TED2008
Paul Rothemund: DNA folding, in detail
Paul Rothemund 详细讲述 DNA 折叠
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2007年,Paul Rothemund 给TED做了一个关于他自己研究方向,DNA折叠的概述演讲.这一次,他陈述了大量清楚的细节来描述这一领域的广阔前景----来建造极小的机器并让它们进行自我组装.
Paul Rothemund - DNA origamist
Paul Rothemund folds DNA into shapes and patterns. Which is a simple enough thing to say, but the process he has developed has vast implications for computing and manufacturing -- allowing us to create things we can now only dream of. Full bio
Paul Rothemund folds DNA into shapes and patterns. Which is a simple enough thing to say, but the process he has developed has vast implications for computing and manufacturing -- allowing us to create things we can now only dream of. Full bio
Double-click the English transcript below to play the video.
00:12
So, people argue vigorously about the definition of life.
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人们总在激烈的争执生命的定义
00:15
They ask if it should have reproduction in it, or metabolism, or evolution.
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它是否应该具有生殖,新陈代谢或者进化这些特征
00:20
And I don't know the answer to that, so I'm not going to tell you.
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我也不知道这个问题的答案,所以我不会和你们说这些
00:22
I will say that life involves computation.
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我要说的是生命中有计算的过程
00:25
So this is a computer program.
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这是一个计算机程序
00:27
Booted up in a cell, the program would execute,
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包含在细胞里,这个程序将来会执行
00:30
and it could result in this person;
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执行的结果就是诞生了这样一个人
00:33
or with a small change, it could result in this person;
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或者有些小的变动,它就会造出这样的一个人
00:36
or another small change, this person;
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又或者有一些其它的变动,就会是这个人
00:38
or with a larger change, this dog,
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或者是个大一点的变化,也许会变成这只狗
00:41
or this tree, or this whale.
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或者是这棵树,或是这条鲸鱼
00:43
So now, if you take this metaphor
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如果你来认真看待
00:45
[of] genome as program seriously,
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把基因组比成一个程序这样的比喻
00:47
you have to consider that Chris Anderson
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你得把Chris Anderson (TED的创始人)
00:49
is a computer-fabricated artifact, as is Jim Watson,
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想成是一样电脑合成的制品,就像Jim Watson(DNA结构的发现者之一)
00:52
Craig Venter, as are all of us.
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Craig Venter(最早开始研究人类基因组序列的科学家之一) 以及我们每一个人一样.
00:55
And in convincing yourself that this metaphor is true,
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为了说服你自己这个比喻是真的
00:57
there are lots of similarities between genetic programs
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如果注意到基因组程序和电脑程序
00:59
and computer programs that could help to convince you.
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的许多共同点, 那这可以帮助你相信这个比喻
01:02
But one, to me, that's most compelling
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但最吸引我的一点
01:04
is the peculiar sensitivity to small changes
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是对微小变化的特殊敏感性
01:07
that can make large changes in biological development -- the output.
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造就了生物进化中的大的改变
01:10
A small mutation can take a two-wing fly
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一个很小的变异可以把一个双翅的苍蝇
01:12
and make it a four-wing fly.
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变成一个四支翅膀的苍蝇
01:13
Or it could take a fly and put legs where its antennae should be.
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或者也可以把这个苍蝇的腿长在它本该长触角的地方
01:17
Or if you're familiar with "The Princess Bride,"
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或者,如果你对"公主新娘"这个电影很熟悉的话
01:19
it could create a six-fingered man.
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小的变异也可能造就一个有六个指头的人
01:21
Now, a hallmark of computer programs
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现在, 电脑程序的一个重要特点
01:23
is just this kind of sensitivity to small changes.
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就是可以有像(生物世界里)这样的对微小变化的敏感性
01:26
If your bank account's one dollar, and you flip a single bit,
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如果你的银行帐户里有一美元, 你只需要把这一位上的数换一下
01:28
you could end up with a thousand dollars.
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你就能有一千美元
01:30
So these small changes are things that I think
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所以就是这些小的变化让我想到
01:33
that -- they indicate to us that a complicated computation
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它们暗示着一个复杂计算过程
01:35
in development is underlying these amplified, large changes.
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总是暗藏在这些被放大的变化背后
01:39
So now, all of this indicates that there are molecular programs underlying biology,
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所以,所有这些都在暗示着在生物中隐含着分子程序
01:45
and it shows the power of molecular programs -- biology does.
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而且生物本身也体现了这些分子程序的强大力量
01:49
And what I want to do is write molecular programs,
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我想做的是写一些有潜力
01:51
potentially to build technology.
