TEDSummit 2019
Johann Hari: This could be why you're depressed and anxious
約翰 ‧ 哈里: 這可能是你憂鬱或焦慮的原因
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Readability: 3.8
5,432,613 views
在這場動人且提出可行做法的演說中，記者約翰‧哈里針對憂鬱症及焦慮症的成因，分享世界各地專家的最新剪接，和一些讓人振奮的解決新方案。哈里說：「如果你感到憂鬱或焦慮，你並不軟弱也沒有發瘋——你只是個有需求卻沒被滿足的人。」
Johann Hari - Journalist
Johann Hari spent three years researching the war on drugs; along the way, he discovered that addiction is not what we think it is. Full bio
Johann Hari spent three years researching the war on drugs; along the way, he discovered that addiction is not what we think it is. Full bio
Double-click the English transcript below to play the video.
00:13
For a really long time,
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有很長的一段時間，
00:14
I had two mysteries
that were hanging over me.
that were hanging over me.
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有兩個謎團一直困擾著我。
00:18
I didn't understand them
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我不了解它們，
00:20
and, to be honest, I was quite afraid
to look into them.
to look into them.
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老實說，我也很害怕去探究它們。
00:24
The first mystery was, I'm 40 years old,
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第一個謎是：我四十歲，
00:27
and all throughout my lifetime,
year after year,
year after year,
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我的一生中，年復一年，
00:31
serious depression and anxiety have risen,
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嚴重的憂鬱和焦慮越來越多，
00:34
in the United States, in Britain,
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在美國、在英國，
00:37
and across the Western world.
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在整個西方世界都是。
00:39
And I wanted to understand why.
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我想要了解原因。
00:43
Why is this happening to us?
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為什麼我們會發生這種狀況？
00:45
Why is it that with each year that passes,
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為什麼隨著每一年過去，
00:48
more and more of us are finding it harder
to get through the day?
to get through the day?
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越來越多的人覺得難以度過每一天？
00:51
And I wanted to understand this
because of a more personal mystery.
because of a more personal mystery.
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我之所以想了解這一點，
是出於一個私人的謎團。
是出於一個私人的謎團。
00:55
When I was a teenager,
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我記得青少年時去看醫生，
00:56
I remember going to my doctor
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00:58
and explaining that I had this feeling,
like pain was leaking out of me.
like pain was leaking out of me.
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向醫生解釋說，我感覺痛苦
好像不斷地從我身上滲漏出來。
好像不斷地從我身上滲漏出來。
01:03
I couldn't control it,
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我無法控制它，
01:04
I didn't understand why it was happening,
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我不了解為什麼會發生這種狀況，
01:06
I felt quite ashamed of it.
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我也感到很羞恥。
01:09
And my doctor told me a story
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醫生跟我說了個故事，
01:10
that I now realize was well-intentioned,
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現在我了解他的意圖很好，
01:12
but quite oversimplified.
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但故事太簡化了，並非完全錯誤。
01:14
Not totally wrong.
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我的醫生說：「我們知道
人為什麼會這樣。
人為什麼會這樣。
01:15
My doctor said, "We know
why people get like this.
why people get like this.
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01:18
Some people just naturally get
a chemical imbalance in their heads --
a chemical imbalance in their heads --
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有些人天生腦內的
化學物質就失衡 ——
化學物質就失衡 ——
01:22
you're clearly one of them.
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顯然你是其中之一。
01:24
All we need to do is give you some drugs,
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我們只要開一些藥給你，
01:26
it will get your chemical
balance back to normal."
balance back to normal."
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你腦內的化學物質就能均衡正常。」
所以我開始吃一種叫做克憂果的藥，
01:28
So I started taking a drug
called Paxil or Seroxat,
called Paxil or Seroxat,
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01:30
it's the same thing with different names
in different countries.
in different countries.
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它在不同的國家有不同的名稱。
我感覺好很多，真的振作起來。
01:34
And I felt much better,
I got a real boost.
I got a real boost.
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01:36
But not very long afterwards,
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但過沒多久，這種
痛苦的感覺又回來了。
痛苦的感覺又回來了。
01:37
this feeling of pain started to come back.
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01:39
So I was given higher and higher doses
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所以我服用的劑量越來越高，
01:41
until, for 13 years, I was taking
the maximum possible dose
the maximum possible dose
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後來的十三年，我所服用的
劑量一直都是法定的最高量。
劑量一直都是法定的最高量。
01:45
that you're legally allowed to take.
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01:47
And for a lot of those 13 years,
and pretty much all the time by the end,
and pretty much all the time by the end,
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在那十三年間大部分的時間，
和幾乎是後段的全部時間，
和幾乎是後段的全部時間，
我仍然感到痛苦。
01:50
I was still in a lot of pain.
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01:52
And I started asking myself,
"What's going on here?
"What's going on here?
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我開始問我自己：
「這是怎麼回事？
「這是怎麼回事？
01:55
Because you're doing everything
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因為你已經做了主流文化
告訴你要做的所有事項——
告訴你要做的所有事項——
01:56
you're told to do by the story
that's dominating the culture --
that's dominating the culture --
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02:00
why do you still feel like this?"
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為什麼你仍然感覺這麼糟？」
02:02
So to get to the bottom
of these two mysteries,
of these two mysteries,
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所以，為了探索這兩個謎，
02:05
for a book that I've written
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為了完成我寫的書，
我踏上了一趟環球大旅程。
我踏上了一趟環球大旅程。
02:06
I ended up going on a big journey
all over the world,
all over the world,
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旅行超過四萬英里。
02:09
I traveled over 40,000 miles.
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02:10
I wanted to sit with the leading
experts in the world
experts in the world
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我想要和世界上
最頂尖的專家坐下來談，
最頂尖的專家坐下來談，
02:13
about what causes depression and anxiety
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了解憂鬱症和焦慮症的成因，
02:15
and crucially, what solves them,
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還有很重要的，要如何解決，
02:17
and people who have come through
depression and anxiety
depression and anxiety
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還想和那些經歷過憂鬱症
和焦慮症的人談談，
和焦慮症的人談談，
瞭解他們是用何種方法走出來的。
02:19
and out the other side
in all sorts of ways.
in all sorts of ways.
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一路上我認識了很多了不起的人，
並向他們學到非常多。
並向他們學到非常多。
02:21
And I learned a huge amount
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02:23
from the amazing people
I got to know along the way.
I got to know along the way.
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02:26
But I think at the heart
of what I learned is,
of what I learned is,
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但我學到的重點是，
02:29
so far, we have scientific evidence
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目前，我們有科學證據證明
02:32
for nine different causes
of depression and anxiety.
of depression and anxiety.
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憂鬱症和焦慮症的九種不同成因。
02:35
Two of them are indeed in our biology.
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其中兩種的確是受到生理的影響。
02:38
Your genes can make you
more sensitive to these problems,
more sensitive to these problems,
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你的基因可能會讓你
對這些問題比較敏感，
對這些問題比較敏感，
02:41
though they don't write your destiny.
