TED2018
Robin Steinberg: What if we ended the injustice of bail?
Filmed:
Readability: 4
2,447,814 views
On any given night, more than 450,000 people in the United States are locked up in jail simply because they don't have enough money to pay bail. The sums in question are often around $500: easy for some to pay, impossible for others. This has real human consequences -- people lose jobs, homes and lives, and it drives racial disparities in the legal system. Robin Steinberg has a bold idea to change this. In this powerful talk, she outlines the plan for The Bail Project -- an unprecedented national revolving bail fund to fight mass incarceration. (This ambitious idea is part of The Audacious Project, TED's initiative to inspire and fund global change.)
Robin Steinberg - Public defender, activist
Robin Steinberg is the CEO of The Bail Project, a new organization designed to combat mass incarceration in the United States by disrupting the money bail system -- one person at a time. As she says: "I hate injustice and simply can't sit still when I see it." Full bio
Robin Steinberg is the CEO of The Bail Project, a new organization designed to combat mass incarceration in the United States by disrupting the money bail system -- one person at a time. As she says: "I hate injustice and simply can't sit still when I see it." Full bio
Double-click the English transcript below to play the video.
00:12
I will never forget the first time
I visited a client in jail.
I visited a client in jail.
0
766
3158
00:17
The heavy, metal door slammed behind me,
1
5074
2207
00:19
and I heard the key turn in the lock.
2
7305
2245
00:22
The cement floor underneath me
had a sticky film on it
had a sticky film on it
3
10198
3255
00:25
that made a ripping sound,
4
13477
1542
00:27
like tape being pulled off a box,
5
15043
2614
00:29
every time I moved my foot.
6
17681
1659
00:31
The only connection to the outside world
was a small window placed too high to see.
was a small window placed too high to see.
7
19955
4776
00:37
There was a small, square table
bolted to the floor
bolted to the floor
8
25441
3055
00:40
and two metal chairs,
9
28520
1452
00:41
one on either side.
10
29996
1528
00:44
That was the first time
I understood viscerally --
I understood viscerally --
11
32354
3468
00:47
just for a fleeting moment --
12
35846
2397
00:50
what incarceration might feel like.
13
38267
1968
00:52
And I promised myself all those years ago
as a young, public defender
as a young, public defender
14
40886
4001
00:56
that I would never,
ever forget that feeling.
ever forget that feeling.
15
44911
2618
01:00
And I never have.
16
48277
1382
01:02
It inspired me to fight for each
and every one of my clients' freedom
and every one of my clients' freedom
17
50024
3951
01:05
as if it was my own.
18
53999
2132
01:09
Freedom.
19
57142
1326
01:10
A concept so fundamental
to the American psyche
to the American psyche
20
58832
3343
01:14
that it is enshrined in our constitution.
21
62199
2624
01:17
And yet, America is addicted
to imprisonment.
to imprisonment.
22
65839
4500
01:22
From slavery through mass incarceration,
23
70958
2552
01:25
it always has been.
24
73534
1333
01:27
Look, we all know the shocking numbers.
25
75704
2928
01:30
The United States incarcerates
more people per capita
more people per capita
26
78656
2652
01:33
than almost any nation on the planet.
27
81332
2752
01:36
But what you may not know
is that on any given night in America,
is that on any given night in America,
28
84938
4210
01:41
almost half a million people go to sleep
in those concrete jail cells
in those concrete jail cells
29
89172
4191
01:45
who have not been convicted of anything.
30
93387
3450
01:49
These mothers and fathers
and sons and daughters
and sons and daughters
31
97764
3774
01:53
are there for one reason
and one reason only:
and one reason only:
32
101562
3695
01:57
they cannot afford to pay
the price of their freedom.
the price of their freedom.
33
105281
3147
02:01
And that price is called bail.
34
109312
2936
02:05
Now, bail was actually created
as a form of conditional release.
as a form of conditional release.