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发展为技术的分子程序
01:53
And there are a lot of people doing this,
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而且有很多人也致力于这一方向
01:54
a lot of synthetic biologists doing this, like Craig Venter.
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有很多合成生物学家在做这些,比如 Craig Venter
01:57
And they concentrate on using cells.
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他们集中精力在利用细胞上
01:59
They're cell-oriented.
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是细胞指向的
02:01
So my friends, molecular programmers, and I
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我的朋友,分子程序师们以及我自己
02:03
have a sort of biomolecule-centric approach.
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有一套以生物-分子为中心的研究方法
02:05
We're interested in using DNA, RNA and protein,
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我们想要利用DNA, RNA 以及蛋白质
02:08
and building new languages for building things from the bottom up,
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为从头开始构建全新的事物创造一种语言
02:11
using biomolecules,
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利用生物分子
02:12
potentially having nothing to do with biology.
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我们希望将来能把这些用在生物学以外的其它领域中.
02:15
So, these are all the machines in a cell.
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细胞中有所有这些"机器"
02:19
There's a camera.
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这是一部照相机
02:21
There's the solar panels of the cell,
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这是细胞中的太阳能电池板
02:22
some switches that turn your genes on and off,
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这是些调控基因的开关
02:24
the girders of the cell, motors that move your muscles.
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这是细胞的大梁, 和驱动肌肉的马达.
02:27
My little group of molecular programmers
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我的分子程序研究小组
02:29
are trying to refashion all of these parts from DNA.
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正在试图从DNA开始重新设计所有这些部件
02:33
We're not DNA zealots, but DNA is the cheapest,
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我们并不是DNA的狂热爱好者,但DNA是最便宜的
02:35
easiest to understand and easy to program material to do this.
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最容易理解的, 而且也适合于对其编程从而实现目的的.
02:38
And as other things become easier to use --
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如果其它的分子变得成容易去利用
02:40
maybe protein -- we'll work with those.
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例如蛋白质,我们也将会利用的.
02:43
If we succeed, what will molecular programming look like?
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如果我们成功了,分子编程会是什么样子的呢?
02:45
You're going to sit in front of your computer.
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你将坐在你的电脑面前
02:47
You're going to design something like a cell phone,
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你将能设计一些东西,比如手机
02:49
and in a high-level language, you'll describe that cell phone.
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而且如果你用一种高级语言,你将能描绘这部手机
02:51
Then you're going to have a compiler
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之后你得有一部编译器
02:53
that's going to take that description
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这部编译器将会接收这些指令
02:54
and it's going to turn it into actual molecules
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然后把它变成真正的分子
02:56
that can be sent to a synthesizer
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这些分子能被送到合成器
02:58
and that synthesizer will pack those molecules into a seed.
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合成器又能把这些分子组装在一起变成一个种子
03:01
And what happens if you water and feed that seed appropriately,
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如果你接着给它浇水而且好好栽培它呢?
03:04
is it will do a developmental computation,
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它会进化成一个计算过程吗?
03:06
a molecular computation, and it'll build an electronic computer.
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一个分子计算过程,而且建立起一个电子计算机.
03:09
And if I haven't revealed my prejudices already,
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如果我还没透露我的观点的话
03:12
I think that life has been about molecular computers
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我认为生命的过程是从分子计算机开始
03:14
building electrochemical computers,
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建造电子化学的计算机
03:16
building electronic computers,
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再接着建电子计算机
03:18
which together with electrochemical computers
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而这些电子计算机和电子化学的计算机
03:20
will build new molecular computers,
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将会创造出新的分子计算机
03:22
which will build new electronic computers, and so forth.
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这些新计算机又将会建造新的电子计算机,如此继续下去
03:25
And if you buy all of this,
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如果你相信所有这些的话
03:26
and you think life is about computation, as I do,
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而且如果你像我一样相信生命全是关于计算的话
03:28
then you look at big questions through the eyes of a computer scientist.
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那你就是在用一个计算机科学家的眼光来看一个重要问题
03:31
So one big question is, how does a baby know when to stop growing?
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一个重要的问题是,婴儿是怎么知道什么时候停止生长的呢?
03:35
And for molecular programming,
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作为一个分子程序员
03:37
the question is how does your cell phone know when to stop growing?
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这个问题就相当于,你的手机如果知道什么时候停止生长
03:39
(Laughter)
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(笑声)
03:40
Or how does a computer program know when to stop running?
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或者说一个电脑程序如何知道什么时候停止运行
03:43
Or more to the point, how do you know if a program will ever stop?
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或者更具体点, 你怎么知道一个程序将有可能会停下来
03:46
There are other questions like this, too.
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当然还有其它类似的问题
03:48
One of them is Craig Venter's question.
