TEDxEast
Ellen Gustafson: Obesity + hunger = 1 global food issue
肥胖+飢餓=全球糧食議題
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慈善餵養袋的創辦人之一，艾倫。古斯塔夫森，認為飢餓和肥胖是一體兩面的。在TED的演說上，她發表了30計畫--這將改變我們在未來三十年的耕作與飲食習慣，並且解決全球糧食分配不平均，以及飢餓與肥胖這兩項問題。
Ellen Gustafson - Social entrepreneur
Co-founder of FEED and creator of The 30 Project, Ellen Gustafson is trying to change the way the world eats. Full bio
Co-founder of FEED and creator of The 30 Project, Ellen Gustafson is trying to change the way the world eats. Full bio
Double-click the English transcript below to play the video.
00:16
I'm Ellen, and I'm totally obsessed with food.
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我是艾倫，而我對於食物可說是相當著迷。
00:19
But I didn't start out obsessed with food.
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但我一開始並不是要研究食物，
00:21
I started out obsessed with global security policy
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我一開始是著重在全球安全政策，
00:23
because I lived in New York during 9/11, and it was obviously a very relevant thing.
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這是因為我在911期間住在紐約，而這很明顯地跟我的研究相當有關聯。
00:26
And I got from global security policy to food
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而我從全球安全政策轉而關注食物，
00:28
because I realized when I'm hungry, I'm really pissed off,
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因為我明白當我飢餓時，我會很惱怒，
00:31
and I'm assuming that the rest of the world is too.
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而我想全世界其他人也是如此。
00:33
Especially if you're hungry and your kids are hungry
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尤其是當你很餓，而且你的孩子也是的時候，
00:35
and your neighbor's kids are hungry and your whole neighborhood is hungry,
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甚至你鄰居的孩子及整個社區的人都是在飢餓的狀態中，
00:37
you're pretty angry.
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這會讓你真的很憤怒。
00:39
And actually, lo and behold, it looks pretty much like
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事實上，狀況看起來像是，
00:41
the areas of the world that are hungry
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世界上處於飢餓的區域
00:43
are also the areas of the world that are pretty insecure.
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同時也是不安全的區域。
00:45
So I took a job at the United Nations World Food Programme
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所以我接下了聯合國世界糧食計畫的一份工作，
00:47
as a way to try to address these security issues
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試著透過糧食安全議題，
00:49
through food security issues.
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藉此來向大家強調這些安全議題。
00:51
And while I was there, I came across
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當我在做這份工作時，
00:53
what I think is the most brilliant of their programs.
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我注意到了聯合國做得最傑出的計畫。
00:55
It's called School Feeding, and it's a really simple idea
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這個計劃叫做學校餵養，而這真的是一個相當簡單的主意，
00:57
to sort of get in the middle of the cycle of poverty and hunger
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就是介入持續困擾著世界上許多人的二個問題--
01:00
that continues for a lot of people around the world, and stop it.
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貧窮與飢餓，介入到這個循環中間，阻止惡性循環。
01:02
By giving kids a free school meal, it gets them into school,
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藉著供給孩童免費的學校餐點，可鼓勵孩子進入學校，
01:05
which is obviously education, the first step out of poverty,
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而很明顯的，教育，是走出貧窮的第一步。
01:08
but it also gives them the micronutrients and the macronutrients they need
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這些餐點還可以供給孩子他們所需的各種營養素，
01:10
to really develop both mentally and physically.
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讓孩子在心理與生理上有更健全的發展。
01:13
While I was working at the U.N., I met this girl. Her name is Lauren Bush.
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當我在聯合國工作時，我遇見了這個女孩。她的名字叫做蘿倫. 布希。
01:16
And she had this really awesome idea
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她提出了一個相當棒的想法，
01:18
to sell the bag called the "Feed Bag" --
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就是販賣這個叫做"餵養袋"的袋子。
01:20
which is really beautifully ironic because you can strap on the Feed Bag.
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這個名稱相當諷刺，也很恰當，因為你真的可以把餵養袋掛在胸前。
01:23
But each bag we'd sell would provide
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我們所販賣的每一個袋子，
01:25
a year's worth of school meals for one kid.
