TED2004
Stewart Brand: The Long Now
斯图尔特·伯兰特谈万年钟
Filmed:
Readability: 3.4
284,772 views
斯图尔特·伯兰特参与了万年时钟的工作，那是一个可以为未来一万年计时的时钟。这一项目启发我们去思考长远的未来。这一演讲中，伯兰特探讨了一个很有趣的问题：这样一个万年钟可以放到哪里？
Stewart Brand - Environmentalist, futurist
Since the counterculture '60s, Stewart Brand has been creating our internet-worked world. Now, with biotech accelerating four times faster than digital technology, Stewart Brand has a bold new plan ... Full bio
Since the counterculture '60s, Stewart Brand has been creating our internet-worked world. Now, with biotech accelerating four times faster than digital technology, Stewart Brand has a bold new plan ... Full bio
Double-click the English transcript below to play the video.
00:12
Welcome to 10,000 feet.
0
0
3000
欢迎来到一万英尺的高空
00:15
Let me explain why we are here
1
3000
1000
先让我介绍一下我们为什么会在这里吧
00:16
and why some of you have a pine cone close to you.
2
4000
4000
也许你们有些人手上就有松塔
00:20
Once upon a time, I did a book called "How Buildings Learn."
3
8000
3000
我曾经写过一本书，叫《建筑是如何学习的》
00:23
Today's event you might call "How Mountains Teach."
4
11000
4000
今天这一演讲你可以理解为“大山是怎么施教的”
00:27
A little background: For 10 years I've been trying to figure out how to
5
15000
2000
先谈一下一些背景：过去的十年，我一直琢磨着
00:29
hack civilization so that we can get long-term thinking
6
17000
5000
破解人类文明，使得我们能够有长远的思维
00:34
to be automatic and common instead of difficult and rare --
7
22000
4000
使得这样的思维方式成为常态，而不是这种艰难或根本就没有的思维
00:38
or in some cases, non-existent.
8
26000
3000
或者在某些情况下，它们就根本不存在
00:41
It would be helpful if humanity got into the habit of thinking
9
29000
5000
假如人类可以养成长线思考的习惯，那将是大好事
00:46
of the now not just as next week or next quarter, but you know,
10
34000
4000
就是说，现在不是指这个星期或下个季度
00:50
next 10,000 years and the last 10,000 years --
11
38000
4000
而是未来一万年以及过去的一万年
00:54
basically civilization's story so far.
12
42000
4000
那也是人类文明史所走过的时间
00:58
So we have the Long Now Foundation in San Francisco.
13
46000
2000
长久基金会就在旧金山
01:00
It's an incubator for about a dozen projects,
14
48000
2000
它是一系列项目的孵化器
01:02
all having to do with continuity over the long term.
15
50000
4000
这些项目都是与长线思考相关的项目
01:06
Our core project is a rather ambitious folly --
16
54000
5000
而我们的核心项目是一个相当宏伟的愚公移山式的工程
01:11
I suppose, a mythic undertaking: to build a 10,000-year clock
17
59000
5000
可以说是一个颇具神话色彩的项目吧，就是要建一个万年钟
01:16
that can really keep good time for that long a period.
18
64000
5000
一个可以一直很好记时的万年钟
01:21
And the design problems of a project like that are just absolutely delicious.
19
69000
7000
而这样一个计划所带来的设计难题也是相当迷人的
01:28
Go to the clock. And what we have here is something
20
76000
5000
好吧，先回到这个钟。
01:33
many of you saw here three years ago.
21
81000
2000
这里看到的其实你们很多人三年前已经看过
01:35
It's the first working prototype of the clock.
22
83000
2000
这是我们制作的第一个可以运行的万年钟模型
01:37
It's about nine feet high.
23
85000
1000
高九英尺
01:38
Designed by Danny Hillis and Alexander Rose. It's presently in London,
24
86000
5000
是由Danny Hillis以及Alexander Rose设计的，它现在放在伦敦
01:43
and is ticking away very deliberately at the science museum there.
25
91000
4000
就在科学博物馆里安静地行走着
01:47
So the design problem for today is going to be,
26
95000
4000
所以说，我们今天面临的设计上的难题是
01:51
how do you house an eventual monumental clock like this
27
99000
4000
怎样永久妥善的安放这样一个钟
01:55
so it can really tick, save time beautifully for 100 centuries?
28
103000
5000
使之可以在一万年之内都能平稳的运行，并准确的计时？
02:00
Well, this was the first solution.
29
108000
2000
这是第一个方案
02:02
Alexander Rose came up with this idea
30
110000
2000
Alexander Rose提出这个设想
02:04
of a spiraloid tower with continuous sloping ramps.
31
112000
5000
用一系列的斜坡做成一个螺旋型的塔
02:09
And it looked like a way to go, until you start thinking
32
117000
2000
这个想法似乎不错
02:11
about, what does deep time do to a building?
33
119000
3000
而一旦你想到长久时间对一座建筑带来的破坏时
02:14
Well, this is what deep time does to a building.
34
122000
3000
看，这就是长久时间对建筑带来的破坏
02:17
This is the Parthenon. It's only 2,450 years old,
35
125000
4000
这是帕提农神庙，它建成至今只有2450年之久
02:21
and look what happened to it.
36
129000
1000
看看它身上发生了什么
02:22
Here's a beautiful project. They really knew it'd last forever,
37
130000
3000
这是一个很美的工程 建筑者以为它可以永世长存
02:25
because they'd build it out of absolutely huge stones.
38
133000
4000
因为他们是用巨型的石块建成的
02:29
And now it's a pathetic ruin and no one even knows what it was used for.
39
137000
3000
现在看到的就只是一堆烂石 也没有人知道那里原来是用作何种用途的
02:32
That's what happens to buildings. They're vulnerable.
40
140000
3000
这就是建筑的命运 它们都是不堪岁月洗礼的
02:35
Even the most durable and intactable buildings,
41
143000
3000
即使是最为持久、最为坚固的建筑
02:38
like the pyramids of Giza, are in bad shape when you look up close.
42
146000
4000
比如吉萨城的金字塔，都已经满目仓荑
02:42
They've been looted inside and out.
43
150000
3000
盗墓者里里外外把坟墓淘空了
02:45
And they're built to protect things but they don't protect things.
