TEDIndia 2009
His Holiness the Karmapa: The technology of the heart
Njegova Svetost Karmapa: Tehnologija srca
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Njegova Svetost Karmapa govori o tome kako je otkriven kao reinkarnacija štovane osobe tibetanskog budizma. Pričajući svoju priču, on nas potiče na rad ne samo na tehnologiji i dizajnu, već tehnologiji i dizajnu srca. Na sceni prevodi Tyler Dewar.
His Holiness the Karmapa - Spiritual leader
Ogyen Trinley Dorje is the 17th Gyalwang Karmapa, a revered figure in Tibetan Buddhism devoted to preserving and propagating Buddhist teachings. Full bio
Ogyen Trinley Dorje is the 17th Gyalwang Karmapa, a revered figure in Tibetan Buddhism devoted to preserving and propagating Buddhist teachings. Full bio
Double-click the English transcript below to play the video.
00:30
Tyler Dewar: The way I feel right now
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Tyler Dewar: Kako se sada osjećam
00:32
is that all of the other speakers
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jest da su svi drugi govornici
00:34
have said exactly what I wanted to say.
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rekli točno ono što sam ja htio reći.
00:36
(Laughter)
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(Smijeh)
00:38
And it seems that the only thing left for me to say
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I čini mi se kako je jedina stvar koja mi je ostala za reći
00:41
is to thank you all for your kindness.
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jest zahvaliti se svima na ljubaznosti.
00:58
TD: But maybe in the spirit
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TD: Ali možda u duhu
01:00
of appreciating the kindness of you all,
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poštivanja vaše ljubaznosti,
01:02
I could share with you
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mogao bih podijeliti s vama
01:04
a little story about myself.
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malu priču o sebi.
01:50
TD: From the time I was very young, onward,
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TD: Od vremena kada sam bio jako mlad, naovamo,
01:53
I was given
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dano mi je
01:55
a lot of different responsibilities,
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puno različitih odgovornosti,
01:57
and it always seemed to me, when I was young,
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i uvijek mi se činilo, kada sam bio mlad,
02:00
that everything was laid out before me.
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kako mi je sve servirano.
02:02
All of the plans for me were already made.
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Svi planovi za mene su već napravljeni.
02:05
I was given the clothes that I needed to wear
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Dana mi je odjeća koju sam morao nositi,
02:07
and told where I needed to be,
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i rečeno mi je gdje bih trebao biti,
02:09
given these very precious
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s obzirom na taj jako dragocjen
02:11
and holy looking robes to wear,
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i svet ogrtač koji sam nosio;
02:14
with the understanding
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s razumijevanjem
02:16
that it was something sacred or important.
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kako je to nešto sveto i važno.
03:07
TD: But before that kind of formal lifestyle happened for me,
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TD: Ali prije nego što mi se dogodio taj formalni životni stil,
03:11
I was living in eastern Tibet with my family.
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živio sam u istočnom Tibetu sa svojom obitelji.
03:14
And when I was seven years old,
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I kada sam imao sedam godina,
03:17
all of a sudden,
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iznenada,
03:19
a search party arrived at my home.
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potraga je stigla u moj dom.
03:21
They were looking the next Karmapa,
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Oni su tražili slijedećeg Karmapa,
03:24
and I noticed they were talking to my mom and dad,
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i primjetio sam kako razgovaraju s mojim mamom i tatom,
03:27
and the news came to me that they were telling me
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i vijesti su došle do mene u kojima su mi rekli
03:30
that I was the Karmapa.
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kako sam ja Karmapa.
03:32
And these days, people ask me a lot,
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I tih dana, ljudi su me stalno pitali,
03:34
how did that feel.
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kakav je bio osjećaj.
03:36
How did that feel when they came and whisked you away,
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Kakav je bio osjećaj kada su došli i odveli vas,
03:38
and your lifestyle completely changed?
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a vaš životni stil se skroz promijenio?
03:40
And what I mostly say is that,
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I ono što uglavnom kažem je,
03:42
at that time,
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u to vrijeme,
03:44
it was a pretty interesting idea to me.
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bila je to prilično interesantna ideja za mene.