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其中一个就是Cragi Venter的问题
03:50
Turns out I think he's actually a computer scientist.
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其实我认为他实际上是一个计算机科学家
03:52
He asked, how big is the minimal genome
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他问,能发展成一个微型生物体
03:55
that will give me a functioning microorganism?
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的最小基因组需要有多大
03:57
How few genes can I use?
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我能少用几个基因?
03:59
This is exactly analogous to the question,
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这个问题其实和,我能写的
04:01
what's the smallest program I can write
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能实现像微软的Word一样功能的最小的程序有多小
04:02
that will act exactly like Microsoft Word?
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是很类似的
04:04
(Laughter)
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(笑声)
04:05
And just as he's writing, you know, bacteria that will be smaller,
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而且在他研究基因组的时候,你知道,细菌将会变小
04:09
he's writing genomes that will work,
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他在研究的基因组能发挥功能
04:10
we could write smaller programs
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我们也能写更小的程序
04:12
that would do what Microsoft Word does.
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而且让它完成像微软的"Word"的一样的功能
04:14
But for molecular programming, our question is,
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但对于分子程序来说,我们的问题是
04:16
how many molecules do we need to put in that seed to get a cell phone?
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我们需要放多少分子到种子里而能让它"长"成一部手机
04:20
What's the smallest number we can get away with?
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我们需要的最小数量是多少
04:22
Now, these are big questions in computer science.
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现在,计算科学领域有一个重大的问题
04:24
These are all complexity questions,
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这些都是复杂的问题
04:26
and computer science tells us that these are very hard questions.
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而且计算科学家告诉我们这些都是相当困难的问题
04:28
Almost -- many of them are impossible.
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几乎,或者说大部分都是不可能回答的
04:30
But for some tasks, we can start to answer them.
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但对于其中的一些,我们可以开始尝试回答
04:33
So, I'm going to start asking those questions
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所以, 我现在要开始问这些
04:34
for the DNA structures I'm going to talk about next.
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关于DNA结构的问题了,这也是我下面要讨论的
04:37
So, this is normal DNA, what you think of as normal DNA.
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在一个正常的DNA里,那种你认为是正常的DNA
04:40
It's double-stranded, it's a double helix,
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它有两股,是双螺旋
04:42
has the As, Ts, Cs and Gs that pair to hold the strands together.
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因为有A,T,C,G这些碱基才能把两股维系在一起
04:45
And I'm going to draw it like this sometimes,
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我下面会用这种方式代表DNA结构
04:47
just so I don't scare you.
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希望不会吓到你们
04:49
We want to look at individual strands and not think about the double helix.
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我们只看这两股中的一股,不把它想成是双螺旋
04:52
When we synthesize it, it comes single-stranded,
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当我们合成的时候,我们先合成单股的
04:55
so we can take the blue strand in one tube
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这样我们可以在一个试管里合成这股蓝色的
04:58
and make an orange strand in the other tube,
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而在另一个试管里合成这条橙色的
05:00
and they're floppy when they're single-stranded.
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它们在单股的时候是松软的
05:02
You mix them together and they make a rigid double helix.
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但当你把它们混合在一起的时候,他们就形成了稳固的双螺旋
05:05
Now for the last 25 years,
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在过去的二十五年里
05:07
Ned Seeman and a bunch of his descendants
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Ned Seeman(纽约大学化学系的一名教授,致力于DNA结构相关的纳米技术的研究)和几个他的学生
05:09
have worked very hard and made beautiful three-dimensional structures
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一直在辛苦研究,并利用这类DNA单股合在一起的反应
05:12
using this kind of reaction of DNA strands coming together.
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做出了漂亮的三维结构
05:15
But a lot of their approaches, though elegant, take a long time.
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他们多数的方法虽然很精致,但需要很长的时间
05:18
They can take a couple of years, or it can be difficult to design.
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也许会需要两三年的时间,或者会特别难以设计
05:21
So I came up with a new method a couple of years ago
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所以我几年前想出了这样一个新方法
05:24
I call DNA origami
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我叫它DNA"折纸"
05:25
that's so easy you could do it at home in your kitchen
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这是项很简单的技术,你甚至可以在自家的厨房里完成
05:27
and design the stuff on a laptop.
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并用笔记本电脑设计这些东西
05:29
But to do it, you need a long, single strand of DNA,
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不过,为了做这些,你需要一个长的单股DNA
05:32
which is technically very difficult to get.
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而从技术角度讲,这种DNA又很难得到
05:34
So, you can go to a natural source.
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所以,你可以找一个自然的来源
05:36
You can look in this computer-fabricated artifact,
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现在来看这个电脑合成的加工品
05:38
and he's got a double-stranded genome -- that's no good.
