TEDSalon 2009 Compassion
Robert Wright: The evolution of compassion
Robert Wright: 同情心的进化论
Filmed:
Readability: 4.3
292,619 views
Robert Wright用进化生物学和博弈论解释了为什么我们赏识“勿施于人”的黄金法则，为什么我们有时会忽略它并且为什么还存在着希望是，在不久的将来，我们都可能有同情心去遵循它。
Robert Wright - Journalist, philosopher
The best-selling author of "Nonzero," "The Moral Animal" and "The Evolution of God," Robert Wright draws on his wide-ranging knowledge of science, religion, psychology, history and politics to figure out what makes humanity tick -- and what makes us moral. Full bio
The best-selling author of "Nonzero," "The Moral Animal" and "The Evolution of God," Robert Wright draws on his wide-ranging knowledge of science, religion, psychology, history and politics to figure out what makes humanity tick -- and what makes us moral. Full bio
Double-click the English transcript below to play the video.
00:13
I'm going to talk about compassion and the golden rule
0
1000
4000
我将要谈谈同情心和黄金法则
00:17
from a secular perspective and even from a kind of scientific perspective.
1
5000
6000
从一个非宗教的角度，更从一种科学的角度。
00:23
I'm going to try to give you a little bit of a natural history
2
11000
3000
我将试图告诉你一点
00:26
of compassion and the golden rule.
3
14000
2000
同情心和黄金法则的自然历史。
00:28
So, I'm going to be sometimes using kind of clinical language,
4
16000
5000
所以，我有的时候将会用比较客观的语言，
00:33
and so it's not going to sound as warm and fuzzy
5
21000
2000
所以可能不会听起来温暖和模糊
00:35
as your average compassion talk.
6
23000
2000
就像你一般听到的有关同情心的演讲。
00:37
I want to warn you about that.
7
25000
3000
我想提醒你这点。
00:40
So, I do want to say, at the outset, that I think compassion's great.
8
28000
4000
所以，我确实想说，起初，我觉得，同情心很棒。
00:44
The golden rule is great. I'm a big supporter of both.
9
32000
3000
黄金法则很棒。我是它们俩的超级支持者。
00:47
And I think it's great that
10
35000
2000
而且我觉得世界上的宗教，
00:49
the leaders of the religions of the world
11
37000
3000
世界上的宗教领袖
00:52
are affirming compassion and the golden rule as fundamental principles
12
40000
5000
断言同情心和黄金法则是
00:57
that are integral to their faiths.
13
45000
3000
他们的信仰的基础原则也是件很棒的事。
01:00
At the same time, I think religions don't deserve all the credit.
14
48000
3000
同时，我想宗教并不是万能的。
01:03
I think nature gave them a helping hand here.
15
51000
4000
我觉得在这方面自然帮了它们一把。
01:07
I'm going to argue tonight that compassion and the golden rule
16
55000
5000
今晚我要讨论的是同情和黄金法则
01:12
are, in a certain sense, built into human nature.
17
60000
3000
在一定程度上，是人性自然的一部分。
01:15
But I'm also going to argue
18
63000
2000
好。但是我还觉得
01:17
that once you understand the sense in which they are built into human nature,
19
65000
4000
一旦你理解了他们是人性自然的一部分的感觉后，
01:21
you realize that just affirming compassion,
20
69000
4000
你将意识到只是确认同情心，
01:25
and affirming the golden rule, is really not enough.
21
73000
3000
确认黄金法则，是远远不够的。
01:28
There's a lot of work to be done after that.
22
76000
3000
之后还有很多工作要做。好。
01:31
OK so, a quick natural history, first of compassion.
23
79000
5000
好。所以，很快的过一下自然历史，首先，同情心。
01:36
In the beginning, there was compassion,
24
84000
3000
在最初，出现了同情心，
01:39
and I mean not just when human beings first showed up,
25
87000
3000
而且，我的意思是，不只是人类出现的时候，
01:42
but actually even before that.
26
90000
2000
而事实上是更早。
01:44
I think it's probably the case that, in the human evolutionary lineage,
27
92000
4000
我想这可能是这样，在人类的演化谱系，
01:48
even before there were homo sapiens,
28
96000
3000
甚至比智人出现的更早，
01:51
feelings like compassion and love and sympathy
29
99000
2000
同情心、爱和怜悯的感觉
01:53
had earned their way into the gene pool,
30
101000
4000
已经找到了进入基因库的方式，
01:57
and biologists have a pretty clear idea of how this first happened.
31
105000
3000
并且生物学家对它最初的出现已经有了很清晰的想法。
02:00
It happened through a principle known as kin selection.