35
113208
3822
02:09
The theory was simple:
36
117054
1322
02:10
set bail at an amount
that somebody could afford to pay --
that somebody could afford to pay --
37
118400
2715
02:13
they would pay it --
38
121139
1157
02:14
it would give them an incentive
to come back to court;
to come back to court;
39
122320
2524
02:16
it would give them some skin in the game.
40
124868
1968
02:18
Bail was never intended
to be used as punishment.
to be used as punishment.
41
126860
3976
02:22
Bail was never intended
to hold people in jail cells.
to hold people in jail cells.
42
130860
3974
02:26
And bail was never, ever intended
to create a two-tier system of justice:
to create a two-tier system of justice:
43
134858
5972
02:32
one for the rich
and one for everybody else.
and one for everybody else.
44
140854
3227
02:36
But that is precisely what it has done.
45
144433
2562
02:39
75 percent of people
in American local jails
in American local jails
46
147507
3392
02:42
are there because they cannot pay bail.
47
150923
2303
02:46
People like Ramel.
48
154215
1560
02:48
On a chilly October afternoon,
49
156514
1600
02:50
Ramel was riding his bicycle
in his South Bronx neighborhood
in his South Bronx neighborhood
50
158138
2842
02:53
on his way to a market
to pick up a quart of milk.
to pick up a quart of milk.
51
161004
2378
02:55
He was stopped by the police.
52
163760
1670
02:57
And when he demanded to know
why he was being stopped,
why he was being stopped,
53
165454
2568
03:00
an argument ensued,
and the next thing he knew,
and the next thing he knew,
54
168046
2326
03:02
he was on the ground in handcuffs,
55
170396
1621
03:04
being charged with "riding
your bicycle on the sidewalk
your bicycle on the sidewalk
56
172041
2998
03:07
and resisting arrest."
57
175063
1272
03:08
He was taken to court,
58
176944
1050
03:10
where a judge set 500 dollars bail.
59
178018
2894
03:12
But Ramel -- he didn't have 500 dollars.
60
180936
3072
03:16
So this 32-year-old father
was sent to "The Boat" --
was sent to "The Boat" --
61
184032
3852
03:19
a floating jail barge
that sits on the East River
that sits on the East River
62
187908
3704
03:23
between a sewage plant and a fish market.
63
191636
2671
03:27
That's right, you heard me.
64
195241
2222
03:29
In New York City, in 2018,
65
197487
2778
03:32
we have a floating prison barge
that sits out there
that sits out there
66
200289
4496
03:36
and houses primarily black and brown men
67
204809
3407
03:40
who cannot pay their bail.
68
208240
2147
03:43
Let's talk for a moment
69
211590
1645
03:45
about what it means to be in jail
even for a few days.
even for a few days.
70
213259
3668
03:49
Well, it can mean losing your job,
71
217368
2977
03:52
losing your home,
72
220369
1333
03:53
jeopardizing your immigration status.
73
221726
2067
03:56
It may even mean
losing custody of your children.
losing custody of your children.
74
224169
2774
03:59
A third of sexual
victimization by jail staff
victimization by jail staff
75
227598
2683
04:02
happens in the first three days in jail,
76
230305
2771
04:05
and almost half of all jail deaths,
including suicides,
including suicides,
77
233100
4235
04:09
happen in that first week.
78
237359
1807
04:11
What's more,
if you're held in jail on bail,
if you're held in jail on bail,
79
239787
3120
04:14
you're four times more likely
to get a jail sentence
to get a jail sentence
80
242931
2611
04:17
than if you had been free,
81
245566
1610
04:19
and that jail sentence
will be three times longer.
will be three times longer.
82
247200
2983
04:23
And if you are black or Latino
and cash bail has been set,
and cash bail has been set,
83
251036
4269
04:27
you are two times more likely
to remain stuck in that jail cell
to remain stuck in that jail cell
84
255329
4211
04:31
than if you were white.
85
259564
1541
04:34
Jail in America is a terrifying,
dehumanizing and violent experience.
dehumanizing and violent experience.
