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TEDWomen 2010

Rufus Griscom + Alisa Volkman: Let's talk parenting taboos

ルーファス・グリスコムとアリサ・ヴォルクマン : 子育てのタブーを語ろう

December 8, 2010

バブルドットコムの設立者であるラファス・グリスコムとアリサ・ヴォルクマンは、子を持つ親達が絶対に認めない4つの事実を、また彼らがそれらを認めなければならない理由を、生き生きとしたコンビネーションの中で明らかにする。子を持つ親だけでなく、そうでない者にも向けられた、愉快で本音あふれるトークである。

Rufus Griscom + Alisa Volkman - Website co-founders
Rufus Griscom and Alisa Volkman co-founded Babble, a website for parents. He’s the CEO, she’s the VP of sales strategy and brand development, and they have three sons. Full bio

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Double-click the English subtitles below to play the video.
Alisa Volkman: So this is where our story begins --
アリサ(以下AV):これが全ての始まり
00:18
the dramatic moments of the birth
私たちの第一子デクラン誕生の
00:21
of our first son, Declan.
劇的な瞬間です
00:23
Obviously a really profound moment,
素晴らしい体験は
00:25
and it changed our lives in many ways.
私たちの人生を変えました
00:27
It also changed our lives in many unexpected ways,
中には想定外のことも多くあり
00:29
and those unexpected ways we later reflected on,
後にそれらを振り返ってみることで
00:31
that eventually spawned a business idea between the two of us,
新たなビジネスが思いつきました
00:34
and a year later, we launched Babble,
そして1年後 親のためのウェブサイト
00:36
a website for parents.
Babbleを立ち上げたのです
00:38
Rufus Griscom: Now I think of our story
ルーファス(以下RG):この物語は
00:40
as starting a few years earlier. AV: That's true.
その数年前に始まります (AV:確かに)
00:42
RG: You may remember, we fell head over heels in love.
覚えてるかな 僕らは恋に落ちたよね
00:45
AV: We did.
AV:そうね
00:48
RG: We were at the time running a very different kind of website.
RG:当時は今とかなり異なるウェブサイト
00:50
It was a website called Nerve.com,
Nerve.comを運営していました
00:52
the tagline of which was "literate smut."
キャッチフレーズは「洗練されたエロ本」
00:54
It was in theory, and hopefully in practice,
性と文化を扱った 知的なオンラインマガジンを
00:57
a smart online magazine
目指したもので 実際
01:00
about sex and culture.
そのとおりのものでした
01:02
AV: That spawned a dating site.
AV:それがある出会い系サイトの元になりました
01:05
But you can understand the jokes that we get. Sex begets babies.
冗談で「セックスで子供が生まれた」や
01:08
You follow instructions on Nerve and you should end up on Babble,
「Nerveについて行ったらBabbleに着いた」など
01:10
which we did.
も言われました
01:13
And we might launch a geriatric site as our third. We'll see.
次は高齢者向けサイトを立ち上げるかもしれません
01:15
RG: But for us, the continuity between Nerve and Babble
RG:でも私たちにとって二つのサイトの共通項は
01:19
was not just the life stage thing,
単にライフステージだけではなく
01:22
which is, of course, relevant,
それも関係はあるのですが
01:24
but it was really more about
それよりも
01:26
our desire to speak very honestly
人が避けたがる話題こそ
01:28
about subjects that people have difficulty speaking honestly about.
人々は率直に話し合いたいという強い願望を持っていることです
01:30
It seems to us that
思うに
01:33
when people start dissembling, people start lying about things,
人が偽ったり 嘘をついたりし始める時こそ
01:35
that's when it gets really interesting.
それは興味深い話題なのであり
01:38
That's a subject that we want to dive into.
私たちはそんな話題を掘り下げたいのです
01:40
And we've been surprised to find, as young parents,
驚いたことに
01:42
that there are almost more taboos around parenting
性について存在する以上の数のタブーが
01:44
than there are around sex.
子育てには存在するのです
01:47
AV: It's true. So like we said,
AV:申し上げた通り
01:49
the early years were really wonderful,
子育ての初期は本当に素晴らしかった一方
01:51
but they were also really difficult.
