TEDxBrussels
Mikko Hypponen: How the NSA betrayed the world's trust -- time to act
米科·海坡能: 美国如何出卖了世界？——采取行动的时候到了
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近期的一些事件都已陆续向我们强调着一个事实，那就是美国一直在对其它国家经过美国服务器的数据施行彻底监视，而不管他们是否做了什么错事。如米科·海坡能（Mikko Hypponen）所说，这就意味着本质上这个世界上每个使用因特网的人都在被监视。这是一个慷慨激昂的重要讲演，带着如此恳切的声音，呼唤我们寻找替代通过美国企业满足世界信息需求的有效途径。
Mikko Hypponen - Cybersecurity expert
As computer access expands, Mikko Hypponen asks: What's the next killer virus, and will the world be able to cope with it? And also: How can we protect digital privacy in the age of government surveillance? Full bio
As computer access expands, Mikko Hypponen asks: What's the next killer virus, and will the world be able to cope with it? And also: How can we protect digital privacy in the age of government surveillance? Full bio
Double-click the English transcript below to play the video.
00:12
The two most likely largest inventions
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互联网和手机可以说是
00:17
of our generation
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我们这个时代
00:19
are the Internet and the mobile phone.
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最为重要的两大发明了
00:22
They've changed the world.
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它们改变了整个世界
00:24
However, largely to our surprise,
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然而，令我们非常吃惊的是
00:28
they also turned out to be the perfect tools
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它们同时也成为了
00:32
for the surveillance state.
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用于国家监视的完美工具
00:35
It turned out that the capability
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事实上，收集关于我们
00:38
to collect data, information and connections
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每个人或者说所有人的
00:42
about basically any of us and all of us
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数据、信息以及关系的这种能力
00:46
is exactly what we've been hearing
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正是这个夏天从
00:48
throughout of the summer
through revelations and leaks
through revelations and leaks
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西方情报机构
00:53
about Western intelligence agencies,
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特别是美国情报机构
00:56
mostly U.S. intelligence agencies,
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所透露或者泄露的
00:59
watching over the rest of the world.
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这些情报机构监视着世界其它地方
01:02
We've heard about these starting with the
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六月六日开始
01:05
revelations from June 6.
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陆续听到一些泄露的消息
01:09
Edward Snowden started leaking information,
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斯诺登开始透露
01:12
top secret classified information,
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那些来源于美国情报机构的
01:14
from the U.S. intelligence agencies,
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顶级机密信息
01:16
and we started learning about things like PRISM
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于是我们也开始了解到一些
01:18
and XKeyscore and others.
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诸如菱镜计划和XKeyscore的事情
01:22
And these are examples of the kinds of programs
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这些都是美国情报机构
01:25
U.S. intelligence agencies are running right now,
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正在运作的项目
01:29
against the whole rest of the world.
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以此对抗世界其它国家
01:32
And if you look back about the forecasts
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如果你回顾一下乔治·奥威尔
01:36
on surveillance by George Orwell,
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有关监视的预言
01:40
well it turns out that
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你会发现
01:42
George Orwell was an optimist.
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奥威尔的确是一个乐观主义者
01:45
(Laughter)
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(笑声)
01:47
We are right now seeing a much larger scale
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如今我们看到的是大规模的
01:50
of tracking of individual citizens
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对普通民众的跟踪
01:52
than he could have ever imagined.
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这远远超出了他最初的想象
01:56
And this here is the infamous
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这就是那个臭名昭著的
01:59
NSA data center in Utah.
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美国犹他州的NSA数据中心
02:03
Due to be opened very soon,
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在不久的将来开放后
02:06
it will be both a supercomputing center
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它将成为一个超级计算中心
02:09
and a data storage center.
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同时也将成为一个超大数据中心
02:11
You could basically imagine it has a large hall
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你几乎可以想象那个被硬盘设备塞满的大厅
02:14
filled with hard drives storing data
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无时不刻都在存储
02:16
they are collecting.
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他们收集来的数据
02:19
And it's a pretty big building.
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这是一幢巨大的建筑
02:21
How big? Well, I can give you the numbers --
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具体有多大呢？我们来看一个数据
02:23
140,000 square meters --
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14万平方米
02:25
but that doesn't really tell you very much.
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可能你对这个数据也没有太多概念
02:27
Maybe it's better to imagine it as a comparison.
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我们最好通过比较来想象
02:31
You think about the largest IKEA store
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想想你去过的
02:33
you've ever been in.
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最大的宜家家具吧
02:35
This is five times larger.
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它将是宜家的五倍大
02:38
How many hard drives can you fit in an IKEA store?
