TEDWomen 2016
Thordis Elva and Tom Stranger: Our story of rape and reconciliation
Tordis Elva (Thordis Elva), Tom Strejndžer (Tom Stranger): Naša priča o silovanju i pomirenju
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Godine 1996, Tordis Elva je imala tinejdžersku romansu sa Tomom Strejndžerom, učesnikom programa razmene đaka iz Australije. Nakon školskog plesa, Tom je silovao Tordis i potom su se razišli različitim putevima na nekoliko godina. U ovom izvanrednom govoru, Elva i Strejndžer nas vode kroz dugogodišnju hronologiju stida i tišine, i pozivaju nas da diskutujemo o sveprisutnom globalnom problemu seksualnog nasilja na nov, iskren način. Za pitanja i odgovore govornika, posetite: go.ted.com/thordisandtom.
Double-click the English transcript below to play the video.
00:12
[This talk contains graphic language
and descriptions of sexual violence
and descriptions of sexual violence
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[Ovaj govor sadrži slikovit jezik
i opise seksualnog nasilja.
i opise seksualnog nasilja.
Savetuje se diskrecija gledalaca.]
00:15
Viewer discretion is advised]
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00:16
Tom Stranger: In 1996,
when I was 18 years old,
when I was 18 years old,
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Tom Strendžer: Godine 1996,
kad mi je bilo 18 godina,
kad mi je bilo 18 godina,
00:19
I had the golden opportunity to go
on an international exchange program.
on an international exchange program.
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imao sam zlatnu priliku da učestvujem
u međunarodnom programu razmene.
u međunarodnom programu razmene.
00:24
Ironically I'm an Australian
who prefers proper icy cold weather,
who prefers proper icy cold weather,
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Ironija je da sam Australijanac
kome se sviđa pravo ledeno hladno vreme,
kome se sviđa pravo ledeno hladno vreme,
00:27
so I was both excited and tearful
when I got on a plane to Iceland,
when I got on a plane to Iceland,
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pa sam bio i uzbuđen i tužan
kad sam se ukrcao na avion za Island,
kad sam se ukrcao na avion za Island,
00:32
after just having farewelled
my parents and brothers goodbye.
my parents and brothers goodbye.
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nakon što sam se upravo oprostio
s roditeljima i braćom.
s roditeljima i braćom.
00:36
I was welcomed into the home
of a beautiful Icelandic family
of a beautiful Icelandic family
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Divna islandska porodica
me je primila u svoj dom,
me je primila u svoj dom,
00:39
who took me hiking,
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vodili su me na planinarenje
00:41
and helped me get a grasp
of the melodic Icelandic language.
of the melodic Icelandic language.
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i pomagali mi da shvatim
melodični islandski jezik.
melodični islandski jezik.
00:45
I struggled a bit with the initial
period of homesickness.
period of homesickness.
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Jedan period u početku
sam se malo mučio s melanholijom.
sam se malo mučio s melanholijom.
00:48
I snowboarded after school,
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Posle škole sam išao na snoubord
00:50
and I slept a lot.
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i mnogo sam spavao.
00:52
Two hours of chemistry class in a language
that you don't yet fully understand
that you don't yet fully understand
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Dvosatni čas hemije na jeziku
koji još uvek dobro ne razumete
koji još uvek dobro ne razumete
00:56
can be a pretty good sedative.
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može da bude prilično dobar sedativ.
00:58
(Laughter)
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(Smeh)
Nastavnik mi je predložio
da se okušam u školskoj predstavi,
da se okušam u školskoj predstavi,
01:00
My teacher recommended
I try out for the school play,
I try out for the school play,
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01:03
just to get me a bit more socially active.
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prosto da bi me malo više
društveno angažovao.
društveno angažovao.
01:06
It turns out I didn't end up
being part of the play,
being part of the play,
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Ispostavilo se da na kraju
nisam bio deo predstave,
nisam bio deo predstave,
01:08
but through it I met Thordis.
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ali sam tim povodom upoznao Tordis.
01:11
We shared a lovely teenage romance,
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Imali smo ljupku tinejdžersku romansu,
i sastajali smo se na užini
samo da bismo se držali za ruke
samo da bismo se držali za ruke
01:13
and we'd meet at lunchtimes
to just hold hands
to just hold hands
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01:16
and walk around old downtown Reykjavík.
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i šetali starim centrom Rejkjavika.
01:18
I met her welcoming family,
and she met my friends.
and she met my friends.
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Upoznao sam njenu gostoprimljivu porodicu,
a ona je upoznala moje prijatelje.
a ona je upoznala moje prijatelje.
01:22
We'd been in a budding relationship
for a bit over a month
for a bit over a month
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Bili smo u drugarskoj vezi
nešto više od meseca
nešto više od meseca
01:25
when our school's Christmas Ball was held.
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kada je održan božićni bal u našoj školi.
01:30
Thordis Elva: I was 16
and in love for the first time.
and in love for the first time.
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Tordis Elva: Bilo mi je 16 godina
i prvi put sam bila zaljubljena.
i prvi put sam bila zaljubljena.
01:33
Going together to the Christmas dance
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Zajednički odlazak na božićni ples
01:35
was a public confirmation
of our relationship,
of our relationship,
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je bila javna potvrda naše veze
01:38
and I felt like the luckiest
girl in the world.
girl in the world.
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i ja sam se osećala
kao najsrećnija devojka na svetu.
kao najsrećnija devojka na svetu.
01:41
No longer a child, but a young woman.
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Nisam više bila dete, već mlada žena.
01:44
High on my newfound maturity,
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Opijena novootkrivenom zrelošću,
01:46
I felt it was only natural to try drinking
rum for the first time that night, too.
rum for the first time that night, too.
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osećala sam da je jedino prirodno
da probam rum prvi put te noći, takođe.
da probam rum prvi put te noći, takođe.
01:51
That was a bad idea.
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To je bila loša ideja.
01:53
I became very ill,
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Veoma mi je pozlilo,
01:55
drifting in and out of consciousness
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padala sam u nesvest i dolazila sebi
01:56
in between spasms of convulsive vomiting.
