TED2019
Jess Kutch: What productive conflict can offer a workplace
Jess Kutch: 职场的有效矛盾能带来什么？
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知道如何将你的职场打造得更好吗？劳工组织者和TED研究员 Jess Kutch 能告诉你如何付诸于行动。在这场简短的演讲中，她解释了“有效矛盾”——当人们组织起来，去挑战并且改善他们的工作环境——是如何能够同时让员工和雇主们受益的。
Jess Kutch - Labor entrepreneur
TED Fellow Jess Kutch is the cofounder of Coworker.org, a nonprofit that helps people join together to improve their jobs and workplaces. Full bio
TED Fellow Jess Kutch is the cofounder of Coworker.org, a nonprofit that helps people join together to improve their jobs and workplaces. Full bio
Double-click the English transcript below to play the video.
00:12
I am a labor organizer,
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我是一名劳工组织者，
00:15
and in 2013, I cofounded
an organization called coworker.org
an organization called coworker.org
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在 2013 年，我与人联合建立了
一个名为 coworker.org 的组织。
一个名为 coworker.org 的组织。
00:19
that uses technology
to help people join with coworkers
to help people join with coworkers
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这个组织旨在使用科技
来帮助人们与同事一起
来帮助人们与同事一起
00:24
and organize for improvements
in the workplace.
in the workplace.
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组织改善职场环境。
00:27
Now, there are two kinds
of reactions to what I do.
of reactions to what I do.
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对于我的工作，
人们一般有两种反应，
人们一般有两种反应，
00:31
Actually, no, there are three.
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实际上应该是三种。
00:33
The first is complete confusion
about what organizing is.
about what organizing is.
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第一种是搞不清“组织”
这个定义是什么意思。
这个定义是什么意思。
00:37
When my doctor asked
what I do and I told him,
what I do and I told him,
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当我的医生问起我的职业，
我告诉了他，
我告诉了他，
00:39
he thought I meant organizing,
like, Marie Kondo-style.
like, Marie Kondo-style.
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他以为我说的组织是
那种类似藤麻理惠的收纳整理风格。
那种类似藤麻理惠的收纳整理风格。
00:43
(Laughter)
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（笑声）
00:44
He was like, "Oh, that's so great,
I could use some of that around here.
I could use some of that around here.
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他说：“哦，那真是太棒了，
可以在这里派上用场，
可以在这里派上用场，
00:48
I would love to clean up
our patient files."
our patient files."
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我很乐意整理病人的档案。”
00:50
And I had to explain to him that no, no,
it's not that kind of organizing,
it's not that kind of organizing,
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之后我不得不向他解释，
“不不，不是那样的组织，
“不不，不是那样的组织，
00:54
it's more like if you showed up
to work tomorrow
to work tomorrow
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更像是如果你明天来上班，
00:57
and all the nurses in the office
had gotten together
had gotten together
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办公室里的所有护士都团结了起来，
要求全面加薪。”
01:00
to ask for an across-the-board raise.
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01:01
(Laughter)
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（笑声）
01:03
"Oh," he replied, and he got really quiet.
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“哦，” 他回复道，
之后就陷入了沉默。
之后就陷入了沉默。
01:06
(Laughter)
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（笑声）
01:07
Yeah, and that's
the second kind of reaction:
the second kind of reaction:
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没错，这差不多就是第二种反应：
01:10
the uncomfortable kind.
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不舒服的那种。
01:12
People usually withdraw
from the conversation
from the conversation
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人们时常抽离对话，
01:14
and find someone else to talk to.
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找另外一个人去交谈。
01:17
Finally, there's the third reaction,
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最后，是第三种反应，
01:19
the excited one,
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兴奋的反应，
01:20
the, "Oh my God, yes! We need this!"
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那种“天呐，太好了！
我们正需要它！”
我们正需要它！”
01:23
And someone always proceeds
to tell me a story.
to tell me a story.
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之后经常就会有人接着给我讲故事。
01:26
It's always a story about a job
or a coworker or a friend
or a coworker or a friend
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一般都是关于一份工作、
一个同事，或一个朋友
一个同事，或一个朋友
01:30
who's enduring something awful at work.
