ABOUT THE SPEAKER
Dan Dennett - Philosopher, cognitive scientist
Dan Dennett thinks that human consciousness and free will are the result of physical processes.

Why you should listen

One of our most important living philosophers, Dan Dennett is best known for his provocative and controversial arguments that human consciousness and free will are the result of physical processes in the brain. He argues that the brain's computational circuitry fools us into thinking we know more than we do, and that what we call consciousness — isn't. His 2003 book "Freedom Evolves" explores how our brains evolved to give us -- and only us -- the kind of freedom that matters, while 2006's "Breaking the Spell" examines belief through the lens of biology.

This mind-shifting perspective on the mind itself has distinguished Dennett's career as a philosopher and cognitive scientist. And while the philosophy community has never quite known what to make of Dennett (he defies easy categorization, and refuses to affiliate himself with accepted schools of thought), his computational approach to understanding the brain has made him, as Edge's John Brockman writes, “the philosopher of choice of the AI community.”

“It's tempting to say that Dennett has never met a robot he didn't like, and that what he likes most about them is that they are philosophical experiments,” Harry Blume wrote in the Atlantic Monthly in 1998. “To the question of whether machines can attain high-order intelligence, Dennett makes this provocative answer: ‘The best reason for believing that robots might some day become conscious is that we human beings are conscious, and we are a sort of robot ourselves.'"

In recent years, Dennett has become outspoken in his atheism, and his 2006 book Breaking the Spell calls for religion to be studied through the scientific lens of evolutionary biology. Dennett regards religion as a natural -- rather than supernatural -- phenomenon, and urges schools to break the taboo against empirical examination of religion. He argues that religion's influence over human behavior is precisely what makes gaining a rational understanding of it so necessary: “If we don't understand religion, we're going to miss our chance to improve the world in the 21st century.”

Dennett's landmark books include The Mind's I, co-edited with Douglas Hofstaedter, Consciousness Explained, and Darwin's Dangerous Idea. Read an excerpt from his 2013 book, Intuition Pumps, in the Guardian >>

More profile about the speaker
Dan Dennett | Speaker | TED.com
TED2003

Dan Dennett: The illusion of consciousness

Dan Dennet: Dan Dennett o zavesti

Filmed:
3,868,782 views

Filozof Dan Dennett prepričljivo pojasni: ne samo, da ne razumemo lastne zavesti, polovico časa nas imajo naši možgani aktivno za norca.
- Philosopher, cognitive scientist
Dan Dennett thinks that human consciousness and free will are the result of physical processes. Full bio

Double-click the English transcript below to play the video.

