TED2013
Sebastião Salgado: The silent drama of photography
Sebastião Salgado: 攝影的默劇
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經濟學博士Sebastião Salgado在他30多歲的時候才開始接觸攝影，從此瘋狂的迷上了攝影。這麼多年，他記錄了世界上的人性，死亡，毀滅，腐朽。在這裡他與我們分享一段影響他極深的私人經驗，從他差點因為攝影死去，到他最近令人窒息的作品《起源》，記錄了世界上被人遺忘的角落和人們。
Sebastião Salgado - Photojournalist
Sebastião Salgado captures the dignity of the dispossessed through large-scale, long-term projects. Full bio
Sebastião Salgado captures the dignity of the dispossessed through large-scale, long-term projects. Full bio
Double-click the English transcript below to play the video.
00:13
I'm not sure that every person here
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我不確定在座的各位
00:15
is familiar with my pictures.
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是否熟悉我的作品。
00:18
I want to start to show just a few pictures to you,
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我想先向你們展示幾幅作品
00:22
and after I'll speak.
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然後我再接著說。
00:57
I must speak to you a little bit of my history,
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我必須介紹一下我的生平，
01:01
because we'll be speaking on this
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因為在接下來的演講中
01:03
during my speech here.
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我們會談到它。
01:06
I was born in 1944 in Brazil,
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1944年我出生於巴西，
01:09
in the times that Brazil was not yet a market economy.
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當時的巴西尚未施行市場經濟
01:13
I was born on a farm,
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我出生在農場，
01:15
a farm that was more than 50 percent rainforest [still].
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農場至少有一半的土地是雨林【現在仍然是】。
01:20
A marvelous place.
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很美的地方。
01:21
I lived with incredible birds, incredible animals,
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我和珍禽奇獸一起生活，
01:25
I swam in our small rivers with our caimans.
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我和凱門鱷在小河中嬉戲。
01:30
It was about 35 families that lived on this farm,
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農場裡大約有35戶人家，
01:33
and everything that we produced on this farm, we consumed.
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我們自給自足。
01:37
Very few things went to the market.
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幾乎不向市場供給。
01:39
Once a year, the only thing that went to the market
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一年中唯一的一次供給
01:42
was the cattle that we produced,
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是我們飼養的牛。
01:43
and we made trips of about 45 days
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我們要花45天的時間
01:46
to reach the slaughterhouse,
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才能到達屠宰場，
01:48
bringing thousands of head of cattle,
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趕着上千頭牛
01:51
and about 20 days traveling back
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然後再花20天的時間返回
01:53
to reach our farm again.
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到達我們的農場。
01:56
When I was 15 years old,
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我15歲的時候，
01:58
it was necessary for me to leave this place
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差不多是要離這個地方的時候了
02:01
and go to a town a little bit bigger -- much bigger --
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去一個大一點的小鎮，其實大很多
02:05
where I did the second part of secondary school.
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我在那裡完成了中學的後半部分的學業。
02:08
There I learned different things.
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我在那裡學到了很多。
02:11
Brazil was starting to urbanize, industrialize,
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巴西開始邁向城市化和工業化，
02:14
and I knew the politics. I became a little bit radical,
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我了解當時的政治。我變的有點激進，
02:18
I was a member of leftist parties,
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我是一名左翼份子，
02:21
and I became an activist.
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接著我變成一名活躍人士。
02:24
I [went to] university to become an economist.
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我想成為一名經濟學家，所以我上了大學。
02:27
I [did] a master's degree in economics.
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並且我拿到了經濟學碩士學位。
02:30
And the most important thing in my life
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而我人生中最重要的一件事
02:33
also happened in this time.
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也在那時發生。
02:35
I met an incredible girl
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我遇見了一位非常非常棒的女孩
02:37
who became my lifelong best friend,
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她成為我的人生伴侶，
02:41
and my associate in everything that I have done till now,
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她參與我到現在為止做的所有事情，
02:45
my wife, Lélia Wanick Salgado.
