TED2017
Tristan Harris: How a handful of tech companies control billions of minds every day
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A handful of people working at a handful of tech companies steer the thoughts of billions of people every day, says design thinker Tristan Harris. From Facebook notifications to Snapstreaks to YouTube autoplays, they're all competing for one thing: your attention. Harris shares how these companies prey on our psychology for their own profit and calls for a design renaissance in which our tech instead encourages us to live out the timeline we want.
Tristan Harris - Design thinker
Tristan Harris helps the technology industry more consciously and ethically shape the human spirit and human potential. Full bio
Tristan Harris helps the technology industry more consciously and ethically shape the human spirit and human potential. Full bio
Double-click the English transcript below to play the video.
00:12
I want you to imagine
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walking into a room,
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a control room with a bunch of people,
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a hundred people, hunched
over a desk with little dials,
over a desk with little dials,
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and that that control room
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will shape the thoughts and feelings
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of a billion people.
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This might sound like science fiction,
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but this actually exists
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right now, today.
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I know because I used to be
in one of those control rooms.
in one of those control rooms.
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I was a design ethicist at Google,
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where I studied how do you ethically
steer people's thoughts?
steer people's thoughts?
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Because what we don't talk about
is how the handful of people
is how the handful of people
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working at a handful
of technology companies
of technology companies
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through their choices will steer
what a billion people are thinking today.
what a billion people are thinking today.
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Because when you pull out your phone
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and they design how this works
or what's on the feed,
or what's on the feed,
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it's scheduling little blocks
of time in our minds.
of time in our minds.
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If you see a notification,
it schedules you to have thoughts
it schedules you to have thoughts
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that maybe you didn't intend to have.
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If you swipe over that notification,
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it schedules you into spending
a little bit of time
a little bit of time
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getting sucked into something
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that maybe you didn't intend
to get sucked into.
to get sucked into.
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When we talk about technology,
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we tend to talk about it
as this blue sky opportunity.
as this blue sky opportunity.
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It could go any direction.
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And I want to get serious for a moment
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and tell you why it's going
in a very specific direction.
in a very specific direction.
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Because it's not evolving randomly.
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There's a hidden goal
driving the direction
driving the direction
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of all of the technology we make,
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and that goal is the race
for our attention.
for our attention.
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Because every new site --
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TED, elections, politicians,
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games, even meditation apps --
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have to compete for one thing,
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which is our attention,
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and there's only so much of it.
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And the best way to get people's attention
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is to know how someone's mind works.
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And there's a whole bunch
of persuasive techniques
of persuasive techniques
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that I learned in college at a lab
called the Persuasive Technology Lab
called the Persuasive Technology Lab
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to get people's attention.
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A simple example is YouTube.
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YouTube wants to maximize
how much time you spend.
how much time you spend.
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And so what do they do?
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They autoplay the next video.
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And let's say that works really well.
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They're getting a little bit
more of people's time.
more of people's time.
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Well, if you're Netflix,
you look at that and say,
you look at that and say,
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well, that's shrinking my market share,
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so I'm going to autoplay the next episode.
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But then if you're Facebook,
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you say, that's shrinking
all of my market share,
all of my market share,
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so now I have to autoplay
all the videos in the newsfeed
all the videos in the newsfeed
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before waiting for you to click play.
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So the internet is not evolving at random.
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The reason it feels
like it's sucking us in the way it is
like it's sucking us in the way it is
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is because of this race for attention.
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We know where this is going.
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Technology is not neutral,
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and it becomes this race
to the bottom of the brain stem
to the bottom of the brain stem
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of who can go lower to get it.
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Let me give you an example of Snapchat.
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If you didn't know,
Snapchat is the number one way
Snapchat is the number one way
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that teenagers in
the United States communicate.
the United States communicate.
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So if you're like me, and you use
text messages to communicate,
text messages to communicate,
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Snapchat is that for teenagers,
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and there's, like,
a hundred million of them that use it.
a hundred million of them that use it.
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And they invented
a feature called Snapstreaks,
a feature called Snapstreaks,
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which shows the number of days in a row
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that two people have
communicated with each other.
communicated with each other.
