TED2019
Barbara J. King: Grief and love in the animal kingdom
Barbara Dž. King (Barbara J. King): Žalost i ljubav u životinjskom carstvu
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Od ožalošćenih orka do uznemirenih slonova, biološka antropološkinja Barbara Dž. King bila je svedok žalosti i ljubavi širom životinjskog carstva. U ovom prosvetljujućem govoru, ona objašnjava dokaze koji podržavaju njeno uverenje da mnoge životinje doživljavaju složene emocije, i predlaže načine na koje svi mi možemo da se moralnije ophodimo prema njima, uključujući svaki put kada jedemo. „Životinje ne tuguju isto kao mi, ali to ne znači da njihova tuga nije stvarna,“ kaže ona. „Stvarna je i boli, i možemo je videti ako tako odlučimo.“
Barbara J. King - Biological anthropologist, writer
As a writer on animal cognition and emotion, Barbara J. King seeks to motivate us all to be kinder to the animals we share the planet with. Full bio
As a writer on animal cognition and emotion, Barbara J. King seeks to motivate us all to be kinder to the animals we share the planet with. Full bio
Double-click the English transcript below to play the video.
00:12
I'd like to tell you today
about an orca named Tahlequah.
about an orca named Tahlequah.
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Htela bih da vam danas pričam
o orki po imenu Talekva.
o orki po imenu Talekva.
00:17
Tahlequah is also known
as J35 to scientists,
as J35 to scientists,
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Talekva je naučnicima
takođe poznata kao J35,
takođe poznata kao J35,
00:21
because she swims with the J Pod
in the Salish Sea.
in the Salish Sea.
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jer pliva zajedno sa jatom J
u Sališkom moru.
u Sališkom moru.
00:24
These are the waters off of
British Columbia and Washington State.
British Columbia and Washington State.
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To su vode koje se protežu kroz
Britansku Kolumbiju i državu Vašington.
Britansku Kolumbiju i državu Vašington.
00:28
Now, last year, in July 2018,
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Prošle godine, u julu 2018,
00:32
she was well along
in her 17-month pregnancy,
in her 17-month pregnancy,
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već je bila u poodmakloj fazi
17-mesečne trudnoće
17-mesečne trudnoće
00:36
and scientists were very excited
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i naučnici su bili vrlo uzbuđeni
00:38
because no baby had survived
in this pod for three long years.
in this pod for three long years.
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jer nijedna beba nije preživela
u ovom jatu tri duge godine.
u ovom jatu tri duge godine.
00:44
Now, orcas are also
known as killer whales.
known as killer whales.
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Orke su takođe poznate i kao kitovi ubice.
00:47
They're profoundly social
and profoundly intelligent beings.
and profoundly intelligent beings.
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Oni su izuzetno društvena
i inteligentna bića.
i inteligentna bića.
00:52
And scientists are very interested
in their behavior,
in their behavior,
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Naučnici su veoma zainteresovani
za njihovo ponašanje
za njihovo ponašanje
00:55
because in their social networks,
they share habits, information
they share habits, information
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jer u okviru svojih društvenih mreža
razmenjuju navike, informacije,
razmenjuju navike, informacije,
00:59
and even affection.
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pa čak i privrženost.
01:00
They create true cultures of the ocean.
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Oni stvaraju istinske kulture okeana.
01:04
But this pod has been in trouble.
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Ali ovo jato je bilo u nevolji.
01:08
The Chinook salmon that the orcas favor
has been way down in the region,
has been way down in the region,
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Količina kraljevskog lososa, kojeg
orke vole, znatno je opala u regionu,
orke vole, znatno je opala u regionu,
01:12
and pollution has been up.
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a zagađenost se povećala.
01:15
But on July 24th, Tahlequah
gave birth to a daughter,
gave birth to a daughter,
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No, 24. jula je Talekva rodila ćerku
01:20
and scientists were so excited
by this development.
by this development.
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i naučnici su se mnogo radovali
takvom razvoju događaja.
takvom razvoju događaja.
01:24
But unfortunately, the same day --
in fact, shortly after birth --
in fact, shortly after birth --
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Nažalost, istog dana -
zapravo, ubrzo nakon porođaja -
zapravo, ubrzo nakon porođaja -
01:28
the calf died.
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mladunče je uginulo.
01:31
Well, what happened next
electrified animal lovers
electrified animal lovers
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Sledeće što se dogodilo
naelektrisalo je ljubitelje životinja
naelektrisalo je ljubitelje životinja
01:34
across the world,
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širom sveta,
01:35
because Tahlequah refused
to let her baby slip off into the water.
to let her baby slip off into the water.
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jer je Talekva odbila da dopusti
da njena beba sklizne u vodu.
da njena beba sklizne u vodu.
01:40
She kept it on her body
and she swam with it.
and she swam with it.
