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Margrethe Vestager: The new age of corporate monopolies
Margrethe Vestager: En ny tid for kommercielle monopoler
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Margrethe Vestager ønsker at fastholde konkurrencen på de europæiske markeder - hvilket er årsagen til, at hun på vegne af EU har tildelt Google en bøde på 2,8 mia. dollars for at have overtrådt konkurrencereglerne, har forlangt 15,3 mia. dollars af Apple for manglende skattebetalinger og undersøgt en række virksomheder, fra Gazprom til Fiat, for brud på konkurrencereglerne. I denne vigtige tale om den globale handels natur forklarer hun, hvorfor markeder har brug for klare regler - og hvordan selv de mest innovative virksomheder kan blive et problem, når de bliver for dominerende. "Reel og fair konkurrence spiller en vigtig rolle i opbyggelsen af den tillid vi behøver, for at få det bedste ud af vores samfund", siger Vestager, "Og det starter med, at vi håndhæver reglerne."
Margrethe Vestager - Commissioner for Competition, European Union
Margrethe Vestager is in charge of regulating commercial activity across the European Union and enforcing the EU’s rules designed to keep the markets fair. Full bio
Margrethe Vestager is in charge of regulating commercial activity across the European Union and enforcing the EU’s rules designed to keep the markets fair. Full bio
Double-click the English transcript below to play the video.
00:12
Let's go back to 1957.
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Forestil jer, at vi er i 1957.
00:18
Representatives
from six European countries
from six European countries
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Repræsentanter fra seks europæiske lande
00:22
had come to Rome
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er rejst til Rom
00:24
to sign the treaty that was
to create the European Union.
to create the European Union.
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for at underskrive traktaten,
der skal skabe den europæiske union.
der skal skabe den europæiske union.
00:29
Europe was destroyed.
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Europa var ødelagt.
00:32
A world war had emerged from Europe.
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En verdenskrig udsprang af Europa.
00:37
The human suffering was unbelievable
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De menneskelige lidelser var ufattelige
00:39
and unprecedented.
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og aldrig set tidligere.
00:43
Those men
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Mændene
00:45
wanted to create a peaceful,
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ønskede at skabe et fredeligt,
00:49
democratic Europe,
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demokratisk Europa.
00:52
a Europe that works for its people.
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Et Europa der er til gavn for folket.
00:55
And one of the many building blocks
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Og et af de mange elementer
00:58
in that peace project
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i dét fredsprojekt
01:00
was a common European market.
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var et fælles europæisk marked.
01:05
Already back then,
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Allerede dengang
01:07
they saw how markets,
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vidste man hvordan markeder,
01:09
when left to themselves,
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der er overladt til sig selv,
01:11
can sort of slip into being
just the private property
just the private property
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kan ende med at blive en privat klub
01:16
of big businesses and cartels,
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for store virksomheder og karteller,
01:20
meeting the needs of some businesses
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der kun tilgodeser visse virksomheders behov
01:23
and not the needs of customers.
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og ikke kundernes behov.
01:27
So from our very first day,
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Så lige fra begyndelsen
01:30
in 1957,
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i 1957,
01:33
the European Union had rules
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har den Europæiske Union haft regler,
01:36
to defend fair competition.
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der beskytter den frie konkurrence.
01:39
And that means competition on the merits,
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Og det betyder konkurrence på basis af,
01:43
that you compete
on the quality of your products,
on the quality of your products,
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at du konkurrerer på
kvaliteten af dine produkter,
kvaliteten af dine produkter,
01:46
the prices you can offer,
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de priser du kan tilbyde,
01:48
the services, the innovation
that you produce.
that you produce.
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de tjenester og den fornyelse du leverer.
01:52
That's competition on the merits.
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Dét er konkurrence på værdier.
01:55
You have a fair chance
of making it on such a market.
of making it on such a market.
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Alle har de samme muligheder
for at klare sig på sådan et marked
for at klare sig på sådan et marked
01:59
And it's my job,
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Og det er mit job
02:01
as Commissioner for Competition,
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som konkurrencekommissær
02:04
to make sure that companies
who do business in Europe
who do business in Europe
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at sikre at virksomheder,
der gør forretninger i Europa,
der gør forretninger i Europa,
02:07
live by those rules.
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overholder disse regler.
02:12
But let's take a step back.
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Men lad os træde et skridt baglæns.
02:16
Why do we need rules
on competition at all?
on competition at all?
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Behøver vi overhovedet
regler for konkurrence?
regler for konkurrence?
02:20
Why not just let businesses compete?
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Hvorfor ikke bare lade
virksomheder konkurrere?
virksomheder konkurrere?
02:24
Isn't that also the best for us
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Vil det ikke også være bedst for os
02:27
if they compete freely,
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at de konkurrerer frit,
02:29
since more competition
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eftersom mere konkurrence
02:31
drives more quality,
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medfører højere kvalitet,
02:34
lower prices, more innovation?
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lavere priser, mere innovation?
02:39
Well, mostly it is.
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Jo, som oftest ...