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可以提供每個孩子一年的學校餐費。
01:28
It's so simple, and we thought, you know, okay,
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這真的很簡單，而我們想，你知道的，
01:30
it costs between 20 and 50 bucks
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一年你只要花二十到五十元，
01:32
to provide school feeding for a year.
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就可以提供一年的學校餐費。
01:34
We could sell these bags and raise a ton of money
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我們可以販賣這些袋子並募得許多錢，
01:36
and a ton of awareness for the World Food Programme.
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還有讓更多人認識世界糧食計畫。
01:38
But of course, you know at the U.N., sometimes things move slowly,
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但當然，你知道在聯合國，有時事情進展得相當緩慢，
01:40
and they basically said no.
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基本上他們否決了這個計畫。
01:42
And we thought, God, this is such a good idea and it's going to raise so much money.
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我們想，天啊! 這真的是非常棒的計畫而且可以募到相當多錢，
01:45
So we said screw it, we'll just start our own company, which we did three years ago.
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我們想管他的，我們就在三年前成立了自己的公司。
01:48
So that was kind of my first dream, was to start this company called FEED,
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成立FEED公司有點像是我的第一個夢想，
01:51
and here's a screenshot of our website.
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這是我們網站的畫面。
01:53
We did this bag for Haiti, and we launched it just a month after the earthquake
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我們為海地製作這個袋子，在大地震之後一個月開始販賣，
01:56
to provide school meals for kids in Haiti.
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為海地的孩童提供學校餐點。
01:58
So FEED's doing great. We've so far provided 55 million meals
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而FEED發展得相當好。到目前為止我們在全世界
02:01
to kids around the world
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賣出了五十五萬五仟個餵養袋，
02:03
by selling now 550,000 bags, a ton of bags, a lot of bags.
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提供了約五千五百萬份學校餐點給各地的孩子。
02:06
All this time you're -- when you think about hunger,
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當你想到飢餓時，
02:09
it's a hard thing to think about, because what we think about is eating.
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這真的蠻難想像的，因為我們所想的都是食物。
02:11
I think about eating a lot, and I really love it.
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我會想到食物，而我真的也很喜歡吃。
02:13
And the thing that's a little strange about international hunger
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當人們提到全球性飢餓及相關議題時，
02:16
and talking about international issues
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有一點很奇怪的是，
02:18
is that most people kind of want to know: "What are you doing in America?"
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大部分的人多少都想知道你在美國做了些什麼？
02:21
"What are you doing for America's kids?"
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你為美國的孩子做了什麼?
02:23
There's definitely hunger in America:
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在美國也絕對有飢餓存在著，
02:25
49 million people and almost 16.7 million children.
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將近有四千九百萬人，和接近一千六百七十萬個孩童在捱餓著，
02:27
I mean that's pretty dramatic for our own country.
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這對我們國家來說真的很特別。
02:30
Hunger definitely means something a little bit different in America than it does internationally,
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美國的飢餓問題和全球其他地方的飢餓問題當然會有點不一樣，
02:33
but it's incredibly important to address hunger in our own country.
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但在我們國家強調飢餓這個課題也是很重要的。
02:36
But obviously the bigger problem that we all know about
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而我們都很清楚，在美國更大的問題很明顯是肥胖，
02:39
is obesity, and it's dramatic.
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這真的很特別。
02:41
The other thing that's dramatic is that both hunger and obesity
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還有另一件事也很特別，那就是飢餓與肥胖的數量，
02:43
have really risen in the last 30 years.
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在過去三十年都上升了。
02:46
Unfortunately, obesity's not only an American problem.
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不幸的，肥胖不僅是美國的問題，
02:48
It's actually been spreading all around the world
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這其實是全世界共有的問題，
02:50
and mainly through our kind of food systems that we're exporting.
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而且主要是由我們所輸出的飲食習慣所造成的。
02:53
The numbers are pretty crazy.
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這些數據真的很誇張。
02:55
There's a billion people obese or overweight
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有十億的人口是肥胖或過重的，
02:57
and a billion people hungry.