44
153000
3000
这些建筑本来是用来保存东西的，但事实上它们起不到这个作用
02:48
So we got to thinking, if you can't put things safely in a building,
45
156000
4000
所以我们想，既然用建筑来放东西不是一个安稳的办法
02:52
where can you safely put them? We thought, OK, underground.
46
160000
3000
哪里才是好的存放地呢？我们想，不如放到地下？
02:55
How about underground with a view?
47
163000
3000
在地表上装一个观测的窗口？
02:58
Underground in a place that's really solid.
48
166000
2000
找一个相当坚固的地方。
03:00
So the obvious answer was, we need a mountain.
49
168000
4000
答案很明显，我们需要找到一座山
03:04
You don't want just any mountain.
50
172000
2000
并且不仅仅是一座山
03:06
You need absolutely the right mountain
51
174000
3000
我们需要合适的山
03:09
if you're going to have a clock for 10,000 years.
52
177000
2000
只有那样才能存放一个万年的钟
03:11
So here's an image of the long view of the search problem.
53
179000
5000
于是，我们又遇到了搜寻合适的地点的难题
03:16
And we got to thinking for various reasons it ought to be a desert mountain,
54
184000
4000
基于多方面的考虑，我们想到那必须是一个位于沙漠地带的山
03:20
so we got looking in the dry areas of the Southwest.
55
188000
3000
于是我们就到美国西南部的干旱地带搜寻
03:23
We looked at mesas in New Mexico.
56
191000
3000
我们看了新墨西哥州的山谷地
03:26
We were looking at dead volcanoes in Arizona.
57
194000
2000
看了亚利桑那州的死火山
03:28
Then Roger Kennedy, who was the director of the National Parks Service,
58
196000
3000
这时，国家公园服务处的Roger Kennedy找到我们
03:31
led us to Eastern Nevada,
59
199000
2000
把我们带到内华达州东部
03:33
to America's newest and oldest national park,
60
201000
3000
来到美国最年轻也最古老的国家公园
03:36
which is called Great Basin National Park.
61
204000
4000
那就是大盘地国家公园
03:40
It's right on the eastern border of Nevada.
62
208000
3000
就在内华达州东部的边界上
03:43
It's the highest range in the state -- over 13,000 feet.
63
211000
4000
那里是整个州最高的地方，有一万三千英尺高
03:47
And you'll notice that on the left, on the left, on the west, it's very steep,
64
215000
4000
你会看到，在左边，在西边，那里非常陡峭
03:51
and on the right it's gentle.
65
219000
3000
而在右边则非常缓和
03:54
This place is remote. It's over 200 miles from any major city.
66
222000
4000
这个地方相当偏僻，离最近的大城市都要200英里
03:58
It's nowhere near any Interstate or railroad.
67
226000
3000
旁边没有任何的州际公路或铁路
04:01
And it's -- the only thing that goes by is what's called
68
229000
4000
附近只有一个称之为
04:05
America's loneliest highway, U.S. 50.
69
233000
4000
美国50号公路，那是美国最寂寞的公路
04:09
Now, inside the yellow line here, on the right is -- that's all national park.
70
237000
5000
在这黄线里面，右边是国家公园
04:14
Inside the green line is national forest.
71
242000
3000
绿线里面就是国家森林
04:17
And then over to the left is Bureau of Land Management land and some private land.
72
245000
4000
左边是国土管理局以及其他私人领地
04:21
Now, as it happened, that two-mile-long strip right in the middle,
73
249000
3000
而刚好中间那一段两英里长的狭窄地带
04:24
this vertical, was available because it was private land.
74
252000
6000
这个竖状地带是私人领地，它可以出让
04:30
And thanks to Jay Walker who was here and Mitch Kapor who was here,
75
258000
4000
感谢Jay Walker以及Mitch Kapor，他们两个今天都在这里
04:34
who started the process, Long Now was able to get that two-mile-long strip of land.
76
262000
6000
这是在他们的支持下，我们得以启动这一项目，买下了这块地
04:40
And now let's look at the grand truth of what's there.
77
268000
3000
好吧，让我们看看那里到底有些什么吧
04:43
We're in Pole Canyon, looking west up the western escarpment
78
271000
4000
我们就在峡谷顶上，西边就是华盛顿山脉的悬崖
04:47
of Mount Washington, which is 11,600 feet on top.
79
275000
5000
那里的最高峰有11600英尺高
04:52
Those white cliffs are a dense Cambrian limestone.
80
280000
3000
那些悬崖都是由密集的寒武纪钟乳石构成的
04:55
That's a 2,000-foot thick formation,
81
283000
3000
有两千英尺厚
04:58
and it might be a beautiful place to hide a clock.
82
286000
5000
用来藏一个钟应该是不错的选择
05:03
It would be a pilgrimage to get to it; it would be a serious hike
83
291000
3000
人们要想去到那里的话，就须得像朝圣者那样徒步前往
05:06
to get up to where the clock is.
84
294000
3000
一步一步的攀上悬崖
05:09
So last June, the Long Now board, some staff and some donors
85
297000
5000
去年六月，长久基金会的董事会成员、一些职员以及捐赠者
05:14
and advisors, made a two-week expedition to the mountain
86
302000
5000
花了两周时间在那里考察
05:19
to explore it and investigate, one, if it's the right mountain,
87
307000
5000
一来是想知道那里是否真的合适
05:24
and two, if it's the right mountain, how it might actually work for us.
88
312000
4000
假如合适的话，我们可以怎么具体去开展这一项目
05:28
Now Danny Hillis sort of framed the problem.
89
316000
3000
Danny Hillis 尝试这样去解决这个问题
05:31
He has a theory of how the overall clock experience should work.
90
319000
3000
他提出了一套理论，向人们解释这一神秘的探访过程是怎么一回事
05:34
It's what he calls the seven stages of a mythic adventure.
91
322000
4000
他说，这一过程包括七个环节
05:38
It starts with the image. The image is a picture you have in your mind
92
326000
4000
一开始是一个图像，也就是在你头脑中形成的图像
05:42
of the goal at the end of the journey.
93
330000
2000
你想象着自己必须完成这一段旅程
05:44
In this case it might well be an image of the clock.
