TEDIndia 2009
Vilayanur Ramachandran: The neurons that shaped civilization
VS Ramachandran：一探神经元 何以筑文明
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神经学家Vilayanur Ramachandran为我们勾勒出镜像神经元的惊人作用。这是一项近期的发现。这些神经元允许我们学会复杂的社会行为，这其中包括着构成人类社会的基础行为。
Vilayanur Ramachandran - Brain expert
Neurologist V.S. Ramachandran looks deep into the brain’s most basic mechanisms. By working with those who have very specific mental disabilities caused by brain injury or stroke, he can map functions of the mind to physical structures of the brain. Full bio
Neurologist V.S. Ramachandran looks deep into the brain’s most basic mechanisms. By working with those who have very specific mental disabilities caused by brain injury or stroke, he can map functions of the mind to physical structures of the brain. Full bio
Double-click the English transcript below to play the video.
00:15
I'd like to talk to you today about the human brain,
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今天，我想和大家一探大脑的奥秘，
00:18
which is what we do research on at the University of California.
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这是我于加州大学所做的研究。
00:20
Just think about this problem for a second.
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试着思考一下这个问题。
00:22
Here is a lump of flesh, about three pounds,
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这里有一堆肉，大概重三磅左右，
00:25
which you can hold in the palm of your hand.
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可以用一掌来握住。
00:27
But it can contemplate the vastness of interstellar space.
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但它却可以探究浩瀚的星际空间；
00:31
It can contemplate the meaning of infinity,
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可以探究无限的意义；
00:33
ask questions about the meaning of its own existence,
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可以探究自身存在的意义；
00:36
about the nature of God.
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可以探究上帝的本质。
00:38
And this is truly the most amazing thing in the world.
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这是世界上最不可思议之事。
00:40
It's the greatest mystery confronting human beings:
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这是人类面临的最大难题之一。
00:43
How does this all come about?
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这一切是怎么来的？
00:45
Well, the brain, as you know, is made up of neurons.
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正如你们所知，脑组织是由神经元所组成的。
00:47
We're looking at neurons here.
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这就是神经元。
00:49
There are 100 billion neurons in the adult human brain.
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成人脑组织里含有一千亿个神经元。
00:52
And each neuron makes something like 1,000 to 10,000 contacts
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每个神经元与其它神经元的
00:55
with other neurons in the brain.
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交接点约有一千至一万处。
00:57
And based on this, people have calculated
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基于此，人们对之进行了计算，
00:59
that the number of permutations and combinations of brain activity
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并得出各种大脑活动的组合总量
01:02
exceeds the number of elementary particles in the universe.
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超过了宇宙中基本粒子的数量。
01:05
So, how do you go about studying the brain?
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所以，我们应该如何研究大脑？
01:07
One approach is to look at patients who had lesions
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一种方法是观察那些有受过脑部
01:09
in different part of the brain, and study changes in their behavior.
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损伤的人，以来研究他们行为的变迁。
01:12
This is what I spoke about in the last TED.
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这是我于上次TED大会上所讲的内容。
01:14
Today I'll talk about a different approach,
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今天我将讲述一种新的方法。
01:16
which is to put electrodes in different parts of the brain,
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这种方法是将电极线置放于大脑的不同部位，
01:18
and actually record the activity of individual nerve cells in the brain.
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以记录单个神经细胞的活动性。
01:22
Sort of eavesdrop on the activity of nerve cells in the brain.
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颇类似于窃听神经细胞在大脑内的活动。
01:26
Now, one recent discovery that has been made
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最近，意大利帕尔马的
01:29
by researchers in Italy, in Parma,
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研究人员们，亦就是里佐拉蒂与其同事们，
01:31
by Giacomo Rizzolatti and his colleagues,
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在大脑前额叶
01:34
is a group of neurons called mirror neurons,
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发现了一组神经元，
01:36
which are on the front of the brain in the frontal lobes.
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这组神经元被他们称作镜像神经元。
01:39
Now, it turns out there are neurons
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此外，大脑里面还有一组神经元，
01:41
which are called ordinary motor command neurons in the front of the brain,
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称作运动神经元，也位于大脑的前半部分，
01:44
which have been known for over 50 years.
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这组神经元是50年前的发现。
01:46
These neurons will fire when a person performs a specific action.
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当我们要做某种运动时，这组神经元就会发射信息至相关器官。
01:49
For example, if I do that, and reach and grab an apple,
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例如，假若我这样做，我向前屈伸，然后抓住一只苹果，
01:52
a motor command neuron in the front of my brain will fire.
