TEDIndia 2009
Shashi Tharoor: Why nations should pursue soft power
沙希·塔鲁尔(Shashi Tharoor): 为什么国家应该采取“软”实力
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Readability: 4.4
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沙希·塔鲁尔认为，印度正在迅速成为一个超级大国 -- 不仅是通过其贸易和政治，而更多的是通过其“软”实力，它正通过饮食，音乐，科技，宝莱坞与世界分享自己的文化。他认为，从长远来看国家实力不是体现于一个国家的军队的大小，更重要的是其对世界心灵和思想的影响力。
Shashi Tharoor - Politician and writer
After a long career at the UN, and a parallel life as a novelist, Shashi Tharoor became a member of India's Parliament. He spent 10 months as India's Minister for External Affairs, building connections between India and the world. Full bio
After a long career at the UN, and a parallel life as a novelist, Shashi Tharoor became a member of India's Parliament. He spent 10 months as India's Minister for External Affairs, building connections between India and the world. Full bio
Double-click the English transcript below to play the video.
00:15
As an Indian, and now as a politician
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作为一个印度人，一名政治家,
00:17
and a government minister,
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一位政府部长
00:19
I've become rather concerned about
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我越来越关注有关
00:21
the hype we're hearing about our own country,
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自己的国家报道，
00:23
all this talk about India becoming a world leader,
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所有这些报道都是关于印度将成为世界的领头羊，
00:25
even the next superpower.
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甚至是下一个超级大国。
00:27
In fact, the American publishers of my book,
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事实上，我的书《大象，老虎和手机》
00:29
"The Elephant, The Tiger and the Cell Phone,"
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被美国出版商，
00:31
added a gratuitous subtitle saying,
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加了一条无必要的副标题—
00:33
"India: The next 21st-century power."
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《印度：21世纪的接替者》。
00:35
And I just don't think that's what India's all about,
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而且我并不认为那就是印度未来的所有
00:37
or should be all about.
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或者应该成为的。
00:39
Indeed, what worries me is the entire notion of world leadership
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事实上，我最担心的是世界的领导观念
00:43
seems to me terribly archaic.
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会是非常陈旧的。
00:45
It's redolent of James Bond movies
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这让人联想起007的电影
00:47
and Kipling ballads.
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和吉卜林（生于印度孟买，英国作家及诗人）的诗歌。
00:49
After all, what constitutes a world leader?
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什么才是世界领袖？
00:51
If it's population, we're on course to top the charts.
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如果按人口来说，我们正朝着排行榜前列航行。
00:54
We will overtake China by 2034.
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2034年我们将超过中国。
00:58
Is it military strength? Well, we have the world's fourth largest army.
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抑或是军事实力？那么，我们有世界第四大军队。
01:01
Is it nuclear capacity? We know we have that.
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还是核能力？我们知道我们有。
01:03
The Americans have even recognized it,
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美国人已意识到这一点，
01:05
in an agreement.
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在(签订)协议中。
01:07
Is it the economy? Well, we have now
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又或是经济发展情况？那么，我们已是
01:09
the fifth-largest economy in the world
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世界第五大经济体
01:11
in purchasing power parity terms.
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按平均购买力计算。
01:13
And we continue to grow. When the rest of the world took a beating last year,
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当世界其它地区去年经济惨遭滑铁卢时，我们依然继续增长。
01:16
we grew at 6.7 percent.
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我们增长了百分之六点七。
01:19
But, somehow, none of that adds up to me,
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但是，不知何故，所有的事一起呈现出來，我都不认为，
01:23
to what I think India really can aim to contribute in the world,
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印度
01:28
in this part of the 21st century.
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为21世纪做出了真正的贡献。
01:30
And so I wondered, could
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所以，我想知道，
01:33
what the future beckons for India to be all about
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未来对印度来说意味着什么
01:36
be a combination of these things allied to something else,
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是这些东西的组合结盟还是别的什么，
01:39
the power of example,
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让我来举一个体现实力的例子，
01:41
the attraction of India's culture,
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印度文化的吸引力，
01:44
what, in other words, people like to call "soft power."
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换句话说，很多人喜欢称之为“软实力”。
01:49
Soft power is a concept invented by a Harvard academic,
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软实力是一位哈佛学者提出的一个概念，
01:52
Joseph Nye, a friend of mine.
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约瑟夫·奈，我的一个朋友。
01:54
And, very simply, and I'm really cutting it short because of the time limits here,
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这个概念很简单，因为时间的限制，我在这里很简短的介绍一下，
01:58
it's essentially the ability of a country to attract others
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它本质上是一个国家能够吸引别人的能力
02:01
because of its culture, its political values,
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由于其文化，政治价值观，
02:03
its foreign policies.