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In other words, what they just did
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is they gave two people
something they don't want to lose.
something they don't want to lose.
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Because if you're a teenager,
and you have 150 days in a row,
and you have 150 days in a row,
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you don't want that to go away.
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And so think of the little blocks of time
that that schedules in kids' minds.
that that schedules in kids' minds.
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This isn't theoretical:
when kids go on vacation,
when kids go on vacation,
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it's been shown they give their passwords
to up to five other friends
to up to five other friends
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to keep their Snapstreaks going,
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even when they can't do it.
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And they have, like, 30 of these things,
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and so they have to get through
taking photos of just pictures or walls
taking photos of just pictures or walls
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or ceilings just to get through their day.
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So it's not even like
they're having real conversations.
they're having real conversations.
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We have a temptation to think about this
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as, oh, they're just using Snapchat
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the way we used to
gossip on the telephone.
gossip on the telephone.
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It's probably OK.
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Well, what this misses
is that in the 1970s,
is that in the 1970s,
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when you were just
gossiping on the telephone,
gossiping on the telephone,
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there wasn't a hundred engineers
on the other side of the screen
on the other side of the screen
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who knew exactly
how your psychology worked
how your psychology worked
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and orchestrated you
into a double bind with each other.
into a double bind with each other.
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Now, if this is making you
feel a little bit of outrage,
feel a little bit of outrage,
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notice that that thought
just comes over you.
just comes over you.
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Outrage is a really good way also
of getting your attention,
of getting your attention,
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because we don't choose outrage.
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It happens to us.
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And if you're the Facebook newsfeed,
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whether you'd want to or not,
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you actually benefit when there's outrage.
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Because outrage
doesn't just schedule a reaction
doesn't just schedule a reaction
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in emotional time, space, for you.
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We want to share that outrage
with other people.
with other people.
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So we want to hit share and say,
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"Can you believe the thing
that they said?"
that they said?"
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And so outrage works really well
at getting attention,
at getting attention,
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such that if Facebook had a choice
between showing you the outrage feed
between showing you the outrage feed
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and a calm newsfeed,
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they would want
to show you the outrage feed,
to show you the outrage feed,
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not because someone
consciously chose that,
consciously chose that,
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but because that worked better
at getting your attention.
at getting your attention.
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And the newsfeed control room
is not accountable to us.
is not accountable to us.
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It's only accountable
to maximizing attention.
to maximizing attention.
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It's also accountable,
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because of the business model
of advertising,
of advertising,
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for anybody who can pay the most
to actually walk into the control room
to actually walk into the control room
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and say, "That group over there,
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I want to schedule these thoughts
into their minds."
into their minds."
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So you can target,
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you can precisely target a lie
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directly to the people
who are most susceptible.
who are most susceptible.
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And because this is profitable,
it's only going to get worse.
it's only going to get worse.
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So I'm here today
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because the costs are so obvious.
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I don't know a more urgent
problem than this,
problem than this,
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because this problem
is underneath all other problems.
is underneath all other problems.
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It's not just taking away our agency
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to spend our attention
and live the lives that we want,
and live the lives that we want,
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it's changing the way
that we have our conversations,
that we have our conversations,
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it's changing our democracy,
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and it's changing our ability
to have the conversations
to have the conversations
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and relationships we want with each other.
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And it affects everyone,
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because a billion people
have one of these in their pocket.
have one of these in their pocket.
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So how do we fix this?
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We need to make three radical changes
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to technology and to our society.
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The first is we need to acknowledge
that we are persuadable.
that we are persuadable.
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Once you start understanding
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that your mind can be scheduled
into having little thoughts
into having little thoughts
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or little blocks of time
that you didn't choose,
that you didn't choose,
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wouldn't we want to use that understanding
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and protect against the way
that that happens?
that that happens?
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I think we need to see ourselves
fundamentally in a new way.
fundamentally in a new way.
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It's almost like a new period
of human history,
of human history,
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like the Enlightenment,
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but almost a kind of
self-aware Enlightenment,
self-aware Enlightenment,
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that we can be persuaded,
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and there might be something
we want to protect.
we want to protect.