本当に困難でもありました
01:53
And we feel like some of that difficulty
その苦労の一部は
01:55
was because of this false advertisement around parenting.
子育てに関する誤った宣伝のせいだと思うのです
01:57
(Laughter)
(笑い)
02:00
We subscribed to a lot of magazines, did our homework,
多くの雑誌を購読し 下調べしたのですが
02:02
but really everywhere you look around, we were surrounded by images like this.
見回すと周りに広がるのは このような光景ばかりだけでした
02:05
And we went into parenting
こんな光景を期待して
02:08
expecting our lives to look like this.
子育てを始めたのに…
02:10
The sun was always streaming in, and our children would never be crying.
日の光がいつも差し込み 子供は決して泣きわめいたりせず
02:12
I would always be perfectly coiffed and well rested,
常に髪型も完璧で いつも元気で
02:15
and in fact, it was not like that at all.
しかし 現実はかけ離れていました
02:19
RG: When we lowered the glossy parenting magazine
RG:私たちが眺めていた こうした美しい写真を
02:21
that we were looking at, with these beautiful images,
掲載した子育て雑誌を下に置き
02:24
and looked at the scene in our actual living room,
実際の我が家のリビングを眺めてみると
02:26
it looked a little bit more like this.
むしろこんな感じでした
02:28
These are our three sons.
うちの3人の息子です
02:30
And of course, they're not always crying and screaming,
もちろん 常に泣き叫んではいませんが
02:32
but with three boys, there's a decent probability
男の子が3人もいれば たいていの場合は
02:34
that at least one of them will not be comporting himself
少なくとも1人は 行儀よくせずに
02:36
exactly as he should.
ぐずっているのです
02:38
AV: Yes, you can see where the disconnect was happening for us.
AV:期待と現実のギャップがどう生まれたのかお分かりでしょう
02:40
We really felt like what we went in expecting
私たちは 期待していたことが
02:43
had nothing to do with what we were actually experiencing,
実際の体験とは何ら関連しないのだと気づき
02:46
and so we decided we really wanted to give it to parents straight.
こうしたことを親たちに率直に伝えようと決めたのです
02:49
We really wanted to let them understand
あるがままの子育ての現実を
02:52
what the realities of parenting were in an honest way.
理解してほしいと強く感じたのです
02:55
RG: So today, what we would love to do
RG:そこで今日 みなさんに
02:58
is share with you four parenting taboos.
子育ての4つのタブーをご紹介します
03:00
And of course, there are many more than four things
もちろん 子育てでのタブーは
03:03
you can't say about parenting,
もっとたくさんあるのですが
03:05
but we would like to share with you today
私たちにとって個人的に特に重要な
03:07
four that are particularly relevant for us personally.
4つについて 今日はお話ししたいと思います
03:09
So the first, taboo number one:
まずは タブーひとつ目:
03:12
you can't say you didn't fall in love with your baby
誕生した瞬間に赤ん坊を愛さなかった とは
03:15
in the very first minute.
言ってはいけません
03:18
I remember vividly, sitting there in the hospital.
私は病院で待っていた時を鮮明に覚えています
03:20
We were in the process of giving birth to our first child.
私たちは初めての子供を分娩する過程にありました
03:23
AV: We, or I?
「私たち」?「私」でしょ?
03:26
RG: I'm sorry.
ごめんなさい
03:28
Misuse of the pronoun.
代名詞の誤用です
03:30
Alisa was very generously in the process
アリサは寛大にも 第一子を
03:32
of giving birth to our first child -- (AV: Thank you.)
分娩してくださっており (AV:どうも)
03:34
-- and I was there with a catcher's mitt.
私は相方として控えて
03:36
And I was there with my arms open.
誕生を待っていました
03:38
The nurse was coming at me
すると珠のような赤ん坊を
03:40
with this beautiful, beautiful child,
抱いた看護師がこちらに向かってきて
03:42
and I remember, as she was approaching me,
その時 私は友人たちの言葉を
03:44
the voices of friends saying,
思い返していました
03:46
"The moment they put the baby in your hands,
「赤ん坊を腕の中に抱いた瞬間
03:49
you will feel a sense of love that will come over you
それまでの人生で経験したどんなことよりも
03:51
that is [on] an order of magnitude more powerful
はるかに巨大な力をもって
03:54
than anything you've ever experienced in your entire life."