03:47
I thought that things would be pretty fun
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Mislio sam kako će stvari biti prilično vesele
03:49
and there would be more things to play with.
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i kako će biti više stvari za igru.
03:52
(Laughter)
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(Smijeh)
04:56
TD: But it didn't turn out to be so fun and entertaining,
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TD: Ali nije ispalo tako veselo i zabavno
04:59
as I thought it would have been.
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kao što sam mislio da će biti.
05:01
I was placed
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Bio sam smješten
05:03
in a pretty strictly controlled environment.
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u prilično strogo kontroliranom okruženju.
05:06
And immediately,
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I bez odlaganja,
05:08
a lot of different responsibilities,
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puno različitih odgovornosti,
05:10
in terms of my education and so forth, were heaped upon me.
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u smislu moje edukacije i tako dalje, bilo mi je natovareno.
05:13
I was separated, largely, from my family,
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Bio sam odvojen, uglavnom, od svoje obitelji,
05:15
including my mother and father.
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uključujući moju majku i oca.
05:17
I didn't have have many personal friends
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Nisam imao puno osobnih prijatelja
05:19
to spend time with,
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s kojima bih provodio vrijeme,
05:21
but I was expected to perform
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ali se od mene očekivalo da izvodim
05:23
these prescribed duties.
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te propisane dužnosti.
05:25
So it turned out that my fantasy
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Tako je ispalo da se moja maštarija
05:28
about an entertaining life of being the Karmapa
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o zabavnom životu Karmapa
05:30
wasn't going to come true.
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neće ostvariti.
05:32
It more felt to be the case to me
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Više sam se osjećao
05:34
that I was being treated like a statue,
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kako me tretiraju kao statuu,
05:37
and I was to sit in one place
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i od mene se očekivalo da sjedim na jednom mjestu
05:40
like a statue would.
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kao što bi statua stajala.
06:31
TD: Nevertheless, I felt that,
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TD: Unatoč svemu, osjećao sam,
06:33
even though I've been separated from my loved ones --
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iako sam bio odvojen od svojih voljenih --
06:36
and, of course, now I'm even further away.
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i, naravno, sada sam još udaljeniji.
06:39
When I was 14, I escaped from Tibet
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Kada mi je bilo 14, pobjegao sam iz Tibeta
06:41
and became even further removed
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i postao sam još udaljeniji
06:43
from my mother and father,
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od svojih majke i oca,
06:45
my relatives, my friends
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svojih rođaka, svojih prijatelja
06:47
and my homeland.
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i svoje domovine.
06:49
But nevertheless,
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Ali unatoč svemu,
06:51
there's no real sense of separation from me in my heart,
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ne postoji stvarni osjećaj odvojenosti od samoga sebe u mom srcu,
06:54
in terms of the love that I feel
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u smislu ljubavi koju osjećam
06:57
for these people.
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za te ljude.
06:59
I feel, still, a very strong connection of love
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Osjećam, još uvijek, snažnu vezu ljubavi
07:02
for all of these people
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za te ljude
07:04
and for the land.
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i za zemlju.
07:32
TD: And I still do
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TD: I još uvijek
07:34
get to keep in touch with my mother and father,
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sam u vezi sa svojim majkom i ocem,
07:36
albeit infrequently.
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iako ne često.
07:38
I talk to my mother
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Pričam sa svojom majkom
07:40
once in a blue moon on the telephone.
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jednom za vrijeme plavog mjeseca preko telefona.
07:42
And my experience is that,
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I moje iskustvo je
07:44
when I'm talking to her,
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dok pričam s njom,
07:46
with every second that passes
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sa svakom sekundom koja prođe
07:48
during our conversation,
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tijekom našeg razgovora,
07:50
the feeling of love that binds us
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osjećaj ljubavi koji nas veže
07:53
is bringing us closer and closer together.
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nas sve više zbližava.
09:08
TD: So those were just a few remarks
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TD: Dakle to je bilo nekoliko opažanja
09:10
about my personal background.
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o mojoj osobnoj povijesti.