00:26
So I'm going to speakgovoriti about a problemproblem that I have
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Povedal vam bo nekaj o svoji težavi.
00:29
and that's that I'm a philosopherfilozof.
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Problem je v tem, da sem filozof.
00:32
(LaughterSmeh)
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(smeh)
00:34
When I go to a partyzabava and people askvprašajte me what do I do
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Ko grem na zabavo in me ljudje vprašajo,
s čim se ukvarjam,
00:37
and I say, "I'm a professorprofesor," theirnjihovi eyesoči glazeglazura over.
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povem: "Profesor sem."
V odziv dobim odsotne poglede.
00:42
When I go to an academicakademski cocktailkoktajl partyzabava
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Ko grem na sprejem za akademike
00:44
and there are all the professorsprofesorji around, they askvprašajte me what fieldpolje I'm in
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in so zraven vsi profesorji,
vprašajo, na katerem področju delam.
00:48
and I say, "philosophyfilozofija" -- theirnjihovi eyesoči glazeglazura over.
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Povem, da je to filozofija,
in v odziv dobim odsotne poglede.
00:51
(LaughterSmeh)
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(smeh)
00:53
When I go to a philosopher'sFilozofovo partyzabava
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Ko grem na zabavo filozofov,
00:56
(LaughterSmeh)
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(smeh)
00:59
and they askvprašajte me what I work on and I say, "consciousnesszavest,"
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me vprašajo, na čem delam.
Povem: "Na zavesti."
01:03
theirnjihovi eyesoči don't glazeglazura over -- theirnjihovi lipsustnice curlcurl into a snarlRežati.
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Njihov pogled ni odsoten -
renčati začnejo.
01:08
(LaughterSmeh)
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(smeh)
01:09
And I get hootssod of derisionposmeh and cacklescackles and growlsgrowls
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Požanjem posmeh, hehet in renčanje,
01:15
because they think, "That's impossiblenemogoče! You can't explainpojasnite consciousnesszavest."
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ker si mislijo: "To ni mogoče.
Ne moreš razložiti zavesti."
01:20
The very chutzpahchutzpah of somebodynekdo thinkingrazmišljanje
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Predrznost, da bi si kdo upal misliti,
01:22
that you could explainpojasnite consciousnesszavest is just out of the questionvprašanje.
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da lahko razloži zavest,
ne pride v poštev.
01:26
My latepozen, lamentedpritoževali friendprijatelj BobBob NozickNozick, a fine philosopherfilozof,
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Moj žal preminuli prijatelj Bob Nozick,
odlični filozof,
01:30
in one of his booksknjige, "PhilosophicalFilozofskih ExplanationsPojasnila,"
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je v svoji knjigi "Filozofske razlage"
01:34
is commentingkomentiral on the ethosETHOS of philosophyfilozofija --
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komentiral etos filozofije,
01:39
the way philosophersfilozofi go about theirnjihovi businessposlovanje.
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kako se filozofi lotevajo svojega dela.
01:41
And he sayspravi, you know, "PhilosophersFilozofi love rationalracionalno argumentprepir."
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Pravi, veste, da filozofi
ljubijo racionalne argumente.
01:45
And he sayspravi, "It seemsZdi se as if the idealidealen argumentprepir
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Trdi tole: "Zdi se, da je idealni argument
01:47
for mostnajbolj philosophersfilozofi is you give your audienceobčinstvo the premisesprostore
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za večino filozofov to,
da občinstvu dajo tezo,
01:53
and then you give them the inferencessklepati and the conclusionzaključek,
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potem sklep in nato zaključek
01:58
and if they don't acceptsprejema the conclusionzaključek, they dieumreti.
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in če njihov zaključek ni sprejet, umrejo.
02:02
TheirNjihovega headsglave explodeeksplodira." The ideaideja is to have an argumentprepir
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Glavo jim raznese." Treba je
imeti argument,
02:05
that is so powerfulmočno that it knocksudarci out your opponentsnasprotniki.
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ki je tako močan, da uniči nasprotnika.
02:09
But in factdejstvo that doesn't changesprememba people'sljudje mindsmisli at all.
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A v resnici to sploh ne spremeni
mnenja ljudi.
02:12
It's very hardtežko to changesprememba people'sljudje mindsmisli
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Težko spremeniš mnenja
02:13
about something like consciousnesszavest,
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o nečem takem, kot je zavest
02:15
and I finallykončno figuredfigured out the reasonrazlog for that.
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in končno sem ugotovil,
zakaj je temu tako.
02:20
The reasonrazlog for that is that everybody'svsi so an expertstrokovnjak on consciousnesszavest.
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Razlog je v tem, da smo vsi
strokovnjaki za zavest.
02:24
We heardslišal the other day that everybody'svsi so got a strongmočno opinionmnenje about videovideo gamesigre.
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Zadnjič smo slišali, da ima vsak
svoje mnenje o video igrah.
02:28
They all have an ideaideja for a videovideo gameigro, even if they're not expertsstrokovnjaki.
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Imajo idejo za video igro,
čeprav niso strokovnjaki.
02:31
But they don't considerrazmislite themselvessami expertsstrokovnjaki on videovideo gamesigre;
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In se tudi nimajo za strokovnjake
za video igre,
le trdna prepričanja imajo.
02:34
they'veoni so just got strongmočno opinionsmnenja.
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02:35
I'm sure that people here who work on, say, climatepodnebje changesprememba
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Prepričan sem, da se ljudje,
ki se ukvarjajo s podnebnimi spremembami
02:40
and globalglobalno warmingsegrevanje, or on the futureprihodnost of the InternetInternet,
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in globalnim segrevanjem
ali s prihodnostjo interneta,
02:45
encountersrečanje people who have very strongmočno opinionsmnenja
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srečujejo ljudi z zelo trdnimi prepričanji
02:47
about what's going to happense zgodi nextNaslednji.
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o tem, kaj se bo zgodilo.
02:50
But they probablyverjetno don't think of these opinionsmnenja as expertisestrokovno znanje.
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A verjetno teh stališč
nimajo za strokovno znanje.
02:54
They're just stronglymočno heldpotekala opinionsmnenja.
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To so samo globoka prepričanja.
02:56
But with regardglede to consciousnesszavest, people seemzdi se to think,
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Ko pride do zavesti,
se zdi, da ljudje mislijo,
03:00
eachvsak of us seemsZdi se to think, "I am an expertstrokovnjak.
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vsak od nas misli: "Strokovnjak sem.
03:03
SimplyPreprosto by beingbiti consciouszavestno, I know all about this."
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Ker sem pri zavesti, vem vse o tem."
03:06
And so, you tell them your theoryteorija and they say,
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Poveste jim svojo teorijo in rekli bodo:
03:08
"No, no, that's not the way consciousnesszavest is!
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"Ne, zavest ni taka!
03:09
No, you've got it all wrongnarobe."
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Popolnoma se motite."
03:11
And they say this with an amazingneverjetno confidencezaupanje.
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In to pravijo neverjetno samozavestno.
03:15
And so what I'm going to try to do todaydanes
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Danes bom torej poskusil
03:17
is to shakepretresite your confidencezaupanje. Because I know the feelingobčutek --
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skrhati vašo samozavest.
Saj poznam ta občutek.
03:20
I can feel it myselfjaz.
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Tudi sam ga imam.
03:22
I want to shakepretresite your confidencezaupanje that you know your ownlastno innermostnotranjega jaza mindsmisli --
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Omajati hočem vaše prepričanje,
da poznate svoj najbolj notranji um,
03:28
that you are, yourselvessami, authoritativeavtoritativno about your ownlastno consciousnesszavest.
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da imate nadzor nad svojo zavestjo.
03:33
That's the orderred of the day here.
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To je danes na dnevnem redu.
03:36
Now, this nicelepo pictureslika showskaže a thought-balloonmisli-balon, a thought-bubblemehurček misel.