32
108000
4000
它是通过亲缘选择的原则出现的。
02:04
And the basic idea of kin selection is that,
33
112000
6000
亲缘选择的基本想法是，
02:10
if an animal feels compassion for a close relative,
34
118000
3000
如果一个动物对近亲有同情的感觉，
02:13
and this compassion leads the animal to help the relative,
35
121000
4000
而且这种同情使这个动物去帮助这个亲戚，
02:17
then, in the end, the compassion actually winds up helping the genes
36
125000
5000
最终，这种同情心事实上帮助这个基因
02:22
underlying the compassion itself.
37
130000
3000
隐含在这个同情心本身。
02:25
So, from a biologist's point of view, compassion is actually
38
133000
4000
所以，从一个生物学家的角度看，同情心是事实上
02:29
a gene's way of helping itself. OK.
39
137000
4000
一个基因帮助它自己的方式。好。
02:33
I warned you this was not going to be very warm and fuzzy.
40
141000
4000
我提醒过你这将不是那么温暖和模糊不清。好吧。
02:37
I'll get there -- I hope to get a little fuzzier.
41
145000
3000
我继续。我希望说得有一点模糊。
02:40
This doesn't bother me so much,
42
148000
2000
对我来说这不是－－这并不让我觉得那么麻烦，
02:42
that the underlying Darwinian rationale of compassion
43
150000
4000
这隐含在达尔文原理的同情心
02:46
is kind of self-serving at the genetic level.
44
154000
2000
在基因的层面上是为自我服务的。
02:48
Actually, I think the bad news about kin selection
45
156000
3000
事实上，我觉得坏消息是关于亲缘选择
02:51
is just that it means that this kind of compassion
46
159000
4000
只是说明这种同情心
02:55
is naturally deployed only within the family.
47
163000
3000
只是自然的在家庭里展开的。
02:58
That's the bad news. The good news is compassion is natural.
48
166000
3000
这是坏消息。好消息是同情心是自然的。
03:01
The bad news is that this kin selected compassion
49
169000
3000
坏消息是这种亲缘选择的同情心
03:04
is naturally confined to the family.
50
172000
2000
是自然的被局限在家庭中。
03:06
Now, there's more good news that came along later in evolution,
51
174000
4000
现在，在之后的进化中有了更多的好消息，
03:10
a second kind of evolutionary logic.
52
178000
3000
第二种进化的逻辑。
03:13
Biologists call that "reciprocal altruism." OK.
53
181000
3000
生物学家称那是互利主义。好的。
03:16
And there, the basic idea is that
54
184000
3000
互利主义基本的观点是
03:19
compassion leads you to do good things for people who then will return the favor.
55
187000
8000
同情心带领你去为那些能回报你的人做好事。
03:27
Again, I know this is not as inspiring a notion of compassion
56
195000
5000
再一次，你知道，这不是像
03:32
as you may have heard in the past,
57
200000
2000
你过去听到过的同情心的概念那样鼓舞人心，
03:34
but from a biologist's point of view, this reciprocal altruism kind of compassion
58
202000
5000
但是从一个生物学家的角度看，这种互利主义的同情心，
03:39
is ultimately self-serving too.
59
207000
3000
最终还是为自我服务的。
03:42
It's not that people think that, when they feel the compassion.
60
210000
2000
那不是人在感觉到同情心的时候想的。
03:44
It's not consciously self-serving, but to a biologist, that's the logic.
61
212000
5000
那不是有意识的为自我服务，但是，对于一个生物学家来说，那就是他的逻辑。
03:49
And so, you wind up most easily extending compassion to friends and allies.
62
217000
6000
所以，你会最容易对你的朋友和同盟者产生同情心。
03:55
I'm sure a lot of you, if a close friend has something really terrible happen to them,
63
223000
6000
我确信你们大多数人，当一个亲近的朋友身上发生了非常严重的事情时，
04:01
you feel really bad.
64
229000
2000
你会感觉很糟。
04:03
But if you read in the newspaper
65
231000
1000
但是如果你是在看报纸
04:04
that something really horrible happened to somebody you've never heard of,
66
232000
3000
上写有一些很可怕的事情发生在一些你从来不认识的人身上的时候，
04:07
you can probably live with that.
67
235000
2000
你知道，你可以没什么事。好的。
04:09
That's just human nature.
68
237000
2000
那只是人类的本性。
04:11
So, it's another good news/bad news story.
69
239000
2000
所以，这是另一个好消息坏消息的故事。
04:13
It's good that compassion was extended beyond the family
70
241000
2000
好消息是因为同情心在进化的逻辑中
04:15
by this kind of evolutionary logic.
71
243000
2000
超越了家庭的范畴。
04:17
The bad news is this doesn't bring us universal compassion by itself.
72
245000
5000
坏消息这没有给我们带来普遍存在的同情心。好的。
04:22
So, there's still work to be done.