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između grčevitih napada povraćanja.
02:00
The security guards wanted
to call me an ambulance,
to call me an ambulance,
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Obezbeđenje je htelo
da pozove hitnu za mene,
da pozove hitnu za mene,
02:03
but Tom acted as my knight
in shining armor,
in shining armor,
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ali je Tom nastupio
kao moj vitez u bleštavom oklopu
kao moj vitez u bleštavom oklopu
02:06
and told them he'd take me home.
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i rekao im je da će me on povesti kući.
02:08
It was like a fairy tale,
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Bilo je poput bajke,
02:10
his strong arms around me,
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njegove snažne ruke oko mene,
02:12
laying me in the safety of my bed.
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spuštao me je u bezbednost mog kreveta.
02:15
But the gratitude that I felt
towards him soon turned to horror
towards him soon turned to horror
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Ali je zahvalnost koju sam osećala
prema njemu uskoro prešla u užas
prema njemu uskoro prešla u užas
02:20
as he proceeded to take off my clothes
and get on top of me.
and get on top of me.
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dok mi je skidao odeću
i spuštao se preko mene.
i spuštao se preko mene.
02:25
My head had cleared up,
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Glava mi se razbistrila,
02:26
but my body was still
too weak to fight back,
too weak to fight back,
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ali mi je telo i dalje bilo
suviše slabo da se odupre,
suviše slabo da se odupre,
02:29
and the pain was blinding.
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a bol je bio zaslepljujući.
02:32
I thought I'd be severed in two.
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Mislila sam da ću se rascepiti na pola.
02:35
In order to stay sane,
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Kako bih ostala pri sebi,
02:37
I silently counted the seconds
on my alarm clock.
on my alarm clock.
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tiho sam brojala sekunde na mom budilniku.
02:41
And ever since that night,
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I od te noći,
02:43
I've known that there are 7,200
seconds in two hours.
seconds in two hours.
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znam da dva sata imaju 7.200 sekundi.
02:51
Despite limping for days
and crying for weeks,
and crying for weeks,
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Uprkos tome što sam ćopala
i plakala nedeljama,
i plakala nedeljama,
02:54
this incident didn't fit my ideas
about rape like I'd seen on TV.
about rape like I'd seen on TV.
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ovaj incident se nije uklapao s idejama
silovanja koje sam videla na TV-u.
silovanja koje sam videla na TV-u.
02:59
Tom wasn't an armed lunatic;
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Tom nije bio naoružani ludak;
03:01
he was my boyfriend.
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bio mi je momak.
03:03
And it didn't happen in a seedy alleyway,
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I to se nije desilo u prljavoj uličici,
03:05
it happened in my own bed.
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desilo se u mom krevetu.
03:08
By the time I could identify
what had happened to me as rape,
what had happened to me as rape,
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Do trenutka kad sam mogla da prepoznam
kao silovanje ono što mi se desilo,
kao silovanje ono što mi se desilo,
03:12
he had completed his exchange program
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njegov program razmene je okončan
03:14
and left for Australia.
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i otišao je u Australiju.
03:16
So I told myself it was pointless
to address what had happened.
to address what had happened.
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Pa sam rekla sebi da je besmisleno
baviti se onim što se desilo.
baviti se onim što se desilo.
03:20
And besides,
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A osim toga,
03:21
it had to have been my fault, somehow.
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nekako je to moralo da bude moja krivica.
03:24
I was raised in a world
where girls are taught
where girls are taught
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Vaspitana sam u svetu u kom devojke uče
03:27
that they get raped for a reason.
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da ih s razlogom siluju.
03:29
Their skirt was too short,
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Njihove suknje su bile suviše kratke,
03:32
their smile was too wide,
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njihov osmeh je bio suviše širok,
03:34
their breath smelled of alcohol.
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dah im se osećao na alkohol.
03:38
And I was guilty of all of those things,
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A ja sam bila kriva za sve to,
03:40
so the shame had to be mine.
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te je krivica morala da bude moja.
Trebale su mi godine da shvatim
03:43
It took me years to realize
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03:45
that only one thing could have stopped me
from being raped that night,
from being raped that night,
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da je samo jedna stvar mogla sprečiti
da budem silovana te noći,
da budem silovana te noći,
03:49
and it wasn't my skirt,
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a to nije bila moja suknja,
03:51
it wasn't my smile,
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nije bio moj osmeh,
03:53
it wasn't my childish trust.
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nije bilo moje detinjasto poverenje.
03:55
The only thing that could've stopped me
from being raped that night
from being raped that night
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Jedino što je moglo da spreči
da budem silovana te noći
da budem silovana te noći
03:59
is the man who raped me --
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je čovek koji me je silovao -
04:01
had he stopped himself.
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da je on zaustavio samog sebe.
04:04
TS: I have vague memories of the next day:
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TS: Sećanja o danu posle su mi bleda:
04:07
the after effects of drinking,
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posledice pijanstva,
04:10
a certain hollowness
that I tried to stifle.
that I tried to stifle.
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određena praznina
koju sam pokušao da ugušim.
koju sam pokušao da ugušim.
04:13
Nothing more.
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Ništa više.
04:15
But I didn't show up at Thordis's door.
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Međutim, nisam se pojavio
na Tordisinim vratima.
na Tordisinim vratima.
04:19
It is important to now state
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Važno je da naglasim
04:21
that I didn't see my deed for what it was.
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da svoje delo nisam shvatao
onim što jeste bilo.
onim što jeste bilo.
04:24
The word "rape" didn't echo
around my mind as it should've,
around my mind as it should've,
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Reč "silovanje" nije odjekivala
u mom umu kao što je trebalo,
u mom umu kao što je trebalo,
04:28
and I wasn't crucifying myself
with memories of the night before.
with memories of the night before.
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i nisu me mučila sećanja na prethodnu noć.
04:33
It wasn't so much a conscious refusal,
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Nije to bilo svesno odbijanje,
04:35
it was more like any acknowledgment
of reality was forbidden.
of reality was forbidden.
