drugačije je jer sada znam
12:30
that depressiondepresija is the familyporodica secrettajna
300
738781
2681
da je depresija porodična tajna
12:33
that everyonesvi has.
301
741462
2077
koju svi imaju.
12:35
I wentotišao a fewnekoliko yearsgodine agopre to a conferencekonferencija,
302
743539
3628
Prije nekoliko godina otišao sam na jednu konferenciju
12:39
and on FridayPetak of the three-daytri dana conferencekonferencija,
303
747167
2653
i u petak tokom trodnevne konferencije,
12:41
one of the participantsučesnici tookuzela me asidesa strane, and she said,
304
749820
2891
jedna od učesnica me je odvela u stranu, i rekla,
12:44
"I sufferpatiti from depressiondepresija and
305
752711
3405
"Ja patim od depresije i
12:48
I'm a little embarrassedpostiđen about it,
306
756116
2769
malo me je sram zbog toga,
12:50
but I've been takinguzimajući this medicationlekovi,
307
758885
2103
ali uzimala sam ovaj lijek,
12:52
and I just wanted to askpitajte you what you think?"
308
760988
2948
i samo sam vas željela pitati za vaše mišljenje?"
12:55
And so I did my bestnajbolje to give
her suchtakve advicesavet as I could.
309
763936
2834
Dao sam joj najbolji savjet koji sam mogao.
12:58
And then she said, "You know,
310
766770
1720
Zatim je rekla, "Znate,
13:00
my husbandmuž would never understandrazumijete this.
311
768490
2791
moj muž nikad neće ovo razumijeti.
13:03
He's really the kindkind of guy to whomkoga
this wouldn'tne bi make any sensesmisao,
312
771281
2573
On je tip kojem ovo nema nikakvog smisla,
13:05
so I just, you know, it's just betweenizmeđu us."
313
773854
2867
to je između nas."
13:08
And I said, "Yes, that's fine."
314
776721
1786
Ja sam rekao, "Da, to je uredu."
13:10
On SundayNedjelja of the sameisto conferencekonferencija,
315
778507
2109
U subotu tokom iste konferencije,
13:12
her husbandmuž tookuzela me asidesa strane,
316
780616
3044
njen muž me je odveo u stranu,
13:15
and he said, "My wifesupruga wouldn'tne bi think
317
783660
1694
i rekao, "Moja žena ne bi mislila
13:17
that I was really much of a guy if she knewznao je this,
318
785354
2435
da sam pravi muškarac da zna ovo,
13:19
but I've been dealingbavljenje with this depressiondepresija
319
787789
2466
ali imam problem sa depresijom
13:22
and I'm takinguzimajući some medicationlekovi,
320
790255
1354
i uzimam neke lijekove,
13:23
and I wonderedpitao se what you think?"
321
791609
2505
i zanimalo me šta vi mislite?"
13:26
They were hidingskrivanje
322
794114
1423
Oni su krili
13:27
the sameisto medicationlekovi in two differentdrugačiji placesmesta
323
795537
2215
isti lijek na različitim mjestima
13:29
in the sameisto bedroomspavaca soba.
324
797752
2645
u istoj spavaćoj sobi.
13:32
And I said that I thought
325
800397
2021
Rekao sam da mislim
13:34
communicationkomunikacija withinunutar the marriagebrak
326
802418
1684
da komunikacija u braku
13:36
mightMožda be triggeringpokreće some of theirnjihova problemsproblemi.
327
804102
2014
možda uzrokuje neke od njihovih problema.
13:38
(LaughterSmijeh)
328
806116
4191
(Smijeh)
13:42
But I was alsotakođe struckudario
329
810307
1655
Ali bio sam iznenađen
13:43
by the burdensometegoban naturepriroda
330
811962
1806
tegobnom prirodom
13:45
of suchtakve mutualmeđusobno secrecytajnost.
331
813768
2373
obostrane tajnovitosti.
13:48
DepressionDepresija is so exhaustingiscrpljujuće.
332
816141
1885
Depresija je tako iscrpljujuća.
13:50
It takes up so much of your time and energyenergija,
333
818026
2768
Oduzima toliko puno vašeg vremena i energije,
13:52
and silencetišina about it,
334
820794
1504
i šutnje o tome
13:54
it really does make the depressiondepresija worselošije.
335
822298
2731
stvarno čini depresiju gorom.
13:57
And then I beganpočeo thinkingrazmišljanje about all the waysnačina
336
825029
1733
Onda sam počeo razmišljati o svim načinima
13:58
people make themselvessami better.
337
826762
1966
na koji ljudi sebi olakšavaju.
14:00
I'd startedzapočet off as a medicalmedicinski conservativekonzervativan.
338
828728
2439
Započeo sam kao medicinski konzervativac.
14:03
I thought there were a fewnekoliko
kindsvrste of therapyterapija that workedradio je,
339
831167
2372
Mislio sam da postoji nekoliko vrsta uspješnih terapija,
14:05
it was clearjasno what they were --
340
833539
1809
jasno je da jesu --
14:07
there was medicationlekovi,
341
835348
1644
postoje lijekovi,
14:08
there were certainsigurno psychotherapiespsihoterapija,
342
836992
1476
postoje određene psihoterapije,
14:10
there was possiblymoguće electroconvulsiveelektrokonvulzivna treatmentliječenje,
343
838468
2445
možda postoji elektrokonvulzivno liječenje,
14:12
and that everything elsedrugo was nonsensegluposti.
344
840913
2675
i da je sve drugo nonsens.
14:15
But then I discoveredotkriveni something.
345
843588
1832
Ali onda sam otkrio nešto.
14:17
If you have brainmozak cancerrak,
346
845420
1752
Ako imate rak na mozgu,
14:19
and you say that standingstojeći on your headglava
347
847172
1472
i stajanje na glavi 20 minuta
14:20
for 20 minutesminuta everysvaki morningjutro makespravi you feel better,
348
848644
2995
svako jutro vam pomaže da se osjećate bolje,
14:23
it maymože make you feel better,
349
851639
1514
možda se osjećate bolje,
14:25
but you still have brainmozak cancerrak,
350
853153
1588
ali i dalje imate rak na mozgu,
14:26
and you'llti ćeš still probablyvjerovatno dieumri from it.
351
854741
2289
i možda ćete i dalje umrijeti zbog toga.
14:29
But if you say that you have depressiondepresija,
352
857030
2512
Ali ako imate depresiju,
14:31
and standingstojeći on your headglava for 20 minutesminuta everysvaki day
353
859542
2105
i zbog stajanja na glavi 20 minuta svaki dan
14:33
makespravi you feel better, then it's workedradio je,
354
861647
2484
osjećate se bolje, onda to pali,
14:36
because depressiondepresija is an illnessbolest of how you feel,
355
864131
2360
jer depresija je bolest onoga kako se osjećate,
14:38
and if you feel better,
356
866491
1609
i ako se osjećate bolje
14:40
then you are effectivelyefikasno not depresseddepresivan anymoreviše.