愛の感情が押し寄せてくるんだよ」と
03:56
So I was bracing myself for the moment.
息をのんでその瞬間を待ちました
03:59
The baby was coming,
赤ん坊はやってきていて
04:01
and I was ready for this Mack truck of love
私は愛が巨大なトラックのように
04:03
to just knock me off my feet.
込み上げるのを私は待っていた
04:05
And instead, when the baby was placed in my hands,
しかし 赤ん坊がこの腕に置かれた瞬間は
04:08
it was an extraordinary moment.
驚くべきものでした
04:11
This picture is from literally a few seconds after
この写真は赤ん坊を抱いたまさにほんの数秒後で
04:13
the baby was placed in my hands and I brought him over.
私が彼を抱いてきて撮ったものなのですが
04:16
And you can see, our eyes were glistening.
ご覧の通り私たちの目は輝き
04:19
I was overwhelmed with love and affection for my wife,
私は妻への愛と愛着で心がいっぱいで
04:21
with deep, deep gratitude
健康な子を授かったことへの
04:24
that we had what appeared to be a healthy child.
深い 深い感謝の思いで満ちあふれています
04:26
And it was also, of course, surreal.
それは現実と思えないほどでした
04:28
I mean, I had to check the tags and make sure.
念のために名札を確認したほどでした
04:30
I was incredulous, "Are you sure this is our child?"
本当に自分たちの子なのか疑ってしまいました
04:32
And this was all quite remarkable.
驚くべきことでした
04:34
But what I felt towards the child at that moment was deep affection,
その時私が子供に対して感じたのは深い愛着でしたが それは
04:37
but nothing like what I feel for him now, five years later.
5年経った今彼に抱いているのとは全く違うものです
04:40
And so we've done something here
そこで 許されないことかもしれませんが
04:43
that is heretical.
わたしたちは
04:45
We have charted
子供への愛を時間軸で
04:47
our love for our child over time.
グラフ化してみました
04:50
(Laughter)
(笑い)
04:53
This, as you know, is an act of heresy.
お分かりの通り これはやってはいけないことで
04:55
You're not allowed to chart love.
愛のグラフ化など許されません
04:58
The reason you're not allowed to chart love
これが許されない理由は 愛が
05:00
is because we think of love as a binary thing.
二項対立のものと考えられているからです
05:02
You're either in love, or you're not in love.
恋に落ちているか 落ちていないか
05:04
You love, or you don't love.
愛しているか 愛してないか
05:06
And I think the reality is that love is a process,
現実的には 私は愛とはプロセスだと思います
05:08
and I think the problem with thinking of love
愛を二項対立図式で理解しようとすることの
05:11
as something that's binary
問題点は そうすると
05:13
is that it causes us
愛なんて欺瞞だとか
05:15
to be unduly concerned
不十分だとか そんなふうに
05:17
that love is fraudulent, or inadequate, or what have you.
わたしたちがむやみに思ってしまうことです
05:19
And I think I'm speaking obviously here to the father's experience.
ここでは当然父親の経験に基づき話しているわけですが
05:22
But I think a lot of men do go through this sense
思うにおそらく多くの男性が 多かれ少なかれ
05:25
in the early months, maybe their first year,
自身の情緒的反応が不十分だという思いを
05:27
that their emotional response is inadequate in some fashion.
子育て初期の数ヶ月 あるいは初年に経験しているでしょう
05:30
AV: Well, I'm glad Rufus is bringing this up,
AV:この話題を取り上げてくれてありがたいです
05:33
because you can notice where he dips in the first years
初年で彼の愛が下降しているのがおわかりでしょう
05:35
where I think I was doing most of the work.
わたしが育児の殆どを担っていたのに
05:38
But we like to joke,
よく冗談で 子供の生後数ヶ月間は
05:41
in the first few months of all of our children's lives,
彼は叔父なんだ と
05:43
this is Uncle Rufus.
言ったりします
05:45
(Laughter)
(笑い)
05:47
RG: I'm a very affectionate uncle, very affectionate uncle.