94
332000
3000
也许旅程的尽头就是一个钟在等着你
05:47
Then there's the point of embarkation, that is, the point of transition
95
335000
4000
而后就是出发，这就是行程的开始点
05:51
from ordinary life to being a pilgrim on a quest.
96
339000
4000
从平常的生活转变为求索的朝圣者
05:55
Then -- this is a nice image of it, there's the labyrinth.
97
343000
4000
而后呢，就是走进迷宫——这一点相当迷人
05:59
The labyrinth is a concept, it's like a twilight zone,
98
347000
4000
迷宫是一个概念，就有如一个幽暗地带
06:03
it's a place where it's difficult, where you get disoriented,
99
351000
3000
要走出非常艰难，你会迷路
06:06
maybe you get scared -- but you have to go through it
100
354000
3000
甚至会被吓坏了——但你必须要走过去
06:09
if you're going to get to some kind of deep reintegration.
101
357000
3000
假如你要获得某种深度的融合的话
06:12
Then there should always be in sight the draw --
102
360000
4000
再而后你肯定会看到
06:16
a kind of a beacon that draws you on through the labyrinth
103
364000
3000
像航标那样的东西，指引你走过重重的迷宫
06:19
to finish the process of getting there.
104
367000
3000
最终走出迷宫
06:22
Now Brian Eno, who's been in the thick of the Long Now process,
105
370000
3000
音乐家Brian Eno——他全程参与了长久基金会的这一项目
06:25
spent two years making a C.D. called "January 7003,"
106
373000
5000
花了两年时间制作了一张名为“7003的一月”的CD
06:30
and it's "Bell Studies for the Clock of the Long Now."
107
378000
3000
“关于万年钟的贝尔研究”
06:33
Based on -- parts of it are based on an algorithm that Danny Hillis developed,
108
381000
5000
其中一部分是根据Danny Hillis开创的算法制作的
06:38
so that a peal of 10 bells
109
386000
2000
十个铃组成一串
06:40
makes a different peal every day for 10,000 years.
110
388000
4000
万年钟在一万年的光阴里每天都可以发出不一样的系列钟声
06:44
The Hillis algorithm. 10 factorial gives you that number.
111
392000
4000
Hillis的算法可以通过指数10达到这一目的
06:48
And in fact, pretty soon we'll hear the sound.
112
396000
3000
我们马上就能听到这声音了
06:51
January 7003. There it is.
113
399000
4000
”7003的一月“。听
06:55
OK, back to Danny's list.
114
403000
2000
现在回到Danny Hillis那个七个环节
06:57
Number five of the seven is the payoff. This is it. The climax.
115
405000
4000
第五点是回报，就是它，最让人兴奋的时光
07:01
The goal. The main thing that you're trying to get to.
116
409000
4000
你到了终点了，到了你想去的地方
07:05
And then Danny says a really great journey will have a secret payoff.
117
413000
4000
Danny说这样一个伟大的旅途应该有一个神秘的收获的
07:09
Something you didn't expect that caps what you did expect.
118
417000
4000
那是你意想不到的收获
07:13
Then there's the return.
119
421000
2000
这就是你的收获
07:15
You've got to have a gradual return to the ordinary world,
120
423000
3000
你要慢慢的返回到平常世界
07:18
so you have time to assimilate what you've learned.
121
426000
4000
你才会慢慢的消化学到的东西
07:22
And then, how about a memento? Number seven.
122
430000
4000
然后呢，是不是应该有一个记念？第七个环节
07:26
At the end of it there's something physical,
123
434000
1000
到最后有一种物质的东西
07:27
a kind of reward that you take away.
124
435000
2000
一种你可以拿走的回报
07:29
It might be a piece of a core drill of the mountain.
125
437000
2000
也许是一件开山岩的钻头
07:31
Something that's just yours.
126
439000
3000
一件你自己的东西
07:34
How do you study a mountain
127
442000
3000
你如何去研究一座山？
07:37
for the kinds of things we're talking about?
128
445000
2000
研究刚才提到的那些特征？
07:39
This is not a normal building project.
129
447000
2000
这不是一个平常的建筑项目
07:41
What do you look for?
130
449000
1000
要注意些什么呢？
07:42
What are the elements that will most affect your ideas and decisions?
131
450000
6000
什么是最能影响你的思想与决定的？
07:48
Start with borders. If you look on the left side of the cliffs here,
132
456000
3000
我们从边界开始，假如你仔细看悬崖的左边
07:51
that's national park. That's sacrosanct --
133
459000
2000
那里是国家公园，是一 块神圣之地
07:53
you can't do anything with that. To the right of it is national forest.
134
461000
3000
这块地不能动用，右边则是国家森林
07:56
There's possibilities. The borders are important.
135
464000
3000
那里有可能（成为选址地），但是对边界必须非常小心
07:59
Other elements were mines, weather, approaches and elevation.
136
467000
8000
其他需要考虑的因素是矿井、天气、进去的难度以及攀登的高度
08:07
And especially trees. Look at those things up on top there.
137
475000
3000
还有特别要留意树。大家看看山顶上有些什么
08:10
It turns out that Mount Washington is covered with bristlecone pines.
138
478000
4000
事实上，华盛顿山脉上面覆盖了古刺果松
08:14
They're the world's oldest living thing.
139
482000
3000
它们是世界上现存的活下来的最古老的生物
08:17
People think they're just the size of shrubs, but that's not actually true.
140
485000
5000
人们以为它们只有灌木丛那么大小，其实不是
08:22
There are trees on that mountain that are 5,000 years old and still living.
141
490000
7000
那座山上有的树其树龄已达五千年了，还在生长着
08:29
The wood is so solid it's like stone, and it lasts for a long time.
142
497000
5000
这棵树的木质是如此坚固，简直有如石块，它已经久很长的时间了
08:34
So when you do tree ring studies of trunks that are on the mountain,
143
502000
4000
要是你对高山上的树进行年轮测试
08:38
some of them go back 10,000 years.
144
506000
3000
有些还可以追溯到上万年前呢
08:41
The stone itself is absolutely beautiful,
145
509000
2000
而这些“石头”本身也非常美丽
08:43
sculpted by millennia of very tough winters up there.
146
511000
4000
因为它们经历了千万年风雨的洗礼
08:47
We had tree ring analysts from the University of Arizona
147
515000
3000
亚利桑那大学对那里的树做了年轮测试
08:50
join us on the expedition.