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及外交政策。
02:05
And, you know, lots of countries do this. He was writing initially about the States,
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而且，你知道，很多国家都在这样做。这实际上是在初步刻画一国家，
02:08
but we know the Alliance Francaise
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如法兰西联盟
02:10
is all about French soft power, the British Council.
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宣扬法国软实力，还有英国文化委员会。
02:13
The Beijing Olympics were an exercise in Chinese soft power.
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北京奥运会是中国宣扬其软实力的鲜明例子。
02:16
Americans have the Voice of America and the Fulbright scholarships.
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美国人有美国之音和富布赖特奖学金计划。
02:20
But, the fact is, in fact,
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但是，实际上
02:22
that probably Hollywood and MTV and McDonalds
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好莱坞，MTV和麦当劳
02:25
have done more for American soft power
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对美国软实力传播作出更大的贡献
02:27
around the world than any specifically government activity.
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且超出了世界上任何政府为此举办的各种特别活动。
02:30
So soft power is something that really emerges
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因此，软实力是真正展现的东西
02:33
partly because of governments,
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部分原因是由于政府的实力，
02:35
but partly despite governments.
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但部分原因是跟政府毫无关联。
02:37
And in the information era we all live in today,
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在我们仙剑生活的时代中，
02:40
what we might call the TED age,
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我们或许会把它称之为TED时代，
02:43
I'd say that countries are increasingly being judged
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我想说，各国正日益
02:46
by a global public that's been fed
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受到全球公众评判，
02:49
on an incessant diet of Internet news,
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如互联网上不断提供的新闻，
02:52
of televised images,
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电视图像，
02:54
of cellphone videos, of email gossip.
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手机视频，电子邮件的说三道四等，
02:57
In other words, all sorts of communication devices
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换言之，我们如今可以通过各种通信设备
03:00
are telling us the stories of countries,
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以得知一国家的信息
03:02
whether or not the countries concerned want people to hear those stories.
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不管相关国家部分是否希望人们获得这些信息。
03:07
Now, in this age, again, countries with access
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今天，拥有通讯及
03:09
to multiple channels of communication
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多重信息渠道的国家
03:11
and information have a particular advantage.
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将享有特别的优势。
03:13
And of course they have more influence, sometimes, about how they're seen.
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当然，他们有着更大的影响力，有时，可以颠倒黑白。
03:17
India has more all-news TV channels
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印度的新闻电视频道
03:19
than any country in the world,
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比世界上任何一个国家都多，
03:21
in fact in most of the countries in this part of the world put together.
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实际上是世界上的大多数国家的新闻电视频道的总和。
03:25
But, the fact still is that it's not just that.
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但是，我们不止步于此。
03:27
In order to have soft power, you have to be connected.
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软实力必须与外界相连。
03:30
One might argue that India has become
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可能有人会说
03:32
an astonishingly connected country.
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印度已成为一个拥有惊人的信息链的国家。
03:34
I think you've already heard the figures.
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我想你们已经听到过这些数字。
03:36
We've been selling 15 million cellphones a month.
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我们每个月销售1500万部手机。
03:40
Currently there are 509 million cellphones
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印度目前共有5.09亿
03:43
in Indian hands, in India.
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手机用户。
03:45
And that makes us larger than the U.S. as a telephone market.
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就电话市场来说，我们已超过美国。
03:49
In fact, those 15 million cellphones
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事实上，每个月1500万部手机的销售量
03:52
are the most connections that any country,
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就像美国和中国
03:54
including the U.S. and China,
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这样的电信市场大国，
03:56
has ever established in the history of telecommunications.
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都没发生过。
03:59
But, what perhaps some of you don't realize
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但是，或许你们还未意识到
04:01
is how far we've come to get there.
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迄今为止，我们是如何达到这种水平的。
04:03
You know, when I grew up in India,
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你们知道，在我小时候
04:05
telephones were a rarity.
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电话可是一种稀有的东西。
04:07
In fact, they were so rare that elected members of Parliament
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事实上，他们是如此稀有，以至于只有当选的议会议员
04:09
had the right to allocate 15 telephone lines
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才有权分享那些
04:12
as a favor to those they deemed worthy.
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他们认为值得青睐的15条电话线。
04:14
If you were lucky enough to be a wealthy businessman
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如果你有幸成为富商
04:17
or an influential journalist, or a doctor or something, you might have a telephone.
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或是一位有影响的记者，或医生，或是其他有影响的人，你才可能获得一部电话。
04:20
But sometimes it just sat there.
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但是，有时只是坐在那里。
04:22
I went to high school in Calcutta.
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我高中是在加尔各答上的。
04:24
And we would look at this instrument sitting in the front foyer.
