TEDxBrisbane
George Blair-West: 3 ways to build a happy marriage and avoid divorce
喬治．布萊爾-韋斯特: 建立快樂婚姻和避免離婚的三種方式
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選擇和某個人結婚並和他共享你的一生，是人生中最重大的決策。但世界上有些地方的離婚率接近50%，很顯然我們能利用一些方法幫助我們挑選伴侶。在這場可化為行動且具有啟發性的演說中，精神病學家喬治．布萊爾-韋斯特分享了可以預防離婚的三項關鍵——且讓你在約會時就能先發現潛藏的問題。
George Blair-West - Psychiatrist
Dr. George Blair-West is an author, researcher and doctor specializing in psychiatry. Full bio
Dr. George Blair-West is an author, researcher and doctor specializing in psychiatry. Full bio
Double-click the English transcript below to play the video.
00:15
Almost 50 years ago,
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大約五十年前，
00:17
psychiatrists Richard Rahe
and Thomas Holmes developed an inventory
and Thomas Holmes developed an inventory
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精神病學家理查．拉希
和湯瑪斯．荷姆斯列出了一張
和湯瑪斯．荷姆斯列出了一張
排序了人類所能經歷
最痛苦事件的評量表。
最痛苦事件的評量表。
00:22
of the most distressing
human experiences that we could have.
human experiences that we could have.
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00:28
Number one on the list? Death of a spouse.
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排名第一的是什麼經歷？喪偶。
00:32
Number two, divorce.
Three, marital separation.
Three, marital separation.
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第二名：離婚。第三名：分居。
00:35
Now, generally, but not always,
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一般來說，但並不盡然，
00:38
for those three to occur, we need
what comes in number seven on the list,
what comes in number seven on the list,
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上述三種狀況會發生的前提是
先要有排行第七名的經歷：
先要有排行第七名的經歷：
00:42
which is marriage.
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婚姻。
00:44
(Laughter)
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（笑聲）
00:46
Fourth on the list is imprisonment
in an institution.
in an institution.
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第四名是被監禁在一個機構中。
00:51
Now, some say number seven
has been counted twice.
has been counted twice.
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有人說這和第七名的項目重覆了。
00:54
(Laughter)
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（笑聲）
00:58
I don't believe that.
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我不這麼認為。
01:00
When the life stress inventory was built,
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在人生壓力量表出現的那個時代，
01:04
back then, a long-term relationship
pretty much equated to a marriage.
pretty much equated to a marriage.
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一段長期的關係就等同於婚姻。
01:10
Not so now.
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現在就不見得了。
所以在這場演說中，
所以在這場演說中，
01:11
So for the purposes of this talk,
I'm going to be including
I'm going to be including
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我會納入……
01:16
de facto relationships,
common-law marriages
common-law marriages
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同居關係、普通法婚姻、
01:18
and same-sex marriages,
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同性婚姻，
01:21
or same-sex relationships
soon hopefully to become marriages.
soon hopefully to become marriages.
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或是有希望很快就能
變成婚姻的同性關係。
變成婚姻的同性關係。
01:26
And I can say from my work
with same-sex couples,
with same-sex couples,
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根據我在工作中
和同性伴侶的互動瞭解，
和同性伴侶的互動瞭解，
01:28
the principles I'm about
to talk about are no different.
to talk about are no different.
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我可以說接下來要談的原則
不會因性向而有所不同。
不會因性向而有所不同。
01:32
They're the same across all relationships.
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這些原則適用於各種關係。
01:35
So in a modern society,
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在現代社會，
01:38
we know that prevention
is better than cure.
is better than cure.
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我們都知道預防勝於治療。
01:42
We vaccinate against polio, diphtheria,
tetanus, whooping cough, measles.
tetanus, whooping cough, measles.
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我們打疫苗來預防小兒麻痺、
白喉、破傷風、百日咳、麻疹。
白喉、破傷風、百日咳、麻疹。
01:47
We have awareness campaigns
for melanoma, stroke, diabetes --
for melanoma, stroke, diabetes --
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對於黑色素瘤、中風、糖尿病，
我們都有舉辦宣導活動——
我們都有舉辦宣導活動——
01:51
all important campaigns.
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都是重要的活動。
01:54
But none of those conditions come close
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但這些疾病沒有一樣會影響到
01:58
to affecting 45 percent of us.
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45% 的我們。
02:02
Forty-five percent: that's
our current divorce rate.
our current divorce rate.
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45%：那是我們目前的離婚率。
02:06
Why no prevention campaign for divorce?