148
518000
2000
他们跟我们一起去的
08:52
Now, if you guys have a pine cone handy,
149
520000
2000
好，假如你们手上有松塔的话
08:54
now's a good time to put it in your hand and feel it, especially on the end.
150
522000
5000
可以用手去摸摸它，特别是顶端。
08:59
That's interesting.
151
527000
2000
很有趣的
09:01
You'll find out why it's called a bristlecone pine. A little sensory experience.
152
529000
6000
你可以体会到它为何叫古刺果松了，你能感觉到的
09:07
Here's Danny Hillis in the midst of a bristlecone pine forest
153
535000
5000
图片上那个就是Danny Hillis，它就在一片古刺果松林里
09:12
on Long Now land. I should say that the age of bristlecones
154
540000
5000
在这块万年钟的土地上，我应该提起这一树种的树龄测算
09:17
was discovered, led by a theory.
155
545000
3000
它是由一个理论推导出来的
09:20
Edmund Schulman in the 1950s
156
548000
2000
Edmund Schulman在1950年代
09:22
had been studying trees under great stress at Timberline,
157
550000
4000
他在Timberline公司用高压研究这些树木
09:26
and came to the realization that he put in an article in Science magazine
158
554000
3000
最后推出一理论，在《科学》杂志上写一文章公布其结果。
09:29
called, "Longevity under Adversity in Conifers."
159
557000
6000
题为“困厄铸就长寿——针叶树的研究”
09:35
And then, based on that principle, he started looking around
160
563000
3000
他起初按照这一理论原理，对该地的周围进行研究
09:38
at the various trees at Timberline,
161
566000
2000
在Timerline公司研究各样的树种
09:40
and realized that the bristlecone pines --
162
568000
2000
结果发现这种古刺果松
09:42
he found some in the White Mountains that were over 4,000 years old.
163
570000
5000
他在怀特山脉发现的这种树有大约4000年的树龄
09:47
Longevity under adversity is a pretty interesting design principle in its own right.
164
575000
5000
“困厄出长寿”本身也是一个很有趣的设计法则
09:52
OK, onto the mines. The first asking price for the property
165
580000
4000
好，我们再看看矿井。最初 是以土地要价
09:56
when we looked at it in 1998 was one billion dollars for 180 acres and a couple of mines.
166
584000
10000
1998年我们第一次去看的时候，那里的要价是十亿美元可以买180英亩的地以及少许的矿井
10:06
Because the owner said, "There's one billion dollars of beryllium in that mountain."
167
594000
4000
因为土地的主人说地里有价值十亿的铍
10:10
And we said, "Wow, that's great. Listen, we'll counter. How about zero?
168
598000
5000
我们说，太棒了——我们能不能以零价购买，我们不要那些矿藏？
10:15
(Laughter)
169
603000
2000
（笑声）
10:17
And we're a non-profit foundation, you can give us the property
170
605000
4000
我们是一个非牟利的基金会，你可以直接把地给我们啊
10:21
and take a hell of a tax deduction.
171
609000
3000
还能减免一大笔的税金呢
10:24
(Laughter)
172
612000
3000
（笑声）
10:27
All you have to do is prove to the government it's worth a billion dollars."
173
615000
3000
只要你能向政府证明那块地值十亿就行了
10:30
Well, a few years went by and there was some kind of back and forth,
174
618000
2000
又过了几年，我们之间也有一些往复
10:32
and by and by, thanks to Mitch and Jay,
175
620000
2000
最后，在Mitch Kapor和Jay的帮助下
10:34
we were able to buy the whole property for 140,000 dollars.
176
622000
5000
我们最终以14万美金买下了这块地
10:39
This is one of the mines. It doesn't have any beryllium in it.
177
627000
4000
这是其中一个矿井，里面根本就没有铍
10:43
It's called the Pole Adit. And it does have tungsten,
178
631000
4000
它叫Pole Adit，里面有钨矿
10:47
a little bit of tungsten, left over, that's the kind of mine it was.
179
635000
3000
不过仅仅是一点点遗留下来的，这就是它的模样
10:50
But it goes a mile-and-a-half in a straight line,
180
638000
2000
它里面有一段是长达1.5英里的直线距离
10:52
due east into the range, into very interesting territory -- except that,
181
640000
6000
一直延伸到东部，去到一个非常有趣的地方
10:58
as you'll see when we go inside in a minute,
182
646000
3000
我们去到里面你就可以看得到
11:01
we were hoping for limestone but in there is just shale.
183
649000
4000
本希望看到钟乳石的，可惜只是看得到页岩
11:05
And shale is not quite completely competent rock.
184
653000
3000
页岩又不是很坚固的石块
11:08
Competent rock is rock that will hold itself up without any shoring.
185
656000
4000
坚固的石块是不需要任何的外物支撑即可树在那里的
11:12
The shale would like some shoring,
186
660000
2000
而页岩则是需要一些支撑的
11:14
and so parts of it are caved in in there.
187
662000
2000
它的有些部分是深深陷入洞里的
11:16
That's Ben Roberts from -- he's the bat specialist from the National Park.
188
664000
4000
这是Ben Roberts，他是国家公园的蝙蝠专家
11:20
But there are many wonders back in there, like this weird fungus
189
668000
4000
里面还有很多奇异的东西，比如这个真菌
11:24
on some of the collapsed timbers.
190
672000
2000
它就生长在一个枯萎的木头上
11:26
OK, here's another mine that's up on top of the property,
191
674000
4000
这是另外一个矿井，它在山上
11:30
and it dates back to 1870.
192
678000
2000
它的历史可以追溯到 1870年
11:32
That's what the property was originally built around --
193
680000
2000
那是这块土地最初开发的时间
11:34
it was a set of mining claims. It was a very productive silver mine.
194
682000
5000
很多矿井项目都在这里开始，那是一个高产的银矿
11:39
In fact, it was the highest-operating mine in Nevada,
195
687000
3000
事实上，它是内华达州海拔最高的作业矿井
11:42
and it ran year round.
196
690000
2000
一年到头都在开工
11:44
You can imagine what it was like in the winter at 10,000 feet.
197
692000
3000
你可以想象在冬季的时候在一万英尺的地方工作是怎么样的感觉
11:47
You may recognize a couple of the miners there.