73
250000
2000
所以，还有要做的工作。
04:24
Now, there's one other result of this dynamic called reciprocal altruism,
74
252000
5000
现在，这种互利主义带来了另外一种结果，
04:29
which I think is kind of good news,
75
257000
2000
我觉得是个很好的消息，
04:31
which is that the way that this is played out in the human species,
76
259000
4000
那是以人类物种作为完结，好的，
04:35
it has given people an intuitive appreciation of the golden rule.
77
263000
4000
那使人们对黄金法则有一种直觉的鉴赏。好的。
04:39
I don't quite mean that the golden rule itself is written in our genes,
78
267000
4000
我的意思不是说黄金法则是我们基因的一部分，
04:43
but you can go to a hunter gatherer society
79
271000
4000
但是你可以去一个猎人聚集的，
04:47
that has had no exposure to any of the great religious traditions,
80
275000
3000
没有任何宗教传统的社会，
04:50
no exposure to ethical philosophy,
81
278000
2000
没有伦理道德哲学的显现，
04:52
and you'll find, if you spend time with these people,
82
280000
2000
然后你会发现，如果你花时间和这些人在一起，
04:54
that, basically, they believe that one good turn deserves another,
83
282000
3000
那么，基本上，他们做好事应该得到回报，
04:57
and that bad deeds should be punished.
84
285000
2000
做坏事应该被惩罚。
04:59
And evolutionary psychologists think that these intuitions have a basis in the genes.
85
287000
6000
而且进化论的心理学家认为这些直觉在基因中是有基础的。
05:05
So, they do understand that if you want to be treated well,
86
293000
4000
所以，他们明白如果你要被很好的对待，
05:09
you treat other people well.
87
297000
2000
你应该对很好的对待别人。
05:11
And it's good to treat other people well.
88
299000
2000
而且对别人好是一件好事。
05:13
That's close to being a kind of built-in intuition.
89
301000
4000
那差不多是在直觉中被建立的。
05:17
So, that's good news. Now, if you've been paying attention,
90
305000
3000
所以，那是好消息。现在，如果你注意听了，
05:20
you're probably anticipating that there's bad news here;
91
308000
3000
你可能正在想坏消息是什么，好的，
05:23
we still aren't to universal love,
92
311000
2000
那就是我们还没达到普遍存在的爱，
05:25
and it's true because, although an appreciation of the golden rule is natural,
93
313000
5000
而且那是真的，因为，虽然对黄金法则的理解是自然的，
05:30
it's also natural to carve out exceptions to the golden rule.
94
318000
5000
但是这也很自然地雕刻出黄金法则的例外情况。
05:35
I mean, for example, none of us, probably, want to go to prison,
95
323000
4000
我的意思是，例如，我们中间没有人，或许，想进监狱，
05:39
but we all think that there are some people who should go to prison. Right?
96
327000
3000
但是我们老是觉得有一些人应该被关在监狱里。对吧？
05:42
So, we think we should treat them differently than we would want to be treated.
97
330000
4000
所以，我们觉得我们应该对他们和他们对我们不一样。
05:46
Now, we have a rationale for that.
98
334000
2000
现在，我们对于这个有一个基本原理。
05:48
We say they did these bad things that make it just that they should go to prison.
99
336000
5000
我们说他们做了坏事所以他们就应该进监狱。
05:53
None of us really extends the golden rule in truly diffuse and universal fashion.
100
341000
4000
我们中间没有人真的将用真实的扩散的并且全面的方式将黄金法则扩大。
05:57
We have the capacity to carve out exceptions,
101
345000
3000
我们有这个能力去雕刻出例外情况，
06:00
put people in a special category.
102
348000
2000
将人放在一个特殊的类别里。
06:02
And the problem is that -- although in the case of sending people to prison,
103
350000
4000
问题是，虽然是这种把人送进监狱的情况，
06:06
you have this impartial judiciary
104
354000
3000
你有中立的法官
06:09
determining who gets excluded from the golden rule --
105
357000
4000
来决定，你知道，那是黄金法则之外的人，
06:13
that in everyday life, the way we all make these decisions
106
361000
4000
在每一天生活中，我们作出对于
06:17
about who we're not going to extend the golden rule to,
107
365000
3000
谁将被排除在黄金法则之外的决定，
06:20
is we use a much rougher and readier formula.
108
368000
3000
我们用一个更加粗糟和准备好的公式，
06:23
Basically it's just like, if you're my enemy, if you're my rival --
109
371000
4000
并且基本上是，如果你是我的敌人，如果你是我的竞争对手，好的，
06:27
if you're not my friend, if you're not in my family --
110
375000
2000
如果你不是我的朋友，如果你不是我的家庭成员，
06:29
I'm much less inclined to apply the golden rule to you.
