TEDSalon NY2014
Kwame Anthony Appiah: Is religion good or bad? (This is a trick question)
Kvame Entoni Apija (Kwame Anthony Appiah): Da li je religija dobra ili loša? (Ovo je trik pitanje)
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U ime religije urađeno je dosta dobrih stvari, kao i dosta loših. Ali šta je zapravo religija - da li je dobra ili loša, sama po sebi? Filozof Kvame Entoni Apija pruža obimno, iznenađujuće viđenje.
Kwame Anthony Appiah - Philosopher
Kwame Anthony Appiah is a philosopher, cultural theorist and novelist. His latest book is "The Honor Code," exploring moral revolutions. Full bio
Kwame Anthony Appiah is a philosopher, cultural theorist and novelist. His latest book is "The Honor Code," exploring moral revolutions. Full bio
Double-click the English transcript below to play the video.
00:12
People say things about religion all the time.
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Ljudi stalno govore
razne stvari o religiji.
razne stvari o religiji.
00:16
(Laughter)
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(Smeh)
00:18
The late, great Christopher Hitchens
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Sada već pokojni, veliki Kristofer Hičens
00:20
wrote a book called "God Is Not Great"
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napisao je knjigu
po imenu "Bog nije velik".
po imenu "Bog nije velik".
00:22
whose subtitle was, "Religion Poisons Everything."
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čiji je podnaslov bio
"Religija truje sve."
"Religija truje sve."
00:25
(Laughter)
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(Smeh)
00:27
But last month, in Time magazine,
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Ali prošlog meseca, u časopisu Tajm,
00:31
Rabbi David Wolpe, who I gather
is referred to as America's rabbi,
is referred to as America's rabbi,
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rabin Dejvid Volp, koga ja smatram
američkim rabinom,
američkim rabinom,
00:35
said, to balance that against
that negative characterization,
that negative characterization,
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rekao je, kako bi ublažio
negativnu karakterizaciju,
negativnu karakterizaciju,
00:40
that no important form of social change
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da nijedan važan oblik društvene promene
00:42
can be brought about except through organized religion.
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ne može biti ostvaren nikako
osim kroz organizovanu religiju.
osim kroz organizovanu religiju.
00:46
Now, remarks of this sort on the negative
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Primedbe na ovaj oblik negativne
00:48
and the positive side are very old.
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i pozitivne strane su veoma stare.
00:52
I have one in my pocket here
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Imam u svom džepu,
00:54
from the first century BCE by Lucretius,
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iz prvog veka pre nove ere, Lukrecijovu
01:00
the author of "On the Nature of Things," who said,
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"O prirodi stvari", gde je autor rekao:
01:03
"Tantum religio potuit suadere malorum" --
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"Tantum religio potuit suadere malorum" -
01:07
I should have been able to learn that by heart —
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Trebalo bi da znam ovo napamet -
01:10
which is, that's how much religion
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što znači, da koliko je religija
01:12
is able to persuade people to do evil,
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u mogućnosti da ubedi ljude da čine zlo,
01:15
and he was talking about the fact
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a govorio je o činjenici
01:17
of Agamemnon's decision to place his daughter
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Agamemnonove odluke
da smesti svoju ćerku
da smesti svoju ćerku
01:20
Iphigenia on an altar of sacrifice
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Ifigeniju na žrtveni oltar
01:22
in order to preserve the prospects of his army.
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kako bi osigurao uspeh svoje vojske.
01:25
So there have been these long debates
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Postojale su velike rasprave,
01:28
over the centuries, in that case, actually,
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vekovima, i u tom slučaju,
zapravo možemo
zapravo možemo
01:30
we can say over the millennia, about religion.
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govoriti o milenijumima, o religiji.
01:31
People have talked about it a lot,
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Ljudi su govorili o tome mnogo,
01:33
and they've said good and bad
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i rekli su dobre i loše
01:35
and indifferent things about it.
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i ravnodušne stvari o tome.
01:39
What I want to persuade you of today
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Danas želim da vas uverim
01:40
is of a very simple claim,
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u veoma jednostavnu tvrdnju,
01:42
which is that these debates are
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a to je da su te debate
01:44
in a certain sense preposterous,
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u neku ruku besmislene,
01:47
because there is no such thing as religion
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jer ne postoji nijedna stvar kao religija
01:51
about which to make these claims.
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o kojoj se grade takve tvrdnje.
01:53
There isn't a thing called religion,
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Ne postoji stvar pod imenom "religija",
01:54
and so it can't be good or bad.
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pa ne može biti dobra ili loša.
01:57
It can't even be indifferent.
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Ne može čak biti ni neutralna.
01:59
And if you think about claims
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Ako razmislite o tvrdnjama
02:02
about the nonexistence of things,
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o nepostojanju stvari,
02:06
one obvious way to try and establish
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očigledan način da se pokuša i postavi
02:08
the nonexistence of a purported thing
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nepostojanje smislene stvari
02:10
would be to offer a definition of that thing
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bi bilo pružanje definicije te stvari
02:13
and then to see whether anything satisfied it.