02:43
But the problem is
that sometimes, for businesses,
that sometimes, for businesses,
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men problemet er at
virksomheder sommetider
virksomheder sommetider
02:48
competition can be inconvenient,
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finder konkurrencen ubelejlig,
02:55
because competition means
that the race is never over,
that the race is never over,
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for konkurrence betyder
at kapløbet aldrig slutter,
at kapløbet aldrig slutter,
og spillet aldrig vundet.
02:59
the game is never won.
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03:02
No matter how well
you were doing in the past,
you were doing in the past,
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Uanset hvor godt
du har klaret dig tidligere,
du har klaret dig tidligere,
03:05
there's always someone
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er der altid nogen derude,
03:06
who are out there
wanting to take your place.
wanting to take your place.
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der ønsker at overtage din plads.
03:12
So the temptation to avoid competition
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Så fristelsen til at undgå konkurrence
03:15
is powerful.
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er stærk.
03:18
It's rooted in motives
as old as Adam and Eve:
as old as Adam and Eve:
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Den er rodfæstet i motiver
så gamle som Adam og Eva:
så gamle som Adam og Eva:
03:23
in greed for yet more money,
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I begæret efter endnu flere penge,
03:27
in fear of losing
your position in the market
your position in the market
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i frygten for at miste markedsandele
03:31
and all the benefits it brings.
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og alle de fordele det fører med sig.
03:35
And when greed and fear
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Og når grådighed og frygt
03:38
are linked to power,
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er knyttet til magt,
03:40
you have a dangerous mix.
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opstår der en farlig kombination.
03:44
We see that in political life.
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Vi ser det i det politiske liv.
03:47
In part of the world,
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I dele af verden
03:49
the mix of greed and fear
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medfører grådighed og frygt
03:51
means that those who get power
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at dem, der får magten,
03:54
become reluctant to give it back.
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kun modstræbende giver den tilbage.
04:00
One of the many things
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En af de mange ting
04:02
I like and admire in our democracies
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jeg beundrer og holder af
i vores demokratier
i vores demokratier
04:07
are the norms
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er de spilleregler,
04:09
that make our leaders hand over power
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der får vores ledere
til at give magten fra sig,
til at give magten fra sig,
04:12
when voters tell them to.
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når vælgerne har besluttet det.
04:16
And competition rules
can do a similar thing in the market,
can do a similar thing in the market,
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Og regler for konkurrence
kan gøre tilsvarende for markeder,
kan gøre tilsvarende for markeder,
04:20
making sure that greed and fear
doesn't overcome fairness.
doesn't overcome fairness.
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og sikre at grådighed og frygt
ikke forhindrer retfærdighed.
ikke forhindrer retfærdighed.
04:27
Because those rules mean
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For de regler betyder
04:29
that companies cannot misuse their power
to undermine competition.
to undermine competition.
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at virksomheder ikke kan misbruge deres
magt til at underminere konkurrenterne.
magt til at underminere konkurrenterne.
04:36
Think for a moment about your car.
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Tænk på din bil.
04:40
It has thousands of parts,
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Den har tusindvis af dele
04:44
from the foam that makes the seats
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lige fra skummet i sæderne
04:47
to the electrical wiring
to the light bulbs.
to the light bulbs.
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til de elektriske ledninger
til lyspærerne.
til lyspærerne.
04:51
And for many of those parts,
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Og for mange af disse dele
04:54
the world's carmakers,
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er verdens bilfabrikanter
04:55
they are dependent
on only a few suppliers.
on only a few suppliers.
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afhængige af ganske få leverandører.
05:01
So it's hardly surprising
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Så det kan næppe overraske
05:03
that it is kind of tempting
for those suppliers
for those suppliers
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at det er fristende
for disse leverandører
for disse leverandører
05:07
to come together and fix prices.
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at mødes og fastsætte priserne.
05:11
But just imagine what that could do
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Men forestil dig hvad det ville betyde
05:13
to the final price
of your new car in the market.
of your new car in the market.
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for prisen på din nye bil.
05:20
Except, it's not imaginary.
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Men det er ikke kun et tankeeksperiment.
05:24
The European Commission
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Den Europæiske Kommission
05:26
has dealt with already
seven different car parts cartels,
seven different car parts cartels,
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har allerede håndteret syv forskellige
karteller inden for dele til biler,
karteller inden for dele til biler,
05:32
and we're still investigating some.
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og vi undersøger stadig et par stykker.
05:36
Here, the Department of Justice
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Det amerikanske Justitsministerium
05:39
are also looking
into the market for car parts,
into the market for car parts,
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undersøger også markedet for bildele,
05:42
and it has called it
the biggest criminal investigation
the biggest criminal investigation
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og de har kaldt det for den
største kriminalefterforskning,
største kriminalefterforskning,
05:46
it has ever pursued.
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de nogensinde har foretaget.
05:49
But without competition rules,
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Men uden konkurrenceregler,
05:51
there would be no investigation,
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ville der ikke være undersøgelser,
05:54
and there would be nothing
to stop this collusion from happening
to stop this collusion from happening
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og intet der kunne forhindre
sådant aftalt spil i at finde sted
sådant aftalt spil i at finde sted
05:58
and the prices of your car to go up.
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og prisen på din bil ville være højere.
