TEDWomen 2015
Jane Fonda and Lily Tomlin: A hilarious celebration of lifelong female friendship
Džejn Fonda (Jane Fonda) i Lili Tomlin (Lily Tomlin): Urnebesna svetkovina celoživotnog ženskog prijateljstva
Filmed:
Readability: 3.6
3,843,912 views
Legendarni duo, Džejn Fonda i Lili Tomlin, su prijateljice već decenijama. U neuvežbanom, nežnom i obuhvatnom razgovoru, koji je vodila Pat Mičel, njih tri raspravljaju o dugovečnosti, feminizmu, razlikama između muških i ženskih prijateljstava, o tome šta znači dobar život i o ženskoj ulozi u budućnosti naše planete. "Ne znam ni šta bih radila bez mojih prijateljica", kaže Fonda. "Postojim jer imam svoje prijateljice."
Jane Fonda - Actor and activist
Jane Fonda has had three extraordinary careers (so far): Oscar-winning actor, fitness guru, impassioned activist. Full bioLily Tomlin - Comedian and actor
Lily Tomlin has been honored by the Kennedy Center and awarded the Mark Twain Prize -- and she's still making vital, hilarious comedy. Full bio
Jane Fonda has had three extraordinary careers (so far): Oscar-winning actor, fitness guru, impassioned activist. Full bioLily Tomlin - Comedian and actor
Lily Tomlin has been honored by the Kennedy Center and awarded the Mark Twain Prize -- and she's still making vital, hilarious comedy. Full bio
Double-click the English transcript below to play the video.
00:12
Pat Mitchell: So I was thinking
about female friendship a lot,
about female friendship a lot,
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Pat Mičel: Dakle, razmišljala sam mnogo
o ženskom prijateljstvu
o ženskom prijateljstvu
00:15
and by the way, these two women,
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i, usput, ove dve žene,
00:18
I'm very honored to say,
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čast mi je da kažem,
00:19
have been my friends
for a very long time, too.
for a very long time, too.
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su mi prijateljice odavno, takođe.
00:22
Jane Fonda: Yes we have.
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Džejn Fonda: Da, jesmo.
00:23
PM: And one of the things
that I read about female friendship
that I read about female friendship
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PM: A nešto što čitam
o ženskom prijateljstvu
o ženskom prijateljstvu
00:27
is something that Cervantes said.
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je nešto što je Servantes rekao.
00:28
He said, "You can tell
a lot about someone,"
a lot about someone,"
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Rekao je: "Možeš mnogo toga
da zaključiš o nekome",
da zaključiš o nekome",
00:32
in this case a woman,
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u ovom slučaju o ženi,
00:33
"by the company that she keeps."
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"na osnovu toga s kim se druži."
00:35
So let's start with --
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Pa, započnimo -
00:37
(Laughter)
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(Smeh)
00:40
JF: We're in big trouble.
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DžF: U ozbiljnom smo problemu.
00:41
Lily Tomlin: Hand me one of those waters,
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Lili Tomlin: Dodaj mi tu jednu vodu,
00:43
I'm extremely dry.
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strašno sam žedna.
00:45
(Laughter)
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(Smeh)
00:53
JF: You're taking up our time.
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DžF: Uzimaš nam vreme.
00:55
We have a very limited --
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Imamo veoma ograničeno -
00:56
LT: Just being with her
sucks the life out of me.
sucks the life out of me.
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LT: Samo njeno prisustvo
isisava život iz mene.
isisava život iz mene.
00:59
(Laughter)
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(Smeh)
01:02
JF: You ain't seen nothing yet.
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DžF: Tek ćeš da vidiš.
Kako bilo - izvinjavam se.
01:03
Anyway -- sorry.
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01:05
PM: So tell me, what do you
look for in a friend?
look for in a friend?
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PM: Recite mi šta tražite kod prijatelja?
01:09
LT: I look for someone
who has a sense of fun,
who has a sense of fun,
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LT: Tražim nekoga ko zna da se zabavlja,
01:12
who's audacious,
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ko je odvažan,
01:15
who's forthcoming, who has politics,
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ko je predusretljiv, razume se u politiku,
01:18
who has even a small scrap
of passion for the planet,
of passion for the planet,
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ko iole ima strasti za planetu,
01:23
someone who's decent,
has a sense of justice
has a sense of justice
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ko je pristojan, ima osećaj za pravdu
01:26
and who thinks I'm worthwhile.
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i ko me smatra vrednom pažnje.
01:28
(Laughter)
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(Smeh)
01:30
(Applause)
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(Aplauz)
01:34
JF: You know, I was thinking this morning,
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DžF: Znate, razmišljala sam jutros,
01:36
I don't even know what I would do
without my women friends.
without my women friends.
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ne znam ni šta bih radila
bez mojih prijateljica.
bez mojih prijateljica.
01:39
I mean it's, "I have my friends,
therefore I am."
therefore I am."
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Mislim to je: "Imam prijatelje,
dakle postojim."
dakle postojim."
01:42
LT: (Laughter)
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LT: (Smeh)
01:43
JF: No, it's true.
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DžF: Ne, istina je.
01:45
I exist because I have
my women friends. They --
my women friends. They --
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Ja postojim jer imam prijateljice. One -
01:48
You're one of them.
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Ti si jedna od njih.
01:49
I don't know about you. But anyway --
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Ne znam za tebe, ali kako bilo -
01:51
(Laughter)
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(Smeh)
01:52
You know, they make me stronger,
they make me smarter,
they make me smarter,
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Znate, zbog njih sam jača,
zbog njih sam pametnija,
zbog njih sam pametnija,
01:55
they make me braver.