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više se činilo kao da je svako priznanje
stvarnosti zabranjeno.
stvarnosti zabranjeno.
04:40
My definition of my actions completely
refuted any recognition
refuted any recognition
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Moja definicija mojih postupaka
je odbijala bilo kakvo priznanje
je odbijala bilo kakvo priznanje
04:44
of the immense trauma I caused Thordis.
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ogromne traume koju sam uzrokovao Tordis.
04:48
To be honest,
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Iskreno,
04:49
I repudiated the entire act
in the days afterwards
in the days afterwards
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odbaciovao sam postupak u potpunosti
narednih dana
narednih dana
04:54
and when I was committing it.
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kao i u trenutku samog čina.
04:57
I disavowed the truth by convincing
myself it was sex and not rape.
myself it was sex and not rape.
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Poricao sam istinu, ubeđujući sebe
da je to bio seks, a ne silovanje.
da je to bio seks, a ne silovanje.
05:02
And this is a lie I've felt
spine-bending guilt for.
spine-bending guilt for.
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A to je laž zbog koje
me je izjedala krivica.
me je izjedala krivica.
05:08
I broke up with Thordis
a couple of days later,
a couple of days later,
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Raskinuo sam sa Tordis
nekoliko dana kasnije
nekoliko dana kasnije
05:10
and then saw her a number of times
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i potom sam je video nekoliko puta
05:12
during the remainder
of my year in Iceland,
of my year in Iceland,
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tokom ostatka moje godine u Islandu,
05:14
feeling a sharp stab
of heavyheartedness each time.
of heavyheartedness each time.
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svaki put osećajući
oštro probadanje utučenosti.
oštro probadanje utučenosti.
05:18
Deep down, I knew I'd done
something immeasurably wrong.
something immeasurably wrong.
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Duboko u sebi sam znao
da sam uradio nešto bezmerno pogrešno.
da sam uradio nešto bezmerno pogrešno.
05:23
But without planning it,
I sunk the memories deep,
I sunk the memories deep,
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Ali ne planirajući tako,
duboko sam potisnuo sećanja,
duboko sam potisnuo sećanja,
05:26
and then I tied a rock to them.
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vezujući kamen za njih.
05:30
What followed is a nine-year period
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Usledio je devetogodišnji period,
05:31
that can best be titled
as "Denial and Running."
as "Denial and Running."
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koji bih najbolje naslovio
kao: "Poricanje i bežanje".
kao: "Poricanje i bežanje".
05:36
When I got a chance to identify
the real torment that I caused,
the real torment that I caused,
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Kad sam imao priliku da spoznam
istinsku agoniju koju sam uzrokovao,
istinsku agoniju koju sam uzrokovao,
05:40
I didn't stand still long enough to do so.
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nisam dovoljno dugo mirovao da to uradim.
05:44
Whether it be via distraction,
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Bilo da se radilo o odvlačenju pažnje,
05:46
substance use,
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konzumiranju droga,
05:47
thrill-seeking
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traženju uzbuđenja
05:49
or the scrupulous policing
of my inner speak,
of my inner speak,
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ili budnom nadgledanju
mog unutrašnjeg govora,
mog unutrašnjeg govora,
05:52
I refused to be static and silent.
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odbijao sam da budem nepokretan i tih.
05:56
And with this noise,
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A uz tu buku,
05:58
I also drew heavily
upon other parts of my life
upon other parts of my life
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takođe sam iskorišćavao
druge aspekte svog života
druge aspekte svog života
06:01
to construct a picture of who I was.
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kako bih izgradio sliku o sebi.
06:04
I was a surfer,
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Bio sam surfer,
06:05
a social science student,
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student društvenih nauka,
06:07
a friend to good people,
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prijatelj dobrih ljudi,
06:09
a loved brother and son,
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voljeni brat i sin,
06:12
an outdoor recreation guide,
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vodič za rekreacije u prirodi
06:13
and eventually, a youth worker.
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i kasnije omladinski radnik.
06:16
I gripped tight to the simple notion
that I wasn't a bad person.
that I wasn't a bad person.
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Čvrsto sam se držao za prostu misao
da nisam loša osoba.
da nisam loša osoba.
06:21
I didn't think I had this in my bones.
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Nisam smatrao da mi je to u krvi.
06:24
I thought I was made up of something else.
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Smatrao sam da sam drugačijeg kova.
06:26
In my nurtured upbringing,
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Tokom mog brižnog odrastanja,
06:28
my loving extended family and role models,
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moja šira porodica puna ljubavi i uzori,
meni bliski ljudi su bili topli i ispravni
06:31
people close to me were warm and genuine
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06:33
in their respect shown towards women.
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u iskazivanju poštovanja prema ženama.
06:36
It took me a long time to stare down
this dark corner of myself,
this dark corner of myself,
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Dugo mi je trebalo da se zagledam
u taj mračni ugao sebe
u taj mračni ugao sebe
06:41
and to ask it questions.
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i da mu postavim pitanja.
06:46
TE: Nine years after the Christmas dance,
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TE: Devet godina nakon božićnog plesa,
06:48
I was 25 years old,
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bilo mi je 25 godina
06:49
and headed straight
for a nervous breakdown.
for a nervous breakdown.
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i srljala sam pravo u nervni slom.
06:53
My self-worth was buried
under a soul-crushing load of silence
under a soul-crushing load of silence
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Moje samopoštovanje je sahranjeno
pod teretom tišine koja je mrvila dušu,
pod teretom tišine koja je mrvila dušu,
06:56
that isolated me from everyone
that I cared about,
that I cared about,
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koja me je odvojila od svih
koji su mi značili,
koji su mi značili,
07:00
and I was consumed
with misplaced hatred and anger
with misplaced hatred and anger
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i ophrvala su me osećanja
pogrešno usmerene mržnje i besa
pogrešno usmerene mržnje i besa
07:02
that I took out on myself.
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koje sam iskalila na sebi.