86
262061
6286
04:41
Now imagine for just one moment
that it's you stuck in that jail cell,
that it's you stuck in that jail cell,
87
269574
5374
04:46
and you don't have
the 500 dollars to get out.
the 500 dollars to get out.
88
274972
2684
04:51
And someone comes along
and offers you a way out.
and offers you a way out.
89
279072
4056
04:56
"Just plead guilty," they say.
90
284145
1848
04:58
"You can go home back to your job.
91
286559
2096
05:01
Just plead guilty.
92
289182
1430
05:03
You can kiss your kids goodnight tonight."
93
291003
2140
05:05
So you do what anybody
would do in that situation.
would do in that situation.
94
293503
3176
05:08
You plead guilty
whether you did it or not.
whether you did it or not.
95
296703
3538
05:13
But now you have a criminal record
96
301173
2477
05:15
that's going to follow you
for the rest of your life.
for the rest of your life.
97
303674
2737
05:19
Jailing people because they don't have
enough money to pay bail
enough money to pay bail
98
307660
3112
05:22
is one of the most unfair,
immoral things we do as a society.
immoral things we do as a society.
99
310796
3853
05:27
But it is also expensive
and counterproductive.
and counterproductive.
100
315369
3040
05:31
American taxpayers --
101
319264
1495
05:32
they spend 14 billion dollars annually
holding people in jail cells
holding people in jail cells
102
320783
4642
05:37
who haven't been convicted of anything.
103
325449
1889
05:39
That's 40 million dollars a day.
104
327362
2313
05:42
What's perhaps more confounding
is it doesn't make us any safer.
is it doesn't make us any safer.
105
330820
3491
05:46
Research is clear
that holding somebody in jail
that holding somebody in jail
106
334915
2502
05:49
makes you significantly more likely
to commit a crime when you get out
to commit a crime when you get out
107
337441
3973
05:53
than if you had been free all along.
108
341438
3658
05:58
Freedom makes all the difference.
109
346440
3331
06:03
Low-income communities
110
351574
1231
06:04
and communities of color
have known that for generations.
have known that for generations.
111
352829
3342
06:08
Together, they have pooled their resources
to buy their loved ones freedom
to buy their loved ones freedom
112
356750
4936
06:13
for as long as bondage
and jail cells existed.
and jail cells existed.
113
361710
3520
06:17
But the reach of the criminal legal system
has grown too enormous,
has grown too enormous,
114
365891
3112
06:21
and the numbers have just too large.
115
369027
2093
06:23
99 percent of jail growth in America
has been the result --
has been the result --
116
371809
4635
06:28
over the last 20 years --
117
376468
1866
06:30
of pre-trial incarceration.
118
378358
2015
06:34
I have been a public defender
for over half my life,
for over half my life,
119
382467
2676
06:37
and I have stood by and watched
thousands of clients
thousands of clients
120
385167
3666
06:40
as they were dragged into those jail cells
121
388857
2140
06:43
because they didn't have
enough money to pay bail.
enough money to pay bail.
122
391021
2352
06:45
I have watched as questions of justice
were subsumed by questions of money,
were subsumed by questions of money,
123
393397
4555
06:49
calling into question the legitimacy
of the entire American legal system.
of the entire American legal system.
124
397976
4169
06:55
I am here to say something simple --
125
403213
3231
06:58
something obvious,
126
406468
1678
07:00
but something urgent.
127
408170
1589
07:02
Freedom makes all the difference,
128
410926
3255
07:06
and freedom should be free.
129
414205
3690
07:09
(Applause)
130
417919
7000
07:17
But how are we going to make that happen?
131
425919
2238
07:20
Well, that's the question
I was wrestling with over a decade ago
I was wrestling with over a decade ago
132
428181
3001
07:23
when I was sitting at a kitchen table
with my husband, David,
with my husband, David,
133
431206
2858
07:26
who is also a public defender.
134
434088
1429
07:27
We were eating our Chinese takeout
and venting about the injustice of it all
and venting about the injustice of it all
135
435541
3665
07:31
when David looked up and said,
136
439230
2412
07:33
"Why don't we just start a bail fund,
137
441666
1884
07:35
and just start bailing
our clients out of jail?"
our clients out of jail?"