357
868100
2830
onda više niste depresivni.
14:42
So I becamepostao much more toleranttolerantni
358
870930
2033
Stoga sam postao tolerantniji
14:44
of the vastogromno worldsvet of alternativealternativa treatmentstretmani.
359
872963
2925
na alternativna liječenja.
14:47
And I get lettersslova, I get hundredsstotine of lettersslova
360
875888
2384
Dobijam hiljade pisama
14:50
from people writingpisanje to tell me
about what's workedradio je for them.
361
878272
2516
ljudi koji mi kažu šta kod njih pali.
14:52
SomeoneNetko was askingpitajući me backstagepozadina todaydanas
362
880788
2201
Neko me je iza bine pitao danas
14:54
about meditationMeditacija.
363
882989
1463
o meditaciji.
14:56
My favoriteomiljeni of the lettersslova that I got
364
884452
2465
Moje omiljeno pismo
14:58
was the one that camedošao from a womanžena
365
886917
1474
je od žene
15:00
who wrotenapisao je and said that she had triedpokušao therapyterapija,
366
888391
2207
koja je napisala da je probala terapiju,
15:02
she had triedpokušao medicationlekovi,
she had triedpokušao prettylepo much everything,
367
890598
2387
lijekove, probala je skoro sve,
15:04
and she had foundpronađeno a solutionrješenje
and hopednadao se I would tell the worldsvet,
368
892985
2837
i našla je rješenje, i nada se da ću ga prenijeti svijetu,
15:07
and that was makingstvaranje little things from yarnpređa.
369
895822
3812
a to je pravljenje malenih stvari od pletiva.
15:11
(LaughterSmijeh)
370
899634
2999
(Smijeh)
15:14
She sentposlat me some of them. (LaughterSmijeh)
371
902633
3524
Poslala mi je nekoliko njih. (Smijeh)
15:18
And I'm not wearingnosi them right now.
372
906157
3688
Ne nosim ih trenutno.
15:21
I suggestedpredložio to her that she alsotakođe should look up
373
909845
2515
Predložio sam joj da potraži
15:24
obsessiveopsesivno compulsivekompulzivno disorderporemećaj in the DSMDSM.
374
912360
4048
opsesivno-kompulzivni poremećaj u priručniku.
15:28
And yetjoš uvek, when I wentotišao to look
at alternativealternativa treatmentstretmani,
375
916408
3128
Kada sam potražio alternativna liječenja,
15:31
I alsotakođe gainedstekao perspectiveperspektiva on other treatmentstretmani.
376
919536
2908
saznao sam o drugim liječenjima.
15:34
I wentotišao throughkroz a tribalplemenski exorcismegzorcizam in SenegalSenegal
377
922444
2903
Prošao sam kroz plemenski egorcizam u Senegalu
15:37
that involveduključeni a great dealdogovoriti of ram'sRam-ove bloodkrv
378
925347
2013
koji je uključivao mnogo ovnove krvi
15:39
and that I'm not going to detaildetalj right now,
379
927360
2062
a čije detalje neću iznositi sada.
15:41
but a fewnekoliko yearsgodine afterwardsnakon toga I was in RwandaRuanda
380
929422
2000
Nekoliko godina poslije, radio sam u Ruandi
15:43
workingraditi on a differentdrugačiji projectprojekat,
381
931422
1758
na jednom drugačijem projektu.
15:45
and I happeneddogodilo se to describeopišite
my experienceiskustvo to someoneneko,
382
933180
2796
Opisivao sam svoje iskustvo jednoj osobi,
15:47
and he said, "Well, you know,
383
935976
1760
a on je rekao, "Pa, znaš,
15:49
that's WestZapad AfricaAfrika, and we're in EastIstok AfricaAfrika,
384
937736
1820
to je zapadna Afrika, a mi smo u istočnoj Africi,
15:51
and our ritualsrituali are in some waysnačina very differentdrugačiji,
385
939556
1834
i naši rituali se na određeni način veoma razlikuju
15:53
but we do have some ritualsrituali that have something
386
941390
2013
ali imamo neke rituale koji imaju nešto
15:55
in commončesto with what you're describingopisivati."
387
943403
1987
zajedničko sa tim što opisuješ."
15:57
And I said, "Oh." And he said, "Yes," he said,
388
945390
1663
Rekao sam, "Je li", a on je rekao "Da, ali
15:59
"but we'vemi smo had a lot of troublenevolja with
WesternZapadni mentalmentalno healthzdravlje workersradnici,
389
947053
2642
imali smo mnogo problema sa radnicima u mentalnog zdravlja na zapadu,
16:01
especiallyposebno the onesone who camedošao
right after the genocidegenocid."
390
949695
2757
posebno s onima koji su došli odmah poslije genocida."
16:04
And I said, "What kindkind of troublenevolja did you have?"
391
952452
2327
Rekao sam, "Kakve ste probleme imali?"
16:06
And he said, "Well,
392
954779
1546
Rekao je, "Pa,
16:08
they would do this bizarrebizarno thing.
393
956325
2664
radii bi bizarne stvari.
16:10
They didn't take people out in the sunshinesunce
394
958989
1885
Nisu izvodili ljude na sunce
16:12
where you beginzapočeti to feel better.
395
960874
1700
gdje bi se počeli osjećati bolje.
16:14
They didn't includeuključi drummingbubanj or musicmuzika
to get people'sljudi bloodkrv going.
396
962574
3094
Nisu uključivali bubnjanje ili muziku da pokrenu ljude.
16:17
They didn't involveuključiti the wholecjelina communityzajednica.
397
965668
1842
Nisu uključili cijelu zajednicu.
16:19
They didn't externalizeobjelodani the depressiondepresija
398
967510
1775
Nisu prikazali depresiju u vanjskom obliku
16:21
as an invasiveinvazivne spiritduh.
399
969285
1433
kao napadački duh.
16:22
InsteadUmjesto toga what they did was they tookuzela people
400
970718
2631
Umjesto toga, oni su odveli jednu po jednu osobu
16:25
one at a time into dingysumorna little roomssobe
401
973349
2628
u prljave male sobe i
16:27
and had them talk for an hoursat
402
975977
1343
tražili da pričaju sat vremena
16:29
about badloše things that had happeneddogodilo se to them."
403
977320
2230
o lošim stvarim koje su im se događale."
16:31
(LaughterSmijeh) (ApplausePljesak)
404
979550
5460
(Smijeh) (Aplauz)
16:37
He said, "We had to askpitajte them to leaveodlazi the countryzemlju."
405
985010
2362
Rekao je, "Morali smo ih zamoliti da napuste zemlju."
16:39
(LaughterSmijeh)
406
987372
3057
(Smijeh)
16:42
Now at the other endkraj of alternativealternativa treatmentstretmani,
407
990429
2444
Na drugom kraju alternativnih liječenja,
16:44
let me tell you about FrankFrank RussakoffRussakoff.