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zbog njih sam hrabrija.
01:56
They tap me on the shoulder when I might
be in need of course-correcting.
be in need of course-correcting.
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Tapšu me po ramenu
kad možda ne idem u pravom smeru.
kad možda ne idem u pravom smeru.
02:01
And most of them are
a good deal younger than me, too.
a good deal younger than me, too.
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I većinom su
prilično mlađe od mene, takođe.
prilično mlađe od mene, takođe.
02:04
You know? I mean, it's nice --
LT: Thank you.
LT: Thank you.
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Znate? Mislim, lepo je to -
LT: Hvala ti.
LT: Hvala ti.
02:06
(Laughter)
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(Smeh)
02:09
JF: No, I do, I include you in that,
because listen, you know --
because listen, you know --
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DžF: Ne, zaista, tu i tebe podrazumevam
jer, slušaj, znaš -
jer, slušaj, znaš -
02:12
it's nice to have somebody still around
to play with and learn from
to play with and learn from
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lepo je i dalje imati nekoga blizu sebe
za igru i učenje
za igru i učenje
02:15
when you're getting toward the end.
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kada se bližite kraju.
02:17
I'm approaching --
I'll be there sooner than you.
I'll be there sooner than you.
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Sve sam bliže - stići ću tamo pre tebe.
02:19
LT: No, I'm glad to have you
parallel aging alongside me.
parallel aging alongside me.
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LT: Ne, drago mi je da mogu
da starim paralelno uz tebe.
da starim paralelno uz tebe.
02:22
(Laughter)
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(Smeh)
02:24
JF: I'm showing you the way.
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DžF: Pokazujem ti kako.
02:26
(Laughter)
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(Smeh)
02:27
LT: Well, you are and you have.
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LT: Pa, zaista to radiš i radila si.
02:29
PM: Well, as we grow older,
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PM: Dakle, kako starimo
02:30
and as we go through
different kinds of life's journeys,
different kinds of life's journeys,
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i kako prolazimo kroz
različite vidove životnih iskustava,
različite vidove životnih iskustava,
02:33
what do you do to keep
your friendships vital and alive?
your friendships vital and alive?
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šta radite da biste očuvale
prijateljstvo vitalnim i živim?
prijateljstvo vitalnim i živim?
02:38
LT: Well you have to use a lot of --
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LT: Pa, morate mnogo da koristite -
02:39
JF: She doesn't invite me over much,
I'll tell you that.
I'll tell you that.
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DžF: Ne poziva me kod sebe često,
to vam mogu reći.
to vam mogu reći.
LT: Moram često da budem
na društvenim mrežama -
na društvenim mrežama -
02:42
LT: I have to use a lot of social media --
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02:44
You be quiet now. And so --
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Ti, tiho tamo. I tako -
02:46
(Laughter)
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(Smeh)
02:48
LT: And I look through my emails,
I look through my texts
I look through my texts
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LT: I pregledam moje mejlove, SMS poruke
kako bih našla prijatelje,
02:51
to find my friends,
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02:52
so I can answer them
as quickly as possible,
as quickly as possible,
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i odgovorila im što je brže moguće
02:54
because I know they need my counsel.
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jer znam da im je potreban moj savet.
02:57
(Laughter)
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(Smeh)
Potrebna im je moja podrška
03:00
They need my support,
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03:01
because most of my friends
are writers, or activists, or actors,
are writers, or activists, or actors,
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jer su moji prijatelji većinom
pisci, aktvisti ili glumci,
pisci, aktvisti ili glumci,
03:04
and you're all three ...
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a ti si sve to...
03:05
and a long string
of other descriptive phrases,
of other descriptive phrases,
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i čitav niz drugih opisnih fraza
03:09
and I want to get to you
as soon as possible,
as soon as possible,
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i želim da ti odgovorim što je pre moguće,
03:13
I want you to know that I'm there for you.
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želim da znaš da sam tu za tebe.
03:15
JF: Do you do emojis?
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DžF: Koristiš li emotikone?
03:17
LT: Oh ...
JF: No?
JF: No?
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LT: Uh...
DžF: Ne?
DžF: Ne?
03:19
LT: That's embarrassing.
JF: I'm really into emojis.
JF: I'm really into emojis.
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LT: Sramota me je.
DžF: Ja baš volim emotikone.
DžF: Ja baš volim emotikone.
03:21
LT: No, I spell out my --
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LT: Ne, ja ispisujem --
03:23
I spell out my words of happiness
and congratulations,
and congratulations,
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Ispisujem svoje izraze sreće i čestitke,
03:27
and sadness.
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i tugu.
DžF: Ispisuješ sve do tančina -
03:29
JF: You spell it right out --
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03:30
LT: I spell it, every letter.
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LT: Ispisujem svako slovo.
03:32
(Laughter)
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(Smeh)
03:33
JF: Such a purist.
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DžF: Kakva puritanka.
03:35
You know, as I've gotten older,
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Znate, kako starim,
03:37
I've understood more
the importance of friendships,
the importance of friendships,
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sve više razumem značaj prijateljstva
03:40
and so, I really make an effort
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i zato se zaista trudim
03:42
to reach out and make play dates --
not let too much time go by.
not let too much time go by.
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da posegnem i zakažem sastanke -
da ne dozvolim da prođe previše vremena.
da ne dozvolim da prođe previše vremena.
03:46
I read a lot
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Čitam mnogo,
03:48
so, as Lily knows all too well,
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kao što je Lili isuviše dobro poznato,
knjige koje mi se svide,
šaljem prijateljima.