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我的妻子，Lélia Wanick Salgado.
02:48
Brazil radicalized very strongly.
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當時，巴西非常的激進。
02:50
We fought very hard against the dictatorship,
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我們和當時的獨裁進行了艱苦的鬥爭
02:53
in a moment it was necessary to us:
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就在那時，我們必須要：
02:55
Either go into clandestinity with weapons in hand,
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武裝起來，秘密活動
02:59
or leave Brazil. We were too young,
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或者離開巴西。我們當時太年輕，
03:01
and our organization thought it was better for us to go out,
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我們的組織以為離開是最好的選擇，
03:06
and we went to France,
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所以我們去了法國，
03:07
where I did a PhD in economics,
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我在那裡拿到了經濟學的博士學位，
03:09
Léila became an architect.
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Léila 成為一名建築師。
03:11
I worked after for an investment bank.
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我在一家投資銀行工作。
03:14
We made a lot of trips, financed development,
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我們經常出差，協同世界銀行
03:17
economic projects in Africa with the World Bank.
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在非洲建設金融項目。
03:20
And one day photography made a total invasion in my life.
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有一天，攝影闖進，並完全佔據了我的生活。
03:24
I became a photographer,
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我成為了一名攝影師，
03:25
abandoned everything and became a photographer,
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放棄了當時擁有的一切，
03:27
and I started to do the photography
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成為一名攝影師，開始攝影
03:30
that was important for me.
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那對我來說很重要。
03:33
Many people tell me that you are a photojournalist,
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很多人對我說：你是一名攝影記者，
03:35
that you are an anthropologist photographer,
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一名人類學攝影師，
03:38
that you are an activist photographer.
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一名激進派攝影師。
03:41
But I did much more than that.
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我做的其實比上述更多。
03:44
I put photography as my life.
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我把攝影視為我的生命。
03:47
I lived totally inside photography
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我生活在攝影裡
03:49
doing long term projects,
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從事長期項目
03:51
and I want to show you just a few pictures
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我想向你們展示幾幅作品
03:54
of -- again, you'll see inside the social projects,
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你們會再次看見這些社會項目的內在
04:00
that I went to, I published many books
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我出版了很多本書
04:02
on these photographs,
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書裡面是我拍攝的照片，
04:05
but I'll just show you a few ones now.
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但是我現在只展示幾張。
04:54
In the '90s, from 1994 to 2000,
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90年代，從1994年到2000年，
04:58
I photographed a story called Migrations.
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我用攝影記錄一個叫做《遷徙》的故事
05:01
It became a book. It became a show.
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我把它出版成了書，也辦過了展覽。
05:03
But during the time that I was photographing this,
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在那期間，我在拍攝這個，
05:06
I lived through a very hard moment in my life, mostly in Rwanda.
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我人生中有過一段很艱難的歲月，大部分時間在盧旺達。
05:12
I saw in Rwanda total brutality.
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我目睹了在盧旺達的暴行，
05:16
I saw deaths by thousands per day.
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我每天都目睹上千人死去。
05:19
I lost my faith in our species.
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我對人類失去了信心，
05:22
I didn't believe that it was possible for us to live any longer,
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我當時覺得人類已經快要滅亡了，
05:26
and I started to be attacked by my own Staphylococcus.
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病菌開始侵入我的身體。
05:32
I started to have infection everywhere.
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我全身都感染，
05:35
When I made love with my wife, I had no sperm that came out of me;
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我和我妻子親熱的時候，射不出精液；
05:39
I had blood.
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是血。
05:42
I went to see a friend's doctor in Paris,
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我去巴黎找一個朋友的醫生，
05:45
told him that I was completely sick.
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我告訴他我病的很嚴重。
05:48
He made a long examination, and told me, "Sebastian,
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他檢查了很長時間，然後和我說：
05:51
you are not sick, your prostate is perfect.