06:03
Yet it's not only companies
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Men det er ikke kun virksomheder
06:05
who can undermine fair competition.
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der begrænser den frie konkurrence.
06:08
Governments can do it, too.
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Regeringer kan også gøre det.
06:11
And governments do that
when they hand out subsidies
when they hand out subsidies
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Og det gør regeringer,
når de yder statsstøtte
når de yder statsstøtte
06:15
to just the favorite few, the selected.
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til nogle få udvalgte - deres favoritter.
06:21
They may do that
when they hand out subsidies --
when they hand out subsidies --
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Det kan ske, når de yder statsstøtte,
06:24
and, of course,
all financed by taxpayers --
all financed by taxpayers --
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og i sagens natur
alene betalt af skatteyderne,
alene betalt af skatteyderne,
06:28
to companies.
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til virksomheder.
06:30
That may be in the form
of special tax treatments,
of special tax treatments,
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Det kan være i form
af særlige skatteregler,
af særlige skatteregler,
06:35
like the tax benefits
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såsom de skattefordele
06:37
that firms like Fiat,
Starbucks and Apple got
Starbucks and Apple got
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som Fiat, Starbucks og Apple fik
06:42
from some governments in Europe.
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af nogle europæiske regeringer.
06:46
Those subsidies stop companies
from competing on equal terms.
from competing on equal terms.
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Den slags støtte forhindrer virksomheder
i at konkurrere på lige vilkår.
i at konkurrere på lige vilkår.
06:51
They can mean that
the companies that succeed,
the companies that succeed,
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Det kan betyde at de virksomheder,
der klarer sig bedst
der klarer sig bedst
06:54
well, they are the companies
that got the most subsidy,
that got the most subsidy,
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bare er de virksomheder,
der har fået mest i støtte,
der har fået mest i støtte,
06:58
the ones that are the best-connected,
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dem der har de bedste forbindelser,
07:00
and not, as it should be,
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og ikke som det burde være,
07:02
the companies that serve
consumers the best.
consumers the best.
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de virksomheder der betjener
deres kunder bedst.
deres kunder bedst.
07:07
So there are times when we need to step in
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Så nogle gange må vi gribe ind
07:10
to make sure that competition
works the way it should.
works the way it should.
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for at sikre at konkurrencen
fungerer som den skal.
fungerer som den skal.
07:15
By doing that, we help
the market to work fairly,
the market to work fairly,
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Ved at gøre dét, hjælper vi markedet
til at fungere på en fair måde,
til at fungere på en fair måde,
07:19
because competition gives consumers
the power to demand a fair deal.
the power to demand a fair deal.
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fordi konkurrence giver forbrugerne
magten til at forlange en fair handel.
magten til at forlange en fair handel.
07:25
It means that companies know
that if they cannot offer good prices
that if they cannot offer good prices
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Det betyder at virksomheder ved,
at hvis de ikke kan tilbyde gode priser
at hvis de ikke kan tilbyde gode priser
07:30
or the service that's expected,
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eller levere de ydelser, der forventes,
07:32
well, the customers
will go somewhere else.
will go somewhere else.
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ja, så vil kunderne gå et andet sted hen.
07:38
And that sort of fairness
is more important
is more important
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Og den slags retfærdighed er vigtigere
07:41
than we may sometimes realize.
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end vi nogle gange indser.
07:47
Very few people think
about politics all the time.
about politics all the time.
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Kun ganske få mennesker
tænker på politik hele tiden.
tænker på politik hele tiden.
07:51
Some even skip it at election time.
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Nogle ikke engang på valgdagen.
07:55
But we are all in the market.
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Men vi er alle en del af markedet.
07:58
Every day, we are in the market.
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Hver eneste dag er vi på markedet.
08:02
And we don't want businesses
to agree on prices in the back office.
to agree on prices in the back office.
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Og vi ønsker ikke, at virksomhederne
aftaler priserne indbyrdes.
aftaler priserne indbyrdes.
08:07
We don't want them
to divide the market between them.
to divide the market between them.
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Vi ønsker ikke, at de opdeler
markedet imellem sig.
markedet imellem sig.
08:11
We don't want one big company
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Vi ønsker ikke én stor virksomhed
08:13
just to shut out competitors
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der forhindrer konkurrenterne i
08:16
from ever showing us what they can do.
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at vise os hvad de kan.
08:20
If that happens,
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Hvis det sker,
08:22
well, obviously, we feel
that someone has cheated us,
that someone has cheated us,
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ja, så vil vi nok føle
at vi er blevet snydt,
at vi er blevet snydt,
08:26
that we are being ignored
or taken for granted by the market.
or taken for granted by the market.
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at vi er blevet ignoreret
eller taget for givet af markedet.
eller taget for givet af markedet.
08:31
And that may undermine
not only our trust in the market
not only our trust in the market
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Og det kan ødelægge ikke bare
vores tillid til markedet
vores tillid til markedet
08:35
but also our trust in the society.
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men også vores tillid til samfundet.
