Jonathan Haidt: Can a divided America heal?
جاناتان هیت: آیا گسستگی در ملت آمریکا التیام پذیر است؟
Jonathan Haidt studies how -- and why -- we evolved to be moral and political creatures. Full bioChris Anderson - TED Curator
After a long career in journalism and publishing, Chris Anderson became the curator of the TED Conference in 2002 and has developed it as a platform for identifying and disseminating ideas worth spreading. Full bio
Double-click the English transcript below to play the video.
ترسناک به نظر می رسه.
in the way that we're familiar with,
که برای ما آشنا نیست،
and how did we get here?
که به این جا رسیدیم؟
apocalyptic sort of feeling.
that the other side is not just --
حق با طرف مقابل نیست--
we strongly dislike them,
به شدت ازشون متنفریم،
a threat to the nation.
برای کشور هستند.
now on both sides.
به ٥٠ درصد رسیده.
than before; it's much more intense.
میکنه؛ خیلی شدیدتره.
at any sort of social puzzle,
نگاه میکنم،
principles of moral psychology,
استفاده میکنم،
به ما کمک میکنه.
have to always keep in mind
باید در ذهن داشته باشید
insights into human social nature
دیدگاهها نسبت به سرشت اجتماعی بشر
against the stranger."
در مقابل غریبه."
to create large societies
جوامع بزرگ ایجاد کنیم
in order to compete with others.
تا با دیگران رقابت کنیم.
and out of small groups,
کوچک رو پشت سر گذاشتیم،
eternal conflict.
تعارض همیشگی داریم.
are making that more bitter,
برامون تلخ تره،
baked into most people's mental wiring
ذهنیت بیشتر مردم هست
a basic aspect of human social cognition.
شناخت اجتماعی بشر هست.
really peacefully,
زندگی صلح آمیز داشته باشیم،
of fun ways of, like, playing war.
که در واقع در اونها داریم می جنگیم.
to exercise this tribal nature
تمرین همون ماهیت قبیله ای است
and exploration and meeting new people.
و آدمهای جدید پیدا و ملاقات کنیم.
as something that goes up or down --
اینطور نگاه کنیم که فراز و فرود داره--
to always be fighting each other,
حتماً باید همه با هم بجنگیم،
can shrink or expand.
"ما" تلقی میکنیم
could continue indefinitely.
میتونه تا بی نهایت ادامه پیدا کنه.
the sense of tribe for a while.
حس قبیله گرایی رو توسعه دادیم.
the new left-right distinction.
که حدفاصل جدید چپ و راسته.
as we've all inherited it,
که همه ما به ارث بردیم،
versus capital distinction,
now, increasingly,
به طور فزاینده می بینیم
who want to stop at nation,
of a sense of being rooted,
ریشه دار بودن دارند،
their community and their nation.
و کشور خود اهمیت میدهند.
anti-parochial and who --
of the John Lennon song "Imagine."
به ترانه جان لنون فکر میکنم "تصور کن":
nothing to kill or die for."
چیزی برای کشتن یا مردن نیست."
who want more global governance,
که اداره جهانی بیشتری میخوان،
they don't like borders.
مرزها رو دوست ندارن.
actually, his name is Shakespeare --
در واقع اسمش شکسپیره--
or drawbridge-downers?"
یا در قلعه بسته باشه؟"
52-48 on that point.
به نسبت ٤٨ به ٥٢ تقسیم میشه.
who grew up with The Beatles
اونایی از ما که با بیتل ها بزرگ شدیم
of dreaming of a more connected world --
و رؤیای جهان متحد--
anyone think badly about that?"
"چگونه کسی میتونه درباره ش فکر بد بکنه؟"
feel that that isn't just silly;
حس میکنن اون نه تنها احمقانه
and they're scared of it.
و ازش میترسن.
in Europe but also here,
در اروپا اما همچنین اینجا،
we have to look very carefully
که باید بسیار با دقت
about diversity and immigration.
و مهاجرت نگاه کنیم.
that the left loves and the right --
چپ دوست داره و راست--
can't think straight about it.
نمیتونن صراحتاً به اون بپردازن.
has grown enormously from it.