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想想你能在宜家塞进多少硬盘设备吧
02:41
Right? It's pretty big.
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是吧？数目的确非常巨大！
02:43
We estimate that just the electricity bill
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我们估算仅用于运行
02:46
for running this data center
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这个数据中心的电费
02:48
is going to be in the tens of millions of dollars a year.
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每年就需要数千万美元
02:51
And this kind of wholesale surveillance
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而这种大规模的监视
02:54
means that they can collect our data
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意味着他们可以收集我们的数据
02:57
and keep it basically forever,
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并且基本上可以永久保留
02:59
keep it for extended periods of time,
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保留很长时间
03:01
keep it for years, keep it for decades.
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几年甚至几十年
03:04
And this opens up completely new kinds of risks
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这个将给我们所有人
03:08
to us all.
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带来前所未有的风险
03:10
And what this is is that it is wholesale
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它将是一种大规模的对我们每个人的
03:13
blanket surveillance on everyone.
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无障碍监视
03:18
Well, not exactly everyone,
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当然，确切来说也不是对所有人
03:20
because the U.S. intelligence only has a legal right
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因为美国情报机构只有对外国人的
03:24
to monitor foreigners.
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合法监视权力
03:26
They can monitor foreigners
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一旦那些非美国的数据流
03:28
when foreigners' data connections
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到达或者经过美国
03:30
end up in the United States or pass
through the United States.
through the United States.
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就要被监视了
03:34
And monitoring foreigners doesn't sound too bad
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监视外国人听起来似乎没那么糟糕
03:37
until you realize
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除非你意识到
03:39
that I'm a foreigner and you're a foreigner.
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其实我们都是老外
03:42
In fact, 96 percent of the planet are foreigners.
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事实上，这个星球上96%都是老外
03:46
(Laughter)
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(笑)
03:47
Right?
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是吧？
03:49
So it is wholesale blanket surveillance of all of us,
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所以说只要你使用通信工具和互联网
03:54
all of us who use telecommunications and the Internet.
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你就会被彻底监视
03:58
But don't get me wrong:
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大家也别误会
04:00
There are actually types
of surveillance that are okay.
of surveillance that are okay.
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的确也有一些还不错的监视形式
04:05
I love freedom, but even I agree
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我热爱自由，但我自始至终也同意
04:08
that some surveillance is fine.
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有一些监视是有益的
04:10
If the law enforcement is trying to find a murderer,
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比如如果执法机关正在寻找一名谋杀犯
04:14
or they're trying to catch a drug lord
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或者搜捕一个贩毒者
04:17
or trying to prevent a school shooting,
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或者试图阻止一场校园枪击案的发生
04:21
and they have leads and they have suspects,
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并且他们中有头目有嫌疑犯
04:23
then it's perfectly fine for them
to tap the suspect's phone,
to tap the suspect's phone,
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此时如果能监听他们的手机
04:26
and to intercept his Internet communications.
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截获他们的网络通信那就太棒了
04:30
I'm not arguing that at all,
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我并不反对这一点
04:32
but that's not what programs like PRISM are about.
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但菱镜计划之类的项目并不是这么做的
04:34
They are not about doing surveillance on people
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他们不是在监视那些
04:37
that they have reason
to suspect of some wrongdoings.
to suspect of some wrongdoings.
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他们有理由怀疑的坏人
04:41
They're about doing surveillance on people
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他们在监视那些
04:42
they know are innocent.
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无辜的人
04:46
So the four main arguments
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对于这样的监听
04:48
supporting surveillance like this,
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有四条主要的理由
04:50
well, the first of all is that whenever you start
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首先是只要你
04:53
discussing about these revelations,
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一开始讨论信息泄露的问题
04:54
there will be naysayers trying to minimize
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总会有反对者站出来
04:57
the importance of these revelations, saying that
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把泄露的重要性降到最小
04:59
we knew all this already,
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他们说我们早已知道这些
05:01
we knew it was happening, there's nothing new here.
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我们知道在发生什么，没有什么新鲜的
05:04
And that's not true. Don't let anybody tell you
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事实不是这样的
05:07
that we knew this already,
because we did not know this already.
because we did not know this already.
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谁说我们早知道这些？我们不知道
05:13
Our worst fears might have been something like this,
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我们最大的恐惧就是这些事情已经发生
05:17
but we didn't know this was happening.
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而我们一无所知
05:19
Now we know for a fact it's happening.
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现在我们的确可以确定的知道在发生什么
05:22
We didn't know about this.
We didn't know about PRISM.