RG:私は叔父にしては 実に愛情深いと思うよ
05:49
AV: Yes, and I often joke with Rufus when he comes home
AV:そうね あと彼が帰宅すると よく
05:51
that I'm not sure he would actually be able to find our child in a line-up
息子を他の子と並べたら見分けがつかないんじゃないの なんて
05:54
amongst other babies.
冗談を言っていたので
05:57
So I actually threw a pop quiz here onto Rufus.
実際にルーファスにクイズを出してみましょう
05:59
RG: Uh oh.
RG:なんだって!?
06:01
AV: I don't want to embarrass him too much. But I am going to give him three seconds.
AV:恥をかかせたくはありませんが 制限時間は3秒です
06:03
RG: That is not fair. This is a trick question. He's not up there, is he?
RG:ずるいな 引っかけ問題だ どれも我が子じゃないんだろう?
06:06
AV: Our eight-week-old son is somewhere in here,
AV:いいえ 生後8週間の息子がいるわよ
06:09
and I want to see if Rufus can actually quickly identify him.
彼は素早く息子を見分けられるでしょうか
06:12
RG: The far left. AV: No!
RG:一番左だ(AV:違うわよ!)
06:14
(Laughter)
(笑い)
06:16
RG: Cruel.
RG:ひどいなぁ
06:23
AV: Nothing more to be said.
AV:何も言えないわ
06:25
(Laughter)
(笑い)
06:27
I'll move on to taboo number two.
2つ目のタブーに移りましょう
06:29
You can't talk about how lonely having a baby can be.
子育てがどんなに孤独かを打ち明けてはいけません
06:31
I enjoyed being pregnant. I loved it.
妊娠中は楽しかったのです
06:34
I felt incredibly connected to the community around me.
周りのコミュニティーとの繋がりを強く感じ
06:36
I felt like everyone was participating in my pregnancy, all around me,
周りの皆が 私の妊娠を共有してくれていると感じました
06:39
tracking it down till the actual due-date.
予定日が近づいてくると 自分を
06:42
I felt like I was a vessel of the future of humanity.
慈愛の未来を乗せた船のように感じたのです
06:46
That continued into the the hospital. It was really exhilarating.
それは入院中まで続き 私はウキウキしていました
06:49
I was shower with gifts and flowers and visitors.
多くの来客があり贈り物や花をいただいたり
06:52
It was a really wonderful experience,
本当に素晴らしい体験でした
06:55
but when I got home,
しかし帰宅すると
06:58
I suddenly felt very disconnected
突然 切り離された気持ちになりました
07:00
and suddenly shut in and shut out,
閉じ込められ 除外された気持ち
07:02
and I was really surprised by those feelings.
またそうした感覚に驚きました
07:05
I did expect it to be difficult,
夜も眠れず 休みなく授乳するのは
07:07
have sleepless nights, constant feedings,
覚悟していたのです でも
07:09
but I did not expect the feelings
私が経験した孤独や寂しさは
07:11
of isolation and loneliness that I experienced,
予想もしないものでした
07:13
and I was really surprised that no one had talked to me,
同時に こんな気持ちになるのだと
07:16
that I was going to be feeling this way.
誰も教えてくれなかった事実に驚き
07:18
And I called my sister
姉に電話しました
07:20
whom I'm very close to -- and had three children --
3人の子持ちの彼女とは仲が良く
07:22
and I asked her, "Why didn't you tell me
こう尋ねました「どうしてこんなふうに
07:25
I was going to be feeling this way,
とてつもなく孤独に感じることを
07:27
that I was going to have these -- feeling incredibly isolated?"
こんな感情を抱くことを教えてくれなかったの?」と
07:29
And she said -- I'll never forget --
忘れもしません 彼女はこう答えました
07:33
"It's just not something you want to say to a mother
「とにかくそれは 初めて子を持つ母親に
07:35
that's having a baby for the first time."
言いたいことじゃないのよ」
07:37
RG: And of course, we think
RG:もちろん私たちは
07:40
it's precisely what you really should be saying
これがまさに 初めて子を持つ母親達に
07:42
to mothers who have kids for the first time.
伝えるべきことだと考えます
07:45
And that this, of course, one of the themes for us
また これは私たちのテーマのひとつで
07:48
is that we think
率直で
07:51
that candor and brutal honesty
残酷な本音こそ 私たち皆が
07:53
is critical to us collectively
良い親であるために必要な
07:55
being great parents.