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他有一个并不太好的双股的基因组
05:40
You look in his intestines. There are billions of bacteria.
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来看他的肠子, 有几十亿的细菌
05:43
They're no good either.
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这也不太妙
05:45
Double strand again, but inside them, they're infected with a virus
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这确实也是双股的,但在内部,它被病毒感染了
05:47
that has a nice, long, single-stranded genome
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其内部有一个很好的长长的单股基因组
05:50
that we can fold like a piece of paper.
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我们可以折叠这个基因组,就像折叠一张纸
05:52
And here's how we do it.
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以下是我们如何做的
05:53
This is part of that genome.
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这是基因组的一部分
05:54
We add a bunch of short, synthetic DNAs that I call staples.
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我们加入一些短小的合成的DNA结构, 我把这些短链叫作 "订书针"
05:57
Each one has a left half that binds the long strand in one place,
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每一个都有一小段可以和长链在某一个地方结全起来
06:01
and a right half that binds it in a different place,
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而另一小段可以结合在长链的另一个地方
06:04
and brings the long strand together like this.
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这样就可以把整个长链改变成这样的结构
06:07
The net action of many of these on that long strand
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许多这些小DNA和长链结合的总结果就是
06:09
is to fold it into something like a rectangle.
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把长链折叠成一个类似于长方形的形状
06:11
Now, we can't actually take a movie of this process,
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目前为止,我们还不能把这一过程拍成电影
06:13
but Shawn Douglas at Harvard
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但是哈佛大学的Shawn Douglas
06:15
has made a nice visualization for us
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为我们做了一个很棒的视觉展示
06:17
that begins with a long strand and has some short strands in it.
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起初的时候有一条长长的链和一些短小的链
06:21
And what happens is that we mix these strands together.
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然后我们把它们混合在一起
06:25
We heat them up, we add a little bit of salt,
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之后加热,并加一点盐
06:27
we heat them up to almost boiling and cool them down,
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把它们加热到几乎到沸腾了,再冷却下来
06:29
and as we cool them down,
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在冷却的过程中
06:30
the short strands bind the long strands
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那些短小的链会和长链
06:32
and start to form structure.
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开始形成结构
06:34
And you can see a little bit of double helix forming there.
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你能在这看到有一点双螺旋形成了
06:38
When you look at DNA origami,
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当你看DNA"折纸"的时候
06:40
you can see that what it really is,
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你能看到它实际上到底是什么
06:43
even though you think it's complicated,
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即使你认为它是个很复杂的东西
06:44
is a bunch of double helices that are parallel to each other,
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其实只是一些双螺旋平行排列在一起
06:47
and they're held together
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它们之所以能组合在一起
06:49
by places where short strands go along one helix
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是因为有那些短小链一端和一个螺旋结合
06:51
and then jump to another one.
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同时另一端再和另一处结合
06:53
So there's a strand that goes like this, goes along one helix and binds --
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所以会有这样的一些链,和一个螺旋并行结合
06:56
it jumps to another helix and comes back.
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同时又跳到另一条螺旋上再回来
06:58
That holds the long strand like this.
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这样能把长链组装成这个样子
07:00
Now, to show that we could make any shape or pattern
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为了展示我们能做成各种我们想要的形状和样式
07:03
that we wanted, I tried to make this shape.
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我想做这样一个形状
07:06
I wanted to fold DNA into something that goes up over the eye,
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我想让DNA这样向上越过眼睛
07:08
down the nose, up the nose, around the forehead,
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到鼻子下面,再回到鼻子上面,绕过额头
07:11
back down and end in a little loop like this.
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再回到下面,像这样完全一个圈
07:14
And so, I thought, if this could work, anything could work.
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然后我想如果能做成这个形状,那任何其它形状都可以
07:17
So I had the computer program design the short staples to do this.
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之后我用电脑程序来设计小的"订书针"来实现这个目标
07:20
I ordered them; they came by FedEx.
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我订购了这些,联邦快运送来的
07:22
I mixed them up, heated them, cooled them down,
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把它们混合起来,加热再冷却下来
07:24
and I got 50 billion little smiley faces
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得到了每滴水中有五百亿个微小
07:28
floating around in a single drop of water.
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的"笑脸"瓢游着.
07:30
And each one of these is just
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而且每一个都只有
07:32
one-thousandth the width of a human hair, OK?
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人类头发的一千之分一那么细.
07:36
So, they're all floating around in solution, and to look at them,
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它们在水里飘浮着,为了能看清楚
07:39
you have to get them on a surface where they stick.
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你需要能找到一个表面能让这些"笑脸"粘在上面
07:41
So, you pour them out onto a surface
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所以,你把它们倒入一个表面上
07:43
and they start to stick to that surface,
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它们开始粘在这个表面上
07:45
and we take a picture using an atomic-force microscope.