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我们默默的坐在大厅前注视着这个通话工具。
04:26
But half the time we would pick it up
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但是，有一半的时间，我们会带着期盼的目光
04:28
with an expectant look on our faces,
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把它接起来，
04:30
there would be no dial tone.
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然而根本没有拨号音。
04:32
If there was a dial tone and you dialed a number,
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如果有拨号音，你拨一个号码，
04:34
the odds were two in three you wouldn't get the number you were intending to reach.
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三分之二的可能性是你根本不能打通你要拨的目的地。
04:38
In fact the words "wrong number" were more popular than the word "Hello."
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事实上，"错号"的声音要比"喂"的声音更为流行。
04:41
(Laughter)
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（笑声）
04:42
If you then wanted to connect to another city,
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如果你想连接到其他城市，
04:44
let's say from Calcutta you wanted to call Delhi,
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假设你想从加尔各答打到德里，
04:46
you'd have to book something called a trunk call,
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你必须预订一种叫长途电话的服务，
04:48
and then sit by the phone all day, waiting for it to come through.
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然后坐在电话旁等上一整天，直到线路为你开通为止。
04:51
Or you could pay eight times the going rate
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或者你可以支付比现行利率高8倍的使用费
04:54
for something called a lightning call.
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支付一种名为闪电呼叫的服务。
04:56
But, lightning struck rather slowly in our country in those days,
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但是，在那些日子里， 就像闪电呼叫的这种服务也是相当的慢，
04:58
so, it was like about a half an hour for a lightning call to come through.
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当时，闪电呼叫服务大约需要半个小时才能打通。
05:02
In fact, so woeful was our telephone service
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事实上，我们的电话服务是这样的悲伤
05:05
that a Member of Parliament stood up in 1984 and complained about this.
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以至于一名国会成员于1984年在议会中对此抱怨。
05:09
And the Then-Communications Minister replied in a lordly manner
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而当时的通信部长以很高傲的态度回答
05:12
that in a developing country
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在一个发展中国家
05:14
communications are a luxury, not a right,
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通讯是一种奢侈品不是一项权利，
05:16
that the government had no obligation to provide better service,
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政府没有义务提供更好的服务，
05:20
and if the honorable Member wasn't satisfied with his telephone,
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而如果荣誉会员不满意他的电话，
05:22
could he please return it, since there was an eight-year-long waiting list
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请他完全可以将电话退回，因为当时的印度，为了打电话，
05:25
for telephones in India.
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有8年之久的等待名单。
05:28
Now, fast-forward to today and this is what you see:
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现在，快进到今天，这是你所看到的，
05:30
the 15 million cell phones a month.
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每个月1500万部手机的销售量
05:32
But what is most striking is who is carrying those cell phones.
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但是，最引人注目的是谁携带手机。
05:36
You know, if you visit friends in the suburbs of Delhi,
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你们知道，如果你在访问新德里郊区的朋友，
05:39
on the side streets you will find a fellow with a cart
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在小街你会发现一个运货马车家伙
05:42
that looks like it was designed in the 16th century,
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看起来就像是在16世纪设计的，
05:45
wielding a coal-fired steam iron
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挥舞燃煤蒸汽电熨斗
05:48
that might have been invented in the 18th century.
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可能已经在18世纪发明的。
05:50
He's called an isthri wala. But he's carrying a 21st-century instrument.
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他被称为isthri wala。但他带着21世纪的工具。
05:53
He's carrying a cell phone because most incoming calls are free,
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他携带手机，因为大部分来电是免费的，
05:56
and that's how he gets orders from the neighborhood,
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这就是他怎么从邻居那里拿到订单的，
05:58
to know where to collect clothes to get them ironed.
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知道在哪里，收集衣服，让他们熨。
06:02
The other day I was in Kerala, my home state,
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有一天，我在喀拉拉邦，我的家乡。
06:05
at the country farm of a friend,
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在一个朋友的农场上，
06:07
about 20 kilometers away from any place you'd consider urban.
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离城里约20公里。
06:11
And it was a hot day and he said, "Hey, would you like some fresh coconut water?"
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它是一个炎热的一天，他说：“嗨，你想喝一些新鲜椰子水吗？”
06:14
And it's the best thing and the most nutritious and refreshing thing you can drink
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这也是在热带那种炎热的天气里，能喝到最有营养的和令人耳目一新的饮料
06:17
on a hot day in the tropics, so I said sure.
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所以我的回答是，当然了。
06:20
And he whipped out his cellphone, dialed the number,
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于是他拿起了他的手机，拨了个号码，
06:22
and a voice said, "I'm up here."