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不過它們無法決定你的命運。
02:43
And there are real brain changes
that can happen when you become depressed
that can happen when you become depressed
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還有當你憂鬱時
大腦的確會產生變化，
大腦的確會產生變化，
02:46
that can make it harder to get out.
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讓你更難擺脫憂鬱。
02:48
But most of the factors
that have been proven
that have been proven
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但已經證明，大部分
造成憂鬱和焦慮的原因
造成憂鬱和焦慮的原因
02:50
to cause depression and anxiety
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02:52
are not in our biology.
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都跟生物學無關。
02:55
They are factors in the way we live.
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而是與我們的生活方式有關。
02:58
And once you understand them,
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一旦你了解了它們，
02:59
it opens up a very different
set of solutions
set of solutions
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就會開啟一套截然不同的解決方案，
03:02
that should be offered to people
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可以和化學抗憂鬱劑一起
提供給患者作為治療選項。
提供給患者作為治療選項。
03:04
alongside the option
of chemical antidepressants.
of chemical antidepressants.
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03:07
For example,
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比如，
03:09
if you're lonely, you're more likely
to become depressed.
to become depressed.
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如果你很孤單，
你比較有可能會憂鬱。
你比較有可能會憂鬱。
03:12
If, when you go to work,
you don't have any control over your job,
you don't have any control over your job,
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如果你在工作職位上沒有任何
掌控權，只能照別人的意思做，
掌控權，只能照別人的意思做，
03:15
you've just got to do what you're told,
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你就比較有可能會憂鬱。
03:17
you're more likely to become depressed.
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如果你很少走入大自然，
03:19
If you very rarely get out
into the natural world,
into the natural world,
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03:22
you're more likely to become depressed.
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你就比較有可能會憂鬱。
03:23
And one thing unites a lot of the causes
of depression and anxiety
of depression and anxiety
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我還發現，有一件事結合了
許多憂鬱和焦慮的成因。
許多憂鬱和焦慮的成因。
03:27
that I learned about.
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不是所有的成因，但很多。
03:28
Not all of them, but a lot of them.
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03:30
Everyone here knows
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大家都知道，
03:32
you've all got natural
physical needs, right?
physical needs, right?
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你們都有自然的生理需求，對吧？
03:34
Obviously.
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當然。
03:35
You need food, you need water,
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你們需要食物，你們需要水，
03:38
you need shelter, you need clean air.
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你們需要庇護，你們需要乾淨的空氣。
03:40
If I took those things away from you,
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如果我把這些都奪走，
你們很快就會出問題。
你們很快就會出問題。
03:42
you'd all be in real trouble, real fast.
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03:44
But at the same time,
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但，同時，
03:46
ever human being
has natural psychological needs.
has natural psychological needs.
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每個人也都有自然的精神需求。
03:50
You need to feel you belong.
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你們需要有歸屬感。
03:52
You need to feel your life
has meaning and purpose.
has meaning and purpose.
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你們需要感受到
自己生活的意義和目的。
自己生活的意義和目的。
03:55
You need to feel that people
see you and value you.
see you and value you.
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你們需要人們關注你、重視你。
03:57
You need to feel you've got
a future that makes sense.
a future that makes sense.
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你們需要覺得會有個具意義的未來。
04:00
And this culture we built
is good at lots of things.
is good at lots of things.
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我們所建立的文化擅長很多事。
04:03
And many things are better
than in the past --
than in the past --
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很多方面都比以前更好——
很高興我活在現代。
很高興我活在現代。
04:05
I'm glad to be alive today.
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但，我們越來越不擅長
04:07
But we've been getting less and less good
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滿足這些深處、根本的心理需求。
04:09
at meeting these deep,
underlying psychological needs.
underlying psychological needs.
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04:13
And it's not the only thing
that's going on,
that's going on,
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這不是唯一的問題，
但我認為這是這種危機
越來越高的主要原因。
越來越高的主要原因。
04:16
but I think it's the key reason
why this crisis keeps rising and rising.
why this crisis keeps rising and rising.
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04:20
And I found this really hard to absorb.
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我很難去接受這個事實。
04:24
I really wrestled with the idea
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我真的很努力去轉換這個概念：
04:26
of shifting from thinking of my depression
as just a problem in my brain,
as just a problem in my brain,
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從原本認為我的憂鬱症
只是我大腦的問題，
只是我大腦的問題，
轉變到是有許多原因造成的，
04:31
to one with many causes,
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04:32
including many in the way we're living.
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包括我們許多的生活方式。
04:34
And it only really began
to fall into place for me
to fall into place for me
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我真正逐漸開始了解它，
04:36
when one day, I went to interview
a South African psychiatrist
a South African psychiatrist
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是有一天，我和一位
南非的精神科醫師面談，
南非的精神科醫師面談，
04:40
named Dr. Derek Summerfield.
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德瑞克 ‧ 沙梅菲爾德博士。
他是個很棒的人。
他是個很棒的人。
04:41
He's a great guy.
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04:43
And Dr. Summerfield
happened to be in Cambodia in 2001,
happened to be in Cambodia in 2001,
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柬埔寨於 2001 年
首次提供化學抗憂鬱劑
首次提供化學抗憂鬱劑
給人民使用，
04:46
when they first introduced
chemical antidepressants
chemical antidepressants
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正好那時沙梅菲爾德博士也在那裡。
04:50
for people in that country.
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04:51
And the local doctors, the Cambodians,
had never heard of these drugs,
had never heard of these drugs,
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當地的醫生，柬埔寨人，
從來沒有聽過這些藥物，
從來沒有聽過這些藥物，
他們問這些是什麼？他做了解釋。
04:55
so they were like, what are they?
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04:56
And he explained.
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04:58
And they said to him,
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他們對他說：
04:59
"We don't need them,
we've already got antidepressants."
we've already got antidepressants."
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「我們不需要，我們已經
有抗憂鬱劑了。」
有抗憂鬱劑了。」
05:02
And he was like, "What do you mean?"
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他說：「什麼意思？」
05:04
He thought they were going to talk about
some kind of herbal remedy,
some kind of herbal remedy,
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他以為他們會說某種藥草療法，
05:07
like St. John's Wort, ginkgo biloba,
something like that.
something like that.
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如聖約翰草、銀杏之類的。
05:11
Instead, they told him a story.
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但，他們卻告訴他一個故事。
05:14
There was a farmer in their community
who worked in the rice fields.
who worked in the rice fields.
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在他們的社區
有個農夫，在稻田工作。
有個農夫，在稻田工作。
05:18
And one day, he stood on a land mine
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有一天，他踩到了地雷，
05:20
left over from the war
with the United States,
with the United States,
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那是和美國打戰時留下來的，
05:22
and he got his leg blown off.
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他的腿被炸斷了。
05:23
So they him an artificial leg,
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他們幫他裝了義肢，
05:25
and after a while, he went back
to work in the rice fields.
to work in the rice fields.