08:39
In a recent survey,
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I en nylig undersøgelse
08:41
more than two-thirds of Europeans
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sagde mere end to ud af tre europæere
08:44
said that they had felt
the effects of lack of competition:
the effects of lack of competition:
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at de havde oplevet virkningerne af
manglende konkurrence
manglende konkurrence
08:49
that the price
for electricity was too high,
for electricity was too high,
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at prisen på strøm var for høj
08:53
that the price for the medicines
they needed was too high,
they needed was too high,
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at prisen på den medicin,
de havde behov for, var for høj
de havde behov for, var for høj
08:57
that they had no real choice
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at de ikke havde et reelt valg
08:59
if they wanted to travel
by bus or by plane,
by bus or by plane,
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hvis de ville rejse med bus eller fly
09:02
or they got poor service
from their internet provider.
from their internet provider.
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eller hvis de fik dårlig service
fra deres internetudbyder.
fra deres internetudbyder.
09:06
In short, they found that the market
didn't treat them fairly.
didn't treat them fairly.
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Kort sagt, de oplevede at markedet
ikke behandlede dem fair.
ikke behandlede dem fair.
09:11
And that might seem
like very small things,
like very small things,
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Og selvom det kan virke som små ting,
09:16
but they can give you this sense
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kan det give følelsen af
09:19
that the world isn't really fair.
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at verden ikke rigtigt er retfærdig.
09:23
And they see the market,
which was supposed to serve everyone,
which was supposed to serve everyone,
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Og de ser markedet,
som skulle være for alle,
som skulle være for alle,
09:28
become more like the private property
of a few powerful companies.
of a few powerful companies.
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mere bliver en slags privat ejendom
delt mellem få magtfulde virksomheder.
delt mellem få magtfulde virksomheder.
09:35
The market is not the society.
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Markedet er ikke samfundet.
09:38
Our societies are, of course,
much, much more than the market.
much, much more than the market.
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Vores samfund er naturligvis
meget mere end markedet.
meget mere end markedet.
09:43
But lack of trust in the market
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Men manglende tillid til markedet
09:46
can rub off on society
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kan farve vores opfattelse
09:49
so we lose trust in our society as well.
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så vi også mister tilliden
til vores samfund.
til vores samfund.
09:55
And it may be the most important
thing we have, trust.
thing we have, trust.
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Og det kan meget vel være det
vigtigste vi har -- tilliden
vigtigste vi har -- tilliden
10:01
We can trust each other
if we are treated as equals.
if we are treated as equals.
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Vi kan have tillid til hinanden
hvis vi bliver behandlet ligeværdigt.
hvis vi bliver behandlet ligeværdigt.
10:08
If we are all to have the same chances,
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4416
Hvis vi alle skal have de samme muligheder,
10:12
well, we all have to follow
the same fundamental rules.
the same fundamental rules.
162
600520
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ja, så må vi alle følge de samme
grundlæggende regler.
grundlæggende regler.
10:17
Of course, some people and some businesses
are more successful than others,
are more successful than others,
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605560
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Selvfølgelig har nogle folk og nogle
virksomheder større succes end andre,
virksomheder større succes end andre,
10:23
but we do not trust in a society
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611360
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men vi stoler ikke på et samfund
10:26
if the prizes are handed out
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hvis præmierne uddeles
10:28
even before the contest begins.
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allerede før konkurrencen er begyndt.
10:33
And this is where
competition rules come in,
competition rules come in,
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621280
2400
Det er derfor vi skal have
regler for konkurrence,
regler for konkurrence,
10:37
because when we make sure
that markets work fairly,
that markets work fairly,
168
625160
3496
for når vi sikrer at markeder
fungerer retfærdigt,
fungerer retfærdigt,
10:40
then businesses compete on the merits,
169
628680
3216
så konkurrerer virksomheder
på de rette værdier
på de rette værdier
10:43
and that helps to build the trust
that we need as citizens
that we need as citizens
170
631920
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og det opbygger den tillid
som vi borgere har brug for
som vi borgere har brug for
10:49
to feel comfortable and in control,
171
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3656
for at føle os tilpasse og i kontrol,
10:52
and the trust that allows
our society to work.
our society to work.
172
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3600
og tilliden der får vores
samfund til at fungere.
samfund til at fungere.
10:58
Because without trust,
everything becomes harder.
everything becomes harder.
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3240
For uden tillid bliver alting sværere.
11:02
Just to live our daily lives,
we need to trust in strangers,
we need to trust in strangers,
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650640
3240
I vores hverdagsliv er det nødvendigt
at stole på fremmede,
at stole på fremmede,
11:07
to trust the banks who keep our money,
175
655000
2720
at stole på bankerne
der opbevarer vores penge,
der opbevarer vores penge,
11:10
the builders who build our home,
176
658800
1720
håndværkerne, der bygger vores hjem,
11:14
the electrician
who comes to fix the wiring,
who comes to fix the wiring,
177
662200
3056
elektrikeren, der ordner forbindelserne,
11:17
the doctor who treats us when we're ill,
178
665280
2336
lægen der behandler os, når vi er syge,
11:19
not to mention
the other drivers on the road,
the other drivers on the road,
179
667640
2816
og ikke at forglemme
de andre bilister på vejen,
de andre bilister på vejen,
11:22
and everyone knows that they are crazy.
180
670480
1920
som vi alle ved er tossede.