07:05
One day, I stormed out
of the door in tears
of the door in tears
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Jednog dana sam u suzama
izjurila kroz vrata
izjurila kroz vrata
07:08
after a fight with a loved one,
140
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nakon svađe sa voljenim
07:10
and I wandered into a café,
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i dovukla sam se do kafića,
07:11
where I asked the waitress for a pen.
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gde sam od konobarice zatražila olovku.
07:14
I always had a notebook with me,
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Uvek sam sa sobom nosila beležnicu,
07:16
claiming that it was to jot down ideas
in moments of inspiration,
in moments of inspiration,
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tvrdeći da mi služi za zapisivanje ideja
u momentima inspiracije,
u momentima inspiracije,
07:20
but the truth was that I needed
to be constantly fidgeting,
to be constantly fidgeting,
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ali istina je da mi je bilo potrebno
da se uvek vrpoljim
da se uvek vrpoljim
07:24
because in moments of stillness,
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jer bih se u trenucima mirovanja
07:26
I found myself counting seconds again.
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zatekla kako ponovo brojim sekunde.
07:30
But that day, I watched in wonder
as the words streamed out of my pen,
as the words streamed out of my pen,
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Tog dana, pak, gledala sam u čudu
kako se reči slivaju niz moju olovku,
kako se reči slivaju niz moju olovku,
07:35
forming the most pivotal letter
I've ever written,
I've ever written,
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oblikujući najkrucijalnije pismo
koje sam ikad napisala,
koje sam ikad napisala,
07:38
addressed to Tom.
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adresirano na Toma.
07:40
Along with an account of the violence
that he subjected me to,
that he subjected me to,
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Uz izveštaj o nasilju kom me je podvrgao,
07:43
the words, "I want to find forgiveness"
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reči: "Želim da nađem oproštaj"
07:47
stared back at me,
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su zurile u mene,
07:48
surprising nobody more than myself.
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iznenađujući mene samu najviše.
07:51
But deep down I realized that this
was my way out of my suffering,
was my way out of my suffering,
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No, duboko u sebi sam shvatila
da je ovo moj izlaz iz patnje
da je ovo moj izlaz iz patnje
07:56
because regardless of whether or not
he deserved my forgiveness,
he deserved my forgiveness,
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jer bez obzira na to
da li je on zasluživao ili ne moj oprost,
da li je on zasluživao ili ne moj oprost,
08:00
I deserved peace.
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ja sam zasluživala mir.
08:03
My era of shame was over.
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Moje doba stida je završeno.
08:08
Before sending the letter,
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Pre nego što sam poslala pismo,
08:09
I prepared myself for all kinds
of negative responses,
of negative responses,
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2747
pripremila sam se za sve vidove
negativnog odgovora
negativnog odgovora
08:12
or what I found likeliest:
no response whatsoever.
no response whatsoever.
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ili onoga što mi je bilo najizglednije:
odsustva bilo kakvog odgovora.
odsustva bilo kakvog odgovora.
08:17
The only outcome
that I didn't prepare myself for
that I didn't prepare myself for
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Jedini ishod na koji nisam bila spremna
08:19
was the one that I then got --
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je onaj koji sam dobila -
08:22
a typed confession from Tom,
full of disarming regret.
full of disarming regret.
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Tomovo pismeno priznanje,
ispunjeno razoružavajućim kajanjem.
ispunjeno razoružavajućim kajanjem.
08:27
As it turns out, he, too,
had been imprisoned by silence.
had been imprisoned by silence.
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Ispostavilo se da je i on sam
bio zraobljenik tišine.
bio zraobljenik tišine.
08:32
And this marked the start
of an eight-year-long correspondence
of an eight-year-long correspondence
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A ovo je obeležilo početak
osmogodišnje prepiske
osmogodišnje prepiske
08:36
that God knows was never easy,
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koja, sam gospod zna,
nikad nije bila laka,
nikad nije bila laka,
08:38
but always honest.
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ali je uvek bila iskrena.
08:41
I relieved myself of the burdens
that I'd wrongfully shouldered,
that I'd wrongfully shouldered,
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Oslobodila sam se tereta
koji sam nepravedno sebi natovarila,
koji sam nepravedno sebi natovarila,
08:45
and he, in turn, wholeheartedly
owned up to what he'd done.
owned up to what he'd done.
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a on je za uzvrat,
svesrdno ovladao onim što je uradio.
svesrdno ovladao onim što je uradio.
08:49
Our written exchanges became a platform
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Naša pismena razmena je postala platforma
08:51
to dissect the consequences of that night,
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2717
za seciranje posledica te noći,
08:54
and they were everything
from gut-wrenching
from gut-wrenching
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2195
a one su sezale od srceparajućih
08:56
to healing beyond words.
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do neizrecivo isceliteljskih.
08:59
And yet, it didn't bring about
closure for me.
closure for me.
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3936
Pa ipak, nije mi donela razrešenje.
09:04
Perhaps because the email format
didn't feel personal enough,
didn't feel personal enough,
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Možda stoga što format imejla
nije bio dovoljno ličan,
nije bio dovoljno ličan,
09:07
perhaps because it's easy to be brave
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možda zato što je lako biti hrabar
09:09
when you're hiding behind a computer
screen on the other side of the planet.
screen on the other side of the planet.
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4108
kada se skrivate iza kompjuterskog ekrana
na drugoj strani planete.
na drugoj strani planete.
09:13
But we'd begun a dialogue
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Međutim, započeli smo dijalog
09:15
that I felt was necessary
to explore to its fullest.
to explore to its fullest.
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za koji sam smatrala da je nužno
da se dokraja istraži.
da se dokraja istraži.
09:20
So, after eight years of writing,
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Pa, nakon osam godina prepiske,
09:22
and nearly 16 years after that dire night,
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i skoro 16 godina od te kobne noći,
09:25
I mustered the courage
to propose a wild idea:
to propose a wild idea:
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sakupila sam hrabrost
da predložim ludu zamisao:
da predložim ludu zamisao:
09:29
that we'd meet up in person
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1660
da se sretnemo uživo
09:31
and face our past once and for all.
