TEDGlobal 2012
Robert Neuwirth: The power of the informal economy
罗伯特.纽温斯：非正式经济体的力量
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罗伯特.纽温斯花了四年的时间，穿梭于街头巷尾的混乱商铺，跟推车小贩、灰色生意人交谈，学习非凡的“D系统” -- 世界上无照经营的经济网络。它给18亿人口提供工作，它是一个实力和范围还未受到应有估量和认可的经济体。
Robert Neuwirth - Author
Robert Neuwirth’s writings on the street-level reality of the developing world have opened a new dialogue on development and economics. Full bio
Robert Neuwirth’s writings on the street-level reality of the developing world have opened a new dialogue on development and economics. Full bio
Double-click the English transcript below to play the video.
00:16
In System D, this
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在D系统中,这是
00:18
is a store,
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其中一个商店
00:20
and what I mean by that is that this is a photograph
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我想说的是这是我在尼日利亚Lagos市
00:23
I took in Makoko, shantytown in Lagos, Nigeria.
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的一个叫Makoko的贫民区拍的照片。
00:28
It's built over the lagoon, and there are no streets
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它是沿着环礁湖而建的，而且没有一条街道
00:30
where there can be stores to shop,
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有商店可以给你购物，
00:32
and so the store comes to you.
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所以”商店“会主动来找你。
00:34
And in the same community,
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在这样一个社区里，
00:36
this is business synergy.
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这就是商业协同效应。
00:38
This is the boat that that lady was paddling around in,
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这是那位女士在划的船，
00:42
and this artisan makes the boat and the paddles
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而这位工匠制造船和桨
00:44
and sells directly
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然后直接卖给
00:46
to the people who need the boat and the paddles.
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需要船和桨的人。
00:48
And this is a global business.
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这是一种全球性的经营模式。
00:50
Ogandiro smokes fish in Makoko in Lagos,
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在Lagos市的Makoko镇里，Ogandiro以熏鱼营生
00:54
and I asked her, "Where does the fish come from?"
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我问她：“你们从哪里弄来的鱼啊？”
00:57
And I thought she'd say, "Oh, you know,
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我以为她会说,：“噢，
01:00
up the lagoon somewhere, or maybe across Africa,"
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某个环礁湖那弄上来的，或许在非洲的另一边”，
01:03
but you'll be happy to know she said
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但有意思的是她说
01:04
it came from here, it comes from the North Sea.
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就是这儿的，北海来的。
01:06
It's caught here, frozen, shipped down to Lagos,
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从这里捕捞，冷冻，然后运送到Lagos，
01:09
smoked, and sold for a tiny increment of profit
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熏好后，再在Lagos的街道上
01:12
on the streets of Lagos.
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赚一点点钱。
01:13
And this is a business incubator.
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这算得上是一个商业培养基地了。
01:15
This is Olusosun dump, the largest garbage dump in Lagos,
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这是Olusosun垃圾场，Lagos最大的垃圾场，
01:19
and 2,000 people work here, and I found this out
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有2000号人在这里工作，这我是通过
01:22
from this fellow, Andrew Saboru.
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Andrew Saboru了解到的。
01:24
Andrew spent 16 years scavenging materials on the dump,
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Andrew花了16年的时间在这个垃圾堆寻找各种材料，
01:28
earned enough money to turn himself into a contract scaler,
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赚了足够多的钱，能够自己做合同商，
01:32
which meant he carried a scale and went around and
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就是他带着一杆秤，然后到处
01:34
weighed all the materials that people had scavenged
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去称量人们从垃圾堆中寻找到的各种材料
01:37
from the dump. Now he's a scrap dealer.
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现在他是个废旧金属的经销商。
01:40
That's his little depot behind him,
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这后面是他的小仓库，
01:42
and he earns twice the Nigerian minimum wage.
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他的收入是尼日尼亚最低收入的两倍。
01:46
This is a shopping mall.
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这是一个购物中心。
01:49
This is Oshodi Market in Lagos.