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為什麼沒有針對離婚做的預防活動？
02:11
Well, I think it's because
our policymakers don't believe
our policymakers don't believe
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我認為原因是因為
我們的政策制訂者不相信
我們的政策制訂者不相信
02:17
that things like attraction
and the way relationships are built
and the way relationships are built
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吸引力和營建關係等這類東西，
02:22
is changeable or educable.
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是可以改變或可以教育的。
02:25
Why?
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為什麼？
02:27
Well, our policymakers currently
are Generation X.
are Generation X.
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目前，我們的政策制訂者
是 X 世代的人。
是 X 世代的人。
02:31
They're in their 30s to 50s.
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他們年約三十幾歲到五十幾歲。
02:34
And when I'm talking to these guys
about these issues,
about these issues,
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當我和他們談到這些議題時，
02:38
I see their eyes glaze over,
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我會看到他們目光變呆滯，
02:40
and I can see them thinking,
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我知道他們在想：
02:42
"Doesn't this crazy psychiatrist get it?
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「這個瘋精神病學家難道不懂嗎？
02:45
You can't control the way in which
people attract other people
people attract other people
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我們無法控制人與人相互吸引
以及建立關係的方式。」
02:49
and build relationships."
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02:52
Not so, our dear millennials.
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不是這樣的，親愛的千禧世代。
02:55
This is the most information-connected,
analytical and skeptical generation,
analytical and skeptical generation,
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這是資訊連結最緊密、最具分析
和懷疑精神的世代，
和懷疑精神的世代，
03:01
making the most informed decisions
of any generation before them.
of any generation before them.
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比起先前的任何世代都能
做出更明智的決策。
做出更明智的決策。
03:06
And when I talk to millennials,
I get a very different reaction.
I get a very different reaction.
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當我和千禧世代談話時，
我得到非常不同的反應。
我得到非常不同的反應。
03:10
They actually want to hear about this.
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他們會很想要聽這件事。
他們想知道我們如何
才能維持長久的關係？
才能維持長久的關係？
03:12
They want to know about how do we
have relationships that last?
have relationships that last?
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03:18
So for those of you who want to embrace
the post- "romantic destiny" era with me,
the post- "romantic destiny" era with me,
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所以，如果你想和我一起
擁抱後「浪漫邂逅」時代，
擁抱後「浪漫邂逅」時代，
03:23
let me talk about my three life hacks
for preventing divorce.
for preventing divorce.
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讓我來談談避免離婚的
三項人生秘技。
三項人生秘技。
03:28
Now, we can intervene
to prevent divorce at two points:
to prevent divorce at two points:
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我們可在以下的兩個時點
介入以預防離婚：
介入以預防離婚：
03:32
later, once the cracks begin to appear
in an established relationship;
in an established relationship;
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後期，在已確立的關係出現裂痕時；
03:37
or earlier, before we commit,
before we have children.
before we have children.
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或早期，在做出承諾之前，
在生孩子之前。
在生孩子之前。
03:42
And that's where I'm going to take us now.
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我現在就要來跟大家談談這些。
03:46
So my first life hack:
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所以，我的第一項人生秘技：
03:48
millennials spend seven-plus hours
on their devices a day.
on their devices a day.
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千禧世代每天會花七個小時以上
在他們的電子裝置。
在他們的電子裝置。
03:54
That's American data.
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那是美國的資料。
03:56
And some say, probably not unreasonably,
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有些人認為，可能不無道理，
03:58
this has probably affected
their face-to-face relationships.
their face-to-face relationships.
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這個現象可能會影響到
他們面對面的關係。
他們面對面的關係。
04:03
Indeed, and add to that
the hookup culture,
the hookup culture,
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的確，再加上配對文化，
04:06
ergo apps like Tinder,
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Tinder 這類約會應用程式，
04:08
and it's no great surprise that
the 20-somethings that I work with
the 20-somethings that I work with
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我並不意外，當工作上
遇到的二十多歲年輕人
遇到的二十多歲年輕人
04:12
will often talk to me about
how it is often easier for them
how it is often easier for them
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常常會跟我談到，
通常對他們來說，和認識的人上床
04:16
to have sex with somebody that they've met
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比和他們做有意義的談話更為容易。
04:18
than have a meaningful conversation.
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04:21
Now, some say this is a bad thing.
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有些人認為這不是好事。
04:24
I say this is a really good thing.
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我會說這是件很好的事。
04:28
It's a particularly good thing
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特別好的一點就是
04:31
to be having sex outside
of the institution of marriage.
of the institution of marriage.