09:12
And in terms of other things that I wanted to share with you,
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I u smislu drugih stvari koje želim s vama podijeliti,
09:15
in terms of ideas,
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u smislu ideja,
09:17
I think it's wonderful to have a situation like this,
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mislim kako je prekrasno imati situaciju poput ove,
09:20
where so many people from different backgrounds and places
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gdje se toliko puno ljudi koji imaju različitu povijest i podrijetlo
09:23
can come together,
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mogu naći zajedno,
09:25
exchange their ideas
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izmjenjivati ideje
09:27
and form relationships of friendship with each other.
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i graditi odnose prijateljstva jedni s drugima.
09:30
And I think that's symbolic
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I mislim kako je to simbol
09:32
of what we're seeing in the world in general,
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onoga što vidimo u svijetu općenito,
09:34
that the world is becoming smaller and smaller,
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kako svijet postaje sve manji i manji,
09:36
and that all of the peoples in the world
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i kako svi ljudi na svijetu
09:39
are enjoying more opportunities for connection.
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uživaju više prilika za povezivanje.
09:43
That's wonderful,
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To je prekrasno,
09:45
but we should also remember
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ali trebali bismo također zapamtiti
09:47
that we should have a similar process happening on the inside.
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kako bismo trebali imati sličan proces koji će se događati iznutra.
09:50
Along with outward development
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Zajedno s vanjskim razvojem
09:52
and increase of opportunity,
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i povećanjem prilika,
09:54
there should be inward development
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trebala bi postojati i unutrašnji razvoj
09:57
and deepening of our heart connections
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i produbljavanje naših srčanih veza
10:00
as well as our outward connections.
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jednako kao i naših vanjskih veza.
10:04
So we spoke and we heard some
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Tako smo razgovarali i čuli neke stvari
10:06
about design this week.
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o dizajnu ovaj tjedan.
10:08
I think that it's important for us to remember
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Mislim kako je za nas važno zapamtiti
10:10
that we need
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kako trebamo
10:12
to keep pushing forward
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gurati naprijed
10:14
on the endeavor
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u nastojanju
10:16
of the design of the heart.
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dizajniranja srca.
10:18
We heard a lot about technology this week,
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Čuli smo jako puno o tehnologiji ovaj tjedan,
10:20
and it's important for us to remember
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i važno nam je zapamtiti
10:22
to invest a lot of our energy
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kako moramo investirati puno energije
10:25
in improving the technology of the heart.
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u poboljšanje tehnologije našeg srca.
10:47
TD: So, even though I'm somewhat happy
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TD: Čak iako sam donekle sretan
10:49
about the wonderful developments that are happening in the world,
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zbog prekrasnih dostignuća koja se događaju u svijetu,
10:52
still, I feel a sense of impediment,
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još uvijek, osjećam prepreke,
10:55
when it comes
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kada dođe
10:57
to the ability that we have
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do sposobnosti koju imamo
10:59
to connect with each other on a heart-to-heart, or a mind-to-mind, level.
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da se povežemo jedni s drugima na razini srca-sa-srcem, ili uma-s-umom.
11:02
I feel that there are some things
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Osjećam kako postoje neke stvari
11:05
that are getting in the way.
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koje su nam na putu.
11:43
TC: My relationship
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TC: Moj odnos
11:45
to this concept of heart-to-heart connection, or mind-to-mind connection,
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s ovim konceptom veza srca-sa-srcom ili uma-s-umom,
11:48
is an interesting one,
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je zanimljiv,
11:50
because, as a spiritual leader, I'm always attempting
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jer, kao spiritualni vođa, uvijek pokušavam
11:52
to open my heart to others
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otvoriti srce drugima
11:54
and offer myself up
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i ponuditi se
11:56
for heart-to-heart and mind-to-mind connections
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za vezu srca-sa srcem i uma-s-umom
11:58
in a genuine way with other people,
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na autentičan način drugim ljudima,
12:00
but at the same time,
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ali u isto vrijeme,
12:02
I've always been advised
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uvijek su mi savjetovali
12:04
that I need to emphasize intelligence
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kako moram naglašavati inteligenciju
12:06
over the heart-to-heart connections,
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ispred veze srca-sa-srcem,
12:08
because, being someone in a position like mine,
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jer, biti u poziciji poput moje,
12:12
if I don't rely primarily on intelligence,
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ako se ne pouzdam primarno u inteligenciju,
12:15
then something dangerous may happen to me.