198
695000
3000
你也许认识开矿的几位探险者
11:50
There's Jeff Bezos on the right and Paul Saville on the left looking for galena,
199
698000
6000
右边是 Jeff Bezos 左边是 Paul Saville ，他们正在找方铅矿
11:56
which is the lead-silver thing. They didn't find any.
200
704000
5000
可是找不到
12:01
They both kept their day jobs. Here's the last mine.
201
709000
5000
他们白天都有工作，这是最后一个矿井
12:06
It's called the Bonanza Adit. It's down in a canyon.
202
714000
2000
它叫Bonanza Adit，是在峡谷底下的
12:08
And Alexander Rose on the left there worked with a bunch of people
203
716000
4000
左边是Alexander Rose，他在和来自国家公园的人员
12:12
from the National Park to survey the whole mine. It's a mile deep.
204
720000
3000
一起探测整个矿井，那里有一英里深
12:15
And they also found four species of bats in there.
205
723000
3000
他们在那还发现了四个种类的蝙蝠
12:18
Now, almost all those mines, by the way, meet underneath the mountain.
206
726000
4000
现在，几乎所有的这些矿井都会聚在山底之下
12:22
They don't quite, but it's something to think about.
207
730000
3000
这是值得思考的地方
12:25
They don't quite meet.
208
733000
2000
它们没有完全的汇聚
12:27
Let's go to weather. Mountains specialize in interesting weather.
209
735000
6000
再看看天气吧。山间的天气都很特别
12:33
Way more interesting than Monterey even today.
210
741000
3000
比蒙特雷的天气有意思多了
12:36
And so one Tuesday morning last June, there we were.
211
744000
3000
去年六月的一个星期二，我们在那里的时候
12:39
Woke up in the morning -- the mountain was covered with snow.
212
747000
3000
早上醒来，山顶上盖满了积雪
12:42
That was a great time to go up and visit our weather station which again,
213
750000
4000
那天我们登上山顶去看我们的气候站，一路真是棒极了。
12:46
thanks to Mitch Kapor, we're building up there.
214
754000
3000
气象站是Mitch Kapor赞助下建起来的
12:49
And it's a pretty interesting scene.
215
757000
3000
那里的风景也很美
12:52
This is, on the left there, the joyful lady is Pat Irwin,
216
760000
3000
左边这位很快活的女士是 Pat Irwin
12:55
who's the regional head of the National Forest Service,
217
763000
3000
她是国家森林服务的地区主管
12:58
and they gave us the temporary use permit to be there.
218
766000
4000
他们允许我们短暂的使用那块地
13:02
We want a temporary use permit for the clock, eventually --
219
770000
2000
我们希望获得一个短期的土地使用许可，结果是
13:04
10,000-year temporary use permit.
220
772000
2000
一个时间为一万年的短期使用许可
13:06
(Laughter)
221
774000
2000
（笑声）
13:08
The weather station's pretty interesting.
222
776000
2000
气象站是很有趣的
13:10
Kurt Bollacker and Alexander Rose designed a radically wireless station.
223
778000
4000
Kurt Bollacker 和 Alexander Rose 设计了一个无线的气象站
13:14
It runs on solar, and it sends a signal
with that antenna
with that antenna
224
782000
3000
通过太阳能驱动，数据通过天线发送
13:17
and bounces it off of micrometeorite trails in the atmosphere
225
785000
6000
信号通过天际间的彗星折射回来
13:23
to a place in Bozeman, Montana, where the data is taken down
226
791000
4000
在蒙特那州的伯兹曼数据中心接收到信号
13:27
and then sent through landlines to San Francisco,
227
795000
3000
然后经由地面网络将数据传送到旧金山
13:30
where we put the data in real time up on our website.
228
798000
4000
在那我们在网上公布实时数据
13:34
And there you see a week of weather at 9,400 feet on Mount Washington.
229
802000
6000
所以你可以在网站上看到高达94000英尺的华盛顿山山顶最近一周的天气变化
13:40
Let's go to approaches.
230
808000
3000
好吧，再看看有些什么样的途径可以去到那里
13:43
As it happens, there are no trails anywhere on Mount Washington,
231
811000
4000
事实是，没有任何行路迹可以走到华盛顿山
13:47
just a few old mining roads like this,
232
815000
2000
只有一些像这样的很老的矿井路
13:49
so you have to bushwhack everywhere.
233
817000
1000
所以说去到任何一个地方都要在丛林中开路
13:50
But there's no bears, and there's no poison oak,
234
818000
4000
但没有熊，也没有毒橡木树
13:54
and there's basically no people because this place has been empty for a long time.
235
822000
6000
也没有人，因为这里的人很久之前就迁走了
14:00
You can hike for days and not encounter anybody.
236
828000
3000
你也许一连走了几天也不会遇上一个人
14:03
Well, here's a potential approach.
237
831000
2000
这里是一个可行的路径
14:05
You need to come up the Lincoln Canyon.
238
833000
3000
你要来到林肯峡谷
14:08
It's this beautiful world all of its own, surrounded by cliffs,
239
836000
3000
那里本身就很美，四周是悬崖削壁
14:11
and it's an easy hike to stroll up the canyon bottom,
240
839000
4000
有一条捷径在峡谷底部很轻松的行走
14:15
until you get to this barrier, and it actually presents a problem.
241
843000
7000
但是，当你来到这里的时候，就碰上了一个难题了
14:22
So you can scratch Lincoln Canyon as an approach.
242
850000
5000
你可以选择从头绕过林肯峡谷作为一条路径
14:27
Another possible approach is right up the western front of the mountain.
243
855000
3000
另一种可能是从山的西边上去
14:30
You can see why we sometimes call it Long Mountain.
244
858000
3000
你也可以理解为何我们称之为长山脉
14:33
And from where you're standing at 6,000 feet in the valley,
245
861000
3000
站在海拔六千英尺高的峡谷上
14:36
it's an easy hike up to the mature pinyon and juniper forest
246
864000
3000
很轻松的就能徒步走到矮松以及针叶松地带
14:39
through that knoll at the front at 7,600 feet.
247
867000
2000
就是通过7600英尺处的一个小丘
14:41
And you can carry right on up through meadows
248
869000
3000
可以继续沿着草地走
14:44
and steepening forest to the high base of the cliffs at 10,500 feet,
249
872000
5000
经过一段陡林来到一万零五百英尺高处悬崖上的基地
14:49
where there's a bit of a problem.