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i suočimo sa prošlošću jednom za svagda.
09:37
TS: Iceland and Australia
are geographically like this.
are geographically like this.
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TS: Island i Australija
su geografski ovako udaljeni.
su geografski ovako udaljeni.
09:41
In the middle of the two is South Africa.
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2247
Tačno između njih je Južna Afrika.
09:44
We decided upon the city of Cape Town,
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2905
Odlučili smo se za grad Kejptaun
09:46
and there we met for one week.
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2044
i tu smo proveli nedelju dana.
09:50
The city itself proved to be
a stunningly powerful environment
a stunningly powerful environment
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3470
Sam grad se ispostavio
kao zapanjujuće moćna sredina
kao zapanjujuće moćna sredina
09:53
to focus on reconciliation
and forgiveness.
and forgiveness.
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2884
za usredsređenje na pomirenje i oproštaj.
09:57
Nowhere else has healing
and rapprochement been tested
and rapprochement been tested
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585847
2639
Nigde isceljenje i zbližavanje
nisu tako testirani
nisu tako testirani
10:00
like it has in South Africa.
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1634
kao u Južnoj Africi.
10:03
As a nation, South Africa sought
to sit within the truth of its past,
to sit within the truth of its past,
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3867
Kao nacija, Južna Afrika je tražila
mesto između istine o svojoj prošlosti
mesto između istine o svojoj prošlosti
10:06
and to listen to the details
of its history.
of its history.
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594927
2403
i detaljnog saslušanja o svojoj istoriji.
10:10
Knowing this only magnified the effect
that Cape Town had on us.
that Cape Town had on us.
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3749
Znajući ovo, dejstvo koje je Kejptaun
imao na nas je bilo još jače.
imao na nas je bilo još jače.
10:16
Over the course of this week,
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1462
Tokom ove sedmice,
10:17
we literally spoke
our life stories to each other,
our life stories to each other,
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605492
2890
bukvalno smo jedno drugom
ispričali naše životne priče,
ispričali naše životne priče,
10:20
from start to finish.
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1590
od početka do kraja.
10:23
And this was about analyzing
our own history.
our own history.
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2500
A radilo se o analiziranju naših istorija.
10:27
We followed a strict policy
of being honest,
of being honest,
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2833
Pratili smo strogi zakon iskrenosti,
10:30
and this also came
with a certain exposure,
with a certain exposure,
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2925
a to je sa sobom donelo
izvesnu izloženost,
izvesnu izloženost,
10:33
an open-chested vulnerability.
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621374
1906
ranjivost otvorene rane.
10:36
There were gutting confessions,
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624312
2127
Bilo je mučnih priznanja
10:38
and moments where we just
absolutely couldn't fathom
absolutely couldn't fathom
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2824
i trenutaka kad prosto
uopšte nismo mogli da dokučimo
uopšte nismo mogli da dokučimo
10:41
the other person's experience.
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1808
iskustvo druge osobe.
10:44
The seismic effects of sexual violence
were spoken aloud and felt,
were spoken aloud and felt,
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632258
4894
Potresna dejstva seksualnog nasilja
su glasno izgovarana i osećana,
su glasno izgovarana i osećana,
10:49
face to face.
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1330
licem u lice.
10:51
At other times, though,
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639979
1503
Drugih puta, pak,
10:53
we found a soaring clarity,
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2634
otkrivali bismo okrepljujuću jasnoću,
10:57
and even some totally unexpected
but liberating laughter.
but liberating laughter.
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4400
čak i potpuno neočekivan,
ali oslobađajući smeh.
ali oslobađajući smeh.
11:03
When it came down to it,
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1530
Kada se sve svede,
11:04
we did out best to listen
to each other intently.
to each other intently.
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3628
dali smo sve od sebe
da pažljivo saslušamo jedno drugo.
da pažljivo saslušamo jedno drugo.
11:09
And our individual realities
were aired with an unfiltered purity
were aired with an unfiltered purity
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5841
I naše individualne stvarnosti
su oslobođene nefilterisanom čistoćom
su oslobođene nefilterisanom čistoćom
11:15
that couldn't do any less
than lighten the soul.
than lighten the soul.
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2376
koja je ništa manje
nego razvedrila naše duše.
nego razvedrila naše duše.
11:20
TE: Wanting to take revenge
is a very human emotion --
is a very human emotion --
216
668508
4045
TE: Želja za osvetom
je veoma ljudsko osećanje -
je veoma ljudsko osećanje -
11:24
instinctual, even.
217
672577
1638
instinktivno, čak.
11:26
And all I wanted to do for years
218
674829
2011
I sve što sam godinama želela
11:28
was to hurt Tom back as deeply
as he had hurt me.
as he had hurt me.
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676864
3969
je da povredim Toma
podjednako snažno koliko je on mene.
podjednako snažno koliko je on mene.
11:33
But had I not found a way
out of the hatred and anger,
out of the hatred and anger,
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681658
3053
Ali da nisam otkrila izlaz
iz mržnje i besa,
iz mržnje i besa,
11:36
I'm not sure I'd be standing here today.
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2165
nisam sigurna da bih danas stajala ovde.
11:40
That isn't to say that I didn't have
my doubts along the way.
my doubts along the way.
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688058
3927
To ne znači da nisam imala
sumnje sve vreme.
sumnje sve vreme.
11:44
When the plane bounced
on that landing strip in Cape Town,
on that landing strip in Cape Town,
223
692689
3661
Kada je avion doskočio
na pistu u Kejptaunu,
na pistu u Kejptaunu,
11:48
I remember thinking,
224
696374
1603
sećam se da sam pomislila:
11:50
"Why did I not just get myself
a therapist and a bottle of vodka
a therapist and a bottle of vodka
225
698001
4206
"Zašto prosto nisam nabavila
terapeuta i flašu votke,
terapeuta i flašu votke,
11:54
like a normal person would do?"
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702231
2216
kao svi normalni ljudi?"
