TED Fellows Retreat 2013
Christopher Soghoian: Government surveillance — this is just the beginning
Kristofer Sogojan (Christopher Soghoian): Nadzor vlasti - ovo je tek početak
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Istraživač privatnosti Kristofer Sogojan gleda kako predeo vladinog nadgledanja izmiče pod našim stopalima, dok industrija raste da podrži programe nadgledanja. Kako on kaže, preko privatnih kompanija vlade kupuju tehnologiju sa kapacitetom provaljivanja u računare, krađe dokumenata i nadgledanja - bez otkrivanja. Ovaj član TED Fellows programa, pruža uznemirujući pogled na ono što dolazi.
Christopher Soghoian - Privacy researcher and activist
Christopher Soghoian researches and exposes the high-tech surveillance tools that governments use to spy on their own citizens, and he is a champion of digital privacy rights. Full bio
Christopher Soghoian researches and exposes the high-tech surveillance tools that governments use to spy on their own citizens, and he is a champion of digital privacy rights. Full bio
Double-click the English transcript below to play the video.
00:12
The 2011 Arab Spring
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Godine 2011, arapsko proleće
00:14
captured the attention of the world.
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privuklo je pažnju sveta.
00:16
It also captured the attention
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Takođe je privuklo pažnju
00:18
of authoritarian governments in other countries,
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diktatorskih vlada drugih zemalja,
00:20
who were worried that revolution would spread.
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koje su se zabrinule
da će se revolucija proširiti.
da će se revolucija proširiti.
00:23
To respond, they ramped up surveillance
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Kao odgovor, oni su pojačali nadzor
00:25
of activists, journalists and dissidents
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aktivista, novinara i disidenata,
00:28
who they feared would inspire revolution
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koji bi inspirisali revoluciju
00:30
in their own countries.
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u njihovim zemljama.
00:32
One prominent Bahraini activist,
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Jedan istaknuti aktivista iz Bahreina,
00:34
who was arrested and tortured by his government,
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kog je njegova vlada uhapsila i mučila,
00:36
has said that the interrogators showed him
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rekao je da su mu ispitivači pokazali
00:38
transcripts of his telephone calls
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transkripte njegovih telefonskih poziva
00:40
and text messages.
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i SMS poruka.
00:42
Of course, it's no secret
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Naravno, nije tajna
00:43
that governments are able to intercept
telephone calls and text messages.
telephone calls and text messages.
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da su vlade sposobne da presretnu
telefonske pozive i SMS poruke.
telefonske pozive i SMS poruke.
00:46
It's for that reason that many activists
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Zbog tog razloga mnogi aktivisti
00:49
specifically avoid using the telephone.
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naročito izbegavaju da koriste telefon.
00:51
Instead, they use tools like Skype,
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Umesto toga, oni koriste
alate poput Skajpa,
alate poput Skajpa,
00:53
which they think are immune to interception.
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za koje misle da su imuni
na presretanje.
na presretanje.
00:56
They're wrong.
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Greše.
00:57
There have now been over the last few years
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U poslednjih nekoliko godina,
pojavila se
pojavila se
01:00
an industry of companies
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industrija kompanija
01:02
who provide surveillance technology to governments,
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koje obezbeđuju vladama
tehnologiju za nadzor,
tehnologiju za nadzor,
01:05
specifically technology that
allows those governments
allows those governments
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naročito tehnologiju koja dozvoljava
tim vladama
tim vladama
01:07
to hack into the computers
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da hakuju kompjutere
01:09
of surveillance targets.
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meta nadzora.
01:11
Rather than intercepting the communications
as they go over the wire,
as they go over the wire,
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Umesto da presreću komunikacije
dok idu preko žice,
dok idu preko žice,
01:13
instead they now hack into your computer,
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oni sada hakuju vaš računar,
01:16
enable your webcam, enable your microphone,
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uključuju vašu veb-kameru,
vaš mikrofon,
vaš mikrofon,
01:18
and steal documents from your computer.
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i kradu dokumente sa vašeg računara.
01:20
When the government of Egypt fell in 2011,
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Kada je vlada Egipta pala 2011,
01:23
activists raided the office of the secret police,
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aktivisti su upali u prostorije
tajne policije,
tajne policije,
01:26
and among the many documents they found
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i među mnogim dokumentima
koje su našli,
koje su našli,
01:28
was this document by the Gamma Corporation,
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bio je ovaj dokument korporacije Gama,
01:31
by Gamma International.
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međunarodne Gama korporacije.