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我们再用原子显微镜来照张相
07:47
It's got a needle, like a record needle,
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原子显微镜有一个针,像是个记录针
07:49
that goes back and forth over the surface,
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在表面上往返运动
07:51
bumps up and down, and feels the height of the first surface.
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一会上一会下来感觉表面的高低
07:54
It feels the DNA origami.
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它能感觉到DNA"折纸"
07:56
There's the atomic-force microscope working
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这里有一个原子显微镜在工作
07:59
and you can see that the landing's a little rough.
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你能看到表面有一点起伏不平
08:00
When you zoom in, they've got, you know,
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当你放大来看,这些"笑脸"
08:02
weak jaws that flip over their heads
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有些下巴与额头重叠在一起
08:03
and some of their noses get punched out, but it's pretty good.
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有些"笑脸"的鼻子被打了,但总体来说是不错的
08:06
You can zoom in and even see the extra little loop,
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你能继续放大,看到更小的多出来的小圈
08:08
this little nano-goatee.
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这些小小的纳米级的山羊胡子
08:10
Now, what's great about this is anybody can do this.
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现在,这项技术的好处在于任何人都能做到
08:13
And so, I got this in the mail about a year after I did this, unsolicited.
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我一年前在邮件里收到了别人自发寄来的这样东西
08:17
Anyone know what this is? What is it?
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有人知道这是什么吗?
08:20
It's China, right?
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是中国的版图
08:22
So, what happened is, a graduate student in China,
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事情是这样的,一个中国的研究生
08:24
Lulu Qian, did a great job.
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钱露露(音译),做了一个很棒的工作
08:26
She wrote all her own software
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她自己写了程序
08:28
to design and built this DNA origami,
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来设计并构建这些DNA 折纸
08:30
a beautiful rendition of China, which even has Taiwan,
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一份十分漂亮的中国版图,还包括台湾
08:33
and you can see it's sort of on the world's shortest leash, right?
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而且你能看到可能是世界上最短的一条绳子了,是吧?
08:36
(Laughter)
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(笑声)
08:39
So, this works really well
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所以这个方法确实很好用
08:41
and you can make patterns as well as shapes, OK?
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而且除了形状外你还能设计不同的样式
08:44
And you can make a map of the Americas and spell DNA with DNA.
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你可以做一张美国的地图,并用DNA来拼写"DNA"这个单词
08:47
And what's really neat about it --
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最精彩的是
08:50
well, actually, this all looks like nano-artwork,
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这些看上去都像是纳米级的艺术品
08:52
but it turns out that nano-artwork
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但实际上纳米级的艺术品
08:53
is just what you need to make nano-circuits.
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其实就是建造纳米级的电路板所需要的东西
08:55
So, you can put circuit components on the staples,
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所以,你可以把电路板的组件安在这些"订书针"上
08:57
like a light bulb and a light switch.
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就像一个电灯泡和一个灯的开关
08:59
Let the thing assemble, and you'll get some kind of a circuit.
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让这些东西组装起来,你就能得到一个电路板
09:02
And then you can maybe wash the DNA away and have the circuit left over.
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之后可以把DNA洗掉,而就只剩下电路板
09:05
So, this is what some colleagues of mine at Caltech did.
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这是我在加州理工大学的一些同事们做的工作
09:07
They took a DNA origami, organized some carbon nano-tubes,
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他们把DNA"折纸",和用有机分子修饰过的碳纳米管
09:10
made a little switch, you see here, wired it up,
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来组装成小的开关,看这里,把它绕起来
09:12
tested it and showed that it is indeed a switch.
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测试后发现它真的是一个开关
09:15
Now, this is just a single switch
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现在它只是单个开关
09:17
and you need half a billion for a computer, so we have a long way to go.
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你需要五亿个这样的单元来组装电脑,所以我们还有很长的路要走
09:21
But this is very promising
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但这却是很有前景的
09:23
because the origami can organize parts just one-tenth the size
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因为这些"折纸"能组装只有普通电脑组件十分之一
09:28
of those in a normal computer.
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那么大的组件
09:29
So it's very promising for making small computers.
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所以这项技术是很有前景能组装出小计算机的
09:32
Now, I want to get back to that compiler.
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现在,我想再回去编译器的话题上
09:35
The DNA origami is a proof that that compiler actually works.
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DNA"折纸"能证明编译器是真的能工作的
09:39
So, you start with something in the computer.
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所以,你在电脑里开始了某一项工作
09:41
You get a high-level description of the computer program,
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你有一个高级的关于电脑程序的说明
09:44
a high-level description of the origami.