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一个运动神经元则会[向我的手]发射一组信息。
01:56
If I reach out and pull an object, another neuron will fire,
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假如我向前屈伸，并回拉一件物品，另外一个神经元则会
01:59
commanding me to pull that object.
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发射另一组信息以控制我的行动。
02:01
These are called motor command neurons that have been known for a long time.
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很早以前，这些运动神经元就被发现了。
02:03
But what Rizzolatti found was
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不过，里佐拉蒂他们发现
02:05
a subset of these neurons,
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这组神经元中包含着另外一组神经元，
02:07
maybe about 20 percent of them, will also fire
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大约百分之二十左右。这些神经元是会当我观看他人
02:09
when I'm looking at somebody else performing the same action.
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行动时，发出与此行动一样的信息。
02:12
So, here is a neuron that fires when I reach and grab something,
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所以，当我向前抓住某物件时，有个神经元会发出相关信息，
02:15
but it also fires when I watch Joe reaching and grabbing something.
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可是若我观看乔做相同的动作时，另一个神经元也会发出相关信息。
02:18
And this is truly astonishing.
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这实在是令人震惊。
02:20
Because it's as though this neuron is adopting
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因为这表明，神经元也会
02:22
the other person's point of view.
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采纳别人的观点。
02:24
It's almost as though it's performing a virtual reality simulation
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几乎就是模仿了他人的动作，
02:28
of the other person's action.
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有如虚拟现实仿真。
02:30
Now, what is the significance of these mirror neurons?
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那么，这些镜像神经元有何存在意义呢？
02:33
For one thing they must be involved in things like imitation and emulation.
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这里我必须引入模仿和仿真的概念。
02:36
Because to imitate a complex act
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假使我们要模仿一种复杂的行为，
02:39
requires my brain to adopt the other person's point of view.
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那么我们的大脑则需要采纳他人的行为观点。
02:42
So, this is important for imitation and emulation.
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因此模仿和仿真是非常重要的。
02:44
Well, why is that important?
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好了，它们为什么重要呢？
02:46
Well, let's take a look at the next slide.
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让我们看看下一张幻灯片。
02:49
So, how do you do imitation? Why is imitation important?
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你怎样进行模仿？模仿为什么重要？
02:52
Mirror neurons and imitation, emulation.
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镜像神经元，模仿和仿真。
02:54
Now, let's look at culture, the phenomenon of human culture.
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现在，让我们从人类文化方面入手。
02:58
If you go back in time about [75,000] to 100,000 years ago,
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让我们回到七万五千年至十万年前时，
03:02
let's look at human evolution, it turns out
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我们来观测下人类进化的过程，结果发现
03:04
that something very important happened around 75,000 years ago.
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于七万五千年前左右，一件重大事件影响了人类的发展。
03:07
And that is, there is a sudden emergence and rapid spread
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那就是，各种独特的“人类”技巧
03:09
of a number of skills that are unique to human beings
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突然出现以及迅速传播。这些技巧包括
03:12
like tool use,
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工具的使用、
03:14
the use of fire, the use of shelters, and, of course, language,
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火的使用、房屋的出现和语言交流，
03:17
and the ability to read somebody else's mind
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以及读取他人心思的能力和
03:19
and interpret that person's behavior.
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理解他人的行为。
03:21
All of that happened relatively quickly.
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这一切都相对地较快发生。
03:23
Even though the human brain had achieved its present size
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原始人类的大脑形状大约于四至五十万年前
03:26
almost three or four hundred thousand years ago,
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就已经发育至今人的形状，
03:28
100,000 years ago all of this happened very, very quickly.
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不过这些事件则是十万年前才快速地发生。
03:30
And I claim that what happened was
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我认为这些事件的产生是
03:33
the sudden emergence of a sophisticated mirror neuron system,
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源于先进的镜像神经元系统的突然浮现，
03:36
which allowed you to emulate and imitate other people's actions.
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这些神经元将允许你模仿他人的行为
03:38
So that when there was a sudden accidental discovery
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所以当氏族的某一成员偶然
03:42
by one member of the group, say the use of fire,
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发现，火的使用，
03:45
or a particular type of tool, instead of dying out,
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或者某种工具的使用，这种方法将会迅速传播
03:47
this spread rapidly, horizontally across the population,
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而非凋零消亡，这种方法将会横向传播于氏族中，
03:50
or was transmitted vertically, down the generations.
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或者代代纵向传播。
03:53
So, this made evolution suddenly Lamarckian,
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所以，这是一种拉马克式进化，
03:55
instead of Darwinian.
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而非达尔文式。
03:57
Darwinian evolution is slow; it takes hundreds of thousands of years.