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onda mi se nešto opasno može dogoditi.
12:19
So it's an interesting paradox at play there.
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Ovdje je interesantan paradoks u igri.
12:25
But I had a really striking experience once,
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Ali imao sam neobično iskustvo jednom,
12:28
when a group from Afghanistan
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kada je grupa iz Afganistana
12:30
came to visit me,
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došla da me posjeti,
12:32
and we had a really interesting conversation.
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i imali smo stvarno interesantan razgovor.
14:10
TD: So we ended up talking about the Bamiyan Buddhas,
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TD: Završili smo govoreći o Bamiyanskim Budama,
14:13
which, as you know,
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koje su, kao što znate,
14:15
were destroyed some years ago in Afghanistan.
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bile uništene prije nekoliko godina u Afganistanu.
14:19
But the basis of our conversation
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Ali osnova našeg razgovora
14:21
was the different approach to spirituality
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bio je drugačiji pristup spiritualnosti
14:23
on the part of the Muslim
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od strane muslimanske
14:25
and Buddhist traditions.
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i budističke tradicije.
14:27
Of course, in Muslim,
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Naravno, u muslimanskoj tradiciji,
14:29
because of the teachings around the concept of idolatry,
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zbog učenja oko koncepta obožavanja,
14:32
you don't find as many
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ne možete pronaći toliko
14:34
physical representations of divinity
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fizičkih reprezentacija božanstvenosti
14:36
or of spiritual liberation
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ili spiritualnog oslobođenja
14:38
as you do in the Buddhist tradition,
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kao što možete u budističkoj tradiciji,
14:40
where, of course, there are many statues of the Buddha
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gdje, naravno, postoji jako puno statua Bude
14:43
that are highly revered.
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koje su visoko štovane.
14:48
So, we were talking about the differences
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Dakle, pričamo o razlikama
14:50
between the traditions
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između tradicija
14:52
and what many people perceived
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i onome što su mnogi ljudi zamijetili
14:54
as the tragedy of the destruction of the Bamiyan Buddhas,
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kao tragediju uništavanja Bamiyanskih Buda,
14:57
but I offered the suggestion
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ali ja sam ponudio sugestiju
14:59
that perhaps we could look at this in a positive way.
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kao bismo možda na to mogli gledati na pozitivan način.
15:03
What we saw in the destruction of the Bamiyan Buddhas
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Ono što smo vidjeli u uništavanju Bamiyanskih Buda
15:10
was the depletion of matter,
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bila je deplijacija važnosti,
15:13
some solid substance
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neka čvrsta tvar
15:15
falling down and disintegrating.
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se srušila i dezintegrirala.
15:17
Maybe we could look at that to be more similar
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Možda bi mogli gledati na to kao nešto slično
15:19
to the falling of the Berlin Wall,
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padu Berlinskog zida
15:21
where a divide
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gdje je podijela
15:23
that had kept two types of people apart
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koja je držala dva tipa ljudi odvojenima
15:26
had collapsed and opened up a door
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pala i otvorila vrata
15:28
for further communication.
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za buduću komunikaciju.
15:30
So I think that, in this way,
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Tako mislim kako je, na ovaj način,
15:32
it's always possible for us
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za nas uvijek moguće
15:34
to derive something positive
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izvući nešto pozitivno
15:37
that can help us understand one another better.
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što će nam pomoći da drugoga razumijemo bolje.
16:20
TD: So, with regard to the development
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TD: Tako, s obzirom na razvoj
16:22
that we've been talking about
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o kojem smo pričali
16:24
here at this conference,
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na ovoj konferenciji,
16:26
I really feel
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stvarno osjećam
16:28
that the development that we make
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kako razvoj koji stvaramo
16:31
shouldn't create a further burden
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ne bi trebao stvarati daljnja opterećenja
16:33
for us as human beings,
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za nas, ljudska bića,
16:35
but should be used
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već bi se trebala koristiti
16:37
to improve
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za poboljšanje
16:40
our fundamental lifestyle
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našeg bazičnog životnog stila
16:42
of how we live in the world.
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kako živimo u svijetu.