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在工作中正在忍受不快的故事。
01:33
What I've noticed is that there is never
a neutral response to what I do.
a neutral response to what I do.
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我已经发现对于我的工作，
没有人能够有中立的反应。
没有人能够有中立的反应。
01:37
You're either repelled by it,
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你要么被它击退，
01:39
or you're struck with
a lightning bolt of excitement.
a lightning bolt of excitement.
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要么被兴奋的闪电击中。
01:43
So why does my work stir up
such strong reactions?
such strong reactions?
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那么为什么我的工作
能激起如此强烈的反应？
能激起如此强烈的反应？
01:47
My hunch is that it's about conflict.
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我的直觉是因为这关乎于矛盾。
01:50
If you have power in your workplace,
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如果你在职场上坐拥权力，
01:52
maybe as a CEO
or a senior leader of some kind,
or a senior leader of some kind,
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可能是CEO或是某种高级领导，
01:56
you're going to feel uncomfortable
with that power being challenged.
with that power being challenged.
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那么当你的权力受到挑战时，
你就会感到不适。
你就会感到不适。
02:00
But if you lack power, or you know someone
who lacks it and needs it,
who lacks it and needs it,
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但如果你或者其他人
缺乏而且需要权力，
缺乏而且需要权力，
02:04
you might grab me by the shoulders
and shake me, you're so pumped.
and shake me, you're so pumped.
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你可能会抓着我的肩膀，激动万分。
02:08
But really, we can all benefit
from understanding
from understanding
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事实上，理解矛盾
在职场中能带来什么，
在职场中能带来什么，
我们所有人都能从中受益。
02:12
what conflict can offer in our workplaces.
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02:15
The power imbalance
in our workplace is real,
in our workplace is real,
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职场中权力分配的不均是真实的，
02:17
and it's constantly changing.
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而且一直在变。
02:19
Power moves between us,
depending on our roles and status.
depending on our roles and status.
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权力在我们之间涌动，
取决于我们的角色和地位。
取决于我们的角色和地位。
02:24
Now, sometimes this can feel
like office politics, right?
like office politics, right?
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有时这感觉像是办公室政治，对吧？
02:27
Which is never fun.
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办公室政治从来都不有趣。
02:29
But when we contest
for power thoughtfully
for power thoughtfully
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但是面对权力，当我们深思熟虑，
02:32
and together with our coworkers,
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并且与同事们并肩，
02:34
it can be incredibly productive.
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就可以让事情变得极其有成效。
02:36
And it's that kind of productive conflict
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这就是今天我想要和大家谈论的
02:38
that I want to talk
to you all about today,
to you all about today,
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那种有效矛盾，
那种可以使我们部分人
听着不舒服的矛盾。
听着不舒服的矛盾。
02:40
the kind that can make
some of us uncomfortable.
some of us uncomfortable.
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02:43
Business leaders should embrace
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当员工们与政策和决策
02:44
when their workers conflict
with policies and decisions,
with policies and decisions,
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发生矛盾冲突时，
商业领袖们应该去接受它，
商业领袖们应该去接受它，
02:47
both for what it teaches us
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不仅为了它教给我们的东西，
02:50
and for what it says about
our commitment to each other.
our commitment to each other.
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也是为了表达出我们对彼此的承诺。
02:53
So what do I mean by
"productive conflict"?
"productive conflict"?
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那么我说的“有效矛盾”是什么意思？
02:56
Well, let me tell you a story.
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先让我给各位讲个故事。
02:58
In 2016, a store employee
for an outdoor retailer --
for an outdoor retailer --
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在 2016 年，
一家户外零售商的店内员工——
一家户外零售商的店内员工——
03:02
I'll call her "Alex" --
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我叫她 “Alex” ——
03:04
Alex approached her boss
and asked for a raise.
and asked for a raise.
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Alex 走到她老板跟前要求涨薪，
03:07
Now, she was told her pay
was fairly standard for her position
was fairly standard for her position
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但是老板告诉她，
她的工资完全符合她的职位标准，
她的工资完全符合她的职位标准，
03:10
and that her boss didn't even have
the authority to give such a raise.
the authority to give such a raise.
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而且她老板本人
甚至没有给员工涨薪权限。
甚至没有给员工涨薪权限。
03:14
And that was supposed to be
the end of the conversation.
the end of the conversation.