šaljem prijateljima.
03:50
my books that I like,
I send to my friends.
I send to my friends.
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LT: Kad smo saznale da ćemo
danas biti ovde
danas biti ovde
03:52
LT: When we knew we would be here today
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03:54
you sent me a lot of books
about women, female friendships,
about women, female friendships,
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poslala si mi gomilu knjiga
o ženama, ženskim prijateljstvima
o ženama, ženskim prijateljstvima
03:56
and I was so surprised
to see how many books,
to see how many books,
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i bila sam iznenađena
tolikim brojem knjiga,
tolikim brojem knjiga,
04:00
how much research
has been done recently --
has been done recently --
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kolika su istraživanja
odrađena u skorije vreme -
odrađena u skorije vreme -
04:02
JF: And were you grateful?
LT: I was grateful.
LT: I was grateful.
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DžF: Jesi li mi bila zahvalna?
LT: Bila sam zahvalna.
LT: Bila sam zahvalna.
04:05
(Laughter)
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(Smeh)
04:10
PM: And --
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PM: I -
04:11
LT: Wait, no, it's really important
because this is another example
because this is another example
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LT: Sačekajte, ne, ovo je zaista važno
jer ovo je još jedan primer
jer ovo je još jedan primer
04:14
of how women are overlooked,
put aside, marginalized.
put aside, marginalized.
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kako su žene zapostavljene,
ostavljene po strani, marginalizovane.
ostavljene po strani, marginalizovane.
04:18
There's been very little
research done on us,
research done on us,
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Veoma malo istraživanja
je obavljeno na nama,
je obavljeno na nama,
04:21
even though we volunteered lots of times.
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iako smo volontirale više puta.
04:23
JF: That's for sure.
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DžF: To je istina.
04:24
(Laughter)
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(Smeh)
04:26
LT: This is really exciting,
and you all will be interested in this.
and you all will be interested in this.
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LT: Ovo je veoma uzbudljivo
i ovo će da vam bude zanimljivo.
i ovo će da vam bude zanimljivo.
04:30
The Harvard Medical School study has shown
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Istraživanje Medicinske škole na Harvardu
je pokazalo
je pokazalo
04:32
that women who have
close female friendships
close female friendships
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da žene koje imaju bliske prijateljice
04:37
are less likely to develop impairments --
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su manje podložne pogoršanjima -
04:40
physical impairments as they age,
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fizičkim pogoršanjima kako stare
04:42
and they are likely to be seen
to be living much more vital, exciting --
to be living much more vital, exciting --
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i češće odaju utisak
kao da žive vitalnije, uzbudljivije -
kao da žive vitalnije, uzbudljivije -
04:48
JF: And longer --
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DžF: I duže -
04:49
LT: Joyful lives.
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LT: Radosnije živote.
DžF: Živimo pet godina duže od muškaraca.
04:50
JF: We live five years longer than men.
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04:52
LT: I think I'd trade the years for joy.
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LT: Mislim da bih menjala
godine za užitak.
godine za užitak.
04:54
(Laughter)
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(Smeh)
04:58
LT: But the most important
part is they found --
part is they found --
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LT: Ali najvažniji deo je da su otkrili -
05:01
the results were so exciting
and so conclusive --
and so conclusive --
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rezultati su bili tako uzbudljivi
i tako ubedljivi -
i tako ubedljivi -
05:04
the researchers found
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istraživači su otkrili
05:06
that not having close female friends
is detrimental to your health,
is detrimental to your health,
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da je odsustvo bliskih prijateljica
štetno po vaše zdravlje,
štetno po vaše zdravlje,
05:12
as much as smoking or being overweight.
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koliko i pušenje ili gojaznost.
05:15
JF: And there's something else, too --
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DžF: Tu je još nešto takođe -
05:17
LT: I've said my part, so ...
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LT: Rekla sam svoje, pa...
05:18
(Laughter)
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(Smeh)
05:19
JF: OK, well, listen to my part,
because there's an additional thing.
because there's an additional thing.
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DžF: U redu, pa, saslušaj sad moj deo
jer ima tu još nešto.
jer ima tu još nešto.
05:23
Because they only --
for years, decades --
for years, decades --
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Zato što su jedino -
godinama, decenijama -
godinama, decenijama -
05:25
they only researched men when they
were trying to understand stress,
were trying to understand stress,
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jedino su istraživali muškarce
kada su pokušavali da shvate stres,
kada su pokušavali da shvate stres,
05:30
only very recently have they researched
what happens to women when we're stressed,
what happens to women when we're stressed,
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tek su u skorije vreme počeli da istražuju
šta se dešava ženama kad su pod stresom
šta se dešava ženama kad su pod stresom
05:34
and it turns out
that when we're stressed -- women,
that when we're stressed -- women,
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i ispostavilo se
da kada smo pod stresom - žene,
da kada smo pod stresom - žene,
05:38
our bodies get flooded by oxytocin.
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naša tela preplavi oksitocin.
05:42
Which is a feel-good, calming,
stress-reducing hormone.
stress-reducing hormone.
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To je hormon dobrog raspoloženja,
koji umiruje i umanjuje stres.
koji umiruje i umanjuje stres.
05:45
Which is also increased
when we're with our women friends.
when we're with our women friends.
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Koji takođe raste
kada smo s prijateljicama.
kada smo s prijateljicama.
05:50
And I do think that's one reason
why we live longer.
why we live longer.
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I smatram da je to jedan od razloga
zašto živimo duže.
zašto živimo duže.