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Sebastian，你沒有病，你的前列腺沒有問題。
05:54
What happened is, you saw so many deaths that you are dying.
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你病的這麼嚴重，是因為你目睹那麼多死亡，
05:58
You must stop. Stop.
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你必須停下來，停下來。
06:01
You must stop because on the contrary, you will be dead."
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你必須要停下來，不然，你會死去。
06:06
And I made the decision to stop.
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我決定要停下來。
06:09
I was really upset with photography,
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攝影令我心煩意亂
06:12
with everything in the world,
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世界上的一切令我心煩意亂，
06:14
and I made the decision to go back to where I was born.
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我決定要回到我出生的地方。
06:18
It was a big coincidence.
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很巧，
06:19
It was the moment that my parents became very old.
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那時我的父母年紀也大了。
06:23
I have seven sisters. I'm one of the only men in my family,
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我有7個姐妹，我是家中唯一的男孩，
06:26
and they made together the decision
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他們一起做了一個決定，
06:28
to transfer this land to Léila and myself.
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把那塊土地轉到我和Léila的名下。
06:31
When we received this land, this land was as dead as I was.
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當我接手這塊土地的時候，它和我一樣，都病入膏肓了。
06:36
When I was a kid, it was more than 50 percent rainforest.
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當我還是個孩子的時候，農場至少有一半的土地是雨林
06:40
When we received the land,
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當我們接手的時候，
06:41
it was less than half a percent rainforest,
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雨林的面積連0.5%都不到，
06:45
as in all my region.
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就和我的國家一樣。
06:47
To build development, Brazilian development,
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在巴西，為了開發，
06:49
we destroyed a lot of our forest.
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我們摧毀了很多雨林。
06:52
As you did here in the United States,
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就像你們在美國或印度，
06:54
or you did in India, everywhere in this planet.
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和世界上的其他地方所作的一樣。
06:56
To build our development,
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我們為了開發，
06:58
we come to a huge contradiction
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碰到了一個很大的矛盾
07:00
that we destroy around us everything.
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我們摧毀身邊的一切。
07:04
This farm that had thousands of head of cattle
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這個曾經飼養上千頭牛的農場
07:08
had just a few hundreds,
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只剩下了幾百頭，
07:10
and we didn't know how to deal with these.
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我們不知道該如何面對這些問題。
07:12
And Léila came up with an incredible idea, a crazy idea.
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Léila 想到了一個很棒的主意，一個瘋狂的主意。
07:16
She said, why don't you put back the rainforest that was here before?
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她說，你為什麼不把消失的雨林重新種回來呢？
07:21
You say that you were born in paradise.
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你說，你出生的地方是個天堂。
07:22
Let's build the paradise again.
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那我們就重建天堂。
07:25
And I went to see a good friend
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我去拜訪了一個好友
07:28
that was engineering forests
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他從事森林設計工程
07:30
to prepare a project for us,
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我們請他幫我們建立重建項目
07:31
and we started. We started to plant, and this
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然後我們就開始了。我們開始種植。
07:34
first year we lost a lot of trees, second year less,
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第一年，死了很多樹。第二年，情況好轉。
07:38
and slowly, slowly this dead land started to be born again.
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然後慢慢的，這片土地死而復生。
07:43
We started to plant hundreds of thousands of trees,
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我們開始種植上百上千棵樹，
07:46
only local species, only native species,
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我們只種本土本國的樹種，
07:50
where we built an ecosystem identical to the one that was destroyed,
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我們建造了一個生態系統，就像以前的那邊土地一樣，
07:53
and the life started to come back in an incredible way.
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生命奇蹟般的開始好轉。
07:58
It was necessary for us to transform our land
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我們當時覺得有必要
08:00
into a national park.
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把我們的土地變成國家公園。
08:02
We transformed. We gave this land back to nature.
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我們轉化了這片土地，將它還給了大自然。
08:05
It became a national park.