We didn't know about PRISM.
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而我们之前并不了解
我们不了解PRISM
我们不了解PRISM
05:24
We didn't know about XKeyscore.
We didn't know about Cybertrans.
We didn't know about Cybertrans.
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也不了解XKeyscore，Cybertrans
05:27
We didn't know about DoubleArrow.
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还有DoubleArrow
05:29
We did not know about Skywriter --
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以及Skywriter
05:31
all these different programs
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这些各式各样
05:33
run by U.S. intelligence agencies.
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由美国情报局运行的项目
05:36
But now we do.
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但现在我们都了解了
05:39
And we did not know
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我们之前也并不知道
05:41
that U.S. intelligence agencies go to extremes
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美国情报机构如何极端到
05:44
such as infiltrating standardization bodies
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通过渗透至标准组织内部
05:48
to sabotage encryption algorithms on purpose.
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以达到削弱加密算法强度的目的
05:53
And what that means
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这就意味着
05:55
is that you take something which is secure,
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如果你拿到一份加密文件
05:57
an encryption algorithm which is so secure
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它的加密算法可以安全到
05:59
that if you use that algorithm to encrypt one file,
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使你加密之后
06:02
nobody can decrypt that file.
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没有任何人可以解开它
06:04
Even if they take every single computer on the planet just to decrypt that one file,
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即便你用地球上的每一个计算机去解密它
06:08
it's going to take millions of years.
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也需要数百万年
06:11
So that's basically perfectly safe, uncrackable.
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它可以说是绝密的，无懈可击
06:13
You take something which is that good
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拿到这样一件完美的东西
06:15
and then you weaken it on purpose,
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然后故意弱化它
06:17
making all of us less secure as an end result.
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使得我们每个人终都变得不安全
06:23
A real-world equivalent would be that
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现实生活中一个类似的例子是
06:25
intelligence agencies would force
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情报机构会强行
06:28
some secret pin code into every single house alarm
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将某种加密识别码植入每个家居防盗系统
06:31
so they could get into every single house
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这样他们就可以进入任何一所房子
06:32
because, you know, bad people
might have house alarms,
might have house alarms,
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因为坏人可能装有防盗系统
06:35
but it will also make all of us
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但这样一来
06:37
less secure as an end result.
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最后我们自己也变得不那么安全
06:39
Backdooring encryption algorithms
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利用加密算法这个后门儿
06:43
just boggles the mind.
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的确让人匪夷所思
06:46
But of course, these intelligence agencies
are doing their job.
are doing their job.
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当然啦，这些情报机构只是在履行自己的职责
06:50
This is what they have been told to do:
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这正是他们被要求做的事情
06:52
do signals intelligence,
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做信号情报
06:54
monitor telecommunications,
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监视通讯渠道
06:56
monitor Internet traffic.
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以及监测网络流量
06:57
That's what they're trying to do,
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这正是他们尝试在做的
06:59
and since most, a very big part
of the Internet traffic today is encrypted,
of the Internet traffic today is encrypted,
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由于目前相当大一部分的互联网流量是加密的
07:02
they're trying to find ways around the encryption.
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他们也就在尝试通过加密寻找突破口
07:04
One way is to sabotage encryption algorithms,
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削弱加密算法就是其中一种手段
07:07
which is a great example
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这是美国情报机构如何
07:09
about how U.S. intelligence agencies
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为所欲为
07:11
are running loose.
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的一个极好的例子
07:13
They are completely out of control,
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他们完全不受控制
07:15
and they should be brought back under control.
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而这些应该加以控制
07:21
So what do we actually know about the leaks?
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而我们对这些信息泄露的真实了解能有多少呢
07:24
Everything is based on the files
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所有这些都基于
07:26
leaked by Mr. Snowden.
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Snowden先生的那些泄露文件
07:29
The very first PRISM slides
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从六月初
07:32
from the beginning of June
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第一个PRISM的幻灯片开始
07:34
detail a collection program where the data
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它详细描述了
07:36
is collected from service providers,
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一个从服务提供商收集数据的项目
07:37
and they actually go and name the service providers
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而且他们还对那些被使用的
07:40
they have access to.
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服务商进行了命名
07:42
They even have a specific date
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甚至为他们设立一个纪念日
07:45
on when the collection of data began
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记载开始从各个服务提供商
07:47
for each of the service providers.
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获取数据的日子
07:49
So for example, they name
the collection from Microsoft
the collection from Microsoft
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比如，他们为2007年9月11号
07:51
started on September 11, 2007,
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开始从Microsoft获取的那批数据起了名字
07:55
for Yahoo on the March 12, 2008,
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还有2008年3月12号的Yahoo
07:58
and then others: Google, Facebook,
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之后还有Google, Facebook
08:01
Skype, Apple and so on.