ものだと考えます
07:57
And it's hard not to think
またこうした孤独感を
07:59
that part of what leads to this sense of isolation
引き起こす要因の一部は 現代社会にあると
08:01
is our modern world.
考えられます
08:03
So Alisa's experience is not isolated.
アリサ一人の経験ではないのです
08:05
So your 58 percent of mothers surveyed
調査によると 58%の母親が
08:07
report feelings of loneliness.
孤独感を感じています
08:09
Of those, 67 percent are most lonely
そのうちの67%が 最も寂しい時期は
08:11
when their kids are zero to five -- probably really zero to two.
子供が0〜5歳の時だと答えています 特に0〜2歳でしょう
08:13
In the process of preparing this,
今日の準備を進めるなかで
08:16
we looked at how some other cultures around the world
世界の他の文化圏では この時期をどう乗り切るのか
08:18
deal with this period of time,
ということを調べました
08:20
because here in the Western world,
なぜならここ西洋では
08:23
less than 50 percent of us live near our family members,
親戚の近くに住む人の割合は50%以下で
08:25
which I think is part of why this is such a tough period.
それが この時期が困難になる理由だと思うのです
08:28
So to take one example among many:
そこでひとつの例を挙げてみましょう
08:31
in Southern India
南インドには
08:33
there's a practice known as jholabhari,
ジョラビハリという風習があり
08:35
in which the pregnant woman, when she's seven or eight months pregnant,
女性は 妊娠7〜8ヶ月目を迎えると
08:37
moves in with her mother
母親の元へ里帰りし
08:40
and goes through a series of rituals and ceremonies,
一連の儀式や祭儀を行ってから出産をし
08:42
give birth and returns home to her nuclear family
生後数ヵ月経ってから
08:44
several months after the child is born.
核家族のもとへ戻るのです
08:47
And this is one of many ways
これが他の文化圏での
08:49
that we think other cultures offset this kind of lonely period.
子育ての孤独を回避する多くの方法の一つです
08:51
AV: So taboo number three:
AV:では 3つ目のタブーです
08:54
you can't talk about your miscarriage -- but today I'll talk about mine.
流産について話してはいけない でも今日は私の経験をお話します
08:56
So after we had Declan,
デクランをもうけた後
08:59
we kind of recalibrated our expectations.
自分たちの期待値を計り直しました
09:01
We thought we actually could go through this again
再度同じことをやりきれるだろうと思ったし
09:03
and thought we knew what we would be up against.
立ちはだかる壁ももう分かっていました
09:06
And we were grateful that I was able to get pregnant,
そして嬉しいことにまた妊娠することができて
09:09
and I soon learned that we were having a boy,
それが男の子だということもすぐに知りました
09:12
and then when I was five months,
すると妊娠5ヶ月の時
09:14
we learned that we had lost our child.
流産したことが発覚しました
09:16
This is actually the last little image we have of him.
これが 最後に撮った彼の画像です
09:18
And it was obviously a very difficult time --
当然 非常に苦しい時期でした
09:22
really painful.
とても辛かった
09:24
As I was working through that mourning process,
この悲嘆の時期を乗り越えている間
09:27
I was amazed that I didn't want to see anybody.
驚くことに 誰にも会いたくありませんでした
09:30
I really wanted to crawl into a hole,
本当に 穴に閉じこもりたくて
09:33
and I didn't really know how I was going
そしてどうやって周囲のコミュニティーに
09:36
to work my way back into my surrounding community.
また復帰すれば良いのか分からなかったのです
09:38
And I realize, I think, the way I was feeling that way,
そして気づきました そういう私の思いは
09:41
is on a really deep gut level,
非常に深い生理的なもので
09:44
I was feeling a lot of shame
ある意味遺伝子的にできて当然の
09:46
and embarrassed, frankly,
出産に失敗したのだという
09:49
that, in some respects, I had failed
とてもみじめな気持ち
09:51
at delivering what I'm genetically engineered to do.
むしろ羞恥心を強く抱いていました
09:53
And of course, it made me question,
また もしもう子供を産めないとしたら
09:56
if I wasn't able to have another child,
私たちの結婚は そして
09:58
what would that mean for my marriage,
女性として自分は どうなってしまうか
10:00
and just me as a woman.