138
443574
2290
07:38
And in that unexpected moment,
139
446836
2460
07:41
the idea for the Bronx
Freedom Fund was born.
Freedom Fund was born.
140
449320
2865
07:45
Look, we didn't know what to expect.
141
453026
2047
07:47
There were plenty of people
that told us we were crazy
that told us we were crazy
142
455097
2616
07:49
and we were going
to lose all of the money.
to lose all of the money.
143
457737
2000
07:51
People wouldn't come back
because they didn't have any stake in it.
because they didn't have any stake in it.
144
459761
3143
07:54
But what if clients did come back?
145
462928
2055
07:57
We knew that bail money comes back
at the end of a criminal case,
at the end of a criminal case,
146
465952
3771
08:01
so it could come back into the fund,
147
469747
2248
08:04
and we could use it over and over again
for more and more bail.
for more and more bail.
148
472019
4484
08:08
That was our big bet,
149
476527
1310
08:09
and that bet paid off.
150
477861
1904
08:12
Over the past 10 years,
151
480393
1191
08:13
we have been paying bails for low-income
residents of New York City,
residents of New York City,
152
481608
3672
08:17
and what we have learned
has exploded our ideas
has exploded our ideas
153
485304
3901
08:21
of why people come back to court
154
489229
1814
08:23
and how the criminal
legal system itself is operated.
legal system itself is operated.
155
491067
2688
08:26
Turns out money isn't what makes
people come back to court.
people come back to court.
156
494533
3880
08:30
We know this because when
the Bronx Freedom Fund pays bail,
the Bronx Freedom Fund pays bail,
157
498437
2937
08:33
96 percent of clients
return for every court appearance,
return for every court appearance,
158
501398
4169
08:37
laying waste to the myth
that it's money that mattered.
that it's money that mattered.
159
505591
3588
08:41
It's powerful evidence
that we don't need cash
that we don't need cash
160
509876
4215
08:46
or ankle bracelets
161
514115
1260
08:47
or unnecessary systems
of surveillance and supervision.
of surveillance and supervision.
162
515399
3435
08:50
We simply need court reminders --
163
518858
2745
08:53
simple court reminders
about when to come back to court.
about when to come back to court.
164
521627
2988
08:57
Next, we learned that if you're held
in jail on a misdemeanor,
in jail on a misdemeanor,
165
525553
4095
09:01
90 percent of people will plead guilty.
166
529672
2311
09:04
But when the fund pays bail,
167
532603
1899
09:06
over half the cases are dismissed.
168
534526
2800
09:10
And in the entire history
of the Bronx Freedom Fund,
of the Bronx Freedom Fund,
169
538603
3856
09:14
fewer than two percent of our clients
have ever received a jail sentence
have ever received a jail sentence
170
542483
4697
09:19
of any kind.
171
547204
1315
09:20
(Applause)
172
548543
6976
09:28
Ramel, a week later --
173
556215
2889
09:31
he was still on the boat,
locked in that jail cell.
locked in that jail cell.
174
559128
3329
09:34
He was on the cusp of losing everything,
175
562481
2485
09:36
and he was about to plead guilty,
176
564990
1943
09:38
and the Bronx Freedom Fund
intervened and paid his bail.
intervened and paid his bail.
177
566957
3198
09:42
Now, reunited with his daughter,
178
570179
1937
09:44
he was able to fight
his case from outside.
his case from outside.
179
572140
2808
09:46
Look, it took some time --
180
574972
1303
09:48
two years, to be exact --
181
576299
2064
09:50
but at the end of that,
182
578387
1230
09:51
his case was dismissed in its entirety.
183
579641
2325
09:54
For Ramel --
184
582928
1151
09:56
(Applause)
185
584103
5237
10:01
For Ramel, the Bronx
Freedom Fund was a lifeline,
Freedom Fund was a lifeline,
186
589364
4643
10:06
but for countless other Americans
locked in jail cells,
locked in jail cells,
187
594031
2801
10:08
there is no freedom fund coming.