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它變成了國家公園。
08:06
We created an institution called Instituto Terra,
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我們成立名為Instituto Terra的機構，
08:10
and we built a big environmental project to raise money everywhere.
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我們發起了一個很大的環境計畫，並四處籌款。
08:15
Here in Los Angeles, in the Bay Area in San Francisco,
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在洛杉磯，或者舊金山的灣區
08:18
it became tax deductible in the United States.
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捐款在美國可以用來抵稅。
08:21
We raised money in Spain, in Italy, a lot in Brazil.
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我們在西班牙，意大利和巴西籌款。
08:24
We worked with a lot of companies in Brazil
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我們和巴西的很多公司合作
08:26
that put money into this project, the government.
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它們為這個計畫注入資金
08:28
And the life started to come, and I had a big wish
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其他生物也來了，我有一個強烈的願望
08:33
to come back to photography, to photograph again.
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重新拾起攝影，重新拍照。
08:36
And this time, my wish was not to photograph anymore
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這次，我的願望不再是
08:39
just one animal that I had photographed all my life: us.
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拍攝我至今一直拍攝的物種：我們人類。
08:44
I wished to photograph the other animals,
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我想拍攝其他的物種，
08:46
to photograph the landscapes,
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拍攝其他的風景
08:48
to photograph us, but us from the beginning,
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拍攝人類，原始的我們
08:52
the time we lived in equilibrium with nature.
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和大自然共生的我們。
08:54
And I went. I started in the beginning of 2004,
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我從2004年的年初開始
08:59
and I finished at the end of 2011.
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在2011年的年末結束。
09:02
We created an incredible amount of pictures,
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我們拍攝了很多照片，
09:05
and the result -- Lélia did the design of all my books,
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這是我們的成果 － Lélia 負責設計所有攝影集。
09:08
the design of all my shows. She is the creator of the shows.
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和攝影展。她策劃這些展覽。
09:11
And what we want with these pictures
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我們對這些照片的期望
09:14
is to create a discussion about what we have that is pristine on the planet
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是激起一場討論：地球上，還有什麼原始存在
09:20
and what we must hold on this planet
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以及我們必須堅持什麼
09:22
if we want to live, to have some equilibrium in our life.
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如果我們想生存下去，我們必須在生活中保持一定的平衡。
09:26
And I wanted to see us
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我想看到
09:28
when we used, yes, our instruments in stone.
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我們使用石器。
09:34
We exist yet. I was last week
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我們存在。我上週
09:36
at the Brazilian National Indian Foundation,
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在巴西國立印第安基金會，
09:39
and only in the Amazon we have about 110 groups
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在亞馬遜，大約有110個印第安部落
09:43
of Indians that are not contacted yet.
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我們還沒有聯繫上。
09:45
We must protect the forest in this sense.
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我們必須要保護這片森林
09:48
And with these pictures, I hope that we can create
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對於這些照片，我希望我們能創造
09:53
information, a system of information.
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信息，一個信息系統。
09:55
We tried to do a new presentation of the planet,
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我們想展示一個新的地球，
09:59
and I want to show you now just a few pictures
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我現在想展示這個項目的一些照片
10:01
of this project, please.
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請展示。
11:59
Well, this — (Applause) —
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唔，這-（掌聲）-
12:01
Thank you. Thank you very much.
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謝謝。非常感謝。
12:09
This is what we must fight hard
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我們必須為之奮鬥
12:12
to hold like it is now.
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來保持現狀。
12:14
But there is another part that we must together rebuild,
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但是有另外一個部分，需要我們一起重建
12:18
to build our societies, our modern family of societies,
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重建我們的社會，我們的現代家庭社會，
12:22
we are at a point where we cannot go back.
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我們已經無法回頭。
12:24
But we create an incredible contradiction.
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我們製造了一個很大的矛盾。
12:27
To build all this, we destroy a lot.