11:56
(Laughter)
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704471
2920
(Smeh)
11:59
At times, our search
for understanding in Cape Town
for understanding in Cape Town
228
707415
3205
Povremeno se naše traganje
za razumevanjem u Kejptaunu
za razumevanjem u Kejptaunu
12:02
felt like an impossible quest,
229
710644
2167
činilo poput nemogućeg pohoda,
12:04
and all I wanted to do was to give up
230
712835
2099
i sve što sam želela je da odustanem
12:06
and go home to my loving
husband, Vidir,
husband, Vidir,
231
714958
2216
i da se vratim kući
svom dragom mužu Vidiru
svom dragom mužu Vidiru
12:09
and our son.
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1211
i našem sinu.
12:11
But despite our difficulties,
233
719994
2363
No, uprkos našim poteškoćama,
12:14
this journey did result
in a victorious feeling
in a victorious feeling
234
722381
4628
ovo putovanje je rezultiralo
pobedonosnim osećanjem
pobedonosnim osećanjem
12:19
that light had triumphed over darkness,
235
727033
3133
da je svetlo trijumfovalo nad tamom,
12:22
that something constructive
could be built out of the ruins.
could be built out of the ruins.
236
730812
4312
da je nešto konstruktivno
moglo da se izgradi na ruševinama.
moglo da se izgradi na ruševinama.
12:28
I read somewhere
237
736572
1325
Negde sam pročitala
12:29
that you should try and be the person
that you needed when you were younger.
that you needed when you were younger.
238
737921
3861
da bi trebalo pokušati biti osoba
koja vam je bila potrebna u mladosti.
koja vam je bila potrebna u mladosti.
12:33
And back when I was a teenager,
239
741806
1584
A kad sam bila tinejdžerka,
12:35
I would have needed to know
that the shame wasn't mine,
that the shame wasn't mine,
240
743414
3848
bilo mi je potrebno saznanje
da sramota nije bila moja,
da sramota nije bila moja,
12:39
that there's hope after rape,
241
747286
2514
da ima nade nakon silovanja,
12:41
that you can even find happiness,
242
749824
1595
da čak možete naći i sreću,
12:43
like I share with my husband today.
243
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1890
poput one koju danas delim sa suprugom.
12:45
Which is why I started writing feverishly
upon my return from Cape Town,
upon my return from Cape Town,
244
753861
4355
Zbog toga sam nakon povratka iz Kejptauna
počela grozničavo da pišem
počela grozničavo da pišem
12:50
resulting in a book co-authored by Tom,
245
758240
2724
ono što će da bude knjiga
u koautorstvu s Tomom,
u koautorstvu s Tomom,
12:52
that we hope can be of use
to people from both ends
to people from both ends
246
760988
3185
za koju se nadamo da će da koristi
ljudima s oba kraja
ljudima s oba kraja
12:56
of the perpetrator-survivor scale.
247
764197
2304
skale žrtva-počinilac.
12:59
If nothing else,
248
767180
1454
Ako ništa drugo,
13:00
it's a story that we would've needed
to hear when we were younger.
to hear when we were younger.
249
768658
4135
to je priča koju je bilo potrebno
da čujemo kad smo bili mlađi.
da čujemo kad smo bili mlađi.
13:06
Given the nature of our story,
250
774726
1821
Zbog prirode naše priče,
13:08
I know the words
that inevitably accompany it --
that inevitably accompany it --
251
776571
2776
znam da su reči
koje neizbežno idu uz nju -
koje neizbežno idu uz nju -
13:11
victim, rapist --
252
779933
2556
žrtva, silovatelj -
13:14
and labels are a way to organize concepts,
253
782513
2255
i etikete su način
organizovanja koncepata,
organizovanja koncepata,
13:16
but they can also be dehumanizing
in their connotations.
in their connotations.
254
784792
4382
ali takođe mogu
svojim konotacijama da onečovečuju.
svojim konotacijama da onečovečuju.
13:21
Once someone's been deemed a victim,
255
789838
2100
Čim nekoga odrede kao žrtvu,
13:23
it's that much easier to file them away
as someone damaged,
as someone damaged,
256
791962
5233
utoliko je lakše otpisati ih
kao nekoga oštećenog,
kao nekoga oštećenog,
13:29
dishonored,
257
797219
1506
obeščašćenog,
13:30
less than.
258
798749
1275
manje vrednog.
13:32
And likewise, once someone
has been branded a rapist,
has been branded a rapist,
259
800643
2720
I slično, čim nekoga
označe kao silovatelja,
označe kao silovatelja,
13:35
it's that much easier
to call him a monster --
to call him a monster --
260
803387
2546
utoliko je lakše nazvati ga čudovištem -
13:38
inhuman.
261
806576
1299
nečovekom.
13:40
But how will we understand
what it is in human societies
what it is in human societies
262
808614
3031
Ali kako ćemo da razumemo
šta to u ljudskim društvima
šta to u ljudskim društvima
13:43
that produces violence
263
811669
1581
uzrokuje nasilje,
13:45
if we refuse to recognize
the humanity of those who commit it?
the humanity of those who commit it?
264
813274
4479
ako odbijamo da priznamo
ljudskost onima koji ga počine?
ljudskost onima koji ga počine?
13:50
And how --
265
818534
1164
I kako -
13:51
(Applause)
266
819722
2179
(Aplauz)
13:53
And how can we empower survivors
if we're making them feel less than?
if we're making them feel less than?
267
821925
5368
I kako ćemo da osnažimo preživele,
ako ih teramo da se osećaju manje vrednim?
ako ih teramo da se osećaju manje vrednim?
14:00
How can we discuss solutions
to one of the biggest threats
to one of the biggest threats
268
828072
3427
Kako ćemo da raspravljamo o rešenjima
za jednu od najvećih pretnji
za jednu od najvećih pretnji
14:03
to the lives of women and children
around the world,
around the world,
269
831523
3274
po živote žena i dece širom sveta,
14:06
if the very words we use
are part of the problem?
are part of the problem?
270
834821
3823
ako su same reči
koje koristimo deo problema?
koje koristimo deo problema?