11:26
And yet, we have to trust them
181
674000
3096
Og alligevel må vi stole på,
11:29
to do the right thing.
182
677120
1360
at de gør det rigtige.
11:32
And the thing is
that the more our societies grow,
that the more our societies grow,
183
680120
3040
Og pointen er, at jo mere
vores samfund vokser,
vores samfund vokser,
11:36
the more important trust becomes
184
684880
3016
jo vigtigere bliver tillid
11:39
and the harder it is to build.
185
687920
3296
og desto sværere bliver den at opbygge.
11:43
And that is a paradox of modern societies.
186
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3720
Og det er et af det moderne
samfunds paradokser.
samfunds paradokser.
11:48
And this is especially true
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2336
Og det er ekstra tydeligt
11:51
when technology changes
the way that we interact.
the way that we interact.
188
699320
2800
når teknologien ændrer
måden, hvorpå vi omgås.
måden, hvorpå vi omgås.
11:55
Of course, to some degree,
technology can help us
technology can help us
189
703840
2336
Selvfølgelig kan teknologi
også hjælpe os
også hjælpe os
11:58
to build trust in one another
with ratings systems and other systems
with ratings systems and other systems
190
706200
4336
med at opbygge tillid til hinanden
med pointsystemer og lignende
med pointsystemer og lignende
12:02
that enable the sharing economy.
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710560
2040
som åbner for deleøkonomi.
12:06
But technology also creates
completely new challenges
completely new challenges
192
714360
3776
Men teknologi skaber også
helt nye udfordringer
helt nye udfordringer
12:10
when they ask us
not to trust in other people
not to trust in other people
193
718160
2400
når vi bliver bedt om
ikke at stole på andre
ikke at stole på andre
12:14
but to trust in algorithms and computers.
194
722120
3720
men at stole på algoritmer og computere.
12:19
Of course, we all see
and share and appreciate
and share and appreciate
195
727920
3856
Selvfølgelig kan vi alle se og værdsætte
12:23
all the good that
new technology can do us.
new technology can do us.
196
731800
3976
alt det gode som teknologi
kan gøre for os.
kan gøre for os.
12:27
It's a lot of good.
197
735800
1360
En masse gode ting.
12:30
Autonomous cars can give people
with disabilities new independence.
with disabilities new independence.
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738240
5136
Selvkørende biler kan give mennesker
med handikap større selvstændighed.
med handikap større selvstændighed.
12:35
It can save us all time,
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743400
1416
Den kan spare os alle tid,
12:36
and it can make a much, much
better use of resources.
better use of resources.
200
744840
2680
og hjælpe os med at udnytte
ressourcer langt bedre.
ressourcer langt bedre.
12:41
Algorithms that rely on crunching
enormous amounts of data
enormous amounts of data
201
749240
4936
Algoritmer der tygger sig igennem
enorme mængder af data
enorme mængder af data
12:46
can enable our doctors
to give us a much better treatment,
to give us a much better treatment,
202
754200
4056
kan give vores læger mulighed for at
tilbyde os en langt bedre behandling
tilbyde os en langt bedre behandling
12:50
and many other things.
203
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1640
og mange andre ting.
12:54
But no one is going
to hand over their medical data
to hand over their medical data
204
762440
4080
Men ingen vil aflevere deres sundhedsdata
12:59
or step into a car
that's driven by an algorithm
that's driven by an algorithm
205
767720
3080
eller sætte sig ind i en bil
styret af en computer
styret af en computer
13:03
unless they trust the companies
that they are dealing with.
that they are dealing with.
206
771880
3560
medmindre de stoler på de virksomheder
som de gør forretning med.
som de gør forretning med.
13:09
And that trust isn't always there.
207
777560
2360
Og den tillid mangler nogen gange.
13:13
Today, for example,
less than a quarter of Europeans
less than a quarter of Europeans
208
781240
4176
I vore dage, til eksempel, stoler
mindre end hver fjerde europæer
mindre end hver fjerde europæer
13:17
trust online businesses
to protect their personal information.
to protect their personal information.
209
785440
4640
på at online-virksomheder beskytter
deres personlige oplysninger.
deres personlige oplysninger.
13:24
But what if people knew
210
792720
1600
Men hvad nu hvis folk vidste
13:27
that they could rely
on technology companies
on technology companies
211
795440
3336
at de kunne stole på at
teknologivirksomheder
teknologivirksomheder
13:30
to treat them fairly?
212
798800
1320
ville behandle dem fair?
13:34
What if they knew that those companies
213
802280
2416
Hvad hvis de vidste at de virksomheder
13:36
respond to competition
by trying to do better,
by trying to do better,
214
804720
3600
reagerer på konkurrence
ved at forsøge at gøre det bedre,
ved at forsøge at gøre det bedre,
13:41
by trying to serve consumers better,
215
809400
2280
ved at betjene deres kunder bedre,
13:45
not by using their power
216
813120
2336
ikke ved at bruge deres magt
13:47
to shut out competitors,
217
815480
2376
til at udelukke konkurrenterne
13:49
say, by pushing their services
218
817880
2376
ved for eksempel at
forringe konkurrenternes
forringe konkurrenternes
13:52
far, far down the list of search results
219
820280
3736
placering på listen over søgeresultater
13:56
and promoting themselves?
