ABOUT THE SPEAKER
Stanley McChrystal - Military leader
General Stanley McChrystal is the former commander of U.S. and International forces in Afghanistan. A four-star general, he is credited for creating a revolution in warfare that fuses intelligence and operations.

Why you should listen

With a remarkable record of achievement, General Stanley McChrystal has been praised for creating a revolution in warfare that fused intelligence and operations. A four-star general, he is the former commander of U.S. and international forces in Afghanistan and the former leader of Joint Special Operations Command (JSOC), which oversees the military’s most sensitive forces. McChrystal’s leadership of JSOC is credited with the December 2003 capture of Saddam Hussein and the June 2006 location and killing of Abu Musab al-Zarqawi, the leader of al-Qaeda in Iraq. McChrystal, a former Green Beret, is known for his candor.

After McChrystal graduated from West Point, he was commissioned as an infantry officer, and spent much of his career commanding special operations and airborne infantry units. During the Persian Gulf War, McChrystal served in a Joint Special Operations Task Force and later commanded the 75th Ranger Regiment. He completed year-long fellowships at Harvard’s John F. Kennedy School of Government in 1997 and in 2000 at the Council on Foreign Relations. In 2002, he was appointed chief of staff of military operations in Afghanistan. Two years later, McChrystal was selected to deliver nationally televised Pentagon briefings about military operations in Iraq. From 2003 to 2008, McChrystal commanded JSOC and was responsible for leading the nation’s deployed military counter-terrorism efforts around the globe. He assumed command of all International Forces in Afghanistan in June 2009. President Obama’s order for an additional 30,000 troops to Afghanistan was based on McChrystal’s assessment of the war there. McChrystal retired from the military in August 2010.

More profile about the speaker
Stanley McChrystal | Speaker | TED.com
TED2014

Stanley McChrystal: The military case for sharing knowledge

史丹利.麥克力斯托: 知識分享的軍事範例

Filmed:
1,059,925 views

2003 年史丹利.麥克力斯托將軍開始對抗蓋達組織時,資訊跟祕密是他行動所需仰賴的命脈。但隨這場非常規之戰不段持續,他開始思考或許將資訊列為機密的這種組織文化往往適得其反。在這精簡有力的演講中,麥克力斯托舉出知識分享的絕佳範例。
- Military leader
General Stanley McChrystal is the former commander of U.S. and International forces in Afghanistan. A four-star general, he is credited for creating a revolution in warfare that fuses intelligence and operations. Full bio

Double-click the English transcript below to play the video.