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Tale slika kaže miselni balon,
miselni mehurček.
03:39
I think everybodyvsi understandsrazume what that meanssredstva.
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Mislim, da vsi vemo, kaj to pomeni.
03:41
That's supposeddomnevno to exhibitrazstavi the streamtok of consciousnesszavest.
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Prikazovalo naj bi tok zavesti.
03:44
This is my favoritenajljubši pictureslika of consciousnesszavest that's ever been doneKončano.
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To je moja najljubša slika zavesti.
03:46
It's a SaulSaul SteinbergSteinberg of courseseveda -- it was a NewNove YorkerYorker coverkritje.
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Gre seveda za Saula Steinberga -
za naslovnico New Yorkerja.
03:49
And this fellowkolega here is looking at the paintingslika by BraqueBraque.
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Tale možakar gleda Braquovo sliko.
03:54
That remindsopozarja him of the wordbeseda baroquebarok, barrackBaraka, barklubje, poodlekoder,
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Spominja ga na barok, barako,
lajež (bark), pudlja,
03:58
SuzanneSuzanne R. -- he's off to the racesdirke.
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Suzanne R. - in tok ga odpelje.
04:00
There's a wonderfulČudovito streamtok of consciousnesszavest here
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Tu gre za čudovit tok zavesti
04:04
and if you followsledite it alongskupaj, you learnučiti se a lot about this man.
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in če mu sledite,
se naučite veliko o tem možu.
04:08
What I particularlyzlasti like about this pictureslika, too,
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Pri tej sliki mi je posebej všeč,
04:10
is that SteinbergSteinberg has renderedopravljene the guy
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da je Steinberg tipa napravil
04:12
in this sortRazvrsti of pointillistpointillist styleslog.
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v tem točkastem stilu.
04:15
WhichKi remindsopozarja us, as RodPalica BrooksBrooks was sayinggovoriti yesterdayvčeraj:
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To nas spominja, kakor je Rod Brooks
včeraj omenil,
04:18
what we are, what eachvsak of us is -- what you are, what I am --
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na to, kaj smo, kaj je vsak od nas -
kaj ste vi, kaj sem jaz,
04:22
is approximatelypribližno 100 trilliontrilijon little cellularcelično robotsroboti.
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to je: približno sto trilijonov
majhnih celičnih robotov.
04:28
That's what we're madeizdelane of.
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Iz tega smo narejeni.
04:30
No other ingredientssestavine at all. We're just madeizdelane of cellscelice, about 100 trilliontrilijon of them.
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Brez drugih sestavin. Samo celice smo,
okoli sto trilijonov le-teh.
04:34
Not a singlesamski one of those cellscelice is consciouszavestno;
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Niti ena od teh celic nima zavesti;
04:36
not a singlesamski one of those cellscelice knowsve who you are, or caresskrbi.
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niti ena od njih ne ve, kdo ste vi,
niti ji to ni mar.
04:41
SomehowNekako, we have to explainpojasnite
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Nekako pa moramo razložiti,
04:43
how when you put togetherskupaj teamsekipe, armiesvojske, battalionsbataljona
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kako, ko sestavimo ekipe,
vojske, bataljone
04:47
of hundredsstotine of millionsmilijoni of little roboticrobotsko unconsciousnezavesten cellscelice --
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stotin milijonov majhnih
robotskih celic brez zavesti,
04:51
not so differentdrugačen really from a bacteriumbakterija, eachvsak one of them --
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ki vsaka zase niso
tako drugačne od bakterije,
04:55
the resultrezultat is this. I mean, just look at it.
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kako je rezultat lahko tole.
Samo poglejte.
04:59
The contentvsebino -- there's colorbarva, there's ideasideje, there's memoriesspomini,
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Vsebina - barva, ideje, spomini,
05:03
there's historyzgodovina. And somehownekako all that contentvsebino of consciousnesszavest
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zgodovina. Nekako je vsa ta
vsebina zavesti
05:07
is accomplisheddoseženo by the busyzaseden activitydejavnost of those hoardsdepojev of neuronsnevroni.
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ustvarjena z delom množic nevronov.
05:12
How is that possiblemogoče? ManyVeliko people just think it isn't possiblemogoče at all.
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Kako je to mogoče?
Mnogi mislijo, da sploh ni.
05:16
They think, "No, there can't be any
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Mislijo si: "Ne, ne more obstajati
05:18
sortRazvrsti of naturalisticnaravoslovne explanationrazlago of consciousnesszavest."
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nikakršna naravna razlaga zavesti."
05:22
This is a lovelylepo bookknjigo by a friendprijatelj of minemoj namedimenovan LeeLee SiegelSiegel,
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To je krasna knjiga
mojega prijatelja Leeja Siegla,
05:25
who'skdo je a professorprofesor of religionreligija, actuallydejansko, at the UniversityUniverza of HawaiiHavaji,
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ki je profesor religije
na univerzi na Havajih.
05:28
and he's an expertstrokovnjak magicianČarovnik, and an expertstrokovnjak
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Je strokovnjak čarodej in strokovnjak
05:30
on the streetulica magicmagija of IndiaIndija, whichki is what this bookknjigo is about,
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za indijsko ulično čarovnijo,
o čemer piše knjiga,
05:34
"NetNeto of MagicMagic."
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"Mreža magije".
05:36
And there's a passageprehod in it whichki I would love to sharedeliti with you.
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V njej je odlomek, ki bi
ga rad delil z vami.
05:39
It speaksgovori so eloquentlyelokventno to the problemproblem.
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Tako jasno govori o težavi.
05:45
"'I'm"Jaz sem writingpisanje a bookknjigo on magicmagija,' I explainpojasnite, and I'm askedvprašal, 'Real"Pravi magicmagija?'
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"Pišem knjigo o magiji," pojasnim,
in vprašajo me: "O pravi magiji?"
05:50
By 'real"pravi magicmagija,' people mean miraclesčudeže,
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S 'pravo magijo' ljudje mislijo čudeže,
05:52
thaumaturgicalthaumaturgical actsdejanja, and supernaturalnadnaravno powerspooblastila.
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tavmaturška dejanja in nadnaravne moči.
05:54
'No,' I answerodgovor. 'Conjuring"Čarovniški trickstriki, not realresnično magicmagija.'
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"Ne," odgovorim.
"O čarovniških trikih, ne o pravi magiji."
05:58
'RealPravi magicmagija,' in other wordsbesede, refersse nanaša to the magicmagija that is not realresnično;
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Z drugimi besedami: 'prava magija'
se nanaša na magijo, ki ni prava;
06:02
while the magicmagija that is realresnično, that can actuallydejansko be doneKončano, is not realresnično magicmagija."
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medtem ko prava magija, tista,
ki jo je možno napraviti, ni prava magija."
06:07
(LaughterSmeh)
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(smeh)
06:11
Now, that's the way a lot of people feel about consciousnesszavest.
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Tako veliko ljudi meni o zavesti.
06:15
(LaughterSmeh)
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(smeh)
06:16
RealPravi consciousnesszavest is not a bagvreča of trickstriki.
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Prava zavest ni vreča trikov.
06:18
If you're going to explainpojasnite this as a bagvreča of trickstriki,
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Če jo hočete razložiti kot tako,
06:20
then it's not realresnično consciousnesszavest, whateverkarkoli it is.
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potem ni prava zavest, karkoli pač že je.
06:23
And, as MarvinMarvin said, and as other people have said,
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In kot so povedali Marvin in drugi:
06:29
"ConsciousnessZavesti is a bagvreča of trickstriki."
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"Zavest je vreča trikov."
06:32
This meanssredstva that a lot of people are just left completelypopolnoma dissatisfiednezadovoljni
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To pomeni, da veliko ljudi ostane
popolnoma nezadovoljnih
06:37
and incredulousneveren when I attemptposkus to explainpojasnite consciousnesszavest.
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in nejevernih, ko skušam razložiti zavest.
06:40
So this is the problemproblem. So I have to
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V tem je torej problem.
Zato moram
06:43
do a little bitbit of the sortRazvrsti of work
