TEDGlobal 2017
Sethembile Msezane: Living sculptures that stand for history's truths
Sethembile Msezane: 代表历史真相的活雕塑
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在占据了开普敦的百年雕塑中，作者没有看到任何反映她真实生活的东西。所以她自己扮演了活雕塑，在公共场所穿着代表性的服装站立数小时，为她的社区夺回这座城市和它的公共空间。在这个强大的巡回演讲中，她分享了她的故事以及她迷人艺术表演背后的动机。
Sethembile Msezane - Artist
Sethembile Msezane deconstructs the act of public commemoration -- how it creates myths, constructs histories, includes some and excludes others. Full bio
Sethembile Msezane deconstructs the act of public commemoration -- how it creates myths, constructs histories, includes some and excludes others. Full bio
Double-click the English transcript below to play the video.
00:12
I'd like for you to take a moment
to imagine this with me.
to imagine this with me.
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我想让各位和我一起想象一个画面。
00:18
You're a little girl of five years old.
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你是一个五岁的小女孩，
00:22
Sitting in front of a mirror,
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坐在镜子前，
00:23
you ask yourself,
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你问自己，
00:26
"Do I exist?"
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“我存在吗？”
00:29
In this space, there is
very little context,
very little context,
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这个空间太清静了，
00:31
and so you move into a different one,
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于是你来到另一个地方，
00:34
one filled with people.
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一个满是人的地方。
00:37
Surely, now you know you're not
a figment of your own imagination.
a figment of your own imagination.
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当然，现在你知道
你不是自己虚构的事物。
你不是自己虚构的事物。
00:41
You breathe their air.
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你和他们呼吸着相同的空气，
00:43
You see them,
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你看得见他们，
00:44
so they must see you.
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他们也看得见你。
00:47
And yet, you still can't help but wonder:
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然而，你仍会情不自禁地想：
00:52
Do I only exist when people speak to me?
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我只有在和他人对话
的时候才存在吗？
的时候才存在吗？
00:57
Pretty heavy thoughts for a child, right?
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对一个孩子来说，
这样的想法很沉重，对吗？
这样的想法很沉重，对吗？
01:01
But through various artworks
that reflect upon our society,
that reflect upon our society,
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但是通过各种各样
可以反映社会问题的艺术作品，
可以反映社会问题的艺术作品，
01:05
I came to understand
how a young black girl can grow up
how a young black girl can grow up
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我逐渐了解到一个年轻
的黑人女孩如何成长，
的黑人女孩如何成长，
01:09
feeling as if she's not seen,
and perhaps she doesn't exist.
and perhaps she doesn't exist.
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觉得好像没人看得见她，
甚至是她根本不存在。
甚至是她根本不存在。
01:16
You see, if young people don't have
positive images of themselves
positive images of themselves
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很明显，如果年轻人
对自身没有正面认识，
对自身没有正面认识，
01:20
and all that remains
are negative stereotypes,
are negative stereotypes,
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只有负面印象时，
01:23
this affects their self-image.
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这会影响到他们的自我认知，
01:26
But it also affects the way
that the rest of society treats them.
that the rest of society treats them.
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这同样也会影响
社会其他人对待他们的方式。
社会其他人对待他们的方式。
01:31
I discovered this
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我发现这一点时，
已经在开普敦生活了大概五年。
01:32
having lived in Cape Town
for about five years at the time.
for about five years at the time.
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01:37
I felt a deep sense
of dislocation and invisibility.
of dislocation and invisibility.
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我深深地感受到了
无归属和被忽视的滋味。
无归属和被忽视的滋味。
01:43
I couldn't see myself represented.
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我看不到自己是什么样的，
01:46
I couldn't see the women who've raised me,
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我看不到养育我的女人，
01:49
the ones who've influenced me,
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那些影响我的人，
01:51
and the ones that have made
South Africa what it is today.
South Africa what it is today.
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那些造就今日南非的人。
01:54
I decided to do something about it.
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我决定做一些事情。
01:59
What do you think when you see this?
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当你看到这个时你想到了什么？
02:03
If you were a black girl,
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如果你是一个黑人女孩，
02:05
how would it make you feel?
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你会有什么感觉？
02:09
Walking down the street,
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沿着这条路往下走，
02:11
what does the city you live in say to you?
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你居住的城市对你表达了什么？
02:15
What symbols are present?
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展示了什么标志事物？
02:17
Which histories are celebrated?
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庆祝了什么历史事件？
02:20
And on the other hand,
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从另一方面来说，
02:21
which ones are omitted?