رشد فاحش داشته.
do a lot of good things.
کارهای خوب زیادی میکنن.
I think, don't see,
فکر کنم نمی بینن،
cuts social capital and trust.
اتحاد و اعتماد اجتماعی رو کاهش میده.
study by Robert Putnam,
توسط رابرت پوتنام هست،
feel that they are the same,
احساس کنن یکسان هستن،
a redistributionist welfare state.
توضیع رفاه داشته باشن.
of being small, homogenous countries.
که کشورهای کوچک و یکدستی باشن.
a progressive welfare state,
left-leaning values, which says,
متمایل به چپ هستند که میگه،
The world is a great place.
دنیا جای خوبیه.
we must welcome them in."
باید بهشون خوشامد بگیم."
this summer,
در سوئد بودم--
is fairly politically correct
از نظر سیاسی کاملاً درست باشه
as we have in America,
در آمریکا، منجر بشه
racially divided, society.
-- به وضوح گسسته از نظر نژادی.
uncomfortable to talk about.
especially in Europe and for us, too,
و همچنین اروپا،
themselves not racists,
humans are just too different;
our sense of what humans are capable of,
تواناییهای بشر هستیم، اگر
much more palatable
scientist named Karen Stenner,
علوم سیاسی به نام کارن استنر هست
we're all the same,
همه یکسان هستیم،
a predisposition to authoritarianism.
به استبداد دارن.
there's not a threat
people are getting more different,
تفاوت افراد داره زیاد میشه،
they want to kick out the deviants.
میخوان متفاوتها رو بیرون کنن.
an authoritarian reaction.
the Lennonist line --
an authoritarian reaction.
واکنش استبدادی ایجاد میکنه.
in America with the alt-right.
در جناح راست می بینیم.
we've seen it all over Europe.
اینو در همه جای اروپا دیدیم.
or the nationalists, are actually right --
بومی گرایان یا ملی گرایان است--
our cultural similarity,
matter very much.
approach to immigration
a generous welfare state,
برای شما ارزشمند باشد،
that we're all the same.
که همه ما یکسان هستیم.
and fears about that
و ترسهای ناشی از آن
of the current divide.
strategic reasoning second.
دوم تفکر راهبردی میاد.
the term "motivated reasoning"
and our verbal abilities
و توانایی های کلامی ما
not to help us find out the truth,
که نتونیم پی به حقیقت ببریم،
defend our reputation ...
و از شهرت خود دفاع کنیم.
at justifying ourselves.
واقعاً، واقعاً خوب هستیم.
group interests into account,
it's my team versus your team,
گروه منه در مقال گروه شما،
that your side is wrong,
که طرف شما اشتباه میکنه،
a political argument.
در یه بحث سیاسی پیروز بشین
with reasons and evidence,
با منطق و مدرک قانع کرد،
the way reasoning works.
give us Google:
گوگل رو به ما بدین؛
was born in Kenya.
10 million hits! Look, he was!"
١٠ میلیون بار! درسته!"
surprise to a lot of people.
شگفتی و ناراحتی خیلی ها شده.
by techno-optimists
افراد خوش بین به فناوری است
that would bring people together.
میتونه افراد رو کنار هم جمع کنه.
unexpected counter-effects to that.
و غیرمنتظره روبرو میشیم.
of yin-yang views
دیدگاههای یین- یانگ
و چپ- راست هستم--
about certain things,
برخی موارد حق داره،
that human nature is good:
که انسان ذاتاً خوبه:
the walls and all will be well.
خراب کن و همه خوب خواهند بود.
not libertarians --
اجتماعی، نه لیبرال ها--
believe people can be greedy
مردم ممکنه حریص
and we need restrictions.
نیاز به محدودیت داریم.
all over the world,
با هم ارتباط برقرار کنن،
و نژادپرستی است.
have been with us forever.
this feeling of division?
گسستگی رو شدیدتر کرده؟
different threads all coming together.