と 問いました
10:02
So it was a very difficult time.
本当に辛い時期でした
10:04
As I started working through it more,
悲しみを乗り越えていく中で
10:06
I started climbing out of that hole and talking with other people.
やっと穴から抜け出し 人とも話すようになりました
10:08
I was really amazed
すると そこで
10:11
by all the stories that started flooding in.
耳にする数々の話に驚いたのです
10:13
People I interacted with daily,
日ごろ関わっている人たち
10:15
worked with, was friends with,
例えば同僚 友人
10:17
family members that I had known a long time,
そして長年知っている親戚ですら
10:19
had never shared with me their own stories.
私に彼らの話をしたことがなかったのです
10:21
And I just remember feeling all these stories came out of the woodwork,
こういった話が 突然どこからともなく次々に現れたように感じて
10:23
and I felt like I happened upon
とある隠された女性社会に
10:26
this secret society of women that I now was a part of,
ふと遭遇し その一員になったかのような気がしました
10:28
which was reassuring and also really concerning.
それは安心と気遣いを与えてくれる場でした
10:31
And I think,
思うに
10:35
miscarriage is an invisible loss.
流産は目に見えない喪失です
10:37
There's not really a lot of community support around it.
援助をしてくれるところもあまりありません
10:39
There's really no ceremony,
儀式や典礼は
10:41
rituals, or rites.
ないのです
10:43
And I think, with a death, you have a funeral, you celebrate the life,
死者の場合は葬式があって その人生が讃えられて
10:45
and there's a lot of community support,
周囲の支えもたくさんもあります
10:48
and it's something women don't have with miscarriage.
女性の流産には それがないのです
10:50
RG: Which is too bad because, of course,
RG:当然 流産は酷いことです
10:52
it's a very common and very traumatic experience.
一般的で 精神的に大きな傷を残します
10:54
Fifteen to 20 percent of all pregnancies result in miscarriage,
妊娠の15〜20%は流産に終わります
10:56
and I find this astounding.
これは驚くべき割合です
10:59
In a survey, 74 percent of women said
ある調査によると 74%の女性が
11:01
that miscarriage, they felt, was partly their fault, which is awful.
流産の原因の一部は自分にあると感じています ひどいことです
11:03
And astoundingly, 22 percent
さらに 22%の女性が
11:06
said they would hide a miscarriage from their spouse.
配偶者にも流産を秘密にするそうです
11:08
So taboo number four:
では タブー4つ目です
11:10
you can't say that your average happiness
子ができたら幸せの水準が下がった
11:12
has declined since having a child.
などと言ってはいけません
11:15
The party line is that every single aspect of my life
家族を持ち 子を授かるという奇跡に巡り会った途端
11:18
has just gotten dramatically better
人生が あらゆる側面で
11:21
ever since I participated
劇的に好転した
11:23
in the miracle that is childbirth and family.
と言うのがお約束なのです
11:25
I'll never forget, I remember vividly to this day,
今も鮮明に覚えている 忘れられない瞬間があって
11:29
our first son, Declan, was nine months old,
その時第一子のデクランは生後9カ月で
11:32
and I was sitting there on the couch,
私はソファに座り
11:35
and I was reading Daniel Gilbert's wonderful book, "Stumbling on Happiness."
ダニエル・ギルバートの『幸せはいつもちょっと先にある』を読んでいました
11:37
And I got about two-thirds of the way through,
本の3分の2ぐらいにさしかかった時
11:40
and there was a chart on the right-hand side --
右手側 つまり右側のページに
11:42
on the right-hand page --
グラフがありました
11:45
that we've labeled here
これです
11:47
"The Most Terrifying Chart Imaginable
『新米の親にとって 想像し得る
11:49
for a New Parent."
最も恐ろしいグラフ』
11:51
This chart is comprised of four completely independent studies.
このグラフは 全く独立した4つの研究で構成されていて
11:53
Basically, there's this precipitous drop
基本的に 結婚満足度には崖のような
11:56
of marital satisfaction,
急降下が見られ
11:59
which is closely aligned, we all know, with broader happiness,
お分かりのように これはより広義の幸せと密接に連動していて
12:01
that doesn't rise again
第一子が大学に進学するまで
12:04
until your first child goes to college.