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但卻有十億的人口是吃不飽的。
02:59
So those seem like two bifurcated problems,
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這兩個看起來像是不一樣的問題，
03:01
but I kind of started to think about, you know,
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但我開始重新思考，就像你們知道的，
03:03
what is obesity and hunger? What are both those things about?
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何謂肥胖?何謂飢餓? 這兩者有什麼共同點?
03:06
Well, they're both about food.
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好的，它們都是糧食問題。
03:08
And when you think about food,
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而當你想到糧食時，
03:10
the underpinning of food in both cases
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飢餓與肥胖的糧食問題，
03:12
is potentially problematic agriculture.
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核心都指向有問題的農業。
03:15
And agriculture is where food comes from.
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而農業就是提供我們糧食的來源。
03:17
Well, agriculture in America's very interesting.
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而在美國，農業是相當有趣的，
03:19
It's very consolidated,
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而且相當發達，
03:21
and the foods that are produced lead to the foods that we eat.
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農業生產出的糧食會變成我們所吃的食物。
03:24
Well, the foods that are produced are, more or less, corn, soy and wheat.
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目前生產的農產品，大多都是玉米，大豆還有小麥。
03:26
And as you can see, that's three-quarters of the food that we're eating for the most part:
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如你所見，我們吃進去的食物裡，有四分之三
03:29
processed foods and fast foods.
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都是加工食品，還有速食。
03:31
Unfortunately, in our agricultural system,
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不幸的，在我們的農業系統裡，
03:33
we haven't done a good job in the last three decades
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過去的三十年都沒有扮演好應有的角色，
03:35
of exporting those technologies around the world.
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沒有將這些農業技術輸出到世界上的其他國家。
03:38
So African agriculture, which is the place of most hunger in the world,
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所以在非洲，世界上最鬧飢荒的地方，
03:41
has actually fallen precipitously
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農業其實是相當的落後，
03:43
as hunger has risen.
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而飢餓的現象也在惡化。
03:45
So somehow we're not making the connect
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但我們並不是想要談
03:47
between exporting a good agricultural system
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輸出農業系統這件事，
03:49
that will help feed people all around the world.
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當然這會幫助餵飽世界上更多人。
03:51
Who is farming them? That's what I was wondering.
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我所疑惑的是，到底是誰在耕種呢?
03:54
So I went and stood on a big grain bin in the Midwest,
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所以我去了中西部，站在一個巨大的穀物桶上。
03:56
and that really didn't help me understand farming,
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這其實並沒有幫我了解到農業，
03:58
but I think it's a really cool picture.
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但我想我照了一張還蠻酷的照片。
04:00
And you know, the reality is that
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而大家都知道的，事實是，
04:02
between farmers in America,
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當我在中西部
04:04
who actually, quite frankly, when I spend time in the Midwest,
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和美國農夫相處時，
04:06
are pretty large in general.
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我發現他們的塊頭都相當大，
04:08
And their farms are also large.
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而他們的農場也相當大。
04:10
But farmers in the rest of the world
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但世界上其他地方的農夫
04:12
are actually quite skinny, and that's because they're starving.
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實際上是相當瘦的，這是因為他們都吃不飽。
04:15
Most hungry people in the world are subsistence farmers.
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世界上大部分飢餓的人都是以農業為生的農夫，
04:17
And most of those people are women --
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而在這之中，大部分是女人，
04:19
which is a totally other topic that I won't get on right now,
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這個話題雖然並不是我現在要討論的，
04:21
but I'd love to do the feminist thing at some point.
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但我也樂意為女性議題做些事。
04:23
I think it's really interesting
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我認為從這兩方面來看農業發展，
04:25
to look at agriculture from these two sides.
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是相當有趣的一件事。
04:27
There's this large, consolidated farming
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美國廣大且發展良好的農業，
04:29
that's led to what we eat in America,
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決定了我們美國人的飲食。
04:31
and it's really been since around 1980,
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而這是從1980年開始的，
04:33
after the oil crisis,
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大概是在石油危機之後，
04:35
when, you know, mass consolidation,
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如同大家所知，那時候農業大量合併，
04:37
mass exodus of small farmers in this country.