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Držala ju je na svom telu
i plivala sa njom.
i plivala sa njom.
01:43
If it did fall off,
she would dive and rescue it,
she would dive and rescue it,
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Ako bi joj ispala,
zaronila bi i spasila je,
zaronila bi i spasila je,
01:47
and she battled stiff currents to do this.
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a borila se protiv jakih struja pri tome.
01:51
Now, she kept this behavior up
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Nastavila je da se tako ponaša
01:53
for 17 days,
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17 dana,
01:56
and during this time,
she swam over 1,000 miles.
she swam over 1,000 miles.
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i za to vreme je preplivala
više od 1 600 kilometara.
više od 1 600 kilometara.
02:00
At that point, she let the little baby
slip off into the water.
slip off into the water.
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U tom trenutku je pustila bebu
da sklizne u vodu.
da sklizne u vodu.
02:04
So today, Tahlequah
swims on with the J Pod,
swims on with the J Pod,
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Danas Talekva i dalje pliva sa jatom J,
02:09
but her grief still moves me.
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ali njena žalost me još uvek pogađa.
02:12
And I do believe that "grief"
is the right word to use.
is the right word to use.
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I zaista verujem da je „žalost“
prava reč koju treba koristiti.
prava reč koju treba koristiti.
02:16
I believe that grief
is the right word to use
is the right word to use
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Verujem da je žalost prava reč
koju treba koristiti
koju treba koristiti
02:18
for numerous animals who mourn the dead.
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za brojne životinje koje oplakuju mrtve.
02:21
They may be friends or mates or relatives.
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One mogu biti prijatelji,
partneri ili srodnici.
partneri ili srodnici.
02:25
Because these visible cues,
these behavioral cues,
these behavioral cues,
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Jer ti vidljivi znaci,
te naznake u ponašanju,
te naznake u ponašanju,
02:28
tell us something about
an animal's emotional state.
an animal's emotional state.
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govore nam nešto
o emocionalnom stanju životinje.
o emocionalnom stanju životinje.
02:32
Now, for the last seven years,
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Proteklih sedam godina
02:34
I've been working to document
examples of animal grief --
examples of animal grief --
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radim na beleženju primera
žalosti kod životinja -
žalosti kod životinja -
02:37
in birds, in mammals,
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kod ptica, sisara,
02:39
in domesticated animals
and in wild animals --
and in wild animals --
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kod pripitomljenih i divljih životinja -
02:42
and I believe in the reality
of animal grief.
of animal grief.
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i verujem da je njihova žalost stvarna.
02:46
Now, I say it this way
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Kažem to tako
02:48
because I need to acknowledge
to you right up front
to you right up front
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jer moram unapred da vam priznam
da se ne slažu svi naučnici sa mnom.
02:50
that not all scientists agree with me.
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02:53
And part of the reason, I think,
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Deo razloga je, rekla bih,
02:55
is because of what I call the "a-word."
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nešto što ja zovem „reč na a“.
02:58
The a-word is anthropomorphism,
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Reč na a je antropomorfizam,
03:00
and historically,
it's been a big deterrent
it's been a big deterrent
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i to je oduvek
u velikoj meri bila prepreka
u velikoj meri bila prepreka
03:02
to recognizing animal emotions.
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za prepoznavanje emocija kod životinja.
Dakle, antropomorfizam
je kada na druge životinje projektujemo
je kada na druge životinje projektujemo
03:05
So, anthropomorphism is when
we project onto other animals
we project onto other animals
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03:09
our capacities or our emotions.
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naše sposobnosti ili naše emocije.
03:12
And we can all probably
think of examples of this.
think of examples of this.
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Verovatno se svi možemo
setiti primera ovoga.
setiti primera ovoga.
03:16
Let's say we have a friend who tells us,
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Recimo da imamo prijatelja koji nam kaže:
03:18
"My cat understands everything I say."
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„Moja mačka razume sve što kažem.“
03:22
Or, "My dog, he's so sweet.
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Ili: „Moj pas je tako sladak.
03:25
he ran right across the yard this morning
towards a squirrel,
towards a squirrel,
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Jutros je trčao po dvorištu
prema veverici,
prema veverici,
03:28
and I know he just wants to play."
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i znam da samo hoće da se igra.“
03:30
Well, maybe.
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Pa, možda.
03:32
Or maybe not.
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Ili možda ne.
03:33
I'm skeptical about claims like those.
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Skeptična sam u vezi sa takvim tvrdnjama.
03:37
But animal grief is different,
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Ali žalost je kod životinja drugačija,
03:39
because we're not trying
to read an animal's mind.
to read an animal's mind.
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jer ne pokušavamo
da čitamo misli životinja.
da čitamo misli životinja.
03:42
We're looking at visible cues of behavior
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Gledamo vidljive znakove ponašanja
03:44
and trying to interpret them
with some meaning.
with some meaning.