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能夠在婚姻的制度之外發生性行為。
04:35
Now, before you go out
and get all moral on me,
and get all moral on me,
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在你們以道德來訓誡我之前，
04:38
remember that Generation X,
in the American Public Report,
in the American Public Report,
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別忘了，根據美國公眾報告，
04:42
they found that 91 percent of women
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他們發現 X 世代中
有 91% 的女性
有 91% 的女性
04:45
had had premarital sex by the age of 30.
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在三十歲之前就有過婚前性行為。
04:48
Ninety-one percent.
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91%。
04:51
It's a particularly good thing that
these relationships are happening later.
these relationships are happening later.
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特別好的一點就是，
關係建立是在之後才發生的。
關係建立是在之後才發生的。
04:56
See, boomers in the '60s --
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六 ○ 年代嬰兒潮出生的人——
04:59
they were getting married
at an average age for women of 20
at an average age for women of 20
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他們平均的結婚年齡是：
女性二十歲，
女性二十歲，
05:03
and 23 for men.
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男性二十三歲。
05:05
2015 in Australia?
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2015 年澳洲的狀況呢？
05:07
That is now 30 for women and 32 for men.
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女性三十歲，男性三十二歲。
05:13
That's a good thing, because
the older you are when you get married,
the older you are when you get married,
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那是件好事，
因為等年紀較長再結婚，
因為等年紀較長再結婚，
05:19
the lower your divorce rate.
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你的離婚率會比較低。
為什麼？為什麼
晚點結婚是有幫助的？
晚點結婚是有幫助的？
05:21
Why?
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05:22
Why is it helpful to get married later?
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05:24
Three reasons.
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有三個理由。第一：
05:25
Firstly, getting married later allows
the other two preventers of divorce
the other two preventers of divorce
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晚婚能讓另外兩項
預防離婚的元素發揮作用。
預防離婚的元素發揮作用。
05:30
to come into play.
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05:31
They are tertiary education
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這兩項元素分別是高等教育
05:34
and a higher income, which tends
to go with tertiary education.
to go with tertiary education.
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及更高的收入，
這項通常和高等教育有關。
這項通常和高等教育有關。
05:38
So these three factors all
kind of get mixed up together.
kind of get mixed up together.
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所以這三個因子彼此都有些關聯。
05:41
Number two,
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第二，
05:42
neuroplasticity research tell us
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神經可塑性研究告訴我們，
05:44
that the human brain is still growing
until at least the age of 25.
until at least the age of 25.
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人類大腦會一直成長到
至少二十五歲。
05:51
So that means how you're thinking
and what you're thinking
and what you're thinking
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那就表示你的思考方式和思考內容
在二十五歲之前仍然在改變。
05:54
is still changing up until 25.
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05:57
And thirdly, and most importantly
to my mind, is personality.
to my mind, is personality.
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第三，也是我認為最重要的，
就是人格。
就是人格。
06:00
Your personality at the age of 20
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你在二十歲時的人格
06:03
does not correlate with
your personality at the age of 50.
your personality at the age of 50.
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和你在五十歲時的人格
並沒有相關性。
並沒有相關性。
06:07
But your personality at the age of 30
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但你在三十歲時的人格
06:09
does correlate with
your personality at the age of 50.
your personality at the age of 50.
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和你在五十歲時的
人格確實有相關性。
人格確實有相關性。
06:13
So when I ask somebody
who got married young why they broke up,
who got married young why they broke up,
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當我問早婚的人，為什麼會分手 ?
他們會說：「我們漸行漸遠。」
06:16
and they say, "We grew apart,"
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06:18
they're being surprisingly accurate,
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這說法其實非常正確，
06:20
because the 20s is a decade
of rapid change and maturation.
of rapid change and maturation.
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因為二十多歲，
是快速改變和成熟的時期。
是快速改變和成熟的時期。
所以，想結婚前你該做的
第一件事就是：變老。
第一件事就是：變老。
06:25
So the first thing you want to get
before you get married is older.
before you get married is older.
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06:30
(Laughter)
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（笑聲）
06:34
Number two,
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第二，
06:35
John Gottman, psychologist
and relationship researcher,
and relationship researcher,
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約翰．高特曼是位心理學家
和關係研究者，
和關係研究者，
06:40
can tell us many factors that correlate
with a happy, successful marriage.
with a happy, successful marriage.
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能告訴我們許多快樂、
成功婚姻的相關要素。
成功婚姻的相關要素。
06:46
But the one that I want to talk about
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但我想要談的是一個重大要素，
06:48
is a big one:
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06:50
81 percent of marriages implode,
self-destruct, if this problem is present.
self-destruct, if this problem is present.