250
877000
3000
可到了这里又有问题了
14:52
Now, Jeff Bezos advised us when he left at the end of the expedition,
251
880000
5000
Jeff Bezos离开我们这个探险队的时候说
14:57
"Make the clock inaccessible.
252
885000
4000
“要让万年钟无路可达
15:01
The harder it is to get to, the more people will value it."
253
889000
4000
越是难以到达，人们越是 会珍视它的价值”
15:05
And check -- those are 600-foot vertical walls there.
254
893000
5000
好，看这里——这就有600英尺高的垂直峭壁
15:10
So Alexander Rose wanted to explore this route,
255
898000
5000
Alexander Rose想试一试攀上去
15:15
and he started over here on the left from his pickup truck
256
903000
4000
他从停泊卡车的左方开始
15:19
at 8,900 feet and headed up the mountain.
257
907000
3000
那里海拔8900英尺
15:22
Now, as you gain elevation your IQ goes down --
258
910000
4000
但是我们知道，去到海拔越高的地方，人的IQ也会随之下降
15:26
(Laughter)
259
914000
2000
（笑声）
15:28
but your emotional affect goes up,
260
916000
2000
但是你的情绪会高涨起来
15:30
which is great for having a mythic experience,
261
918000
3000
这对于探秘之旅而言是有益的
15:33
whether you want to or not.
262
921000
2000
不管你自身是否愿意
15:35
In fact, Danny Hillis can estimate altitude
263
923000
3000
当时，Danny Hillis还能估算高度
15:38
by how much math he can't do in his head.
264
926000
3000
靠他不能用他的大脑来进行计算的程度
15:41
(Laughter)
265
929000
3000
（笑声）
15:44
Now, I happened to be on the radio with Alexander
266
932000
2000
我曾经和Alexander出现在电台节目上
15:46
when he got to this point at the base of the cliffs, and he said, quote,
267
934000
5000
当他到达悬崖之基部这一点的时候，他说
15:51
"There's a hidden notch. I think I can get up a ways."
268
939000
5000
“那里有个隐秘的V形口，我想我可以通过那里上去的”
15:56
Now, he's a rock climber, but you know, he's our executive director.
269
944000
4000
他会攀岩，同时也是我们的项目执行总监
16:00
I don't want him killed. I know he's going to love cliffs.
270
948000
2000
我不希望他就此送命，因为我知道他很热爱那项运动
16:02
I'm saying, "Be careful, be careful, be careful."
271
950000
3000
我说，“你要小心、小心、再小心啊”
16:05
Then he starts going up, and the next thing I hear is,
272
953000
3000
他就这样上去了，我接着就听到
16:08
"I'm half-way up. It's like climbing stairs. I'm going up 60 degrees.
273
956000
6000
“我爬到一半距离了，简直跟爬楼梯没什么两样，我还是沿着60度角爬的呢”
16:14
It's a secret passage. It's like something from Tolkien."
274
962000
4000
这里是一个秘密的通道，就像是托尔金小说里描写的那样“
16:18
And I'm going, "Careful, careful. Please be careful."
275
966000
3000
我接着说：“你小心点，小心点，求你小心点！”
16:21
And then, of course, the next thing I hear is,
276
969000
1000
接下来我听到的是
16:22
"I've made it to the top. You can see all of creation from up here."
277
970000
3000
“我到山顶了，在这里你可以看到造化的万物啊！”
16:25
And he dashed across the top of the mountains.
278
973000
3000
他在山顶上狂奔
16:28
In fact, there he is. That's Alexander Rose.
279
976000
2000
看，那个就是他
16:30
First ascent of the western face to Mount Washington,
280
978000
3000
他是第一个从西侧登上华盛顿山山顶的
16:33
and a solo ascent at that.
281
981000
4000
并且完全是一个人完成的
16:37
This discovery changed everything about our sense of these cliffs
282
985000
3000
这一发现完全改变了我们对于那些悬崖的看法
16:40
and what to do with them.
283
988000
2000
以及我们对待它们的态度
16:42
We realized that we had to name this thing that Alexander discovered.
284
990000
4000
我们觉得有必要给这个Alexander发现的东西命名
16:46
How about Zander's Crevice? No.
285
994000
4000
是不是叫桑德缝隙呢？不好
16:50
(Laughter)
286
998000
4000
（笑声）
16:54
So we finally decided on Alexander's Siq.
287
1002000
3000
最后我们决定将其以Alexander命名
16:57
Zander's Siq is named after -- some of you have been to Petra,
288
1005000
3000
桑德缝隙——假如你去过Petra的话
17:00
there's this wonderful slot canyon that leads into Petra
289
1008000
4000
那里是一个非常美丽的狭长地带，它通向Petra
17:04
called the Siq, and so this is the Siq.
290
1012000
2000
名字叫Siq，这就是
17:06
And it really is hidden. I can't find it in this image,
291
1014000
3000
它真的是隐藏起来的，在地图上看不到的
17:09
and I'm not sure you can.
292
1017000
1000
不知你们能否找到
17:10
Only when you get fresh snow can you see just along the rim there,
293
1018000
4000
只有等到雪后刚过的时候，你才会看到这种轮缘
17:14
and that brings it out.
294
1022000
2000
这时它才能被发现
17:16
Now, Danny and I were up at this same area one day,
295
1024000
2000
有一天，Danny和我到了同一个地方
17:18
and Danny looked over to the right
296
1026000
2000
Danny看了看右手边
17:20
and noticed something halfway up the cliffs,
297
1028000
3000
看到悬崖的半空中
17:23
which is a kind of a porch or a cliff shelf with bristlecones on it,
298
1031000
4000
那里就是如一个小平面，上面有些古勒果松
17:27
and supposed that people going up to the clock inside the mountain
299
1035000
4000
设想一下，假如有人从山里面去寻找万年钟
17:31
could come out onto that shelf and look down at the view.
300
1039000
4000
他们可能来到这里，并且被那松树吸引探出头来
17:35
And the people toiling up the mountain could see them,
301
1043000
3000
那些想登到山顶的人能看得到他们
17:38
these tiny little people up there, incredibly halfway up the cliff.