408
992873
2035
dopustite mi da vam ispričam o Franku Russakoffu.
16:46
FrankFrank RussakoffRussakoff had the worstnajgore depressiondepresija
409
994908
3053
On je imao najgoru depresiju
16:49
perhapsmožda that I've ever seenviđeni in a man.
410
997961
2915
koju sam vidio kod čovjeka.
16:52
He was constantlystalno depresseddepresivan.
411
1000876
1993
Bio je konstantno depresivan.
16:54
He was, when I metispunjen him, at a pointtačka at whichšto
412
1002869
2141
Kada sam ga upoznao svaki mjesec
16:57
everysvaki monthmesec he would have electroshockElektrošok treatmentliječenje.
413
1005010
3158
je imao tretman elektrošokom.
17:00
Then he would feel sortsortiraj of disorienteddezorientiran for a weeksedmicu.
414
1008168
2575
Osjećao bi se dezorijentisan čitavu sedmicu.
17:02
Then he would feel okay for a weeksedmicu.
415
1010743
1803
Onda bi bio dobro čitavu sedmicu.
17:04
Then he would have a weeksedmicu of going downhillnizbrdo.
416
1012546
1700
A onda bi išao nizbrdo cijelu sedmicu.
17:06
And then he would have anotherdrugi
electroshockElektrošok treatmentliječenje.
417
1014246
2685
Onda bi opet imao tretman elektrošokom.
17:08
And he said to me when I metispunjen him,
418
1016931
1415
Kada sam ga upoznao, rekao mi je,
17:10
"It's unbearablenepodnošljiva to go throughkroz my weeksnedelje this way.
419
1018346
2552
"Nepodnošljivo je prolaziti ovako.
17:12
I can't go on this way,
420
1020898
1507
Ne mogu više ovako,
17:14
and I've figuredfigured out how I'm going to endkraj it
421
1022405
2264
skontao sam kako ću ovo okončati
17:16
if I don't get better.
422
1024669
1557
ako mi ne bude bolje.
17:18
But," he said to me, "I heardčuo about a protocolprotokol
423
1026226
2708
Ali", rekao mi je, "čuo sam o protokolu
17:20
at MassMasa GeneralOpće for a procedureprocedure calledpozvana
424
1028934
2223
na Mass General bolnici za proceduru koja se zove
17:23
a cingulotomycingulotomija, whichšto is a brainmozak surgeryoperacija,
425
1031157
2026
cingulotomija, operacija na mozgu,
17:25
and I think I'm going to give that a try."
426
1033183
2571
mislim da ću probati to."
17:27
And I rememberzapamtite beingbiće amazedzapanjen at that pointtačka
427
1035754
1954
Sjećam se da sam bio zadivljen u tom trenutku
17:29
to think that someoneneko
428
1037708
1300
da neko ko je očito
17:31
who clearlyjasno had so manymnogi badloše experiencesiskustva
429
1039008
3221
imao toliko loše iskustva
17:34
with so manymnogi differentdrugačiji treatmentstretmani
430
1042229
1859
sa toliko raznih tretmana
17:36
still had buriedpokopan in him somewherenegde enoughdosta optimismoptimizam
431
1044088
3122
i dalje ima negdje duboko u sebi optimizma
17:39
to reachdostignuti out for one more.
432
1047210
2550
da pokuša sa još jednim tretmanom.
17:41
And he had the cingulotomycingulotomija,
433
1049760
2180
Podvrgnuo se cingulatomiji,
17:43
and it was incrediblyNeverovatno successfuluspješno.
434
1051940
2041
i bila je nevjerovatno uspješna.
17:45
He's now a friendprijatelju of minemoj.
435
1053981
1493
Danas smo prijatelji.
17:47
He has a lovelydivno wifesupruga and two beautifulprelepo childrendjeca.
436
1055474
3492
Ima divnu ženu i dvoje prelijepe djece.
17:50
He wrotenapisao je me a letterpismo the ChristmasBožić after the surgeryoperacija,
437
1058966
2949
Pisao mi je za Božić poslije operacije,
17:53
and he said,
438
1061915
1189
i napisao,
17:55
"My fatherotac sentposlat me two presentspredstavlja this yeargodina,
439
1063104
2407
"Otac mi je poslao dva poklona ove godine,
17:57
First, a motorizedmotornih vozila C.D. rackstalak from The SharperOštrije ImageSlika
440
1065511
2602
Prvo, stalak za CD-ove iz The Sharper Image
18:00
that I didn't really need,
441
1068113
1421
koji mi zapravo ne treba,
18:01
but I knewznao je he was givingdavanje it to me to celebrateslaviti
442
1069534
2097
ali znam da mi je to poklonio da proslavim
18:03
the factčinjenica that I'm livingživi on my ownvlastiti
443
1071631
1728
činjenicu da mogu da živim samostalno
18:05
and have a jobposao I seemizgleda to love.
444
1073359
2047
i da imam posao koji izgleda da volim.
18:07
And the other presentprisutan
445
1075406
1561
A drugi poklon
18:08
was a photofotografija of my grandmotherbaka,
446
1076967
1576
je bio slika moje bake,
18:10
who committedposvećeno suicidesamoubistvo.
447
1078543
2252
koja se ubila.
18:12
As I unwrappedunwrapped it, I beganpočeo to cryplač,
448
1080795
2935
Kada sam je otpakovao počeo sam plakati,
18:15
and my mothermajka camedošao over and said,
449
1083730
1880
moja majka je prišla i rekla,
18:17
'Are you cryingplakati because of the
relativesrođaci you never knewznao je?'
450
1085610
3315
'Da li plačeš zbog rodbine koju nikada nisu poznavao?'
18:20
And I said, 'She' Ona had the sameisto diseasebolesti I have.'
451
1088925
4088
Rekao sam, 'Ona je imala istu bolest kao i ja.'
18:25
I'm cryingplakati now as I writepisati to you.
452
1093013
2581
Plačem dok ti pišem ovo.
18:27
It's not that I'm so sadtužan, but I get overwhelmedpreplavljen,
453
1095594
3595
Nije da sam tužan, ali savladaju me emocije
18:31
I think, because I could have killedubijen myselfja,
454
1099189
2221
jer sam se mogao ubiti,
18:33
but my parentsroditelji keptčuva me going,
455
1101410
1703
ali roditelji su me održavali u životu,
18:35
and so did the doctorsdoktori,
456
1103113
1749
kao i doktori,
18:36
and I had the surgeryoperacija.
457
1104862
1854
a onda sam imao operaciju.
18:38
I'm aliveživ and gratefulzahvalni.
458
1106716
2815
Živ sam i zahvalan.
18:41
We liveuživo in the right time,
459
1109531
2260
Živimo u pravom vremenu,
18:43
even if it doesn't always feel like it."
460
1111791
3879
iako se uvijek ne čini tako."