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i videti da li ju je bilo šta zadovoljilo.
02:15
I'm going to start out on that little route
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Počeću sa tom premisom
02:19
to begin with.
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za početak.
02:20
So if you look in the dictionaries
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Ako pogledate u rečnike
i ako razmisilite o tome,
02:22
and if you think about it,
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02:24
one very natural definition of religion
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veoma prirodna definicija religije
02:26
is that it involves belief in gods or in spiritual beings.
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je da ona uključuje verovanje u bogove
ili duhovna bića.
ili duhovna bića.
Kao što rekoh, to stoji u mnogim rečnicima,
02:32
As I say, this is in many dictionaries,
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02:33
but you'll also find it actually
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ali ćete zapravo pronaći
02:36
in the work of Sir Edward Tylor,
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u radu Ser Edvarda Tajlora,
koji je bio prvi profesor antropologije
na Oksfordu,
na Oksfordu,
02:38
who was the first professor
of anthropology at Oxford,
of anthropology at Oxford,
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02:40
one of the first modern anthropologists.
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jedan od prvih modernih antropologa.
02:42
In his book on primitive culture,
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U njegovoj knjizi o primitivnoj kulturi,
02:44
he says the heart of religion
is what he called animism,
is what he called animism,
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kaže da je srce religije
ono što on zove animizam,
ono što on zove animizam,
02:47
that is, the belief in spiritual agency,
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što je verovanje u duhovni organ,
02:49
belief in spirits.
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verovanje u duhovnost.
02:51
The first problem for that definition
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Prvi problem za tu definiciju
02:53
is from a recent novel by Paul Beatty called "Tuff."
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potiče od skorašnjeg romana Pola Betija
pod imenom "Taf".
pod imenom "Taf".
02:56
There's a guy talking to a rabbi.
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Čovek priča sa rabinom.
02:57
The rabbi says he doesn't believe in God.
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Rabin kaže da ne veruje u boga.
Čovek kaže:
Čovek kaže:
03:00
The guy says, "You're a rabbi,
how can you not believe in God?"
how can you not believe in God?"
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"Ti si rabin, kako možeš da
ne veruješ u boga?"
ne veruješ u boga?"
03:02
And the reply is, "It's what's
so great about being Jewish.
so great about being Jewish.
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On odgovara:
"Zato je tako dobro biti Jevrej.
"Zato je tako dobro biti Jevrej.
03:06
You don't have to believe in a God per se,
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Ne moraš da veruješ
u boga samog po sebi,
u boga samog po sebi,
03:08
just in being Jewish." (Laughter)
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samo zato što si Jevrej."
(Smeh)
(Smeh)
03:10
So if this guy is a rabbi, and a Jewish rabbi,
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Ako je čovek rabin i Jevrej rabin
03:13
and if you have to believe in
God in order to be religious,
God in order to be religious,
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i ako morate da verujete u boga
da biste bili religiozni,
da biste bili religiozni,
03:16
then we have the rather counterintuitive conclusion
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onda imamo kontraintuitivni zaključak
03:20
that since it's possible to be a Jewish rabbi
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da pošto je moguće biti jevrejski rabin
03:22
without believing in God,
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bez verovanja u boga,
03:24
Judaism isn't a religion.
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judaizam nije religija.
03:26
That seems like a pretty counterintuitive thought.
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To izgleda kao prilično
kontraintuitivna misao.
kontraintuitivna misao.
03:29
Here's another argument against this view.
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Evo drugog argumenta
protiv ovakvog viđenja.
protiv ovakvog viđenja.
03:33
A friend of mine, an Indian friend of mine,
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Moj prijatelj, Indijac,
03:35
went to his grandfather when he was very young,
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išao je kod svog dede
kad je bio veoma mlad
kad je bio veoma mlad
03:37
a child, and said to him,
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kao dete, i rekao mu:
03:38
"I want to talk to you about religion,"
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"Želim da pričam sa tobom o religiji."
a deda mu je rekao: "Premlad si.
03:40
and his grandfather said, "You're too young.
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03:42
Come back when you're a teenager."
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Dođi kad budeš tinejdžer."
03:43
So he came back when he was a teenager,
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Došao je kad je postao tinejdžer,
03:45
and he said to his grandfather,
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i rekao je dedi:
03:47
"It may be a bit late now
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"Možda je sad malo kasno
03:48
because I've discovered that
I don't believe in the gods."
I don't believe in the gods."
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jer sam otkrio da ne verujem u bogove."
03:52
And his grandfather, who was a wise man, said,
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Deda, koji je bio mudar čovek, reče mu:
03:54
"Oh, so you belong to the atheist branch
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"Dakle, ti pripadaš ateističkoj branši
03:56
of the Hindu tradition." (Laughter)
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Hindu tradicije."