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手机那边传来一个声音说，“我就在附近。”
06:24
And right on top of the nearest coconut tree,
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而且就在最近的椰子树的顶端，
06:26
with a hatchet in one hand and a cell phone in the other,
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一个手里拿着手斧，另一只手里拿着手机
06:29
was a local toddy tapper,
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是一个本地卖椰子汁的
06:31
who proceeded to bring down the coconuts for us to drink.
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他井然有序地从椰子树上给我们带来新鲜的椰子汁。
06:34
Fishermen are going out to sea and carrying their cell phones.
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渔民们在出海前拿起他们的手机。
06:37
When they catch the fish they call all the market towns along the coast
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当他们捕获到鱼时，他们会给所有沿岸集镇打去电话
06:40
to find out where they get the best possible prices.
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找出他们在那儿能得到最好的价格。
06:42
Farmers now, who used to have to spend half a day of backbreaking labor
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以前的农民奔命半天
06:46
to find out if the market town was open,
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为去找到哪里有集市开放，
06:48
if the market was on,
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如果市场开放的话，
06:50
whether the product they'd harvested could be sold, what price they'd fetch.
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他们还得知道是否值得出售自己的丰收物，是否能卖个好价钱。
06:53
They'd often send an eight year old boy all the way on this trudge
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为此他们会经常派一名8岁的男孩一路跋涉
06:56
to the market town to get that information and come back,
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到集镇获得信息然后再回来，
06:58
then they'd load the cart.
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之后他们还得装车。
07:00
Today they're saving half a day's labor with a two minute phone call.
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今时今日，过去大半天的劳动仅仅用两分钟的电话就解决了。
07:04
So this empowerment of the underclass
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这种被赋有权力的底层阶级
07:07
is the real result of India being connected.
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就是印度信息连接的真实的结果。
07:10
And that transformation is part of where India is heading today.
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而这种转变是印度今天发展方向的一部分。
07:15
But, of course that's not the only thing about India that's spreading.
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但是，当然这不是印度发展的唯一形式。
07:18
You've got Bollywood. My attitude to Bollywood is best summarized
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你们一定听说过宝莱坞。 我对宝莱坞的观点可以用
07:21
in the tale of the two goats at a Bollywood garbage dump --
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两只山羊在宝莱坞垃圾场的故事概括 --
07:24
Mr. Shekhar Kapur, forgive me --
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[不明确] 请原谅 --
07:28
and they're chewing away on cans of celluloid discarded by a Bollywood studio.
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他们咀嚼着被一个宝莱坞工作室丢弃的一罐电影胶片。
07:32
And the first goat, chewing away, says, "You know, this film is not bad."
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第一个山羊，咀嚼着，说：“你知道，这部电影不错（指胶片的味道）。”
07:35
And the second goat says, "No, the book was better."
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第二个山羊说：“不，书的味道更好些。”
07:39
(Laughter)
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（笑）
07:45
I usually tend to think that the book is usually better,
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我通常倾向于认为，书是更好的，
07:48
but, having said that,
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但是，话虽如此，
07:50
the fact is that Bollywood is now
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事实是，宝莱坞
07:52
taking a certain aspect of Indian-ness and Indian culture around the globe,
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以某一方面在世界各地传播着印度海岬和印度文化，
07:56
not just in the Indian diaspora in the U.S. and the U.K.,
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不仅只是为了给在美国和英国生活的印度侨民，
07:59
but to the screens of Arabs and Africans, of Senegalese and Syrians.
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而且也搬上了从阿拉伯人到非洲人，从塞内加尔到叙利亚人的屏幕。
08:03
I've met a young man in New York whose illiterate mother
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我在纽约遇见一位年轻人，他母亲是文盲
08:06
in a village in Senegal
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并住在塞内加尔的一个村子里，
08:08
takes a bus once a month to the capital city of Dakar,
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她每月都乘车去省会达喀尔，
08:11
just to watch a Bollywood movie.
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仅仅是为了观看宝莱坞电影。
08:13
She can't understand the dialogue.
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她无法理解对话内容。
08:15
She's illiterate, so she can't read the French subtitles.
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她是文盲，因此她看不懂法文字幕。
08:18
But these movies are made to be understood despite such handicaps,
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但是，尽管有这些障碍，这些电影还是可以理解的，
08:21
and she has a great time in the song and the dance and the action.
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她很开心的欣赏着电影里的音乐，舞蹈和画面，
08:24
She goes away with stars in her eyes about India, as a result.
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结果，她从宝莱坞电影明星那里获知关于印度的印象。
08:28
And this is happening more and more.
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这种例子发生的越来越多。
08:30
Afghanistan, we know what a serious security problem
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阿富汗，我们知道那里存在着什么样的严重安全问题
08:33
Afghanistan is for so many of us in the world.
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阿富汗是我们许多在世界上的人来说，关心的焦点。
08:36
India doesn't have a military mission there.