01:33
Gamma is a German company
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To je nemačka firma koja proizvodi
01:34
that manufactures surveillance software
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softver za nadgledanje
01:36
and sells it only to governments.
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i prodaje ga samo vladama.
01:38
It's important to note that most governments
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Važno je zabeležiti
da većina vlada
da većina vlada
01:40
don't really have the in-house capabilities
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zaista nema vlastite sposobnosti
01:42
to develop this software.
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da razvije ovaj softver.
01:43
Smaller ones don't have the resources
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Manje države nemaju sredstva
01:45
or the expertise,
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ili stručnjake,
01:47
and so there's this market of Western companies
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i zato postoji tržište
kompanija sa zapada,
kompanija sa zapada,
01:50
who are happy to supply them with the tools
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koje ih rado snabdevaju alatima
01:52
and techniques for a price.
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i tehnikama za određenu cenu.
01:54
Gamma is just one of these companies.
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Gama je samo jedna od ovih kompanija.
01:56
I should note also that Gamma never actually sold
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Takođe treba napomenuti
da Gama zapravo nikad nije prodala
da Gama zapravo nikad nije prodala
01:59
their software to the Egyptian government.
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svoj softver egipatskoj vladi.
02:01
They'd sent them an invoice for a sale,
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Poslali su im fakturu za prodaju,
02:04
but the Egyptians never bought it.
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ali Egipćani ga nikad nisu kupili.
02:05
Instead, apparently, the Egyptian government
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Egipatska vlada je zapravo izgleda
02:07
used a free demo version of Gamma's software.
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koristila besplatnu demo verziju
Gaminog softvera.
Gaminog softvera.
02:10
(Laughter)
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(Smeh)
02:13
So this screenshot is from a sales video
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Ova slika je iz reklamnog videa
02:16
that Gamma produced.
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koji je Gama proizvela.
02:18
Really, they're just emphasizing
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Zapravo, oni samo naglašavaju,
02:20
in a relatively slick presentation
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u relativno uglađenoj prezentaciji,
02:21
the fact that the police can sort of sit
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činjenicu da policija
otprilike može da sedi
otprilike može da sedi
02:23
in an air-conditioned office
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u klimatizovanoj kancelariji
02:25
and remotely monitor someone
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i sa udaljenosti nadgleda
02:26
without them having any idea that it's going on.
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nekoga ko nema pojma
o tome šta se događa.
o tome šta se događa.
02:28
You know, your webcam light won't turn on.
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Svetlo na vašoj vebkameri
neće se upaliti.
neće se upaliti.
02:30
There's nothing to indicate that
the microphone is enabled.
the microphone is enabled.
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Ne postoji ništa što ukazuje na to
da je vaš mikrofon uključen.
da je vaš mikrofon uključen.
02:34
This is the managing director
of Gamma International.
of Gamma International.
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Ovo je rukovodeći direktor
Gama Internešnala.
Gama Internešnala.
02:37
His name is Martin Muench.
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Njegovo ime je Martin Minh.
02:39
There are many photos of Mr. Muench that exist.
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Postoji mnogo fotografija
gospodina Minha.
gospodina Minha.
02:42
This is perhaps my favorite.
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Ova je možda meni omiljena.
02:44
I'm just going to zoom in a little bit onto his webcam.
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Zumiraću malo na njegovu veb-kameru.
02:46
You can see there's a little sticker
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Možete tu videti malu nalepnicu
02:48
that's placed over his camera.
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koja je postavljena preko kamere.
02:50
He knows what kind of surveillance is possible,
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On zna koja vrsta nadzora je moguća,
02:52
and so clearly he doesn't want it to be used
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i jasno da ne želi da se upotrebi
02:54
against him.
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protiv njega.
02:55
Muench has said that he intends
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Minh je rekao da je namera
02:57
for his software to be used
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njegovog softvera bila
02:59
to capture terrorists and locate pedophiles.
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hvatanje terorista i lociranje pedofila.
03:02
Of course, he's also acknowledged that once
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Naravno, takođe je priznao da jednom
03:04
the software has been sold to governments,
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kad softver proda vladama,
03:06
he has no way of knowing how it can be used.
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on nema načina da zna kako se koristi.
03:10
Gamma's software has been located on servers
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Gamin softver je lociran na serverima
03:12
in countries around the world,
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u zemljama celog sveta,
03:13
many with really atrocious track records
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u mnogim sa zaista svirepim
zapisima praćenjima
zapisima praćenjima
03:16
and human rights violations.
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i kršenjima ljudskih prava.
03:17
They really are selling their
software around the world.
software around the world.