(Smeh)
(Smeh)
03:59
And finally, there's this guy,
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Na kraju, postoji jedan čovek
04:03
who famously doesn't believe in God.
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koji uopšte ne veruje u boga.
04:05
His name is the Dalai Lama.
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Njegovo ime je Dalaj Lama.
04:07
He often jokes that he's one
of the world's leading atheists.
of the world's leading atheists.
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Često se šali da je on jedan
od najvećih svetskih ateista.
od najvećih svetskih ateista.
04:10
But it's true, because the Dalai Lama's religion
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Ali to je istina, jer religija Dalaj Lame
04:13
does not involve belief in God.
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ne uključuje verovanje u boga.
04:15
Now you might think this just shows
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Možete misliti da to samo pokazuje
04:17
that I've given you the wrong definition
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da sam vam dao pogrešnu definiciju
04:20
and that I should come up with some other definition
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i da bi trebalo da imam drugu
04:22
and test it against these cases
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i da je testiram sa ovim slučajevima
04:24
and try and find something that captures
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i pokušam da nađem nešto što obuhvata
04:26
atheistic Judaism, atheistic Hinduism,
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ateistički judaizam, ateistički hinduizam,
04:29
and atheistic Buddhism as forms of religiosity,
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i ateistički budizam kao forme
religioznosti, ali zapravo
religioznosti, ali zapravo
04:33
but I actually think that that's a bad idea,
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verujem da je to loša ideja,
04:34
and the reason I think it's a bad idea
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a razlog zbog kojeg mislim
da je to loša ideja
da je to loša ideja
04:37
is that I don't think that's how
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je da ne verujem da je to način
na koji naš koncept religije funkcioniše.
04:38
our concept of religion works.
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04:40
I think the way our concept of religion works
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Mislim da naš koncept religije
04:42
is that we actually have, we have a list
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funkcioniše tako što imamo listu
04:45
of paradigm religions
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paradigmi religija
04:47
and their sub-parts, right,
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i njihove poddelove
04:50
and if something new comes along
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i ako se nešto novo pojavi
04:52
that purports to be a religion,
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što nagoveštava religiju,
04:54
what we ask is, "Well, is it like one of these?"
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ono što pitamo je:
"Da li je nešto poput ovih?"
"Da li je nešto poput ovih?"
04:56
Right?
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Zar ne?
04:59
And I think that's not only
how we think about religion,
how we think about religion,
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Mislim da to nije jedini način
kako mislimo o religiji.
kako mislimo o religiji.
05:01
and that's, as it were,
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To je, kao što je bilo,
05:03
so from our point of view,
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sa naše tačke gledišta,
bilo bi dobro da išta
na toj listi bude religija,
na toj listi bude religija,
05:04
anything on that list had better be a religion,
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05:06
which is why I don't think an account of religion
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zbog čega mislim da prikaz religije
05:08
that excludes Buddhism and Judaism
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koji isključuje budizam i judaizam
05:10
has a chance of being a good starter,
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nema šanse da bude dobar početak,
05:13
because they're on our list.
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jer su na našoj listi.
05:15
But why do we have such a list?
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Ali zašto imamo tu listu?
05:17
What's going on? How did it come about
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Šta se dešava?
Kako je došlo do toga da imamo listu?
05:19
that we have this list?
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05:21
I think the answer is a pretty simple one
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Mislim da je odgovor prilično jednostavan
05:24
and therefore crude and contentious.
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i stoga sirov i sporan.
Siguran sam da se dosta ljudi neće
05:27
I'm sure a lot of people will disagree with it,
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05:29
but here's my story,
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složiti sa time, ali evo moje priče,
05:30
and true or not, it's a story that I think
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i istinita ili ne, to je priča koja vam
05:33
gives you a good sense of how
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daje dobar osećaj za to kako je
05:35
the list might have come about,
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lista možda nastala i stoga vam
05:37
and therefore helps you to think about
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pomaže da razmislite o tome
05:38
what use the list might be.
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koja upotreba liste može postojati.
05:40
I think the answer is, European travelers,
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Mislim da je odgovor ovde,
kada su evropski putnici,
kada su evropski putnici,
05:43
starting roughly about the time of Columbus,
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počevši otprilike u vreme Kolumba,
05:45
started going around the world.
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krenuli na put oko sveta.
05:46
They came from a Christian culture,
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Potekli su iz hrišćanske kulture,
05:49
and when they arrived in a new place,
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i kada su stigli na novo mesto
05:51
they noticed that some people
didn't have Christianity,
didn't have Christianity,
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primetili su da neki ljudi
nemaju hrišćanstvo
nemaju hrišćanstvo
05:53
and so they asked themselves
the following question:
the following question:
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i pitali su se sledeće:
05:55
what have they got instead of Christianity?
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šta imaju umesto hrišćanstva?
05:59
And that list was essentially constructed.
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A onda je lista nastala.