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Skype, Apple等等
08:04
And every single one of these companies denies.
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任何一个公司对此都呈否认态度
08:07
They all say that this simply isn't true,
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都说这简直就是谎言
08:11
that they are not giving
backdoor access to their data.
backdoor access to their data.
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他们从来没有开过后门让别人获取他们的数据
08:16
Yet we have these files.
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但是我们的确得到了这些文件
08:20
So is one of the parties lying,
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那么是其中一方在撒谎吗？
08:22
or is there some other alternative explanation?
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有没有其他可能的解释？
08:25
And one explanation would be
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一种可能的解释是
08:28
that these parties, these service providers,
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这些当事人，也就是这些服务提供商
08:31
are not cooperating.
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他们并没有合作
08:33
Instead, they've been hacked.
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只是被黑了
08:36
That would explain it. They aren't cooperating. They've been hacked.
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这种解释是合理的：他们没有参与而是受到了黑客攻击
08:39
In this case, they've been hacked
by their own government.
by their own government.
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其实可以说是他们被自己的政府黑了
08:44
That might sound outlandish,
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也许这听起来有点荒唐
08:46
but we already have cases where this has happened,
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但我们的确有过这样的案例
08:48
for example, the case of the Flame malware
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比如那个有关恶意软件Flame的案子
08:51
which we strongly believe was authored
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我们之前多么坚信它是由
08:53
by the U.S. government,
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美国政府授权的
08:55
and which, to spread, subverted the security
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3899
而就是它破坏了Windows的
08:59
of the Windows Update network,
186
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网络升级系统的安全
09:02
meaning here, the company was hacked
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这就意味着
09:06
by their own government.
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2358
他们被自己的政府黑了
09:08
And there's more evidence
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1599
当然还有更多
09:10
supporting this theory as well.
190
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支撑这个说法的证据
09:13
Der Spiegel, from Germany, leaked more information
191
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4005
德国的明镜周刊（Der Spiegel）暴露了更多
09:17
about the operations run by the elite hacker units
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有关这些情报机构中的顶级黑客团队
09:21
operating inside these intelligence agencies.
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所做作为的信息
09:24
Inside NSA, the unit is called TAO,
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2626
在NSA内部, 这个部门被叫做TAO
09:27
Tailored Access Operations,
195
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1845
特定情报获取行动
09:28
and inside GCHQ, which is the U.K. equivalent,
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这个等同于英国GCHQ内部的NAC
09:32
it's called NAC, Network Analysis Centre.
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网络分析中心（Network Analysis Centre）
09:36
And these recent leaks of these three slides
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最近泄露的这三个幻灯片
09:40
detail an operation
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详细描述了一个由GCHQ情报局
09:42
run by this GCHQ intelligence agency
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3158
在英国发起的行动
09:45
from the United Kingdom
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1809
目标定位在
09:47
targeting a telecom here in Belgium.
202
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4233
一个比利时的电信公司
09:51
And what this really means
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2276
这件事表明了一个事实
09:53
is that an E.U. country's intelligence agency
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一个欧盟国家的情报机构
09:57
is breaching the security
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2215
正在蓄意破坏
10:00
of a telecom of a fellow E.U. country on purpose,
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4813
联盟国家电信公司的安全
10:04
and they discuss it in their slides completely casually,
207
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3835
而他们在幻灯片里谈论这件事时
10:08
business as usual.
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一如既往的自然
10:10
Here's the primary target,
209
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1668
这是主要目标
10:11
here's the secondary target,
210
599996
1378
这是次要目标
10:13
here's the teaming.
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1424
这是他们的团队
10:14
They probably have a team building
on Thursday evening in a pub.
on Thursday evening in a pub.
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3856
他们通常会在周四晚上在酒吧里做团队建设的活动
10:18
They even use cheesy PowerPoint clip art
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3041
他们每成功一次
10:21
like, you know, "Success,"
214
609695
1707
就会用一些俗气的幻灯片
10:23
when they gain access to services like this.
215
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3264
庆祝所谓的胜利
10:26
What the hell?
216
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2826
他们究竟在搞什么鬼
10:31
And then there's the argument
217
619685
1833
有人会争辩说
10:33
that okay, yes, this might be going on,
218
621518
1660
是的，他们是在监视
10:35
but then again, other countries are doing it as well.
219
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2637
但话说回来，哪个国家没有这样的行动呢？
10:37
All countries spy.