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一个高级的关于"折纸"的说明
09:46
You can compile it to molecules, send it to a synthesizer,
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你能把这些编译成分子,把它发给组装的人
09:49
and it actually works.
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而且它还确实可以工作
09:50
And it turns out that a company has made a nice program
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事实上有个公司发明了一个很好的程序
09:54
that's much better than my code, which was kind of ugly,
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一个比我的丑陋程序要好得多的程序
09:56
and will allow us to do this in a nice,
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这个程序能让我们更好的实现设计过程
09:57
visual, computer-aided design way.
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用一种电脑辅助的视觉设计方法
10:00
So, now you can say, all right,
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现在,你就能明白
10:01
why isn't DNA origami the end of the story?
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为什么DNA "折纸"不是一个终结
10:03
You have your molecular compiler, you can do whatever you want.
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你有分子的编译器,你能用它实现任何你想做的事
10:05
The fact is that it does not scale.
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问题是它不能大规模生产
10:08
So if you want to build a human from DNA origami,
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所以如果你想从DNA"折纸"起发展成一个人
10:11
the problem is, you need a long strand
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问题是,你需要很长的一股DNA
10:13
that's 10 trillion trillion bases long.
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大概需要有十万亿万亿碱基的DNA链
10:16
That's three light years' worth of DNA,
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相当于三光年长的DNA
10:18
so we're not going to do this.
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所以我们不能这么做
10:20
We're going to turn to another technology,
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我们得用别的技术
10:22
called algorithmic self-assembly of tiles.
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一种叫作模块的算术自行组装的方法
10:24
It was started by Erik Winfree,
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这项技术是由Erik Winfree 发明的
10:26
and what it does,
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这项技术是
10:27
it has tiles that are a hundredth the size of a DNA origami.
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它有一些大约是DNA"折纸"百分之一长度的模块
10:31
You zoom in, there are just four DNA strands
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如果你放大来看,那有四股DNA
10:34
and they have little single-stranded bits on them
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这上面有很小的单股的小片段
10:36
that can bind to other tiles, if they match.
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如果相互匹配，这些小片段可以和别的模块连接在一起
10:38
And we like to draw these tiles as little squares.
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我们用小的正方形来代表这些模块
10:42
And if you look at their sticky ends, these little DNA bits,
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如果你注意到它们的粘性末端,这些小的DNA片段
10:44
you can see that they actually form a checkerboard pattern.
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你能看到它们能形成一个格子图案
10:47
So, these tiles would make a complicated, self-assembling checkerboard.
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所以这些小的模块将会自动组装成一个复杂的格子图案
10:50
And the point of this, if you didn't catch that,
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关键是你可能没有注意到
10:52
is that tiles are a kind of molecular program
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这些小模块其实类似于分子程序
10:55
and they can output patterns.
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而且他们能呈现出某种样式
10:58
And a really amazing part of this is
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最神奇的地方是
11:00
that any computer program can be translated
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任何电脑程序都能被
11:02
into one of these tile programs -- specifically, counting.
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转录成这样一些模块程序,更确切地说,计数.
11:05
So, you can come up with a set of tiles
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你可以准备好一些模块
11:08
that when they come together, form a little binary counter
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当这些模块被放在一起的时候, 能形成一个二进制的计数器
11:11
rather than a checkerboard.
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而不只是一个格子图案
11:13
So you can read off binary numbers five, six and seven.
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你能直接读出二进制的五,六和七
11:16
And in order to get these kinds of computations started right,
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为了能让这类的计算正确开始
11:19
you need some kind of input, a kind of seed.
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你需要输入一些东西,类似于一个种子
11:21
You can use DNA origami for that.
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你可以用DNA"折纸"来当种子
11:23
You can encode the number 32
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你可以把32编码到
11:25
in the right-hand side of a DNA origami,
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DNA"折纸"的右手边
11:27
and when you add those tiles that count,
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然后当你加入那些能计数的模块后
11:29
they will start to count -- they will read that 32
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它们将开始计数,当它们读到32时
11:32
and they'll stop at 32.
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他们就能停下来
11:34
So, what we've done is we've figured out a way
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所以,我们所做的就是找到了一种方法
11:37
to have a molecular program know when to stop going.
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能让一个分子程序知道什么时候停止生长
11:40
It knows when to stop growing because it can count.
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它知道什么时候停下来,因为它能计算
11:42
It knows how big it is.
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它知道已经长了有多大
11:44
So, that answers that sort of first question I was talking about.
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所以,这就能回答我提出的第一个问题
11:47
It doesn't tell us how babies do it, however.
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但它还是不能告诉我们婴儿是如何做到这一点的.