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达尔文式进化是异乎缓慢的，它大概需要几千年的时间来产生效用。
04:00
A polar bear, to evolve a coat,
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若要使一只北极熊进化出一件外衣，
04:02
will take thousands of generations, maybe 100,000 years.
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则需要他们经过数千代的传承，或许需要十万年方能得出外衣。
04:05
A human being, a child, can just watch its parent
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一个人类小孩，则仅需观看他的父母
04:08
kill another polar bear,
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如何屠杀另一只北极熊，
04:11
and skin it and put the skin on its body, fur on the body,
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将其剥皮拆骨，用来制造外衣。
04:14
and learn it in one step. What the polar bear
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小孩因此可以快速掌握这一技能。
04:16
took 100,000 years to learn,
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北极熊需要十万年才得以进化出外衣，
04:18
it can learn in five minutes, maybe 10 minutes.
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人类小孩仅仅要五分钟或者十分钟就学会了。
04:21
And then once it's learned this it spreads
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当他们学会之后，这项技能将以
04:23
in geometric proportion across a population.
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燎原之势散播于他们的氏族当中。
04:26
This is the basis. The imitation of complex skills
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这就是本源。文化就是模仿
04:29
is what we call culture and is the basis of civilization.
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复杂的行为活动，而文明则产于此。
04:32
Now there is another kind of mirror neuron,
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现在我将讲到另外一种镜像神经元，
04:34
which is involved in something quite different.
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担负另外的功能。
04:36
And that is, there are mirror neurons,
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有些镜像神经元只管活动，
04:38
just as there are mirror neurons for action, there are mirror neurons for touch.
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另外一些则管触觉。
04:41
In other words, if somebody touches me,
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换句话来说，假如某人触碰了我，
04:43
my hand, neuron in the somatosensory cortex
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我的手，位于躯体感觉皮层的神经元
04:45
in the sensory region of the brain fires.
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将会发出一组信息。
04:47
But the same neuron, in some cases, will fire
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但同一个神经元，在某些情况下，
04:50
when I simply watch another person being touched.
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当我观看他人被触碰时，也会发出信息。
04:52
So, it's empathizing the other person being touched.
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注意，我是说他人被触碰。
04:55
So, most of them will fire when I'm touched
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大多数的神经元都会于我被触碰时
04:57
in different locations. Different neurons for different locations.
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发出信息。不同的神经元负责不同的身体区域。
05:00
But a subset of them will fire even when I watch somebody else
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偏偏有小部分的神经元在我观看他人被触碰时
05:02
being touched in the same location.
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也会发出相同的信息。
05:04
So, here again you have neurons
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因此，这里又有一群神经元
05:06
which are enrolled in empathy.
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参与进了你与他人之间的共鸣。
05:08
Now, the question then arises: If I simply watch another person being touched,
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不过问题是：假如我只观看他人被触碰，
05:11
why do I not get confused and literally feel that touch sensation
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那么为什么我不会
05:15
merely by watching somebody being touched?
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有那种被触碰的感觉呢？
05:17
I mean, I empathize with that person but I don't literally feel the touch.
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我与那人产生共鸣，但我并未产生触碰感。
05:21
Well, that's because you've got receptors in your skin,
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那是因为我们皮肤上有感受器，
05:23
touch and pain receptors, going back into your brain
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一种痛感受器，它会向大脑
05:25
and saying "Don't worry, you're not being touched.
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反馈道：“切莫担心，你还未被触碰呢。
05:28
So, empathize, by all means, with the other person,
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注意，是另外一个人被触碰呢，
05:31
but do not actually experience the touch,
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而不是我们自己呀。
05:33
otherwise you'll get confused and muddled."
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要不我们自己则会搞混呢。”
05:35
Okay, so there is a feedback signal
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所以，这里会有一种反馈信号
05:37
that vetoes the signal of the mirror neuron
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以阻止镜像神经元所发出的信号，
05:39
preventing you from consciously experiencing that touch.
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从而使你避免感觉到那股错误的触碰感。
05:42
But if you remove the arm, you simply anesthetize my arm,
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然而，当你移除你的手臂时，
05:45
so you put an injection into my arm,
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或者向你的手臂注射麻醉剂，
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anesthetize the brachial plexus, so the arm is numb,
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从而麻醉臂丛神经
05:49
and there is no sensations coming in,
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使你无法感觉到你的手臂的时候，
05:51
if I now watch you being touched,
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假如你现在观看他人手掌被触碰，
05:53
I literally feel it in my hand.
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你的手掌也会有被触碰的感觉。
05:55
In other words, you have dissolved the barrier
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换句话说，你将你与他人之间的
05:57
between you and other human beings.