220
625815
2423
也许真的是
10:40
And maybe that's true.
221
628238
1738
所有国家都有间谍
10:41
Many countries spy, not all of them,
but let's take an example.
but let's take an example.
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629976
2438
很多国家都有，但并不是所有都是这样
10:44
Let's take, for example, Sweden.
223
632414
2111
比如说，瑞典
10:46
I'm speaking of Sweden because Sweden
224
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1376
我提起瑞典这个国家是因为
10:47
has a little bit of a similar law to the United States.
225
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2279
在法律方面它与美国是有些相似的
10:50
When your data traffic goes through Sweden,
226
638180
2123
当你的数据流经过瑞典的时候
10:52
their intelligence agency has a legal right by the law
227
640303
2810
他们的情报机构的确是有
10:55
to intercept that traffic.
228
643113
2001
截获这些数据的合法权力
10:57
All right, how many Swedish decisionmakers
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645114
3205
那么，有多少瑞典的决策者
11:00
and politicians and business leaders
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2872
政治家和商业领袖
11:03
use, every day, U.S.-based services,
231
651191
3073
每天使用美国的服务呢？
11:06
like, you know, run Windows or OSX,
232
654264
3268
比如像使用Windows或OSX
11:09
or use Facebook or LinkedIn,
233
657532
2210
使用Facebook或LinkedIn
11:11
or store their data in clouds like iCloud
234
659742
3400
或者将数据上传到类似iCloud中进行云存储
11:15
or Skydrive or DropBox,
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663142
3894
还有Skydrive或者DropBox
11:19
or maybe use online services like
Amazon web services or sales support?
Amazon web services or sales support?
236
667036
4303
也许还有一些在线服务，类似Amazon网络服务或者销售支持？
11:23
And the answer is, every single Swedish
business leader does that every single day.
business leader does that every single day.
237
671339
3957
答案是，每一个瑞典的商业人士每天都会使用它们
11:27
And then we turn it around.
238
675296
1599
那么如果我们反过来问
11:28
How many American leaders
239
676895
1905
有多少美国杰出人士
11:30
use Swedish webmails and cloud services?
240
678800
4293
使用瑞典的网络邮箱和云服务呢？
11:35
And the answer is zero.
241
683093
2040
答案是零
11:37
So this is not balanced.
242
685133
2269
所以这显然是不平衡的
11:39
It's not balanced by any means, not even close.
243
687402
4625
相差甚远
11:44
And when we do have the occasional
244
692027
2441
即使有一天我们偶然发现一个
11:46
European success story,
245
694468
2001
欧洲人获胜的故事
11:48
even those, then, typically end up being sold
to the United States.
to the United States.
246
696469
3566
典型的结局一定是这个服务被美国公司收购
11:52
Like, Skype used to be secure.
247
700035
2264
比如，Skype最初采用端到端的加密
11:54
It used to be end-to-end encrypted.
248
702299
2733
所以还是安全的
11:57
Then it was sold to the United States.
249
705032
2041
后来被卖给了美国后
11:59
Today, it no longer is secure.
250
707073
2649
就不再安全了
12:01
So once again, we take something which is secure
251
709722
3221
所以，我们再一次把一个原本安全的东西
12:04
and then we make it less secure on purpose,
252
712943
1870
弄得不再安全
12:06
making all of us less secure as an outcome.
253
714813
4484
使得我们所有人最终也都不再安全了
12:12
And then the argument that the United States
254
720855
2247
也有争论说
12:15
is only fighting terrorists.
255
723102
2018
美国只是在
12:17
It's the war on terror.
256
725120
1166
展开一场针对恐怖分子的战争
12:18
You shouldn't worry about it.
257
726286
2547
本来无需担忧
12:20
Well, it's not the war on terror.
258
728833
2230
但事实上它不是
12:23
Yes, part of it is war on terror, and yes,
259
731063
2173
是的，我们承认这中间有恐怖分子
12:25
there are terrorists, and they do kill and maim,
260
733236
2976
我们必须与这些
12:28
and we should fight them,
261
736212
1551
肆意残害的行为作战
12:29
but we know through these leaks
262
737763
1606
但从那些泄露的消息中我们也知道
12:31
that they have used the same techniques
263
739369
2582
他们在使用相同的手段
12:33
to listen to phone calls of European leaders,
264
741951
3336
监听那些欧洲的领导者
12:37
to tap the email of residents of Mexico and Brazil,
265
745287
3455
截获墨西哥和巴西居民的邮件
12:40
to read email traffic inside the United Nations Headquarters and E.U. Parliament,
266
748742
4806
甚至联合国总部以及欧盟议会的邮件
12:45
and I don't think they are trying to find terrorists
267
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3154
他们显然不会在欧盟议会内部
12:48
from inside the E.U. Parliament, right?