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opraviti nekaj takega dela,
06:46
that a lot of you won'tne bo like,
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ki mnogim med vami ne bo všeč
06:50
for the sameenako reasonrazlog that you don't like to see
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iz enakega razloga, iz katerega
si ne želite
06:52
a magicmagija tricktrik explainedpojasnil to you.
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vedeti, kako poteka čarovniški trik.
06:54
How manyveliko of you here, if somebodynekdo -- some smartpameten aleckanej --
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Ko vam kak pametnjakovič
06:58
startsse začne tellingpovedal you how a particularzlasti magicmagija tricktrik is doneKončano,
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začne razlagati, kako narediti
nek čarovniški trik, kdo med vami
07:01
you sortRazvrsti of want to blockblok your earsušesa and say, "No, no, I don't want to know!
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si hoče zatisniti ušesa in reči:
"Ne, ne, nočem vedeti!
07:04
Don't take the thrillvznemirjenje of it away. I'd ratherprecej be mystifiedzmedena.
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Ne uničite vznemirjenja, raje sem v dvomu.
07:07
Don't tell me the answerodgovor."
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Ne povejte mi odgovora."
07:10
A lot of people feel that way about consciousnesszavest, I've discoveredodkriti.
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Ugotovil sem, da ima veliko ljudi
tak odnos do zavesti.
07:13
And I'm sorry if I imposenaloži some clarityjasnost, some understandingrazumevanje on you.
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In žal mi je, če vam bom vsilil
nekaj pojasnil, nekaj razumevanja.
07:19
You'dBi better leavedopust now if you don't want to know some of these trickstriki.
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Če nočete slišati o teh trikih,
raje odidite zdaj.
07:24
But I'm not going to explainpojasnite it all to you.
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A ne bom vam pojasnil vsega.
07:28
I'm going to do what philosophersfilozofi do.
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Po filozofsko bom to rešil.
07:31
Here'sTukaj je how a philosopherfilozof explainspojasnjuje the sawing-the-lady-in-halfžaganje-the lady-v-pol tricktrik.
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Tako filozof pojasni trik
žaganja ženske na pol.
07:37
You know the sawing-the-lady-in-halfžaganje-the lady-v-pol tricktrik?
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Saj poznate ta trik, ne?
07:39
The philosopherfilozof sayspravi, "I'm going to explainpojasnite to you how that's doneKončano.
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Filozof pravi: "Pojasnil vam bom,
kako to poteka.
07:43
You see, the magicianČarovnik doesn't really saw the ladygospa in halfpol."
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Veste, čarodej v resnici
ženske ne prežaga na pol."
07:48
(LaughterSmeh)
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(smeh)
07:50
"He merelysamo makesnaredi you think that he does."
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"Samo zavede vas, da mislite, da jo."
07:54
And you say, "Yes, and how does he do that?"
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"In kako to stori?"
07:55
He sayspravi, "Oh, that's not my departmentoddelek, I'm sorry."
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On odvrne: "To pa ni
moje področje, žal."
07:57
(LaughterSmeh)
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(smeh)
08:02
So now I'm going to illustrateilustrirajte how philosophersfilozofi explainpojasnite consciousnesszavest.
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Pokazal vam bom, kako
filozofi pojasnijo zavest.
08:05
But I'm going to try to alsotudi showshow you
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Hkrati vam bom tudi skušal pokazati,
08:08
that consciousnesszavest isn't quitečisto as marvelousčudovito --
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da zavest ni tako čudovita -
08:11
your ownlastno consciousnesszavest isn't quitečisto as wonderfulČudovito --
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vaša zavest ni tako krasna -
08:13
as you maylahko have thought it is.
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kot ste mislili, da je.
08:15
This is something, by the way, that LeeLee SiegelSiegel talkspogovori about in his bookknjigo.
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O tem Lee Siegel govori v svoji knjigi.
08:19
He marvelsčudeži at how he'llon bo do a magicmagija showshow, and afterwardspotem
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Opisuje, kako bo ustvaril čarovniško
predstavo in kako bodo potem
08:23
people will swearPreklinjati they saw him do X, Y, and Z. He never did those things.
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ljudje prisegali, da je naredil X, Y in Z.
Teh stvari nikoli ne naredi.
08:27
He didn't even try to do those things.
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Niti poskusi ne.
08:29
People'sLjudske memoriesspomini inflatenapihne what they think they saw.
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Človeški spomini napihnejo to,
kar mislijo, da so videli.
08:33
And the sameenako is trueresnično of consciousnesszavest.
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Isto velja za zavest.
08:36
Now, let's see if this will work. All right. Let's just watch this.
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Poglejmo, ali bo tole delovalo. V redu.
Oglejmo si tole.
08:43
Watch it carefullyskrbno.
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Pazljivo glejte.
08:56
I'm workingdelo with a youngmladi computer-animatorračunalniški animator documentariandokumentarnih filmov
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Delam z mladim računalniškim animatorjem
08:59
namedimenovan NickNick DeamerDeamer, and this is a little demodemo that he's doneKončano for me,
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Nickom Deamerjem, ki je zame
napravil tale demo,
09:04
partdel of a largervečje projectprojekt some of you maylahko be interestedzainteresirani in.
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del večjega projekta,
ki vas bo morda zanimal.
09:07
We're looking for a backerSponsor.
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Iščemo podpornika.
09:10
It's a feature-lengthcelovečerni documentarydokumentarni film on consciousnesszavest.
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Gre za celovečerni dokumentarec o zavesti.
09:14
OK, now, you all saw what changedspremenjeno, right?
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No, ste videli, kaj se je spremenilo, ne?
09:20
How manyveliko of you noticedopazili that everyvsak one of those squareskvadratov changedspremenjeno colorbarva?
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Koliko vas je opazilo, da so
vsi kvadrati spremenili barvo?
09:25
EveryVsak one. I'll just showshow you by runningteče it again.
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Vsi. Ponovno vam bom pokazal.
09:34
Even when you know that they're all going to changesprememba colorbarva,
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Celo ko veste, da bodo
vsi spremenili barvo,
09:39
it's very hardtežko to noticeopaziti. You have to really concentrateosredotočiti
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je to težko opaziti.
Res se morate osredotočiti,
09:43
to pickpick up any of the changesspremembe at all.
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da opazite kakršnokoli spremembo.
09:46
Now, this is an exampleprimer -- one of manyveliko --
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To je primer - eden mnogih -
09:51
of a phenomenonfenomen that's now beingbiti studiedštudiral quitečisto a bitbit.
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pojava, ki ga precej preučujemo.
09:53
It's one that I predictednapovedano in the last pagestran or two of my
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Predvidel sem ga na zadnjih straneh svoje
09:57
1991 bookknjigo, "ConsciousnessZavesti ExplainedPojasnil,"
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knjige "Pojasnjena zavest" iz leta 1991,
09:59
where I said if you did experimentsposkuse of this sortRazvrsti,
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kjer sem trdil, da če
izvajate take poskuse,
10:02
you'dTi bi find that people were unablene morem to pickpick up really largevelik changesspremembe.
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boste ugotovili, da ljudje
ne zaznajo zelo velikih sprememb.
10:05
If there's time at the endkonec,
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Če bo na koncu čas,
10:07
I'll showshow you the much more dramaticdramatično caseprimera.
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vam pokažem veliko bolj
dramatičen primer.
10:10
Now, how can it be that there are all those changesspremembe going on,
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Kako je mogoče, da se
dogajajo vse te spremembe,
10:15
and that we're not awarese zaveda of them?
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pa se jih ne zavedamo?
10:18
Well, earlierprej todaydanes, JeffJeff HawkinsHawkins mentionedomenjeno the way your eyeoči saccadessaccades,
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Prejle je Jeff Hawkins omenil,
kako se oko hitro premika,
10:23
the way your eyeoči movespremakne around threetri or fourštiri timeskrat a seconddrugič.