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这是在Lagos的Oshodi市场。
01:51
Jorge Luis Borges had a story called "The Aleph,"
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Jorge Luis Borges有一个叫“The Aleph”的故事，
01:53
and the Aleph is a point in the world
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Aleph是世界上的某一点
01:55
where absolutely everything exists,
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那里有世界上所有的事物，
01:57
and for me, this image is a point in the world
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对我来说，这幅图就是这么一个点
02:00
where absolutely everything exists.
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应有尽有。
02:02
So, what am I talking about when I talk about System D?
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因此，我在说D系统的时候，我指的是什么呢?
02:05
It's traditionally called the informal economy,
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通常它是叫做非正规经济，
02:07
the underground economy, the black market.
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地下经济，黑市。
02:11
I don't conceive of it that way.
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我不那么觉得。
02:13
I think it's really important to understand that something like
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我觉得这种东西是完全开放的，
02:16
this is totally open. It's right there for you to find.
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这一点很重要。它就在那里，等你去发现。
02:20
All of this is happening openly, and aboveboard.
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所有这一切都是公开进行的，在地面上。
02:23
There's nothing underground about it.
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根本没有什么地下的东西。
02:26
It's our prejudgment that it's underground.
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所谓地下，是我们的偏见。
02:29
I've pirated the term System D from the former French colonies.
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我从前法国殖民地借用了“D系统”这个术语。
02:34
There's a word in French that is débrouillardise,
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在法语中有一个词是débrouillardise，
02:37
that means to be self-reliant,
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意思是独立的，
02:39
and the former French colonies have turned that into
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所以以前的法国殖民地就将D系统
02:42
System D for the economy of self-reliance,
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描述为独立的经济，
02:45
or the DIY economy.
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或者说DIY经济系统。
02:48
But governments hate the DIY economy,
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不过政府讨厌DIY经济系统，
02:51
and that's why -- I took this picture in 2007,
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这就是原因 -- 我在2007年照的这张照片，
02:54
and this is the same market in 2009 --
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这是2009年的同一个市场 --
02:59
and I think, when the organizers of this conference
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我觉得，当这个大会的组织者正在谈论
03:01
were talking about radical openness,
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极度开放的时候,
03:03
they didn't mean that the streets should be open
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他们没想着街道应该敞开
03:05
and the people should be gone.
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并且了无人迹。
03:07
I think what we have is a pickle problem.
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我觉得我们在这里有个酸黄瓜的问题。
03:11
I had a friend who worked at a pickle factory,
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我有一个朋友在酸黄瓜工厂工作，
03:14
and the cucumbers would come flying down
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所有黄瓜都会经过一个传送带
03:16
this conveyer belt, and his job was to pick off the ones
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他的工作是挑出
03:20
that didn't look so good and throw them in the bin
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那些比较烂的黄瓜，把他们扔到桶里
03:22
labeled "relish" where they'd be crushed and mixed
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桶上贴有"风味"的标签，这些黄瓜会被搅碎并和醋混合
03:24
with vinegar and used for other kinds of profit.
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然后拿出去卖了赚钱。
03:27
This is the pickle economy.
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这就是酸黄瓜经济系统。
03:30
We're all focusing on — this is a statistic from
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我们都在关心 -- 这是这个月早期
03:32
earlier this month in the Financial Times —
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在金融时刊杂志上的一个数据 --
03:35
we're all focusing on the luxury economy.
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我们都在关注奢侈品经济。
03:38
It's worth 1.5 trillion dollars every year, and that's
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每年它等价于150亿美金
03:41
a vast amount of money, right?
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这算是一笔巨大的金额，对吧？
03:43
That's three times the Gross Domestic Product of Switzerland.
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这个数字是瑞士GDP的三倍。
03:46
So it's vast. But it should come with an asterisk,
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确实是很庞大的数字。不过这数应该打个星号，
03:51
and the asterisk is that it excludes two thirds of the workers
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这个星号注明这其中排除了全世界
03:55
of the world.
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三分之二的工人。
03:56
1.8 billion people around the world work
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全世界18亿的人口工作于
03:59
in the economy that is unregulated and informal.
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这个未经管制的，非正式的经济系统。
04:05
That's a huge number, and what does that mean?