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i pokušavamo da ih protumačimo
dajući im neki smisao.
dajući im neki smisao.
03:47
Now, it's true -- scientists
often push back at me,
often push back at me,
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Istina, naučnici
mi često protivreče i kažu:
mi često protivreče i kažu:
03:50
and they'll say,
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„Vidi, životinja je možda pod stresom,
03:51
"Ah, look, the animal might be stressed,
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03:53
or maybe the animal's just confused
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ili je možda samo zbunjena
jer joj je poremećena rutina.“
03:55
because his or her routine
has been disrupted."
has been disrupted."
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03:58
But I think that this overworry
about anthropomorphism
about anthropomorphism
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Ali mislim da ova preterana briga
zbog antropomorfizma
zbog antropomorfizma
04:03
misses a fundamental point.
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previđa suštinsku stvar.
04:05
And that is that animals
can care very deeply for each other,
can care very deeply for each other,
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A to je da životinje mogu
izuzetno brinuti jedna za drugu,
izuzetno brinuti jedna za drugu,
04:09
maybe they even love each other.
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možda se čak i voleti.
04:11
And when they do,
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A kada je to slučaj,
04:12
a survivor's heart
can be pierced by a death.
can be pierced by a death.
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smrt može probosti srce preživelog.
04:17
Let's face it:
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Priznajmo:
04:18
if we deny evolutionary continuity,
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ako poričemo evolutivni kontinuitet,
04:21
we are really missing out
on embracing part of ourselves.
on embracing part of ourselves.
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propuštamo da prihvatimo deo samih sebe.
04:25
So yes, I believe in the reality
of animal grief,
of animal grief,
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Dakle, da, verujem da je žalost
kod životinja stvarna
kod životinja stvarna
04:28
and I also think that if we recognize it,
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i takođe mislim da, ako je prepoznamo,
04:30
we can make the world
a better place for animals,
a better place for animals,
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možemo učiniti svet
boljim mestom za životinje,
boljim mestom za životinje,
04:33
a kinder place for animals.
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prijatnijim prema životinjama.
04:36
So let me tell you a little bit more
about animal grief.
about animal grief.
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Da vam kažem nešto više
o žalosti kod životinja.
o žalosti kod životinja.
04:40
I'm going to start in Kenya.
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Počeću u Keniji.
04:43
You see here there's
an elephant named Eleanor
an elephant named Eleanor
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Vidite ovde slonicu po imenu Elenor
04:45
who came one day with bruised legs,
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koja se jednog dana pojavila
sa modricama po nogama
sa modricama po nogama
04:48
and she collapsed.
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i srušila se.
04:50
You see on the left
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Vidite na levoj strani
04:52
that another female named Grace
came to her right away
came to her right away
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da joj je odmah prišla
druga ženka po imenu Grejs
druga ženka po imenu Grejs
04:55
and, using her own trunk, propped her up,
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i poduprla je pomoću svoje surle,
04:58
tried to get her up on her feet.
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u pokušaju da je podigne na noge.
05:00
And she did succeed,
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I uspela je,
05:01
but then Eleanor collapsed again.
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ali se Elenor onda ponovo srušila.
05:04
At this point, Grace became
visibly distressed,
visibly distressed,
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U ovom trenutku je Grejs
postala vidno uznemirena,
postala vidno uznemirena,
05:07
and she prodded the body,
and she vocalized.
and she vocalized.
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gurala je telo i proizvodila zvuke.
05:11
Eleanor collapsed again,
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Elenor se ponovo srušila,
05:13
and unfortunately, she did die.
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i nažalost, uginula je.
05:16
What you see on the right is a female
from another family named Maui,
from another family named Maui,
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Ono što vidite na desnoj strani je ženka
iz druge porodice po imenu Maui
iz druge porodice po imenu Maui
05:20
who came after the death,
and she stayed at the body.
and she stayed at the body.
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koja je došla nakon što je uginula
i ostala je uz telo.
i ostala je uz telo.
05:23
She held a vigil there,
and she even rocked in distress
and she even rocked in distress
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Tu je držala bdenje,
a čak se i ljuljala od bola
a čak se i ljuljala od bola
05:27
over the body.
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nad telom.
05:28
So the scientists watching the elephants
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Naučnici koji su posmatrali slonove
05:31
kept close observation on Eleanor's body
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pomno su gledali Elenorino telo
05:34
for seven days.
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sedam dana.
05:36
And during those seven days,
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Tokom tih sedam dana,
05:37
a parade of elephants came
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došla je parada slonova
05:39
from five different families.
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iz pet različitih porodica.
05:42
Now, some were just curious,
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Neki su samo bili radoznali,
ali drugi su ispoljavali ponašanja
05:44
but others carried out behaviors
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05:45
that I really believe
should be classified as grief.
should be classified as grief.