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Oni zaista prodaju svoj softver
u celom svetu.
u celom svetu.
03:21
Gamma is not the only company in the business.
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Gama nije jedina kompanija u poslu.
03:23
As I said, it's a $5 billion industry.
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Kako sam rekao, to je industrija
od 5 milijardi dolara.
od 5 milijardi dolara.
03:26
One of the other big guys in the industry
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Jedan od drugih
velikih igrača u industriji
velikih igrača u industriji
03:29
is an Italian company called Hacking Team.
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je italijanska kompanija
zvana Haking Tim.
zvana Haking Tim.
03:31
Now, Hacking Team has what is probably
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Haking Tim ima verovatno
03:33
the slickest presentation.
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najuglađeniju prezentaciju.
03:35
The video they've produced is very sexy,
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Video koji su proizveli
je veoma seksi,
je veoma seksi,
03:38
and so I'm going to play you a clip
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i pustiću vam isečak
03:39
just so you can get a feel
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samo da biste stekli osećaj
03:41
both for the capabilities of the software
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o sposobnostima softvera,
03:42
but also how it's marketed
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ali i o tome kako se reklamira
03:44
to their government clients.
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svojim klijentima, vladama.
03:46
(Video) Narrator: You want to look
through your target's eyes.
through your target's eyes.
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(Video) Narator: Želite da gledate
kroz oči vaše mete.
kroz oči vaše mete.
03:50
(Music)
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(Muzika)
03:52
You have to hack your target.
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Morate hakovati vašu metu.
03:55
["While your target is browsing the web, exchanging documents, receiving SMS, crossing the borders"]
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["Dok ona pretražuje internet, razmenjuje
dokumente, prima SMS, prelazi granice"]
dokumente, prima SMS, prelazi granice"]
04:01
You have to hit many different platforms.
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Morate da pogodite
mnogo različitih platformi.
mnogo različitih platformi.
04:04
["Windows, OS X, iOS, Android,
Blackberry, Symbian, Linux"]
Blackberry, Symbian, Linux"]
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["Vindouz, OS X, iOS, Android,
Blekberi, Simbijan, Linuks"]
Blekberi, Simbijan, Linuks"]
04:08
You have to overcome encryption
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Morate prevazići enkripciju
04:10
and capture relevant data.
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i uhvatiti bitne podatke.
04:13
[Skype & encrypted calls, target location,
messaging, relationships,
messaging, relationships,
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[Skajp i šifrovani pozivi, lokacija mete,
poruke, veze,
poruke, veze,
04:18
web browsing, audio & video"]
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pretraživanje interneta, audio i video"]
04:21
Being stealth and untraceable.
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Biti u tajnosti i nemoguć za otkriti.
04:25
["Immune to any protection system
Hidden collection infrastructure"]
Hidden collection infrastructure"]
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["Imun na svaki sistem zaštite,
skrivenu kolekciju infrastrukture"]
skrivenu kolekciju infrastrukture"]
04:28
Deployed all over your country.
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Raspoređen po celoj vašoj zemlji.
04:32
["Up to hundreds of thousands of targets
Managed from a single spot"]
Managed from a single spot"]
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["Čak stotine hiljada meta
kontrolisane sa jednog mesta"]
kontrolisane sa jednog mesta"]
04:37
Exactly what we do.
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Tačno ono što radimo.
04:40
Christopher Soghoian: So, it
would be funny if it wasn't true,
would be funny if it wasn't true,
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Kristofer Sogojan: Bilo bi smešno
da nije istina,
da nije istina,
04:42
but, in fact, Hacking Team's software
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ali, u stvari, softver Haking tima
04:44
is being sold to governments around the world.
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se prodaje vladama širom sveta.
04:47
Last year we learned, for example,
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Prošle godine smo, na primer, saznali
04:49
that it's been used to target Moroccan
journalists by the Moroccan government.
journalists by the Moroccan government.
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da ga koristi marokanska vlast
za marokanske novinare.
za marokanske novinare.
04:53
Many, many countries it's been found in.
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Pronađen je u mnogim, mnogim zemljama.
04:56
So, Hacking Team has also been actively courting
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Haking Tim se aktivno udvarao
04:59
the U.S. law enforcement market.
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američkom tržištu za sprovođenje zakona.
05:01
In the last year or so, the company
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Otprilike u poslednjoj godini,
05:03
has opened a sales office in Maryland.
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kompanija je otvorila
prodajni prostor u Merilendu.
prodajni prostor u Merilendu.
05:08
The company has also hired a spokesperson.
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Takođe je zaposlila portparola.