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哪些东西被省略了？
02:23
You see, public spaces are hardly
ever as neutral as they may seem.
ever as neutral as they may seem.
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公共空间难以
像它们看起来那样中立，
像它们看起来那样中立，
02:28
I discovered this when I made
this performance in 2013 on Heritage Day.
this performance in 2013 on Heritage Day.
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当我在2013年遗产日
演出时发现了这一点。
演出时发现了这一点。
02:36
Cape Town is teeming
with masculine architecture,
with masculine architecture,
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开普敦充满了阳刚的建筑，
02:41
monuments and statues,
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纪念碑还有雕塑，
02:43
such as Louis Botha in that photograph.
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如照片中的路易斯 博塔。
02:46
This overt presence of white colonial
and Afrikaner nationalist men
and Afrikaner nationalist men
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这个明显存在着
白人殖民主义和民族主义的人，
白人殖民主义和民族主义的人，
02:52
not only echoes a social,
gender and racial divide,
gender and racial divide,
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不仅反映了社会、性别和种族分化，
02:58
but it also continues to affect
the way that women --
the way that women --
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它还持续影响着女性——
03:03
and the way, particularly, black women --
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特别是黑人女性——看待自己的方式，
03:06
see themselves in relation
to dominant male figures
to dominant male figures
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如何将自身和在公共场合占主导地位
03:12
in public spaces.
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的男性联系起来。
03:17
For this reason, among others,
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为此，
03:19
I don't believe that we need statues.
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我觉得我们不需要雕塑。
03:22
The preservation of history
and the act of remembering
and the act of remembering
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历史的保存和记忆
03:26
can be achieved in more memorable
and effective ways.
and effective ways.
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可以通过更值得纪念
和有效的方式实现。
和有效的方式实现。
03:32
As part of a year-long
public holiday series,
public holiday series,
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作为年公共假日系列的一部分，
03:36
I use performance art
as a form of social commentary
as a form of social commentary
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我用表演艺术评价社会，
03:40
to draw people's attention
to certain issues,
to certain issues,
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将人们的目光聚焦到某些问题上，
03:43
as well as addressing the absence
of the black female body
of the black female body
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并弥补黑人女性
在公共纪念场合中的缺失，
03:49
in memorialized public spaces,
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03:51
especially on public holidays.
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特别是公共假日。
03:55
Women's Day was coming up.
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妇女节就要来了。
03:57
I looked at what the day means --
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我查了一下妇女节的意义——
03:59
the Women's March
to the union buildings in 1956,
to the union buildings in 1956,
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1956年，妇女到联合国大厦游行，
04:04
petitioning against the pass laws.
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请愿反对通过的法案，
04:08
Juxtaposed with the hypocrisy
of how women are treated,
of how women are treated,
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并反对虚伪对待女性，
04:12
especially in public spaces today,
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特别是在如今的公共场所。
04:15
I decided to do something about it.
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我决定做一些什么。
04:19
Headline:
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标题：
04:21
[Women in miniskirt attacked at taxi rank]
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【穿着迷你裙的女性
在出租车站遭遇袭击】
在出租车站遭遇袭击】
04:29
How do I comment on such polar opposites?
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我应该对这种事情做何评价呢？
04:33
In the guise of my great-grandmother,
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我伪装成我曾祖母的样子，
04:35
I performed bare-breasted,
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真空上阵，
04:37
close to the taxi rank in KwaLanga.
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在瓜朗嘎出租车候车站附近。
04:41
This space is also called Freedom Square,
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那里也被称为自由广场，
04:43
where women were a part of demonstrations
against apartheid laws.
against apartheid laws.
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在那儿，女性是反对
种族隔离法示威的一部分。
种族隔离法示威的一部分。
04:49
I was not comfortable with women
being seen as only victims in society.
being seen as only victims in society.
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我不喜欢女性仅仅
被当作社会的受害者。
被当作社会的受害者。
04:56
You might wonder
how people reacted to this.
how people reacted to this.
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你可能会好奇人们对此行为的反应。
04:59
(Video) Woman: (Cheering)
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（视频）女：（欢呼）
05:03
Woman 2 (offscreen): Yes!
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女2（画外）：太棒了！
05:13
Sethembile Msezane: Pretty cool, huh?
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挺酷的，对吧？
05:16
(Applause)
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（鼓掌）
05:19
So I realized that through
my performances,
my performances,
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我意识到通过我的表演，
05:22
I've been able to make regular people
reflect upon their society,
reflect upon their society,
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我可以让普通人反思这个社会，
05:27
looking at the past
as well as the current democracy.
as well as the current democracy.