05:54
And I feel so bad for men
because they don't have that.
because they don't have that.
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I žao mi je muškaraca jer nemaju to.
05:56
Testosterone in men
diminishes the effects of oxytocin.
diminishes the effects of oxytocin.
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Testosteron kod muškaraca
umanjuje efekte oksitocina.
umanjuje efekte oksitocina.
06:01
LT: Well, when you and I
and Dolly made "9 to 5" ...
and Dolly made "9 to 5" ...
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LT: Pa, kad smo ti, ja i Doli
po čitavi dan...
po čitavi dan...
DžF: Oh -
06:04
JF: Oh --
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LT: Smejale smo se, da,
toliko smo se smejale
toliko smo se smejale
06:05
LT: We laughed, we did,
we laughed so much,
we laughed so much,
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06:07
we found we had so much in common
and we're so different.
and we're so different.
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jer imamo toliko toga zajedničkog,
a tako smo različite.
a tako smo različite.
06:10
Here she is, like Hollywood royalty,
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Ona je poput holivudske plemićke,
06:12
I'm like a tough kid from Detroit,
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ja sam poput grubog deteta iz Detroita,
06:14
[Dolly's] a Southern kid
from a poor town in Tennessee,
from a poor town in Tennessee,
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[Doli] je dete s juga,
iz siromašnog grada Tenesija,
iz siromašnog grada Tenesija,
06:18
and we found we were so in sync as women,
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a otkrile smo da smo potpuno
saglasne kao žene
saglasne kao žene
06:22
and we must have --
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i mora da smo -
06:23
we laughed -- we must have added
at least a decade onto our lifespans.
at least a decade onto our lifespans.
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toliko smo se smejale - da mora da smo
međusobno produžile živote za deceniju.
međusobno produžile živote za deceniju.
06:29
JF: I think -- we sure
crossed our legs a lot.
crossed our legs a lot.
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DžF: Verujem - svakako
je bilo mnogo prekrštanja nogu.
je bilo mnogo prekrštanja nogu.
06:32
(Laughter)
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(Smeh)
06:34
If you know what I mean.
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Ako znate na šta mislim.
06:37
LT: I think we all know what you mean.
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LT: Svi znamo na šta misliš.
06:39
(Laughter)
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(Smeh)
06:41
PM: You're adding decades
to our lives right now.
to our lives right now.
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PM: Dodajete nam decenije upravo sad.
06:44
So among the books that Jane
sent us both to read on female friendship
sent us both to read on female friendship
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Dakle, među knjigama koje nam je Džejn
poslala da čitamo o ženskom prijateljstvu
poslala da čitamo o ženskom prijateljstvu
06:49
was one by a woman we admire greatly,
Sister Joan Chittister,
Sister Joan Chittister,
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je jedna od žene kojoj se mnogo divimo,
Sestre Džoan Čitister,
Sestre Džoan Čitister,
06:53
who said about female friendship
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koja je rekla za žensko prijateljstvo
06:55
that women friends
are not just a social act,
are not just a social act,
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da prijateljice nisu samo društveni čin,
06:59
they're a spiritual act.
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one su duhovni čin.
07:01
Do you think of your friends as spiritual?
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Da li razmišljaš tako
o svojim prijateljicama?
o svojim prijateljicama?
07:03
Do they add something
spiritual to your lives?
spiritual to your lives?
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Donose li dozu duhovnosti
u tvoj život?
u tvoj život?
07:06
LT: Spiritual -- I absolutely think that.
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LT: Duhovnost - apsolutno verujem u to.
07:10
Because -- especially people
you've known a long time,
you've known a long time,
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Jer - naročito ljudi
koje poznajete veoma dugo,
koje poznajete veoma dugo,
07:13
people you've spent time with --
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s kojim ste provodili vreme -
07:14
I can see the spiritual
essence inside them,
essence inside them,
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mogu da vidim duhovnu srž u njima,
07:17
the tenderness, the vulnerability.
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nežnost, ranjivost.
07:22
There's actually kind of a love,
an element of love in the relationship.
an element of love in the relationship.
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Zapravo to je vid ljubavi,
elemenat ljubavi u vezi.
elemenat ljubavi u vezi.
07:26
I just see deeply into your soul.
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Mogu skroz da ti vidim dušu.
07:30
PM: Do you think that, Jane --
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PM: Slažeš li se, Džejn -
07:31
LT: But I have special powers.
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LT: Međutim ja imam supermoći.
07:34
JF: Well, there's all kinds of friends.
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DžF: Pa, postoje razna prijateljstva.
07:36
There's business friends,
and party friends,
and party friends,
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Postoje poslovni prijatelji
i prijatelji za žurke,
i prijatelji za žurke,
07:38
I've got a lot of those.
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imam mnogo tih.
07:40
(Laughter)
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(Smeh)
07:42
But the oxytocin-producing
friendships have ...
friendships have ...
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Međutim prijateljstva
koja proizvode oksitocin...
koja proizvode oksitocin...
07:47
They feel spiritual
because it's a heart opening, right?
because it's a heart opening, right?
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Imaju duhovnu auru
jer otvaraju dušu, zar ne?
jer otvaraju dušu, zar ne?
07:51
You know, we go deep. And --
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Znate, razotkrivamo se. I -
07:54
I find that I shed tears a lot
with my intimate friends.
with my intimate friends.
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otkrila sam da mnogo plačem
sa svojim prisnim prijateljicama.
sa svojim prisnim prijateljicama.
08:01
Not because I'm sad but because
I'm so touched and inspired by them.
I'm so touched and inspired by them.
