TED Salon Brightline Initiative
Matt Goldman: The search for "aha!" moments
马特·高曼: 追寻顿悟时刻
Filmed:
Readability: 4.1
1,238,048 views
1988年，马特·高曼与人联合创办了蓝人乐团，这项外百老汇戏剧表演以幽默、涂满蓝色颜料的身体以及特技表演引起了一股轰动。表演坚持一个前提，即特定的条件可以创造出顿悟时刻——惊奇的时刻、学习的时刻以及热情洋溢的时刻，让这些时刻来得更加频繁、刻意，而非随机、偶然出现。如今，高曼致力于将从蓝人乐队中学到的经验运用于教育事业上，并创建了蓝学校，一所平衡发展学术能力、创造性思维以及自我和社交智能的学校。“我们需要为创新思维的发展和繁荣创造安全有利的条件，”高曼说道。
Matt Goldman - Entrepreneur
Matt Goldman is a co-founder of the international theatrical sensation Blue Man Group and the NYC-based Blue School. Full bio
Matt Goldman is a co-founder of the international theatrical sensation Blue Man Group and the NYC-based Blue School. Full bio
Double-click the English transcript below to play the video.
00:12
So it's 1969, New York City,
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1969年，纽约市，
三年级的音乐课上，
00:18
third grade music class,
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老师带我们走进一个
只有一架钢琴和几把椅子的房间。
只有一架钢琴和几把椅子的房间。
00:22
and our teacher brings us into a room
with nothing but a piano and chairs.
with nothing but a piano and chairs.
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他一个个地点名，
00:28
And one by one, he calls us up,
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弹奏了中央C音，
要求我们跟着唱。
要求我们跟着唱。
00:31
and he plays middle C,
and he asks us to sing it.
and he asks us to sing it.
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00:34
(Singing)
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（唱歌）
00:37
And you're either instructed
to go to the right of the room
to go to the right of the room
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接着你根据指示
要么走到房间右边，
要么走到房间右边，
要么走到左边。
00:40
or the left side of the room.
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（笑声）
00:41
(Laughter)
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00:45
And when all 35 kids are done,
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当35个孩子都结束跟唱时，
00:48
the left side of the room,
which I was a part of,
which I was a part of,
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房间左边的孩子们，
我也是其中之一，
我也是其中之一，
00:52
was told to stand up
and go back to home room.
and go back to home room.
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被要求起立，回到年级教室。
00:56
(Laughter)
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（笑声）
00:58
And none of us ever received
another music class again
another music class again
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从那以后一直到小学毕业，
我们再也没有
我们再也没有
01:04
in elementary school.
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上过音乐课。
01:06
An in club and an out club
was established,
was established,
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入选阵营和淘汰阵营
就这样建立了，
就这样建立了，
而当时我甚至不知道
什么是入门测试。
什么是入门测试。
01:10
and I didn't even know
what the gating test was in the moment.
what the gating test was in the moment.
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01:17
A few years later, English class ...
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几年之后，英语课……
01:20
(Laughter)
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（笑声）
01:22
first paper of a new semester,
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新学期的第一篇作文批改后下发了，
01:27
and I get the paper back,
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我拿回来一看，
01:29
and it's C+,
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成绩是C+，
还有一条评语，
“意料之中的良好”。
“意料之中的良好”。
01:31
with the comment,
"Good as can be expected."
"Good as can be expected."
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01:35
(Laughter)
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（笑声）
01:38
Now, honestly, I didn't mind a C+.
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其实坦白说，我并不介意得了C+。
01:41
I was just happy it wasn't a C- or a D.
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反而我还庆幸不是C-或D。
01:45
But the "good as can be
expected" comment ...
expected" comment ...
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但是“意料之中的良好”
这个评语……
这个评语……
01:48
even at that young age,
it didn't seem right.
it didn't seem right.
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即便是在童年时期，
也让我觉得不太舒服。
也让我觉得不太舒服。
01:52
It seemed somehow limiting.
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似乎像是一种限定性评语。
01:57
Now, how many people here
have had an experience similar to that,
have had an experience similar to that,
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那么，在座的有多少人
在学校或者工作场所
在学校或者工作场所
02:02
either at school or the workplace?
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有过相似的经历？
02:07
We're not alone.