11:50
So now, we can use this counting to try and get at much bigger things
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现在,我们能用这种计数方法来试着做出
11:54
than DNA origami could otherwise.
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比DNA"折纸"能做到的更大的东西来
11:55
Here's the DNA origami, and what we can do
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这是一个DNA"折纸",我们能做的是
11:58
is we can write 32 on both edges of the DNA origami,
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在DNA"折纸"的两条边都写上32
12:01
and we can now use our watering can
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我们现在能用"洒水壶"来给
12:03
and water with tiles, and we can start growing tiles off of that
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这些模块"浇水",从这些模块再长出新的模块
12:07
and create a square.
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来组成一个正方形
12:09
The counter serves as a template
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计数器就好像是个一模板
12:12
to fill in a square in the middle of this thing.
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填充在正方形的中央
12:14
So, what we've done is we've succeeded
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这样,我们就能成功地
12:15
in making something much bigger than a DNA origami
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利用DNA"折纸"和模块的组合
12:18
by combining DNA origami with tiles.
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来合成比DNA"折纸"更大许多的东西
12:21
And the neat thing about it is, is that it's also reprogrammable.
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巧妙的是,它能够重复编写
12:24
You can just change a couple of the DNA strands in this binary representation
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通过改变二进制代表里的几股DNA
12:28
and you'll get 96 rather than 32.
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你就能得到一个96而不是32
12:31
And if you do that, the origami's the same size,
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在这前提下,如果你保持DNA"折纸"的大小不变
12:34
but the resulting square that you get is three times bigger.
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你就能得到一个比原来大三倍的正方形
12:39
So, this sort of recapitulates
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简单来概括一下
12:40
what I was telling you about development.
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我所讲的生长
12:42
You have a very sensitive computer program
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你有一个很敏感的电脑程序
12:45
where small changes -- single, tiny, little mutations --
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其中很小的变化, 单个的,很微小的变异
12:48
can take something that made one size square
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能把一个本来能生产出一个某个尺寸的正方形
12:50
and make something very much bigger.
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变成生产出一些特别大的东西来
12:54
Now, this -- using counting to compute
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这种利用计数来计算
12:57
and build these kinds of things
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并利用这种发展过程来
12:59
by this kind of developmental process
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构建这种东西的过程
13:01
is something that also has bearing on Craig Venter's question.
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也是Craig Venter关心的问题
13:05
So, you can ask, how many DNA strands are required
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所以,如果你问,到底需要多少股DNA
13:07
to build a square of a given size?
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来建造一个特定大小的正方形?
13:09
If we wanted to make a square of size 10, 100 or 1,000,
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如果我们想建一个10或者100或者1000那么大的正方形
13:14
if we used DNA origami alone,
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如果我们只用DNA"折纸"
13:16
we would require a number of DNA strands that's the square
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我们得需要一个有正方形边长
13:19
of the size of that square;
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平方那么多股的DNA"折纸"
13:21
so we'd need 100, 10,000 or a million DNA strands.
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我们就得需要100或者10000甚至1百万股DNA
13:23
That's really not affordable.
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这个数字实在是太大了
13:25
But if we use a little computation --
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但如果我们用一点计算的方法
13:27
we use origami, plus some tiles that count --
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我们用DNA"折纸", 外加一些能计数的模块
13:31
then we can get away with using 100, 200 or 300 DNA strands.
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那我们只需要100或者200或者300股DNA
13:34
And so we can exponentially reduce the number of DNA strands we use,
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这样我们就能指数级的减少需要用的DNA
13:39
if we use counting, if we use a little bit of computation.
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如果我们用一点计算的方法的话.
13:42
And so computation is some very powerful way
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计算是一种很有效的方法
13:45
to reduce the number of molecules you need to build something,
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能用来减少为了建造这些东西而需要的分子数量
13:48
to reduce the size of the genome that you're building.
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也可以减少你建造的基因组的大小
13:51
And finally, I'm going to get back to that sort of crazy idea
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最后,我还是回到那个
13:54
about computers building computers.
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有关计算机再建造计算机的疯狂想法
13:56
If you look at the square that you build with the origami
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看着这个用DNA"折纸"建造的正方形
13:59
and some counters growing off it,
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和从它长出来的计数器
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the pattern that it has is exactly the pattern that you need
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它的样式就和你要建一个内存所需要的样式
14:04
to make a memory.
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是一模一样的
14:05
So if you affix some wires and switches to those tiles --
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所以如果你在模块上附上一些电线和开关
14:08
rather than to the staple strands, you affix them to the tiles --
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或者说把它们附在模块上,而不是DNA短链上
14:11
then they'll self-assemble the somewhat complicated circuits,
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之后他们就能自己组装成有一点复杂的电路
14:14
the demultiplexer circuits, that you need to address this memory.