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za koje zaista smatram
da se mogu svrstati kao žalost.
da se mogu svrstati kao žalost.
05:50
So what does grief look like?
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Kako žalost izgleda?
05:52
It can be rocking, as I said, in distress.
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To može biti ljuljanje,
kao što rekoh, od tuge.
kao što rekoh, od tuge.
05:55
It can also be social withdrawal,
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Može biti i društveno povlačenje,
05:57
when an animal just takes
himself or herself away from friends
himself or herself away from friends
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kada se životinja
samo udalji od prijatelja
samo udalji od prijatelja
06:01
and stays by themselves,
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i ostane nasamo,
06:04
or a failure to eat or sleep properly,
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ili ne može da jede i spava kako treba,
06:07
sometimes a depressed posture
or vocalization.
or vocalization.
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a ponekad i depresivno držanje
ili oglašavanje.
ili oglašavanje.
06:11
It can be very helpful
for those of us studying this
for those of us studying this
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Za nas koji izučavamo ovo
može biti veoma korisno
može biti veoma korisno
06:14
to be able to compare the behavior
of a survivor before death
of a survivor before death
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da uporedimo ponašanje preživelog
pre smrti i nakon smrti,
06:18
and after death,
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06:19
because that increases the rigor
of our interpretation.
of our interpretation.
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jer to poboljšava tačnost naših tumačenja.
06:23
And I can explain this to you
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To vam mogu objasniti
06:25
by talking about two ducks
named Harper and Kohl.
named Harper and Kohl.
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kroz priču o dvema patkama
po imenu Harper i Kol.
po imenu Harper i Kol.
06:30
So we're into birds now.
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Dakle, sad smo prešli na ptice.
06:32
So Harper and Kohl were raised
at a foie gras factory,
at a foie gras factory,
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Harper i Kol su uzgajani
u uzgajivačnici za "foa gra"
u uzgajivačnici za "foa gra"
06:35
and they were treated cruelly.
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i prema njima je okrutno postupano.
06:37
Foie gras does involve
force-feeding of birds.
force-feeding of birds.
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"Foa gra" podrazumeva
prisilno hranjenje ptica.
prisilno hranjenje ptica.
06:40
So this hurt their bodies, and their
spirits were not in good shape, either.
spirits were not in good shape, either.
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Tako da je to škodilo njihovom telu,
a ni njihov duh nije bio u dobrom stanju.
a ni njihov duh nije bio u dobrom stanju.
06:44
But thankfully, they were rescued
by a farm sanctuary in upstate New York.
by a farm sanctuary in upstate New York.
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Ali, na sreću, spašeni su
na farmerskom utočištu u Njujorku.
na farmerskom utočištu u Njujorku.
06:49
And for four years, they stabilized,
and they were fast friends.
and they were fast friends.
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Tokom četiri godine su se stabilizovali
i brzo sklopili prijateljstvo.
i brzo sklopili prijateljstvo.
06:53
They often took themselves
to a small pond on the property.
to a small pond on the property.
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Često su odlazili
do malog jezera na imanju.
do malog jezera na imanju.
06:57
Then, Kohl started to have
really intractable pain in his legs,
really intractable pain in his legs,
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Zatim je Kol počeo da dobija
vrlo uporne bolove u nogama
vrlo uporne bolove u nogama
07:01
and it was clear to the sanctuary
that he had to be euthanized humanely,
that he had to be euthanized humanely,
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i utočištu je postalo jasno da nad njim
mora biti izvršena humana eutanazija,
mora biti izvršena humana eutanazija,
07:05
and he was.
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i to su i uradili.
07:07
But then the sanctuary workers
did a brilliant thing,
did a brilliant thing,
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Ali onda su radnici u utočištu
učinili sjajnu stvar,
učinili sjajnu stvar,
07:09
because they brought Harper
to the body to see.
to the body to see.
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jer su doveli Harpera da vidi telo.
07:14
And at first, Harper prodded
the body of his friend,
the body of his friend,
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Harper je u početku
gurao telo svog prijatelja,
gurao telo svog prijatelja,
07:17
but then he laid himself over it,
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ali onda je legao preko njega
07:20
and he stayed there
for over an hour with his friend.
for over an hour with his friend.
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i ostao tu sa svojim drugom
više od jednog sata.
više od jednog sata.
07:23
And in the weeks after,
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U nedeljama koje su usledile,
07:26
he had a hard time.
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bilo mu je teško.
07:28
He would go back to that same pond
where he had been with Kohl,
where he had been with Kohl,
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Vratio bi se na to isto jezero
gde je odlazio sa Kolom
gde je odlazio sa Kolom
07:31
and he didn't want any other friends.
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i nije želeo druge prijatelje.
07:34
And within two months, he died as well.
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U roku od dva meseca je i on uginuo.