111
377000
5000
我将更少的倾向于将你纳入黄金法则。好的。
06:34
We all do that,
112
382000
2000
我们都差不多这样做，
06:36
and you see it all over the world.
113
384000
3000
而且你可以看到整个世界都是这样。
06:39
You see it in the Middle East:
114
387000
3000
你知道，你看中东。
06:42
people who, from Gaza, are firing missiles at Israel.
115
390000
3000
从加沙来的人正在向以色列发射导弹。
06:45
They wouldn't want to have missiles fired at them, but they say,
116
393000
2000
他们不想向他们发射导弹，但是他们说，
06:47
"Well, but the Israelis, or some of them have done things
117
395000
2000
“那，但是以色列人，或者一些以色列人以前做过一些事情
06:49
that put them in a special category."
118
397000
2000
可以使被放在一个特殊的类别里。”
06:51
The Israelis would not want to have an economic blockade imposed on them,
119
399000
3000
以色列人不希望经济封锁强加在他们身上，
06:54
but they impose one on Gaza, and they say,
120
402000
2000
但是他们希望强加在加沙，而且他们说，
06:56
"Well, the Palestinians, or some of them, have brought this on themselves."
121
404000
3000
“那，巴勒斯坦人，或者是一些巴勒斯坦人，他们自找的。“
06:59
So, it's these exclusions to the golden rule that amount to a lot of the world's trouble.
122
407000
8000
所以，正是这些黄金法则的例外情况给世界造成了很多麻烦。
07:07
And it's natural to do that.
123
415000
3000
而且他们是很自然的这样做的。
07:10
So, the fact that the golden rule is in some sense built in to us
124
418000
3000
所以，在某种程度上黄金发则是我们一部分的这个事实，
07:13
is not, by itself, going to bring us universal love.
125
421000
6000
靠它自己不能给我们带来普遍性的爱。
07:19
It's not going to save the world.
126
427000
2000
它拯救不了世界。
07:21
Now, there's one piece of good news I have that may save the world. Okay.
127
429000
5000
现在，我有一个能拯救世界的好消息。好。
07:26
Are you on the edges of your seats here?
128
434000
3000
你现在紧张吗？
07:29
Good, because before I tell you about that good news,
129
437000
2000
好，因为在我告诉你这个好消息之前，
07:31
I'm going to have to take a little excursion through some academic terrain.
130
439000
5000
我将不得不涉猎一下学术的领域。
07:36
So, I hope I've got your attention with this promise of good news
131
444000
3000
所以，我希望我已经得到了你对于
07:39
that may save the world.
132
447000
3000
这个能拯救世界的好消息的关注。
07:42
It's this non-zero-sumness stuff you just heard a little bit about.
133
450000
3000
它是你们刚听到一点的总和非零。
07:45
It's just a quick introduction to game theory.
134
453000
3000
这只是对游戏理论的一个很快的介绍。
07:48
This won't hurt. Okay.
135
456000
2000
不会让人很难受。好。
07:50
It's about zero-sum and non-zero-sum games.
136
458000
2000
这是有关“零和”与“非零和”的游戏。
07:52
If you ask what kind of a situation
137
460000
4000
如果你问什么样的情况
07:56
is conducive to people becoming friends and allies,
138
464000
3000
有利于人们成为朋友和盟友，
07:59
the technical answer is a non-zero-sum situation.
139
467000
3000
技术的回答是非零总和的情况。
08:02
And if you ask what kind of situation
140
470000
2000
如果你问什么样的情况
08:04
is conducive to people defining people as enemies,
141
472000
2000
是有利于人们定义敌人的概念，
08:06
it's a zero-sum situation.
142
474000
2000
那是零和的情况。好。
08:08
So, what do those terms mean?
143
476000
2000
那么，这些词汇的意思是什么？
08:10
Basically, a zero-sum game is the kind you're used to in sports,
144
478000
3000
基本上，一个零和的游戏，是你习惯在运动会中遇到的，
08:13
where there's a winner and a loser.
145
481000
2000
其中有优胜者和失败者。
08:15
So, their fortunes add up to zero.
146
483000
3000
所以，他们的情况加起来是零。
08:18
So, in tennis, every point is either good for you and bad for the other person,
147
486000
5000
那么，在网球比赛中，每一分都是对于你是好的，对于另外那个人是坏的，
08:23
or good for them, bad for you.
148
491000
2000
或者是对于另外那些人是好的，对于你是坏的。
08:25
Either way, your fortunes add up to zero. That's a zero-sum game.