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看来并不是只有我们。
02:11
So I guess it might be ironic
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我觉得这可能有点讽刺，
02:14
that my life path
would lead me to a career
would lead me to a career
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我的人生道路引导我成为了
02:18
of making music and writing
for Blue Man Group
for Blue Man Group
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蓝人乐队的音乐制作人和编剧，
（笑声）
02:23
(Laughter)
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02:24
and starting a school.
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并且创办了一所学校。
02:26
(Laughter)
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（笑声）
02:28
But school was torture for me.
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但学校对我来说是一种折磨。
02:32
As someone who didn't have
a natural proclivity for academics,
a natural proclivity for academics,
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作为一名对学术
天生就没有太多兴趣的学生，
天生就没有太多兴趣的学生，
02:36
and my teachers never seemed
to understand me,
to understand me,
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我的老师们似乎从来都不理解我，
02:39
I didn't know how to navigate schools
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我不知道怎么过好校园生活，
02:41
and schools didn't know
what to do with me.
what to do with me.
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学校也不知道该拿我怎么办。
02:45
So I started to ask the question,
even back then,
even back then,
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所以我开始问这个问题，
甚至年少时就有了这个想法，
甚至年少时就有了这个想法，
02:49
if these environments
didn't know what to do
didn't know what to do
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如果这些环境不知道如何
包容那些不适应标准模式的人，
02:52
with people who didn't fit
a standard mold,
a standard mold,
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02:56
why weren't we reshaping the environments
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为什么我们不重新塑造这些环境
03:00
to take advantage of people's strengths?
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来充分利用人们各自的优势？
03:05
What I've come to believe
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我逐渐开始相信，
03:08
is that we need to cultivate
safe and conducive conditions
safe and conducive conditions
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为了使创新的思想发展和繁荣，
03:13
for new and innovative ideas
to evolve and thrive.
to evolve and thrive.
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我们需要创造安全有利的环境。
03:19
We know that humans
are innately innovative,
are innately innovative,
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我们知道人类天生具有创造力，
03:23
because if we weren't,
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因为如果没有的话，
03:24
we'd all be using the same arrowheads
that we were using 10,000 years ago.
that we were using 10,000 years ago.
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我们可能都还在使用
一万年以前的箭头石器。
一万年以前的箭头石器。
03:30
So one of the things
that I started to question is,
that I started to question is,
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所以，在这之中我想问的是，
03:33
are there ways to make innovation easier
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有没有什么方法
可以使创新变得更容易，
可以使创新变得更容易，
03:38
and happen more frequently?
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更频繁？
03:41
Is there a way to take those aha moments,
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有没有一种方法可以使
那些看似随机、偶然发生的
那些看似随机、偶然发生的
03:44
those breakthroughs that seem
to happen randomly and occasionally,
to happen randomly and occasionally,
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顿悟时刻和突破，
03:50
and have them happen
intentionally and frequently?
intentionally and frequently?
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刻意地、频繁地发生？
03:55
When we started Blue Man Group in 1988,
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当1988年创立蓝人乐队之前，
03:58
we had never done
an off-Broadway show before.
an off-Broadway show before.
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我们从未做过
外百老汇戏剧表演。
外百老汇戏剧表演。
04:01
We'd actually done almost no theater.
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实际上，我们
几乎没有做过戏剧表演。
几乎没有做过戏剧表演。
04:05
But we knew what we were passionate about,
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但是我们知道
我们对什么充满激情，
我们对什么充满激情，
04:08
and it was a whole series of things
that we had never seen onstage before,
that we had never seen onstage before,
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这些是我们之前在舞台上
从未见到过的，
从未见到过的，
04:12
things like art and pop culture
and technology and sociology
and technology and sociology
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像是艺术、流行文化、
技术、社会学、
技术、社会学、
04:16
and anthropology and percussion
and comedy and following your bliss.
and comedy and following your bliss.
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人类学、打击乐器、
喜剧以及随性而为。
喜剧以及随性而为。
04:23
We established a rule
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我们定了一条原则，
04:25
that nothing made it onstage
if we had seen it before,
if we had seen it before,
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舞台上不会出现
我们之前见过的东西，
我们之前见过的东西，
04:30
and we wanted to inspire
creativity and connectedness
creativity and connectedness
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我们想激发自己和观众的
04:34
in ourselves and our audiences;
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创造力和连通性；
04:37
we wanted to do
a little bit of social good,
a little bit of social good,
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我们想为社会公益
尽点绵薄之力，
尽点绵薄之力，
04:39
and we wanted to have fun doing it.