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那种你在内存里会需要的解复用器
14:17
So you can actually make a complicated circuit
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所以你能用一点计算来建一个
14:19
using a little bit of computation.
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复杂的电路.
14:21
It's a molecular computer building an electronic computer.
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这是一个分子计算机建电子计算机的过程
14:24
Now, you ask me, how far have we gotten down this path?
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你也许会问,在这条路上我们已经走了多远?
14:27
Experimentally, this is what we've done in the last year.
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从实验角度来说,这是我们去年完成的.
14:30
Here is a DNA origami rectangle,
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这里有一个DNA"折纸"的长方形
14:33
and here are some tiles growing from it.
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和一些从它长出来的模块.
14:35
And you can see how they count.
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你能看出来它们是怎么计数的.
14:37
One, two, three, four, five, six, nine, 10, 11, 12, 17.
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一,二,三,四,五,六,九,十,十一,十二,十七
14:49
So it's got some errors, but at least it counts up.
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它有错误,但至少能越数越大
14:53
(Laughter)
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(笑声)
14:54
So, it turns out we actually had this idea nine years ago,
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实际上,我们九年前就开始有了这一想法
14:57
and that's about the time constant for how long it takes
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这大约就是做这件事必须得投入的时间
15:00
to do these kinds of things, so I think we made a lot of progress.
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我觉得我们有很大进步.
15:02
We've got ideas about how to fix these errors.
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我们现在也有想法去校正这些错误.
15:04
And I think in the next five or 10 years,
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我认为在未来的五或十年里
15:06
we'll make the kind of squares that I described
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我们将能做出我刚才形容的那种正方形
15:08
and maybe even get to some of those self-assembled circuits.
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或者还能做一些那种自我组装的电路.
15:11
So now, what do I want you to take away from this talk?
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我希望你们今天能从我的讲解里学到什么呢?
15:15
I want you to remember that
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我希望你们能记住
15:17
to create life's very diverse and complex forms,
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为了创造出生物体非常多样和复杂的形式
15:21
life uses computation to do that.
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生物要用计算来实现这一目标.
15:23
And the computations that it uses, they're molecular computations,
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而且它所用的计算是分子计算形式,
15:27
and in order to understand this and get a better handle on it,
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为了能理解并更好的利用这一点
15:29
as Feynman said, you know,
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就像费曼说的,
15:31
we need to build something to understand it.
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为了理解某样东西,我们得建造一个出来
15:33
And so we are going to use molecules and refashion this thing,
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我们将用分子,重新设计这些东西
15:37
rebuild everything from the bottom up,
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并从头开始从新建造每一样东西
15:39
using DNA in ways that nature never intended,
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用一种自然从未用过的方式
15:42
using DNA origami,
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用DNA"折纸"
15:44
and DNA origami to seed this algorithmic self-assembly.
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和DNA"折纸"引导的算法的自我组装.
15:47
You know, so this is all very cool,
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你知道的,所有这些都很棒
15:50
but what I'd like you to take from the talk,
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但我希望你们能从这个演讲
15:51
hopefully from some of those big questions,
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提及的问题当中有所收获
15:53
is that this molecular programming isn't just about making gadgets.
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这类的分子程序不仅仅是建一些小工具
15:56
It's not just making about --
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它不仅仅是能造.....
15:58
it's making self-assembled cell phones and circuits.
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能用来建自我组装的手机和电路
16:00
What it's really about is taking computer science
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真正关键的是,利用计算科学
16:02
and looking at big questions in a new light,
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并且用一种新的眼光看待大问题
16:05
asking new versions of those big questions
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从新的角度来问这些问题
16:07
and trying to understand how biology
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并且试图理解生物
16:09
can make such amazing things. Thank you.
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是如何创造这些另人惊奇的事物的. 谢谢.
16:12
(Applause)
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(掌声)
ABOUT THE SPEAKER
Paul Rothemund - DNA origamistPaul Rothemund folds DNA into shapes and patterns. Which is a simple enough thing to say, but the process he has developed has vast implications for computing and manufacturing -- allowing us to create things we can now only dream of.
Why you should listen
Paul Rothemund won a MacArthur grant this year for a fairly mystifying study area: "folding DNA." It brings up the question: Why fold DNA? The answer is -- because the power to manipulate DNA in this way could change the way we make things at a very basic level.
Rothemund's work combines the study of self-assembly (watch the TEDTalks from Neil Gershenfeld and Saul Griffith for more on this) with the research being done in DNA nanotechnology -- and points the way toward self-assembling devices at microscale, making computer memory, for instance, smaller, faster and maybe even cheaper.
Paul Rothemund | Speaker | TED.com