149
493000
3000
不管怎么看，你们的情况加起来都是零。这就是零和游戏。
08:28
Now, if you're playing doubles,
150
496000
2000
现在，如果你玩双打，
08:30
then the person on your side of the net
151
498000
2000
那么在你网子这边的人
08:32
is in a non-zero-sum relationship with you,
152
500000
3000
与你就是非零和的关系。
08:35
because every point is either good for both of you -- positive, win-win --
153
503000
3000
因为每一分不是对你们俩同时都是好的，积极的，双赢，
08:38
or bad for both of you, it's lose-lose.
154
506000
2000
就是对你们两个同时都是坏的，双输。好。
08:40
That's a non-zero-sum game.
155
508000
2000
那个是非零和的游戏。
08:42
And in real life, there are lots of non-zero-sum games.
156
510000
3000
那么在现实生活中，有很多非零和的游戏。
08:45
In the realm of economics, say, if you buy something:
157
513000
3000
在经济领域中，比方说，如果你买东西，
08:48
that means you'd rather have the merchandise than the money,
158
516000
3000
那意味着你宁愿要商品也不要钱，
08:51
but the merchant would rather have the money than the merchandise.
159
519000
3000
但是商人是宁愿要钱也不要商品。
08:54
You both feel you've won.
160
522000
2000
你们两个都感觉你们赢了。好。
08:56
In a war, two allies are playing a non-zero-sum game.
161
524000
3000
在战争中，两个同盟正在玩非零和的游戏。
08:59
It's going to either be win-win or lose-lose for them.
162
527000
3000
那对于他们将是双赢或者双输。
09:02
So, there are lots of non-zero-sum games in real life.
163
530000
7000
这样，在现实生活中有很多的非零和的游戏。
09:09
And you could basically reformulate what I said earlier,
164
537000
4000
那么你基本上可以再用形式表示我刚才说的，
09:13
about how compassion is deployed and the golden rule is deployed,
165
541000
3000
关于同情心和黄金法则是怎么被调用的话，
09:16
by just saying, well, compassion most naturally flows along non-zero-sum channels
166
544000
6000
只是说的话，那么，同情心最自然地在非零和的渠道中流淌，
09:22
where people perceive themselves as being in a potentially win-win situation
167
550000
3000
那样人们把他们自己看成与他们的
09:25
with some of their friends or allies.
168
553000
3000
朋友或者同盟是潜在的双赢关系。
09:28
The deployment of the golden rule
169
556000
2000
黄金法则的调用
09:30
most naturally happens along these non-zero-sum channels.
170
558000
3000
最自然的发生在这些非零和的遇到中。
09:33
So, kind of webs of non-zero-sumness
171
561000
2000
所以，非零和的网，
09:35
are where you would expect compassion and the golden rule
172
563000
4000
是你可以期待同情心和黄金法则
09:39
to kind of work their magic.
173
567000
2000
发挥他们神奇力量的地方。
09:41
With zero-sum channels you would expect something else.
174
569000
2000
零和的渠道，你只能期待别的了。
09:43
Okay. So, now you're ready for the good news that I said might save the world.
175
571000
4000
好。那么，现在你已经准备好来听我刚才说可能拯救世界的那个好消息了。
09:47
And now I can admit that it might not too,
176
575000
3000
那现在我可以承认那也不一定能拯救世界，
09:50
now that I've held your attention for three minutes of technical stuff.
177
578000
6000
现在我已经让你注意了三分钟的技术的东西。
09:56
But it may. And the good news is that history
178
584000
5000
但是它是有可能的。而且好消息是历史
10:01
has naturally expanded these webs of non-zero-sumness,
179
589000
4000
已经自然地将非零和的网扩展，
10:05
these webs that can be these channels for compassion.
180
593000
4000
这些网可以是同情心的渠道。
10:09
You can go back all the way to the stone age:
181
597000
3000
你可以一直回到石器时代，
10:12
technological evolution -- roads, the wheel, writing,
182
600000
8000
而且，我想，从技术革命，公路，轮胎，写字，
10:20
a lot of transportation and communication technologies --
183
608000
3000
很多交通和交流技术
10:23
has just inexorably made it so that more people
184
611000
3000
正是无情的使更多的人
10:26
can be in more non-zero-sum relationships
185
614000
3000
能够和
10:29
with more and more people at greater and greater distances.
186
617000
3000
更多的人在更远的距离中拥有跟多的非零和的关系。
10:32
That's the story of civilization.
187
620000
3000
那也差不多使人类文明的故事。
10:35
It's why social organization has grown from the hunter-gatherer village
188
623000
5000
这是为什么社会组织已经从猎采的村子
10:40
to the ancient state, the empire, and now here we are in a globalized world.
189
628000
3000
发展成古代的国家，王国，和现在我们在的全球的世界。
10:43
And the story of globalization is largely a story of non-zero-sumness.