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也想充分地享受这个过程。
04:42
And in the office,
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在办公室，
04:43
we wanted to create an environment
where people treated each other
where people treated each other
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我们想创造一种环境，相比外界而言，
04:47
just a little bit better,
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在这种环境下
04:49
just a little bit more
respect and consideration
respect and consideration
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人与人之间更加善待彼此，
04:53
than in the outside world.
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更加尊重和关心彼此。
04:56
And we continued to iterate
and collaborate and find solutions
and collaborate and find solutions
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我们不断重复、协作、寻找方法
05:01
to create things that hadn't been seen.
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来创造之前从未见过的事物。
05:06
Over time, I've come to identify
the optimal conditions
the optimal conditions
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久而久之，我逐渐识别出
打造具有创造力和
创新性环境的最佳条件
创新性环境的最佳条件
05:12
for these types of creative
and innovative environments
and innovative environments
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05:16
are clear intent, purpose and passion:
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就是明确的意图、目的以及激情：
05:20
this is working on something
bigger than ourselves.
bigger than ourselves.
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这在比我们自身
还要强大的事物上面起作用。
还要强大的事物上面起作用。
05:24
Personal integrity:
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正直的人品：
05:26
it's doing what we say we're going to do.
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它会使我们说到做到。
05:29
It's being our authentic self
in all interactions.
in all interactions.
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它是我们互相交流中的真实自我。
05:32
Direct communication
and clear expectations,
and clear expectations,
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直接的交流和明确的期望，
05:36
even when the subject matter is difficult.
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即便是在主题难以商榷的时候。
05:39
Grit and perseverance:
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勇气和毅力：
05:41
iteration, iteration, iteration.
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重复、重复、重复。
05:46
Establish collaborative teams.
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组建协作团队。
05:49
Instill deep trust and mutual respect.
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逐渐灌输高度信任和互相尊重。
05:52
Everyone on your team is in.
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你团队里的每一个人都参与其中。
05:54
There is no out club.
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没有人应该置身事外。
05:57
We rise as a team, we fall as a team,
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成也团队，败也团队，
决定就是，决定要坚持到底。
06:00
and decisions are decisions
until they're not.
until they're not.
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06:03
Embrace multiple perspectives.
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包容多种观点。
06:06
This means all voices matter,
all emotions matter.
all emotions matter.
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这意味着所有的声音都很重要，
所有的情感都很重要。
所有的情感都很重要。
06:10
Address disagreements head-on.
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各种意见互相碰撞。
06:12
People should feel seen and heard.
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人们应该感受到自己
被关注、被倾听。
被关注、被倾听。
06:15
Take risks and celebrate mistakes.
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敢于承担风险，乐观面对错误。
06:18
A commitment to being
a learning organization,
a learning organization,
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承诺成为一个学习型组织，
06:21
always trying to spiral upwards
the innovation and learning curves.
the innovation and learning curves.
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一直努力推动创新和学习曲线
呈螺旋式上升。
呈螺旋式上升。
06:28
And speak in one voice.
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发出同一种声音。
06:30
This is perhaps the glue
that holds all these conditions together.
that holds all these conditions together.
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这有可能是粘连
所有这些条件的粘合剂。
所有这些条件的粘合剂。
06:35
The concept is that we speak
in the exact same manner
in the exact same manner
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这意味着我们用完全相同的方式，
06:39
about someone who's not in the room
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当面和私下
06:42
as if they are in the room.
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谈论别人。
06:45
Now this seems basic,
but it's an aspirational practice
but it's an aspirational practice
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这看似简单，但
其实是一个考验意志力的实践，
其实是一个考验意志力的实践，
06:50
that helps deal with difficult situations
in a more respectful way.
in a more respectful way.
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有助于以更委婉的方式
处理困难的情况。
处理困难的情况。
06:57
Sewing this practice in can have
a profound effect on raising the bar,
a profound effect on raising the bar,
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运用这一方法，对于实现进步，
07:02
on mutual respect, trust,
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互相尊重、信任，
07:04
reducing gossip and politics
in the office and the classroom,
in the office and the classroom,
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减少办公室、教室的
流言蜚语和争斗具有深远影响，
流言蜚语和争斗具有深远影响，
07:10
and thus reducing the noise that gets
in the way of the innovative process.
in the way of the innovative process.