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看看过去和现在的民主。
05:31
(Video) Man (offscreen):
She's been there since three o'clock.
She's been there since three o'clock.
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（视频）男（画外）：
她从三点开始就在那儿了。
她从三点开始就在那儿了。
男2（画外）：三点之前吧，
已经一个小时没动了。
已经一个小时没动了。
05:34
Man 2 (offscreen): Just before three.
About an hour still?
About an hour still?
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男1：是的，今天非常热。
05:37
Man 1: Yeah. It's just a really hot day.
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05:45
Man 1: It's very interesting.
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男1：这很有意思。
05:47
It's very powerful.
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很有力量，
05:50
I think it's cool.
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我觉得很酷。
我认为不久就会有很多人加入她，
05:54
I think a lot of people
are quick to join a group
are quick to join a group
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这是通往某个事业的重要一步，
05:59
that's a movement towards something,
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06:01
but not many people are ready
to do something as an individual.
to do something as an individual.
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但只有少数人做好了
独自行动的准备。
独自行动的准备。
06:07
Man 2: So it's the individual
versus the collective.
versus the collective.
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男2：所以这是个人和群体的对抗。
男1：是的。
06:09
Man 1: Yeah.
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我认为她在表演中
传达了自身的信息——
传达了自身的信息——
06:10
So I think her pushing her own
individual message in performance ...
individual message in performance ...
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06:17
it's powerful.
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这很厉害。
06:20
Yeah, I think it's quite powerful
that she's doing it on her own.
that she's doing it on her own.
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我觉得她依靠自己的力量很令人敬佩，
我想知道她为什么用假发作翅膀，
06:25
I'd be interested to know why
she's using hair extensions as wings,
she's using hair extensions as wings,
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06:29
or whatever those things are meant to be.
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或者那些东西意味着什么。
06:34
They are wings, yes?
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它们是翅膀吗？
06:38
Woman 3: With her standing
there right now,
there right now,
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女3：她现在站在那里，
06:41
I think it's just my interpretation
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我的理解是，
06:45
that we are bringing the statue down
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我们把那个雕塑弄倒，
06:48
and bringing up something
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树立起一个
06:50
that's supposed to represent
African pride, I think.
African pride, I think.
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象征着非洲骄傲的东西，
或者类似的东西。
06:55
Or something like that.
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06:57
Something should stand while Rhodes falls,
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当罗德倒下之后
应该要有新的东西起来，
应该要有新的东西起来，
这应该就是她要表达的。
07:01
I think that's what it's saying. Yeah.
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07:04
Yes. Thank you.
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是的，谢谢。
男3：我后面的东西代表了非洲文化。
07:05
Man 3: What is behind me
represents the African culture.
represents the African culture.
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我们不应该有殖民主义法律，
07:09
We can't have the colonialist law,
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我们应该把这些殖民雕塑全都弄走。
07:11
so we need to remove
all these colonial statues.
all these colonial statues.
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我们现在有了自己的雕塑，
07:14
We have have our own statues now,
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我们非洲的领导人巴巴塔，
莫岁岁，夸梅·恩克鲁玛——
莫岁岁，夸梅·恩克鲁玛——
07:17
our African leaders --
Bhambatha, Moshoeshoe, Kwame Nkrumah --
Bhambatha, Moshoeshoe, Kwame Nkrumah --
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那些为了我们的自由牺牲生命的人。
07:22
all those who paid their lives
for our liberation.
for our liberation.
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21世纪我们不能继续那样下去了，
07:26
We can't continue in the 21st century,
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不能在取得民主的21年之后，
07:28
and after 21 years of democracy,
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在我们国家还保留殖民者。
07:30
have the colonizers in our own country.
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他们属于别的地方，
也许是博物馆，但不是这里。
也许是博物馆，但不是这里。
07:33
They belong somewhere.
Maybe in a museum; not here.
Maybe in a museum; not here.
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我的意思是教育机构
07:36
I mean learning institutions,
places where young people,
places where young people,
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是塑造年轻思想的地方。
07:39
young minds are being shaped.
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我们不能继续放路易斯·博塔、
罗德这些人的雕像，
罗德这些人的雕像，
07:40
So we cannot continue to have Louis Botha,
Rhodes, all these people,
Rhodes, all these people,
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因为他们代表了殖民主义。
07:45
because they're representing
the colonialism.
the colonialism.
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07:50
(Applause)
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（掌声）
07:56
Sethembile Msezane: On April 9, 2015,
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2015年4月9日，
07:59
the Cecil John Rhodes statue
was scheduled to be removed
was scheduled to be removed
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塞西尔·约翰·罗兹雕像
计划被拆除，
计划被拆除，
不同的利益相关者间展开了
08:03
after a month of debates
for and against its removal
for and against its removal
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为期一个月的激烈讨论。
08:07
by various stakeholders.