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这也是一个庞大的数字，而这意味着什么呢？
04:08
Well, it means if it were united in a single political system,
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这意味着如果把它联合成一个单独的政治体系，
04:13
one country, call it
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一个国家，管它叫做
04:17
"The United Street Sellers Republic," the U.S.S.R.,
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“联合街道商家共和国”，简称U.S.S.R.（和前苏联同名），
04:20
or "Bazaaristan,"
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或者“Bazaaristan（荒诞里斯坦）”，
04:22
it would be worth 10 trillion dollars every year,
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它每年的生产价值有10千亿美元，
04:26
and that would make it the second largest economy
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这将变成全世界第二大的经济系统
04:28
in the world, after the United States.
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仅次于美国。
04:31
And given that projections are that the bulk
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而根据预测
04:34
of economic growth over the next 15 years will come
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今后15年很大一部分的经济增长
04:37
from emerging economies in the developing world,
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都会从发展中世界的新兴经济体而来，
04:41
it could easily overtake the United States
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它可以轻而易举地取代美国
04:43
and become the largest economy in the world.
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从而成为世界上最大的经济动脉。
04:46
So the implications of that are vast, because it means
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（这个经济体）影响深远，因为它意味着
04:50
that this is where employment is — 1.8 billion people —
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所有的就业都将会在这里 -- 18亿人口 --
04:53
and this is where we can create a more egalitarian world,
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在这里我们可以创建一个更加平等的世界，
04:58
because people are actually able to earn money and live
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因为人们都能够赚到钱，安居乐业
05:02
and thrive, as Andrew Saboru did.
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并繁荣起来，就跟Andrew Saboru做的一样。
05:05
Big businesses have recognized this,
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大的商业机构已经看到了这一点，
05:07
and what's fascinating about this slide,
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这张幻灯片的有趣之处在于，
05:09
it's not that the guys can carry boxes on their heads
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不是那些可以头顶箱子
05:11
and run around without dropping them off.
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并且在行走中保持箱子不掉的人。
05:14
it's that the Gala sausage roll is a product that's made
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而是Gala香肠卷是由
05:17
by a global company called UAC foods
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一家叫做UAC foods的全球性公司生产的
05:20
that's active throughout Africa and the Middle East,
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在非洲和中东地区都卖得很火
05:22
but the Gala sausage roll is not sold in stores.
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但Gala香肠卷却没在商店里上架。
05:26
UAC foods has recognized that it won't sell if it's in stores.
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UAC foods意识到一旦上架，就卖不出去了。
05:29
It's only sold by a phalanx of street hawkers
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它仅仅是由一群街头小贩贩卖的
05:33
who run around the streets of Lagos at bus stations
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他们在Lagos穿街走巷，在公车站
05:36
and in traffic jams and sell it as a snack,
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在堵车的时候，把香肠卷当零食来卖，
05:41
and it's been sold that way for 40 years.
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而且已经用这种方式卖了40年了。
05:44
It's a business plan for a corporation.
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这是他们公司的营销计划，
05:46
And it's not just in Africa.
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而且不止在非洲是这样。
05:48
Here's Mr. Clean looking amorously at all the other
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这是“清洁大叔”谄媚地看着
05:51
Procter & Gamble products,
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宝洁公司的其他产品，
05:53
and Procter & Gamble, you know,
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保洁，大家都知道，
05:56
the statistic always cited is that Wal-Mart
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一个总被引用的数据是说沃尔玛
05:58
is their largest customer, and it's true, as one store,
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是他们最大的客户，的确是这样
06:03
Wal-Mart buys 15 percent, thus 15 percent
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单沃尔玛就购买了宝洁15%的产品
06:06
of Procter & Gamble's business is with Wal-Mart,
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所以宝洁15%的生意是和沃尔玛谈的
06:10
but their largest market segment is something that they call
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但他们最大的市场段是他们称之为
06:13
"high frequency stores," which is all these tiny kiosks
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“高频商店”的，也就是这些小摊子
06:16
and the lady in the canoe and all these other businesses
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那个划小木舟的妇女，所有那些生意
06:19
that exist in System D, the informal economy,
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在D系统这个非正式的经济里，
06:25
and Procter & Gamble makes 20 percent of its money
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宝洁20%的盈利
06:28
from that market segment,
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就是从这个市场段来的，
06:30
and it's the only market segment that's growing.