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為了建立這些，我們摧毀了很多。
12:29
Our forest in Brazil, that antique forest
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我們巴西的森林，古老的森林
12:31
that was the size of California,
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差不多和加利福尼亞州一樣大
12:34
is destroyed today 93 percent.
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93%的森林已經被毀滅了。
12:37
Here, on the West Coast, you've destroyed your forest.
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這裡，在西海岸，你們毀滅了你們的森林。
12:40
Around here, no? The redwood forests are gone.
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在這附近，不是嗎？紅杉樹森林已經一去不復返。
12:43
Gone very fast, disappeared.
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消失的很快。
12:45
Coming the other day from Atlanta, here, two days ago,
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兩天前，我從亞特蘭大州趕來
12:47
I was flying over deserts
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飛機在沙漠上空
12:49
that we made, we provoked with our own hands.
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我們親手創造的沙漠。
12:52
India has no more trees. Spain has no more trees.
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印度沒有樹木，西班牙也是一樣。
12:55
And we must rebuild these forests.
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我們必須重建樹木。
12:58
That is the essence of our life, these forests.
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森林對我們的生命太重要了，
13:02
We need to breathe. The only factory
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我們需要呼吸。
13:06
capable to transform CO2 into oxygen,
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唯一可以把二氧化碳轉化為氧氣的
13:10
are the forests.
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就是森林。
13:12
The only machine capable to capture the carbon
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唯一可以吸收
13:16
that we are producing, always,
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我們排放出的碳的就是樹木，
13:19
even if we reduce them, everything that we do, we produce CO2,
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即使我們嘗試減少排放，我們所做的一切
13:23
are the trees.
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本身就在排放碳體。
13:24
I put the question -- three or four weeks ago,
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我三四周前提出一個問題
13:29
we saw in the newspapers
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我們在報紙上看到
13:30
millions of fish that die in Norway.
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在挪威，數百萬條魚死去。
13:33
A lack of oxygen in the water.
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因為水裡的氧氣不夠。
13:36
I put to myself the question, if for a moment,
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我問我自己，如果有那麼一刻，
13:39
we will not lack oxygen for all animal species,
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所有的物種都不會缺氧
13:43
ours included -- that would be very complicated for us.
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包括我們的 -- 那將會變得很複雜。
13:46
For the water system, the trees are essential.
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樹木對於水資源是至關重要的。
13:50
I'll give you a small example that you'll understand very easily.
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我舉個小例子，你們就會很容易了解了。
13:54
You happy people that have a lot of hair on your head,
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你們這些滿頭豐髮的幸運人，
13:58
if you take a shower, it takes you
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如果你洗澡
14:01
two or three hours to dry your hair
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頭髮大約要兩三個小時才會乾
14:05
if you don't use a dryer machine.
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如果你不用吹風機。
14:07
Me, one minute, it's dry. The same with the trees.
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我，一分鐘，就乾了。 樹木也是一樣的。
14:12
The trees are the hair of our planet.
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樹木就像是地球的頭髮。
14:14
When you have rain in a place that has no trees,
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如果一個沒有樹木的地方在下雨，
14:18
in just a few minutes, the water arrives in the stream,
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幾分鐘後，雨水成流
14:22
brings soil, destroying our water source,
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帶來泥沙，摧毀我們的水源，
14:24
destroying the rivers,
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摧毀河流，
14:26
and no humidity to retain.
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無法保持濕度。
14:28
When you have trees, the root system holds the water.
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如果有樹木，樹根會留住雨水。
14:32
All the branches of the trees, the leaves that come down
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樹枝樹葉下垂
14:35
create a humid area,
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營造一個濕潤的環境，
14:37
and they take months and months under the water, go to the rivers,
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它們需要幾個月的時間匯入河流，
14:41
and maintain our source, maintain our rivers.
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保持我們的水源，維護我們的河流。
14:45
This is the most important thing,
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這是最重要的
14:47
when we imagine that we need water for every activity in life.