188
596856
2068
10:11
It's time to do something about that.
189
599528
2067
10:14
It's time to do something big.
190
602173
2331
10:16
It's time to do something bold.
191
604528
2039
10:19
It's time to do something,
maybe, audacious?
maybe, audacious?
192
607016
3378
10:22
(Laughter)
193
610418
1227
10:23
We want to take our proven,
revolving bail-fund model
revolving bail-fund model
194
611669
3270
10:26
that we built in the Bronx
195
614963
1366
10:28
and spread it across America,
196
616353
1824
10:30
attacking the front end
of the legal system
of the legal system
197
618201
2197
10:32
before incarceration begins.
198
620422
1866
10:34
(Applause)
199
622312
1978
10:36
(Cheers)
200
624314
3312
10:39
(Applause)
201
627650
6058
10:45
Here's the plan.
202
633732
1182
10:46
(Applause)
203
634938
1052
10:48
We're going to bail out
as many people as we can
as many people as we can
204
636014
2239
10:50
as quickly as we can.
205
638277
1234
10:51
Over the next five years,
206
639535
1232
10:52
partnering with public defenders
and local community organizations,
and local community organizations,
207
640791
3143
10:55
we're going to set up 40 sites
in high-need jurisdictions.
in high-need jurisdictions.
208
643958
2750
10:58
The goal is to bail out 160,000 people.
209
646732
3233
11:02
Our strategy leverages the fact
210
650453
1612
11:04
that bail money comes back
at the end of a case.
at the end of a case.
211
652089
2508
11:06
Data from the Bronx
212
654621
1220
11:07
shows that a dollar can be used
two or three times a year,
two or three times a year,
213
655865
4811
11:12
creating a massive force multiplier.
214
660700
2313
11:15
So a dollar donated today can be used
to pay bail for up to 15 people
to pay bail for up to 15 people
215
663516
5150
11:20
over the next five years.
216
668690
2009
11:23
Our strategy also relies on the experience
and the wisdom and the leadership
and the wisdom and the leadership
217
671483
5069
11:28
of those who have experienced
this injustice firsthand.
this injustice firsthand.
218
676576
3874
11:32
(Applause)
219
680474
1849
11:34
Each bail project site will be staffed
by a team of bail disrupters.
by a team of bail disrupters.
220
682347
4031
11:38
These are passionate, dedicated
advocates from local communities,
advocates from local communities,
221
686903
4001
11:42
many of whom were formerly
incarcerated themselves,
incarcerated themselves,
222
690928
2609
11:45
who will pay bails and support clients
223
693561
2349
11:47
while their cases are going
through the legal system,
through the legal system,
224
695934
2477
11:50
providing them with whatever
resources and support they may need.
resources and support they may need.
225
698435
3193
11:54
Our first two sites are up and running.
226
702233
2617
11:56
One in Tulsa, Oklahoma,
227
704874
1753
11:58
and one in St. Louis, Missouri.
228
706651
1786
12:01
And Ramel?
229
709120
1150
12:02
He's training right now to be a bail
disrupter in Queens County, New York.
disrupter in Queens County, New York.
230
710634
3524
12:06
(Applause)
231
714182
5441
12:11
Our next three sites are ready to launch
232
719647
2326
12:13
in Dallas, Detroit
and Louisville, Kentucky.
and Louisville, Kentucky.
233
721997
2980
12:17
The Bail Project will attack
the money bail system
the money bail system
234
725878
2929
12:20
on an unprecedented scale.
235
728831
1833
12:23
We will also listen, collect and elevate
236
731369
4485
12:27
and honor the stories of our clients
237
735878
2365
12:30
so that we can change hearts and minds,
238
738267
2455
12:32
and we will collect
critical, national data
critical, national data
239
740746
3644
12:36
that we need so we can chart
a better path forward
a better path forward
240
744414
3640
12:40
so that we do not recreate this system
of oppression in just another form.
of oppression in just another form.