14:13
TS: From what I've now learnt,
271
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2492
TS: Sada znam
14:16
my actions that night in 1996
were a self-centered taking.
were a self-centered taking.
272
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4573
da je moje ponašanje u noći 1996,
bilo sebično uzimanje.
bilo sebično uzimanje.
14:22
I felt deserving of Thordis's body.
273
850028
2123
Osećao sam da zaslužujem Tordisino telo.
14:25
I've had primarily positive
social influences
social influences
274
853743
2865
Imao sam pre svega pozitivne
društvene uticaje
društvene uticaje
14:28
and examples of equitable
behavior around me.
behavior around me.
275
856632
2541
i primere egalitarnog ponašanja oko mene.
14:31
But on that occasion,
276
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1197
Ali tom prilikom,
14:33
I chose to draw upon the negative ones.
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odlučio sam da se vodim negativnim.
14:35
The ones that see women
as having less intrinsic worth,
as having less intrinsic worth,
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Onim koji gledaju na žene
kao da imaju po prirodi manju vrednost,
kao da imaju po prirodi manju vrednost,
14:39
and of men having some unspoken
and symbolic claim to their bodies.
and symbolic claim to their bodies.
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a da muškarci imaju neko prećutno
i simbolično pravo na njihova tela.
i simbolično pravo na njihova tela.
14:45
These influences I speak of
are external to me, though.
are external to me, though.
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Ovi uticaji o kojima govorim
su ipak za mene spoljni.
su ipak za mene spoljni.
14:49
And it was only me in that room
making choices,
making choices,
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I jedino sam ja u toj prostoriji
donosio odluke,
donosio odluke,
14:52
nobody else.
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niko drugi.
14:54
When you own something
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Kada ovladate nečim
14:56
and really square up to your culpability,
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i zaista izađete na čistac
sa svojom krivicom,
sa svojom krivicom,
15:00
I do think a surprising thing can happen.
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verujem da iznenađujuće stvari
mogu da se dese.
mogu da se dese.
15:03
It's what I call a paradox of ownership.
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To nazivam paradoksom ovladavanja.
15:06
I thought I'd buckle
under the weight of responsibility.
under the weight of responsibility.
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Mislio sam da ću da se pognem
pod teretom odgovornosti.
pod teretom odgovornosti.
15:10
I thought my certificate
of humanity would be burnt.
of humanity would be burnt.
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Mislio sam da će moja diploma
čovečnosti da sagori.
čovečnosti da sagori.
15:14
Instead, I was offered
to really own what I did,
to really own what I did,
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Umesto toga mi je ponuđeno
da zaista ovladam svojim delom
da zaista ovladam svojim delom
15:19
and found that it didn't possess
the entirety of who I am.
the entirety of who I am.
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i otkrio sam da ono ne gospodari
mojom celokupnom ličnošću.
mojom celokupnom ličnošću.
15:23
Put simply,
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Prosto rečeno,
15:24
something you've done doesn't have
to constitute the sum of who you are.
to constitute the sum of who you are.
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nešto što ste uradili ne mora
da bude zbir svega što jeste.
da bude zbir svega što jeste.
15:30
The noise in my head abated.
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Buka u mojoj glavi se stišala.
15:32
The indulgent self-pity
was starved of oxygen,
was starved of oxygen,
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Prepuštanje samosažaljenju
je lišeno kiseonika
je lišeno kiseonika
15:37
and it was replaced
with the clean air of acceptance --
with the clean air of acceptance --
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i zamenio ga je svež vazduh prihvatanja -
15:42
an acceptance that I did hurt
this wonderful person standing next to me;
this wonderful person standing next to me;
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prihvatanja da jesam povredio
ovo divno biće koje stoji pored mene;
ovo divno biće koje stoji pored mene;
15:46
an acceptance that I am part of a large
and shockingly everyday grouping of men
and shockingly everyday grouping of men
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prihvatanje da sam deo velikog i šokantno
svakodnevnog gomilanja muškaraca
svakodnevnog gomilanja muškaraca
15:52
who have been sexually violent
toward their partners.
toward their partners.
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koji su seksualno nasilni
prema svojim partnerima.
prema svojim partnerima.
15:56
Don't underestimate the power of words.
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Ne potcenjujte snagu reči.
16:00
Saying to Thordis that I raped her
changed my accord with myself,
changed my accord with myself,
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Rekavši Tordis da sam je silovao,
promenio se moj odnos prema sebi,
promenio se moj odnos prema sebi,
16:05
as well as with her.
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kao i prema njoj.
16:07
But most importantly,
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Ali što je najvažnije
16:09
the blame transferred from Thordis to me.
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krivica je prešla sa Tordis na mene.
16:13
Far too often,
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Suviše često,
16:14
the responsibility is attributed
to female survivors of sexual violence,
to female survivors of sexual violence,
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4584
odgovornos se pripisuje ženama
koje su preživele seksualno nasilje,
koje su preživele seksualno nasilje,
16:19
and not to the males who enact it.
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a ne muškarcima koji su ga izvršili.
16:22
Far too often,
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Suviše često
16:23
the denial and running leaves all parties
at a great distance from the truth.
at a great distance from the truth.
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5082
poricanje i bežanje ostavlja sve strane
na velikoj udaljenosti od istine.
na velikoj udaljenosti od istine.
16:30
There's definitely a public
conversation happening now,
conversation happening now,
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2780
Definitivno je u toku javna rasprava,
16:34
and like a lot of people,
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i kao i mnoge ljude,
16:36
we're heartened
that there's less retreating
that there's less retreating
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2590
ohrabruje nas da je sve manje povlačenja
16:39
from this difficult
but important discussion.
but important discussion.
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2720
od ove teške, ali važne rasprave.
16:43
I feel a real responsibility
to add our voices to it.
to add our voices to it.
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3638
Osećam istinsku odgovornost
da joj doprinesem našim glasovima.
da joj doprinesem našim glasovima.
16:50
TE: What we did is not a formula
that we're prescribing for others.
that we're prescribing for others.
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4659
TE: Naš postupak nije recept
koji prepisujemo drugima.
koji prepisujemo drugima.