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08:10
This caused a widespread interest
in statues in South Africa.
in statues in South Africa.
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这在南非引起了人们
对雕塑的广泛兴趣。
对雕塑的广泛兴趣。
08:15
Opinions varied, but the media
focused on problematizing
focused on problematizing
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人们意见不一，但媒体的焦点
集中在移除雕塑的问题。
08:20
the removal of statues.
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08:25
On that -- well, that year,
I had just begun my master's
I had just begun my master's
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那年，我刚开始在开普敦大学
08:28
at the University of Cape Town.
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攻读研究生。
08:32
During the time
of the debate of the statue,
of the debate of the statue,
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在讨论雕塑问题的那段时间里，
我重复做着一个梦，
08:35
I had been having reoccurring dreams
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关于一只鸟。
08:39
about a bird.
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于是我开始
08:41
And so I started conjuring her
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08:44
mentally, spiritually and through dress.
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从精神上和穿着上召唤她。
那天，
08:50
On that day,
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我碰巧要和指导老师开会，
08:51
I happened to be having
a meeting with my supervisors,
a meeting with my supervisors,
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他们告诉我当天要拆除雕塑。
08:55
and they told me that the statue
was going to fall on that day.
was going to fall on that day.
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09:00
I told them that I'd explain later,
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我告诉他们我要推迟会议，
09:02
but we had to postpone the meeting
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稍后解释原因，
09:04
because I was going to perform her
as the statue came down.
as the statue came down.
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因为我要在雕塑倒下的时候表演她。
09:09
Her name was Chapungu.
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她的名字是查平谷。
09:11
She was a soapstone bird
that was looted from Great Zimbabwe
that was looted from Great Zimbabwe
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她是在19世纪晚期从津巴布韦
09:15
in the late 1800s,
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被洗劫来的皂石鸟。
09:17
and is still currently housed
in Cecil John Rhodes's estate
in Cecil John Rhodes's estate
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目前，她还在开普敦的
09:21
in Cape Town.
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塞西尔·约翰·罗兹的庄园里。
那天，
09:24
On that day,
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我用身体来展现她的存在，
09:25
I embodied her existence using my body,
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在烈日下站了快四个小时。
09:29
while standing in the blazing sun
for nearly four hours.
for nearly four hours.
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那时，
09:35
As the time came,
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鹤苏醒了。
09:37
the crane came alive.
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09:39
The people did, too --
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人们也是——
人们大叫，
09:41
shouting,
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尖叫，
09:42
screaming,
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握紧拳头，
09:43
clenching their fists
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用手机和相机记录下了那个时刻。
09:45
and taking pictures of the moment
on their phones and cameras.
on their phones and cameras.
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09:49
Chapungu's wings,
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查平谷的翅膀
09:51
along with the crane,
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以及那只鹤
09:52
rose to declare the fall
of Cecil John Rhodes.
of Cecil John Rhodes.
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宣告了塞西尔·约翰·罗德斯的离开。
09:59
(Applause)
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（掌声）
10:04
Euphoria filled the air
as he became absent from his base,
as he became absent from his base,
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他被移除时，广场的空气中
弥漫着喜悦的气氛，
弥漫着喜悦的气氛，
在与此同时，
她继续保持不动，
她继续保持不动，
10:08
while she remained still,
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一直在那里，
10:12
very present,
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甚至是在雕像被移除的半个小时后。
10:13
half an hour after his removal.
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种族隔离被禁止的23年后，
10:18
Twenty-three years after apartheid,
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南非出现了新生代激进分子。
10:21
a new generation of radicals
has arisen in South Africa.
has arisen in South Africa.
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查平谷和罗德的故事
10:24
The story of Chapungu and Rhodes
in the same space and time
in the same space and time
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代表了非常重要的问题，
10:29
asks important questions
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关于性别，
10:31
related to gender,
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权利，
10:34
power,
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自我象征，
10:35
self-representation,
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创造历史，
10:37
history making
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以及遣返。
10:38
and repatriation.
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从那以后，
10:43
From then on,
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我意识到我的精神信仰与理想
10:44
I realized that my spiritual
beliefs and dreams
beliefs and dreams
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使我的物质生活变得丰富多彩。
10:49
texture my material reality.
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但对我而言，
查平谷的故事尚未完结。
查平谷的故事尚未完结。
10:53
But for me, Chapungu's story
felt incomplete.
felt incomplete.