07:38
Now, I'm happy to say
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Sa zadovoljstvom mogu reći
07:39
that not all grieving animals
have this sorrowful outcome.
have this sorrowful outcome.
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da nemaju sve ožalošćene životinje
ovako tužan kraj.
ovako tužan kraj.
07:43
Last summer, I flew to Boston
to visit my adult daughter, Sarah.
to visit my adult daughter, Sarah.
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Prošlog leta sam letela u Boston
da bih posetila svoju odraslu ćerku Saru.
da bih posetila svoju odraslu ćerku Saru.
Bila sam sa svojim suprugom Čarlijem.
07:48
I was with my husband Charlie.
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07:49
I really needed a break from work.
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Zaista mi je bio potreban odmor od posla.
07:53
But I succumbed,
and I checked my work email.
and I checked my work email.
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Ali sam podlegla
i proverila poslovni imejl.
i proverila poslovni imejl.
07:57
You know how that is.
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Znate kako to ide.
07:58
And there was a communication
about a dejected donkey.
about a dejected donkey.
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I tu je bila prepiska
o potištenom magarcu.
o potištenom magarcu.
Za mene, kao antropologa,
to nije bilo ono što sam očekivala,
to nije bilo ono što sam očekivala,
08:03
Now, as an anthropologist,
this wasn't what I expected,
this wasn't what I expected,
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ali tu se našlo, i drago mi je
da sam to pročitala.
da sam to pročitala.
08:05
but there it was, and I'm glad I read it.
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08:07
Because a donkey named Lena
had gone to another farm sanctuary,
had gone to another farm sanctuary,
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Zato što je magarica po imenu Lina
otišla u drugo farmersko utočište
otišla u drugo farmersko utočište
08:12
this one in Alberta, Canada,
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u Alberti u Kanadi,
08:14
as the only donkey there,
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kao jedini magarac tamo,
08:17
and had trouble making friends
for that reason.
for that reason.
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i zbog toga je imala problema
da nađe prijatelje.
da nađe prijatelje.
08:19
But she eventually did make friends
with an older horse named Jake,
with an older horse named Jake,
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Ali na kraju se sprijateljila
sa starijim konjem po imenu Džejk
sa starijim konjem po imenu Džejk
i tri godine su bili nerazdvojni.
08:23
and for three years they were inseparable.
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08:26
But the reason the email came
was that Jake, at age 32, the horse,
was that Jake, at age 32, the horse,
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Povod za imejl je nastao
kada se konj Džejk, star 32 godine,
kada se konj Džejk, star 32 godine,
08:30
had become gravely ill
and had to be put down,
and had to be put down,
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ozbiljno razboleo
i morali su da ga uspavaju,
i morali su da ga uspavaju,
08:33
and this is what was going on.
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pa se ovo dogodilo.
08:36
This is Lena standing on Jake's grave.
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Ovo je Lina koja stoji na Džejkovom grobu.
08:39
She didn't want to come in at night.
She didn't want to come in for food.
She didn't want to come in for food.
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Nije htela da uđe unutra noću.
Nije htela da dođe po hranu.
Nije htela da dođe po hranu.
Nije htela da dođe po vodu.
08:42
She didn't want to come in for water.
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Kopala je po grobu, njakala u bolu,
08:44
She pawed at the grave,
she brayed in distress,
she brayed in distress,
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08:47
and there she stood.
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i tako je tu stajala.
08:50
So we talked and we brainstormed.
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Tako smo razgovarali i iznosili ideje.
08:52
What do you do for an animal like this?
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Kako pomoći ovakvoj životinji?
08:55
And we talked about the role of time,
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Pričali smo o ulozi vremena,
08:57
of extra love and kindness from people
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dodatne ljubavi i dobrote ljudi,
09:00
and of urging her to make a new friend.
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kao i o podsticanju
da nađe novog prijatelja.
da nađe novog prijatelja.
09:03
And here's where her trajectory does
diverge from that of Harper the duck,
diverge from that of Harper the duck,
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Tu se njena putanja
razlikuje od patka Harpera,
razlikuje od patka Harpera,
09:07
because she did make a new friend,
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jer ona jeste našla novog druga
09:09
and sanctuary workers wrote back
and said it worked out well.
and said it worked out well.
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i radnici iz utočišta su nam pisali
i rekli da se sve dobro završilo.
i rekli da se sve dobro završilo.
09:14
Now sometimes, scientists
supplement observation
supplement observation
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Ponekad naučnici dopunjuju posmatranje
09:17
with hormonal analysis.
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hormonskom analizom.
09:19
There's an example of a group
of scientists in Botswana,
of scientists in Botswana,
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Postoji primer grupe naučnika u Bocvani
09:22
who took fecal material from baboons
and compared two different groups.
and compared two different groups.