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印度在哪儿没有军事任务。
08:38
You know what was India's biggest asset in Afghanistan in the last seven years?
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你们知道印度过去7年在阿富汗最大的资产是什么？
08:42
One simple fact:
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一个简单的事实：
08:44
you couldn't try to call an Afghan at 8:30 in the evening.
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你不能尝试在晚上8:30给阿富汗人打电话。
08:47
Why? Because that was the moment
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为什么？因为在那个时间断
08:49
when the Indian television soap opera,
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正在播放印度电视肥皂剧，
08:51
"Kyunki Saas Bhi Kabhi Bahu Thi," dubbed into Dari, was telecast on Tolo T.V.
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[印地文]，配上印度手纺纱棉毯， 在Todo T.V 上转播
08:57
And it was the most popular television show in Afghan history.
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它是阿富汗史上最受欢迎的电视节目。
09:00
Every Afghan family wanted to watch it.
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每一个阿富汗家庭都想看。
09:02
They had to suspend functions at 8:30.
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他们于8:30不得不停做其它的事情。
09:04
Weddings were reported to be interrupted
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据报告，婚礼被中断
09:07
so guests could cluster around the T.V. set,
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让客人可以围绕在电视机前，
09:09
and then turn their attention back to the bride and groom.
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电视剧完后才注意力回到新郎和新娘上。
09:12
Crime went up at 8:30. I have read a Reuters dispatch --
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我看到过路透社的新闻报道，称在8:30犯罪率上升 --
09:15
so this is not Indian propaganda, a British news agency --
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所以，这并不是印度的宣传，而是一家英国通讯社的报道 --
09:18
about how robbers in the town of Musarri Sharif*
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如小偷是如何在马扎里沙里夫市
09:21
stripped a vehicle of its windshield wipers,
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偷取汽车挡风玻璃雨刷，
09:24
its hubcaps, its sideview mirrors,
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其轮毂，其侧视镜的，
09:27
any moving part they could find, at 8:30,
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任何活动部件，他们都可以在8:30找到，
09:30
because the watchmen were busy watching the T.V. rather than minding the store.
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因为警卫忙着看电视，而不是看商店。
09:33
And they scrawled on the windshield in a reference to the show's heroine,
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之后他们在挡风玻璃上涂写在该节目的女主角，
09:37
"Tulsi Zindabad": "Long live Tulsi."
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"Tulsi Zindabad" : " Tulsi万岁."
09:40
(Laughter)
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（笑)
09:41
That's soft power. And that is what India is developing
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这就是软实力。而这正是印度正在发展中的
09:45
through the "E" part of TED:
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就像通过TED 中的 "E" 字母（娱乐）:
09:47
its own entertainment industry.
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自己的娱乐事业。
09:49
The same is true, of course -- we don't have time for too many more examples --
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同样是如此 -- 当然我们没有太多时间，举更多的例子 --
09:52
but it's true of our music, of our dance,
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但对于我们的舞蹈，音乐，
09:55
of our art, yoga, ayurveda, even Indian cuisine.
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艺术，瑜伽，印度草医学，甚至印度菜来说，这是事实。
09:59
I mean, the proliferation of Indian restaurants
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我的意思是，印度餐馆的扩散，
10:02
since I first went abroad as a student, in the mid '70s,
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我第一次出国留学的时候，是在七十年代中期，
10:05
and what I see today, you can't go to a mid-size town in Europe or North America
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现时，当你在欧洲或北美的中小城市里，
10:09
and not find an Indian restaurant. It may not be a very good one.
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你不可能找不到印度餐馆。尽管可能不是很地道。
10:12
But, today in Britain, for example,
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但是，我们以今天的英国为例，
10:14
Indian restaurants in Britain
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在英国的印度餐馆
10:17
employ more people than the coal mining,
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雇员工人数超过了其煤炭开采，
10:19
ship building and iron and steel industries combined.
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造船和钢铁工业雇用员工的总和。
10:22
So the empire can strike back.
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因此，帝国还可以反击吗。
10:24
(Applause)
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（鼓掌声）
10:31
But, with this increasing awareness of India,
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但随着对印度认识的提高
10:33
with you and with I, and so on,
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通过你们和我，还有其他人，
10:35
with tales like Afghanistan,
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通过像阿富汗的故事，
10:37
comes something vital in the information era,
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来自信息时代里的一些重要的东西，
10:40
the sense that in today's world
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在当今世界中的一种感觉
10:43
it's not the side of the bigger army that wins,
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这不是拥有战无不败的强大的军队，
10:46
it's the country that tells a better story that prevails.
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而是一个国家能讲述可广泛流行的故事。
10:49
And India is, and must remain, in my view, the land of the better story.