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The second is we need new models
and accountability systems
and accountability systems
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so that as the world gets better
and more and more persuasive over time --
and more and more persuasive over time --
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because it's only going
to get more persuasive --
to get more persuasive --
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that the people in those control rooms
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are accountable and transparent
to what we want.
to what we want.
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The only form of ethical
persuasion that exists
persuasion that exists
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is when the goals of the persuader
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are aligned with the goals
of the persuadee.
of the persuadee.
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And that involves questioning big things,
like the business model of advertising.
like the business model of advertising.
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Lastly,
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we need a design renaissance,
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because once you have
this view of human nature,
this view of human nature,
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that you can steer the timelines
of a billion people --
of a billion people --
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just imagine, there's people
who have some desire
who have some desire
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about what they want to do
and what they want to be thinking
and what they want to be thinking
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and what they want to be feeling
and how they want to be informed,
and how they want to be informed,
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and we're all just tugged
into these other directions.
into these other directions.
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And you have a billion people just tugged
into all these different directions.
into all these different directions.
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Well, imagine an entire design renaissance
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that tried to orchestrate
the exact and most empowering
the exact and most empowering
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time-well-spent way
for those timelines to happen.
for those timelines to happen.
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And that would involve two things:
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one would be protecting
against the timelines
against the timelines
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that we don't want to be experiencing,
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the thoughts that we
wouldn't want to be happening,
wouldn't want to be happening,
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so that when that ding happens,
not having the ding that sends us away;
not having the ding that sends us away;
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and the second would be empowering us
to live out the timeline that we want.
to live out the timeline that we want.
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So let me give you a concrete example.
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Today, let's say your friend
cancels dinner on you,
cancels dinner on you,
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and you are feeling a little bit lonely.
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And so what do you do in that moment?
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You open up Facebook.
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And in that moment,
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the designers in the control room
want to schedule exactly one thing,
want to schedule exactly one thing,
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which is to maximize how much time
you spend on the screen.
you spend on the screen.
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Now, instead, imagine if those designers
created a different timeline
created a different timeline
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that was the easiest way,
using all of their data,
using all of their data,
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to actually help you get out
with the people that you care about?
with the people that you care about?
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Just think, alleviating
all loneliness in society,
all loneliness in society,
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if that was the timeline that Facebook
wanted to make possible for people.
wanted to make possible for people.
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Or imagine a different conversation.
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Let's say you wanted to post
something supercontroversial on Facebook,
something supercontroversial on Facebook,
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which is a really important
thing to be able to do,
thing to be able to do,
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to talk about controversial topics.
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And right now, when there's
that big comment box,
that big comment box,
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it's almost asking you,
what key do you want to type?
what key do you want to type?
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In other words, it's scheduling
a little timeline of things
a little timeline of things
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you're going to continue
to do on the screen.
to do on the screen.
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And imagine instead that there was
another button there saying,
another button there saying,
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what would be most
time well spent for you?
time well spent for you?
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And you click "host a dinner."
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And right there
underneath the item it said,
underneath the item it said,
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"Who wants to RSVP for the dinner?"
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And so you'd still have a conversation
about something controversial,
about something controversial,
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but you'd be having it in the most
empowering place on your timeline,
empowering place on your timeline,
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which would be at home that night
with a bunch of a friends over
with a bunch of a friends over
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to talk about it.
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So imagine we're running, like,
a find and replace
a find and replace
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on all of the timelines
that are currently steering us
that are currently steering us
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towards more and more
screen time persuasively
screen time persuasively
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and replacing all of those timelines
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with what do we want in our lives.
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It doesn't have to be this way.
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Instead of handicapping our attention,
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imagine if we used all of this data
and all of this power
and all of this power
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and this new view of human nature
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to give us a superhuman ability to focus
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and a superhuman ability to put
our attention to what we cared about
our attention to what we cared about
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and a superhuman ability
to have the conversations
to have the conversations
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that we need to have for democracy.
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The most complex challenges in the world
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require not just us
to use our attention individually.
to use our attention individually.