268
756702
3018
寻找恐怖分子，对吧？
12:51
It's not the war on terror.
269
759720
1948
所以，这不是一场针对恐怖分子的战争
12:53
Part of it might be, and there are terrorists,
270
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4142
虽然部分意义上可以说是
12:57
but are we really thinking about terrorists
271
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2427
恐怖主义的确是存在的
13:00
as such an existential threat
272
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2169
但我们会认为它是一种
13:02
that we are willing to do anything at all to fight them?
273
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3676
必需我们不惜一切代价去全力对抗的现存威胁么？
13:06
Are the Americans ready
to throw away the Constituion
to throw away the Constituion
274
774082
3491
美国人民准备为了恐怖分子
13:09
and throw it in the trash
just because there are terrorists?
just because there are terrorists?
275
777573
4241
而抛弃宪法？
13:13
And the same thing with the Bill of Rights
and all the amendments
and all the amendments
276
781814
2524
抛弃那些人权法案？
13:16
and the Universal Declaration of Human Rights
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2317
还有世界人权宣言
13:18
and the E.U. conventions on human rights
and fundamental freedoms
and fundamental freedoms
278
786655
5151
欧盟那些关于人权和基本自由的法案
13:23
and the press freedom?
279
791806
1517
还有出版自由？
13:25
Do we really think terrorism
is such an existential threat,
is such an existential threat,
280
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3815
我们真的认为恐怖主义
13:29
we are ready to do anything at all?
281
797138
3126
需要我们不惜这一切代价吗？
13:34
But people are scared about terrorists,
282
802490
2664
是的，人们惧怕恐怖主义
13:37
and then they think that
maybe that surveillance is okay
maybe that surveillance is okay
283
805154
2414
所以也许他们认为这样的监视是合理的
13:39
because they have nothing to hide.
284
807568
2044
反正也没什么需要隐藏的
13:41
Feel free to survey me if that helps.
285
809612
2707
需要的话那就随便监视好了
13:44
And whoever tells you that they have nothing to hide
286
812319
2888
但是，谁说他们没有什么值得隐藏起来的？
13:47
simply hasn't thought about this long enough.
287
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4713
只是他们还没有考虑那么长远罢了
13:54
(Applause)
288
822520
5865
(掌声)
14:00
Because we have this thing called privacy,
289
828385
2772
因为我们每个人都有隐私
14:03
and if you really think that you have nothing to hide,
290
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2345
如果你真的认为你没有什么要隐藏的
14:05
please make sure that's the first thing you tell me,
291
833502
2216
那你一定要弄清楚这是你告诉我的第一件事
14:07
because then I know
292
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1550
因为这之后我会觉得
14:09
that I should not trust you with any secrets,
293
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1640
不能再信任你
14:10
because obviously you can't keep a secret.
294
838908
3298
因为你明显不会保守秘密
14:17
But people are brutally honest with the Internet,
295
845065
3829
人们对互联网都表现出盲目的诚实
14:20
and when these leaks started,
296
848894
2696
当那些信息开始泄露的时候
14:23
many people were asking me about this.
297
851590
1878
许多人问我
14:25
And I have nothing to hide.
298
853468
1574
说他们没有什么需要隐瞒的
14:27
I'm not doing anything bad or anything illegal.
299
855042
3290
也没有做什么坏事或者违法的事情
14:30
Yet, I have nothing that I would in particular
300
858332
2785
而且我也没有什么想要与
14:33
like to share with an intelligence agency,
301
861117
2793
情报中心分享的特殊信息
14:35
especially a foreign intelligence agency.
302
863910
4137
何况还是国外的情报机构
14:40
And if we indeed need a Big Brother,
303
868047
2855
就算我们真的需要一个老大
14:42
I would much rather have a domestic Big Brother
304
870902
3478
我也希望他是本国的
14:46
than a foreign Big Brother.
305
874380
3160
而不是来自国外
14:49
And when the leaks started,
the very first thing I tweeted about this
the very first thing I tweeted about this
306
877545
5059
当信息泄露开始的时候，我最先发表的
14:54
was a comment about how,
307
882604
2074
一条评论就是关于
14:56
when you've been using search engines,
308
884678
1688
当人们使用搜索引擎时，
14:58
you've been potentially leaking all that
to U.S. intelligence.
to U.S. intelligence.