220
824040
1760
og fremhæve sig selv i stedet?
13:59
What if they knew
that compliance with the rules
that compliance with the rules
221
827920
4256
Hvad hvis de vidste, at
overholdelse af reglerne
overholdelse af reglerne
14:04
was built into the algorithms by design,
222
832200
3680
skal være en del af algoritmernes design,
at algoritmen skal gå i skole
og lære om konkurrenceregler
og lære om konkurrenceregler
14:09
that the algorithm had to go
to competition rules school
to competition rules school
223
837080
2896
14:12
before they were ever allowed to work,
224
840000
1960
før den overhovedet må tages i brug,
14:16
that those algorithms were designed
225
844120
2736
at disse algoritmer blev designet
14:18
in a way that meant
that they couldn't collude,
that they couldn't collude,
226
846880
3616
så de ikke kunne lave lyssky aftaler,
14:22
that they couldn't form
their own little cartel
their own little cartel
227
850520
3016
at de ikke kunne danne
deres eget lille kartel
deres eget lille kartel
14:25
in the black box they're working in?
228
853560
1880
i den sorte kasse, hvor de arbejder?
14:29
Together with regulation,
229
857480
1800
I kombination med regulering
14:32
competition rules can do that.
230
860280
1960
kan konkurrenceregler gøre netop det.
14:35
They can help us to make sure
231
863240
1776
De kan hjælpe os med at sikre
14:37
that new technology treats people fairly
232
865040
3480
at ny teknologi behandler folk fair
14:41
and that everyone can compete
on a level playing field.
on a level playing field.
233
869680
3480
og at alle konkurrerer på lige vilkår.
14:46
And that can help us build the trust
234
874800
3256
Og det kan hjælpe os med
at opbygge den tillid
at opbygge den tillid
14:50
that we need for real innovation
235
878080
2416
som kræves for at innovation virkelig
14:52
to flourish
236
880520
1296
kan blomstre
14:53
and for societies to develop for citizens.
237
881840
3600
og for at samfund kan udvikles
til gavn for deres borgere.
til gavn for deres borgere.
14:59
Because trust cannot be imposed.
238
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2240
For tillid kan ikke blive pålagt.
15:03
It has to be earned.
239
891000
1480
Den skal fortjenes.
15:06
Since the very first days
of the European Union,
of the European Union,
240
894280
3976
Lige siden den Europæiske Unions
allerførste dage,
allerførste dage,
15:10
60 years ago,
241
898280
1320
for 60 år siden,
15:12
our competition rules have helped
242
900800
2936
har vores konkurrenceregler hjulpet til
15:15
to build that trust.
243
903760
1480
at opbygge den tillid.
15:19
A lot of things have changed.
244
907120
1600
Meget har ændret sig.
15:22
It's hard to say
what those six representatives
what those six representatives
245
910440
3336
Det er svært at vide, hvad
de seks repræsentanter
de seks repræsentanter
15:25
would have made of a smartphone.
246
913800
1524
ville have sagt til smartphones.
15:29
But in today's world,
247
917000
1616
Men i vor tids verden,
15:30
as well as in their world,
248
918640
2616
såvel som i deres,
15:33
competition makes the market
work for everyone.
work for everyone.
249
921280
3120
er konkurrence det, der får
markedet til at fungere for alle.
markedet til at fungere for alle.
15:38
And that is why I am convinced
250
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2256
Og det er derfor jeg er overbevist om
15:40
that real and fair competition
251
928280
3176
at ægte og fair konkurrence
15:43
has a vital role to play
252
931480
2056
spiller en vigtig rolle
15:45
in building the trust we need
253
933560
2176
i opbygningen af den tillid, vi behøver
15:47
to get the best of our societies,
254
935760
3120
for at få det bedste ud af vores samfund
15:52
and that starts with enforcing our rules,
255
940000
4976
og det begynder med
at vi håndhæver vores regler,
at vi håndhæver vores regler,
15:57
actually just to make
the market work for everyone.
the market work for everyone.
256
945000
3816
blot for at sikre at markedet
fungerer for alle.
fungerer for alle.
16:00
Thank you.
257
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1376
Tak.
16:02
(Applause)
258
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3440
(Bifald)
16:07
Bruno Giussani: Thank you.
259
955760
1280
Bruno Giussani (BG): Tak.
16:11
Thank you, Commissioner.
260
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1256
Tak, Kommissær.
16:12
Margrethe Vestager: It was a pleasure.
261
960640
1856
Margrethe Vestager (MV): En fornøjelse.
16:14
BG: I want to ask you two questions.
262
962520
1736
BG: Jeg har to spørgsmål til dig.
16:16
The first one is about data,
because I have the impression
because I have the impression
263
964280
2736
Det første handler om data,
for det er min opfattelse
for det er min opfattelse
16:19
that technology and data are changing
the way competition takes place
the way competition takes place
264
967040
3416
at teknologi og data ændrer måden
hvorpå konkurrence finder sted
hvorpå konkurrence finder sted
16:22
and the way competition regulation
is designed and enforced.
is designed and enforced.