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一陣子之後，他又回到田裡工作。
但，很顯然，戴著義肢
05:28
But apparently, it's super painful
to work under water
to work under water
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在水中工作非常痛苦，
05:30
when you've got an artificial limb,
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05:32
and I'm guessing it was pretty traumatic
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我猜想，要他回到當初
被炸傷的稻田裡工作
被炸傷的稻田裡工作
05:34
to go back and work in the field
where he got blown up.
where he got blown up.
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也是件很難過的事。
05:36
The guy started to cry all day,
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這個人開始整天哭泣，
05:39
he refused to get out of bed,
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他拒絕下床，
05:40
he developed all the symptoms
of classic depression.
of classic depression.
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他出現了典型憂鬱症的所有病徵。
05:44
The Cambodian doctor said,
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柬埔寨醫生說：
05:45
"This is when we gave him
an antidepressant."
an antidepressant."
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「此時，我們給了他抗憂鬱劑。」
05:47
And Dr. Summerfield said,
"What was it?"
"What was it?"
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沙梅菲爾德博士問：「那是什麼？」
05:50
They explained that they went
and sat with him.
and sat with him.
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他們解釋，那就是他們去陪他坐坐。
05:53
They listened to him.
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他們傾聽他說話。
05:56
They realized that his pain made sense --
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他們了解他的痛苦是合情合理的——
05:59
it was hard for him to see it
in the throes of his depression,
in the throes of his depression,
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他在憂鬱的煎熬中很難看到這一點，
06:01
but actually, it had perfectly
understandable causes in his life.
understandable causes in his life.
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但其實，他生活中造成憂鬱的成因
是完全可以理解的。
是完全可以理解的。
06:05
One of the doctors, talking to the people
in the community, figured,
in the community, figured,
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其中一位醫生在跟
社區民眾談話時，想到：
社區民眾談話時，想到：
「如果我們買一頭牛給這個人，
他就能變成酪農，
他就能變成酪農，
06:09
"You know, if we bought this guy a cow,
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06:11
he could become a dairy farmer,
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06:13
he wouldn't be in this position
that was screwing him up so much,
that was screwing him up so much,
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他就不用待在讓他感覺
這麼糟的田裡工作了。」
這麼糟的田裡工作了。」
06:16
he wouldn't have to go
and work in the rice fields."
and work in the rice fields."
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所以他們買了一頭牛給他。
06:18
So they bought him a cow.
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幾週之內，他就不再哭泣了，
06:20
Within a couple of weeks,
his crying stopped,
his crying stopped,
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06:22
within a month, his depression was gone.
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一個月之內，憂鬱症也沒了。
06:24
They said to doctor Summerfield,
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他們對沙梅菲爾德博士說：
「博士，那頭牛就是抗憂鬱劑，
「博士，那頭牛就是抗憂鬱劑，
06:25
"So you see, doctor, that cow,
that was an antidepressant,
that was an antidepressant,
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那就是你的意思，對吧？」
06:28
that's what you mean, right?"
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06:30
(Laughter)
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（笑聲）（掌聲）
06:31
(Applause)
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06:34
If you'd been raised to think
about depression the way I was,
about depression the way I was,
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如果在座大部分的人在成長過成中
被灌輸的憂鬱症知識和我相同，
被灌輸的憂鬱症知識和我相同，
06:37
and most of the people here were,
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這聽起來會像是個爛笑話吧？
06:38
that sounds like a bad joke, right?
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「我去找醫生拿抗憂鬱劑，
她給了我一頭牛。」
她給了我一頭牛。」
06:40
"I went to my doctor
for an antidepressant,
for an antidepressant,
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06:42
she gave me a cow."
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06:43
But what those Cambodian
doctors knew intuitively,
doctors knew intuitively,
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但，那些柬埔寨醫生靠著直覺，
06:46
based on this individual,
unscientific anecdote,
unscientific anecdote,
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根據這個個案，
沒有科學根據的軼事，
沒有科學根據的軼事，
06:49
is what the leading
medical body in the world,
medical body in the world,
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就知道了世界上最重要的醫療組織，
06:53
the World Health Organization,
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世界衛生組織，
06:55
has been trying to tell us for years,
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根據最佳科學證據所得之結果，
06:57
based on the best scientific evidence.
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數年來持續在告訴我們的事。
07:00
If you're depressed,
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如果你感到憂鬱，
07:02
if you're anxious,
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如果你感到焦慮，
07:05
you're not weak, you're not crazy,
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你並不是軟弱，你並沒有發瘋，
07:08
you're not, in the main,
a machine with broken parts.
a machine with broken parts.
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基本上，你並不是零件故障的機器。
07:12
You're a human being with unmet needs.
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你是人類，只是有些需求未被滿足。
07:15
And it's just as important to think here
about what those Cambodian doctors
about what those Cambodian doctors
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這裡還有一點也同等重要，
要想想那些柬埔寨醫生
要想想那些柬埔寨醫生
及世界衛生組織並沒有說什麼。
07:19
and the World Health Organization
are not saying.
are not saying.
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他們沒有對這位農夫說：
07:21
They did not say to this farmer,
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07:23
"Hey, buddy, you need
to pull yourself together.
to pull yourself together.
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「嘿，老兄，你得要振作起來。
07:26
It's your job to figure out
and fix this problem on your own."
and fix this problem on your own."
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想辦法解決這個問題
是你自己的責任。」
是你自己的責任。」
07:29
On the contrary, what they said is,
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正好相反，他們說的是：
07:31
"We're here as a group
to pull together with you,
to pull together with you,
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「我們大家在此一起陪你振作起來，
07:35
so together, we can figure out
and fix this problem."
and fix this problem."
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我們同心協力就能
想辦法解決這個問題。」
想辦法解決這個問題。」
07:40
This is what every depressed person needs,
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這是每個憂鬱的人都需要的，
07:44
and it's what every
depressed person deserves.
depressed person deserves.
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也是每個憂鬱的人都應得的。
07:47
This is why one of the leading
doctors at the United Nations,
doctors at the United Nations,
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這就是為什麼聯合國
最頂尖的醫生之一
最頂尖的醫生之一
07:50
in their official statement
for World Health Day,
for World Health Day,
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在 2017 世界衛生日的官方聲明中，
07:53
couple of years back in 2017,
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07:54
said we need to talk less
about chemical imbalances
about chemical imbalances
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說我們需要少談一點化學失衡，
07:57
and more about the imbalances
in the way we live.
in the way we live.
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多談一點生活方式的失衡。
08:00
Drugs give real relief to some people --
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藥物的確能讓某些人喘口氣——
有段時間我確實得到舒緩——
有段時間我確實得到舒緩——
08:02
they gave relief to me for a while --
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08:05
but precisely because this problem
goes deeper than their biology,
goes deeper than their biology,
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但，正因為這個問題
超越生物學的範疇，
超越生物學的範疇，
08:09
the solutions need to go much deeper, too.