05:10
They've been attending
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Oni posećuju konferencije
05:12
surveillance industry conferences
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industrije za nadgledanje
05:13
where law enforcement officials show up.
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gde se pojavljuju predstavnici zakona.
05:15
They've spoken at the conferences.
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Oni govore na konferencijama.
05:17
What I thought was most fascinating was
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Najfascinantnije mi je
05:19
they've actually paid for the coffee break
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da su oni zapravo platili
pauzu za kafu
pauzu za kafu
05:21
at one of the law enforcement conferences
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na jednoj od ovih konferencija
05:23
earlier this year.
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ranije ove godine.
05:24
I can't tell you for sure that Hacking Team
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Ne mogu vam reći sa sigurnošću
da je Haking Tim
da je Haking Tim
05:26
has sold their technology in the United States,
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prodao svoju tehnologiju
u Sjedinjenim Državama,
u Sjedinjenim Državama,
05:29
but what I can tell you that if they haven't sold it,
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ali mogu vam reći
da ako je nisu prodali,
da ako je nisu prodali,
05:31
it isn't because they haven't been trying hard.
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to nije zato što se nisu jako trudili.
05:34
So as I said before,
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Kao što sam već rekao,
05:36
governments that don't really have the resources
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vlade koje nemaju resurse
05:38
to build their own tools will buy
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da izgrade svoje alate, kupiće
05:40
off-the-shelf surveillance software,
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softver za nadzor sa tržišta
05:41
and so for that reason,
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i iz tog razloga,
05:43
you see that the government of, say, Tunisia,
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vidite da, recimo, vlada Tunisa,
05:45
might use the same software
as the government of Germany.
as the government of Germany.
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možda koristi isti softver
kao vlada Nemačke.
kao vlada Nemačke.
05:47
They're all buying off-the-shelf stuff.
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Svi oni kupuju sa tržišta.
05:50
The Federal Bureau of
Investigation in the United States
Investigation in the United States
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FBI u Sjedinjenim Državama
05:52
does have the budget to build
their own surveillance technology,
their own surveillance technology,
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ima budžet za izgradnju
vlastite tehnologije nadzora,
vlastite tehnologije nadzora,
05:55
and so for several years, I've been trying
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i tako sam nekoliko godina pokušavao
05:57
to figure out if and how the FBI
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da saznam da li i kako FBI
05:59
is hacking into the computers of surveillance targets.
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hakuje kompjutere meta nadzora.
06:02
My friends at an organization called
the Electronic Frontier Foundation --
the Electronic Frontier Foundation --
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Moji prijatelji iz organizacije
Fondacija Elektronskog Fronta -
Fondacija Elektronskog Fronta -
06:05
they're a civil society group —
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oni su grupa građana -
06:07
obtained hundreds of documents from the FBI
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dobili su stotine dokumenata od FBI
06:10
detailing their next generation
of surveillance technologies.
of surveillance technologies.
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sa detaljima o sledećoj generaciji
tehnologija za nadzor.
tehnologija za nadzor.
06:13
Most of these documents were heavily redacted,
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Veći deo ovih dokumenata
je prilično izmenjen,
je prilično izmenjen,
06:15
but what you can see from the slides,
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ali ono što možete da vidite sa slajdova,
06:18
if I zoom in, is this term:
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ako zumiram, je ovaj termin:
06:20
Remote Operations Unit.
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Jedinica za Daljinske Operacije.
06:22
Now, when I first looked into this,
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Kada sam ovo prvi put pogledao,
06:24
I'd never heard of this unit before.
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nikad pre nisam čuo za ovu jedinicu.
06:26
I've been studying surveillance
for more than six years.
for more than six years.
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Proučavam nadgledanje
više od šest godina.
više od šest godina.
06:28
I'd never heard of it.
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nikad nisam čuo za njih.
06:30
And so I went online and I did some research,
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Pa sam otišao onlajn i malo istraživao,
06:32
and ultimately I hit the mother lode
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i na kraju pogodio zlatnu žilu
06:34
when I went to LinkedIn,
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kada sam otišao na LinkedIn,
06:35
the social networking site for job seekers.
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društvenu mrežu za traženje posla.
06:38
There were lots of former
U.S. government contractors
U.S. government contractors
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Bilo je mnogo bivših radnika
vlade SAD-a
vlade SAD-a
06:41
who had at one point worked
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koji su nekad radili
06:42
for the Remote Operating Unit,
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u toj jedinici,
06:44
and were describing in surprising detail on their CVs
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3414
i opisivali su sa iznenađujućim detaljima
u svojim biografijama
u svojim biografijama
06:47
what they had done in their former job.