18:47
I was struckudario by the factčinjenica that depressiondepresija
461
1115670
1897
Bio sam iznenađen činjenicom da depresija
18:49
is broadlyširoko perceivedpercipiraju to be
462
1117567
1725
je općenito shvaćena kao
18:51
a modernmoderno, WesternZapadni, middle-classsrednje klase thing,
463
1119292
3537
moderna, zapadnjačka, buržujska stvar,
18:54
and I wentotišao to look at how it operatedupravlja
464
1122829
2152
krenuo sam da vidim kako funkcioniše
18:56
in a varietyraznovrsnost of other contextskontekstima,
465
1124981
2003
u raznim drugim kontekstima.
18:58
and one of the things I was mostnajviše interestedzainteresovan in
466
1126984
2119
Jedna od stvari za koju sam najviše bio zainteresiran
19:01
was depressiondepresija amongmeđu the indigentsiromaha.
467
1129103
1790
je depresija kod siromašnih ljudi.
19:02
And so I wentotišao out to try to look at
468
1130893
1781
Krenuo sam da vidim
19:04
what was beingbiće donezavršeno for
poorsiromašno people with depressiondepresija.
469
1132674
2580
kako se pomaže siromašnim ljudima s depresijom.
19:07
And what I discoveredotkriveni is that poorsiromašno people
470
1135254
2158
Otkrio sam da siromašni ljudi
19:09
are mostlyuglavnom not beingbiće treatedtretirani for depressiondepresija.
471
1137412
2557
uglavnom nisu lječeni za depresiju.
19:11
DepressionDepresija is the resultrezultat of a geneticgenetski vulnerabilityranjivost,
472
1139969
2919
Depresija je rezultat genetičke ranjivosti,
19:14
whichšto is presumablyverovatno evenlyravnomjerno
distributeddistribuirani in the populationstanovništvo,
473
1142888
3158
koja je vjerovatno jednako rasprostranjena u populaciji,
19:18
and triggeringpokreće circumstancesokolnosti,
474
1146046
1953
i okolonosti koji je izazivaju,
19:19
whichšto are likelyvjerovatno to be more severeozbiljna
475
1147999
1903
koji su vjerovatno ozbiljniji
19:21
for people who are impoverishedosiromašen.
476
1149902
1875
za siromašne ljude.
19:23
And yetjoš uvek it turnsokreće se out that if you have
477
1151777
2427
Ipak ispada da ako imaš
19:26
a really lovelydivno life but feel miserablemizeran all the time,
478
1154204
2140
divnu ženu ali stalno se osjećaš jadno,
19:28
you think, "Why do I feel like this?
479
1156344
2000
pomisliš, "Zašto se osjećam ovako?
19:30
I mustmora have depressiondepresija."
480
1158344
1669
Mora da imam depresiju."
19:32
And you setset out to find treatmentliječenje for it.
481
1160013
1923
I kreneš tražiti lijek za to.
19:33
But if you have a perfectlysavršeno awfulstrašno life,
482
1161936
2093
Ali ako imaš užasan život,
19:36
and you feel miserablemizeran all the time,
483
1164029
1867
i stalno se osječaš jadno,
19:37
the way you feel is commensurateproporcionalan with your life,
484
1165896
2826
način kako se osjećaš je proporcionalan tvom životu,
19:40
and it doesn't occurpojaviti to you to think,
485
1168722
1724
i ne pada ti na pamet da pomisliš,
19:42
"Maybe this is treatabletretirati."
486
1170446
1783
"Možda se ovo može liječiti."
19:44
And so we have an epidemicepidemija in this countryzemlju
487
1172229
3136
Tako imamo epidemiju depresije
19:47
of depressiondepresija amongmeđu impoverishedosiromašen people
488
1175365
2913
među siromašnim ljudima u ovoj državi
19:50
that's not beingbiće pickedizabrali up
and that's not beingbiće treatedtretirani
489
1178278
2512
koja nije otkrivena i koja se ne liječi
19:52
and that's not beingbiće addressedadresirano,
490
1180790
2056
i koja se ne rješava,
19:54
and it's a tragedytragedija of a grandgrand ordernaruči.
491
1182846
2200
to je velika tragedija.
19:57
And so I foundpronađeno an academicakademski
492
1185046
1488
Našao sam profesoricu
19:58
who was doing a researchistraživanje projectprojekat
493
1186534
1817
koja je radila istraživački projekat
20:00
in slumspredgrađe outsidespolja of D.C.,
494
1188351
1741
u sirotinjskim četvrtima izvan Washingtona,
20:02
where she pickedizabrali up womenžene who had
come in for other healthzdravlje problemsproblemi
495
1190092
2997
gdje je upoznala žene koje su došle zbog drugih zdravstvenih problema
20:05
and diagnoseddijagnosticira them with depressiondepresija,
496
1193089
1779
i dijagonisticirala im je depresiju,
20:06
and then providedobezbeđeni sixšest monthsmjeseci
of the experimentaleksperimentalno protocolprotokol.
497
1194868
3266
i onda omogućila 6 mjeseci eksperimentalnog protokola.
20:10
One of them, LollyŠtapiću, camedošao in,
498
1198134
2329
Jedna od njih, Lolly, je došla,
20:12
and this is what she said the day she camedošao in.
499
1200463
2297
i evo šta je rekla taj dan.
20:14
She said, and she was a womanžena, by the way,
500
1202760
3395
Usput, ona je žena
20:18
who had sevensedam childrendjeca. She said,
501
1206155
2092
koja ima sedmero djece. Rekla je,
20:20
"I used to have a jobposao but I had to give it up because
502
1208247
2651
"Imala sam posao, ali morala sam ga se odreći, jer
20:22
I couldn'tnije mogao go out of the housekuća.
503
1210898
2060
nisam mogla izaći iz kuće.
20:24
I have nothing to say to my childrendjeca.
504
1212958
2228
Nemam šta reći svojoj djeci.
20:27
In the morningjutro, I can't wait for them to leaveodlazi,
505
1215186
2767
Ujutro, jedva čekam da odu,
20:29
and then I climbpenjati se in bedkrevet and
pullpovući the coverspokriva over my headglava,
506
1217953
2990
i onda legnem u krevet i prekrijem glavu pokrivačem,
20:32
and threetri o'clockO'clock when they come home,
507
1220943
1646
a 3 sata kada se vraćaju
20:34
it just comesdolazi so fastbrzo."
508
1222589
1801
dolete tako brzo."
20:36
She said, "I've been takinguzimajući a lot of TylenolTylenol,
509
1224390
2240
Rekla je, "Uzimala sam dosta Tylenola,
20:38
anything I can take so that I can sleepspavaj more.
510
1226630
2759
bilo šta da spavam više.
20:41
My husbandmuž has been tellinggovoreći me I'm stupidglupo, I'm uglyružno.
511
1229389
3770
Moj muž mi je govorio da sam glupa, ružna.