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从而减少妨碍创新进程的闲言碎语。
07:16
At Blue Man Group, iteration
was essential for our creative process.
was essential for our creative process.
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在蓝人乐队，重复循环
对于我们的创意过程十分重要。
对于我们的创意过程十分重要。
07:20
We were writing a piece
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我们在写一个作品的时候
07:22
where we were trying to illustrate
the consumption / waste loop
the consumption / waste loop
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会试图以一种有趣的、创意的
以及惊奇的方式
以及惊奇的方式
07:28
in a funny and creative
and surprising way for our audiences.
and surprising way for our audiences.
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向我们的观众说明消耗 - 浪费循环。
07:34
Now, if you have yourselves thought about
trying to do the same endeavor,
trying to do the same endeavor,
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如果你们也想这么做，
07:41
I can save you a lot of time
right here and now.
right here and now.
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此时此刻我就可以
帮你们节约很多时间。
帮你们节约很多时间。
07:44
I can definitively tell you
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我可以肯定地告诉你
07:47
that oatmeal, Jell-O, Cream of Wheat,
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燕麦片、果冻、麦片粥、
07:52
Gak, pudding, clay, tapioca,
Silly Putty and tomato paste
Silly Putty and tomato paste
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泥浆、布丁、黏土、木薯粉、
弹性橡皮泥和番茄酱，
弹性橡皮泥和番茄酱，
07:58
do not slide through a tube
that's coiled up under your costumes
that's coiled up under your costumes
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以上这些都不是通过
盘旋在你们衣服里的管子喷射，
盘旋在你们衣服里的管子喷射，
08:05
that's meant to come out
an orifice in your chest
an orifice in your chest
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而是通过你们胸前的喷孔
08:08
and spray towards the audience.
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朝观众喷射。
08:11
It won't happen.
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别担心，这不会发生的。
08:13
(Laughter)
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（笑声）
08:15
After months of iteration,
we finally happened upon bananas.
we finally happened upon bananas.
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在经历了几个月的重复测试之后，
我们最后偶然发现了香蕉。
我们最后偶然发现了香蕉。
08:21
(Laughter)
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（笑声）
08:23
Who knew that bananas
would have the exact right properties
would have the exact right properties
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谁会知道香蕉正好有这个属性，
08:27
to stay solid even when pushed
through a tube with forced air,
through a tube with forced air,
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当它被加压气流
通过一根管子推出去时，
通过一根管子推出去时，
能够保持固体状态，
而且它足够光滑，能够产生
而且它足够光滑，能够产生
08:32
yet slippery enough to have
the dramatic oozing effect
the dramatic oozing effect
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引人注目的渗透效果。
08:38
that we were looking for.
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08:40
(Laughter)
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（笑声）
08:41
This piece became a signature
of the Blue Man show.
of the Blue Man show.
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这个作品成为
蓝人秀的一个代表作。
蓝人秀的一个代表作。
08:47
But we didn't throw out
all the rules of theater altogether.
all the rules of theater altogether.
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但是我们并没有抛弃
全部的戏剧规则。
全部的戏剧规则。
08:51
We had set designs.
We had lighting designs.
We had lighting designs.
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我们有布景设计。
我们有灯光设计。
我们有灯光设计。
08:54
We had a stage manager calling the shows.
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还有一名舞台监督主管。
08:57
But I'm fairly sure
we were one of the very first shows
we were one of the very first shows
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但我相当确定，
我们的表演是最早
我们的表演是最早
09:02
that was connecting with our audience
in a respectful way,
in a respectful way,
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以一种尊重的方式
与观众建立联系的表演之一，
与观众建立联系的表演之一，
09:06
by hanging them upside down,
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通过将他们倒吊起来，
09:08
(Laughter)
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（笑声）
09:10
dipping them in paint,
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把他们浸入颜料里，
09:13
slamming them against a canvas,
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再拍到帆布上，
09:15
(Laughter)
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（笑声）
09:16
putting their heads
in 70 pounds of Jell-O,
in 70 pounds of Jell-O,
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把他们的头部放到
70磅重的果冻中，
70磅重的果冻中，
09:20
and then making them
one of the heroes of the show.
one of the heroes of the show.