18:16
TD: Of course, I rejoice
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TD: Naravno, radujem se
18:18
in the development and the growth and the rise
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razvoju i rastu i napretku
18:21
of the noble land of India, the great country of India,
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plemenite zemlje Indije, velike zemlje Indije,
18:24
but at the same time, I think,
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ali u isto vrijeme, mislim,
18:26
as some of us have acknowledged,
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kao što su neki od nas prepoznali,
18:29
we need to be aware
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mislim kako moramo biti svjesni
18:31
that some aspects of this rise
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kako neki aspekti tog napretka
18:34
are coming at the cost
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dolaze na trošak
18:37
of the very ground
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temelja
18:39
on which we stand.
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na kojem stojimo.
18:41
So, as we are climbing the tree,
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Tako, dok se penjemo po drvetu,
18:44
some of the things that we're doing
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neke od stvari koje radimo
18:46
in order to climb the tree
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kako bismo se penjali
18:48
are actually undermining
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u stvari potkopavaju
18:50
the tree's very root.
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korijen drveta.
18:52
And so,
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I tako,
18:54
what I think it comes down to
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ono što ja mislim se svodi
18:56
is a question of, not only having information of what's going on,
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na pitanje o, ne samo posjedovanja informacije o tome što se događa,
19:00
but paying attention to that
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već obraćanje pažnje na to
19:03
and letting that shift our motivation
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i dozvole da nam to promijeni motivaciju
19:06
to become more sincere
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kako bismo postali iskreniji
19:09
and genuinely positive.
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i stvarno pozitivni.
19:13
We have hear, this week,
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Čuli smo, ovaj tjedan
19:15
about the horrible sufferings, for example,
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o strašnim patnjama, na primjer,
19:19
that so many women of the world
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koje tolike žene svijeta
19:22
are enduring day-to-day.
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trpe iz dana u dan.
19:24
We have that information,
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Imamo informacije,
19:26
but what often happens to us
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ali ono što nam se često događa
19:28
is that we don't really choose to pay attention to it.
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jest da izaberemo kako nećemo obraćati pažnju.
19:31
We don't really choose to allow that
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U stvari ne dozvoljavamo si da
19:33
to cause there to be a shift in our hearts.
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taj razlog uzrokuje promjenu u našim srcima.
19:36
So I think the way forward for the world --
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Tako mislim kako je put naprijed za svijet --
19:38
one that will bring the path of outer development
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onaj koji će nam omogućiti put vanjskog razvoja
19:42
in harmony
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u harmoniji
19:47
with the real root of happiness --
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sa stvarnim korijenom sreće --
19:50
is that we allow
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onaj koji dozvoljava
19:52
the information that we have
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da informacije koje imamo
19:54
to really make a change in our heart.
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stvore promjenu u našim srcima.
20:45
TD: So I think that sincere motivation
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TD: Mislim kako je iskrena motivacija
20:47
is very important for our future well-being,
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jako važna za naše buduće blagostanje,
20:50
or deep sense of well-being as humans,
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ili duboko osjećanje blagostanja kao ljudi,
20:53
and I think that means sinking in
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i mislim kako to znači utonuće u
20:56
to whatever it is you're doing now.
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štogod da radite sada.
20:58
Whatever work you're trying to do now to benefit the world,
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Kojigod posao sada pokušavate raditi da poboljšate svijet,
21:00
sink into that,
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utonite u njega,
21:02
get a full taste of that.
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okusite ga u potpunosti.
21:40
TD: So, since we've been here this week,
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TD: S obzirom da smo ovdje ovaj tjedan,
21:42
we've taken millions of breaths, collectively,
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zajedno napravili milijune izdisaja,
21:47
and perhaps we haven't witnessed
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i možda smo svjedočili
21:49
any course changes
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nekim promjenama
21:51
happening in our lives,
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koje se događaju u našim životima,
21:53
but we often miss the very subtle changes.
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ali često propuštamo zapaziti suptilnije promjene.