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They require us to use our attention
and coordinate it together.
and coordinate it together.
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Climate change is going to require
that a lot of people
that a lot of people
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are being able
to coordinate their attention
to coordinate their attention
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in the most empowering way together.
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And imagine creating
a superhuman ability to do that.
a superhuman ability to do that.
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Sometimes the world's
most pressing and important problems
most pressing and important problems
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are not these hypothetical future things
that we could create in the future.
that we could create in the future.
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Sometimes the most pressing problems
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are the ones that are
right underneath our noses,
right underneath our noses,
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the things that are already directing
a billion people's thoughts.
a billion people's thoughts.
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And maybe instead of getting excited
about the new augmented reality
about the new augmented reality
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and virtual reality
and these cool things that could happen,
and these cool things that could happen,
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which are going to be susceptible
to the same race for attention,
to the same race for attention,
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if we could fix the race for attention
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on the thing that's already
in a billion people's pockets.
in a billion people's pockets.
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Maybe instead of getting excited
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about the most exciting
new cool fancy education apps,
new cool fancy education apps,
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we could fix the way
kids' minds are getting manipulated
kids' minds are getting manipulated
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into sending empty messages
back and forth.
back and forth.
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(Applause)
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Maybe instead of worrying
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about hypothetical future
runaway artificial intelligences
runaway artificial intelligences
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that are maximizing for one goal,
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we could solve the runaway
artificial intelligence
artificial intelligence
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that already exists right now,
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which are these newsfeeds
maximizing for one thing.
maximizing for one thing.
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It's almost like instead of running away
to colonize new planets,
to colonize new planets,
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we could fix the one
that we're already on.
that we're already on.
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(Applause)
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Solving this problem
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is critical infrastructure
for solving every other problem.
for solving every other problem.
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There's nothing in your life
or in our collective problems
or in our collective problems
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that does not require our ability
to put our attention where we care about.
to put our attention where we care about.
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At the end of our lives,
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all we have is our attention and our time.
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What will be time well spent for ours?
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Thank you.
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(Applause)
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Chris Anderson: Tristan, thank you.
Hey, stay up here a sec.
Hey, stay up here a sec.
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First of all, thank you.
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I know we asked you to do this talk
on pretty short notice,
on pretty short notice,
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and you've had quite a stressful week
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getting this thing together, so thank you.
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Some people listening might say,
what you complain about is addiction,
what you complain about is addiction,
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and all these people doing this stuff,
for them it's actually interesting.
for them it's actually interesting.
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All these design decisions
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have built user content
that is fantastically interesting.
that is fantastically interesting.
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The world's more interesting
than it ever has been.
than it ever has been.
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What's wrong with that?
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Tristan Harris:
I think it's really interesting.
I think it's really interesting.
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One way to see this
is if you're just YouTube, for example,
is if you're just YouTube, for example,
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you want to always show
the more interesting next video.
the more interesting next video.
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You want to get better and better
at suggesting that next video,
at suggesting that next video,
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but even if you could propose
the perfect next video
the perfect next video
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that everyone would want to watch,
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it would just be better and better
at keeping you hooked on the screen.
at keeping you hooked on the screen.
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So what's missing in that equation
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is figuring out what
our boundaries would be.
our boundaries would be.
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You would want YouTube to know
something about, say, falling asleep.
something about, say, falling asleep.
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The CEO of Netflix recently said,
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"our biggest competitors
are Facebook, YouTube and sleep."
are Facebook, YouTube and sleep."
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And so what we need to recognize
is that the human architecture is limited
is that the human architecture is limited
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and that we have certain boundaries
or dimensions of our lives
or dimensions of our lives
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that we want to be honored and respected,
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and technology could help do that.
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(Applause)
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CA: I mean, could you make the case
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that part of the problem here is that
we've got a naïve model of human nature?
we've got a naïve model of human nature?
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So much of this is justified
in terms of human preference,
in terms of human preference,
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where we've got these algorithms
that do an amazing job
that do an amazing job
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of optimizing for human preference,
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but which preference?