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小型農場的農夫紛紛出走。
04:39
And then in the same time period,
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在這同時，
04:41
you know, we've kind of left Africa's farmers to do their own thing.
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我們的策略有點是讓非洲的農民們自生自滅。
04:44
Unfortunately, what is farmed ends up as what we eat.
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不幸的，耕作出的糧食就是我們所吃下肚的東西。
04:47
And in America, a lot of what we eat
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而在美國，我們吃的許多食物，
04:49
has led to obesity and has led to a real change
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導致人們肥胖，並且改變了
04:52
in sort of what our diet is in the last 30 years.
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我們過去三十年來的飲食習慣。
04:55
It's crazy.
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這真的是很瘋狂。
04:57
A fifth of kids under two drinks soda.
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兩歲以下的兒童有五分之一都喝汽水，
04:59
Hello. You don't put soda in bottles.
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拜託，沒人會把汽水放進奶瓶裡，
05:01
But people do because it's so cheap,
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但大家都這樣做，因為汽水很便宜。
05:03
and so our whole food system in the last 30 years
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而我們整個的飲食習慣也在過去的三十年間
05:05
has really shifted.
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做了很大的改變。
05:07
I think, you know, it's not just in our own country,
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我想，你們也知道，這不只發生在我們的國家，
05:09
but really we're exporting the system around the world,
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但我們的的確確是把這樣的習慣傳到世界各地。
05:12
and when you look at the data of least developed countries --
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當你看看這些發展最落後國家的數據，
05:15
especially in cities, which are growing really rapidly --
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尤其是在城市中，人們食用美國加工食品的數據，
05:18
people are eating American processed foods.
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成長得相當快。
05:20
And in one generation,
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而在同一個世代中，
05:22
they're going from hunger,
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有些人處於飢餓狀態，
05:24
and all of the detrimental health effects of hunger,
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還要承受飢餓所引起的健康問題，
05:26
to obesity and things like diabetes
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有些人則過度肥胖，有糖尿病、
05:28
and heart disease in one generation.
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心臟病等問題。
05:30
So the problematic food system
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所以這種有問題的飲食習慣，
05:32
is affecting both hunger and obesity.
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正同時產生出飢餓與肥胖這兩個問題。
05:34
Not to beat a dead horse,
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我們並不是在老調重彈，
05:36
but this is a global food system
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但這是一個全球性的飲食問題，
05:38
where there's a billion people hungry and billion people obese.
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在這之中有十億人在捱餓，另外卻也有十億人過度肥胖。
05:41
I think that's the only way to look at it.
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我想唯一解決問題的方法，
05:43
And instead of taking these two things as
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不是把這兩個問題
05:45
bifurcated problems that are very separate,
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看成毫不相干的兩件事，
05:47
it's really important to look at them as one system.
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而是把飢餓與肥胖看成是同一個問題。
05:50
We get a lot of our food from all around the world,
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我們從世界各地取得許多食物，
05:52
and people from all around the world are importing our food system,
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同樣的，世界各地的人也向美國學習飲食習慣。
05:55
so it's incredibly relevant to start a new way of looking at it.
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所以，從新的角度看待這件事是相當重要的。
05:57
The thing is, I've learned --
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而我學到的是，
05:59
and the technology people that are here, which I'm totally not one of them --
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這裡有相當多的科技人士，我當然不在其內，
06:02
but apparently, it really takes 30 years
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但很明顯的，許多科學家
06:04
for a lot of technologies to become really endemic to us,
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必須花上三十年才能做出市場上的流行商品，
06:07
like the mouse and the Internet and Windows.
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像是滑鼠，網路還有微軟的Windows。
06:09
You know, there's 30-year cycles.
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你知道的，這是個三十年的循環。
06:11
I think 2010 can be a really interesting year
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我認為2010年會是相當有趣的一年，
06:13
because it is the end of the 30-year cycle,
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因為到2010年會是這一個三十年循環的結尾。
06:15
and it's the birthday of the global food system.
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這是全球新世代飲食習慣的三十週年紀念日，
06:17
So that's the first birthday I want to talk about.