265
970480
4656
og den måde, hvorpå konkurrence-
reguleringen udformes og håndhæves.
reguleringen udformes og håndhæves.
16:27
Can you maybe comment on that?
266
975160
1656
Kan du prøve at kommentere på det?
16:28
MV: Well, yes, it is
definitely challenging us,
definitely challenging us,
267
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3336
MV: Ja, det er bestemt udfordrende for os,
16:32
because we both have to sharpen our tools
268
980200
3216
fordi vi skal gøre vores
nuværende værktøjer skarpere,
nuværende værktøjer skarpere,
16:35
but also to develop new tools.
269
983440
1840
samtidig med at vi udvikler nye.
16:38
When we were going through
the Google responses
the Google responses
270
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2856
Da vi gennemgik Googles svar
16:41
to our statement of objection,
271
989000
2736
på vores anklageskrift,
16:43
we were going through
5.2 terabytes of data.
5.2 terabytes of data.
272
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4200
fyldte svaret 5,2 terabytes.
16:49
It's quite a lot.
273
997080
1520
Det er ikke så lidt.
16:51
So we had to set up new systems.
274
999320
3296
Så vi måtte udvikle nye systemer.
16:54
We had to figure out how to do this,
275
1002640
2616
Vi måtte finde en måde at gøre dette på,
16:57
because you cannot work
the way you did just a few years ago.
the way you did just a few years ago.
276
1005280
4096
for du kan ikke længere arbejde på
samme måde som for blot få år siden.
samme måde som for blot få år siden.
17:01
So we are definitely
sharpening up our working methods.
sharpening up our working methods.
277
1009400
3880
Så vi er helt sikkert ved at skærpe
vores måde at arbejde på.
vores måde at arbejde på.
17:05
The other thing is
that we try to distinguish
that we try to distinguish
278
1013880
2136
En anden ting er, at vi prøver at skelne
17:08
between different kinds of data,
279
1016040
1696
mellem forskellige typer af data,
17:09
because some data is extremely valuable
280
1017760
2576
for nogle data er ekstremt værdifulde
17:12
and they will form, like,
a barrier to entry in a market.
a barrier to entry in a market.
281
1020360
3256
og de kan virke som en barriere
for at komme ind på et marked.
for at komme ind på et marked.
17:15
Other things you can just --
it loses its value tomorrow.
it loses its value tomorrow.
282
1023640
4040
Andre data kan du bare ...
de mister deres værdi i morgen.
de mister deres værdi i morgen.
17:20
So we try to make sure
283
1028560
1536
Så vi prøver at sikre
17:22
that we never, ever underestimate the fact
284
1030119
3457
at vi aldrig nogensinde
undervurderer det faktum
undervurderer det faktum
17:25
that data works
as a currency in the market
as a currency in the market
285
1033599
3977
at data fungerer
som en valuta i markedet
som en valuta i markedet
17:29
and as an asset that can be
a real barrier for competition.
a real barrier for competition.
286
1037599
5041
og som et aktiv der kan lægge
hindringer i vejen for konkurrencen.
hindringer i vejen for konkurrencen.
17:35
BG: Google. You fined them
2.8 billion euros a few months ago.
2.8 billion euros a few months ago.
287
1043560
4536
BG: Google. Du gav dem en bøde på
2.8 mia. euro for et par måneder siden.
2.8 mia. euro for et par måneder siden.
17:40
MV: No, that was dollars.
It's not so strong these days.
It's not so strong these days.
288
1048119
2657
MV: Nej, det var dollars.
Kursen er ikke så høj længere.
Kursen er ikke så høj længere.
17:42
BG: Ah, well, depends on the --
289
1050800
1496
BG: Ja, det afhænger vel af ...
17:44
(Laughter)
290
1052320
1016
(Latter)
17:45
Google appealed the case.
The case is going to court.
The case is going to court.
291
1053360
2496
Google ankede sagen.
Sagen skal nu for retten.
Sagen skal nu for retten.
17:47
It will last a while.
292
1055880
1560
Det kommer til at tage tid.
17:50
Earlier, last year, you asked Apple
to pay 13 billion in back taxes,
to pay 13 billion in back taxes,
293
1058240
4736
Engang, sidste år, bad du Apple betale
13 milliarder i skyldig skat,
13 milliarder i skyldig skat,
17:55
and you have also
investigated other companies,
investigated other companies,
294
1063000
3136
og du har også efterforsket
mange andre virksomheder,
mange andre virksomheder,
17:58
including European and Russian companies,
295
1066160
2056
i høj grad europæiske og russiske,
18:00
not only American companies, by far.
296
1068240
2096
ikke bare amerikanske virksomheder.
18:02
Yet the investigations
against the American companies
against the American companies
297
1070360
4296
Alligevel er det efterforskningen
af de amerikanske virksomheder
af de amerikanske virksomheder
18:06
are the ones that have attracted
the most attention
the most attention
298
1074680
2416
der tiltrækker sig mest opmærksomhed
18:09
and they have also attracted
some accusations.
some accusations.
299
1077120
3016
og de har også medført beskyldninger.