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印度是，而且应继续，在我看来，有众多故事的国家。
10:54
Stereotypes are changing. I mean, again, having gone to the U.S.
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定型观念正在发生变化。我的意思是，再次，流向了美国
10:57
as a student in the mid '70s,
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作为七十年代中期的学生，
10:59
I knew what the image of India was then, if there was an image at all.
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我知道当时印度的形象是指对印度的整体印象。
11:02
Today, people in Silicon Valley and elsewhere
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今天，人们在硅谷和其他地方
11:05
speak of the IITs, the Indian Institutes of Technology
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谈及印度理工学院，印度技术学院时，
11:08
with the same reverence they used to accord to MIT.
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他们都给予与麻省理工学院同样的崇敬。
11:12
This can sometimes have unintended consequences. OK.
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这有时会产生意想不到的后果。好的。
11:14
I had a friend, a history major like me,
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我有一个朋友，主修历史和我一样，
11:17
who was accosted at Schiphol Airport in Amsterdam,
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曾在阿姆斯特丹的斯希普霍尔机场，
11:20
by an anxiously perspiring European saying,
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被一个很焦急的一位欧洲人问道，
11:22
"You're Indian, you're Indian! Can you help me fix my laptop?"
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“你是印度人，你是印度人！你能帮我修一下我的笔记本吗？”
11:25
(Laughter)
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（笑）
11:27
We've gone from the image of India as
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我们的形象已经从印度作为
11:30
land of fakirs lying on beds of nails,
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躺在钉床上的苦行僧，
11:33
and snake charmers with the Indian rope trick,
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用印度绳耍蛇的把戏的国家
11:36
to the image of India as a land of mathematical geniuses,
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到一个拥有充满数学天才，
11:39
computer wizards, software gurus.
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电脑奇才，软件大师的土地。
11:41
But that too is transforming the Indian story around the world.
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但是那也改变了印度在世界各地的故事。
11:46
But, there is something more substantive to that.
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但是，还有更实质性的东西。
11:48
The story rests on a fundamental platform
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随后的故事取决于
11:50
of political pluralism.
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政治多元化的基本平台
11:52
It's a civilizational story to begin with.
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这是一个文明的故事开始。
11:54
Because India has been an open society for millennia.
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几千年来印度已经成为一个开放的社会。
11:59
India gave refuge to the Jews, fleeing the destruction of the first temple
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印度给予被巴比伦人入侵的犹太人庇护，
12:04
by the Babylonians, and said thereafter by the Romans.
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又据说，是从古罗马人那里获得庇荫。
12:07
In fact, legend has is that when Doubting Thomas, the Apostle, Saint Thomas,
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事实上，传说中，当传教士，圣托马斯时
12:12
landed on the shores of Kerala, my home state,
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于我的家乡喀拉拉邦海岸登陆，
12:14
somewhere around 52 A.D.,
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大概在公元52年，
12:16
he was welcomed on shore by a flute-playing Jewish girl.
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他在岸上受到由长笛演奏的犹太女孩的欢迎。
12:19
And to this day remains the only Jewish diaspora
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而直到今时今日他们仍然
12:23
in the history of the Jewish people, which has never encountered
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唯一一群没受到种族歧视的
12:25
a single incident of anti-semitism.
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犹太侨民。
12:28
(Applause)
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（鼓掌）
12:34
That's the Indian story.
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这是印度的故事。
12:36
Islam came peacefully to the south,
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伊斯兰教和平地来到南方，
12:38
slightly more differently complicated history in the north.
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稍微复杂的是北部的历史。
12:40
But all of these religions have found a place and a welcome home in India.
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但是，这些宗教都在印度找到了安家的地方。
12:45
You know, we just celebrated, this year, our general elections,
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正如你们所知，我们刚刚庆祝完，我国今年的大选，
12:48
the biggest exercise in democratic franchise in human history.
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这是人类历史上民主人口最多的国家。
12:51
And the next one will be even bigger, because our voting population
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而下一届的选举将会更大，因为我们的投票人口
12:53
keeps growing by 20 million a year.
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保持每年2000万人的增长速度。
12:56
But, the fact is
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但是，事实是
12:58
that the last elections, five years ago,
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五年前的选举，
13:00
gave the world extraordinary phenomenon
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给予世界一震惊的景象，
13:02
of an election being won by a woman political leader
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选举获胜人是女性政治领袖
13:06
of Italian origin and Roman Catholic faith, Sonia Gandhi,
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意大利裔和天主教信仰者，索尼娅甘地，
13:09
who then made way for a Sikh, Mohan Singh,
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国会议员莫汉·辛格则用锡克教徒的方式
13:12
to be sworn in as Prime Minister
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来宣誓就任总理，
13:14
by a Muslim, President Abdul Kalam,
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在印度总统卡拉姆则是一位穆斯林,
13:17
in a country 81 percent Hindu.