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我想要談談這第一個三十週年。
06:19
You know, I think if we really think that
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大家都知道，如果我們真的認為
06:21
this is something that's happened in the last 30 years, there's hope in that.
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這是過去三十年累積下來而產生的結果，那我們還有希望。
06:24
It's the thirtieth anniversary of GMO crops
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這是基因作物、重量杯汽水、
06:26
and the Big Gulp, Chicken McNuggets, high fructose corn syrup,
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麥克雞塊、高果糖玉米糖漿、美國農場危機、
06:29
the farm crisis in America
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以及我們對全球農業
06:31
and the change in how we've addressed agriculture internationally.
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態度轉變的三十週年紀念日。
06:34
So there's a lot of reasons to take this 30-year time period
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所以將這個三十年的週期看做是
06:36
as sort of the creation of this new food system.
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新飲食習慣的誕生，是很有道理的。
06:39
I'm not the only one who's obsessed with this whole 30-year thing.
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我並不是唯一一個執著於這個三十年週期的人，
06:42
The icons like Michael Pollan
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代表人物像是麥克。保倫，
06:44
and Jamie Oliver in his TED Prize wish
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以及傑米。奧利佛，他在許下TED願望時，
06:46
both addressed this last three-decade time period
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就曾指出，過去的三十年，
06:49
as incredibly relevant for food system change.
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是我們飲食習慣改變的重大時期。
06:52
Well, I really care about 1980
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老實說，我也真的很在乎1980年，
06:54
because it's also the thirtieth anniversary of me this year.
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因為今年剛好也是我三十歲生日。
06:57
And so in my lifetime,
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而在我的生命中，
07:00
a lot of what's happened in the world --
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發生了許多事，
07:02
and being a person obsessed with food --
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做為一個對食物有所執著的人，
07:04
a lot of this has really changed.
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很多事真的都變得不一樣了。
07:06
So my second dream is that I think
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所以我的第二個夢想是，
07:08
we can look to the next 30 years
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讓我們往下一個三十年看，
07:10
as a time to change the food system again.
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並將其視為再一次改變飲食習慣的時機。
07:12
And we know what's happened in the past,
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我們知道過去所發生的一切，
07:14
so if we start now, and we look at technologies
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如果我們從現在開始，正視飲食習慣的長期發展，
07:16
and improvements to the food system long term,
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導入科技加以改善，
07:18
we might be able to recreate the food system
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我們很有可能可以再創造出新的飲食習慣。
07:20
so when I give my next talk and I'm 60 years old,
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這樣一來，當我六十歲發表下一場演說時，
07:22
I'll be able to say that it's been a success.
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我就能夠說這真的是非常成功。
07:25
So I'm announcing today the start of a new organization,
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所以我現在要來宣布一個新組織正式成立，
07:27
or a new fund within the FEED Foundation, called the 30 Project.
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這是在FEED基金會下的一個計畫，叫做30計畫。
07:30
And the 30 Project is really focused
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30計畫著重在
07:32
on these long-term ideas
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改變飲食習慣
07:34
for food system change.
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這個長期理念。
07:36
And I think by aligning international advocates that are addressing hunger
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我想將國際對於飢餓的關注
07:39
and domestic advocates that are addressing obesity,
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和國內對於肥胖議題的重視做結合，
07:41
we might actually look for long-term solutions
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我們真的很有可能找到長期的解決方式，
07:44
that will make the food system better for everyone.
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並找出有益於每個人的飲食習慣。
07:46
We all tend to think that these systems are quite different,
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我們都認為飲食習慣大相逕庭，
07:48
and people argue whether or not organic can feed the world,
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人們也質疑有機食物是否能夠餵飽全世界，
07:51
but if we take a 30-year view,
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但如果我們從30年週期的角度看，
07:53
there's more hope in collaborative ideas.
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將這些議題綜合起來，會更有希望找到解決方案。
07:55
So I'm hoping that by connecting really disparate organizations
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所以我希望藉由結合不同的組織團體，
07:58
like the ONE campaign and Slow Food,
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像是ONE運動以及慢食運動，
08:00
which don't seem right now to have much in common,
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這些組織現在似乎沒有太多共通處，
08:02
we can talk about holistic, long-term, systemic solutions
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但我們可討論長期、整體性且有系統的解決方案，
08:05
that will improve food for everyone.