190
631000
4000
全球化的故事是一个很大的非零和的故事。
10:47
You've probably heard the term "interdependence"
191
635000
2000
你可能已经听说了互相依赖这个词
10:49
applied to the modern world. Well, that's just another term for non-zero-sum.
192
637000
4000
应用于当今世界。那，这只是非零和的另一个说法。
10:53
If your fortunes are interdependent with somebody,
193
641000
3000
如果你的命运和另一个人的命运相互依赖，
10:56
then you live in a non-zero-sum relationship with them.
194
644000
3000
那么你和那些人的关系就是非零和的关系。
10:59
And you see this all the time in the modern world.
195
647000
2000
而且在你总是可以在当今的世界看到这种关系。
11:01
You saw it with the recent economic crash,
196
649000
2000
你可以看到在近期的金融危机，
11:03
where bad things happen in the economy --
197
651000
3000
经济发生了很多不好的事，
11:06
bad for everybody, for much of the world.
198
654000
3000
对每个人都不好，对世界都不好。
11:09
Good things happen, and it's good for much of the world.
199
657000
3000
好事发生了，这对世界都好。
11:12
And, you know, I'm happy to say, I think there's really evidence
200
660000
3000
而且，你知道，我很高兴可以说，我想确实有证据
11:15
that this non-zero-sum kind of connection
201
663000
3000
证明这种非零和的联系
11:18
can expand the moral compass.
202
666000
3000
可以扩大道德的范畴。
11:21
I mean, if you look at the American attitudes
203
669000
3000
我的意思是，如果你看美国
11:24
toward Japanese during World War II --
204
672000
4000
对日本的态度，在二战期间，
11:28
look at the depictions of Japanese
205
676000
2000
看对日本人的描写，
11:30
in the American media as just about subhuman,
206
678000
2000
在美国的媒体中，就是不是人，
11:32
and look at the fact that we dropped atomic bombs,
207
680000
2000
而且看我们扔了原子弹的事实，
11:34
really without giving it much of a thought --
208
682000
3000
真是没有考虑很多。
11:37
and you compare that to the attitude now,
209
685000
2000
但是你对比现在对日本的态度，
11:39
I think part of that is due to a kind of economic interdependence.
210
687000
3000
我觉得那部分是根据一种经济互相依赖的关系。
11:42
Any form of interdependence, or non-zero-sum relationship
211
690000
3000
任何形式的互相依赖，非零和的关系
11:45
forces you to acknowledge the humanity of people.
212
693000
3000
迫使你了解人们的人性。
11:48
So, I think that's good.
213
696000
2000
所以，我想那很好。
11:50
And the world is full of non-zero-sum dynamics.
214
698000
3000
而且世界上充满了非零和的动态。
11:53
Environmental problems, in many ways, put us all in the same boat.
215
701000
4000
环境问题，在很多角度，把我们所有人放在同一个船上。
11:57
And there are non-zero-sum relationships that maybe people aren't aware of.
216
705000
5000
而且还有一些人们可能还没注意到的非零和的关系。
12:02
For example, probably a lot of American Christians
217
710000
4000
好，所以，举个例子，可能很多的美国基督徒
12:06
don't think of themselves as being in a non-zero-sum relationship
218
714000
4000
并不认为他们和
12:10
with Muslims halfway around the world,
219
718000
2000
世界另一头的穆斯林是非零和的关系，
12:12
but they really are, because if these Muslims become happier and happier
220
720000
5000
但是他们确实是，因为如果穆斯林
12:17
with their place in the world and feel that they have a place in it,
221
725000
3000
在他们的地方变得越来越高兴，而且觉得他们在世界上拥有一个地方，
12:20
that's good for Americans, because there will be fewer terrorists
222
728000
3000
那对美国人来说是好事，因为那样汇减少威胁
12:23
to threaten American security.
223
731000
2000
美国安全的恐怖分子。
12:25
If they get less and less happy, that will be bad for Americans.
224
733000
4000
如果穆斯林们越来越不快乐，那对美国人来说是坏事儿。好。
12:29
So, there's plenty of non-zero-sumness.
225
737000
3000
所以，有很多非零和的存在。
12:32
And so, the question is: If there's so much non-zero-sumness,
226
740000
5000
那所以，问题是：如果有这么多的非零和存在，
12:37
why has the world not yet been suffused in love, peace, and understanding?
227
745000
4000
那为什么这个世界现在还没有充满爱，和平与理解呢？
12:41
The answer's complicated. It's the occasion for a whole other talk.
228
749000
3000
这个答案很复杂。它可能可以促成整个另外一个演讲。
12:44
Certainly, a couple of things are that,
229
752000
4000
但是当然有一些事情是那样，
12:48
first of all, there are a lot of zero-sum situations in the world.