16:55
Nobody has the right to tell anyone else
how to handle their deepest pain
how to handle their deepest pain
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Niko nema prava da kaže nekom drugom
kako da se bori sa najvećim bolom
kako da se bori sa najvećim bolom
17:00
or their greatest error.
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1745
ili najvećom greškom.
17:03
Breaking your silence is never easy,
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2351
Prekinuti ćutanje nikad nije lako,
17:05
and depending on where
you are in the world,
you are in the world,
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2214
a u zavisnosti od toga
gde se nalazite u svetu,
gde se nalazite u svetu,
17:07
it can even be deadly
to speak out about rape.
to speak out about rape.
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3212
može čak i da bude smrtonosno
govoriti o silovanju.
govoriti o silovanju.
17:12
I realize that even the most
traumatic event of my life
traumatic event of my life
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Shvatam da je čak i najtraumatičniji
događaj u mom životu
događaj u mom životu
17:16
is still a testament to my privilege,
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2759
i dalje svedočanstvo moje privilegovanosti
17:18
because I can talk about it
without getting ostracized,
without getting ostracized,
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jer mogu da govorim o tome,
a da ne budem prognana
a da ne budem prognana
17:22
or even killed.
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ili čak ubijena.
17:24
But with that privilege of having a voice
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Međutim, s privilegijom posedovanja glasa,
17:27
comes the responsibility of using it.
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dolazi odgovornost njegovog korišćenja.
17:30
That's the least I owe
my fellow survivors who can't.
my fellow survivors who can't.
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4530
To je najmanje što dugujem
mojim kolegama preživelim koji ne mogu.
mojim kolegama preživelim koji ne mogu.
17:36
The story we've just relayed is unique,
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3066
Priča koju smo upravo podelili
je jedinstvena,
je jedinstvena,
17:39
and yet it is so common with sexual
violence being a global pandemic.
violence being a global pandemic.
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4666
a ipak je toliko uobičajena,
budući da je seksualno nasilje
globalna pandemija.
globalna pandemija.
17:44
But it doesn't have to be that way.
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Međutim, ne mora da bude tako.
17:47
One of the things that I found useful
on my own healing journey
on my own healing journey
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3016
Nešto što mi je bilo korisno
na sopstvenom putu isceljenja
na sopstvenom putu isceljenja
17:50
is educating myself about sexual violence.
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2648
je učenje o seksualnom nasilju.
17:53
And as a result,
I've been reading, writing
I've been reading, writing
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2414
A zbog toga sam čitala, pisala
17:55
and speaking about this issue
for over a decade now,
for over a decade now,
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2653
i govorila o ovom pitanju,
sad već više od deceniju,
sad već više od deceniju,
17:58
going to conferences around the world.
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2552
posećujući konferencije širom sveta.
18:01
And in my experience,
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1979
A prema mom iskustvu,
18:03
the attendees of such events
are almost exclusively women.
are almost exclusively women.
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4631
učesnici sličnih događaja
su skoro isključivo žene.
su skoro isključivo žene.
18:09
But it's about time that we stop treating
sexual violence as a women's issue.
sexual violence as a women's issue.
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Ali vreme je da prestanemo da tretiramo
seksualno nasilje kao žensko pitanje.
seksualno nasilje kao žensko pitanje.
18:15
(Applause)
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5447
(Aplauz)
18:29
A majority of sexual violence
against women and men
against women and men
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Seksualno nasilje
nad ženama i muškarcima
nad ženama i muškarcima
18:33
is perpetrated by men.
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1883
većinom počine muškarci.
18:35
And yet their voices are sorely
underrepresented in this discussion.
underrepresented in this discussion.
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Pa ipak, njihovi glasovi su krajnje
nezastupljeni u ovoj raspravi.
nezastupljeni u ovoj raspravi.
18:40
But all of us are needed here.
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Međutim, neophodno je prisustvo svih.
18:45
Just imagine all the suffering
we could alleviate
we could alleviate
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Samo zamislite koliku patnju
bismo mogli da ublažimo,
bismo mogli da ublažimo,
18:49
if we dared to face this issue together.
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ako bismo se usudili
da se zajedno suočimo s ovim problemom.
da se zajedno suočimo s ovim problemom.
18:54
Thank you.
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Hvala vam.
18:56
(Applause)
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(Aplauz)
ABOUT THE SPEAKERS
Thordis Elva - WriterThordis Elva is one of the two authors of "South of Forgiveness," a unique collaboration between a survivor and perpetrator of rape.
Why you should listen
Thordis Elva is a firm believer in the healing potential of dialogue when it comes to ending the silence that shrouds sexual violence. In 2015, she was voted Woman of the Year in her native Iceland due to her tireless campaigning for gender equality.
As an award-winning writer, journalist and public speaker, Elva has utilized many different platforms for her activism, including plays, films and books. Her passion for equality extends to the internet, and she has toured extensively giving lectures about online bullying, non-consensual pornography and digital human rights to audiences such as the United Nations and the Nordic Council of Ministers.
Read a Q&A with Elva about her TED Talk on the TED Blog.
Thordis Elva | Speaker | TED.com
Tom Stranger - Co-author, landscape gardener
Tom Stranger is the co-author "South of Forgiveness."
Why you should listen
Social sciences and the outdoors have been both professional directions and personal themes for Tom Stranger. After studying social science and working in outdoor recreation, Tom Stranger's focus shifted towards working with young people with complex needs -- mental health challenges, substance addiction, homelessness and neurological impairment. His time working with young people has taught him the immense value of listening with intent.
Stranger has recently completed and thoroughly enjoyed a Master of Cultural Studies at the University of Sydney, and he has returned to work in the outdoors as a landscaper. During his studies, he was involved as a co-author in the writing of South of Forgiveness. He and the book's primary author, Thordis Elva, share the hope that in speaking up they will add their voices to the ever-growing public discourse around relations of gender and sexual violence.
Read a Q&A with Stranger about his TED Talk on the TED Blog.
Tom Stranger | Speaker | TED.com