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然后使他们成为表演的主角。
09:26
(Laughter)
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（笑声）
09:29
Besides that, we didn't reinvent
what didn't need to be reinvented.
what didn't need to be reinvented.
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此外，我们并没有重复
不需要被重复的东西。
不需要被重复的东西。
09:34
(Laughter)
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（笑声）
09:41
Years later, we took all this learning
and we created a school --
and we created a school --
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多年之后，我们基于全部经验
创办了一所学校——
创办了一所学校——
09:48
a school for our children
that we wish we had gone to,
that we wish we had gone to,
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一所为我们的孩子创办的，
连我们自己都希望儿时能够进入的学校，
连我们自己都希望儿时能够进入的学校，
一所无论走廊里发生的一切
09:54
a school where it was just as important
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09:58
what happened in the hallways
between classes
between classes
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还是教室里发生的一切，
10:01
as what happened in the classes;
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都同样重要的学校；
10:04
a place where you got music class
even when you couldn't sing middle C.
even when you couldn't sing middle C.
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一个即使你无法唱出中央C音，
依然可以在这里上音乐课的地方。
依然可以在这里上音乐课的地方。
10:12
At Blue School, teachers
and parents and students
and parents and students
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在蓝学校里，老师、家长和学生
是显而易见的平等的合作者，
10:15
are equal collaborators at the table,
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10:17
intentionally creating a safe space
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他们有意地创造出一个安全的空间，
10:20
where they can develop
a lifelong, joyful passion for learning.
a lifelong, joyful passion for learning.
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身处其中，他们可以产生对学习的
一种终身的、愉悦的激情。
一种终身的、愉悦的激情。
10:25
Again, we didn't try to reinvent the wheel
when it didn't need to be reinvented.
when it didn't need to be reinvented.
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再次说明，我们不会在
非必要时做毫无意义的重复。
非必要时做毫无意义的重复。
10:29
We don't shy away from
the more traditional methods
the more traditional methods
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我们不会羞于使用传统的方法，
10:33
like direct instruction,
when it's the best way into a lesson.
when it's the best way into a lesson.
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比如直接教学法，
如果这是授课的最好方式。
如果这是授课的最好方式。
10:37
But we balance it with an integrated
learning across all subjects approach,
learning across all subjects approach,
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但是我们用一种跨学科的
综合学习方法与之达到相互平衡，
综合学习方法与之达到相互平衡，
10:43
and balance is the key.
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平衡即是关键。
10:46
In fact, Blue School was founded
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实际上，蓝学校就是建立在
学术能力、创造性思维、
自我和社交智能
自我和社交智能
10:49
on a balance between academic mastery,
creative thinking,
creative thinking,
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10:55
and self and social intelligence.
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三者相互平衡的基础之上。
10:58
I realize that this might sound
like common sense,
like common sense,
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我知道这听起来似乎是常识，
11:02
but in some circles, this is radical.
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但在一些圈子里，
会被认为是激进的。
会被认为是激进的。
11:05
(Laughter)
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（笑声）
11:08
And these qualities have brought
a lot of attention to Blue School
a lot of attention to Blue School
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作为一所真正的创新型学校，
这些品质使蓝学校备受关注。
11:12
as a truly innovative school.
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11:17
Nearly 10 years in,
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花了将近十年的时间，
11:20
we announced the expansion
of the middle school.
of the middle school.
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我们宣布扩展中学。
全体教员要求我们的六年级学生
11:23
Our faculty asked our sixth graders
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11:26
to participate in the development
of middle school values.
of middle school values.
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一起参与发展中学价值观。
11:30
Their process began with a question:
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他们的活动以一个问题开始：
11:33
What do you need from our community
to be happy and productive at school?
to be happy and productive at school?
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你需要从我们的团体中得到什么，
可以使你在学校获得快乐和收获？
可以使你在学校获得快乐和收获？
11:40
Students moved through a six-week process
of individual work, collaborative work,
of individual work, collaborative work,
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学生们通过为时六个星期的
独立思考，合作讨论，
独立思考，合作讨论，
11:45
refinement, and consensus,
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提炼并达成一致，
11:48
and the list they came up with
is really extraordinary.
is really extraordinary.
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他们所列出的内容非常出色。
11:55
Be engaged and present with each other.