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Ne zato što sam tužna, već
zato što sam dirnuta i inspirisana njima.
zato što sam dirnuta i inspirisana njima.
08:06
LT: And you know one of you
is going to go soon.
is going to go soon.
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LT: A znaš i da će jedna od vas
uskoro da umre.
uskoro da umre.
08:09
(Laughter)
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(Smeh)
08:14
PM: Well, two of us are sitting here,
Lily, which one are you talking about?
Lily, which one are you talking about?
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PM: Pa, nas dve sedimo ovde,
Lili, o kojoj pričaš?
Lili, o kojoj pričaš?
08:19
(Laughter)
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(Smeh)
08:20
And I always think, when women
talk about their friendships,
talk about their friendships,
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I uvek mislim da kad žene
pričaju o svojim prijateljstvima,
pričaju o svojim prijateljstvima,
08:23
that men always look a little mystified.
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da muškarci uvek izgledaju zbunjeno.
08:26
What are the differences, in your opinion,
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Koje su razlike, po tvom mišljenju,
08:29
between men friendships
and women friendships?
and women friendships?
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između muških i ženskih prijateljstava?
08:32
JF: There's a lot of difference,
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DžF: Ima mnogo razlike
08:34
and I think we have to have
a lot of empathy for men --
a lot of empathy for men --
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i mislim da moramo da imamo mnogo
saosećanja prema muškarcima -
saosećanja prema muškarcima -
08:37
(Laughter)
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(Smeh)
08:38
that they don't have what we have.
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jer nemaju to što mi imamo.
08:43
Which I think may be why they die sooner.
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Zbog čega mislim da ranije umiru.
08:45
(Laughter)
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(Smeh)
08:47
I have a lot of compassion for men,
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Saosećam mnogo s muškarcima
08:49
because women, no kidding, we --
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jer žene, bez šale, mi -
08:53
women's relationships, our friendships
are full disclosure, we go deep.
are full disclosure, we go deep.
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ženske veze, naša prijateljstva
su potpuno razotkrivanje, mi se predajemo.
su potpuno razotkrivanje, mi se predajemo.
08:59
They're revelatory.
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To su otkrovenja.
09:01
We risk vulnerability --
this is something men don't do.
this is something men don't do.
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Mi rizikujemo ranjivost -
nešto što muškarci ne rade.
nešto što muškarci ne rade.
09:06
I mean how many times
have I asked you, "Am I doing OK?"
have I asked you, "Am I doing OK?"
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Mislim, koliko puta sam te upitala:
"Kako mi ide?"
"Kako mi ide?"
09:09
"Did I really screw up there?"
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"Jesam li zaista zabrljala na sceni?"
09:11
PM: You're doing great.
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PM: Sjajno ti ide.
09:13
(Laughter)
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(Smeh)
09:14
JF: But I mean, we ask questions like that
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DžF: Ali, mislim,
mi postavljamo takva pitanja
mi postavljamo takva pitanja
09:17
of our women friends,
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našim prijateljicama,
09:18
and men don't.
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muškarci ne.
09:20
You know, people describe women's
relationships as face-to-face,
relationships as face-to-face,
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Znate, ženska prijateljstva se opisuju
kao direktna, licem u lice,
kao direktna, licem u lice,
09:24
whereas men's friendships
are more side-by-side.
are more side-by-side.
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dok su muška prijateljstva
više bok uz bok.
više bok uz bok.
09:27
LT: I mean most of the time
men don't want to reveal their emotions,
men don't want to reveal their emotions,
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LT: Mislim, muškarci uglavnom
ne žele da otkriju svoje emocije,
ne žele da otkriju svoje emocije,
09:31
they want to bury deeper feelings.
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žele da zakopaju dublja osećanja.
09:33
I mean, that's the general,
conventional thought.
conventional thought.
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Mislim, to je uopšteno
konvencionalna misao.
konvencionalna misao.
09:36
They would rather go off in their man cave
and watch a game or hit golf balls,
and watch a game or hit golf balls,
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Radije bi otišli u svoju mušku pećinu,
gledali utakmicu, udarali loptice za golf
gledali utakmicu, udarali loptice za golf
09:40
or talk about sports,
or hunting, or cars or have sex.
or hunting, or cars or have sex.
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ili pričali o sportu ili o automobilima
ili išli u lov ili bi imali seks.
ili išli u lov ili bi imali seks.
09:45
I mean, it's just the kind of --
it's a more manly behavior.
it's a more manly behavior.
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Mislim, to je nekako -
to je muževnije ponašanje.
to je muževnije ponašanje.
09:48
JF: You meant --
LT: They talk about sex.
LT: They talk about sex.
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DžF: Šta si mislila pod -
LT: Pričaju o seksu.
LT: Pričaju o seksu.
09:51
I meant they might have sex
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Mislim, mogu da imaju seks,
09:52
if they could get somebody
in their man cave to --
in their man cave to --
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ako mogu da dovedu nekoga
u svoju mušku pećinu da -
u svoju mušku pećinu da -
09:55
(Laughter)
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(Smeh)
09:58
JF: You know something, though,
that I find very interesting --
that I find very interesting --
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DžF: Znate li šta mi je zanimljivo, pak,
to mi je veoma zanimljivo -
to mi je veoma zanimljivo -
10:01
and again, psychologists didn't know this
until relatively recently --
until relatively recently --
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i opet, psiholozi nisu znali za ovo
sve do skoro -
sve do skoro -
10:06
is that men are born every bit
as relational as women are.
as relational as women are.
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da su muškarci rođeni u potpunosti
skloni vezama kao žene.
skloni vezama kao žene.