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koji su uzimali fekalne uzorke pavijana
i upoređivali dve različite grupe.
i upoređivali dve različite grupe.
09:27
The first group were females
who had witnessed a predator attack
who had witnessed a predator attack
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Prva grupa su bile ženke
koje su prisustvovale napadu predatora
koje su prisustvovale napadu predatora
09:31
and lost someone in that attack,
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i koje su izgubile nekoga u tom napadu,
09:34
and the second group were females
who had witnessed an attack
who had witnessed an attack
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a druga grupa su bile ženke
koje su prisustvovale napadu,
koje su prisustvovale napadu,
09:36
but had not lost someone.
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ali nisu nikoga izgubile.
09:38
And the stress hormones
were way up in that first group.
were way up in that first group.
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Hormoni stresa su bili
značajno povišeni u prvoj grupi.
značajno povišeni u prvoj grupi.
09:41
But here's the thing:
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Ali evo u čemu je stvar:
09:43
the scientists didn't just
call them "stressed baboons,"
call them "stressed baboons,"
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naučnici ih nisu nazvali
samo „pavijanima pod stresom“,
samo „pavijanima pod stresom“,
09:45
they called them "bereaved baboons,"
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već „ožalošćenim pavijanima“,
09:48
and in part, that's because
of the observations that they made.
of the observations that they made.
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što je delimično zbog njihovih zapažanja.
09:52
For example, this mother-daughter
pair were very close,
pair were very close,
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Na primer, ova majka i ćerka
bile su vrlo bliske,
bile su vrlo bliske,
09:55
and then the daughter
was killed by a lion.
was killed by a lion.
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i zatim je lav ubio ćerku.
09:58
The mother removed herself
from all her friends,
from all her friends,
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Majka se odvojila
od svih svojih prijatelja,
od svih svojih prijatelja,
10:00
from her grooming networks,
and just stayed by herself for weeks --
and just stayed by herself for weeks --
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od mreže sa kojom je čistila krzno,
ostala je sama sa sobom nedeljama -
ostala je sama sa sobom nedeljama -
10:05
bereavement --
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ožalošćenost -
10:06
and she then slowly recovered.
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i potom se polako oporavila.
10:11
So we have bereaved baboons.
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Dakle, imamo ožalošćene pavijane.
10:13
Will science tell us someday
about bereaved bees?
about bereaved bees?
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Da li će nam nauka jednog dana
govoriti o ožalošćenim pčelama?
govoriti o ožalošćenim pčelama?
10:17
Will we hear about frogs who mourn?
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Hoćemo li čuti za žabe koje oplakuju?
Ne bih rekla, a mislim da je razlog tome
to što je životinjama zaista potreban
to što je životinjama zaista potreban
10:21
I don't think so, and I think the reason
is because animals really need
is because animals really need
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10:25
one-to-one, close relationships
for that to happen.
for that to happen.
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vrlo blizak odnos, „jedan na jedan“,
da bi se to dogodilo.
da bi se to dogodilo.
10:28
I also know that circumstance matters,
and personality matters.
and personality matters.
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Takođe znam da su okolnosti
važne, kao i ličnost.
važne, kao i ličnost.
10:33
I have documented
cats and dogs who grieve,
cats and dogs who grieve,
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Dokumentovala sam mačke i pse koji tuguju,
10:36
our companion animals,
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naše kućne ljubimce,
10:38
but I also interacted with a woman
who was extremely bothered
who was extremely bothered
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ali sam takođe komunicirala sa ženom
kojoj je izuzetno smetalo
kojoj je izuzetno smetalo
10:40
because her dog wasn't grieving.
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što njen pas nije tugovao.
10:43
She said to me, "The first dog
in the house has died.
in the house has died.
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Rekla mi je: „Prvi pas u kući je uginuo.
10:47
The second animal does not
seem concerned, the second dog.
seem concerned, the second dog.
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Druga životinja, drugi pas,
deluje kao da ga se to ne tiče.
deluje kao da ga se to ne tiče.
10:50
What is wrong with him?"
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Šta nije u redu sa njim?“
10:51
(Laughter)
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(Smeh)
10:53
And as I listened to her,
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Dok sam je slušala,
10:55
I realized that this dog was now
the only animal in the household,
the only animal in the household,
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shvatila sam da je taj pas
sada jedina životinja u kući,
sada jedina životinja u kući,
10:59
and as far as he was concerned,
that was a pretty good deal.
that was a pretty good deal.
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i što se njega tiče,
to je bila prilično dobra stvar.
to je bila prilično dobra stvar.
11:03
So circumstances matter.
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Dakle, okolnosti su bitne.
11:06
Now, in any case, animals
are not going to grieve
are not going to grieve
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U svakom slučaju, životinje neće tugovati
11:09
exactly like we do.
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isto kao i mi.
11:11
We have human creativity.