00:12
When I was a young年輕 officer, they told me
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當我還是個年輕軍官時,
他們告訴我
00:14
to follow跟隨 my instincts本能,
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要跟著直覺走、
00:16
to go with my gut腸道,
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照本能行事,
00:19
and what I've learned學到了
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而我學到的是
00:21
is that often經常 our instincts本能 are wrong錯誤.
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我們的直覺通常都是錯的。
00:25
In the summer夏季 of 2010,
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2010 年夏天,
00:28
there was a massive大規模的 leak洩漏 of classified分類 documents文件
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有許多機密文件
00:32
that came來了 out of the Pentagon五角大樓.
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從國防部流出。
00:35
It shocked吃驚 the world世界,
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這震驚了世界
00:36
it shook震撼 up the American美國 government政府,
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也撼動了美國政府,
00:38
and it made製作 people ask a lot of questions問題,
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並引起民眾的許多質疑,
00:40
because the sheer絕對 amount of information信息
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因為這些外洩的大量資訊
00:43
that was let out, and the potential潛在 impacts影響,
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和潛在的影響
00:46
were significant重大.
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極為驚人。
00:49
And one of the first questions問題 we asked ourselves我們自己
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很多人首先會問
00:53
was why would a young年輕 soldier士兵 have access訪問
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為什麼一位年輕的士兵有權限
00:56
to that much information信息?
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獲得這麼多的資訊?
00:59
Why would we let sensitive敏感 things
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為什麼我們讓敏感資訊
01:01
be with a relatively相對 young年輕 person?
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被一位年輕人知道?
01:05
In the summer夏季 of 2003, I was assigned分配 to command命令
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2003 年的夏天,我被派任指揮
01:08
a special特別 operations操作 task任務 force,
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一個特別行動部隊,
01:11
and that task任務 force was spread傳播 across橫過 the Mideast中東
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這是分佈在中東的部隊,
01:13
to fight鬥爭 al Qaeda凱達.
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為打擊蓋達組織。
01:15
Our main主要 effort功夫 was inside Iraq伊拉克,
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我們主要精力放在伊拉克,
01:18
and our specified規定 mission任務
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而我們的具體任務
01:20
was to defeat打敗 al Qaeda凱達 in Iraq伊拉克.
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是要擊敗伊拉克的蓋達組織,
01:21
For almost幾乎 five years年份 I stayed there,
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我在那待了將近五年時間。
01:25
and we focused重點 on fighting戰鬥 a war戰爭
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我們專心打一場戰爭,
01:26
that was unconventional非傳統的 and it was difficult
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這是非常規且困難的戰爭,
01:31
and it was bloody血腥
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非常血腥
01:33
and it often經常 claimed聲稱 its highest最高 price價錢
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且付出最慘痛代價的
01:36
among其中 innocent無辜 people.
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往往都是那些無辜的人。
01:39
We did everything we could
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我們盡全力
01:42
to stop al Qaeda凱達
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阻止蓋達組織,
01:44
and the foreign國外 fighters戰士 that
came來了 in as suicide自殺 bombers轟炸機
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阻止外國自殺炸彈客,
01:47
and as accelerants促進劑 to the violence暴力.
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因為他們加劇了這場暴力。
01:52
We honed磨練 our combat戰鬥 skills技能,
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我們精進作戰技巧、
01:54
we developed發達 new equipment設備,
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發展新裝備、
01:57
we parachuted跳傘, we helicoptered乘直升機,
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我們跳傘、搭直升機、
02:00
we took small boats, we drove開車, and we walked
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乘小船、開車、步行,
02:02
to objectives目標 night after night to stop
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日以繼夜的活動都為了
阻止這組織所帶來的殺戮。
02:05
the killing謀殺 that this network網絡 was putting forward前鋒.
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02:10
We bled流血,
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我們流血、
02:13
we died死亡,
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有人死亡、
02:14
and we killed殺害 to stop that organization組織
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我們殺戮,
都為阻止這組織
加諸在伊拉克人民的暴力行為。
02:19
from the violence暴力 that they were putting
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02:21
largely大部分 against反對 the Iraqi伊拉克人 people.
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02:25
Now, we did what we knew知道,
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我們執行所知的、
02:28
how we had grown長大的 up, and
one of the things that we knew知道,
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一直以來所學的,
這其中一件事就是
02:31
that was in our DNA脫氧核糖核酸, was secrecy保密.
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在我們組織的 DNA 中存在著保密性。
02:34
It was security安全. It was protecting保護 information信息.
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這是保護資訊關乎安全、
資訊是命脈的想法,
02:36
It was the idea理念 that information信息 was the lifeblood命脈
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02:39
and it was what would protect保護 and keep people safe安全.
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認為這可以保護人民。
02:42
And we had a sense that,
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我們也感受到
02:44
as we operated操作 within our organizations組織,
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自己組織運作時,
02:46
it was important重要 to keep information信息
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很重要的是,將資訊
02:48
in the silos筒倉 within the organizations組織,
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儲存在這組織的地窖中,
02:50
particularly尤其 only give information信息
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特別是只將資訊
02:53
to people had a demonstrated證明 need to know.
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提供給需要知道的人。
02:57
But the question often經常 came來了, who needed需要 to know?
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但這經常引起一個問題:誰需要知道?
03:02
Who needed需要, who had to have the information信息
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誰需要知道這資訊
03:05
so that they could do the important重要
parts部分 of the job工作 that you needed需要?
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以達成所需的重要任務?
03:09
And in a tightly緊緊 coupled耦合 world世界,
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在這個緊密相連的世界中,
03:11
that's very hard to predict預測.
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這是很難預測的。
03:13
It's very hard to know who needs需求 to have information信息
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很難知道誰需要這些資訊
03:16
and who doesn't.
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而誰不需要。
03:18
I used to deal合同 with intelligence情報 agencies機構,
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我以前跟情報機關合作過,
03:20
and I'd complain抱怨 that they weren't
sharing分享 enough足夠 intelligence情報,
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也會抱怨他們不分享足夠的情報。
03:22
and with a straight直行 face面對, they'd他們會
look at me and they'd他們會 say,
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他們通常都一臉正經的告訴我:
03:24
"What aren't you getting得到?" (Laughter笑聲)
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「有什麼你不知道的嗎?」(笑聲)
03:26
I said, "If I knew知道 that, we wouldn't不會 have a problem問題."
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我說,「要是我知道答案,
我們就不會有這問題了。」
03:32
But what we found發現 is we had to change更改.
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不過我發現我們需要改變。
03:34
We had to change更改 our culture文化 about information信息.
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我們必須改變我們對資訊的文化。
03:36
We had to knock down walls牆壁. We had to share分享.
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必須打破壁壘、必須分享。
03:38
We had to change更改 from who needs需求 to know
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必須從「誰必須知道」的想法
03:41
to the fact事實 that who doesn't know,