10:09
If you look at films
of newborn baby boys and girls,
of newborn baby boys and girls,
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Ako pogledate snimke
novorođenih dečaka i devojčica,
novorođenih dečaka i devojčica,
10:13
you'll see the baby boys
just like the girls,
just like the girls,
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videćete da dečaci, baš kao i devojčice,
10:15
gazing into their mother's eyes,
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zure u majčine oči,
10:18
you know, needing that relational
exchange of energy.
exchange of energy.
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znate, potrebna im je
međusobna razmena energije.
međusobna razmena energije.
10:22
When the mother looks away,
they could see the dismay on the child,
they could see the dismay on the child,
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Kad majka odvrati pogled,
može da se vidi zaprepašćenje kod deteta,
može da se vidi zaprepašćenje kod deteta,
10:27
even the boy would cry.
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čak bi i dečaci zaplakali.
10:28
They need relationship.
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Potrebne su im veze.
10:30
So the question is why,
as they grow older, does that change?
as they grow older, does that change?
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Pa je pitanje: zašto se,
kako odrastaju, to menja?
kako odrastaju, to menja?
10:34
And the answer is patriarchal culture,
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A odgovor je u patrijarhalnoj kulturi,
10:37
which says to boys and young men
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koja govori dečacima i mladićima
10:40
that to be needing of relationship,
to be emotional with someone is girly.
to be emotional with someone is girly.
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da je potreba za vezom, za razmenom
osećanja s nekim, za devojčice.
osećanja s nekim, za devojčice.
10:45
That a real man doesn't ask
directions or express a need,
directions or express a need,
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Da pravi muškarac ne pita za smer
ili ne ispoljava potrebe,
ili ne ispoljava potrebe,
10:51
they don't go to doctors if they feel bad.
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ne ide kod doktora kad se oseća loše.
10:53
They don't ask for help.
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Ne pita za pomoć.
10:55
There's a quote that I really like,
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Postoji citat koji baš volim:
10:56
"Men fear that becoming 'we'
will erase his 'I'."
will erase his 'I'."
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"Muškarci se plaše da kad bi postali 'mi'
to izbrisalo njihovo 'ja'."
to izbrisalo njihovo 'ja'."
11:01
You know, his sense of self.
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Znate, njihovu svest o sebi.
11:03
Whereas women's sense of self
has always been kind of porous.
has always been kind of porous.
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Dok je svest o sebi kod žena
oduvek bila nekako porozna.
oduvek bila nekako porozna.
11:07
But our "we" is our saving grace,
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Međutim naše "mi" je naše iskupljenje,
11:11
it's what makes us strong.
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to nas čini jakima.
11:14
It's not that we're better than men,
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Nismo bolje od muškaraca,
samo ne moramo da dokazujemo
svoju muževnost.
svoju muževnost.
11:15
we just don't have
our masculinity to prove.
our masculinity to prove.
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11:18
LT: And, well --
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LT: Pa, da -
11:19
JF: That's a Gloria Steinem quote.
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DžF: To je citat Glorije Stajnam.
11:21
So we can express our humanity --
LT: I know who Gloria Steinem is.
LT: I know who Gloria Steinem is.
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Dakle, mi ispoljavamo našu ljudskost -
LT: Znam ko je Glorija Stajnam.
LT: Znam ko je Glorija Stajnam.
11:24
JF: I know you know who she is,
but I think it's a --
but I think it's a --
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DžF: Znam da znaš ko je, ali verujem da -
11:27
(Laughter)
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(Smeh)
11:29
No, but it's a great quote, I think.
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Ne, smatram da je to sjajan citat.
11:31
We're not better than men, we just
don't have our masculinity to prove.
don't have our masculinity to prove.
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Nismo bolje od mušakaraca, prosto
ne moramo da dokazujemo muževnost.
ne moramo da dokazujemo muževnost.
11:35
And that's really important.
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A to je zaista važno.
11:36
LT: But men are
so inculcated in the culture
so inculcated in the culture
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LT: Međutim muškarci su tako
stopljeni s kulturom
stopljeni s kulturom
11:39
to be comfortable in the patriarchy.
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da im je udobno u patrijarhatu.
11:42
And we've got to make
something different happen.
something different happen.
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A mi moramo nešto da promenimo.
11:45
JF: Women's friendships
are like a renewable source of power.
are like a renewable source of power.
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DžF: Ženska prijateljstva
su poput obnovljivih izvora energije.
su poput obnovljivih izvora energije.
11:49
LT: Well, that's what's exciting
about this subject.
about this subject.
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LT: Pa, to je uzbudljivo kod ove teme.
11:52
It's because our friendships --
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Zato što naša prijateljstva -
11:53
female friendships
are just a hop to our sisterhood,
are just a hop to our sisterhood,
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ženska prijateljstva
su prosto skokovi u sestrinstva,
su prosto skokovi u sestrinstva,
11:58
and sisterhood can be
a very powerful force,
a very powerful force,
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a sestrinstvo može da bude
veoma jaka sila,
veoma jaka sila,
12:01
to give the world --
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da podari svetu,
12:03
to make it what it should be --
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da bude ono što bi trebalo da bude -
12:05
the things that humans desperately need.
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ono što ljudima očajnički treba.
12:08
PM: It is why we're talking about it,
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PM: Zato razgovaramo o tome
12:10
because women's friendships are,
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jer su ženska prijateljstva,
12:12
as you said, Jane,
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kao što si rekla, Džejn,
12:13
a renewable source of power.
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obnovljivi izvori energije.
12:15
So how do we use that power?