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因此解決方案也得要更深入。
08:12
But when I first learned that,
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但，當我初次聽到這些時，
08:15
I remember thinking,
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我記得我心想：
08:16
"OK, I could see
all the scientific evidence,
all the scientific evidence,
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「好，我看到了科學證據，
也閱讀了很多文獻，
也閱讀了很多文獻，
08:19
I read a huge number of studies,
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我訪問的很多專家
都解釋了這個狀況，」
都解釋了這個狀況，」
08:20
I interviewed a huge number of the experts
who were explaining this,"
who were explaining this,"
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但我不斷想著：
「我們怎麼可能辦到？」
「我們怎麼可能辦到？」
08:23
but I kept thinking, "How can we
possibly do that?"
possibly do that?"
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讓我們憂鬱的事物，
08:26
The things that are making us depressed
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大部分的情況下都比
柬埔寨農夫的狀況還要複雜。
柬埔寨農夫的狀況還要複雜。
08:28
are in most cases more complex
than what was going on
than what was going on
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08:30
with this Cambodian farmer.
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08:32
Where do we even begin with that insight?
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根據那個觀點的話，
我們要從何處著手進行呢？
我們要從何處著手進行呢？
08:34
But then, in the long journey for my book,
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但，在為自己寫書而踏上的
漫長世界之旅中，
08:38
all over the world,
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08:39
I kept meeting people
who were doing exactly that,
who were doing exactly that,
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我不斷遇到一些確實在這麼做的人，
08:42
from Sydney, to San Francisco,
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從雪黎、舊金山
08:44
to São Paulo.
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到聖保羅。
08:45
I kept meeting people
who were understanding
who were understanding
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我不斷遇到一些人，他們都了解
08:48
the deeper causes
of depression and anxiety
of depression and anxiety
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憂鬱症和焦慮症的更深層成因，
08:50
and, as groups, fixing them.
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且大家團結起來，解決它們。
08:52
Obviously, I can't tell you
about all the amazing people
about all the amazing people
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我無法跟各位聊所有這些
我遇到、寫出來的非凡人物，
我遇到、寫出來的非凡人物，
08:55
I got to know and wrote about,
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也無法談到我所了解造成
憂鬱症和焦慮症的九個成因，
憂鬱症和焦慮症的九個成因，
08:57
or all of the nine causes of depression
and anxiety that I learned about,
and anxiety that I learned about,
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他們不會讓我講十小時的
TED 演說 —— 你可以跟他們客訴。
TED 演說 —— 你可以跟他們客訴。
09:00
because they won't let me give
a 10-hour TED Talk --
a 10-hour TED Talk --
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09:03
you can complain about that to them.
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但我想把焦點放在兩個成因上，
09:04
But I want to focus on two of the causes
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09:06
and two of the solutions
that emerge from them, if that's alright.
that emerge from them, if that's alright.
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534813
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如果可以的話，再談兩個
從它們發展出來的解決方案。
從它們發展出來的解決方案。
09:10
Here's the first.
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第一個，
09:12
We are the loneliest society
in human history.
in human history.
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我們是人類史上最孤單的社會。
09:15
There was a recent study
that asked Americans,
that asked Americans,
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最近有一項研究，詢問美國人：
09:18
"Do you feel like you're no longer
close to anyone?"
close to anyone?"
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「你是否覺得你不再
和任何人親近了？」
和任何人親近了？」
39% 的人說他們正是如此。
「不再和任何人親近了。」
「不再和任何人親近了。」
09:21
And 39 percent of people
said that described them.
said that described them.
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09:25
"No longer close to anyone."
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09:26
In the international
measurements of loneliness,
measurements of loneliness,
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從孤單的國際測量指標來看，
09:28
Britain and the rest of Europe
are just behind the US,
are just behind the US,
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英國和歐洲其他地方
緊接在美國之後，
緊接在美國之後，
09:31
in case anyone here is feeling smug.
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所以各位也別沾沾自喜。
09:33
(Laughter)
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（笑聲）
09:34
I spent a lot of time discussing this
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我花了很多時間和世上
最頂尖的專家討論孤單這個議題，
最頂尖的專家討論孤單這個議題，
09:36
with the leading expert
in the world on loneliness,
in the world on loneliness,
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有位很了不起的人，
芝加哥的約翰‧卡喬波教授，
芝加哥的約翰‧卡喬波教授，
09:38
an incredible man
named professor John Cacioppo,
named professor John Cacioppo,
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09:40
who was at Chicago,
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他在研究中提出的
一個問題讓我想了很多。
一個問題讓我想了很多。
09:42
and I thought a lot about one question
his work poses to us.
his work poses to us.
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09:44
Professor Cacioppo asked,
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約翰卡喬波問：
09:47
"Why do we exist?
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「我們為什麼存在？
09:48
Why are we here, why are we alive?"
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我們為什麼在這裡，
為什麼活著？」
為什麼活著？」
09:50
One key reason
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一個重要理由
09:53
is that our ancestors
on the savannas of Africa
on the savannas of Africa
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就是我們在非洲無樹平原上的祖先
09:56
were really good at one thing.
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1720
非常擅長一件事。
09:58
They weren't bigger than the animals
they took down a lot of the time,
they took down a lot of the time,
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他們獵殺的動物
體型通常都比他們還大，
體型通常都比他們還大，
他們獵殺的動物
速度通常都比他們還快，
速度通常都比他們還快，
10:01
they weren't faster than the animals
they took down a lot of the time,
they took down a lot of the time,
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3313
但他們非常擅於組成團體
10:04
but they were much better
at banding together into groups
at banding together into groups
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2714
10:07
and cooperating.
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同心協力。
10:09
This was our superpower as a species --
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這是我們這個物種的超能力——
10:11
we band together,
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1405
我們會團結，
10:13
just like bees evolved to live in a hive,
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就像蜜蜂演化成居住在蜂巢中，
10:15
humans evolved to live in a tribe.
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人類演化成居住在部落中。
10:17
And we are the first humans ever
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我們是史上最早開始
10:22
to disband our tribes.
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拆散部落的人類。
10:24
And it is making us feel awful.
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這讓我們感覺糟透了。
10:27
But it doesn't have to be this way.
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但不一定要如此。
10:29
One of the heroes in my book,
and in fact, in my life,
and in fact, in my life,
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事實上，我書中和人生中的一位英雄
10:31
is a doctor named Sam Everington.
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是一位名為山姆‧艾佛林頓的醫生。
10:33
He's a general practitioner
in a poor part of East London,
in a poor part of East London,
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他是在東倫敦貧窮地區
執業的家庭醫生，
執業的家庭醫生，
10:36
where I lived for many years.
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我在那裡住過很多年。
10:38
And Sam was really uncomfortable,
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山姆感到很不舒服，
10:40
because he had loads of patients
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1556
他有很多病人來找他都是
因為嚴重的憂鬱症和焦慮症。
因為嚴重的憂鬱症和焦慮症。
10:41
coming to him with terrible
depression and anxiety.
depression and anxiety.
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2444
10:44
And like me, he's not opposed
to chemical antidepressants,
to chemical antidepressants,
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2722
他跟我一樣不反對化學抗憂鬱劑，
他認為藥物能讓部分人舒緩症狀。
10:46
he thinks they give
some relief to some people.
some relief to some people.
256
634863
2222
但他知道兩件事。
10:49
But he could see two things.