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來改善你我所吃的食物。
08:07
Some ideas I've had is like, look,
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有些想法，像是我剛提的，
08:09
the reality is -- kids in the South Bronx need apples and carrots
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在南布朗克斯的孩子需要蘋果與胡蘿蔔，
08:12
and so do kids in Botswana.
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而在博茨瓦納的孩子也一樣。
08:14
And how are we going to get those kids those nutritious foods?
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那我們要如何讓這些孩子取得營養的食物呢?
08:17
Another thing that's become incredibly global is production of meat and fish.
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另一個全球化的議題則是肉類與魚類的生產，
08:20
Understanding how to produce protein
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瞭解如何生產出
08:22
in a way that's healthy for the environment and healthy for people
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能兼顧環境與人類健康的蛋白質，
08:25
will be incredibly important to address things like climate change
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將是很重要的事，因為這關係到氣候變遷、
08:28
and how we use petrochemical fertilizers.
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以及我們如何使用石化肥料等議題。
08:31
And you know, these are really relevant topics
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大家都知道，這些都是息息相關的議題，
08:33
that are long term
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長期來說，
08:35
and important for both people in Africa who are small farmers
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對非洲的小農夫、美國農夫、
08:38
and people in America who are farmers and eaters.
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以及消費者都是相當的重要。
08:41
And I also think that thinking about processed foods in a new way,
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我也認為，我們應該以全新的角度來看待加工食品，
08:44
where we actually price the negative externalities
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實際上，這些加工食品裡所添加的不良添加物，
08:47
like petrochemicals and like fertilizer runoff
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像是石化肥料等，其成本都已被累加進
08:50
into the price of a bag of chips.
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一包洋芋片的販售價格當中。
08:52
Well, if that bag of chips then becomes
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如果一包洋芋片的販售價格，
08:54
inherently more expensive than an apple,
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比一顆蘋果還來的貴，
08:56
then maybe it's time for a different sense
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那也許該是我們好好想想的時候了，
08:58
of personal responsibility in food choice
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我們每個人都必須為所選擇的食物負責，
09:00
because the choices are actually choices
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因為你可以選擇，
09:02
instead of three-quarters of the products being made just from corn, soy and wheat.
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而不是讓玉米、大豆和小麥被做成佔我們食物來源四分之三的加工食品。
09:05
The 30Project.org is launched,
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這項30計畫已經展開，
09:07
and I've gathered a coalition of a few organizations to start.
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我也邀請到了一些組織開始加入，
09:10
And it'll be growing over the next few months.
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在未來幾個月還會有更多組織加入。
09:13
But I really hope that you will all think of ways that you can
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我真的希望大家能以長期的角度來想想辦法，
09:15
look long term at things like the food system
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想想我們的飲食習慣，
09:17
and make change.
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並做出改變。
09:19
(Applause)
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(掌聲)
ABOUT THE SPEAKER
Ellen Gustafson - Social entrepreneurCo-founder of FEED and creator of The 30 Project, Ellen Gustafson is trying to change the way the world eats.
Why you should listen
Ellen Gustafson co-founded FEED Projects in 2007, creating an immensely popular bag whose profits are donated to the UN World Food Program (WFP). As a former employee of the WFP, she supported their mission to provide school lunches in developing countries so that children could receive both the nutrition and education they need. FEED has also created special bags and a new fund to address the crisis in Haiti, helping the children they once fed at school to rebuild their schools.
At TEDxEast in May 2010, Gustafson launched The 30 Project -- an effort to address the world’s hunger and obesity problems as a holistic global food issue. In her new venture, she hopes to stimulate a movement that will change our food and agricultural systems over the next 30 years so that healthy, balanced meals are available to all. Before her efforts to fix the world’s food issues, Gustafson’s primary concern was international security. She wrote and edited pieces on international terrorism for ABC and was a research associate at the Council on Foreign Relations.
Ellen Gustafson | Speaker | TED.com