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如果有這個問題出現，
81% 的婚姻都會潰堤
導致自我毀滅。
導致自我毀滅。
06:56
And the second reason why I want
to talk about it here
to talk about it here
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我想要在這裡談它的第二個理由
是因為你在約會時就可以評估它。
06:59
is because it's something
you can evaluate while you're dating.
you can evaluate while you're dating.
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07:03
Gottman found that the relationships
that were the most stable and happy
that were the most stable and happy
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高特曼發現，
最穩定、快樂且較長久的關係，
07:08
over the longer term
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是夫妻能夠共享權力的婚姻。
07:10
were relationships in which
the couple shared power.
the couple shared power.
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07:14
They were influenceable:
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他們能相互影響：
07:18
big decisions, like buying a house,
overseas trips, buying a car,
overseas trips, buying a car,
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重大決策，比如買房子、
出國旅行、買車子、
出國旅行、買車子、
07:23
having children.
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生孩子。
07:24
But when Gottman
drilled down on this data,
drilled down on this data,
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但當高特曼深入分析這些資料，
07:27
what he found was that women
were generally pretty influenceable.
were generally pretty influenceable.
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他發現女性通常很容易受影響。
07:33
Guess where the problem lay?
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猜猜問題在哪裡？
07:35
(Laughter)
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（笑聲）
07:36
Yeah, there's only
two options here, isn't there?
two options here, isn't there?
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是的，只有兩個選項，對吧？
07:39
Yeah, we men were to blame.
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是的，要怪我們男人。
07:42
The other thing that Gottman found
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高特曼還有一項發現，
07:44
is that men who are influenceable
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能夠受影響的男性
07:48
also tended to be "outstanding fathers."
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也傾向會成為「出色的爸爸」。
07:53
So women: How influenceable is your man?
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所以，女性們：妳的男人
會受妳多少的影響？
會受妳多少的影響？
07:58
Men:
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男性們：
08:03
you're with her because you respect her.
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你和她在一起是因為你尊重她，
08:07
Make sure that respect plays out
in the decision-making process.
in the decision-making process.
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請確保自己在做決策的過程中
也能展現出那份尊重。
也能展現出那份尊重。
08:14
Number three.
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第三，
08:19
I'm often intrigued by
why couples come in to see me
why couples come in to see me
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通常我很好奇那些已經有
08:23
after they've been married
for 30 or 40 years.
for 30 or 40 years.
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三十或四十年婚齡的夫妻，
為何還來找我。
為何還來找我。
08:26
This is a time when they're approaching
the infirmities and illness of old age.
the infirmities and illness of old age.
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這是他們面臨體弱和疾病的高齡期。
08:31
It's a time when they're particularly
focused on caring for each other.
focused on caring for each other.
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這個是他們會特別重視
照護彼此的時期。
照護彼此的時期。
08:37
They'll forgive things
that have bugged them for years.
that have bugged them for years.
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他們會寬恕那些多年來
煩擾他們的事情。
煩擾他們的事情。
08:40
They'll forgive all betrayals,
even infidelities,
even infidelities,
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他們會寬恕背叛，甚至不忠，
08:43
because they're focused
on caring for each other.
on caring for each other.
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因為他們把焦點放在照顧彼此。
所以，是什麼讓他們分離？
所以，是什麼讓他們分離？
08:46
So what pulls them apart?
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08:47
The best word I have
for this is reliability,
for this is reliability,
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我能想到最理想的詞是：可靠度，
08:50
or the lack thereof.
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或是說缺乏可靠度。
08:52
Does your partner have your back?
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你的另一半能當你的靠山嗎？
這有兩種形式。
這有兩種形式。
08:54
It takes two forms.
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08:55
Firstly, can you rely on your partner
to do what they say they're going to do?
to do what they say they're going to do?
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第一，你能不能仰賴你的另一半，
相信他會說到做到？
09:01
Do they follow through?
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他們能堅持到底嗎？
09:03
Secondly,
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第二，
09:06
if, for example,
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舉例來說，
09:08
you're out and you're being
verbally attacked by somebody,
verbally attacked by somebody,
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若你在外面被人言語攻擊，
09:10
or you're suffering from
a really disabling illness,
a really disabling illness,
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或是你得了失能的疾病，
09:16
does your partner step up
and do what needs to be done
and do what needs to be done
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你的另一半會義無反顧地
扛起保護和照顧的責任，
扛起保護和照顧的責任，
09:19
to leave you feeling
cared for and protected?
cared for and protected?