241
748078
4730
12:45
The Bail Project,
242
753434
1161
12:46
by bailing out 160,000 people
over the next five years,
over the next five years,
243
754619
3609
12:50
will become one of the largest
non-governmental decarcerations
non-governmental decarcerations
244
758252
3438
12:53
of Americans in history.
245
761714
1653
12:55
So look --
246
763900
1151
12:57
(Applause)
247
765075
2460
12:59
the criminal legal system, as it exists --
248
767559
2580
13:02
it needs to be dismantled.
249
770163
1903
13:04
But here's the thing I know
from decades in the system:
from decades in the system:
250
772090
2581
13:06
real, systemic change takes time,
251
774695
2715
13:09
and it takes a variety of strategies.
252
777434
1802
13:11
So it's going to take all of us.
253
779260
2156
13:13
It's going to take
the civil rights litigators,
the civil rights litigators,
254
781440
2253
13:15
the community organizers, the academics,
the media, the philanthropists,
the media, the philanthropists,
255
783717
4429
13:20
the students, the singers, the poets,
256
788170
2070
13:22
and, of course, the voices and efforts
of those who are impacted by this system.
of those who are impacted by this system.
257
790264
4370
13:27
But here's what I also know:
258
795924
2441
13:30
together, I believe we can end
mass incarceration.
mass incarceration.
259
798389
3377
13:34
But one last thing:
260
802965
2112
13:37
those people, sitting in America,
in those jail cells,
in those jail cells,
261
805101
3540
13:40
in every corner of the country,
262
808665
2301
13:42
who are held in jail
on bail bondage, right now --
on bail bondage, right now --
263
810990
3306
13:46
they need a lifeline today.
264
814320
2164
13:49
That's where The Bail Project comes in.
265
817322
2026
13:52
We have a proven model, a plan of action,
266
820077
3325
13:55
and a growing network of bail disrupters
267
823426
2120
13:57
who are audacious enough
to dream big and fight hard,
to dream big and fight hard,
268
825570
3820
14:01
one bail at a time, for as long it takes,
269
829414
2974
14:04
until true freedom and equal justice
are a reality in America.
are a reality in America.
270
832412
4750
14:09
Thank you.
271
837589
1150
14:10
(Applause)
272
838763
7000
ABOUT THE SPEAKER
Robin Steinberg - Public defender, activistRobin Steinberg is the CEO of The Bail Project, a new organization designed to combat mass incarceration in the United States by disrupting the money bail system -- one person at a time. As she says: "I hate injustice and simply can't sit still when I see it."
Why you should listen
Robin Steinberg is the CEO of The Bail Project and a senior fellow at the UCLA Law Criminal Justice Program. As she writes: "When I started my career, all I wanted was to be a great public defender for my clients. I vowed to fight for their rights, dignity and humanity in a system that seemed intent on crushing them, their families and their communities. It was hard work, but I woke up everyday inspired and with a sense of purpose -- even when the unfairness of the system made me cry. I was doing my part in the larger struggle for social justice -- one client at a time. But the need to do more, to rethink the very nature of public defense and challenge the larger systemic issues that fueled the cycle of criminalization and poverty led me to start The Bronx Defenders in 1997. For 20 years, I worked to create a new vision of public defense, extending legal representation and advocacy beyond criminal court with the goal of breaking that cycle. That process led to the founding of several new initiatives, including Still She Rises, a public defender office dedicated exclusively to the representation of women in the criminal justice system, and The Bronx Freedom Fund, a revolving bail fund that used philanthropic dollars to pay bail for clients who couldn’t buy their freedom.
"As it turns out, what I love most is getting people out of jail so they can be home with their families and have a fighting chance in court. My new organization, The Bail Project, will take the lessons we learned in the Bronx and go to dozens of high-need jurisdictions with the goal of paying bail for 160,000 people over the next five years, disrupting the bail system, reducing the human suffering it causes and continuing the fight to decarcerate America."
Robin Steinberg | Speaker | TED.com