257
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1373
第一，
10:50
Firstly, his patients were depressed
and anxious a lot of the time
and anxious a lot of the time
258
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3555
大部分的時候，他的病人
會憂鬱和焦慮的理由是
完全可以理解的，比如孤單。
完全可以理解的，比如孤單。
10:54
for totally understandable
reasons, like loneliness.
reasons, like loneliness.
259
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3738
10:57
And secondly, although the drugs
were giving some relief to some people,
were giving some relief to some people,
260
645847
3444
第二，雖然藥物可以
舒緩某一部分人的症狀
舒緩某一部分人的症狀
但卻無法解決大多數人的問題，
11:01
for many people,
they didn't solve the problem.
they didn't solve the problem.
261
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2268
11:03
The underlying problem.
262
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1533
背後的問題。
11:05
One day, Sam decided
to pioneer a different approach.
to pioneer a different approach.
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2651
有一天，山姆決定
帶頭嘗試一種不同的方法。
帶頭嘗試一種不同的方法。
11:08
A woman came to his center,
his medical center,
his medical center,
264
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2452
一名女子來到他的中心，
他的醫療中心，
他的醫療中心，
11:11
called Lisa Cunningham.
265
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1467
她叫做麗莎‧康寧漢。
11:12
I got to know Lisa later.
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1874
我後來認識了麗莎。
11:14
And Lisa had been shut away in her home
with crippling depression and anxiety
with crippling depression and anxiety
267
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4084
因為麗莎有極嚴重的憂鬱症和焦慮症，
她一直被禁閉在家中，
她一直被禁閉在家中，
11:18
for seven years.
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1150
長達七年。
11:20
And when she came to Sam's center,
she was told, "Don't worry,
she was told, "Don't worry,
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2925
當她到山姆的中心時，
她被告知：「別擔心，
她被告知：「別擔心，
11:23
we'll carry on giving you these drugs,
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1830
我們會繼續給你那些藥物，
11:25
but we're also going to prescribe
something else.
something else.
271
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2797
但我們也會開其他的處方箋給妳。
11:28
We're going to prescribe for you
to come here to this center twice a week
to come here to this center twice a week
272
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3443
我們要開給你的處方箋，
是每週來這個中心兩次，
是每週來這個中心兩次，
11:31
to meet with a group of other
depressed and anxious people,
depressed and anxious people,
273
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2778
和一群也患有憂鬱和焦慮的人聚會，
11:34
not to talk about how miserable you are,
274
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2810
但不是要談你們有多可憐，
11:37
but to figure out something
meaningful you can all do together
meaningful you can all do together
275
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3547
而是要想出你們可以
一起做什麼有意義的事，
一起做什麼有意義的事，
11:41
so you won't be lonely and you won't feel
like life is pointless."
like life is pointless."
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這樣你們才不會覺得孤單，
不會覺得活著沒意思。」
不會覺得活著沒意思。」
11:44
The first time this group met,
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這群人初次見面時，
11:47
Lisa literally started
vomiting with anxiety,
vomiting with anxiety,
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麗莎因為焦慮症發作而開始嘔吐，
11:49
it was so overwhelming for her.
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這對她來說太難以招架了。
11:51
But people rubbed her back,
the group started talking,
the group started talking,
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但有人順撫她的背，
這群人開始談話，
這群人開始談話，
11:54
they were like, "What could we do?"
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702005
1675
他們說：「我們能做什麼？」
11:55
These are inner-city,
East London people like me,
East London people like me,
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2294
這些人像我一樣是市中心貧民區的
東倫敦人，不懂園藝。
東倫敦人，不懂園藝。
11:58
they didn't know anything about gardening.
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他們說：「一起學園藝如何？」
12:00
They were like, "Why don't we
learn gardening?"
learn gardening?"
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在醫生的辦公室後方
有一塊灌木叢林地。
有一塊灌木叢林地。
12:02
There was an area
behind the doctors' offices
behind the doctors' offices
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「我們何不把這塊地變成花園？」
12:04
that was just scrubland.
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1151
12:05
"Why don't we make this into a garden?"
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1882
他們開始去圖書館借書，
12:07
They started to take books
out of the library,
out of the library,
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開始看 YouTube 上的影片。
12:09
started to watch YouTube clips.
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他們開始把手伸進泥土裡。
12:11
They started to get
their fingers in the soil.
their fingers in the soil.
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2159
12:13
They started to learn
the rhythms of the seasons.
the rhythms of the seasons.
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他們開始學習季節的節奏。
12:16
There's a lot of evidence
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有很多證據顯示，
12:18
that exposure to the natural world
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接觸大自然世界就是
很強大的抗憂鬱劑。
很強大的抗憂鬱劑。
12:19
is a really powerful antidepressant.
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1976
12:21
But they started to do something
even more important.
even more important.
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但，他們開始做更重要的事。
12:25
They started to form a tribe.
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他們開始形成社群。
12:27
They started to form a group.
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他們開始形成團體。
12:29
They started to care about each other.
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他們開始關心彼此。
12:31
If one of them didn't show up,
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如果他們當中有人沒出現，
12:32
the others would go
looking for them -- "Are you OK?"
looking for them -- "Are you OK?"
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其他人會去找他，問：「你還好嗎？」
協助他找出那天讓他心煩的事。
12:35
Help them figure out
what was troubling them that day.
what was troubling them that day.
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麗莎是這樣跟我說的：
12:38
The way Lisa put it to me,
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746161
1803
12:39
"As the garden began to bloom,
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「當花園開始綻放，
12:42
we began to bloom."
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我們也開始綻放。」
12:44
This approach is called
social prescribing,
social prescribing,
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2032
這種方法叫做「社交處方」，
12:46
it's spreading all over Europe.
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在歐洲各地都有。
12:48
And there's a small,
but growing body of evidence
but growing body of evidence
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2301
目前證據不多，但在持續增加中，
12:50
suggesting it can produce real
and meaningful falls
and meaningful falls
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證明這個方法能真正且有意義地
讓憂鬱症和焦慮症的狀況減輕。
12:53
in depression and anxiety.
309
761298
1978
12:55
And one day, I remember
standing in the garden
standing in the garden
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3721
有一天，記得我站在花園裡，
12:59
that Lisa and her once-depressed
friends had built --
friends had built --
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767045
2481
麗莎和她曾經憂鬱的朋友
所建造的花園——
所建造的花園——
13:01
it's a really beautiful garden --
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1584
那個花園真的很美——
13:03
and having this thought,
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1191
當時我心想，
13:04
it's very much inspired by a guy
called professor Hugh Mackay in Australia.
called professor Hugh Mackay in Australia.
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3871
這個想法的靈感來自
澳洲的休伊‧麥凱教授。
澳洲的休伊‧麥凱教授。
13:08
I was thinking, so often
when people feel down in this culture,
when people feel down in this culture,
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776268
4381
我想通常在這種文化下，
當大家感到低潮時，
當大家感到低潮時，
13:12
what we say to them -- I'm sure
everyone here said it, I have --
everyone here said it, I have --
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780673
3064
我們會對他們說——
我相信大家都說過，我就有——
我相信大家都說過，我就有——
13:15
we say, "You just need
to be you, be yourself."
to be you, be yourself."