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Mi imamo ljudsku kreativnost.
11:13
We paint our grief, dance our grief,
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Slikamo svoju tugu, plešemo je,
11:16
write our grief.
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ispisujemo je.
11:18
We also can grieve for people
we've never met,
we've never met,
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Takođe možemo žaliti zbog ljudi
koje nikada nismo upoznali,
koje nikada nismo upoznali,
11:21
across space and time.
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kroz prostor i vreme.
11:23
I felt this strongly when I went to Berlin
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To sam snažno osetila
kada sam otišla u Berlin
kada sam otišla u Berlin
11:26
and I stood at the Holocaust Memorial.
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i stajala u Memorijalu žrtvama Holokausta.
11:29
Animals don't grieve exactly like we do,
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Životinje ne tuguju isto kao mi,
11:31
but this doesn't mean
that their grief isn't real.
that their grief isn't real.
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ali to ne znači
da njihova tuga nije stvarna.
da njihova tuga nije stvarna.
11:34
It is real, and it's searing,
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Stvarna je i boli,
11:37
and we can see it if we choose.
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i možemo je videti ako tako odlučimo.
11:41
Now, I've lost both my parents.
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Ja sam izgubila oba roditelja.
11:43
I lost a very dear friend
at a young age from AIDS.
at a young age from AIDS.
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U mladosti sam izgubila
veoma dragog prijatelja zbog side.
veoma dragog prijatelja zbog side.
11:48
I believe most likely most of you
here have lost someone.
here have lost someone.
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Verujem da je verovatno
većina vas ovde izgubila nekoga.
većina vas ovde izgubila nekoga.
11:52
And I have found it a genuine comfort,
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Pronašla sam istinsku utehu,
11:56
a solace, to know that we aren't
the only beings on this earth
the only beings on this earth
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ohrabrenje, u saznanju da nismo
jedina bića na planeti
jedina bića na planeti
12:00
who feel love and grief.
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koja osećaju ljubav i žalost.
12:04
And I think this is important.
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Mislim da je to važno.
12:06
I also think we can take
this a step further,
this a step further,
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Takođe mislim da možemo
da odemo korak dalje
da odemo korak dalje
12:08
and we can realize
that the reality of animal grief
that the reality of animal grief
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i da možemo shvatiti
da nam postojanje žalosti životinja
da nam postojanje žalosti životinja
12:11
can help us be better
and do better for animals.
and do better for animals.
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može pomoći da budemo bolji
i bolje se ophodimo prema njima.
i bolje se ophodimo prema njima.
12:15
This is already happening with Tahlequah,
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To se već dešava u slučaju Talekve
12:17
because the United States and Canada have
renewed their talks with greater urgency
renewed their talks with greater urgency
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jer su Sjedinjene Države i Kanada
sa većom hitnošću obnovile razgovore
sa većom hitnošću obnovile razgovore
12:22
for how to help the orcas,
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o tome kako da pomognu orkama,
12:24
how to restore the Chinook salmon
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kako da obnove zalihe kraljevskog lososa
12:26
and how to help with the water pollution.
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i kako da pomognu sa zagađenjem vode.
12:29
We can also see that if grief is real,
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Takođe možemo uvideti da,
ako je žalost stvarna,
ako je žalost stvarna,
12:31
there's tremendous
plausibility to the notion
plausibility to the notion
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ogromna je verovatnoća
12:34
that animals feel a whole range of things.
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da životinje osećaju čitav niz stvari.
12:37
So we could look at joy,
sadness, even hope.
sadness, even hope.
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Možemo videti radost, tugu, pa čak i nadu.
12:42
And if we do that,
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Ako to uradimo,
12:44
here's how we can start
to think about the world.
to think about the world.
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evo kako možemo početi
da razmišljamo o svetu.
da razmišljamo o svetu.
12:46
We can look at orcas and say,
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Možemo pogledati orke i reći
12:48
we know they grieve,
we know they feel their lives,
we know they feel their lives,
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da znamo da tuguju,
znamo da osećaju svoj život,
znamo da osećaju svoj život,
12:51
and we can refuse to confine them
to small tanks in theme parks
to small tanks in theme parks
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5417
i možemo odbiti da ih ograničimo
na male akvarijume u tematskim parkovima
na male akvarijume u tematskim parkovima
12:57
and make them perform
for our entertainment.
for our entertainment.
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i da ih teramo da nastupaju
radi naše zabave.
radi naše zabave.
13:00
(Applause)
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(Aplauz)
13:02
Thank you.
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Hvala.
13:04
We can look at elephants
and say, yes, they grieve,
and say, yes, they grieve,
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Možemo pogledati slonove,
uvažiti da oni tuguju,
uvažiti da oni tuguju,
13:07
and we can renew our efforts
against international trophy hunting
against international trophy hunting
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i možemo obnoviti svoje napore u borbi
protiv međunarodnog trofejnog lova
protiv međunarodnog trofejnog lova
13:11
and against poaching.