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kako se pogled premakne tri-
ali štirikrat na sekundo.
10:26
He didn't mentionomeniti the speedhitrost. Your eyeoči is constantlynenehno in motiongibanje,
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Ni omenil hitrosti.
Vaše oko se stalno giblje,
10:29
movingpremikanje around, looking at eyesoči, nosesnosovi, elbowskomolci,
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premika naokoli, gleda
oči, nosove, komolce,
10:32
looking at interestingzanimivo things in the worldsvet.
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opazuje zanimive stvari po svetu.
10:34
And where your eyeoči isn't looking,
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In ko oko ne gleda,
10:36
you're remarkablyIzjemno impoverishedosiromašena in your visionvizijo.
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je vaš vid neverjetno slabši.
10:39
That's because the fovealfoveal partdel of your eyeoči,
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To pa zato, ker je fovea očesa,
10:42
whichki is the high-resolutionvisoka ločljivost partdel,
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ki skrbi za visoko resolucijo,
10:44
is only about the sizevelikost of your thumbnailsličico heldpotekala at armsroke lengthdolžina.
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velika le toliko kot noht,
viden na iztegnjeni roki.
10:47
That's the detailpodrobnosti partdel.
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To je detajl, ki ga vidimo.
10:49
It doesn't seemzdi se that way, does it?
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Ampak ne zdi se tako, mar ne?
10:52
It doesn't seemzdi se that way, but that's the way it is.
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Ne zdi se tako, a tako je.
10:54
You're gettingpridobivanje in a lot lessmanj informationinformacije than you think.
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Dobivate veliko manj informacij,
kot si mislite.
10:58
Here'sTukaj je a completelypopolnoma differentdrugačen effectučinek. This is a paintingslika by BellottoBellotto.
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Tole je povsem drug učinek.
To je Bellottova slika.
11:04
It's in the museummuzej in NorthSeverni CarolinaCarolina.
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Nahaja se v muzeju v Severni Karolini.
11:06
BellottoBellotto was a studentštudent of Canaletto'sOsebe Canaletto.
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Bellotto je bil Canalettov študent.
11:09
And I love paintingsslike like that --
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Rad imam take slike -
11:10
the paintingslika is actuallydejansko about as bigvelik as it is right here.
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tale je približno tako velika kot tukaj.
11:14
And I love CanalettosCanalettos, because CanalettoCanaletto has this fantasticfantastično detailpodrobnosti,
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Rad imam Canalettove slike,
ker imajo čudovit detajl,
11:17
and you can get right up
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lahko se približate
11:20
and see all the detailspodrobnosti on the paintingslika.
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in vidite vse detajle na sliki.
11:23
And I startedzačel acrossčez the halldvorana in NorthSeverni CarolinaCarolina,
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Začel sem na drugi strani dvorane
v Severni Karolini,
11:28
because I thought it was probablyverjetno a CanalettoCanaletto,
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ker sem mislil, da gre za Canaletta,
11:30
and would have all that in detailpodrobnosti.
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in sem to videl v podrobnosti.
11:32
And I noticedopazili that on the bridgemost there, there's a lot of people --
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Opazil sem, da je na mostu veliko ljudi,
11:35
you can just barelykomaj see them walkinghoditi acrossčez the bridgemost.
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komaj jih lahko vidite, kako ga prečkajo.
11:38
And I thought as I got closerbližje
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Mislil sem, da ko se bom približal,
11:39
I would be ablesposoben to see all the detailpodrobnosti of mostnajbolj people,
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bom lahko videl podrobnosti večine ljudi,
11:42
see theirnjihovi clothesoblačila, and so forthnaprej.
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njihove obleke in tako naprej.
11:44
And as I got closerbližje and closerbližje, I actuallydejansko screamedzakričal.
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Ko sem bil še bliže, sem kar zakričal.
11:48
I yelledvikala out because when I got closerbližje,
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To pa zato, ker ko sem se približal,
11:50
I foundnajdemo the detailpodrobnosti wasn'tni bilo there at all.
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sem ugotovil, da detajla sploh ni.
11:54
There were just little artfullyumetelno placedpostavljen blobsblobs of paintbarva.
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Samo umetelno postavljene
packe barve so bile.
11:58
And as I walkedhodil towardsproti the pictureslika,
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Ko sem se bližal sliki,
12:01
I was expectingpričakujejo detailpodrobnosti that wasn'tni bilo there.
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sem pričakoval detajl, ki ga ni bilo.
12:04
The artistumetnik had very cleverlyspretno suggestedpredlagal people and clothesoblačila
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Umetnik je pametno nakazal
ljudi in oblačila
12:09
and wagonsvagoni and all sortsvrste of things,
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ter vagone in druge stvari,
12:12
and my brainmožganov had takensprejeti the suggestionpredlog.
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moji možgani pa so sprejeli te znake.
12:15
You're familiarznano with a more recentnedavno technologytehnologijo, whichki is -- There,
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Novejša tehnologija je - vidite -
12:21
you can get a better viewpogled of the blobsblobs.
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lahko bolje vidite packe.
12:23
See, when you get closeblizu
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Ko se približate,
12:25
they're really just blobsblobs of paintbarva.
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so to res le barvne packe.
12:30
You will have seenvidel something like this -- this is the reverseobratno effectučinek.
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Tole ste že videli; gre za obraten učinek.
12:44
I'll just give that to you one more time.
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Še enkrat vam bom pokazal.
12:47
Now, what does your brainmožganov do when it takes the suggestionpredlog?
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Kaj vaši možgani storijo, ko dobijo namig?
12:54
When an artfulPrepreden blobzbirke dvojiških podatkov of paintbarva or two, by an artistumetnik,
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Ko spretna umetnikova packa ali dve
12:59
suggestspredlaga a personoseba -- say, one of
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namigne na osebo - recimo
13:05
MarvinMarvin Minsky'sPotrošiti samostanska cerkev je little societydružbo of mindum --
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majhno družbo umov Marvina Minskega -
13:07
do they sendpošlji little paintersslikarji out to fillizpolnite in all the detailspodrobnosti in your brainmožganov somewherenekje?
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mar pošljejo majhne slikarje,
da zapolnijo vrzeli v možganih?
13:12
I don't think so. Not a chancepriložnost. But then, how on EarthZemlja is it doneKončano?
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Mislim, da ne. Niti slučajno.
Ampak, kako pa se potem to zgodi?
13:17
Well, rememberZapomni si the philosopher'sFilozofovo explanationrazlago of the ladygospa?
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Se spomnite filozofske razlage ženske?
13:22
It's the sameenako thing.
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Gre za isto stvar.
13:25
The brainmožganov just makesnaredi you think that it's got the detailpodrobnosti there.
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Možgani vas napeljejo, da mislite,
da obstaja ta detajl.
13:28
You think the detail'spodrobno je there, but it isn't there.
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Mislite, da je tam, vendar ga ni.
13:31
The brainmožganov isn't actuallydejansko puttingdajanje the detailpodrobnosti in your headglava at all.
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Možgani sploh ne slikajo
detajla v vaši glavi.
13:34
It's just makingizdelavo you expectpričakovati the detailpodrobnosti.
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Samo navedejo vas, da ga pričakujete.
13:37
Let's just do this experimentposkus very quicklyhitro.
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Naredimo hiter poskus.
13:40
Is the shapeobliko on the left the sameenako as the shapeobliko on the right, rotatedzavrti?
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Je oblika na levi ista kot tista na desni,
ki je obrnjena?
13:45
Yes.
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Da.
13:47
How manyveliko of you did it by rotatingRotacijski the one on the left
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Koliko vas je v mislih