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轉變為「誰不知道,
03:43
and we need to tell, and tell
them as quickly很快 as we can.
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我們需要盡快告訴他們」。
03:46
It was a significant重大 culture文化 shift轉移 for an organization組織
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這是很重大的組織文化轉變,
03:49
that had secrecy保密 in its DNA脫氧核糖核酸.
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尤其對一個 DNA 中
存在著保密性的組織來說更是如此。
03:55
We started開始 by doing things, by building建造,
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我們開始建立
03:57
not working加工 in offices辦事處,
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--不是在辦公室中--
03:59
knocking敲門 down walls牆壁, working加工 in things we called
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而是打破壁壘,
在我們所謂的狀況警覺室中工作。
04:00
situation情況 awareness意識 rooms客房,
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04:03
and in the summer夏季 of 2007,
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在 2007 年夏天,
04:05
something happened發生 which哪一個 demonstrated證明 this.
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有件事成為知識分享的佳例。
04:07
We captured捕獲 the personnel人員 records記錄
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我們找到一些人員資料,
04:09
for the people who were bringing使 foreign國外 fighters戰士
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是那些將外國武裝份子
04:11
into Iraq伊拉克.
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帶進伊拉克的人員資料。
04:13
And when we got the personnel人員 records記錄, typically一般,
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通常我們拿到這些人員資料時
04:15
we would have hidden these,
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會把它們藏起來,
04:17
shared共享 them with a few少數 intelligence情報 agencies機構,
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只分享給極少數情報組織,
04:19
and then try to operate操作 with them.
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再與其合作。
04:21
But as I was talking to my intelligence情報 officer,
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但當我與情報官討論時,
04:23
I said, "What do we do?"
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我問:「我們要怎麼做?」
04:24
And he said, "Well, you found發現 them." Our command命令.
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他說:「你找到這些資料的。」
我們有權處理。
04:27
"You can just declassify撤銷密級 them."
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「你可以撤銷機密等級。」
04:29
And I said, "Well, can we declassify撤銷密級 them?
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我說:「我們能撤銷機密等級嗎?
04:31
What if the enemy敵人 finds認定 out?"
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如果被敵軍發現呢?」
04:32
And he says, "They're their personnel人員 records記錄."
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他說:「這本就是他們的人員名單啊。」
04:34
(Laughter笑聲)
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(笑聲)
04:36
So we did,
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所以我們就這麼做了,
04:37
and a lot of people got upset煩亂 about that,
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引起許多人不滿,
04:39
but as we passed通過 that information信息 around,
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但當我們將資訊分享出去時,
04:41
suddenly突然 you find that information信息 is only of value
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你會突然發現,
資訊唯有在交給
能做出行動的人時才有價值
04:44
if you give it to people who have the ability能力
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04:46
to do something with it.
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04:48
The fact事實 that I know something has zero value
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我空握有知識是沒有價值的
04:50
if I'm not the person who can actually其實
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除非我是那個
04:52
make something better because of it.
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可以將之加以運用的人。
04:54
So as a consequence後果, what we did was
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因此我們將
04:56
we changed the idea理念 of information信息,
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資訊的想法改變了。
04:59
instead代替 of knowledge知識 is power功率,
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與其將知識視為力量,
05:01
to one where sharing分享 is power功率.
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不如想成分享是力量。
05:04
It was the fundamental基本的 shift轉移,
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這是很徹底的想法轉變,
05:06
not new tactics策略, not new weapons武器,
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不是新的作戰策略、新武器,
05:08
not new anything else其他.
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這想法一點也不新穎。
05:10
It was the idea理念 that we were now part部分 of a team球隊
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只是將我們視為一個團隊
05:12
in which哪一個 information信息 became成為 the essential必要 link鏈接
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而知識是我們之間的必要連結
05:15
between之間 us, not a block between之間 us.
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而不是彼此間的阻礙。
05:19
And I want everybody每個人 to take a deep breath呼吸
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現在請大家深吸一口氣,
05:22
and let it out,
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吐出來。
05:24
because in your life, there's going to be information信息
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因為你的一生中,一定會有些資訊
05:26
that leaks洩漏 out you're not going to like.
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被洩漏出來,而你不喜歡的。
05:28
Somebody's某人的 going to get my college學院 grades等級 out,
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有人會把我大學成績抖出來,
05:30
a that's going to be a disaster災害. (Laughter笑聲)
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一定會很慘。(笑聲)
05:34
But it's going to be okay, and I will tell you that
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但這一點也沒關係,告訴你們
05:38
I am more scared害怕 of the bureaucrat
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比起這個,我更怕官僚制度
05:41
that holds持有 information信息 in a desk drawer抽屜
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將資訊鎖在抽屜中
05:43
or in a safe安全 than I am of someone有人 who leaks洩漏,
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或是保險箱裡,而不是怕有人洩密。
05:46
because ultimately最終, we'll be better off if we share分享.
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因為追根究柢,
相互分享會達到更好的結果。
05:49
Thank you.
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謝謝。
05:51
(Applause掌聲)
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(掌聲)
05:57
Helen海倫 Walters沃爾特斯: So I don't know if
you were here this morning早上,
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海倫.華特:我們不知道
你今早在不在現場。
05:59
if you were able能夠 to catch抓住 Rick幹草堆 LedgettLedgett,
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不過如果你遇到瑞克.雷傑特
06:01
the deputy director導向器 of the NSANSA
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——美國國家安全局副局長——
06:03
who was responding響應 to Edward愛德華
Snowden's斯諾登的 talk earlier this week.
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他回應了幾天前
愛德華.史諾頓的演講。
06:07
I just wonder奇蹟, do you think the American美國 government政府
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我想問,你認為美國政府
06:09
should give Edward愛德華 Snowden斯諾登 amnesty大赦?
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應該給愛德華豁免權嗎?
06:12
Stanley斯坦利 McChrystal麥克里斯特爾: I think that
Rick幹草堆 said something very important重要.
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史丹利.麥克力斯托:
我想瑞克提到一點很重要。
06:14
We, most people, don't know all the facts事實.
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大多數的人都不知道全情。
06:17
I think there are two parts部分 of this.
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我想這件事有一體兩面。
06:18
Edward愛德華 Snowden斯諾登 shined閃耀 a
light on an important重要 need
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愛德華.史諾頓揭露了
世人須了解的重要之事。
06:22
that people had to understand理解.
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06:23
He also took a lot of documents文件 that he didn't have
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但他也拿了許多
他並不知道其重要性的文件。
06:26
the knowledge知識 to know the importance重要性 of,
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06:29
so I think we need to learn學習 the facts事實 about this case案件
145
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2433
所以我想我們需要了解更多實情
06:31
before we make snap judgments判斷
146
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1547
才能對愛德華.史諾頓一案做出評判。
06:33
about Edward愛德華 Snowden斯諾登.
147
381337
2148
06:35
HWHW: Thank you so much. Thank you.
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海倫.華特:非常謝謝你。
06:37
(Applause掌聲)
149
385669
1918
(掌聲)
Translated by Adrienne Lin
Reviewed by Kuan-Yi Li