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皂石鸟，
10:56
This soapstone bird,
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上帝与我们祖先的精神使者，
10:58
a spiritual medium and messenger
of God and the ancestors,
of God and the ancestors,
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需要我继续她的故事。
11:02
needed me to continue her story.
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11:05
And so I dabbled in the dream space
a little bit more,
a little bit more,
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所以我深入这个梦境，
“坠落”就这样诞生了。
11:10
and this is how "Falling" was born.
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11:19
[A film by Sethembile Msezane]
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【演讲者的电影】
（视频）
11:20
(Video) (A capella singing)
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【坠落】
11:51
[FALLING]
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11:58
(Applause)
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（掌声）
12:02
In the film,
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在电影中，
津巴布韦，南非还有德国
有着同样的故事，
有着同样的故事，
12:03
Zimbabwe, South Africa and Germany
share a common story
share a common story
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关于从津巴布韦洗劫来的皂石鸟。
12:07
about the soapstone birds
that were looted from Great Zimbabwe.
that were looted from Great Zimbabwe.
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12:12
After Zimbabwe gained its independence,
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津巴布韦独立后，
除了一种鸟，其他所有鸟
都回到了纪念碑。
都回到了纪念碑。
12:14
all the birds except for one
were returned to the monument.
were returned to the monument.
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12:19
"Falling" explores the mythological belief
that there will be unrest
that there will be unrest
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“坠落”探索了神话中会动摇的信仰，
12:24
until the final bird is returned.
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直到最后那只鸟回来。
12:28
Through my work,
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通过我的工作，
12:30
I have realized a lot
about the world around me:
about the world around me:
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我加深了对周围世界的了解，
12:34
how we move through spaces,
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我们如何移动，
12:37
who we choose to celebrate
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我们选择歌颂什么人，
铭记什么人。
12:39
and who we remember.
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12:42
Now I look in the mirror
and not only see an image of myself,
and not only see an image of myself,
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现在我看向镜子时
不仅仅看到了我自己，
不仅仅看到了我自己，
12:46
but of the women
who have made me who I am today.
who have made me who I am today.
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还看到了塑造我的其他女性。
12:50
I stand tall in my work,
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我在工作中毫不畏惧地
歌颂女性历史，
12:53
celebrating women's histories,
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希望有一天
12:56
in the hope that perhaps one day,
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12:59
no little black girl has to ever feel
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不再有黑人女孩觉得
她好像不存在一样。
13:02
like she doesn't exist.
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13:04
Thank you.
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谢谢。
13:05
(Applause)
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（掌声）
ABOUT THE SPEAKER
Sethembile Msezane - ArtistSethembile Msezane deconstructs the act of public commemoration -- how it creates myths, constructs histories, includes some and excludes others.
Why you should listen
With masked face and powerful gestures, Sethembile Msezane disrupts and deconstructs the process of commemorative practice in South Africa, demanding space next to colonial-era statues for her country's, and her gender's, erased histories. In one iconic work, she performed at the removal of the John Cecil Rhodes statue at the University of Cape Town ("Chapungu: The Day Rhodes Fell," 2015), and starting in 2013 she performed a series of pieces called "Public Holiday" that place her body in contrast to colonial-era monuments in Cape Town's CBD.
Msezane is a ANTI Festival International Prize for Live Art nominee (2017). She is the TAF & Sylt Emerging Artist Residency Award winner (2016), and she is the first recipient of the Rising Light award at the Mbokodo Awards. She is also a a Barclays L’Atelier Top 10 Finalist (2016). Her 2017 solo show at Gallery MOMO is titled "Kwasuka Sukel: Re-imagined Bodies of a (South African) '90s Born Woman", and features sculptural work that places colonial images in the context of Victorian-style furniture and dress, reframing and reclaiming a part of colonial history. She was one of the selected artists for gallery solo projects at the FNB Joburg Art Fair (2017), and her work is currently housed in the Zeitz MOCAA collection as well as Iziko South African National Gallery's collection.
Selected group shows include "Women's Work and The Art of Disruptions" at the Iziko South African National Gallery (2016), "Dis(colour)ed Margins" at the National Gallery of Zimbabwe (2017), "Re[as]sisting Narratives" at Framer Framed, Amsterdam (2016), "Dance, if you want to enter my country!/ Global Citizen" at GoetheOnMain, Johannesburg (2016), "Nothing Personal" at SMAC Gallery, Cape Town, #theopening at Greatmore Studios, Cape Town (2016) and "Translations" at Emergent Art Space and Reed College, Portland, Oregon (2015).
Sethembile Msezane | Speaker | TED.com