309
886366
3649
是如何将信息泄露给了美国情报机构
15:02
And two minutes later, I got a reply
310
890015
1972
两分钟后我收到一条回复
15:03
by somebody called Kimberly from the United States
311
891987
2336
来自一个叫做Kimberly的美国人
15:06
challenging me, like, why am I worried about this?
312
894323
2167
他反对我说
15:08
What am I sending to worry about this?
Am I sending naked pictures or something?
Am I sending naked pictures or something?
313
896503
4032
我又没有发送裸照之类的东西，为什么我还需要担心这个？
15:12
And my answer to Kimberly was
314
900535
1968
我回答他说
15:14
that what I'm sending is none of your business,
315
902503
3029
我发送什么与你无关
15:17
and it should be none
of your government's business either.
of your government's business either.
316
905532
4265
当然也与你的政府无关
15:21
Because that's what it's about. It's about privacy.
317
909797
2252
因为这就是隐私
15:24
Privacy is nonnegotiable.
318
912049
1914
这一点没什么好讨论的
15:25
It should be built in to all the systems we use.
319
913963
3960
就是应该在我们所用的所有系统得到保障
15:31
(Applause)
320
919968
3578
(鼓掌)
15:38
And one thing we should all understand
321
926830
2619
有一点我们需要知道的是
15:41
is that we are brutally honest with search engines.
322
929449
4599
我们对搜索引擎也是在盲目信任
15:46
You show me your search history,
323
934048
2751
只要你透露了你的搜索记录
15:48
and I'll find something incriminating
324
936799
2366
我就能在五分钟之内
15:51
or something embarrassing there in five minutes.
325
939165
3437
找到那些与之关联的让人尴尬的东西
15:54
We are more honest with search engines
326
942602
1788
我们对搜索引擎的诚实
15:56
than we are with our families.
327
944390
1762
常常多于对我们的家庭
15:58
Search engines know more about you
328
946152
2091
搜索引擎通常也比你的家人
16:00
than your family members know about you.
329
948243
2766
更了解你
16:03
And this is all the kind
of information we are giving away,
of information we are giving away,
330
951009
3088
这就是那些我们
16:06
we are giving away to the United States.
331
954097
4375
泄露给美国的信息
16:10
And surveillance changes history.
332
958472
2478
监视改变历史
16:12
We know this through examples
of corrupt presidents like Nixon.
of corrupt presidents like Nixon.
333
960950
3209
堕落总统Nixon之类的例子告诉我们这些
16:16
Imagine if he would have had the kind
of surveillance tools that are available today.
of surveillance tools that are available today.
334
964159
4472
想象下如果他当时有现在这样的情报收集工具会怎么样吧
16:20
And let me actually quote
335
968631
2309
我想用巴西总统Dilma Rousseff夫人
16:22
the president of Brazil, Ms. Dilma Rousseff.
336
970940
3133
做个例子
16:26
She was one of the targets of NSA surveillance.
337
974073
3286
她就是NSA监视的对象之一
16:29
Her email was read, and she spoke
338
977359
2276
她的邮件被截获了
16:31
at the United Nations Headquarters, and she said,
339
979635
3023
她曾经在联合国总部质问
16:34
"If there is no right to privacy,
340
982658
2013
“如果没有隐私的权利
16:36
there can be no true freedom
of expression and opinion,
of expression and opinion,
341
984671
2827
就不会有什么真正的言论自由和舆论自由
16:39
and therefore, there can be no effective democracy."
342
987498
5111
因此也不可能有有效的民主”
16:44
That's what it's about.
343
992609
2345
就是这样
16:46
Privacy is the building block of our democracies.
344
994954
3868
隐私是民主的基础
16:52
And to quote a fellow security researcher, Marcus Ranum,
345
1000611
3465
一名在安全方面的同行学者Marcus Ranum曾说
16:56
he said that the United States
is right now treating the Internet
is right now treating the Internet
346
1004076
3827
如今美国对互联网的态度
16:59
as it would be treating one of its colonies.
347
1007903
3093
就像对待他们的殖民地
17:02
So we are back to the age of colonization,
348
1010996
2565
所以我们已经又回到了殖民时代
17:05
and we, the foreign users of the Internet,
349
1013561
3062
我们这些互联网的外国用户
17:08
we should think about Americans as our masters.
350
1016623
3705
应该把美国当做自己的主人
17:15
So Mr. Snowden, he's been blamed for many things.