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Pa, kako da iskoristimo tu moć?
12:17
JF: Well, women are the fastest growing
demographic in the world,
demographic in the world,
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DžF: Pa, žene su najbrže rastuća
populacija u svetu,
populacija u svetu,
12:21
especially older women.
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naročito starije žene.
12:22
And if we harness our power,
we can change the world.
we can change the world.
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I, ako bismo upregli našu snagu,
mogle bismo da promenimo svet.
mogle bismo da promenimo svet.
12:26
And guess what? We need to.
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I znate šta? Moramo.
12:28
(Applause)
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(Aplauz)
I moramo to da uradimo što pre.
12:30
And we need to do it soon.
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12:31
And one of the things
that we need to do --
that we need to do --
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A jedna od stvari
koje moramo da uradimo -
koje moramo da uradimo -
12:34
and we can do it as women --
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a mi to, kao žene, možemo -
12:35
for one thing, we kind of set
the consumer standards.
the consumer standards.
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za početak, nekako smo
podesili potrošačke standarde.
podesili potrošačke standarde.
12:38
We need to consume less.
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Moramo manje da trošimo.
12:41
We in the Western world
need to consume less
need to consume less
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Mi u zapadnom svetu
moramo manje da trošimo
moramo manje da trošimo
12:44
and when we buy things, we need to
buy things that are made locally,
buy things that are made locally,
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i kada kupujemo stvari, treba
da kupujemo stvari lokalnog porekla,
da kupujemo stvari lokalnog porekla,
kada kupujemo hranu, treba da kupujemo
hranu koja je uzgajana lokalno.
hranu koja je uzgajana lokalno.
12:47
when we buy food, we need to buy food
that's grown locally.
that's grown locally.
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12:50
We are the ones
that need to get off the grid.
that need to get off the grid.
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Mi smo ti koji moramo
da budemo nezavisni od tržišta.
da budemo nezavisni od tržišta.
12:53
We need to make ourselves
independent from fossil fuels.
independent from fossil fuels.
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Moramo da se oslobodimo
zavisnosti od fosilnih goriva.
zavisnosti od fosilnih goriva.
12:59
And the fossil fuel companies --
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1976
A kompanije za fosilna goriva -
13:01
the Exxons and the Shell Oils
and those bad guys --
and those bad guys --
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Eksons i Šel Oils i drugi negativci -
13:04
cause they are --
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jer to jesu -
13:05
are going to tell us that we can't do it
without going back to the Stone Age.
without going back to the Stone Age.
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će nam reći da ne možemo to da uradimo,
a da se ne vratimo u kameno doba.
a da se ne vratimo u kameno doba.
13:09
You know, that the alternatives
just aren't quite there yet,
just aren't quite there yet,
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Znate, da alternative prosto
još uvek nisu dovoljno dobre,
još uvek nisu dovoljno dobre,
13:12
and that's not true.
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a to nije istina.
13:14
There are countries in the world right now
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Trenutno imamo države u svetu
13:16
that are living mostly on renewable
energy and doing just fine.
energy and doing just fine.
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koje uglavnom žive na obnovljivoj energiji
i ništa im ne fali.
i ništa im ne fali.
13:19
And they tell us that if we do
wean ourselves from fossil fuel
wean ourselves from fossil fuel
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I govore nam da, ako se
odviknemo od fosilnih goriva,
odviknemo od fosilnih goriva,
13:23
that we're going to be
back in the Stone Age,
back in the Stone Age,
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da ćemo se vratiti u kameno doba,
13:25
and in fact, if we begin
to use renewable energy,
to use renewable energy,
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a zapravo, ako počnemo
da koristimo obnovljivu energiju,
da koristimo obnovljivu energiju,
umesto što kopamo po Arktiku,
umesto što kopamo -
umesto što kopamo -
13:30
and not drill in the Arctic,
and not drill --
and not drill --
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13:32
LT: Oh, boy.
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LT: O, bože.
DžF: I da ne kopamo
po naftnom pesku Alberte -
po naftnom pesku Alberte -
13:33
JF: And not drill
in the Alberta tar sands --
in the Alberta tar sands --
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13:35
Right.
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Je li tako?
13:36
That we will be --
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Bićemo -
13:38
there will be more democracy
and more jobs and more well-being,
and more jobs and more well-being,
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imaćemo više demokratije
i više poslova i biće više opšteg dobra,
i više poslova i biće više opšteg dobra,
13:41
and it's women that are
going to lead the way.
going to lead the way.
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a žene su te koje će da predvode.
13:43
LT: Maybe we have the momentum
to start a third-wave feminist movement
to start a third-wave feminist movement
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LT: Možda imamo impuls da započnemo
treći talas feminističkog pokreta
treći talas feminističkog pokreta
13:48
with our sisterhood around the world,
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s našim sestrinstvima širom sveta,
13:50
with women we don't see,
women we may never meet,
women we may never meet,
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s ženama koje ne vidimo,
ženama koje nikad ne srećemo,
ženama koje nikad ne srećemo,
13:53
but we join together that way,
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ali se na taj način udružimo
13:56
because --
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jer -
13:57
Aristotle said --
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Aristotel je rekao -
13:59
most people --
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većina ljudi -
14:01
people would die without male friendships.
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ljudi bi umrli bez muških prijatelja.
14:04
And the operative word here was "male."
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Glavna reč ovde je "muških".
Smatrali su da bi prijateljstva
trebalo da budu među jednakim,
trebalo da budu među jednakim,
14:07
Because they thought that friendships
should be between equals
should be between equals
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14:10
and women were not considered equal --
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a žene nisu smatrane jednakim -
14:12
JF: They didn't think
we had souls even, the Greeks.
we had souls even, the Greeks.