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3224
我們會說：「你只是需要
做自己，做你自己。」
做自己，做你自己。」
13:19
And I've realized, actually,
what we should say to people is,
what we should say to people is,
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787742
2950
我了解到，其實我們
應該是要對他們說：
應該是要對他們說：
13:22
"Don't be you.
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790716
1150
「不要做自己。
13:24
Don't be yourself.
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1333
不要做你自己。
13:26
Be us, be we.
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2209
做我們，成為我們。
13:28
Be part of a group."
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1325
成為團體的一份子。」
13:30
(Applause)
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3706
（掌聲）
13:33
The solution to these problems
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801844
2579
這些問題的解決方案
13:36
does not lie in drawing
more and more on your resources
more and more on your resources
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3151
不是更依賴你自個兒孤立的資源——
13:39
as an isolated individual --
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807622
1439
那是讓我們陷入這危機的部分原因。
13:41
that's partly what got us in this crisis.
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809085
2040
解決方案需要的是重新
和比自己更大的東西做連結。
和比自己更大的東西做連結。
13:43
It lies on reconnecting
with something bigger than you.
with something bigger than you.
328
811149
2753
13:45
And that really connects
to one of the other causes
to one of the other causes
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813926
2421
那就連結到了憂鬱症
和焦慮症的另一個成因，
和焦慮症的另一個成因，
13:48
of depression and anxiety
that I wanted to talk to you about.
that I wanted to talk to you about.
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2897
也是我要和大家談的。
大家都知道，
13:51
So everyone knows
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819292
1690
13:53
junk food has taken over our diets
and made us physically sick.
and made us physically sick.
332
821006
3746
垃圾食物主宰了我們的飲食，
讓我們的身體出現毛病。
讓我們的身體出現毛病。
13:56
I don't say that
with any sense of superiority,
with any sense of superiority,
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824776
2206
我並不是帶著優越感這麼說的。
13:59
I literally came to give
this talk from McDonald's.
this talk from McDonald's.
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827006
2399
我來這裡演講之前
真的是去吃了麥當勞。
真的是去吃了麥當勞。
14:01
I saw all of you eating that
healthy TED breakfast, I was like no way.
healthy TED breakfast, I was like no way.
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829429
3513
我看到大家都吃健康的 TED 早餐，
我心想...免談 。
14:04
But just like junk food has taken over
our diets and made us physically sick,
our diets and made us physically sick,
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832966
5143
但就像垃圾食物主宰了我們的
飲食，讓我們的身體出現毛病，
飲食，讓我們的身體出現毛病，
14:10
a kind of junk values
have taken over our minds
have taken over our minds
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838133
4110
某種垃圾價值觀也主宰了我們的大腦，
14:14
and made us mentally sick.
338
842267
1478
讓我們的心理出現毛病。
14:16
For thousands of years,
philosophers have said,
philosophers have said,
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844157
3104
數千年來都有哲學家說，
14:19
if you think life is about money,
and status and showing off,
and status and showing off,
340
847285
4588
如果你認為人生的重點就是金錢、
地位和炫耀，
14:23
you're going to feel like crap.
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851897
1523
你將會感覺糟透了。
14:25
That's not an exact quote
from Schopenhauer,
from Schopenhauer,
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853444
2067
那並非叔本華的原句，
但他說的意思大致就是如此。
14:27
but that is the gist of what he said.
343
855535
1772
14:29
But weirdly, hardy anyone
had scientifically investigated this,
had scientifically investigated this,
344
857331
3026
但很奇怪，幾乎沒有人
針對這點做科學研究，
針對這點做科學研究，
14:32
until a truly extraordinary person
I got to know, named professor Tim Kasser,
I got to know, named professor Tim Kasser,
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860381
3649
一直到我認識的一位
非凡人物，提姆‧卡瑟，
非凡人物，提姆‧卡瑟，
14:36
who's at Knox College in Illinois,
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864054
2293
伊利諾州諾克斯學院的教授，
14:38
and he's been researching this
for about 30 years now.
for about 30 years now.
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866371
2563
至今他研究這個主題
已有三十年的時間了。
已有三十年的時間了。
14:40
And his research suggests
several really important things.
several really important things.
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868958
3016
他的研究指出好幾個非常重要的重點。
14:43
Firstly, the more you believe
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871998
3191
首先，你越是相信
14:47
you can buy and display
your way out of sadness,
your way out of sadness,
350
875213
4365
你可以用金錢與炫耀來脫離悲傷，
14:51
and into a good life,
351
879602
2191
走入美好的生活，
14:53
the more likely you are to become
depressed and anxious.
depressed and anxious.
352
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2912
你就越有可能變得憂鬱和焦慮。
14:56
And secondly,
353
884753
1293
第二，
14:58
as a society, we have become
much more driven by these beliefs.
much more driven by these beliefs.
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886070
4588
我們這個社會
越來越被這些信念給影響和驅動。
15:02
All throughout my lifetime,
355
890682
1413
我一生中都處在
15:04
under the weight of advertising
and Instagram and everything like them.
and Instagram and everything like them.
356
892119
4193
廣告、IG 等等的壓力影響之下。
當在想這個議題時，我了解到，
15:08
And as I thought about this,
357
896871
1373
15:10
I realized it's like we've all been fed
since birth, a kind of KFC for the soul.
since birth, a kind of KFC for the soul.
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898268
5761
我們打從出生就一直
被餵食某種的心靈肯德基。
被餵食某種的心靈肯德基。
15:16
We've been trained to look for happiness
in all the wrong places,
in all the wrong places,
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904053
3873
我們都被訓練成
從錯誤的地方去尋找快樂，
從錯誤的地方去尋找快樂，
15:19
and just like junk food
doesn't meet your nutritional needs
doesn't meet your nutritional needs
360
907950
2770
就像垃圾食物無法滿足你的營養需求，
15:22
and actually makes you feel terrible,
361
910744
2298
還會讓你感覺更糟，
15:25
junk values don't meet
your psychological needs,
your psychological needs,
362
913066
3142
垃圾價值觀也無法滿足你的心理需求，
15:28
and they take you away from a good life.
363
916232
2642
且它們會讓你遠離美好生活。
15:30
But when I first spent time
with professor Kasser
with professor Kasser
364
918898
2623
但，當我初次和卡瑟教授相處時，
15:33
and I was learning all this,
365
921545
1477
我了解到所有這些，
15:35
I felt a really weird mixture of emotions.
366
923046
2587
當時覺得五味雜陳。
15:37
Because on the one hand,
I found this really challenging.
I found this really challenging.
367
925657
2690
因為一方面，我覺得這很有挑戰性。
15:40
I could see how often
in my own life, when I felt down,
in my own life, when I felt down,
368
928371
3262
瞭解到在我人生當中，
當我覺得沮喪時，
當我覺得沮喪時，
15:43
I tried to remedy it with some kind of
show-offy, grand external solution.
show-offy, grand external solution.