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i protiv krivolova.
13:13
(Applause)
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(Aplauz)
13:15
Thank you.
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Hvala.
13:16
And we can look at our closest
living relatives, monkeys and apes,
living relatives, monkeys and apes,
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I možemo pogledati svoje najbliže rođake,
majmune i čovekolike majmune,
majmune i čovekolike majmune,
13:20
and know yes they grieve,
they feel their lives,
they feel their lives,
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i znati da oni tuguju,
da osećaju svoj život,
da osećaju svoj život,
13:23
so they don't deserve to be confined
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tako da ne zaslužuju da budu zarobljeni
13:25
in highly invasive biomedical experiments
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u vrlo invazivnim
biomedicinskim eksperimentima
biomedicinskim eksperimentima
13:29
year after year.
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iz godine u godinu.
13:31
And, you know --
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I, znate -
13:32
(Applause)
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(Aplauz)
13:33
the ducks Harper and Kohl,
they tell us something too.
they tell us something too.
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3478
patke Harper i Kol
nam takođe govore o nečemu.
nam takođe govore o nečemu.
13:37
They help us connect the dots
and realize that what we eat
and realize that what we eat
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Pomažu nam da povežemo stvari
i shvatimo da ono što jedemo
i shvatimo da ono što jedemo
13:41
affects how animals live.
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utiče na to kako životinje žive.
13:43
And it's not just foie gras,
and it's not just ducks.
and it's not just ducks.
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Ne radi se samo o jelu "foa gra",
i nije reč samo o patkama.
i nije reč samo o patkama.
13:46
We can think about pigs and chickens
and cows in factory farms,
and cows in factory farms,
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Možemo da razmislimo o svinjama, pilićima
i kravama u industrijskim farmama,
i kravama u industrijskim farmama,
13:52
and we can know.
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i možemo o tome saznati.
13:53
I can tell you the science is real
that these animals feel, too.
that these animals feel, too.
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Mogu vam reći da postoji stvarna nauka
o osećanjima i tih životinja.
o osećanjima i tih životinja.
13:57
So every single time
we choose a plant-based meal,
we choose a plant-based meal,
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Zato svaki put kada odaberemo
obrok od biljaka,
obrok od biljaka,
14:01
we are contributing
to reducing animal suffering.
to reducing animal suffering.
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doprinosimo smanjenju patnje životinja.
14:06
(Applause)
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(Aplauz)
14:09
So yes, I believe in the reality
of animal grief.
of animal grief.
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Dakle, da, verujem da je žalost
kod životinja stvarna.
kod životinja stvarna.
14:13
I believe in the reality of animal love,
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Verujem u postojanje ljubavi kod životinja
14:16
and I think it is time for us humans
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i smatram da je vreme da mi ljudi
14:18
to recognize that
we don't own these things.
we don't own these things.
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prepoznamo da to nije naša svojina.
14:21
And when we see that,
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Kada to uvidimo,
14:23
we have an opportunity to make the world
so much better for animals,
so much better for animals,
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imamo priliku da učinimo svet
mnogo boljim za životinje,
mnogo boljim za životinje,
14:27
a kinder world, a gentler world,
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prijatnijim, nežnijim,
14:29
and along the way, we might
just save ourselves, too.
just save ourselves, too.
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a usput bismo mogli spasiti i sami sebe.
14:34
Thank you so much.
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Mnogo vam hvala.
14:35
(Applause)
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(Aplauz)
14:37
Thank you. Thank you.
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Hvala. Hvala.
14:39
(Applause)
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(Aplauz)
ABOUT THE SPEAKER
Barbara J. King - Biological anthropologist, writerAs a writer on animal cognition and emotion, Barbara J. King seeks to motivate us all to be kinder to the animals we share the planet with.
Why you should listen
Barbara J. King writes and speaks about the thinking and feeling abilities of animals ranging from our closest living relatives, monkeys and apes, to orcas and octopuses. In her own words: "After 28 years of teaching anthropology at the College of William and Mary, I’m now a full-time freelance science writer and speaker. My husband and I care for homeless cats and spend all the time we can in nature. For work, I’ve observed baboons in Kenya, and gorillas and bonobos in captivity, and for pleasure bison in Yellowstone. I focus on how the science of animal cognition and emotion might help animals.
"My books take up topics ranging from animal grief to who (not what) we eat and how religion evolved, tied together by my focus on animals. I wrote weekly for six years for NPR about science, and my work has appeared in Scientific American, Aeon and Undark magazines. I love giving public science talks and I am active daily on Twitter @bjkingape."
King is the author of How Animals Grieve, Personalities on the Plate and Evolving God.
Barbara J. King | Speaker | TED.com