20:45
I wishželim I could stop the painbol."
512
1233159
3505
Željela bih da zaustavim bol."
20:48
Well, she was broughtdoveden into
this experimentaleksperimentalno protocolprotokol,
513
1236664
2640
Ona je uključena u ovaj eksperimentalni program,
20:51
and when I interviewedintervjuisano her sixšest monthsmjeseci laterkasnije,
514
1239304
2308
i kada sam je intervjuisao 6 mjeseci poslije,
20:53
she had takenuzeti a jobposao workingraditi in childcarebriga o djeci
515
1241612
4407
počela je raditi u vrtiću
20:58
for the U.S. NavyMornarica, she had left the abusiveuvredljiv husbandmuž,
516
1246019
3805
za Ratnu mornaricu SAD-a, napustila je nasilnog muža,
21:01
and she said to me,
517
1249824
2082
i rekla mi je,
21:03
"My kidsdeca are so much happiersretniji now."
518
1251906
2369
"Moja djeca su mnogo sretnija sada."
21:06
She said, "There's one roomsoba in my newnovo placemesto
519
1254275
1977
Rekla je, "U mom novom domu postoji jedna soba
21:08
for the boysmomci and one roomsoba for the girlsdevojke,
520
1256252
2608
za dječake i jedna za djevojčice,
21:10
but at night, they're just all up on my bedkrevet,
521
1258860
2539
ali navečer, svi su u mom krevetu,
21:13
and we're doing homeworkzadaća
all togetherzajedno and everything.
522
1261399
2612
radimo zadaću, svi zajedno.
21:16
One of them wants to be a preacherpropovjednik,
523
1264011
1673
Jedan od njih želi biti svećenik,
21:17
one of them wants to be a firefightervatrogasac,
524
1265684
1700
jedan želi biti vatrogasac,
21:19
and one of the girlsdevojke sayskaže she's going to be a lawyeradvokat.
525
1267384
2966
a jedna od djevojčica kaže da želi biti advokat.
21:22
They don't cryplač like they used to,
526
1270350
2005
Ne plaču kao prije,
21:24
and they don't fightborba like they did.
527
1272355
2558
i ne svađaju se.
21:26
That's all I need now is my kidsdeca.
528
1274913
3780
Sve što sada trebam su moja djeca.
21:30
Things keep on changingmenja se,
529
1278693
1912
Stvari se mijenjaju,
21:32
the way I dresshaljina, the way I feel, the way I actčiniti.
530
1280605
5193
način na koji se oblačim, osjećam, ponašam.
21:37
I can go outsidespolja not beingbiće afraiduplašen anymoreviše,
531
1285798
3687
Mogu izaći vani bez straha,
21:41
and I don't think those badloše feelingsosjecanja are comingdolaze back,
532
1289485
3409
i ne mislim da će se ti loši osjećaji vratiti,
21:44
and if it weren'tnisu for DrDr. MirandaMiranda and that,
533
1292894
3035
i da nije bilo doktorice Mirande
21:47
I would still be at home with
the coverspokriva pulledvuče over my headglava,
534
1295929
3617
ja bih i dalje bila kući sa prekrivačem preko glave,
21:51
if I were still aliveživ at all.
535
1299546
2349
ako bi uopšte bila živa.
21:53
I askedpitan the LordGospodin to sendpošalji me an angelanđeo,
536
1301895
3732
Molila sam Boga da mi pošalje anđela,
21:57
and he heardčuo my prayersmolitve."
537
1305627
4330
i on uslišio je moje molitve."
22:01
I was really movedpreselio se by these experiencesiskustva,
538
1309959
3353
Ova iskustva su me zaista dirnula,
22:05
and I decidedodlučio that I wanted to writepisati about them
539
1313312
2539
i odlučio sam da želim da pišem o njima
22:07
not only in a bookknjiga I was workingraditi on,
540
1315851
1379
ne samo za knjigu na kojoj sam radio,
22:09
but alsotakođe in an articlečlanak,
541
1317230
1311
već i u članku.
22:10
and so I got a commissionprovizija from
The NewNovi YorkYork TimesPuta MagazineMagazin
542
1318541
2321
Dobio sam narudžbu od The New York Times Magazina
22:12
to writepisati about depressiondepresija amongmeđu the indigentsiromaha.
543
1320862
2016
da pišem o depresiji među siromašnima.
22:14
And I turnedokrenuo se in my storypriča,
544
1322878
1616
Predao sam svoju priču.
22:16
and my editorurednik calledpozvana me and said,
545
1324494
1596
Moj urednik me je nazvao i rekao
22:18
"We really can't publishobjaviti this."
546
1326090
1710
"Ovo zaista ne možemo objaviti."
22:19
And I said, "Why not?"
547
1327800
1750
Rekao sam, "Zašto ne?"
22:21
And she said, "It just is too far-fetcheddalekovano.
548
1329550
2305
Ona je rekla, "Ovo je neuvjerljivo.
22:23
These people who are sortsortiraj of at
the very bottomdno rungžbica of societydruštvo
549
1331855
3778
Ove osobe na samom dnu društvene ljestice
22:27
and then they get a fewnekoliko monthsmjeseci of treatmentliječenje
550
1335633
1704
prime nekoliko mjeseci lječenja
22:29
and they're virtuallypraktično readyspreman to runtrči MorganMorgan StanleyStanley?
551
1337337
2632
i onda su doslovno spremni da upravljaju Morganom Stanleyjem?
22:31
It's just too implausibleneverovatno."
552
1339969
1854
To je nevjerovatno."
22:33
She said, I've never even heardčuo of anything like it."
553
1341823
2205
Rekla je, "Nikad nisam čula za takvo nešto."
22:36
And I said, "The factčinjenica that you've never heardčuo of it
554
1344028
2534
Ja sam rekao, "To što vi niste čuli za to
22:38
is an indicationindikacija that it is newsvijesti."
555
1346562
3000
pokazuje da je to novost."
22:41
(LaughterSmijeh) (ApplausePljesak)
556
1349562
6134
(Smijeh) (Aplauz)
22:49
"And you are a newsvijesti magazinečasopis."
557
1357317
2494
"A vi ste novina."
22:51
So after a certainsigurno amountiznos of negotiationpregovaranje,
558
1359811
1982
Nakon određenog pregovaranja,
22:53
they agreedsložio se to it.
559
1361793
1241
pristali su.
22:55
But I think a lot of what they said
560
1363034
1615
Ali mnogo sam razmišljao da ono što su reklli
22:56
was connectedpovezan in some strangečudno way
561
1364649
2295
je na neki čudan načim povezao
22:58
to this distasteodvratnost that people still have
562
1366944
2142
sa gnušanjem ljudi prema
23:01
for the ideaideja of treatmentliječenje,
563
1369086
1463
ideji liječenja,
23:02
the notionpojam that somehownekako if we wentotišao out
564
1370549
1882
da ako odemo
23:04
and treatedtretirani a lot of people in indigentsiromaha communitieszajednice,
565
1372431
2696
da liječimo ljude u siromašnim zajednicama,
23:07
that would be an exploitativeeksploatacijske thing to do,
566
1375127
1898
to bi bilo izrabljivački
23:09
because we would be changingmenja se them.