06:02
It consists of the things that other people had
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Sastoji se od stvari
koje su drugi ljudi imali
koje su drugi ljudi imali
06:04
instead of Christianity.
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umesto hrišćanstva.
06:07
Now there's a difficulty with proceeding in that way,
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Postoji poteškoća
sa napretkom u tom smeru
sa napretkom u tom smeru
06:10
which is that Christianity is extremely,
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a to je da je hrišćanstvo ekstremno,
06:13
even on that list, it's an extremely specific tradition.
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čak i na toj listi,
ekstremno specifična tradicija.
ekstremno specifična tradicija.
06:17
It has all kinds of things in it
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U sebi ima svakakve stvari
06:19
that are very, very particular
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koje su izuzetno posebne
06:21
that are the results of the specifics
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i koje su posledice specifičnosti
06:23
of Christian history,
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hrišćanske istorije i jedna stvar
06:26
and one thing that's at the heart of it,
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koja je u srcu toga,
06:27
one thing that's at the heart of
most understandings of Christianity,
most understandings of Christianity,
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jedna stvar koja je
u srcu većine shvatanja hrišćanstva,
u srcu većine shvatanja hrišćanstva,
06:30
which is the result of the
specific history of Christianity,
specific history of Christianity,
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što je posledica specifične
istorije hrišćanstva,
istorije hrišćanstva,
06:32
is that it's an extremely creedal religion.
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a to je da je to veoma ubedljiva religija.
06:36
It's a religion in which people are really concerned
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To je religija u kojoj su ljudi
veoma zabrinuti
veoma zabrinuti
06:38
about whether you believe the right things.
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za to da li verujete u prave stvari.
06:41
The history of Christianity, the
internal history of Christianity,
internal history of Christianity,
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Interna istorija hrišćanstva
je većinom istorija
je većinom istorija
06:43
is largely the history of people killing each other
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ljudi koji su ubijali jedni druge
06:45
because they believed the wrong thing,
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jer su verovali u pogrešne stvari,
06:47
and it's also involved in
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i takođe je uključena
06:49
struggles with other religions,
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u borbe sa ostalim religijama,
06:51
obviously starting in the Middle Ages,
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očigledno počevši od Srednjeg veka,
06:55
a struggle with Islam,
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borba sa Islamom,
06:56
in which, again, it was the infidelity,
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u kojem je, ponovo, nevera,
06:59
the fact that they didn't believe the right things,
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činjenica da nisu verovali u prave stvari,
07:01
that seemed so offensive to the Christian world.
167
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to je delovalo veoma uvredljivo
za hrišćanski svet.
za hrišćanski svet.
07:05
Now that's a very specific and particular history
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To je veoma specifična i posebna istorija
07:07
that Christianity has,
169
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koju hrišćanstvo ima,
07:10
and not everywhere is everything
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i nije svuda sve
07:13
that has ever been put on this sort of list like it.
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što je ikada bilo stavljeno
na ovakvu vrstu liste.
na ovakvu vrstu liste.
07:17
Here's another problem, I think.
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Evo i drugog problema.
Dogodila se veoma posebna stvar.
07:18
A very specific thing happened.
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1338
07:20
It was actually adverted to earlier,
174
428110
1452
Zapravo je spomenuto ranije,
07:21
but a very specific thing happened
175
429562
1541
ali veoma posebna stvar se dogodila
07:23
in the history of the kind of Christianity
176
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2189
u istoriji vrste hrišćanstva
07:25
that we see around us
177
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1521
koju vidimo oko sebe
07:26
mostly in the United States today,
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2184
većinom danas u Americi
07:28
and it happened in the late 19th century,
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3103
i desila se krajem 19. veka,
07:32
and that specific thing that happened
180
440100
1409
a ta posebna stvar koja se dogodila
07:33
in the late 19th century
181
441509
1009
krajem 19. veka
07:34
was a kind of deal that was cut
182
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2955
je bila vrsta dogovora koji je postignut
07:37
between science,
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2510
između nauke,
07:39
this new way of organizing intellectual authority,
184
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5693
novog načina organizovanja
intelektualnog autoriteta,
intelektualnog autoriteta,
07:45
and religion.
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1197
i religije.
07:46
If you think about the 18th century, say,
186
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1891
Ako pomislite na 18. vek, recimo,
07:48
if you think about intellectual life
187
456764
1470
ako mislite
07:50
before the late 19th century,
188
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2356
o intelektualnom životu
pre kraja 19. veka,
pre kraja 19. veka,
07:52
anything you did, anything you thought about,
189
460590
3170
sve što ste uradili,
sve o čemu ste mislili
sve o čemu ste mislili
07:55
whether it was the physical world,
190
463760
2730
bilo da je fizički svet,
07:58
the human world,
191
466490
1531
ljudski svet,
08:00
the natural world apart from the human world,
192
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2230
prirodni svet van ljudskog,
08:02
or morality, anything you did
193
470251
1967
ili moralnost, bilo šta što ste radili
08:04
would have been framed against the background
194
472218
1676
bi se uokvirilo u pozadinu
08:05
of a set of assumptions that were religious,
195
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2463
grupe religioznih pretpostavki,
08:08
Christian assumptions.