369
931657
5265
我有多常會以炫耀式的、
虛榮華麗的外在表象試圖去補償它。
15:49
And I could see why that
did not work well for me.
did not work well for me.
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937441
2690
我能理解為什麼
那種方式對我不太有用。
那種方式對我不太有用。
15:52
I also thought,
isn't this kind of obvious?
isn't this kind of obvious?
371
940930
2882
我也在想，這不是蠻明顯的嗎？
15:55
Isn't this almost like banal, right?
372
943836
1745
可說是很老套吧？
15:57
If I said to everyone here,
373
945605
1325
如果我對各位說，
15:58
none of you are going to lie
on your deathbed
on your deathbed
374
946954
2143
在臨終前，你不可能會去想著
16:01
and think about all the shoes you bought
and all the retweets you got,
and all the retweets you got,
375
949121
3316
你買過的鞋子、推文有多少轉推，
你會想著人生中有愛、
有意義、有連結的時刻。
有意義、有連結的時刻。
16:04
you're going to think about moments
376
952461
1683
16:06
of love, meaning
and connection in your life.
and connection in your life.
377
954168
2111
這幾乎是陳腔濫調了。
16:08
I think that seems almost like a cliché.
378
956303
1945
但我不斷和卡瑟教授談，並說：
16:10
But I kept talking
to professor Kasser and saying,
to professor Kasser and saying,
379
958272
2349
「我為何會感覺到
這種奇怪的雙重感？」
這種奇怪的雙重感？」
16:12
"Why am I feeling
this strange doubleness?"
this strange doubleness?"
380
960645
2353
16:15
And he said, "At some level,
we all know these things.
we all know these things.
381
963022
3807
他說：「在某種層面上，
我們都知道這些事。
我們都知道這些事。
16:18
But in this culture,
we don't live by them."
we don't live by them."
382
966853
2375
但在這文化中，我們
不依靠它們來過活。」
不依靠它們來過活。」
16:21
We know them so well
they've become clichés,
they've become clichés,
383
969252
2079
我們覺得那些都是老生常談，
卻不會依此過日子。
卻不會依此過日子。
16:23
but we don't live by them.
384
971355
1278
16:24
I kept asking why, why would we know
something so profound,
something so profound,
385
972657
3209
我一直問為何我們如此深刻地瞭解，
卻不依此來過日子？
卻不依此來過日子？
16:27
but not live by it?
386
975890
1286
16:29
And after a while,
professor Kasser said to me,
professor Kasser said to me,
387
977200
3404
一會兒之後，卡瑟教授對我說：
16:32
"Because we live in a machine
388
980628
2421
「因為我們生活在一台
16:35
that is designed to get us to neglect
what is important about life."
what is important about life."
389
983073
3733
設計成讓我們去忽略人生中
重要事物的機器中。」
重要事物的機器中。」
16:39
I had to really think about that.
390
987260
1587
我得好好想想那句話。
16:40
"Because we live in a machine
391
988871
1405
「因為我們生活在一台設計來
16:42
that is designed to get us
to neglect what is important about life."
to neglect what is important about life."
392
990300
3678
讓我們忽略人生中
重要事物的機器裡。」
重要事物的機器裡。」
16:46
And professor Kasser wanted to figure out
if we can disrupt that machine.
if we can disrupt that machine.
393
994299
3778
卡瑟教授想要知道
我們是否能瓦解這台機器。
我們是否能瓦解這台機器。
16:50
He's done loads of research into this;
394
998101
1873
他做了一大堆相關研究；
讓我舉個例子，
讓我舉個例子，
16:51
I'll tell you about one example,
395
999998
1555
我真心鼓勵大家試著
把這招用在朋友和家人身上。
把這招用在朋友和家人身上。
16:53
and I really urge everyone here
to try this with their friends and family.
to try this with their friends and family.
396
1001577
3500
16:57
With a guy called Nathan Dungan,
he got a group of teenagers and adults
he got a group of teenagers and adults
397
1005101
3342
有一個人叫奈森‧鄧肯，
他讓一群青少年和成人
他讓一群青少年和成人
17:00
to come together for a series of sessions
over a period of time, to meet up.
over a period of time, to meet up.
398
1008467
4213
在一段時間中參加一連串的聚會活動。
17:04
And part of the point of the group
399
1012704
1763
這個團體的目的之一，
17:06
was to get people to think
about a moment in their life
about a moment in their life
400
1014491
3300
是要讓大家想想他們人生中
真正具有意義和目的的時刻。
17:09
they had actually found
meaning and purpose.
meaning and purpose.
401
1017815
2746
17:12
For different people,
it was different things.
it was different things.
402
1020585
2143
大家的答案都不同。
有些人的答案是玩音樂、
寫作、幫助某人——
寫作、幫助某人——
17:14
For some people, it was playing music,
writing, helping someone --
writing, helping someone --
403
1022752
3617
17:18
I'm sure everyone here
can picture something, right?
can picture something, right?
404
1026393
2803
我相信各位都能想出一個答案吧？
17:21
And part of the point of the group
was to get people to ask,
was to get people to ask,
405
1029220
2881
這個團體還有個目的，
就是要讓大家去提問：
就是要讓大家去提問：
17:24
"OK, how could you dedicate
more of your life
more of your life
406
1032125
2762
「好，你要如何能奉獻更多的人生
17:26
to pursuing these moments
of meaning and purpose,
of meaning and purpose,
407
1034911
2684
去追尋這些有意義有目的的時刻，
17:29
and less to, I don't know,
buying crap you don't need,
buying crap you don't need,
408
1037619
2950
少把人生花在……
買你不需要的垃圾，
買你不需要的垃圾，
17:32
putting it on social media
and trying to get people to go,
and trying to get people to go,
409
1040593
2722
把它貼到社群媒體上讓大家說
『天啊，好羨慕喔！』」
『天啊，好羨慕喔！』」
17:35
'OMG, so jealous!'"
410
1043339
1267
17:36
And what they found was,
411
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1643
他們的發現是，
17:38
just having these meetings,
412
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1334
光是開這些會議，
17:39
it was like a kind of Alcoholics Anonymous
for consumerism, right?
for consumerism, right?
413
1047983
3110
這有點像是消費主義的
戒酒暱名聚會，對吧？
戒酒暱名聚會，對吧？
17:43
Getting people to have these meetings,
articulate these values,
articulate these values,
414
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2953
讓大家參與會議，
清楚表達這些價值觀，
清楚表達這些價值觀，
17:46
determine to act on them
and check in with each other,
and check in with each other,
415
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2531
下決心要身體力行、彼此督促，
17:49
led to a marked shift in people's values.
416
1057339
2857
最終讓大家的價值觀顯著地轉變。
17:52
It took them away from this hurricane
of depression-generating messages
of depression-generating messages
417
1060220
4413
帶我們遠離一直以來
訓練我們在錯的地方尋找快樂
訓練我們在錯的地方尋找快樂
17:56
training us to seek happiness
in the wrong places,
in the wrong places,
418
1064657
2634
而產生憂鬱情緒的暴風圈，
17:59
and towards more meaningful
and nourishing values
and nourishing values
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3341
轉向更有意義、更富營養的價值觀，
18:02
that lift us out of depression.