567
1377025
1642
jer bismo ih mijenjali.
23:10
There is this falselažno moralmoralno imperativeimperativ
568
1378667
2033
Postoji lažni moralni imperativ
23:12
that seemsizgleda to be all around us
569
1380700
1789
oko nas
23:14
that treatmentliječenje of depressiondepresija,
570
1382489
2354
da je liječenje depresije,
23:16
the medicationslijekovi and so on, are an artificevještak,
571
1384843
2299
lijekovi i tako dalje, izmišljotina,
23:19
and that it's not naturalprirodno.
572
1387142
2172
i da nije prirodno.
23:21
And I think that's very misguidedu zabludi.
573
1389314
2849
Mislim da je to veoma pogrešno.
23:24
It would be naturalprirodno for people'sljudi teethzubi to fallpada out,
574
1392163
3532
Normalno je da zubi ispadaju,
23:27
but there is nobodyniko militatingmilitating againstprotiv toothpastepasta za zube,
575
1395695
3330
ali niko ne sprečava korištenje kaladonta,
23:31
at leastnajmanje not in my circleskrugovi.
576
1399025
2128
barem ne u mojoj okolini.
23:33
And people then say, "Well, but isn't depressiondepresija
577
1401153
2502
Ljudi onda kažu, "Pa, zar nije depresija ono
23:35
partdeo of what people are supposednavodno to experienceiskustvo?
578
1403655
2185
što ljudi trebaju iskusiti?
23:37
Didn't we evolveevoluirati to have depressiondepresija?
579
1405840
1741
Zar se nismo razvili da imamo depresiju?
23:39
Isn't it partdeo of your personalityličnost?"
580
1407581
1907
Zar to nije dio ličnosti?"
23:41
To whichšto I would say, moodraspoloženje is adaptiveadaptivno.
581
1409488
2746
Na to ja odgovaram, raspoloženje je prilagodljivo.
23:44
BeingBiće ablesposoban to have sadnesstuga and fearstrah
582
1412234
3329
Iskustvo tuge i straha,
23:47
and joyradost and pleasurezadovoljstvo
583
1415563
1842
radosti i zadovoljstva
23:49
and all of the other moodsraspoloženja that we have,
584
1417405
1803
i sva druga raspoloženje,
23:51
that's incrediblyNeverovatno valuablevredno.
585
1419208
2064
su nevjerovatno vrijedna.
23:53
And majormajor depressiondepresija is something that happensse dešava
586
1421272
3047
Velika depresija je nešto što se dogodi
23:56
when that systemsistem getsdobiva brokenslomljen.
587
1424319
2012
kada se taj sistem pokvari.
23:58
It's maladaptivemaladaptivnom.
588
1426331
1717
To je loša prilagodba.
24:00
People will come to me and say,
589
1428048
1572
Ljudi mi prilaze i kažu,
24:01
"I think, thoughipak, if I just stickštap it out for anotherdrugi yeargodina,
590
1429620
2768
"Ako izdržim još jednu godinu,
24:04
I think I can just get throughkroz this."
591
1432388
2076
mislim da mogu uspjeti."
24:06
And I always say to them, "You maymože get throughkroz it,
592
1434464
2303
Uvijek m kažem, "Možeš uspjeti,
24:08
but you'llti ćeš never be 37 again.
593
1436767
2709
ali nikad više nećeš imati 37 godin.
24:11
Life is shortkratko, and that's a wholecjelina yeargodina
594
1439476
2550
Život je prekratak, i to je čitava godina dana
24:14
you're talkingpričaju about givingdavanje up.
595
1442026
1956
koje bi se odrekao.
24:15
Think it throughkroz."
596
1443982
1538
Dobro promisli."
24:17
It's a strangečudno povertysiromaštvo of the Englishengleski languagejezik,
597
1445520
2846
Zbog siromašnosti engleskog jezika,
24:20
and indeedzaista of manymnogi other languagesjezici,
598
1448366
2108
kao i drugih jezika,
24:22
that we use this sameisto wordriječ, depressiondepresija,
599
1450474
2218
mi koristimo istu riječ, depresija,
24:24
to describeopišite how a kidklinac feelsoseća se
600
1452692
1805
da opišemo kako se djete osjeća
24:26
when it rainskiša on his birthdayrođendan,
601
1454497
1712
kada pada kiša na njegov rođendan,
24:28
and to describeopišite how somebodyneko feelsoseća se
602
1456209
2528
i da opišemo kako se neko osjeća
24:30
the minuteminut before they commitpočiniti suicidesamoubistvo.
603
1458737
2454
minutu prije nego počine samoubistvo.
24:33
People say to me, "Well, is it
continuouskontinuirano with normalnormalno sadnesstuga?"
604
1461191
3105
Ljudi mi govore, "Pa, da li traje duže nego normalna tuga?"
24:36
And I say, in a way it's continuouskontinuirano
with normalnormalno sadnesstuga.
605
1464296
3144
A ja odgovorim da traje na neki način.
24:39
There is a certainsigurno amountiznos of continuitykontinuitet,
606
1467440
2200
Postoji određena količina neprekidnosti,
24:41
but it's the sameisto way there's continuitykontinuitet
607
1469640
1957
isto kao što
24:43
betweenizmeđu havingimati an irongvožđe fenceOgrada outsidespolja your housekuća
608
1471597
1987
kada željezna ograda ispred kuće
24:45
that getsdobiva a little rusthrđa spottacka
609
1473584
1677
ima malo hrđe
24:47
that you have to sandpijesak off and do a little repaintingrepainting,
610
1475261
2746
koja se mora ošmirglati i prefarbati,
24:50
and what happensse dešava if you leaveodlazi
the housekuća for 100 yearsgodine
611
1478007
2647
a šta se dogodi ako ostavimo kuću na 100 godins+a,
24:52
and it rustsneće zahrđati throughkroz untildo it's only a pilegomila
612
1480654
2898
ona će hrđati sve dok se ne pretvori u hrpu
24:55
of orangenarandžasto dustprašinu.
613
1483552
1234
narandžaste prašine.
24:56
And it's that orangenarandžasto dustprašinu spottacka,
614
1484786
2173
Ta narandžasta prašnjava mrlja
24:58
that orangenarandžasto dustprašinu problemproblem,
615
1486959
1789
je problem
25:00
that's the one we're settingpodešavanje out to addressadresa.
616
1488748
2989
koji želimo da riješimo.
25:03
So now people say,
617
1491737
2240
Ljudi kažu,
25:05
"You take these happysrećan pillspilule, and do you feel happysrećan?"