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šta su radili na tim
prethodnim poslovima.
prethodnim poslovima.
06:49
(Laughter)
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(Smeh)
06:51
So I took this information
171
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Uzeo sam te informacije
06:53
and I gave it to a journalist that I know
and trust at the Wall Street Journal,
and trust at the Wall Street Journal,
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i dao ih novinarki Vol Strit Žurnala
koju poznajem i kojoj verujem,
koju poznajem i kojoj verujem,
06:57
and she was able to contact several other
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1801
i ona je kontaktirala nekoliko drugih
06:59
former law enforcement officials
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bivših predstavnika zakona,
07:01
who spoke on background and confirmed
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1806
koji su potvrdili
07:02
that yes, in fact, the FBI has a dedicated team
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da zapravo, FBI ima posvećeni tim
07:06
that does nothing but hack into the computers
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2136
koji isključivo hakuje računare
07:08
of surveillance targets.
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meta nadzora.
07:09
Like Gamma and Hacking Team,
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Kao Gama i Haking Tim,
07:11
the FBI also has the capability
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2117
FBI takođe ima sposobnost
07:13
to remotely activate webcams, microphones,
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da sa udaljenosti aktivira
vebkamere, mikrofone,
vebkamere, mikrofone,
07:17
steal documents, get web browsing information,
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uzima dokumente i informacije
o pretraživanju
o pretraživanju
07:19
the works.
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i ostalo.
07:21
There's sort of a big problem
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1822
Postoji prilično veliki problem
07:23
with governments going into hacking,
185
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sa vladama koje ulaze u hakovanje,
07:24
and that's that terrorists, pedophiles,
186
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2519
a to je da teroristi, pedofili,
07:27
drug dealers, journalists and human rights activists
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2911
dileri drogom, novinari
i borci za ljudska prava
i borci za ljudska prava
07:30
all use the same kinds of computers.
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svi koriste iste vrste računara.
07:32
There's no drug dealer phone
189
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Ne postoji telefon za dilera droge
07:34
and there's no journalist laptop.
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1966
i ne postoji laptop za novinara.
07:36
We all use the same technology,
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2234
Svi koristimo istu tehnologiju,
07:38
and what that means then is that for governments
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1894
i to onda znači da vlade,
07:40
to have the capability to hack into the computers
193
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2117
da bi mogle da provale u računare
07:42
of the real bad guys,
194
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stvarno loših momaka,
07:44
they also have to have the capability
195
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takođe moraju imati sposobnost
07:46
to hack into our devices too.
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da provale i u naše uređaje.
07:48
So governments around the world
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Tako da su vlade širom sveta
07:50
have been embracing this technology.
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prigrlile ovu tehnologiju.
07:51
They've been embracing hacking
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Prigrlile su hakovanje
07:53
as a law enforcement technique,
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kao tehniku sprovođenja zakona,
07:55
but without any real debate.
201
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1950
ali bez ikakve prave rasprave.
07:57
In the United States, where I live,
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U sjedinjenim Državama, gde ja živim,
07:58
there have been no congressional hearings.
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1825
nije bilo saslušanja u kongresu.
08:00
There's no law that's been passed
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1961
Ne postoji odobreni zakon
08:02
specifically authorizing this technique,
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2073
koji posebno odobrava ovu tehniku,
08:04
and because of its power and potential for abuse,
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i zbog njene moći i potencijala
za zloupotrebu,
za zloupotrebu,
08:07
it's vital that we have an informed public debate.
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bitno je da imamo informisanu
javnu raspravu.
javnu raspravu.
08:10
Thank you very much.
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Mnogo vam hvala.
08:12
(Applause)
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(Aplauz)
ABOUT THE SPEAKER
Christopher Soghoian - Privacy researcher and activistChristopher Soghoian researches and exposes the high-tech surveillance tools that governments use to spy on their own citizens, and he is a champion of digital privacy rights.
Why you should listen
TED Fellow Christopher Soghoian is a champion of digital privacy rights, with a focus on the role that third-party service providers play in enabling governments to monitor citizens. As the principal technologist at the American Civil Liberties Union, he explores the intersection of federal surveillance and citizen's rights.
Before joining the ACLU, he was the first-ever technologist for the Federal Trade Commision's Division of Privacy and Identity Protection, where he worked on investigations of Facebook, Twitter, MySpace and Netflix. Soghoian is also the creator of Do Not Track, an anti-tracking device that all major web browsers now use, and his work has been cited in court.
Christopher Soghoian | Speaker | TED.com