18:12
You have been accused, essentially,
of protectionism, of jealousy,
of protectionism, of jealousy,
300
1080160
3136
Du er, basalt set, blevet beskyldt for
protektionisme, for jalousi
protektionisme, for jalousi
18:15
or using legislation
to hit back at American companies
to hit back at American companies
301
1083320
2896
og for at bruge lovgivningen til at ramme
amerikanske virksomheder,
amerikanske virksomheder,
18:18
that have conquered European markets.
302
1086240
2296
der har erobret de europæiske markeder.
18:20
"The Economist" just this week
on the front page writes,
on the front page writes,
303
1088560
3456
På forsiden af denne uges
"The Economist" står der:
"The Economist" står der:
18:24
"Vestager Versus The Valley."
304
1092040
1896
"Vestager Versus The Valley"
18:25
How do you react to that?
305
1093960
1320
Hvordan reagerer du på det?
18:28
MV: Well, first of all,
I take it very seriously,
I take it very seriously,
306
1096600
3216
MV: Først og fremmest
tager jeg det meget alvorligt,
tager jeg det meget alvorligt,
18:31
because bias has no room
in law enforcement.
in law enforcement.
307
1099840
5320
for forudindtagethed har ingen plads
i håndhævelsen af vores love.
i håndhævelsen af vores love.
18:38
We have to prove our cases
with the evidence and the facts
with the evidence and the facts
308
1106160
3176
Vi må basere vores sager
på beviser og fakta
på beviser og fakta
18:41
and the jurisprudence
309
1109360
2016
og gældende retspraksis
18:43
in order also to present it to the courts.
310
1111400
2040
for at kunne føre sagen for domstolene.
18:46
The second thing is
that Europe is open for business,
that Europe is open for business,
311
1114760
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For det andet, så er Europa
åben for forretninger,
åben for forretninger,
18:50
but not for tax evasion.
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men ikke for skatteunddragelse.
18:52
(Applause)
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(Bifald)
18:58
The thing is that we are changing,
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Vi er ved at forandre os,
19:02
and for instance,
when I ask my daughters --
when I ask my daughters --
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for eksempel, når jeg spørger mine døtre
19:04
they use Google as well --
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- der også bruger Google -
19:06
"Why do you do that?"
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"Hvorfor gør I det?"
19:07
They say, "Well, because it works.
It's a very good product."
It's a very good product."
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er svaret "Fordi det virker.
Det er rigtigt godt produkt."
Det er rigtigt godt produkt."
19:10
They would never, ever,
come up with the answer,
come up with the answer,
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De ville aldrig svare,
19:13
"It's because it's a US product."
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"Fordi det er lavet i USA."
19:15
It's just because it works.
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Det er bare fordi, det virker.
19:17
And that is of course how it should be.
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Og det er selvfølgelig
sådan det skal være.
sådan det skal være.
19:19
But just the same, it is important
that someone is looking after to say,
that someone is looking after to say,
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Men stadig, det er vigtigt at
nogen holder øje og kan sige,
nogen holder øje og kan sige,
19:23
"Well, we congratulate you
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"Vi lykønsker jer,
19:25
while you grow and grow and grow,
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mens I bare vokser og vokser,
19:28
but congratulation stops
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men lykønskningen stopper
19:30
if we find that you're
misusing your position
misusing your position
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hvis vi opdager, at
I misbruger jeres position
I misbruger jeres position
19:34
to harm competitors
so that they cannot serve consumers."
so that they cannot serve consumers."
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til at skade konkurrenter,
så de ikke kan betjene kunder."
så de ikke kan betjene kunder."
19:38
BG: It will be
a fascinating case to follow.
a fascinating case to follow.
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BG: Det bliver en
spændende sag at følge.
spændende sag at følge.
19:40
Thank you for coming to TED.
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Tak for at du kom til TED.
19:41
MV: It was a pleasure. Thanks a lot.
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MV: Det var en fornøjelse. Mange tak
19:43
(Applause)
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(Bifald)
ABOUT THE SPEAKER
Margrethe Vestager - Commissioner for Competition, European UnionMargrethe Vestager is in charge of regulating commercial activity across the European Union and enforcing the EU’s rules designed to keep the markets fair.
Why you should listen
Margrethe Vestager has been described as "the most powerful woman in Brussels" -- otherwise said, in European politics. As Commissioner for Competition for the European Union, Vestager is in charge of regulating commercial activity across the 28 member states and enforcing the EU's rules designed to keep the markets fair -- rules that, she believes, some big companies have been abusing. In 2016, Vestager ordered Apple to pay €13 bn (about US$15.3 bn) in back taxes. In June 2017, she fined Google €2.4 bn (US$2.8 bn) for manipulating search results in favor of its own services. Other antitrust cases are open against Google. Facebook, Amazon, Russian natural gas producer Gazprom, Italian carmaker Fiat and others are also on her radar screen.
Born in Denmark, Vestager held various ministerial posts in her country's government before being appointed to the European Commission in 2014. Her politics are liberal in the classic meaning of the term: free speech, free assembly and free trade -- but she argues that it can only happen if markets are free of undue influence and anti-competitive behaviors.
Margrethe Vestager | Speaker | TED.com