618
1493977
2731
"Ako uzmemo ove sretne lijekove, da li se osjećamo sretno?"
25:08
And I don't.
619
1496708
1886
Ja se ne osjećam.
25:10
But I don't feel sadtužan about havingimati to eatjesti lunchručak,
620
1498594
2822
Ali nisam tužan što moram ručati,
25:13
and I don't feel sadtužan about my answeringodgovarajući machinemašina,
621
1501416
2836
nisam tužan zbog telefonske sekretrice,
25:16
and I don't feel sadtužan about takinguzimajući a showertuš.
622
1504252
2845
nisam tužan zbog tuširanja.
25:19
I feel more, in factčinjenica, I think,
623
1507097
2854
Osjećam se, zapravo, mislim,
25:21
because I can feel sadnesstuga withoutbez nullityništavilo.
624
1509951
2430
jer mogu osjećati tugu bez ništavnosti.
25:24
I feel sadtužan about professionalprofesionalno disappointmentsrazočaranja,
625
1512381
4347
Tužan sam zbog profesionalnih razočarenja,
25:28
about damagedoštećeno relationshipsveze,
626
1516728
2347
zbog narušenih veza,
25:31
about globalglobalno warmingzagrevanje.
627
1519075
2039
zbog globalnog zagrijavanja.
25:33
Those are the things that I feel sadtužan about now.
628
1521114
2725
Zbog toga sam tužan sada.
25:35
And I said to myselfja, well, what is the conclusionzaključak?
629
1523839
2734
Rekao sam sebi, pa šta je zaključak?
25:38
How did those people who have better livesživi
630
1526573
2561
Kako su ljudi sa boljim životima
25:41
even with biggerveće depressiondepresija manageupravljati to get throughkroz?
631
1529134
2554
i većom depresijom uspjeli?
25:43
What is the mechanismmehanizam of resilienceotpornost?
632
1531688
2797
Koji je mehanizam otpornosti?
25:46
And what I camedošao up with over time
633
1534485
2084
S vremenom sam zaključio
25:48
was that the people who denyporiči theirnjihova experienceiskustvo,
634
1536569
2916
da ljudi koji osporavaju svoje iskustvo,
25:51
the onesone who say, "I was depresseddepresivan a long time agopre
635
1539485
2032
oni koji ironično kažu, "Bio sam depresivan jako dugo
25:53
and I never want to think about it again
636
1541517
1737
i ne želim o tome razmišljati više
25:55
and I'm not going to look at it
637
1543254
1242
ne želim gledati na to
25:56
and I'm just going to get on with my life,"
638
1544496
1890
želim samo nastaviti sa svojim životom,"
25:58
ironicallyironično, those are the people
639
1546386
1959
to su ljudi
26:00
who are mostnajviše enslavedporobili by what they have.
640
1548345
2698
koji su najviše zarobljeni sa onim što imaju.
26:03
ShuttingZaklopac out the depressiondepresija strengthensjača it.
641
1551043
2564
Potiskivanje depresije samo je čini snažnijom.
26:05
While you hidesakriti from it, it growsraste.
642
1553607
3280
Ona raste, dok se vi krijete od nje.
26:08
And the people who do better
643
1556887
2860
Ljudi kojima je bolje
26:11
are the onesone who are ablesposoban to toleratetolerirati the factčinjenica
644
1559747
2599
su oni koji mogu tolerisati činjenicu
26:14
that they have this conditionstanje.
645
1562346
1622
da imaju ovu bolest.
26:15
Those who can toleratetolerirati theirnjihova depressiondepresija
646
1563968
2470
Oni koji mogu tolerisati svoju depresiju
26:18
are the onesone who achievepostići resilienceotpornost.
647
1566438
1782
su oni koji su otporni.
26:20
So FrankFrank RussakoffRussakoff said to me,
648
1568220
1783
Frank Russakof mi je rekao,
26:22
"If I had it again to do over,
649
1570003
1516
"Ako bih morao proći kroz ovo opet,
26:23
I supposePretpostavimo I wouldn'tne bi do it this way,
650
1571519
2137
pretpostavljam da ne bih uradio isto,
26:25
but in a strangečudno way, I'm gratefulzahvalni
651
1573656
1964
ali na čudan način, ja sam zahvalan
26:27
for what I've experiencediskusan.
652
1575620
1503
na svom iskustvu.
26:29
I'm gladdrago mi je to have been in the hospitalbolnica 40 timesputa.
653
1577123
3817
Drago mi je što sam bio 40 puta u bolnici.
26:32
It taughtpredavao me so much about love,
654
1580940
2603
Toliko me je naučila o ljubavi,
26:35
and my relationshipveza with my parentsroditelji and my doctorsdoktori
655
1583543
2840
moj odnos sa roditeljima i doktorima
26:38
has been so preciousdragocen to me, and will be always."
656
1586383
4389
je dragocijen."
26:42
And MaggieMaggie RobbinsRobbins said,
657
1590772
1926
Maggie Robbins je rekla,
26:44
"I used to volunteervolonter in an AIDSAIDS-A clinicklinika,
658
1592698
2989
"Volontirala sam u klinici za AIDS,
26:47
and I would just talk and talk and talk,
659
1595687
3014
pričala sam i pričala
26:50
and the people I was dealingbavljenje with
660
1598701
1813
sam ljudima
26:52
weren'tnisu very responsiveOdgovarajuće, and I thought,
661
1600514
2067
koji nisu baš uzvraćali, i mislila sam,
26:54
'That's not very friendlyprijateljski or helpfulkorisno of them.'
662
1602581
3961
'To nije prijateljski ili korisno sa njihove strane.'
26:58
And then I realizedrealizovan,
663
1606542
1642
Onda sam shvatila
27:00
I realizedrealizovan that they weren'tnisu going to do more
664
1608184
2127
da neće uraditi više
27:02
than make those first fewnekoliko minutesminuta of smallmali talk.
665
1610311
2387
od tih prvih nekoliko minuta čavrljanja.
27:04
It was simplyjednostavno going to be an occasionprigodom
666
1612698
2057
To će jednostavno biti situacija
27:06
where I didn't have AIDSAIDS-A and I wasn'tnije dyingumiranje,
667
1614755
2878
u kojoj ja nemam AIDS i ne umirem,
27:09
but could toleratetolerirati the factčinjenica that they did
668
1617633
2973
ali mogu tolerisati činjenicu da oni imaju
27:12
and they were.
669
1620606
1787
i da će umrijeti.
27:14
Our needspotrebe are our greatestnajveći assetsimovina.
670
1622393
3603
Naše potrebe su naša najveća imovina.
27:17
It turnsokreće se out I've learnednaučio to give
671
1625996
2139
Ispostavilo se da sam naučila dati
27:20
all the things I need."
672
1628135
4025
sve što mi treba."