196
476357
1203
hrišćanskih pretpostavki.
08:09
You couldn't give an account
197
477560
1666
Ne biste mogli da ispričate
08:11
of the natural world
198
479226
1596
o prirodnom svetu,
08:12
that didn't say something about its relationship,
199
480822
2922
a da ne kažete nešto o njegovoj vezi,
08:15
for example, to the creation story
200
483744
1808
na primer, za priču o postanju
08:17
in the Abrahamic tradition,
201
485552
1540
u avramskoj tradiciji,
08:19
the creation story in the first book of the Torah.
202
487092
3204
priču o postanju u prvoj knjizi Tore.
08:22
So everything was framed in that way.
203
490296
3317
Sve je bilo uokvireno na taj način.
08:25
But this changes in the late 19th century,
204
493613
2432
To se menja krajem 19. veka
08:28
and for the first time, it's possible for people
205
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2325
i po prvi put, moguće je da ljudi
08:30
to develop serious intellectual careers
206
498370
2379
razviju ozbiljne intelektualne karijere
08:32
as natural historians like Darwin.
207
500749
2194
kao prirodni istoričari poput Darvina.
08:34
Darwin worried about the relationship between
208
502943
1985
Darvin je bio zabrinut za vezu između
08:36
what he said and the truths of religion,
209
504928
2553
onoga što je rekao i istina religije
08:39
but he could proceed, he could write books
210
507481
1925
ali je mogao da nastavi, da piše knjige
08:41
about his subject
211
509406
1784
o svojoj temi,
08:43
without having to say what the relationship was
212
511190
2696
a da ne mora da objasni
kakva je bila veza
kakva je bila veza
08:45
to the religious claims,
213
513886
1472
sa religijskim tvrdnjama
08:47
and similarly, geologists
increasingly could talk about it.
increasingly could talk about it.
214
515358
2382
i takođe, geolozi su mogli
da o tome govore.
da o tome govore.
U ranom 19. veku, ako biste bili geolog
08:49
In the early 19th century, if you were a geologist
215
517740
1802
08:51
and made a claim about the age of the Earth,
216
519542
1923
i izneli tvrdnju o dobu Zemlje,
morali biste da objasnite
da li je bila saglasna
da li je bila saglasna
08:53
you had to explain whether that was consistent
217
521465
1642
08:55
or how it was or wasn't consistent
218
523107
1430
ili kako jeste ili nije saglasna
08:56
with the age of the Earth implied
219
524537
1372
sa dobom Zemlje
08:57
by the account in Genesis.
220
525909
1553
koje se navodi u Postanju.
08:59
By the end of the 19th century,
221
527462
1185
Krajem 19. veka, mogli ste
09:00
you can just write a geology textbook
222
528647
1513
da napišete udžbenik o geologiji
09:02
in which you make arguments
about how old the Earth is.
about how old the Earth is.
223
530160
2359
u kojem dajete argumente
koliko je Zemlja stara.
koliko je Zemlja stara.
09:04
So there's a big change, and that division,
224
532519
2091
Dakle, postoji velika promena
09:06
that intellectual division of
labor occurs as I say, I think,
labor occurs as I say, I think,
225
534610
2935
i ta intelektualna podela rada se javlja
09:09
and it sort of solidifies so that by the end
226
537545
2825
i učvršćuje tako da krajem
09:12
of the 19th century in Europe,
227
540370
3158
19. veka u Evropi
09:15
there's a real intellectual division of labor,
228
543528
1991
nastaje intelektualna podela rada,
09:17
and you can do all sorts of serious things,
229
545519
2000
i možete da radite
svakakve ozbiljne stvari
svakakve ozbiljne stvari
09:19
including, increasingly, even philosophy,
230
547519
3902
uključujući, čak i filozofiju,
09:23
without being constrained by the thought,
231
551421
2858
a da ne budete ograničeni mišlju:
09:26
"Well, what I have to say has to be consistent
232
554279
2281
"Ono što moram da kažem
mora biti u saglasnosti
mora biti u saglasnosti
09:28
with the deep truths that are given to me
233
556560
2679
sa dubokim istinama koje mi je dala
09:31
by our religious tradition."
234
559239
2510
religijska tradicija."
09:33
So imagine someone who's coming out
235
561749
2164
Zamislite nekoga ko izlazi
09:35
of that world, that late-19th-century world,
236
563913
3817
iz tog sveta, tog sveta iz kraja 19. veka,
09:39
coming into the country that I grew up in, Ghana,
237
567730
3752
ulazi u zemlju
gde sam ja odrastao, Ganu,
gde sam ja odrastao, Ganu,
09:43
the society that I grew up in, Asante,
238
571482
2260
društvo u kojem sam odrastao, Asante,
09:45
coming into that world
239
573742
1406
ulazi u taj svet
09:47
at the turn of the 20th century
240
575148
2016
na prekretnici 20. veka
09:49
with this question that made the list:
241
577164
2023
sa pitanjem koje je sačinilo listu:
09:51
what have they got instead of Christianity?