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當我們想像我們每天的生活都離不開水。
14:51
I want to show you now, to finish,
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結束之前，我必須要展示
14:53
just a few pictures that for me
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另外一些對於我來說很重要的照片
14:56
are very important in that direction.
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在那個方面。
14:59
You remember that I told you,
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還記得我說過
15:01
when I received the farm from my parents
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當我接手我父母的農場的時候
15:03
that was my paradise, that was the farm.
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曾經的對於我來說是天堂的農場。
15:06
Land completely destroyed, the erosion there, the land had dried.
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已是一片乾枯，荒涼。
15:11
But you can see in this picture,
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但是你看這張照片，
15:14
we were starting to construct an educational center
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我們開始建立一個教育中心
15:18
that became quite a large environmental center in Brazil.
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後來成為了巴西一個很大的環境中心
15:23
But you see a lot of small spots in this picture.
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你看這些照片上一些小點，
15:27
In each point of those spots, we had planted a tree.
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我們在每一個小點所在的地方種一棵樹
15:31
There are thousands of trees.
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有上千棵樹。
15:32
Now I'll show you the pictures made exactly in the same point
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現在我展示給你們看一下兩個月前
15:36
two months ago.
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在同一個位置拍攝的照片。
15:39
(Applause)
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（掌聲）
15:48
I told you in the beginning that it was necessary
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開始我就說了
15:50
for us to plant about 2.5 million trees
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我們需要種植大約250萬棵樹
15:55
of about 200 different species
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大約200種不同的樹種
15:57
in order to rebuild the ecosystem.
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以便重建我們的生態系統。
16:01
And I'll show you the last picture.
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我展示最後一張照片。
16:03
We are with two million trees in the ground now.
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我們已經種植了200萬棵樹，
16:06
We are doing the sequestration
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我們的樹林吸收了
16:08
of about 100,000 tons of carbon with these trees.
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大約10萬噸的碳。
16:12
My friends, it's very easy to do. We did it, no?
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我的朋友們，真的很簡單，我們做到了，不是嗎？
16:17
By an accident that happened to me,
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因為一個發生在我身上的事故，
16:19
we went back, we built an ecosystem.
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我們回去，並建造了一個生態系統。
16:23
We here inside the room,
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我們現在在室內，
16:25
I believe that we have the same concern,
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我相信我們有同樣的擔憂，
16:29
and the model that we created in Brazil,
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我們在巴西建立的模式，
16:31
we can transplant it here.
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我們可以移植到這裡。
16:33
We can apply it everywhere around the world, no?
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我們可以將它應用於世界各地，不是嗎？
16:36
And I believe that we can do it together.
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我相信，我們齊心協力，一定可以做到。
16:39
Thank you very much.
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非常感謝。
16:40
(Applause)
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（掌聲）
ABOUT THE SPEAKER
Sebastião Salgado - PhotojournalistSebastião Salgado captures the dignity of the dispossessed through large-scale, long-term projects.
Why you should listen
A gold miner in Serra Pelada, Brazil; a Siberian Nenet tribe that lives in -35°C temperatures; a Namibian gemsbok antelope. These are just a few of the subjects from Sebastião Salgado’s immense collection of work devoted to the world’s most dispossessed and unknown.
Brazilian-born Salgado, who shoots only using Kodak film, is known for his incredibly long-term projects, which require extensive travel and extreme lifestyle changes. Workers took seven years to complete and contained images of manual laborers from 26 countries, while Migrations took six years in 43 different countries on all seven continents. Most recently Salgado completed Genesis, an ambitious eight-year project that spanned 30 trips to the world’s most pristine territories, land untouched by technology and modern life. Among Salgado’s many travels for Genesis was a two-month hike through Ethiopia, spanning 500 miles with 18 pack donkeys and their riders. In the words of Brett Abbott, a Getty Museum curator, Salgado’s approach can only be described as “epic.”
Sebastião Salgado | Speaker | TED.com