230
756000
4000
首先，世界上有很多零和的情况。
12:52
And also, sometimes people don't recognize
231
760000
4000
而且，你知道，有时候，一次一次地，人们不能识别出
12:56
the non-zero-sum dynamics in the world.
232
764000
5000
世界上的非零和的动态情况
13:01
In both of these areas,
233
769000
2000
而且我想，在这两个领域，
13:03
I think politicians can play a role.
234
771000
3000
我想政治家都可以扮演一个角色。
13:06
This isn't only about religion.
235
774000
2000
这并不只是关于宗教。
13:08
I think politicians can help foster non-zero-sum relationships,
236
776000
5000
我认为政治家可以帮助建立非零和的关系，
13:13
Economic engagement is generally better than blockades and so on,
237
781000
3000
订立经济合约比经济封锁好，
13:16
in this regard.
238
784000
2000
我认为至少就这反面来说是这样。
13:18
And politicians can be aware, and should be aware that,
239
786000
3000
政治家需要注意，
13:21
when people around the world are looking at them,
240
789000
2000
当世界各地的人们都注视着他们时，
13:23
are looking at their nation
241
791000
2000
他们其实是在注视他们所代表的国家，
13:25
and picking up their cues
242
793000
2000
人们在他们身上寻找线索，
13:27
for whether they are in a zero-sum or a non-zero-sum relationship with a nation --
243
795000
4000
他们与其他国家是零和或者非零和的关系，
13:31
like, say, America, or any other nation --
244
799000
3000
例如，与美国，或者其他什么国家，
13:34
human psychology is such that they use cues like:
245
802000
3000
人们通常的心理就是利用线索：
13:37
Do we feel we're being respected?
246
805000
2000
我们是否得到了应有的尊重？
13:39
Because, you know, historically, if you're not being respected,
247
807000
3000
因为，他人不尊重你，
13:42
you're probably not going to wind up in a non-zero-sum,
248
810000
3000
从历史上来看，那双方很那逃出零和的结局，
13:45
mutually profitable relationship with people.
249
813000
3000
或者建立其他互惠的关系。
13:48
So, we need to be aware of what kind of signals we're sending out.
250
816000
5000
所以，我们必须注意我们在发出什么样的信号。
13:53
And some of this, again, is in the realm of political work.
251
821000
5000
其中有些信号是类似于政治领域的工作。
13:58
If there's one thing I can encourage everyone to do,
252
826000
2000
让我鼓励大家去做什么的话，
14:00
politicians, religious leaders, and us,
253
828000
3000
无论是政治家、宗教领袖或者我们自己，
14:03
it would be what I call "expanding the moral imagination" --
254
831000
5000
我唯一鼓励的是扩展我们的道德想象力。
14:08
that is to say, your ability to put yourself in the shoes
255
836000
3000
也就是你理解
14:11
of people in very different circumstances.
256
839000
3000
处于各种不同情况下人们的能力。
14:14
This is not the same as compassion,
257
842000
2000
这与同情不同，
14:16
but it's conducive to compassion. It opens the channels for compassion.
258
844000
6000
但是对施加同情有利。因为它开辟了同情的渠道。
14:22
And I'm afraid we have another good news/bad news story,
259
850000
3000
我们还有一个喜忧参半的故事，
14:25
which is that the moral imagination is part of human nature.
260
853000
3000
那就是：到的想象力是人类本性的一部分。
14:28
That's good, but again we tend to deploy it selectively.
261
856000
5000
这是个好消息。但是，我们通常有选择性低在利用这一本性。
14:33
Once we define somebody as an enemy,
262
861000
2000
一旦我们将某人划为敌人，
14:35
we have trouble putting ourselves in their shoes, just naturally.
263
863000
5000
就很自然地无法理解他们的感受。
14:40
So, if you want to take a particularly hard case for an American:
264
868000
4000
典型的例子就是美国，
14:44
somebody in Iran who is burning an American flag, and you see them on TV.
265
872000
4000
那些你从电视上看到的烧美国国旗的伊朗人。
14:48
Well, the average American is going to resist
266
876000
3000
普通美国人都会
14:51
the moral exercise of putting themselves in that person's head
267
879000
4000
抵制站在对方的角度上思考问题这样的道德实践
14:55
and is going to resist the idea that they have much in common with that person.
268
883000
3000
也会抵制这样的想法，即他们与伊朗人在大多数方面具有相同点。
14:58
And if you tell them, "Well, they think America disrespects them
269
886000
4000
如果你告诉美国人，伊朗人是因为感觉美国人不尊重他们
15:02
and even wants to dominate them, and they hate America.