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ABOUT THE SPEAKER
Stanley McChrystal - Military leader
General Stanley McChrystal is the former commander of U.S. and International forces in Afghanistan. A four-star general, he is credited for creating a revolution in warfare that fuses intelligence and operations.

Why you should listen

With a remarkable record of achievement, General Stanley McChrystal has been praised for creating a revolution in warfare that fused intelligence and operations. A four-star general, he is the former commander of U.S. and international forces in Afghanistan and the former leader of Joint Special Operations Command (JSOC), which oversees the military’s most sensitive forces. McChrystal’s leadership of JSOC is credited with the December 2003 capture of Saddam Hussein and the June 2006 location and killing of Abu Musab al-Zarqawi, the leader of al-Qaeda in Iraq. McChrystal, a former Green Beret, is known for his candor.

After McChrystal graduated from West Point, he was commissioned as an infantry officer, and spent much of his career commanding special operations and airborne infantry units. During the Persian Gulf War, McChrystal served in a Joint Special Operations Task Force and later commanded the 75th Ranger Regiment. He completed year-long fellowships at Harvard’s John F. Kennedy School of Government in 1997 and in 2000 at the Council on Foreign Relations. In 2002, he was appointed chief of staff of military operations in Afghanistan. Two years later, McChrystal was selected to deliver nationally televised Pentagon briefings about military operations in Iraq. From 2003 to 2008, McChrystal commanded JSOC and was responsible for leading the nation’s deployed military counter-terrorism efforts around the globe. He assumed command of all International Forces in Afghanistan in June 2009. President Obama’s order for an additional 30,000 troops to Afghanistan was based on McChrystal’s assessment of the war there. McChrystal retired from the military in August 2010.

More profile about the speaker
Stanley McChrystal | Speaker | TED.com

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