obrnilo levo obliko,
13:49
in your mind'sum je eyeoči, to see if it matchedujemanje up with the one on the right?
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da bi videli, ali se ujema z desno?
13:52
How manyveliko of you rotatedzavrti the one on the right? OK.
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Koliko vas je obrnilo desno? OK.
13:56
How do you know that's what you did?
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Kako veste, da ste to storili?
13:58
(LaughterSmeh)
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(smeh)
14:01
There's in factdejstvo been a very interestingzanimivo debaterazprava
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Zadnjih dvajset let v kognitivni znanosti
14:03
ragingdivja for over 20 yearslet in cognitivekognitivno scienceznanost --
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poteka zelo zanimiva razprava,
14:06
variousrazlično experimentsposkuse startedzačel by RogerRoger ShepherdPastir,
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Roger Shepherd je sprožil več poskusov
14:08
who measuredmerjeno the angularKotni velocityhitrost of rotationvrtenje of mentalduševno imagesslike.
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merjenja kotne hitrosti
rotacije miselnih slik.
14:13
Yes, it's possiblemogoče to do that.
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Ja, to se da meriti.
14:15
But the detailspodrobnosti of the processproces are still in significantpomembno controversyPolemika.
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A podrobnosti postopka
so še vedno kontroverzne.
14:22
And if you readpreberite that literatureliteratura, one of the things
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Če berete to literaturo,
14:25
that you really have to come to termspogoji with is
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se morate sprijazniti s tem,
14:28
even when you're the subjectpredmet in the experimentposkus, you don't know.
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da tudi kot subjekt v poskusu,
ne morete vedeti.
14:30
You don't know how you do it.
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Ne veste, kako se to zgodi.
14:32
You just know that you have certainnekateri beliefsprepričanja.
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Veste samo, da ste v nekaj prepričani.
14:35
And they come in a certainnekateri orderred, at a certainnekateri time.
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Prepričanja si sledijo v določenem redu,
v določenem času.
14:38
And what explainspojasnjuje the factdejstvo that that's what you think?
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Kako pojasniti, da je to to, kar mislite?
14:40
Well, that's where you have to go backstagezakulisje and askvprašajte the magicianČarovnik.
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Hja, to je čas, da greste v zaodrje
in vprašate čarodeja.
14:44
This is a figureštevilka that I love: BradleyBradley, PetriePetrie, and DumaisDumais.
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Tale mi je všeč:
Bradley, Petrie in Dumais.
14:48
You maylahko think that I've cheatedgoljufal,
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Mislite, da sem goljufal,
14:50
that I've put a little whiter-than-whitebolj kot bele boundarymeja there.
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da sem označil malo preveč belo mejo?
14:55
How manyveliko of you see that sortRazvrsti of boundarymeja,
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Koliko vas vidi mejo,
14:57
with the NeckerNecker cubekocka floatingplavajoče in frontspredaj of the circleskroge?
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kjer Neckerjeva kocka lebdi pred krogi?
15:00
Can you see it?
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Jo vidite?
15:02
Well, you know, in effectučinek, the boundary'sje meja really there, in a certainnekateri sensesmisel.
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Veste, v bistvu je meja nekako res tam.
15:07
Your brainmožganov is actuallydejansko computingračunalništvo that boundarymeja,
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Možgani ustvarjajo to mejo,
15:10
the boundarymeja that goesgre right there.
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ki poteka točno tukaj.
15:15
But now, noticeopaziti there are two waysnačinov of seeingvidenje the cubekocka, right?
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Opazite, da lahko kocko
vidite na dva načina?
15:17
It's a NeckerNecker cubekocka.
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To je Neckerjeva kocka.
15:19
EverybodyVsi can see the two waysnačinov of seeingvidenje the cubekocka? OK.
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Jo lahko vsi vidite na dva načina?
Prav.
15:23
Can you see the fourštiri waysnačinov of seeingvidenje the cubekocka?
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Jo lahko vidite na štiri načine?
15:27
Because there's anotherdrugo way of seeingvidenje it.
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Ker obstaja še en način.
15:29
If you're seeingvidenje it as a cubekocka floatingplavajoče in frontspredaj of some circleskroge,
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Če jo vidite kot kocko,
ki lebdi pred nekaj krogi,
15:32
some blackčrna circleskroge, there's anotherdrugo way of seeingvidenje it.
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nekaj črnimi krogi,
potem obstaja še en način gledanja.
15:35
As a cubekocka, on a blackčrna backgroundozadje,
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Kot kocka na črnem ozadju,
15:37
as seenvidel throughskozi a piecekos of SwissŠvicarski cheesesir.
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ki jo gledamo skozi
švicarski sir.
15:39
(LaughterSmeh)
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(smeh)
15:42
Can you get it? How manyveliko of you can't get it? That'llDa boste help.
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Vidite? Koliko vas vidi? To bo pomagalo.
15:48
(LaughterSmeh)
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(smeh)
15:50
Now you can get it. These are two very differentdrugačen phenomenapojavov.
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Zdaj vidite. To sta dva
različna pojava.
15:55
When you see the cubekocka one way, behindzadaj the screenzaslon,
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Ko kocko vidite izza zaslona,
16:01
those boundariesmeje go away.
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meje izginejo.
16:03
But there's still a sortRazvrsti of fillingpolnjenje in, as we can tell if we look at this.
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A ostaja še določeno polnilo,
kot lahko vidimo tule.
16:08
We don't have any troubletežave seeingvidenje the cubekocka, but where does the colorbarva changesprememba?
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Nimamo težav videti kocko,
a kje se spremeni barva?
16:12
Does your brainmožganov have to sendpošlji little paintersslikarji in there?
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Ali možgani pošljejo
na delo majhne slikarje?
16:15
The purple-paintersvijolično-slikarji and the green-painterszeleno-slikarji
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Se vijolični in zeleni malarji
16:17
fightboj over who'skdo je going to paintbarva that bitbit behindzadaj the curtainzavese? No.
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borijo za to, kdo bo pobarval
kos za zaslonom? Ne.
16:20
Your brainmožganov just letsdovolimo it go. The brainmožganov doesn't need to fillizpolnite that in.
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Možgani se ne ukvarjajo s tem.
Ni jim treba zapolniti tega.
16:29
When I first startedzačel talkinggovoriti about
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Ko sem začel govoriti o primeru
16:32
the BradleyBradley, PetriePetrie, DumaisDumais exampleprimer that you just saw --
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Bradleya, Petrieja in Dumaisa,
ki ste ga pravkar videli,
16:36
I'll go back to it, this one --
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naj ga še enkrat pokažem -
16:40
I said that there was no filling-inpolnjenje v behindzadaj there.
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sem dejal, da tam ni polnila.
16:47
And I supposeddomnevno that that was just a flatstanovanje truthresnica, always trueresnično.
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Predvideval sem, da je to splošna resnica,
da vedno drži.
16:50
But RobRob VanVan LierLier has recentlypred kratkim shownprikazano that it isn't.
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A Rob van Lier je pred kratkim pokazal,
da ni tako.
16:55
Now, if you think you see some palebledo yellowrumeno --
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Če mislite, da vidite bledo rumeno,
17:00
I'll runteči this a fewmalo more timeskrat.
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bom še nekajkrat pokazal.
17:02
Look in the graysiva areasobmočja,
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Glejte na siva območja,
17:06
and see if you seemzdi se to see something sortRazvrsti of shadowysenčen movingpremikanje in there --
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morda boste videli nekakšne sence,
ki se premikajo.
17:11
yeah, it's amazingneverjetno. There's nothing there. It's no tricktrik.
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Noro, ne? Nič ni tam. Nobenega trika ni.
17:18
["FailureNeuspeh to DetectOdkrivanje ChangesSpremembe in ScenesPrizori" slidezdrs]