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2000
讓我們擺脫憂鬱症。
18:05
But with all the solutions that I saw
and have written about,
and have written about,
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3302
但，根據我看到並寫出來的
這些解決方案，
這些解決方案，
18:08
and many I can't talk about here,
422
1076673
2739
有許多我來不及在這裡談到，
18:11
I kept thinking,
423
1079436
1371
我不斷思考，
18:12
you know: Why did it take me so long
to see these insights?
to see these insights?
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3699
為什麼我花了這麼多時間
才能深刻理解這些真知灼見？
才能深刻理解這些真知灼見？
18:16
Because when you explain them to people --
425
1084554
2016
因為，向別人解釋這些時 ——
18:18
some of them are more
complicated, but not all --
complicated, but not all --
426
1086594
2444
有些比較複雜，
但並非全部都很複雜——
但並非全部都很複雜——
18:21
when you explain this to people,
it's not like rocket science, right?
it's not like rocket science, right?
427
1089062
3244
向別人解釋時，不會非常難理解吧？
某種程度上，
我們早就知這些道理。
我們早就知這些道理。
18:24
At some level, we already
know these things.
know these things.
428
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2095
18:26
Why do we find it so hard to understand?
429
1094449
2637
為什麼會這麼難理解？
18:29
I think there's many reasons.
430
1097110
1934
我想，理由有很多。
18:31
But I think one reason is
that we have to change our understanding
that we have to change our understanding
431
1099475
4269
但我認為其中一個理由是，
我們得要改變我們對
憂鬱症及焦慮症的了解。
憂鬱症及焦慮症的了解。
18:35
of what depression
and anxiety actually are.
and anxiety actually are.
432
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3420
18:39
There are very real
biological contributions
biological contributions
433
1107776
2182
生物因子的確對憂鬱症
和焦慮症有很明確的影響。
和焦慮症有很明確的影響。
18:41
to depression and anxiety.
434
1109982
1733
18:44
But if we allow the biology
to become the whole picture,
to become the whole picture,
435
1112117
3754
但如果我們讓生物因素
成為唯一的解答，
成為唯一的解答，
18:47
as I did for so long,
436
1115895
1246
像我長久以來認為的，我會說
還有文化層面所帶給我的影響，
還有文化層面所帶給我的影響，
18:49
as I would argue our culture
has done pretty much most of my life,
has done pretty much most of my life,
437
1117165
4065
18:53
what we're implicitly saying to people
is, and this isn't anyone's intention,
is, and this isn't anyone's intention,
438
1121254
3857
我們隱晦地在告訴人們說......
那不是任何人的本意，
那不是任何人的本意，
18:57
but what we're implicitly
saying to people is,
saying to people is,
439
1125135
3037
但我們在暗示大家的是：
19:00
"Your pain doesn't mean anything.
440
1128196
2302
「你的痛苦沒有任何意義。
19:02
It's just a malfunction.
441
1130522
1436
它只是一種故障。
19:03
It's like a glitch in a computer program,
442
1131982
2469
就像電腦程式會有小錯誤，
19:06
it's just a wiring problem in your head."
443
1134475
2667
只是你腦中的迴路出了點問題。
19:10
But I was only able to start
changing my life
changing my life
444
1138061
3107
但，我是在了解到憂鬱症
並不是一種故障之後，
並不是一種故障之後，
19:13
when I realized your depression
is not a malfunction.
is not a malfunction.
445
1141192
4065
我才有辦法開始改變我的人生。
19:18
It's a signal.
446
1146620
1150
它是個訊號。
19:20
Your depression is a signal.
447
1148684
2007
你的憂鬱症是個訊號。
19:23
It's telling you something.
448
1151077
1841
它有訊息要告訴你。
19:24
(Applause)
449
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4611
（掌聲）
19:29
We feel this way for reasons,
450
1157577
2389
我們會有這種感覺是有原因的，
19:31
and they can be hard to see
in the throes of depression --
in the throes of depression --
451
1159990
2715
在憂鬱的劇痛當中很難看見這些原因，
19:34
I understand that really well
from personal experience.
from personal experience.
452
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2610
有切身之痛的我非常能夠理解這點。
19:37
But with the right help,
we can understand these problems
we can understand these problems
453
1165363
3483
但，若有正確的協助，
我們就能了解這些問題
我們就能了解這些問題
19:40
and we can fix these problems together.
454
1168870
2474
並一起修正這些問題。
19:43
But to do that,
455
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1192
但，要做到這一點的第一步
19:44
the very first step
456
1172584
1738
就是要停止侮辱這些訊號，
19:46
is we have to stop insulting these signals
457
1174346
2618
19:48
by saying they're a sign of weakness,
or madness or purely biological,
or madness or purely biological,
458
1176988
4192
別再說它們是軟弱、瘋狂的象徵，
或單純生物的反應，
或單純生物的反應，
19:53
except for a tiny number of people.
459
1181204
1935
只有少部分的人是真的如此。
19:55
We need to start
listening to these signals,
listening to these signals,
460
1183163
3626
我們得要開始傾聽這些訊號，
19:58
because they're telling us
something we really need to hear.
something we really need to hear.
461
1186813
3272
因它們在告訴我們所需傾聽的警訊。
20:02
It's only when we truly
listen to these signals,
listen to these signals,
462
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5023
只有當我們能真正
傾聽這些訊號時，
傾聽這些訊號時，
20:07
and we honor these signals
and respect these signals,
and respect these signals,
463
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4015
當我們能尊重、重視這些訊號時，
20:11
that we're going to begin to see
464
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2247
我們才能夠開始看見
20:13
the liberating, nourishing,
deeper solutions.
deeper solutions.
465
1201871
4158
讓人解放、營養豐富
且更深刻的解決方案。
且更深刻的解決方案。
20:19
The cows that are waiting all around us.
466
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4073
到處都有牛在等著我們。
20:23
Thank you.
467
1211585
1181
謝謝。
20:24
(Applause)
468
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3688
（掌聲）
ABOUT THE SPEAKER
Johann Hari - JournalistJohann Hari spent three years researching the war on drugs; along the way, he discovered that addiction is not what we think it is.
Why you should listen
British journalist Johann Hari is the author of the New York Times best-selling book Chasing The Scream, from which his talk on addiction was adapted and for which he spent three years researching the war on drugs and questioning the ways in which we treat addiction.
He has written for many of the world’s leading newspapers and magazines, including The New York Times, Le Monde, The Guardian, New Republic, The Nation, Slate.com, and The Sydney Morning Herald. He was a columnist for the British newspaper The Independent for nine years.
Hari was twice named National Newspaper Journalist of the Year by Amnesty International, was named Gay Journalist of the Year at the Stonewall Awards -- and won the Martha Gellhorn Prize for political writing.
Johann Hari | Speaker | TED.com