270
890000
3000
甚至是妄图统治他们，所以他们憎恨美国人。
15:05
Has there ever been somebody who disrespected you so much
271
893000
2000
有没有什么人不尊重你
15:07
that you kind of hated them briefly"?
272
895000
2000
使得你就因此很憎恨他们呢？
15:09
You know, they'll resist that comparison and that's natural, that's human.
273
897000
3000
他们会自发地抵制同情心，并且这种做法也是自然的，符合人性的。
15:12
And, similarly, the person in Iran:
274
900000
2000
与之类似，伊朗人，
15:14
when you try to humanize somebody in America who said that Islam is evil,
275
902000
4000
当他们试图教化那些说穆斯林是魔鬼的美国人时，
15:18
they'll have trouble with that.
276
906000
2000
他们也感到了困难。
15:20
So, it's a very difficult thing to get people to expand the moral imagination
277
908000
5000
所以很难扩大人民的道德想象力
15:25
to a place it doesn't naturally go.
278
913000
3000
在那些不符合人类天性的领域。
15:28
I think it's worth the trouble because,
279
916000
3000
但是我认为即使困难也是值得的，因为
15:31
again, it just helps us to understand.
280
919000
2000
这帮助我们理解，
15:33
If you want to reduce the number of people who are burning flags,
281
921000
2000
如果你想减少烧国旗的人数，
15:35
it helps to understand what makes them do it.
282
923000
2000
那么去了解他们为什么会那么做就很重要。
15:37
And I think it's good moral exercise.
283
925000
3000
并且我认为这是好的道德练习。
15:40
I would say here is where religious leaders come in,
284
928000
3000
我再次强调宗教领袖就是这么来的，
15:43
because religious leaders are good at reframing issues for people,
285
931000
7000
因为宗教领袖善于把事情重述给人们，
15:50
at harnessing the emotional centers of the brain
286
938000
2000
同时控制大脑中情绪的强度
15:52
to get people to alter their awareness and reframe the way they think.
287
940000
5000
使得人们改变他们的仪式，改变思考的方式。
15:57
I mean, religious leaders are kind of in the inspiration business.
288
945000
4000
我的意思是宗教领袖是与灵魂打交道的。
16:01
It's their great calling right now,
289
949000
2000
这就是当前来自上帝的、对他们的召唤
16:03
to get people all around the world better at expanding their moral imaginations,
290
951000
4000
让全世界的人们有更强的道德想象力，
16:07
appreciating that in so many ways they're in the same boat.
291
955000
4000
认识到所有的人在很多方面是相同的。
16:11
I would just sum up the way things look, at least from this secular perspective,
292
959000
6000
我想总结一下事情的表象，从现实的角度，
16:17
as far as compassion and the golden rule go,
293
965000
4000
就同情和黄金法则来说，
16:21
by saying that it's good news that compassion and the golden rule
294
969000
6000
黄金法则和同情
16:27
are in some sense built into human nature.
295
975000
5000
都是人本性的一部分，这是一个好消息。
16:32
It's unfortunate that they tend to be selectively deployed.
296
980000
5000
不幸的是，对它们的开发是选择性地。
16:37
And it's going to take real work to change that.
297
985000
4000
需要我们付出努力来改变这种现状。
16:41
But, nobody ever said that doing God's work was going to be easy. Thanks.
298
989000
5000
当然这很难，但是就像上帝的工作一样伟大，值得我们去做。谢谢。
16:46
(Applause)
299
994000
2000
（掌声响起）
ABOUT THE SPEAKER
Robert Wright - Journalist, philosopherThe best-selling author of "Nonzero," "The Moral Animal" and "The Evolution of God," Robert Wright draws on his wide-ranging knowledge of science, religion, psychology, history and politics to figure out what makes humanity tick -- and what makes us moral.
Why you should listen
Author Robert Wright thinks the crises the human species now faces are moral in nature, and that our salvation lies in the intelligent pursuit of self-interest. In his book Nonzero, Wright argues that life depends on a non-zero-sum dynamic. While a zero-sum game depends on a winner and loser, all parties in a non-zero-sum game win or lose together, so players will more likely survive if they cooperate. This points to an optimistic future of ultimate cooperation among humans -- if we recognize the game.
Well-respected for his erudition and original thinking (Bill Clinton hailed him as a genius), Wright draws from multiple disciplines -- including science, religion, history and politics -- in his search for big-picture perspectives on today's problems, particularly terrorism, while offering guarded hope for where we might be headed. A Schwartz Senior Fellow at the New America Foundation, Wright also hosts an interview series with celebrated thinkers at Meaningoflifetv.com.
Wright's newest book, The Evolution of God, explores the history of the idea of God in the three Abrahamic religions, Judaism, Islam and Christianity.
Robert Wright | Speaker | TED.com