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There's the preferences
of things that we really care about
of things that we really care about
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when we think about them
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versus the preferences
of what we just instinctively click on.
of what we just instinctively click on.
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If we could implant that more nuanced
view of human nature in every design,
view of human nature in every design,
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would that be a step forward?
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TH: Absolutely. I mean, I think right now
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it's as if all of our technology
is basically only asking our lizard brain
is basically only asking our lizard brain
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what's the best way
to just impulsively get you to do
to just impulsively get you to do
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the next tiniest thing with your time,
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instead of asking you in your life
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what we would be most
time well spent for you?
time well spent for you?
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What would be the perfect timeline
that might include something later,
that might include something later,
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would be time well spent for you
here at TED in your last day here?
here at TED in your last day here?
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CA: So if Facebook and Google
and everyone said to us first up,
and everyone said to us first up,
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"Hey, would you like us
to optimize for your reflective brain
to optimize for your reflective brain
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or your lizard brain? You choose."
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TH: Right. That would be one way. Yes.
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CA: You said persuadability,
that's an interesting word to me
that's an interesting word to me
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because to me there's
two different types of persuadability.
two different types of persuadability.
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There's the persuadability
that we're trying right now
that we're trying right now
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of reason and thinking
and making an argument,
and making an argument,
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but I think you're almost
talking about a different kind,
talking about a different kind,
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a more visceral type of persuadability,
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of being persuaded without
even knowing that you're thinking.
even knowing that you're thinking.
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TH: Exactly. The reason
I care about this problem so much is
I care about this problem so much is
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I studied at a lab called
the Persuasive Technology Lab at Stanford
the Persuasive Technology Lab at Stanford
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that taught people
exactly these techniques.
exactly these techniques.
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There's conferences and workshops
that teach people all these covert ways
that teach people all these covert ways
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of getting people's attention
and orchestrating people's lives.
and orchestrating people's lives.
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And it's because most people
don't know that that exists
don't know that that exists
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that this conversation is so important.
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CA: Tristan, you and I, we both know
so many people from all these companies.
so many people from all these companies.
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There are actually many here in the room,
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and I don't know about you,
but my experience of them
but my experience of them
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is that there is
no shortage of good intent.
no shortage of good intent.
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People want a better world.
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They are actually -- they really want it.
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And I don't think anything you're saying
is that these are evil people.
is that these are evil people.
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It's a system where there's
these unintended consequences
these unintended consequences
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that have really got out of control --
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TH: Of this race for attention.
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It's the classic race to the bottom
when you have to get attention,
when you have to get attention,
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and it's so tense.
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The only way to get more
is to go lower on the brain stem,
is to go lower on the brain stem,
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to go lower into outrage,
to go lower into emotion,
to go lower into emotion,
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to go lower into the lizard brain.
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CA: Well, thank you so much for helping us
all get a little bit wiser about this.
all get a little bit wiser about this.
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Tristan Harris, thank you.
TH: Thank you very much.
TH: Thank you very much.
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(Applause)
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ABOUT THE SPEAKER
Tristan Harris - Design thinkerTristan Harris helps the technology industry more consciously and ethically shape the human spirit and human potential.
Why you should listen
Tristan Harris has been called "the closest thing Silicon Valley has to a conscience" by The Atlantic magazine. Prior to founding the new Center for Humane Technology, he was Google's Design Ethicist, developing a framework for how technology should "ethically" steer the thoughts and actions of billions of people from screens.
Harris has spent a decade understanding the invisible influences that hijack human thinking and action. Drawing on literature from addiction, performative magic, social engineering, persuasive design and behavioral economics, he is currently developing a framework for ethical persuasion, especially as it relates to the moral responsibility of technology companies.
Rolling Stone magazine named Harris one of "25 People Shaping the World" in 2017. His work has been featured on TED, "60 Minutes," HBO's "RealTime with Bill Maher," "PBS NewsHour," Recode, The Atlantic, WIRED, the New York Times, Der Spiegel, The Economist and many more. Harris has briefed heads of state, technology company CEOs and members of the US Congress about the attention economy.
Tristan Harris | Speaker | TED.com