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(Nezmožnost opaziti spremembe na slikah)
17:24
This is RonRon Rensink'sOsebe Rensink work, whichki was in some degreestopnja
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To je delo Rona Rensinka, ki ga je nekako
17:26
inspirednavdihnjen by that suggestionpredlog right at the endkonec of the bookknjigo.
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navdihnil predlog na koncu knjige.
17:30
Let me just pausepavza this for a seconddrugič if I can.
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Naj ustavim tole za trenutek.
17:32
This is change-blindnesssprememb slepota.
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To je slepota za spremembo.
17:34
What you're going to see is two picturesslike,
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Videli boste dve sliki,
17:36
one of whichki is slightlymalce differentdrugačen from the other.
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kjer je ena malce drugačna.
17:38
You see here the redrdeča roofstreha and the graysiva roofstreha,
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Tu sta rdeča in siva streha
17:41
and in betweenmed them there will be a maskmaska,
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in med njima bo maska
17:43
whichki is just a blankprazno screenzaslon, for about a quarterčetrtletje of a seconddrugič.
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za četrtinko sekunde,
kar je samo prazen zaslon.
17:47
So you'llboš see the first pictureslika, then a maskmaska,
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Videli boste prvo sliko, potem masko,
17:49
then the seconddrugič pictureslika, then a maskmaska.
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potem drugo sliko, potem masko.
17:51
And this will just continuenadaljuj, and your jobdelo as the subjectpredmet
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To se bo nadaljevalo, vi pa morate
17:55
is to presspritisnite the buttongumb when you see the changesprememba.
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pritisniti gumb, ko vidite spremembo.
17:58
So, showshow the originaloriginal pictureslika for 240 millisecondsmilisekundah. BlankPrazno.
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Pokažimo original za 240 milisekund.
Praznina.
18:06
ShowPrikaži the nextNaslednji pictureslika for 240 millisecondsmilisekundah. BlankPrazno.
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Druga slika za 240 milisekund. Praznina.
18:12
And keep going, untildo the subjectpredmet pressesstiskalnice the buttongumb, sayinggovoriti,
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In tako naprej, dokler udeleženec
ne pritisne gumba,
18:16
"I see the changesprememba."
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kar pomeni: "Vidim spremembo."
18:18
So now we're going to be subjectspredmetov in the experimentposkus.
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Bodimo zdaj mi udeleženci poskusa.
18:21
We're going to startZačni easyenostavno. Some examplesprimeri.
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Začeli bomo enostavno. Nekaj primerov.
18:30
No troubletežave there.
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Brez težav..
18:32
Can everybodyvsi see? All right.
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Vsi vidite? V redu.
18:35
IndeedDejansko, Rensink'sOsebe Rensink subjectspredmetov tookvzel only a little bitbit more
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Rensinkovi udeleženci so potrebovali
18:39
than a seconddrugič to presspritisnite the buttongumb.
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malo več kot sekundo za pritisk na gumb.
18:46
Can you see that one?
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Vidite tole?
18:55
2.9 secondssekund.
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2,9 sekunde.
19:04
How manyveliko don't see it still?
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Koliko vas še vidi?
19:07
What's on the roofstreha of that barnskedenj?
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Kakšna je streha na tistem seniku?
19:09
(LaughterSmeh)
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(smeh)
19:20
It's easyenostavno.
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Enostavno je.
19:46
Is it a bridgemost or a dockdok?
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Je most ali dok?
19:52
There are a fewmalo more really dramaticdramatično onestiste, and then I'll closeblizu.
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Še nekaj bolj dramatičnih pride,
potem pa končam.
19:56
I want you to see a fewmalo that are particularlyzlasti strikingpresenetljivo.
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Morate videti nekaj prav osupljivih.
20:00
This one because it's so largevelik and yetše it's prettylepa hardtežko to see.
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Tale je tako velika, a vseeno
jo je težko opaziti.
20:07
Can you see it?
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Vidite?
20:10
AudienceObčinstvo: Yes.
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(občinstvo:) Da.
20:12
DanDan DennettDennett: See the shadowssence going back and forthnaprej? Prettylepo bigvelik.
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(Dan Dennett:) Vidite, kako gredo sence
naprej in nazaj? Noro.
20:23
So 15.5 secondssekund is the medianmediana time
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Tule je povprečni čas
20:27
for subjectspredmetov in his experimentposkus there.
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udeležencev, 15,5 sekund.
20:29
I love this one. I'll endkonec with this one,
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Tega obožujem. Ta bo zadnji,
20:32
just because it's suchtako an obviousočitno and importantpomembno thing.
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ker je tako očiten in pomemben.
20:37
How manyveliko still don't see it? How manyveliko still don't see it?
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Koliko vas še ne vidi?
Koliko vas še ne vidi?
20:43
How manyveliko enginesmotorji on the wingkrilo of that BoeingBoeing?
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Koliko motorjev je na krilu tega Boeinga?
20:46
(LaughterSmeh)
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(smeh)
20:47
Right in the middlesredi of the pictureslika!
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Sredi slike!
20:53
Thankshvala very much for your attentionpozornost.
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Hvala za pozornost.
20:54
What I wanted to showshow you is that scientistsznanstveniki,
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Pokazati sem vam hotel, da znanstveniki,
20:59
usinguporabo theirnjihovi from-the-outsideod zunaj, third-persontretje osebe methodsmetode,
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ki uporabljajo metode od zunaj,
z vidika tretje osebe,
21:03
can tell you things about your ownlastno consciousnesszavest
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lahko povedo stvari o vaši zavesti,
21:05
that you would never dreamsanje of,
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o katerih vi ne bi niti sanjali,
21:07
and that, in factdejstvo, you're not the authorityorgan
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in da vi niste tak gospodar
21:09
on your ownlastno consciousnesszavest that you think you are.
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svoje zavesti, kot mislite, da ste.
21:11
And we're really makingizdelavo a lot of progressnapredek
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Velik napredek dosegamo
21:13
on comingprihajajo up with a theoryteorija of mindum.
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pri razvoju teorije uma.
21:16
JeffJeff HawkinsHawkins, this morningjutro, was describingopisuje his attemptposkus
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Jeff Hawkins je zjutraj opisoval poskus
21:22
to get theoryteorija, and a good, bigvelik theoryteorija, into the neurosciencenevroznanost.
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priti do dobre velike teorije
v nevroznanosti.
21:26
And he's right. This is a problemproblem.
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Prav ima. V tem je problem.
21:31
HarvardHarvard MedicalMedicinske SchoolŠola onceenkrat -- I was at a talk --
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Nekoč sem bil na predavanju
Harvardske šole medicine,
21:33
directordirektor of the lablaboratorij said, "In our lablaboratorij, we have a sayinggovoriti.
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kjer je direktor laboratorija dejal:
"Pri nas imamo pregovor,
21:37
If you work on one neuronnevron, that's neurosciencenevroznanost.
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da če delate na enem nevronu,
je to nevroznanost.
21:40
If you work on two neuronsnevroni, that's psychologyPsihologija."
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Če delate na dveh, pa je psihologija."
21:43
(LaughterSmeh)
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(smeh)
21:47
We have to have more theoryteorija, and it can come as much from the topna vrh down.
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Potrebujemo več teorije
in ta lahko pride tudi od zgoraj.
21:50
Thank you very much.
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Hvala lepa.
21:52
(ApplauseAplavz)
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(aplavz)
Translated by Klavdija Cernilogar
Reviewed by Nika Kotnik