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而印度教则统治着百分之八十一的国民。
13:19
(Applause)
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（鼓掌）
13:28
This is India, and of course it's all the more striking
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这就是印度，当然它更引人注目
13:31
because it was four years later that we all applauded
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因为这是4年之后，我们都为他鼓掌
13:33
the U.S., the oldest democracy in the modern world,
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美国，在现代世界最古老的民主国家，
13:37
more than 220 years of free and fair elections,
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220多年的自由和公正的选举
13:40
which took till last year to elect a president or a vice president
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去年选出的总统和副总统，
13:44
who wasn't white, male or Christian.
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既不是白人也不是基督教徒
13:46
So, maybe -- oh sorry, he is Christian, I beg your pardon --
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也许， - 哦，对不起，他是基督徒，请原谅 --
13:49
and he is male, but he isn't white.
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他是一位男性，但不是一名白人。
13:51
All the others have been all those three.
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他们这些人都包含那三点。
13:53
(Laughter)
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（笑）
13:55
All his predecessors have been all those three,
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他所有的前任都包含那三点，
13:57
and that's the point I was trying to make.
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这就是我想试图解释的核心问题。
13:59
(Laughter)
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（笑）
14:00
But, the issue is
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但是，问题是
14:02
that when I talked about that example,
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当我谈到这个例子时，
14:04
it's not just about talking about India, it's not propaganda.
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它不只是在说印度，这不是一个宣传。
14:09
Because ultimately, that electoral outcome
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因为最终，该选举结果
14:12
had nothing to do with the rest of the world.
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与世界其他地区无关。
14:14
It was essentially India being itself.
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这实质上是关于印度的自身。
14:16
And ultimately, it seems to me,
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并最终，在我看来，
14:18
that always works better than propaganda.
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比宣传要更有效。
14:20
Governments aren't very good at telling stories.
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各国政府并不擅长讲故事。
14:23
But people see a society for what it is,
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但是，选民看到的是社会的真实情况，
14:25
and that, it seems to me, is what ultimately
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而且，在我看来，
14:27
will make a difference in today's information era,
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正是他们最终将决定当今的信息时代的差异，
14:31
in today's TED age.
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今时的TED时代。
14:33
So India now is no longer
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因此，印度现在已不再有
14:36
the nationalism of ethnicity or language or religion,
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种族、语言或信仰民族主义，
14:40
because we have every ethnicity known to mankind, practically,
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因为我们知道每一个种族都是人类大家庭的一员，实际上，
14:42
we've every religion know to mankind,
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我们都知道人类的各种宗教，
14:44
with the possible exception of Shintoism,
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日本神道教可能例外。
14:46
though that has some Hindu elements somewhere.
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虽然这部分有一些印度教的地方。
14:49
We have 23 official languages that are recognized in our Constitution.
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我们宪法承认23种官方语言。
14:54
And those of you who cashed your money here
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你们在这里兑换现钱时，
14:56
might be surprised to see how many scripts there are
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可能会惊奇地发现卢比上
14:59
on the rupee note, spelling out the denominations.
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有那么多关于面额的脚本说明。
15:01
We've got all of that.
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我们已经有了这一切。
15:03
We don't even have geography uniting us,
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我们甚至没有完整的地理版图。
15:05
because the natural geography of the subcontinent
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因为我们属于地理学中的次大陆
15:08
framed by the mountains and the sea was hacked
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由山和海组成的框架
15:10
by the partition with Pakistan in 1947.
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被巴基斯坦在1947年分裂。
15:13
In fact, you can't even take the name of the country for granted,
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事实上，你甚至不能理所当然的采用国名。
15:16
because the name "India" comes from the river Indus,
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因为“印度”这个名称，是来自印度河，
15:18
which flows in Pakistan.
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此河在巴基斯坦的流动。
15:20
But, the whole point is that India
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但是，整个问题是，印度
15:23
is the nationalism of an idea.
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是一个民族主义的观念。
15:25
It's the idea of an ever-ever-land,
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这个观念就是无限的土地，
15:28
emerging from an ancient civilization,
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源于一种古老的文明，
15:30
united by a shared history,
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分享着共同的历史，
15:32
but sustained, above all, by pluralist democracy.
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但是长期来看，最重要的是，通过多元化民主。
15:35
That is a 21st-century story as well as an ancient one.
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这是21世纪的故事，也是一个古老的一个。
15:39
And it's the nationalism of an idea that
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并且它是一个观念的民族主义，
15:42
essentially says you can endure differences of caste, creed,
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本质上说，你可以忍受种姓差异，信仰，
15:46
color, culture, cuisine, custom and costume, consonant, for that matter,
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肤色，文化，饮食，风俗和服装，辅音的差别，
15:51
and still rally around a consensus.