242
579187
3763
šta oni imaju umesto hrišćanstva?
09:54
Well, here's one thing he would have noticed,
243
582950
2857
Evo jedne stvari koju bi primetio,
09:57
and by the way, there was a
person who actually did this.
person who actually did this.
244
585807
2344
i inače, postojala je osoba
koja je uradila to.
koja je uradila to.
10:00
His name was Captain Rattray,
245
588151
1299
To je bio kapetan Ratrej,
10:01
he was sent as the British
government anthropologist,
government anthropologist,
246
589450
2052
i bio je poslat
kao antropolog britanske vlade
kao antropolog britanske vlade
10:03
and he wrote a book about Asante religion.
247
591502
1993
i napisao je knjigu o Asante religiji.
10:05
This is a soul disc.
248
593495
2540
Ovo je disk duše.
Ima ih gomila u Britanskom muzeju.
Mogao bih da vam dam
Mogao bih da vam dam
10:08
There are many of them in the British Museum.
249
596035
2273
10:10
I could give you an interesting, different history
250
598308
1270
zanimljivu, različitu istoriju
10:11
of how it comes about that many of the things
251
599578
2165
o tome kako je došlo
da toliko mnogo stvari
da toliko mnogo stvari
10:13
from my society ended up in the British Museum,
252
601743
3391
iz mog društva završi u Britanskom muzeju,
10:17
but we don't have time for that.
253
605134
1811
ali nemamo vremena za to.
10:18
So this object is a soul disc.
254
606945
1492
Ovaj predmet je disk duše.
10:20
What is a soul disc?
255
608437
1138
Šta je to disk duše?
10:21
It was worn around the necks
256
609575
1829
Nošen je oko vrata
10:23
of the soul-washers of the Asante king.
257
611404
2570
čistača duše Asante kralja.
10:25
What was their job? To wash the king's soul.
258
613974
3555
Šta je bilo njihov posao?
Da čiste kraljevu dušu.
Da čiste kraljevu dušu.
10:29
It would take a long while
259
617529
1905
Trebalo je dosta vremena
10:31
to explain how a soul could be the kind of thing
260
619434
2227
da se objasni kako duša može biti stvar
10:33
that could be washed,
261
621661
1300
koja se može čistiti,
10:34
but Rattray knew that this was religion
262
622961
2779
ali je Ratrej znao da je ovo religija
10:37
because souls were in play.
263
625740
3503
jer su duše bile u igri.
10:41
And similarly,
264
629243
1746
I takođe,
10:42
there were many other things, many other practices.
265
630989
2207
bilo je mnogo drugih stvari,
mnogo običaja.
mnogo običaja.
10:45
For example, every time anybody
had a drink, more or less,
had a drink, more or less,
266
633196
2363
Na primer, skoro svaki put
kad bi neko pio piće,
kad bi neko pio piće,
10:47
they poured a little bit on the ground
267
635559
2022
prosuli bi malo na zemlju
10:49
in what's called the libation,
268
637581
1729
nazivajući to prolivanjem u slavu boga,
10:51
and they gave some to the ancestors.
269
639310
1689
i dali bi nešto precima.
Moj otac je to radio.
Svaki put kad bi otvorio bocu viskija,
Svaki put kad bi otvorio bocu viskija,
10:52
My father did this. Every time
he opened a bottle of whiskey,
he opened a bottle of whiskey,
270
640999
2349
10:55
which I'm glad to say was very often,
271
643348
1521
što je srećom bilo često,
10:56
he would take the top off and
pour off just a little on the ground,
pour off just a little on the ground,
272
644869
3879
skinuo bi čep i prosuo
veoma malo na zemlju,
veoma malo na zemlju,
11:00
and he would talk to,
273
648748
1351
i govorio bi,
11:02
he would say to Akroma-Ampim, the founder of our line,
274
650099
3540
obraćao bi se Akromi-Ampimu,
osnivaču naše loze,
osnivaču naše loze,
11:05
or Yao Antony, my great uncle,
275
653639
1596
ili Jao Entoniju, mom pradedi,
11:07
he would talk to them,
276
655235
1895
govorio bi im,
11:09
offer them a little bit of this.
277
657130
2223
nudeći malo toga.
11:11
And finally, there were these
huge public ceremonials.
huge public ceremonials.
278
659353
2885
I konačno, bile su ogromne
javne ceremonije.
javne ceremonije.