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DžF: Grci nisu smatrali
čak ni da imamo duše.
čak ni da imamo duše.
14:15
LT: No, exactly. That shows you
just how limited Aristotle was.
just how limited Aristotle was.
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LT: Ne, baš tako. To vam pokazuje
samo koliko je ograničen bio Aristotel.
samo koliko je ograničen bio Aristotel.
14:18
(Laughter)
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(Smeh)
14:21
And wait, no, here's the best part.
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I sačekajte, ne, ovo je najbolji deo.
14:23
It's like, you know,
men do need women now.
men do need women now.
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Znači, znate, muškarcima
su sada potrebne žene.
su sada potrebne žene.
14:27
The planet needs women.
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Planeti su potrebne žene.
14:29
The US Constitution needs women.
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Ustavu SAD-a su potrebne žene.
14:31
We are not even in the Constitution.
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Mi nismo čak ni u Ustavu.
14:34
JF: You're talking about
the Equal Rights Amendment.
the Equal Rights Amendment.
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DžF: Govoriš o Amandmanu
o jednakim pravima.
o jednakim pravima.
14:37
LT: Right.
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LT: Baš tako.
14:38
Justice Ginsberg said something like --
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Džastis Ginzberg je rekla nešto u smislu -
14:43
every constitution that's been written
since the end of World War II
since the end of World War II
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u svaki ustav koji je napisan
od završetka Drugog svetskog rata,
od završetka Drugog svetskog rata,
14:47
included a provision that made women
citizens of equal stature,
citizens of equal stature,
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uvrštena je odredba kojom su žene
proglašene građanima jednakog statusa,
proglašene građanima jednakog statusa,
14:52
but ours does not.
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međutim u našem nije tako.
14:54
So that would be a good place to start.
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Pa bi bilo dobro početi odatle.
14:56
Very, very mild --
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Veoma, veoma blago -
14:58
JF: Right.
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DžF: Upravo tako.
14:59
(Applause)
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(Aplauz)
15:02
And gender equality, it's like a tide,
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A rodna ravnopravnost je poput plime,
15:04
it would lift all boats, not just women.
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podigla bi sve brodove, ne samo žene.
15:06
PM: Needing new role models
on how to do that.
on how to do that.
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PM: Potrebni su nam novi uzori
kako bismo to postigli.
kako bismo to postigli.
15:09
How to be friends,
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Kako da budemo prijatelji,
15:10
how to think about our power
in different ways,
in different ways,
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kako da razmišljamo o moći drugačije,
15:13
as consumers,
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kao potrošači,
15:15
as citizens of the world,
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kao građani sveta
15:16
and this is what makes Jane and Lily
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a zbog ovoga su Džejn i Lili
15:19
a role model of how
women can be friends --
women can be friends --
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uzori za ženska prijateljstva -
15:21
for a very long time,
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na dugi vremenski period,
15:23
and even if they occasionally disagree.
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pa čak i kad se povremeno ne slažu.
15:25
Thank you.
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Hvala vam.
15:28
Thank you both.
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Havala vam obema.
15:29
(Applause)
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(Aplauz)
15:30
JF: Thanks.
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DžF: Hvala.
15:35
LT: Thank you.
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LT: Hvala vam.
15:36
JF: Thank you.
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DžF: Hvala vam.
15:38
(Applause)
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(Aplauz)
ABOUT THE SPEAKERS
Jane Fonda - Actor and activistJane Fonda has had three extraordinary careers (so far): Oscar-winning actor, fitness guru, impassioned activist.
Why you should listen
Jane Fonda is an actor, author, producer and activist supporting environmental issues, peace and female empowerment. She founded the Georgia Campaign for Adolescent Pregnancy Prevention, and established the Jane Fonda Center for Adolescent Reproductive Health at Emory. She cofounded the Women’s Media Center, and sits on the board of V-Day, a global effort to stop violence against women and girls.
Fonda's remarkable screen and stage career includes two Best Actress Oscars, an Emmy, a Tony Award nomination and an Honorary Palme d’Or from the Cannes Film Festival. Offstage, she revolutionized the fitness industry in the 1980s with Jane Fonda’s Workout — the all-time top-grossing home video. She has written a best-selling memoir, My Life So Far, and Prime Time, a comprehensive guide to living life to the fullest.
Jane Fonda | Speaker | TED.com
Lily Tomlin - Comedian and actor
Lily Tomlin has been honored by the Kennedy Center and awarded the Mark Twain Prize -- and she's still making vital, hilarious comedy.
Why you should listen
Throughout her extraordinary career, Lily Tomlin has won seven Emmys; a Tony for her one-woman Broadway show, Appearing Nitely; a second Tony for Best Actress; a Drama Desk Award and an Outer Critics' Circle Award for her one-woman performance in Jane Wagner’s The Search for Signs of Intelligent Life in the Universe; a Grammy for her comedy album, This Is a Recording; and two Peabody Awards, the first for the ABC television special, Edith Ann’s Christmas: Just Say Noël, and the second for narrating and executive producing the HBO film, The Celluloid Closet. In 2003, she received the Mark Twain Prize for American Humor, and in December 2014 she was the recipient of the prestigious Kennedy Center Honors in Washington DC.
She made her film debut in Robert Altman's Nashville, and gave a generation-defining performance alongside Dolly Parton and Jane Fonda in the workplace revenge comedy 9 to 5.
Lily Tomlin | Speaker | TED.com