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事情到这里本来就应该结束了。
03:18
Unhappy with that answer,
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Alex 对于老板的回答很不满意，
03:19
Alex went home, and she decided
to create a campaign on coworker.org,
to create a campaign on coworker.org,
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回到家，她决定在 coworker.org 上
03:23
asking the corporate office
to give raises to store employees.
to give raises to store employees.
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发起一场运动，
要求公司给店内员工涨薪。
要求公司给店内员工涨薪。
03:27
Within days, employees
from around the country
from around the country
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没几天，全国各地的员工
03:30
began joining Alex's effort
and sharing their own stories
and sharing their own stories
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开始加入 Alex 的运动
并分享他们自己
并分享他们自己
03:33
about what they were earning --
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目前收入的故事——
03:34
11, 12 dollars an hour --
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11 或 12 美金时薪——
03:36
and how that wage
was impacting their lives.
was impacting their lives.
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以及那个工资水平
是如何影响他们生活的。
是如何影响他们生活的。
03:38
Some even shared
that they had quit recently
that they had quit recently
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有些人甚至说他们最近辞职了，
03:41
to work for competitors who paid more.
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去薪水更高的竞争公司工作。
03:44
But here's the thing: they also shared
that they didn't want to quit,
that they didn't want to quit,
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但问题是：他们也分享说
他们不想要离开，
他们不想要离开，
03:47
they liked their job, they believed
in the company's mission,
in the company's mission,
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他们喜欢自己的工作，
他们相信公司的使命，
他们相信公司的使命，
03:50
but for them, the pay issue
was a growing problem in their work lives.
was a growing problem in their work lives.
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但对于他们来说，薪水一直是
一个日渐增长的问题。
一个日渐增长的问题。
03:55
Well, after weeks of this groundswell
of employee activism,
of employee activism,
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在员工运动情绪高涨的几周后，
04:00
the company decided to raise wages
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公司决定在国内各个城市
04:02
by five to 15 percent
in cities across the country.
in cities across the country.
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加薪 5% - 15%。
04:05
And that's what I mean
by productive conflict:
by productive conflict:
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这就是我说的有效矛盾：
04:08
pushing up against the things
that aren't working for us
that aren't working for us
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在没有其它解决途径的前提下，
04:10
when there exists no other path forward.
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向上反抗那些对我们不利的事。
04:13
The other thing I learned
in doing this work
in doing this work
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在这个工作中，我学会的另外一件事
04:16
is that people engage
in productive conflict
in productive conflict
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就是当人们在意
他们的工作和同事时，
他们的工作和同事时，
04:18
when they care about their jobs
and their coworkers.
and their coworkers.
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他们就会参与有效矛盾。
04:21
Now, that surprised me at first.
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这事一开始让我非常惊讶。
04:24
I expected the worst jobs,
the worst workplaces,
the worst workplaces,
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我期待最差劲的工作
和最垃圾的工作场所
和最垃圾的工作场所
04:26
to have the most
employee activism on our site,
employee activism on our site,
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在我们网站上有最多的员工运动，
04:29
but the opposite is often true.
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但实际情况恰恰相反。
04:32
When we come together,
we can accomplish great things.
we can accomplish great things.
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当我们凝聚在一起，
我们可以成就大事。
我们可以成就大事。
04:37
At one company,
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有一个公司，
04:39
there are more than 50 campaigns
by employees there
by employees there
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有超过 50 个的员工运动，
04:42
on issues ranging from dress code changes
to legitimate safety concerns.
to legitimate safety concerns.
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从着装要求的改变
到合法合理的安全顾虑。
到合法合理的安全顾虑。
04:47
And get this:
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最终结果：
04:48
that same company has
the lowest voluntary turnover rate
the lowest voluntary turnover rate
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相较该行业其它主要连锁公司，
04:53
of any major chain in its sector.
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这家公司的自愿离职率最低。
04:55
And it also has one of the higher
productivity rates as well.
productivity rates as well.