Ovo je crtež iz ranog 19. veka
11:14
This is an early-19th-century drawing
279
662238
1416
11:15
by another British military officer
280
663654
1273
koji je nacrtao drugi britanski oficir
11:16
of such a ceremonial,
281
664927
2050
i koji prikazuje takvu ceremonju,
11:18
where the king was involved,
282
666977
2128
gde je uključen kralj,
11:21
and the king's job,
283
669105
1406
i kraljevski posao,
11:22
one of the large parts of his job,
284
670511
1189
jedan od većih delova njegovog posla,
11:23
apart from organizing warfare and things like that,
285
671700
2951
pored organizovanja rata
i sličnih stvari,
i sličnih stvari,
11:26
was to look after the tombs of his ancestors,
286
674651
3346
bilo je da nadgleda
grobove svojih predaka
grobove svojih predaka
11:29
and when a king died,
287
677997
1997
i kada je kralj umro,
tron na kom je sedeo
tron na kom je sedeo
11:31
the stool that he sat on was blackened
288
679994
1514
bio je zacrnjen
11:33
and put in the royal ancestral temple,
289
681508
2884
i odnešen u kraljevski hram predaka.
11:36
and every 40 days,
290
684392
2129
I svakih 40 dana kralj Asantea
11:38
the King of Asante has to go and do cult
291
686521
1855
morao je da ode i izvrši kult
11:40
for his ancestors.
292
688376
1362
za svoje pretke.
11:41
That's a large part of his job,
293
689738
1502
To je veliki deo posla
11:43
and people think that if he doesn't do it,
294
691240
1873
i ljudi smatraju da ako ne uradi to,
11:45
things will fall apart.
295
693113
1731
stvari će se raspasti.
11:46
So he's a religious figure,
296
694844
2366
Dakle, on je religiozna figura,
11:49
as Rattray would have said,
297
697210
1325
kao što bi Ratrej rekao,
11:50
as well as a political figure.
298
698535
2625
kao i politička figura.
11:53
So all this would count as religion for Rattray,
299
701160
4684
Sve ovo bi se računalo
kao religija za Ratreja.
kao religija za Ratreja.
11:57
but my point is that when you look
300
705844
1939
ali moje mišljenje je da kada gledate
11:59
into the lives of those people,
301
707783
1382
u živote tih ljudi,
12:01
you also find that every time they do anything,
302
709165
2745
otkrivate da svaki put kad urade nešto
12:03
they're conscious of the ancestors.
303
711910
2034
svesni su svojih predaka.
12:05
Every morning at breakfast,
304
713944
2033
Svako jutro na doručku
12:07
you can go outside the front of the house
305
715977
1826
odete napolje ispred kuće
12:09
and make an offering to the god tree, the nyame dua
306
717803
3096
i date ponudu božjem drvetu, nima due
12:12
outside your house,
307
720899
1184
van vaše kuće, i ponovo,
12:14
and again, you'll talk to the gods
308
722083
1317
razgovaraćete sa bogovima,
12:15
and the high gods and the low gods
309
723400
1026
visokim i niskim bogovima,
12:16
and the ancestors and so on.
310
724426
1658
precima i tako dalje.
12:18
This is not a world
311
726084
1536
Ovo nije svet
12:19
in which the separation between religion and science
312
727620
2907
u kojem se desilo razdvajanje
12:22
has occurred.
313
730527
1574
između religije i nauke.
12:24
Religion has not being separated
314
732101
1543
Religija se nije razdvojila
od bilo koje oblasti života,
12:25
from any other areas of life,
315
733644
1276
12:26
and in particular,
316
734920
1997
i posebno,
12:28
what's crucial to understand about this world
317
736917
1695
što je ključno za razumevanje sveta,
12:30
is that it's a world in which the job
318
738612
1538
je to da je to svet u kojem posao
12:32
that science does for us
319
740150
1138
koji nauka obavlja za nas
12:33
is done by what Rattray is going to call religion,
320
741288
3144
urađen onim što će
Ratrej nazvati religijom,
Ratrej nazvati religijom,
12:36
because if they want an explanation of something,
321
744432
1940
jer ako žele da objasne nešto,
12:38
if they want to know why the crop just failed,
322
746372
1828
da znaju zašto usev nije uspeo,
12:40
if they want to know why it's raining
323
748200
1286
da znaju zašto pada kiša
12:41
or not raining, if they need rain,
324
749486
2418
ili ne pada, ako im treba kiša,
12:43
if they want to know why
325
751904
2524
ako žele da znaju zašto
12:46
their grandfather has died,
326
754428
1859
im je deda umro,
12:48
they are going to appeal to the very same entities,
327
756287
2908
pozvaće se na ista imena,
12:51
the very same language,
328
759195
1442
iste jezike,
12:52
talk to the very same gods about that.
329
760637
2616
govoriće istim bogovima o tome.
12:55
This great separation, in other words,
330
763253
2089
Ovo veliko razdvajanje, drugim rečima,
12:57
between religion and science hasn't happened.
331
765342
1931
između religije i nauke
se nije dogodilo.
se nije dogodilo.