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就此而言，仍然有和睦团结的共识。
15:54
And the consensus is of a very simple principle,
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而共识是一个非常简单的原则，
15:56
that in a diverse plural democracy like India
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在一个多元化的民主国家就像印度
16:00
you don't really have to agree on everything all the time,
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你真的不必在所有的时间同意每件事，
16:04
so long as you agree on the ground rules
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只要你对你将如何表达
16:06
of how you will disagree.
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不同意见的规则达成一致。
16:08
The great success story of India,
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印度伟大的成功故事，
16:10
a country that so many learned scholars and journalists
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一个国家，有这么多经验的学者和新闻工作者
16:13
assumed would disintegrate, in the '50s and '60s,
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假设即将瓦解，在五十年代，六十年代，
16:16
is that it managed to maintain consensus on how to survive without consensus.
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只要能够维持生存是没有共识的共识。
16:21
Now, that is the India that is emerging into the 21st century.
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今天，印度是以迈进21世纪。
16:25
And I do want to make the point
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我想要强调的是
16:27
that if there is anything worth celebrating about India,
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如果有什么可以使印度值得庆祝的事的话，
16:30
it isn't military muscle, economic power.
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它不是军事实力，经济实力。
16:32
All of that is necessary,
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所有这一切是必要的，
16:34
but we still have huge amounts of problems to overcome.
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但我们仍然有大量的问题需要克服。
16:37
Somebody said we are super poor, and we are also super power.
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有人说我们即是超级穷国，也是超级强国。
16:40
We can't really be both of those.
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我们不可能两者兼是。
16:42
We have to overcome our poverty. We have to deal with the
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我们必须克服我们的贫穷。我们必须处理
16:44
hardware of development,
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硬件的发展，
16:46
the ports, the roads, the airports,
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港口，道路，机场，
16:48
all the infrastructural things we need to do,
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我们需要做所有基础设施的事情，
16:50
and the software of development,
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和软件开发，
16:52
the human capital, the need for the ordinary person in India
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人力资本，用于在印度普通人的需要
16:56
to be able to have a couple of square meals a day,
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就是每一日三顿饭能吃得很丰盛，
16:59
to be able to send his or her children
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能够送他或她的孩子
17:01
to a decent school,
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去一个体面的学校，
17:03
and to aspire to work a job
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并有志投身工作
17:05
that will give them opportunities in their lives
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这可以帮助他们给育它们生活的机会
17:08
that can transform themselves.
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并且可以改变自己。
17:10
But, it's all taking place, this great adventure of conquering those challenges,
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但是，这一切的发生，这种伟大的冒险征服需要一种挑战，
17:14
those real challenges which none of us can pretend don't exist.
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这种挑战是不容我们可以假装不存在。
17:17
But, it's all taking place in an open society,
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并且，这一切都发生在一个开放的社会里，
17:20
in a rich and diverse and plural civilization,
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在一个丰富多样和多元文化当中，
17:23
in one that is determined to liberate and fulfill
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是一个是要解放和实现
17:26
the creative energies of its people.
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人民的创造力社会中。
17:28
That's why India belongs at TED,
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这就是为什么印度所属于TED,
17:31
and that's why TED belongs in India.
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这就是为什么TED所属于印度。
17:33
Thank you very much.
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非常感谢。
17:35
(Applause)
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（鼓掌声）
ABOUT THE SPEAKER
Shashi Tharoor - Politician and writerAfter a long career at the UN, and a parallel life as a novelist, Shashi Tharoor became a member of India's Parliament. He spent 10 months as India's Minister for External Affairs, building connections between India and the world.
Why you should listen
In May 2009, Shashi Tharoor was elected to Parliament, representing the Thiruvananthapuram constituency in Kerala. For 10 months, he also served as Minister for External Affairs, charged with helping India engage with the world. Follow him on Twitter, @shashitharoor, or his YouTube channel, to get a look in at his whirlwind life of service.
Before entering politics, Tharoor spent almost three decades with the UN as a refugee worker and peace-keeper, working as a senior adviser to the Secretary-General. Meanwhile, he maintained a parallel career as a writer, producing three novels, a biography of Nehru and several collections of essays on literature and global affairs (plus hundreds of articles for magazines and journals). He was the UN Under-Secretary General for Communications and Public Information under Kofi Annan, and was India's candidate in 2006 for the post of Secretary-General. He left the UN in 2007.
His latest book is Shadows Across the Playing Field: 60 Years of India-Pakistan Cricket, written with former Pakistan foreign secretary (and cricket legend) Shaharyar Khan.
Shashi Tharoor | Speaker | TED.com