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这家公司也同样有着较高的生产率。
05:01
Business leaders:
you shouldn't fear conflict,
you shouldn't fear conflict,
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商业领袖们：
你们不应该惧怕矛盾，
你们不应该惧怕矛盾，
05:03
and you shouldn't try to tamp down on it
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你们也不应该
在矛盾即将于职场发生时
在矛盾即将于职场发生时
05:05
the minute it bubbles up
in your workforce.
in your workforce.
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就打压它。
05:08
While it can introduce uncertainties
that can be difficult to manage,
that can be difficult to manage,
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尽管接受矛盾可能意味着
引入难以管理的不确定因素，
引入难以管理的不确定因素，
05:13
those uncertainties are trying
to tell you something
to tell you something
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但那些不确定因素
正在尝试告诉你一些
需要你关注的根本问题。
需要你关注的根本问题。
05:16
about an underlying problem
that needs your attention.
that needs your attention.
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05:20
And I think this is
especially important right now,
especially important right now,
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我认为这非常重要，尤其是现在。
05:23
you know, as technology
transforms nearly everyone's job
transforms nearly everyone's job
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随着技术对近乎每个人工作的转变，
05:28
and as the structures
that contain our work
that contain our work
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以及囊括我们工作的结构
05:31
are changing at a pace not seen
since the Industrial Revolution.
since the Industrial Revolution.
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正在以从工业革命以来
前所未有的速度改变，
前所未有的速度改变，
05:35
We all need to be shaping
and participating in the future of work.
and participating in the future of work.
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我们所有人都需要塑造自己
并参与到未来工作。
并参与到未来工作。
05:40
We all need to be challenging
and changing the parts of our work lives
and changing the parts of our work lives
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我们都需要挑战和改变
我们工作生活中
我们工作生活中
破碎不堪的部分。
05:44
that are broken.
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05:47
So I hope the next time
a coworker invites you
a coworker invites you
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因此我希望，
如果下一次你的一个同事
如果下一次你的一个同事
05:50
maybe to join a sign-on
letter to your boss,
letter to your boss,
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邀请你参与签署一封
给老板的联名信，
给老板的联名信，
05:53
or a group of employees asks for a meeting
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或是一群员工要求开会
05:56
to discuss their concerns
about the new health care plan,
about the new health care plan,
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讨论他们对新医疗计划的顾虑，
06:00
I hope you'll consider it an opportunity
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我希望，你能把它当作一个机会，
06:03
to build a better workplace,
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一个营造更好职场环境的机会，
06:05
a stronger business
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一个打造更强企业的机会，
06:07
and an economy that works for all of us.
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和一个适合所有人的经济环境。
06:10
Thank you.
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谢谢。
06:11
(Applause)
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（掌声）
ABOUT THE SPEAKER
Jess Kutch - Labor entrepreneurTED Fellow Jess Kutch is the cofounder of Coworker.org, a nonprofit that helps people join together to improve their jobs and workplaces.
Why you should listen
Jess Kutch and her team at Coworker.org are figuring out the technology, organizing models, financing and policies that can help workers improve their companies and industries in today’s economy. At Coworker.org, they believe anyone can be a workplace organizer and that seeking positive change at work is a form of civic and community leadership that requires infrastructure. Since 2013, hundreds of thousands of people in the United States and worldwide have used Coworker.org tools and services to win wage increases, scheduling improvements and parental leave benefits; end biased dress codes; fix harassment policies; demand corporate ethics and much more. Coworker.org also helps channel workers' information about the real-time effects of digital economy trends -- like automation, data profiting, surveillance and app-based gig work -- to influence decisions that will shape the future of work and inequality.
Kutch has 15 years of experience innovating at the intersection of technology and social change. Previously, she led a team at Change.org that inspired hundreds of thousands of people to launch and lead their own efforts on the platform. She also spent five years at the Service Employees International Union (SEIU), where she pioneered digital strategies for the labor movement. Kutch is a TED Fellow, an Echoing Green Global Fellow, a J.M.K. Innovation Prize winner and an Aspen Institute Job Quality Fellow. She is a frequently requested speaker at business, labor, futurist, democracy and economic conferences around the world. She has been invited to provide expert testimony to the EEOC Task Force on Harassment in the Workplace and the National Labor Relations Board. In 2015, Coworker.org cohosted the first-ever White House Town Hall on Worker Voice.
Jess Kutch | Speaker | TED.com