12:59
Now, this would be a mere historical curiosity,
332
767273
4325
Ovo bi bila samo istorijska zanimljivost,
13:03
except that in large parts of the world,
333
771598
3452
samo što je to u velikom delu sveta
13:07
this is still the truth.
334
775050
2744
i dalje istina.
13:09
I had the privilege of going to a wedding
335
777794
2008
Imao sam privilegiju da idem na venčanje
13:11
the other day in northern Namibia,
336
779802
1765
pre neki dan u severnoj Namibiji,
13:13
20 miles or so south of the Angolan border
337
781567
2845
oko 30km južno od granice sa Angolom
13:16
in a village of 200 people.
338
784412
1733
u selu od 200 ljudi.
13:18
These were modern people.
339
786145
1168
Ovo su bili moderni ljudi.
13:19
We had with us Oona Chaplin,
340
787313
1891
Sa nama je bilaUna Čaplin,
13:21
who some of you may have heard of,
341
789204
1409
za koju ste neki od vas i čuli
13:22
and one of the people from
this village came up to her,
this village came up to her,
342
790613
2079
i jedan od ljudi iz sela joj je prišao
13:24
and said, "I've seen you in 'Game of Thrones.'"
343
792692
2731
i rekao: "Video sam te u Igri prestola."
13:27
So these were not people who
were isolated from our world,
were isolated from our world,
344
795423
3828
To nisu bili ljudi koji su se izolovali
iz našeg sveta,
iz našeg sveta,
13:31
but nevertheless, for them,
345
799251
1529
ali ipak za njih,
13:32
the gods and the spirits are still very much there,
346
800780
2553
bogovi i duše su još uvek tu
i kada smo bili u autobusu,
vozeći se između
vozeći se između
13:35
and when we were on the bus going back and forth
347
803333
1826
13:37
to the various parts of the [ceremony],
348
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različitih delova ceremonije,
13:38
they prayed not just in a generic way
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nisu se molili samo na opšti način
13:41
but for the safety of the journey,
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već za sigurnost putovanja
13:42
and they meant it,
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i to su i mislili
13:43
and when they said to me that my mother,
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i kada su mi rekli da je majka,
13:46
the bridegroom's [grandmother],
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mladina baba,
13:48
was with us, they didn't mean it figuratively.
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sa nama, nisu mislili figurativno.
13:51
They meant, even though she was a dead person,
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Mislili su, čak i ako je
bila mrtva osoba,
bila mrtva osoba,
13:53
they meant that she was still around.
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mislili su da je i dalje živa.
13:56
So in large parts of the world today,
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U većini delova sveta danas,
13:59
that separation between science and religion
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to razdvajnje između nauke i religije
14:01
hasn't occurred in large parts of the world today,
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nije se dogodilo,
14:02
and as I say, these are not --
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i kao što sam rekao, to nisu -
14:06
This guy used to work for Chase and at the World Bank.
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Ovaj momak je radio
za Čejs i Svetsku banku.
za Čejs i Svetsku banku.
14:11
These are fellow citizens of the world with you,
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Ovo su stanovnici sveta zajedno sa vama
14:14
but they come from a place in which religion
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ali dolaze iz mesta u kojem religija
14:15
is occupying a very different role.
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igra veoma različitu ulogu.
14:17
So what I want you to think about
next time somebody wants
next time somebody wants
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Sledeći put kad neko želi
14:19
to make some vast generalization about religion
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da napravi široku
generalizaciju o religiji
generalizaciju o religiji
14:22
is that maybe there isn't such a thing
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želim da pomislite da možda
ne postoji religija,
ne postoji religija,
14:25
as a religion, such a thing as religion,
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religija kao takva,
14:27
and that therefore what they say
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i stoga ono što kažu
14:29
cannot possibly be true.
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ne može sigurno biti istina.
14:32
(Applause)
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(Aplauz)
ABOUT THE SPEAKER
Kwame Anthony Appiah - PhilosopherKwame Anthony Appiah is a philosopher, cultural theorist and novelist. His latest book is "The Honor Code," exploring moral revolutions.
Why you should listen
Kwame Anthony Appiah works on political and moral theory, the philosophy of language and mind, and African intellectual history. In his 2010 book The Honor Code, he explores a hidden engine of reform: appeals to honor. Examining moral revolutions in the past—and campaigns against abhorrent practices today—he shows that appeals to reason, morality, or religion aren’t enough to ring in reform.
He's the author of Lines of Descent, a thoughtful look at the career of sociologist W.E.B. DuBois, and Cosmopolitanism: Ethics in a World of Strangers, which studied "the powerful ties that connect people across religions, culture and nations … and of the deep conflicts within them." In 2008, Appiah published Experiments in Ethics, in which he reviews the relevance of empirical research to ethical theory. Appiah has also published several novels, including Avenging Angel, Nobody Likes Letitia and Another Death in Venice.
Kwame Anthony Appiah | Speaker | TED.com