27:24
ValuingVrednovanje one'sjedan je depressiondepresija
673
1632160
1691
Ako cijenimo tuđu depresiju,
27:25
does not preventsprečiti a relapserelapsa,
674
1633851
2194
to neće spriječiti da se ona ponovo javi,
27:28
but it maymože make the prospectprospekt of relapserelapsa
675
1636045
2661
ali može tolerisati izglede
27:30
and even relapserelapsa itselfsam easierlakše to toleratetolerirati.
676
1638706
4218
ponovne depresije.
27:34
The questionpitanje is not so much
677
1642924
2045
To nije pitanje
27:36
of findingpronalaženje great meaningznačenje and decidingodlučujući
678
1644969
2175
traženja značenja i odlučivanja da li je
27:39
your depressiondepresija has been very meaningfulsmisleno.
679
1647144
2027
depresija imala smisla.
27:41
It's of seekingtražeći that meaningznačenje
680
1649171
2171
To je pitanje traženja tog značenja
27:43
and thinkingrazmišljanje, when it comesdolazi again,
681
1651342
1804
i razmišljanja, kada se pojavi ponovo,
27:45
"This will be hellishpaklene,
682
1653146
1640
"Ovo će biti kao u paklu,
27:46
but I will learnuči something from it."
683
1654786
2701
ali naučit ću nešto iz toga."
27:49
I have learnednaučio in my ownvlastiti depressiondepresija
684
1657487
2264
Iz svoje depresije sam naučio
27:51
how bigveliki an emotionemocija can be,
685
1659751
2013
kako velika emocija može biti,
27:53
how it can be more realstvarno than factsčinjenice,
686
1661764
3097
kako može biti stvarnija od činjenica,
27:56
and I have foundpronađeno that that experienceiskustvo
687
1664861
2949
i otkrio sam da to iskustvo
27:59
has alloweddozvoljeno me to experienceiskustvo positivepozitivno emotionemocija
688
1667810
2892
mi je omogućilo da iskusim pozitivne emocije
28:02
in a more intenseintenzivno and more focusedfokusiran way.
689
1670702
3520
na intenzivniji i usmjereni način.
28:06
The oppositesuprotno of depressiondepresija is not happinesssreća,
690
1674222
3487
Suprotnost depresije nije sreća,
28:09
but vitalityvitalnost,
691
1677709
1454
nego životna snaga,
28:11
and these daysdana, my life is vitalvitalno,
692
1679163
2741
Ovih dana, pun sam životne snage,
28:13
even on the daysdana when I'm sadtužan.
693
1681904
2745
čak i kad sam tužan.
28:16
I feltosećao se that funeralpogreb in my brainmozak,
694
1684649
3313
Osjetih pogreb u svom mozgu,
28:19
and I satsat nextsledeći to the colossuskolos
695
1687962
2024
i sjedoh pokraj kolosa
28:21
at the edgeivica of the worldsvet,
696
1689986
2247
na kraju svijeta.
28:24
and I have discoveredotkriveni
697
1692233
2089
Otkrio sam
28:26
something insideunutra of myselfja
698
1694322
1851
nešto unutar sebe
28:28
that I would have to call a souldušu
699
1696173
2133
što moram nazvati dušom
28:30
that I had never formulatedformulirana
untildo that day 20 yearsgodine agopre
700
1698306
3756
što nikad nisam formulisao do tog dana 20 godina prije
28:34
when helldođavola camedošao to payplatiti me a surpriseiznenađenje visitposjetite.
701
1702062
4518
kada me je đavo iznenada posjetio.
28:38
I think that while I hatedmrzela beingbiće depresseddepresivan
702
1706580
4098
Iako mrzim biti u depresiji,
28:42
and would hatemrzite to be depresseddepresivan again,
703
1710678
2334
i mrzio bih da se ponovo pojavi,
28:45
I've foundpronađeno a way to love my depressiondepresija.
704
1713012
2744
Otkrio sam načim da zavolim svoju depresiju.
28:47
I love it because it has forcedprisiljen me
705
1715756
2025
Volim je jer me je natjerala
28:49
to find and clingdržati se to joyradost.
706
1717781
2769
da nađem radost i da je se držim.
28:52
I love it because eachsvaki day I decideodlučiti,
707
1720550
3488
Zbog toga što svaki dan odlučim,
28:56
sometimesponekad gamelyinvestitora u,
708
1724038
1540
ponekad odvažno,
28:57
and sometimesponekad againstprotiv the moment'strenutak reasonrazlog,
709
1725578
2698
a ponekad neopravdano,
29:00
to cleaveprilijepiti to the reasonsrazloge for livingživi.
710
1728276
2578
da se držim razloga zbog kojih vrijedi živjeti.
29:02
And that, I think, is a highlyvisoko privilegedprivilegovan raptureushićenja.
711
1730854
4123
Mislim da je to veoma privilegovano ushićenje.
29:06
Thank you.
712
1734977
3983
Hvala vam.
29:10
(ApplausePljesak)
713
1738960
3136
(Aplauz)
Translated by Samra Cebiric
Reviewed by Mirza Celikovic

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ABOUT THE SPEAKER
Andrew Solomon - Writer
Andrew Solomon writes about politics, culture and psychology.

Why you should listen

Andrew Solomon is a writer, lecturer and Professor of Clinical Psychology at Columbia University. He is president of PEN American Center. He writes regularly for The New Yorker and the New York Times.

Solomon's newest book, Far and Away: Reporting from the Brink of Change, Seven Continents, Twenty-Five Years was published in April, 2016. His previous book, Far From the Tree: Parents, Children, and the Search for Identity won the National Book Critics Circle award for nonfiction, the Wellcome Prize and 22 other national awards. It tells the stories of parents who not only learn to deal with their exceptional children but also find profound meaning in doing so. It was a New York Times bestseller in both hardcover and paperback editions. Solomon's previous book, The Noonday Demon: An Atlas of Depression, won the 2001 National Book Award for Nonfiction, was a finalist for the 2002 Pulitzer Prize and was included in The Times of London's list of one hundred best books of the decade. It has been published in twenty-four languages. Solomon is also the author of the novel A Stone Boat and of The Irony Tower: Soviet Artists in a Time of Glasnost.

Solomon is an activist in LGBT rights, mental health, education and the arts. He is a member of the boards of directors of the National LGBTQ Force and Trans Youth Family Allies. He is a member of the Board of Visitors of Columbia University Medical Center, serves on the National Advisory Board of the Depression Center at the University of Michigan, is a director of Columbia Psychiatry and is a member of the Advisory Board of the Depression and Bipolar Support Alliance. Solomon also serves on the boards of the Metropolitan Museum of Art, Yaddo and The Alex Fund, which supports the education of Romani children. He is also a fellow of Berkeley College at Yale University and a member of the New York Institute for the Humanities and the Council on Foreign Relations.

Solomon lives with his husband and son in New York and London and is a dual national. He also has a daughter with a college friend; mother and daughter live in Texas but visit often.


More profile about the speaker
Andrew Solomon | Speaker | TED.com