با هم در نظر بگیرید.
actually, America and Europe --
-- در واقع در آمریکا و اروپا--
from Joe Henrich and others
in a commons dilemma
دوراهی تعارض منافع آزمایش میکنیم
اگه شما--
during World War II,
نوجوان بودند،
looking for scraps of aluminum
دنبال تکه های آلومینیم
همه با هم می کشیدن.
and government,
at compromise and cooperation.
واقعاً خوبن.
by the end of the '90s.
نسل بیبی بومر طرف هستیم.
each other within each country,
با یکدیگر در داخل هر کشور شد،
"The Greatest Generation,"
"بزرگترین نسل،"
is the purification of the two parties.
تصفیه دو حزبه.
and conservative Democrats.
و دموکرات محافظه کار وجود داشت.
that was really bipartisan.
که واقعاً دوحزبی بود.
that started things moving,
این چیزها شروع به تغییر کرد،
liberal party and conservative party.
و یه حزب محافظه کار خالص داشتیم.
really are different,
واقعاً متفاوت هستن،
our children to marry them,
بچه هامون با اونها ازدواج کنن،
didn't matter very much.
دهه ٦٠ زیاد مهم نبود.
و همون طور که گفتم،
for post-hoc reasoning and demonization.
استدلال و تسویه حساب بعد از واقعه است.
on the internet now is quite troubling.
اینترنت کاملاً دردسرسازه.
on Twitter about the election
درباره انتخاب کردم
brought to us by #Trump."
توسط #ترامپ رایج شد."
dedication page. Disgusting!"
هیلاری دروغگو. چندش آور!"
is troubling to me.
منو اذیت میکنه.
or a disagreement about something,
بحث کنین یا موافقش نباشین،
takes things to a much deeper level.
چیزها رو عمیق تر می کنه.
you get angry, you're not angry;
عصبانی هستی، عصبانی نیستی؛
as subhuman, monstrous,
به مادون انسان، به هیولا،
on marital therapy.
درباره ازدواج درمانی.
of the couple shows disgust or contempt,
از دیگری چندشش بشه یا تحقیرش کنه،
to get divorced soon,
از هم جدا خواهند شد،
that doesn't predict anything,
این چیزی رو پیش بینی نمیکنه،
it actually is good.
در واقع چیز خوبیه.
uses the word "disgust" a lot.
"چندش" زیاد استفاده میکنه.
so disgust does matter a lot --
پس چندش خیلی مهمه--
unique to him --
که منحصر به اوست--
اهریمنی تر جلوه میدهیم،
the Manichaean worldview,
is a battle between good and evil
نبرد بین خیر و شر است
they're wrong or I don't like them,
اشتباه میکنن یا ازشون خوشمون نمیاد،
for example, on campus now.
مثلاً در دانشگاه می بینیم.
to keep people off campus,
generation of young people,
involves a lot of disgust,
با چندش فراوان همراه باشه،
in politics as they get older.
در سیاست دخالت کنند.
and I think about emotions a lot.
و درباره عواطف زیلد فکر میکنم،
of disgust is actually love.
در واقع عشقه.
powerful means we have.
که در اختیار داریم.
that they're lovely.
که اونها دوست داشتنی هستن.
or changes your category as well.
یا دسته بندی شما هم تغییر میکنه.
much more mixed up in the their towns
در شهرهاشون بسیار مختلط تر بودن
this great moral divide,
ایجاد شده،
that we're moving to be near people
کوچ میکنیم تا نزدیک افرادی باشیم
who's on the other side.
طرف دیگه باشه سخت تر شده.
or say to Americans,
about each other
چی باید بفهمیم
یک دقیقه دوباره فکر کنیم
thing to keep in mind --
که باید به خاطر بسپاریم--
scientist Alan Abramowitz,
آلن آبرامویتز هست،
is increasingly governed
به طور فزاینده توسط چیزی
OK there's a candidate,
خب، یه کاندیدا هست،
you vote for the candidate.
به کاندیدا رأی میدی.
and all sorts of other trends,
و انواع گرایش های دیگه،
the other side so horrible, so awful,
طرف دیگه رو خراب کنه،
against the other side
علیه طرف مقابل رأی بدی
that if people are on the left,
که اگه افراد سمت چپ،
that Republicans were bad,
جمهوریخواهها بد هستن، اما
I can paint with all the things
میتونم همه رو به شکلی ببینم
with their candidate.