302
1046000
3000
这些看上去很小的人在那里，就悬在半空
17:41
How did they get there? Do I have to do that?
303
1049000
3000
他们是怎么去到那里的？我是不是也要那样做？
17:44
And so that maybe becomes part of the draw and part of the labyrinth.
304
1052000
3000
那也许就是万年钟带给游人的吸引力与神秘感之一
17:47
You can get another angle on Danny's porch
305
1055000
4000
这里是另一个视角
17:51
by going around to the south and looking north at the whole formation there.
306
1059000
7000
绕到是南部，然后向北部去看整个山景
17:58
And you need to know that Danny's clock is to be kept accurate
307
1066000
3000
要知道，Danny的钟是要校对准时的
18:01
by a ray of sunshine, that perfect noon hitting it every sunny day,
308
1069000
5000
这依靠每个晴天正好在中午的太阳光照射
18:06
and the pulse of heat from that sets off a solar trigger
309
1074000
3000
那样一股热就足以驱动一个太阳能的控制器
18:09
which resets the clock to make it perfectly accurate.
310
1077000
3000
那个装置就会把时间调整过来，使时间完全正确
18:12
So even with the slowing of the rotation of the earth and so on,
311
1080000
2000
所以即使地球自转速度变慢了
18:14
the clock will keep perfectly good time.
312
1082000
3000
那个钟依然会准时的
18:17
So here we're looking from the south, look north.
313
1085000
2000
这是从南部、从北部望过去的照片
18:19
This is all Forest Service land. If you go up on top of those cliffs,
314
1087000
4000
这里是森林植被的领地。假如你登上这些悬崖的顶端
18:23
that's some of the Long Now land in those trees.
315
1091000
3000
会看到在森林中的长久基金会基地
18:26
And if you go up there and look back, then you'll get a sense of
316
1094000
5000
假如你再往上走，回头来看，你会体会到
18:31
what the view starts to be like from the top of the mountain.
317
1099000
3000
“一览众山小”的感觉
18:34
That's the long view. That's 80 miles to the horizon.
318
1102000
4000
这就是长距离的视野。这里离地平线有八万英里
18:38
And that's also timberline and those bristlecones really are shrubs.
319
1106000
4000
这也是林木线所在，这里的古勒果松则确实是灌木
18:42
That's a different place to be. It's 11,400 feet and it's exquisite.
320
1110000
8000
那是很不一样的地方。那里高11400英尺，景色非常壮观
18:50
Now, if you go over to the right from this image to looking at the edge of the cliffs,
321
1118000
4000
假如你仔细看这幅图的右边，特别是悬崖的边缘
18:54
it's 600 foot, just about a yard to the left of Kurt Bollacker's foot,
322
1122000
4000
有600英尺高，在Kurt Bollacker腿左边一步之遥
18:58
there is a 600-foot drop. He's ambling on over to Zander's Siq.
323
1126000
5000
600英尺垂直落下，他正慢慢的走到桑德缝隙 边上
19:03
That's what it looks like looking down it.
324
1131000
4000
往下看的时候就是这个样子
19:07
We should probably put in a rail or something.
325
1135000
4000
我想我们也许应该在那里放一围栏或之类的东西
19:11
Over on the eastern side it's gentle, as you can see.
326
1139000
4000
山的东峦则相对平缓得多
19:15
And that's not snow -- that's what the white limestone looks like.
327
1143000
3000
注意，那可不是雪，而是白色的钟乳石
19:18
You also see there a bighorn sheep.
328
1146000
4000
你还能看到一只长着很长的棱角的绵羊
19:22
Their herd was reintroduced from Wyoming.
329
1150000
3000
这些是从怀俄明州重新引进过来的
19:25
And they're doing pretty well, but they've got a bit of trouble.
330
1153000
3000
它们在这边过得挺好的，但它现处于困难的境地
19:28
This is Danny Hillis, and he's figuring out a design problem.
331
1156000
3000
Danny Hillis正在那里寻找着一个设计问题的答案
19:31
he's trying to determine if where he is on a bit of Long Now land
332
1159000
5000
他在想那里算不算是长久基金会的地
19:36
would appear from down in the valley to be the actual peak of the mountain.
333
1164000
6000
看起来从峡谷底下算起都是山顶
19:42
because the real peak is hidden around the corner.
334
1170000
2000
因为真正的山顶是在一个隐蔽的角落里的
19:44
This is what in the infantry we used to call the military crest.
335
1172000
4000
我们过去在部队里管那叫部队峰顶
19:48
And as it turned out the answer is, yes,
336
1176000
3000
这个问题的答案是肯定的
19:51
that is from down below in the valley it does look like the peak,
337
1179000
4000
从峡谷深处望出来可以看到，这一块还是山峰
19:55
and that might be conjured with.
338
1183000
2000
是人的视觉错误而已
19:57
We gradually realized we have three serious design domains to work on with this.
339
1185000
5000
所以我们在这里就遇到了三个设计难题
20:02
One is the experience of the mountain.
340
1190000
2000
一是关于高山的体验
20:04
Another is the experience in the mountain.
341
1192000
3000
二是山里头的体验
20:07
And the third is the experience from the mountain,
342
1195000
3000
第三个就是来自高山的体验
20:10
which is really dominated by the view shed
343
1198000
3000
第三点完全受到峡谷底下狭隘的观察视角的局限
20:13
of the spring valley there behind Danny,
344
1201000
4000
Danny 后面是河溪谷
20:17
and if you look off to the right, out there,
345
1205000
2000
要是你往右边看
20:19
15 miles across to the Schell Creek range.
346
1207000
4000
在离斯耐尔小溪 15英里以外的地方
20:23
In the front, there are 10 ranches strung right along the base of the mountains
347
1211000
3000
可以看到在大山脚下散布着10个农场
20:26
using the water from the mountains.
348
1214000
2000
其水源就来自于山间
20:28
In fact, there are artesian wells where water springs right into the air.
349
1216000
5000
在那你甚至还能看到地下水崩涌而出呢
20:33
One of the ranches is called the Kirkeby Ranch,
350
1221000
3000
其中一个农场叫Kirkeby农场
20:36
and I'll take you there for a minute.
351
1224000
2000
等下就会介绍
20:38
It's a very nice ranch.