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而且它还是唯一一个在成长的市场段。
06:34
So Procter & Gamble says, "We don't care whether a store
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所以宝洁公司就说，“我们不在乎一个商店
06:37
is incorporated or registered or anything like that.
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是否是公司，注册过或怎样。
06:40
We want our products in that store."
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我们就是要我们的商品在那儿上架。”
06:43
And then there's mobile phones.
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再说到手机
06:46
This is an ad for MTN,
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这是一个广告，给MTN做的
06:47
which is a South African multinational
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一个南非的跨国公司
06:50
active in about 25 countries,
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覆盖范围约有25个国家，
06:53
and when they came into Nigeria —
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当他们进驻尼日利亚时 --
06:54
Nigeria is the big dog in Africa.
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尼日利亚在非洲是举足轻重的。
06:56
One in seven Africans is a Nigerian,
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在非洲每七个人中就有一个是尼日利亚人
06:59
and so everyone wants in to the mobile phone market
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所以所有人都想进入到尼日利亚的这个手机市场。
07:01
in Nigeria. And when MTN came in, they wanted
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当MTN进入的时候，
07:03
to sell the mobile service like I get in the United States
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他们想要像在美国一样销售移动业务
07:06
or like people get here in the U.K. or in Europe --
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或者像是在英国，欧洲一样 --
07:10
expensive monthly plans, you get a phone,
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每月付多一点的钱，就能得到一部手机
07:14
you pay overages,
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但你得付超限租金，
07:16
you're killed with fees --
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而且费用还不少 --
07:18
and their plan crashed and burned.
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所以他们的计划很快就失败了。
07:20
And they went back to the drawing board, and they retooled,
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然后他们回到画板上，重新规划
07:22
and they came up with another plan:
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之后得出这么一个计划：
07:23
We don't sell you the phone,
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我们不卖给你手机，
07:26
we don't sell you the monthly plan.
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我们也不卖给你月租套餐。
07:27
We only sell you airtime.
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我们只卖通话时间。
07:31
And where's the airtime sold?
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那么通话时间在哪卖呢？
07:33
It's sold at umbrella stands all over the streets,
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他们就在街上那些伞搁架上卖，
07:37
where people are unregistered, unlicensed,
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尽管人们都是没有登记，没有执照的
07:40
but MTN makes most of its profits,
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但MTN确实赚了一笔，
07:43
perhaps 90 percent of its profits,
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约占他们总盈利的90%吧，
07:46
from selling through System D, the informal economy.
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就仅从这个D系统，这个非正式经济中得到盈利。
07:50
And where do the phones come from?
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那么那些手机是从哪儿来的呢？
07:52
Well, they come from here. This is in Guangzhou, China,
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其实，他们是从这里来的。这里是中国的广州
07:55
and if you go upstairs in this rather sleepy looking
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如果你走上楼去，走上这个看起来很萧条的
07:59
electronics mall, you find the Guangzhou Dashatou
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电子商城，你就到了广州的大沙头
08:03
second-hand trade center,
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二手交易中心，
08:06
and if you go in there, you follow the guys with the muscles
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如果你进去了，你就跟着那些肌肉佬
08:09
who are carrying the boxes, and where are they going?
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那些扛着箱子的，他们要去哪儿呢？
08:12
They're going to Eddy in Lagos.
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他们要去Lago的Eddy。
08:15
Now, most of the phones there are not second-hand at all.
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现在，那儿大部分的手机都不是二手的了。
08:17
The name is a misnomer.
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那是名不符实的，
08:19
Most of them are pirated. They have the name brand
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他们是盗版的。在手机上面有牌子的商标
08:22
on them, but they're not manufactured by the name brand.
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但他们却不是那些正牌厂子组装的。
08:25
Now, are there downsides to that?