راضی نیستن.
election in American history.
در تاریخ انتخابات آمریکاست.
your feelings about the candidate
درباره کاندیدا
who are given a choice.
میخوان انتخابش کنن جدا کنی،
in a separate moral world --
زندگی می کنیم
is that we're all trapped in "The Matrix,"
اینه که همه در "ماتریکس" به دام افتادیم
a consensual hallucination.
یه توهم چندجانبه.
that the other side --
که طرف دیگه
they're the worst people in the world,
بدترین آدمهای روی زمین هستن،
to back that up.
different set of facts.
different threats to the country.
برای کشور می بینه.
from being in the middle
از اینکه وسط باشی
is: both sides are right.
یعنی: حق با هر دو طرفه.
to this country,
incapable of seeing them all.
همه اونها رو ببینه.
that we almost need a new type of empathy?
به نوع جدیدی از هم دردی نیاز داریم؟
I can put myself in your shoes."
میتونم خودمو جای تو بذارم."
the needy, the suffering.
دردمندان، به کار میبریم.
to people who we feel as other,
استفاده نمی کنیم، یا اونایی که
to build that type of empathy?
هم دردی ایجاد بشه؟
hot topic in psychology,
داغی در روانشناسی است،
on the left in particular.
به ویژه در جناح چپه.
for the preferred classes of victims.
برای گروههای ارجحی از قربانیان.
think are so important.
فکر میکنیم خیلی مهم هستن.
because you get points for that.
چون به خاطرش تشویق میشین.
if you do it when it's hard to do.
که انجامش سخت باشه.
of dealing with our race problems
با مشکلات نژادی سروکله زدیم
for a long time
اولویت اول ما بود
threat on our hands.
دم دست داریم.
divide we face.
and gender and LGBT,
و جنسیت و دگرباشان جنسی داریم
of the next 50 years,
to get better on their own.
a lot of institutional reforms,
فراوان خواهیم داشت،
wonky conversation.
پرحاشیه ای خواهد بود.
realizing that this is a turning point.
که مردم متوجه بشن این یه نقطه عطفه.
از هم دردی داریم.
if you don't want to --
اگه نمی خواین--
to spend the next four years
اگه میخواین جهار سال آینده رو
for the last year -- raise your hand.
باشین-- دستتون رو بلند کنین.
read Marcus Aurelius.
مارک اورلیوس بخونین.
for how to drop the fear,
درباره رها کردن ترس،
wisdom for this kind of empathy.
درباره این نوع هم دردی هست.
people do to help heal?
تا خوب بشن؟
to overcome your deepest prejudices.
به عمیق ترین تعصب هاتون غلبه کنین.
and stronger than race prejudices
عمیق تر و قویتر از
that's the main thing.
این مسئله اصلی است.
awful for one of you --
ناخوشایند باشه--
reach out and say you want to talk.
و بعد برین و بگین میخواین حرف بزنین.
Friends and Influence People" --
"آیین دوست یابی"--
if you start by acknowledging,
به شرطی که با قدردانی شروع کنید.
about you, Uncle Bob,"
به تو، عمو باب،" یا
احترام میذارم، اینه که ..."
appreciation, it's like magic.
مثل معجزه س.
things I've learned
که یاد گرفتم
at apologizing now,
خیلی خوب هستم،
somebody was right about.
شخصی در موردی حق داشته.
and it's actually really fun.
و واقعاً خوش میگذره.
speaking with you.
واقعاً دلچسبه.
the ground that we're on
که در اون هستیم
of morality and human nature.
درباره اخلاق و فطرت بشر.
this time with us.
در اختیار ما گذاشتی.
ABOUT THE SPEAKERS
Jonathan Haidt - Social psychologistJonathan Haidt studies how -- and why -- we evolved to be moral and political creatures.
Why you should listen
By understanding more about our moral psychology and its biases, Jonathan Haidt says we can design better institutions (including companies, universities and democracy itself), and we can learn to be more civil and open-minded toward those who are not on our team.