352
1226000
2000
那里很漂亮
20:40
Alfalfa and cattle, run by Paul and Ronnie Brenham,
353
1228000
5000
处处都能看到紫花苜蓿和奶牛的踪迹，它是由Paul 和Ronnie Brenham共同经营的
20:45
and it's pretty idyllic. It's also hard work.
354
1233000
5000
田园风光很美，但他们干这活也是挺辛苦的
20:50
And most of these ranches are having trouble keeping going.
355
1238000
2000
很多农场存在着维持下去的难题
20:52
This is their view to the west of the Schell Creek range.
356
1240000
4000
这是从农场上看斯耐尔小溪之西岸景色
20:56
And if you go out to that line of trees at the far end,
357
1244000
3000
假如你去到远方的树林边
20:59
you'll see what the valley used to look like.
358
1247000
4000
还能看得到过去的峡谷是怎样的
21:03
This is Rocky Mountain junipers that have been there for thousands of years.
359
1251000
5000
这是刺柏，它们长在洛基山已有数千年时间了
21:08
And a scheme emerged that Long Now is looking to see
360
1256000
3000
长久基金会正在考虑是否有可能买下
21:11
if it might be possible to buy up the whole valley,
361
1259000
3000
这个峡谷地区的整一块地
21:14
because those 10 ranches with their 17,000 acres
362
1262000
4000
因为那十个农场包括17000英亩的土地
21:18
dominate a 500 square mile valley with their grazing allotments and so on,
363
1266000
5000
覆盖了500平方英里的矿区峡谷
21:23
and there's a possibility that you could get the whole thing
364
1271000
3000
我们认为有可能用五百万美金买下这里整一块地
21:26
for five million dollars and gradually restore it to its wild condition,
365
1274000
4000
而后使其逐步恢复到原貌
21:30
and somewhere in the process turn it back over to the National Park,
366
1278000
4000
在适当的时候，将其转变为国家公园
21:34
and it would double the size of Great Basin National Park. That would be swell.
367
1282000
4000
这样就可以使得大盘地国家公园的面积增加一倍。那就太棒了
21:38
OK, let's take one more look at the mountain itself.
368
1286000
3000
好吧，我们再看看这大山一眼吧
21:41
The clock experience should be profound,
369
1289000
4000
这样一个探寻万年钟的过程应该是能够给人带来深刻体会的
21:45
but from the outside it should be invisible.
370
1293000
4000
可是，人们在外面是不会体验到这点的
21:49
Now, at the base of the high cliffs there's this natural cave.
371
1297000
4000
在悬崖的底部，有一个天然的洞穴
21:53
It's only about 12 feet deep, but what if it were deepened from inside?
372
1301000
4000
只有12英尺深 但里面是否曾经是深拓过？
21:57
You excavated from somewhere, came up from inside and deepened it.
373
1305000
3000
你可以自己去开掘，走到里头去，接着深挖
22:00
And then you could have an entrance
374
1308000
1000
你可能找到一个出口
22:01
which was very rough and narrow as you first went in,
375
1309000
3000
一开始的时候很简陋
22:04
that gradually becomes more refined and then actually quite exquisite.
376
1312000
4000
可是慢慢的会变得更光滑更具美感
22:08
And this stone takes a perfect polish.
377
1316000
3000
这块石头则显然被很多人踩过
22:11
You'd have a polished set of passages and chambers in there
378
1319000
5000
你要经过很多关才能最终去到
22:16
eventually leading to the 10,000 year clock.
379
1324000
4000
万年钟所在地
22:20
And it's not a mine. This would be a nuanced evocation
380
1328000
4000
这里不是一个矿井，这是一个精心设计的鬼魂召唤,
22:24
of the basic structure of the mountain,
381
1332000
3000
基于这座大山的基本结构
22:27
and you would be appreciating it as much from inside as you do from outside.
382
1335000
3000
到了里面，你的欣赏感觉决不亚于在外面对大山的欣赏
22:30
This is architecture not made by building,
383
1338000
3000
这样的建筑艺术是大楼所做不到的
22:33
but by what you very carefully take away.
384
1341000
4000
是你非常仔细的开发过程中才能达到的
22:37
So that's what the mountain taught us.
385
1345000
3000
这就是大山带给我们的智慧
22:40
Most of the amazingness of the clock
386
1348000
3000
万年钟最迷人的地方
22:43
we can borrow from the amazingness of the mountain.
387
1351000
4000
也是借由神秘大山才得以体现
22:47
All we have to do is highlight its spectacular features and blend in with them.
388
1355000
4000
我们所做的，就是勾勒出其壮观的部分，并使之与大山相溶
22:51
It's not a clock in a mountain -- it's a mountain clock.
389
1359000
5000
这不是一个大山里的时钟，而是一个以大山为主体的时钟
22:56
Now, the Tewa Indians in the Southwest have a saying
390
1364000
2000
西南方土著特瓦族印第安人这么一句谚语：
22:58
for what you need to do when you want to think long term about anything.
391
1366000
6000
你要做事之时应该考虑到长远的未来，
23:04
They say, "pin peya obe" -- welcome to the mountain.
392
1372000
7000
土著语是 "pin peya obe" -- 欢迎来到大山
23:11
Thank you.
393
1379000
2000
谢谢大家
23:13
(Applause)
394
1381000
5000
（鼓掌）
ABOUT THE SPEAKER
Stewart Brand - Environmentalist, futuristSince the counterculture '60s, Stewart Brand has been creating our internet-worked world. Now, with biotech accelerating four times faster than digital technology, Stewart Brand has a bold new plan ...
Why you should listen
With biotech accelerating four times faster than digital technology, the revival of extinct species is becoming possible. Stewart Brand plans to not only bring species back but restore them to the wild.
Brand is already a legend in the tech industry for things he’s created: the Whole Earth Catalog, The WELL, the Global Business Network, the Long Now Foundation, and the notion that “information wants to be free.” Now Brand, a lifelong environmentalist, wants to re-create -- or “de-extinct” -- a few animals that’ve disappeared from the planet.
Granted, resurrecting the woolly mammoth using ancient DNA may sound like mad science. But Brand’s Revive and Restore project has an entirely rational goal: to learn what causes extinctions so we can protect currently endangered species, preserve genetic and biological diversity, repair depleted ecosystems, and essentially “undo harm that humans have caused in the past.”
Stewart Brand | Speaker | TED.com