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讓你感受到關愛與呵護？
09:23
And here's the rub:
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困難處在這裡：
09:25
if you're facing old age,
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如果你步入老年，
09:27
and your partner
isn't doing that for you --
isn't doing that for you --
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而你的另一半沒有為你做這些——
09:29
in fact, you're having
to do that for them --
to do that for them --
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事實上，是你得要為他們做這些 ——
09:32
then in an already-fragile relationship,
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那麼，在已經很脆弱的關係中，
09:35
it can look a bit like you might
be better off out of it rather than in it.
be better off out of it rather than in it.
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你可能就會覺得，脫離關係
會比留在關係中更好些。
會比留在關係中更好些。
09:41
So is your partner there for you
when it really matters?
when it really matters?
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所以，
在重要的時刻，
你的另一半會陪在你身邊嗎？
你的另一半會陪在你身邊嗎？
09:49
Not all the time, 80 percent of the time,
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不用隨時都在，
80% 的時候要在，
80% 的時候要在，
09:51
but particularly if it's important to you.
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特別是對你而言很重要的時候。
09:55
On your side, think carefully before you
commit to do something for your partner.
commit to do something for your partner.
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在你這一邊，
在你對另一半承諾之前要謹慎思考。
10:01
It is much better to commit to
as much as you can follow through
as much as you can follow through
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量力而為地履行承諾，
比輕諾寡信卻事後讓人失望，
10:05
than to commit to more
sound-good-in-the-moment
sound-good-in-the-moment
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10:08
and then let them down.
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要好太多。
10:14
And if it's really important
to your partner, and you commit to it,
to your partner, and you commit to it,
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如果你承諾了某件對你的
另一半而言是很重要的事，
另一半而言是很重要的事，
10:18
make sure you move hell
and high water to follow through.
and high water to follow through.
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要確保自己就算上刀山
下油鍋也得堅持到底。
下油鍋也得堅持到底。
10:21
Now, these are things
that I'm saying you can look for.
that I'm saying you can look for.
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這些是你們可以注意的事情。
10:24
Don't worry, these are also
things that can be built
things that can be built
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別擔心，這些在現存的關係中，
也可以建構出來。
10:27
in existing relationships.
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10:32
I believe that the most important decision
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我相信，你所能做出
10:37
that you can make
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最重要的決策
10:38
is who you choose as a life partner,
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就是選擇人生的伴侶，
10:43
who you choose as
the other parent of your children.
the other parent of your children.
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你要選擇誰來當孩子的家長？
10:47
And of course, romance has to be there.
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當然，一定要有愛情的成分。
10:49
Romance is a grand and beautiful
and quirky thing.
and quirky thing.
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愛情是種令人愉悅、美好
卻又變幻莫測的東西。
卻又變幻莫測的東西。
10:54
But we need to add
to a romantic, loving heart
to a romantic, loving heart
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但除了要有浪漫、懂愛的心之外，
10:59
an informed, thoughtful mind,
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我們還要有顆明智細心的大腦，
11:03
as we make the most important
decision of our life.
decision of our life.
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才能為我們的人生
做出最重要的決策。
做出最重要的決策。
11:06
Thank you.
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謝謝。
11:07
(Applause)
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（掌聲）
ABOUT THE SPEAKER
George Blair-West - PsychiatristDr. George Blair-West is an author, researcher and doctor specializing in psychiatry.
Why you should listen
Dr. George Blair-West specializes in psychiatry in private practice in Brisbane, Australia. He sub-specializes in trauma and relationship/sex therapy. His abiding interest is distilling the latest psychotherapeutic research, honing these insights for impactful delivery through his clinical work, and then sharing them with the greater population.
In the 1990s, as a Senior Lecturer at the University of Queensland, Blair-West published widely on suicide and depression. Needing to lose weight himself, he then turned his focus to the overlooked research into the psychological forces that prevent weight loss. The bestselling book Weight Loss for Food Lovers: Understanding Our Minds and Why We Sabotage Our Weight Loss (translated into Dutch and Chinese) along with related research papers resulted in keynote addresses, a regular spot on the Australian breakfast show Today and media appearances around the world. A children's book on teaching healthy eating habits followed, and in 2010 Blair-West was named one of the "top 20 most influential obesity experts in the world."
Blair-West's 2013 novel The Way of The Quest received three international awards and was about the "how to" of finding one's meaning and purpose in life while building healthy relationships.
Helping people make sense of relationships is Blair-West's most important work. Drawing on his 25 years as a relationship therapist, he is currently writing his fourth book, How to Make the Biggest Decision of Your Life with his daughter Jiveny Blair-West, a dating coach. He and his wife Penny, a psychologist, celebrated 30 years of marriage in 2018.
George Blair-West | Speaker | TED.com