Haidt is a social psychologist whose research on morality across cultures led to his 2008 TED Talk on the psychological roots of the American culture war, and his 2013 TED Talk on how "common threats can make common ground." In both of those talks he asks, "Can't we all disagree more constructively?" Haidt's 2012 TED Talk explored the intersection of his work on morality with his work on happiness to talk about "hive psychology" -- the ability that humans have to lose themselves in groups pursuing larger projects, almost like bees in a hive. This hivish ability is crucial, he argues, for understanding the origins of morality, politics, and religion. These are ideas that Haidt develops at greater length in his book, The Righteous Mind: Why Good People are Divided by Politics and Religion.
Haidt joined New York University Stern School of Business in July 2011. He is the Thomas Cooley Professor of Ethical Leadership, based in the Business and Society Program. Before coming to Stern, Professor Haidt taught for 16 years at the University of Virginia in the department of psychology.
Haidt's writings appear frequently in the New York Times and The Wall Street Journal. He was named one of the top global thinkers by Foreign Policy magazine and by Prospect magazine. Haidt received a B.A. in Philosophy from Yale University, and an M.A. and Ph.D. in Psychology from the University of Pennsylvania.
Jonathan Haidt | Speaker | TED.com
Chris Anderson - TED Curator
After a long career in journalism and publishing, Chris Anderson became the curator of the TED Conference in 2002 and has developed it as a platform for identifying and disseminating ideas worth spreading.
Why you should listen
Chris Anderson is the Curator of TED, a nonprofit devoted to sharing valuable ideas, primarily through the medium of 'TED Talks' -- short talks that are offered free online to a global audience.
Chris was born in a remote village in Pakistan in 1957. He spent his early years in India, Pakistan and Afghanistan, where his parents worked as medical missionaries, and he attended an American school in the Himalayas for his early education. After boarding school in Bath, England, he went on to Oxford University, graduating in 1978 with a degree in philosophy, politics and economics.
Chris then trained as a journalist, working in newspapers and radio, including two years producing a world news service in the Seychelles Islands.
Back in the UK in 1984, Chris was captivated by the personal computer revolution and became an editor at one of the UK's early computer magazines. A year later he founded Future Publishing with a $25,000 bank loan. The new company initially focused on specialist computer publications but eventually expanded into other areas such as cycling, music, video games, technology and design, doubling in size every year for seven years. In 1994, Chris moved to the United States where he built Imagine Media, publisher of Business 2.0 magazine and creator of the popular video game users website IGN. Chris eventually merged Imagine and Future, taking the combined entity public in London in 1999, under the Future name. At its peak, it published 150 magazines and websites and employed 2,000 people.
This success allowed Chris to create a private nonprofit organization, the Sapling Foundation, with the hope of finding new ways to tackle tough global issues through media, technology, entrepreneurship and, most of all, ideas. In 2001, the foundation acquired the TED Conference, then an annual meeting of luminaries in the fields of Technology, Entertainment and Design held in Monterey, California, and Chris left Future to work full time on TED.
He expanded the conference's remit to cover all topics, including science, business and key global issues, while adding a Fellows program, which now has some 300 alumni, and the TED Prize, which grants its recipients "one wish to change the world." The TED stage has become a place for thinkers and doers from all fields to share their ideas and their work, capturing imaginations, sparking conversation and encouraging discovery along the way.
In 2006, TED experimented with posting some of its talks on the Internet. Their viral success encouraged Chris to begin positioning the organization as a global media initiative devoted to 'ideas worth spreading,' part of a new era of information dissemination using the power of online video. In June 2015, the organization posted its 2,000th talk online. The talks are free to view, and they have been translated into more than 100 languages with the help of volunteers from around the world. Viewership has grown to approximately one billion views per year.
Continuing a strategy of 'radical openness,' in 2009 Chris introduced the TEDx initiative, allowing free licenses to local organizers who wished to organize their own TED-like events. More than 8,000 such events have been held, generating an archive of 60,000 TEDx talks. And three years later, the TED-Ed program was launched, offering free educational videos and tools to students and teachers.
Chris Anderson | Speaker | TED.com