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互相参与彼此的工作。
12:01
Respect and support
what others need in order to learn.
what others need in order to learn.
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尊重与支持其他人
为了学习而需要的东西。
为了学习而需要的东西。
12:08
Be inclusive of our diversity --
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包容我们的多样性——
12:12
the way we look, think and act.
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即包容我们的外貌、
思想以及行为。
思想以及行为。
12:17
Cultivate the practice of self-awareness
and awareness of others.
and awareness of others.
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培养自我意识行为
以及他人意识的行为。
以及他人意识的行为。
12:23
Honor and make time for fun and joy.
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腾出时间做些有趣的事情。
12:28
And challenge ourselves,
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挑战自我，
12:30
practice being OK,
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行为端正，
犯错误，
12:32
making mistakes,
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12:34
and support each other through them.
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并通过这些互相支持。
12:39
Remember, these kids were 11 years old
when they came up with this.
when they came up with this.
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要知道，提出以上观点的
孩子们才11岁。
孩子们才11岁。
12:45
They articulated what took us
20 years to identify.
20 years to identify.
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他们明确有力地表达出了
我们花了20多年才得出的观点。
我们花了20多年才得出的观点。
12:53
One of the great by-products
of creating these vibrant communities
of creating these vibrant communities
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创建这个充满活力的团体
顺带产生了一个了不起的效果。
顺带产生了一个了不起的效果。
13:00
is that we become attractors for people
who want to prioritize these values.
who want to prioritize these values.
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那就是我们吸引了
那些更看重这些价值观的人们。
那些更看重这些价值观的人们。
13:09
They want to prioritize it above things
like money and prestige and tradition.
like money and prestige and tradition.
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他们想把这些价值观排在
金钱、名誉以及传统之前。
金钱、名誉以及传统之前。
13:16
We can all be on this road together,
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在你们所在的公司里，
你们自己的团体里、家里，
你们自己的团体里、家里，
13:19
you at your own values
in your own companies,
in your own companies,
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你们有自己的价值观，
13:23
in your own communities and families.
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我们所有人都可以携手共进。
13:26
For us, for me, it was about
prioritizing children's voices
prioritizing children's voices
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对于我们，对于我，这种价值观是
把孩子们的诉求排在前面，
把孩子们的诉求排在前面，
13:32
to give them the tools to help build
a harmonious and sustainable world.
a harmonious and sustainable world.
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给他们提供方法，帮助他们
建立一个和谐、可持续的世界。
建立一个和谐、可持续的世界。
13:39
I invite you to be on this exciting,
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我在此邀请各位一同参与
这个令人激动的、
这个令人激动的、
13:44
passionate, joyful journey together.
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充满激情的、愉悦的旅程。
13:48
And together, good as can be expected
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一起努力，当我们的期望是
通过重塑我们所处的环境，
13:52
is limitless when the expectation
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我们就可以改变世界的时候，
13:56
is that by reshaping our environments,
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意料之中的美好就永无止境。
14:00
we can change the world.
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14:04
Thank you.
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谢谢。
14:05
(Applause)
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（掌声）
Translated by Bingxian Bai
ABOUT THE SPEAKER
Matt Goldman - EntrepreneurMatt Goldman is a co-founder of the international theatrical sensation Blue Man Group and the NYC-based Blue School.
Why you should listen
A few of Matt Goldman's titles include award-winning writer and performer, Grammy-nominated musician and composer, co-founder of the international theatrical sensation Blue Man Group, CEO of its parent organization Blue Man Productions, and co-founder of the NYC-based Blue School.
Goldman spent his boyhood in New York City, with parents who encouraged him to learn about a diverse range of interests. After earning an MBA degree, he began a career in software development, only to step away from the growing industry to follow where the Blue Man path would lead. His business knowledge assisted the friends early on, guiding them to make decisions in regard to the longevity and ownership of their creative work.
After nearly twenty years at the Blue Man helm with Chris Wink and Phil Stanton, Goldman made the decision to follow his passion for learning and education. The threesome teamed up with other artists and educators to form Blue School in New York City. With over 300 students enrolled in Pre-K through 8th grade, the school is designed to reimagine a more complete, balanced and exuberant approach to education. Goldman serves as Board Vice-Chair and co-Founder of the school.
Matt Goldman | Speaker | TED.com