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那么，这种系统有什么缺陷吗？
08:27
Well, I guess. You know, China has no —
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啊，我觉得。你懂的，中国没有 --
08:31
(Laughter) — no intellectual property, right?
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(笑声) -- 知识产权，是吗？
08:34
Versace without the vowels.
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Versace (范思哲) 中间少了个元音。
08:36
Zhuomani instead of Armani.
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Zhuomani，而不是 Armani
08:38
S. Guuuci, and -- (Laughter) (Applause)
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S. Guuuci -- (笑声)(掌声)
08:43
All around the world this is how products
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在世界的各个地方，产品就是这样被
08:46
are being distributed, so, for instance,
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投入市场的，比如
08:49
in one street market on Rua 25 de Março
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在Rua 25 de Marco商业区的街上
08:52
in São Paulo, Brazil,
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在圣保罗，巴西，
08:54
you can buy fake designer glasses.
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你可以买到冒牌的名牌眼镜。
08:57
You can buy cloned cologne.
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可以买到克隆的古龙香水。
08:59
You can buy pirated DVDs, of course.
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可以买到盗版的DVD，这是肯定的。
09:02
You can buy New York Yankees caps
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还可以买到纽约洋基棒球队的棒球帽
09:05
in all sorts of unauthorized patterns.
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印有各种未经授权的图案。
09:08
You can buy cuecas baratas, designer underwear
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可以买到廉价的内衣，或者是名牌内衣
09:11
that isn't really manufactured by a designer,
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但不是名牌制造商生产的，
09:13
and even pirated evangelical mixtapes. (Laughter)
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还甚至可以买到福音歌曲合集。（笑声）
09:18
Now, businesses tend to complain about this,
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正规企业大多会抱怨这些盗版仿冒，
09:20
and their, they, I don't want to take away from their
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他们的，我不想掩盖他们
09:24
entire validity of complaining about it,
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抱怨的合理性，
09:26
but I did ask a major sneaker manufacturer earlier this year
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但我今年曾问过一个大型帆布鞋生产商
09:30
what they thought about piracy,
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他们是怎么看待盗版的，
09:33
and they told me, "Well, you can't quote me on this,
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他们告诉我，“怎么说呢，你可不能说是我说的，
09:35
because if you quote me on this, I have to kill you,"
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如果你说了的话，我就得灭了你，”
09:37
but they use piracy as market research.
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他们把盗版当作市场调查 (的信息反馈)。
09:42
The sneaker manufacturer told me that if
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帆布鞋生产商告诉过我
09:46
they find that Pumas are being pirated, or Adidas
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如果他们发现Pumas被盗版了，或者Adidas
09:49
are being pirated and their sneakers aren't being pirated,
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被盗版了，而他们自己的牌子却没被盗版
09:53
they know they've done something wrong. (Laughter)
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他们便知道他们肯定出问题了（笑声）
09:56
So it's very important to them to track piracy
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所以对于他们而言关注盗版很重要
09:59
exactly because of this, and the people who are buying,
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正因为如此，还有那些购买者
10:01
the pirates, are not their customers anyway,
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那些盗版商，根本不是他们的消费群体，
10:03
because their customers want the real deal.
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因为他们的消费者要的是真材实料。
10:06
Now, there's another problem.
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现在还有一个问题。
10:07
This is a real street sign in Lagos, Nigeria.
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在尼日利亚Lagos市的街头巷尾都有这一现象
10:11
All of System D really doesn't pay taxes, right?
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所有的系统D确实不缴税，对吗？
10:14
And when I think about that, first of all I think that
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当我考虑这个问题的时候，我首先想到的是
10:16
government is a social contract between the people and
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政府是一个人与人之间的社会契约
10:19
the government, and if the government isn't transparent,
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而政府，如果这个政府不够透明
10:22
then the people aren't going to be transparent either,
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那么它的人民也不会透明，
10:24
but also that we're blaming the little guy
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但我们通常会指责那些
10:27
who doesn't pay his taxes, and we're not recognizing
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偷税漏税的小人物，却忽视了
10:29
that everyone's fudging things all over the world,
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不管在世界的哪个地方，总有人在搪塞过关，
10:32
including some extremely respected businesses,
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包括那些特别受尊重的企业，
10:36
and I'll give you one example.