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ABOUT THE SPEAKER
Dan Dennett - Philosopher, cognitive scientist
Dan Dennett thinks that human consciousness and free will are the result of physical processes.

Why you should listen

One of our most important living philosophers, Dan Dennett is best known for his provocative and controversial arguments that human consciousness and free will are the result of physical processes in the brain. He argues that the brain's computational circuitry fools us into thinking we know more than we do, and that what we call consciousness — isn't. His 2003 book "Freedom Evolves" explores how our brains evolved to give us -- and only us -- the kind of freedom that matters, while 2006's "Breaking the Spell" examines belief through the lens of biology.

This mind-shifting perspective on the mind itself has distinguished Dennett's career as a philosopher and cognitive scientist. And while the philosophy community has never quite known what to make of Dennett (he defies easy categorization, and refuses to affiliate himself with accepted schools of thought), his computational approach to understanding the brain has made him, as Edge's John Brockman writes, “the philosopher of choice of the AI community.”

“It's tempting to say that Dennett has never met a robot he didn't like, and that what he likes most about them is that they are philosophical experiments,” Harry Blume wrote in the Atlantic Monthly in 1998. “To the question of whether machines can attain high-order intelligence, Dennett makes this provocative answer: ‘The best reason for believing that robots might some day become conscious is that we human beings are conscious, and we are a sort of robot ourselves.'"

In recent years, Dennett has become outspoken in his atheism, and his 2006 book Breaking the Spell calls for religion to be studied through the scientific lens of evolutionary biology. Dennett regards religion as a natural -- rather than supernatural -- phenomenon, and urges schools to break the taboo against empirical examination of religion. He argues that religion's influence over human behavior is precisely what makes gaining a rational understanding of it so necessary: “If we don't understand religion, we're going to miss our chance to improve the world in the 21st century.”

Dennett's landmark books include The Mind's I, co-edited with Douglas Hofstaedter, Consciousness Explained, and Darwin's Dangerous Idea. Read an excerpt from his 2013 book, Intuition Pumps, in the Guardian >>

More profile about the speaker
Dan Dennett | Speaker | TED.com