351
1023005
3975
Snowden先生曾经受到过种种指责
17:18
Some are blaming him for causing problems
352
1026980
2654
有些人谴责他带来了美国云产业
17:21
for the U.S. cloud industry
and software companies with these revelations --
and software companies with these revelations --
353
1029634
3191
和软件公司的信息泄露问题
17:24
and blaming Snowden for causing problems
for the U.S. cloud industry
for the U.S. cloud industry
354
1032825
4296
而这些谴责就如同
17:29
would be the equivalent of blaming Al Gore
355
1037121
2459
在责备Al Gore
17:31
for causing global warming.
356
1039580
2317
带来全球变暖问题一样
17:33
(Laughter)
357
1041897
2254
(笑)
17:36
(Applause)
358
1044151
5071
(鼓掌)
17:43
So, what is there to be done?
359
1051853
6208
那么，我们该怎么办？
17:50
Should we worry. No, we shouldn't worry.
360
1058061
1780
我们需要担忧吗？不
17:51
We should be angry, because this is wrong,
361
1059841
2436
我们应该为这些丑恶的、无礼的、不该发生的事情
17:54
and it's rude, and it should not be done.
362
1062277
2739
而愤怒
17:57
But that's not going to really change the situation.
363
1065016
2268
但这些对改变现实无济于事
17:59
What's going to change the situation
for the rest of the world
for the rest of the world
364
1067284
3221
对于世界其它国家来说解决这一问题的方法
18:02
is to try to steer away
365
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2282
就是尝试避开
18:04
from systems built in the United States.
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美国建立的这些系统
18:07
And that's much easier said than done.
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但这说起来容易做起来难
18:10
How do you do that?
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该怎么做呢
18:11
A single country, any single country in Europe
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任何一个欧洲国家
18:13
cannot replace and build replacements
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都没有能力替代
18:16
for the U.S.-made operating systems
and cloud services.
and cloud services.
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美国制造的操作系统和云服务
18:19
But maybe you don't have to do it alone.
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但也许我们可以不用孤军奋战
18:21
Maybe you can do it together with other countries.
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而是与其它国家联合
18:22
The solution is open source.
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这个解决方案是开源的
18:26
By building together open, free, secure systems,
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通过一同构建这样一个开放、免费并安全的系统
18:31
we can go around such surveillance,
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我们可以绕开监视
18:34
and then one country doesn't have
to solve the problem by itself.
to solve the problem by itself.
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并且每个国家都不再只靠自己的力量
18:38
It only has to solve one little problem.
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而只需要解决一个小问题
18:40
And to quote a fellow security researcher, Haroon Meer,
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我们的安全专家Haroon Meer说过
18:46
one country only has to make a small wave,
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每个国家都只能成为一个小水波
18:49
but those small waves together become a tide,
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而聚在一起就可以掀起巨浪
18:52
and the tide will lift all the boats up at the same time,
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从而可以同时载起所有的小船
18:56
and the tide we will build
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这个安全，免费并开源的系统
18:57
with secure, free, open-source systems,
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将成为推动我们所有人的彭波巨浪
19:01
will become the tide that will lift all of us
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使我们可以从此
19:03
up and above the surveillance state.
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彻底逃脱国家的监视
19:09
Thank you very much.
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谢谢大家
19:11
(Applause)
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(鼓掌)
ABOUT THE SPEAKER
Mikko Hypponen - Cybersecurity expertAs computer access expands, Mikko Hypponen asks: What's the next killer virus, and will the world be able to cope with it? And also: How can we protect digital privacy in the age of government surveillance?
Why you should listen
The chief research officer at F-Secure Corporation in Finland, Mikko Hypponen has led his team through some of the largest computer virus outbreaks in history. His team took down the world-wide network used by the Sobig.F worm. He was the first to warn the world about the Sasser outbreak, and he has done classified briefings on the operation of the Stuxnet worm -- a hugely complex worm designed to sabotage Iranian nuclear enrichment facilities.
As a few hundred million more Internet users join the web from India and China and elsewhere, and as governments and corporations become more sophisticated at using viruses as weapons, Hypponen asks, what's next? Who will be at the front defending the world’s networks from malicious software? He says: "It's more than unsettling to realize there are large companies out there developing backdoors, exploits and trojans."
Even more unsettling: revelations this year that the United States' NSA is conducting widespread digital surveillance of both US citizens and anyone whose data passes through a US entity, and that it has actively sabotaged encryption algorithms. Hypponen has become one of the most outspoken critics of the agency's programs and asks us all: Why are we so willing to hand over digital privacy?
Read his open-season Q&A on Reddit:"My TED Talk was just posted. Ask me anything.
See the full documentary on the search for the Brain virus.
Mikko Hypponen | Speaker | TED.com