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我来举个例子，
10:37
There was one company that paid 4,000 bribes
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有一个公司行贿了4000次
10:41
in the first decade of this millennium, and
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在这个世纪的头十年，
10:43
a million dollars in bribes every business day, right?
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每个工作日的行贿数额约100万美元，对吗？
10:48
All over the world. And that company
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在全世界中。那个公司
10:51
was the big German electronics giant Siemens.
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正是德国的电子巨头西门子。
10:54
So this goes on in the formal economy
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所以这种现象在正规的经济体系里存在
10:57
as well as the informal economy,
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在非正规的经济体系里亦然，
11:00
so it's wrong of us to blame — and I'm not singling out
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所以是我们错怪了 -- 我不是单单
11:02
Siemens, I'm saying everyone does it. Okay?
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把西门子拎出来，我是说每个企业都这样。
11:06
I just want to end by saying that if Adam Smith
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我只想这样收尾，如果亚当.史密斯
11:09
had framed out a theory of the flea market
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当初建立的是一个跳蚤市场的理论
11:12
instead of the free market, what would be some
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而非自由市场的理论，那么最终的
11:15
of the principles?
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准则是什么？
11:17
First, it would be to understand that it could be
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首先要明白的一点是
11:21
considered a cooperative, and this is a thought
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市场将是合作制的，这是
11:23
from the Brazilian legal scholar Roberto Mangabeira Unger.
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巴西法律学者Roberto Mangabeira Unger的一个观点。
11:28
Cooperative development is a way forward.
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合作式的发展将是今后前进的方向。
11:30
Secondly, from the [Austrian] anarchist philosopher Paul Feyerabend,
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其次，引用[奥地利]无政府主义哲学家Paul Feyerabend的观点，
11:35
facts are relative, and what is a massive right
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事实是相对的，对于一个尼日利亚商人来说
11:39
of self-reliance to a Nigerian businessperson
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是一个绝对正确的自我独立，
11:42
is considered unauthorized and horrible to other people,
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对他人来讲也许是不合法，甚至是骇人听闻的，
11:46
and we have to recognize that there are differences
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我们必须承认
11:48
in how people define things and what their facts are.
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人们定义问题的方式和所认为的事实是有出入的。
11:50
And third is, and I'm taking this from
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再者，借用
11:53
the great American beat poet Allen Ginsberg,
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伟大的美国潦倒诗人Allen Ginsberg的想法，
11:57
that alternate economies barter and
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不同的经济体间互相以物易物
12:00
different kinds of currency, alternate currencies
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而不同种类的货币
12:03
are also very important, and he talked about
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也很重要，他谈过
12:05
buying what he needed just with his good looks.
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用他的容貌来买他需要的。
12:08
And so I just want to leave you there, and say that
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所以我想在这里结束，
12:12
this economy is a tremendous force for global development
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这个经济体是一个全球发展的强大生力军
12:16
and we need to think about it that way.
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我们需要这么思考。
12:18
Thank you very much. (Applause)
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非常感谢。（掌声）
12:21
(Applause)
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（掌声）
ABOUT THE SPEAKER
Robert Neuwirth - AuthorRobert Neuwirth’s writings on the street-level reality of the developing world have opened a new dialogue on development and economics.
Why you should listen
For too many people in the world, Robert Neuwirth suggests, the world's globalized economic system has turned out to be a capitalism of decay. Only by embracing true sharing strategies, he argues, can people develop an equitable vision of the future.
Neuwirth is the author of two previous books: Stealth of Nations (2011), on the global growth of the street markets and cross-border smuggling, and Shadow Cities (2005), on the power of squatter communities and shantytowns. His work has appeared in documentary films, on radio and television, and in many publications. In addition to writing, he has taught at Rikers Island, New York City’s jail, and at Columbia University’s Graduate School of Journalism.
Robert Neuwirth | Speaker | TED.com