21:56
And I think
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I mislim
21:59
that sometimes we develop
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kako ponekad razvijamo
22:01
grand concepts
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velike koncepte
22:03
of what happiness
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ono kako sreća
22:05
might look like for us,
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izgleda za nas,
22:07
but that, if we pay attention,
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dok u stvari, kada bismo obratili pažnju,
22:09
we can see that there are little symbols of happiness
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mogli bi vidjeti kako postoje mali simboli sreće
22:12
in every breath that we take.
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u svakom našem udisaju.
23:21
TD: So, every one of you who has come here
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TD: Tako je svatko od vas tko je došao ovdje
23:24
is so talented,
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toliko talentiran,
23:26
and you have so much to offer to the world,
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i imate toliko puno za ponuditi svijetu,
23:30
I think it would be a good note to conclude on then
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mislim kako bi bilo dobro zaključiti
23:34
to just take a moment
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da uzmete trenutak
23:37
to appreciate how fortunate we are
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i zahvalite kako smo sretni
23:39
to have come together in this way and exchanged ideas
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što smo se okupili na ovaj način i razmijenili ideje
23:42
and really form a strong aspiration
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i stvarno stvorite snažnu aspiraciju
23:44
and energy within ourselves
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i energiju unutar sebe
23:46
that we will take the good
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koja će uzeti dobro
23:48
that has come from this conference,
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koje je došlo od ove konferencije,
23:50
the momentum, the positivity,
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momentum, pozitivnost,
23:53
and we will spread that and plant it
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i to ćemo rasprostrijeti i posaditi
23:55
in all of the corners of the world.
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u sve kutove svijeta.
24:18
His Holiness the Karmapa: Tomorrow is my Talk.
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Njegova Svetost Karmapa: Sutra je moj govor.
24:32
TD: Lakshmi has worked incredibly hard,
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TD: Lakshmi je radila nevjerojatno teško,
24:35
even in inviting me,
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kako bi me pozvala,
24:37
let alone everything else that she has done
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na stranu sve ostalo što je napravila
24:39
to make this happen,
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kako bi se ovo dogodilo,
24:41
and I was somewhat resistant at times,
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a ja sam se ponekad opirao,
24:44
and I was also very nervous throughout this week.
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i bio sam također prilično nervozan cijeli tjedan.
24:47
I was feeling under the weather and dizzy and so forth,
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Osjećao sam se boležljivo i vrtoglavo i tako dalje,
24:50
and people would ask me, why.
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i ljudi bi me pitali, zašto.
24:52
I would tell them, "It's because I have to talk tomorrow."
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Rekao bih im, "To je zato jer imam govor sutra."
24:57
And so Lakshmi had to put up with me through all of that,
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I tako je Lakshmi morala prolaziti sa mnom kroz sve to,
25:00
but I very much appreciate
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ali ja jako cijenim
25:02
the opportunity she's given me
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priliku koju mi je dala
25:04
to be here.
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da budem ovdje.
25:06
And to you, everyone, thank you very much.
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I vama, svima, hvala vam puno.
25:09
(Applause)
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(Pljesak)
25:12
HH: Thank you very much.
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NjV: Hvala vam puno.
25:14
(Applause)
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(Pljesak)
ABOUT THE SPEAKER
His Holiness the Karmapa - Spiritual leaderOgyen Trinley Dorje is the 17th Gyalwang Karmapa, a revered figure in Tibetan Buddhism devoted to preserving and propagating Buddhist teachings.
Why you should listen
The name "Karmapa" means "the one who carries out Buddha-activity," and for seventeen lifetimes, a karmapa has embodied the teachings of Buddha in tibet. The 17th Gyalwang Karmapa, Ogyen Trinley Dorje, was born a nomad in Tibet in 1985 and recognized by the Dalai Lama in 1992 as the 17th Karmapa. The young boy was brought to the Tsurphu monastery to live and study for his life as a spiritual teacher and activist.
At age 14, he made a daring flight from Tibet, and now works from a temporary camp in Dharamsala, near his friend the Dalai Lama. (After the Dalai Lama, he's seen as Tibetan Buddhism's second-highest-ranking spiritual leader, though the two men lead different schools within the faith.) In 2008, he made a long visit to the United States, where he spoke and taught at Buddhist centers around the country. And in 2009 he toured Europe, speaking about faith -- but also about protecting the environment.
His Holiness the Karmapa | Speaker | TED.com