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隔膜溶解了。
05:59
So, I call them Gandhi neurons, or empathy neurons.
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因此，我称他们为甘地神经元，或者是共鸣神经元。
06:02
(Laughter)
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(笑声)
06:03
And this is not in some abstract metaphorical sense.
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这并不是种抽象的道理，
06:06
All that's separating you from him,
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将你与他人隔开的
06:08
from the other person, is your skin.
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就是你的皮肤。
06:10
Remove the skin, you experience that person's touch in your mind.
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移除你的皮肤，你将会与他人感同身受。
06:14
You've dissolved the barrier between you and other human beings.
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你将你与他人之间的隔膜溶解了。
06:17
And this, of course, is the basis of much of Eastern philosophy,
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这些当然就是大部分东方哲学的基础。
06:19
and that is there is no real independent self,
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那就是没有真实独立的自我
06:22
aloof from other human beings, inspecting the world,
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将你与他人隔开，从而以审视这个世界，
06:24
inspecting other people.
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审视他人。
06:26
You are, in fact, connected not just via Facebook and Internet,
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事实上，我们与他人交结并不只是通过Facebook或是网络，
06:29
you're actually quite literally connected by your neurons.
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而是各式各样的神经元。
06:32
And there is whole chains of neurons around this room, talking to each other.
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在这间大厅里，有一群的神经元正互相交谈着呢。
06:35
And there is no real distinctiveness
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你与他人的意识
06:37
of your consciousness from somebody else's consciousness.
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并没有任何真正的差异。
06:39
And this is not mumbo-jumbo philosophy.
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这并不是晦涩难懂的哲学。
06:41
It emerges from our understanding of basic neuroscience.
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这是由基础神经学所引申出来的。
06:44
So, you have a patient with a phantom limb. If the arm has been removed
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当你接诊一位有幻肢的病人时，幻肢即是
06:47
and you have a phantom, and you watch somebody else
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截肢或残废的患者仍感到自己有该肢体的存在，当他观察他人
06:49
being touched, you feel it in your phantom.
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被触碰时，他也会有此感。
06:51
Now the astonishing thing is,
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令人震惊的是，
06:53
if you have pain in your phantom limb, you squeeze the other person's hand,
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当你患有幻肢痛时，你对他人的手掌
06:56
massage the other person's hand,
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进行按摩时，
06:58
that relieves the pain in your phantom hand,
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你的疼痛感便会减轻。
07:00
almost as though the neuron
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这是因为你的神经元
07:02
were obtaining relief from merely
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正获取他人被按摩时
07:04
watching somebody else being massaged.
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所获得的舒适感。
07:06
So, here you have my last slide.
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这是我最后一张幻灯片。
07:09
For the longest time people have regarded science
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长期以来，人们都将科学与
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and humanities as being distinct.
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人文学科分开，
07:13
C.P. Snow spoke of the two cultures:
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C.P.斯诺指出两种文化：
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science on the one hand, humanities on the other;
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一种是科学，一种是人文；
07:18
never the twain shall meet.
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将永不相见。
07:20
So, I'm saying the mirror neuron system underlies the interface
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而我则认为镜像神经元系统将再次引起
07:22
allowing you to rethink about issues like consciousness,
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一场思潮，将使你重新思考什么是意识，
07:25
representation of self,
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什么代表自我，
07:27
what separates you from other human beings,
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什么将你于他人区分开，
07:29
what allows you to empathize with other human beings,
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什么使你与他人产生共鸣，
07:31
and also even things like the emergence of culture and civilization,
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什么使文化与文明产生，
07:34
which is unique to human beings. Thank you.
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什么才是人类所独有的事物。谢谢。
07:36
(Applause)
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(鼓掌)
ABOUT THE SPEAKER
Vilayanur Ramachandran - Brain expertNeurologist V.S. Ramachandran looks deep into the brain’s most basic mechanisms. By working with those who have very specific mental disabilities caused by brain injury or stroke, he can map functions of the mind to physical structures of the brain.
Why you should listen
V.S. Ramachandran is a mesmerizing speaker, able to concretely and simply describe the most complicated inner workings of the brain. His investigations into phantom limb pain, synesthesia and other brain disorders allow him to explore (and begin to answer) the most basic philosophical questions about the nature of self and human consciousness.
Ramachandran is the director of the Center for Brain and Cognition at the University of California, San Diego, and an adjunct professor at the Salk Institute. He is the author of Phantoms in the Brain (the basis for a Nova special), A Brief Tour of Human Consciousness and The Man with the Phantom Twin: Adventures in the Neuroscience of the Human Brain.
Vilayanur Ramachandran | Speaker | TED.com