上昇することはありません
12:06
So I'm sitting here looking at the next two decades of my life,
こうして私は 来る20年間の人生 つまりこれから
12:09
this chasm of happiness
まっさかさまに突っ込んでいく
12:12
that we're driving our proverbial convertible straight into.
幸福の谷底を眺めていたのです
12:14
We were despondent.
落胆しました
12:17
AV: So you can imagine, I mean again, the first few months were difficult,
AV:最初の大変だった数カ月を何とかして
12:20
but we'd come out of it,
切り抜けたというのに
12:22
and were really shocked to see this study.
この研究には大変ショックを受けました
12:24
So we really wanted to take a deeper look at it
そこで 希望の光を見いだすために
12:26
in hopes that we would find a silver lining.
もっと深く掘り下げてみたかったのです
12:29
RG: And that's when it's great to be running a website for parents,
RG:親向けウェブサイトを運営していたため
12:31
because we got this incredible reporter
素晴らしい記者がいて
12:33
to go and interview all the scientists
先の4つの研究を指揮した科学者に
12:36
who conducted these four studies.
インタビューしてもらえました
12:39
We said, something is wrong here.
私たちは この研究はどこかおかしい
12:41
There's something missing from these studies.
何か要素が欠けているはずだ と主張しました
12:43
It can't possibly be that bad.
結果がこんな酷いはずないですから
12:45
So Liz Mitchell did a wonderful job with this piece,
そこでリズ・ミッチェルは尽力してくれ
12:49
and she interviewed four scientists,
4人の研究者とダニエル・ギルバートに
12:52
and she also interviewed Daniel Gilbert,
インタビューをしてくれたのです
12:55
and we did indeed find a silver lining.
実際に 希望の光は見つかりました
12:57
So this is our guess
これが 私たちが予想する
12:59
as to what this baseline of average happiness
幸福の平均値の基準線が人生を通して
13:01
arguably looks like throughout life.
描く形です しかしもちろん
13:04
Average happiness is, of course, inadequate,
幸福の平均値はひとつひとつの経験を
13:06
because it doesn't speak
反映しないので
13:08
to the moment-by-moment experience,
不十分な数値と言えるでしょう
13:10
and so this is what we think it looks like
従って ひとつひとつの経験を
13:12
when you layer in
織り込めば
13:15
moment-to-moment experience.
このような形になります
13:17
And so we all remember as children,
子どもの頃を思い出してみると
13:20
the tiniest little thing -- and we see it on the faces of our children --
自分の子供の顔にも現れますが ものすごく小さな
13:22
the teeniest little thing
本当に些細な事柄で
13:25
can just rocket them to these heights
天にも昇るような喜びを
13:27
of just utter adulation,
もたらしてくれる一方
13:29
and then the next teeniest little thing
次のほんの些細な出来事によって
13:31
can cause them just to plummet to the depths of despair.
絶望の縁に突き落とされてしまうのです
13:33
And it's just extraordinary to watch, and we remember it ourselves.
見ていて驚きますし 自身の経験としても覚えていますよね
13:35
And then, of course, as you get older,
ところが 歳をとるにつれて
13:38
it's almost like age is a form of lithium.
まるでリチウムのように
13:40
As you get older, you become more stable.
だんだんと安定してきます
13:42
And part of what happens, I think, in your '20s and '30s,
20〜30代に起こる現象の一部は おそらく
13:45
is you start to learn to hedge your happiness.
幸福に保険をかけることを覚えることです
13:48
You start to realize that
気づくのです
13:50
"Hey, I could go to this live music event
「そうだ 音楽の生ライブに行って
13:52
and have an utterly transforming experience
全身に鳥肌が立つような
13:55
that will cover my entire body with goosebumps,
すばらしい体験をしてこよう
13:57
but it's more likely that I'll feel claustrophobic
でもきっと人混みでぎゅうぎゅうだろうし
14:00
and I won't be able to get a beer.
ビールも買えないんだろうな
14:02
So I'm not going to go.
やめよう
14:05
I've got a good stereo at home. So, I'm not going to go."
家に良いステレオもあるし 行かなくていいや」と
14:07
So your average happiness goes up,
そうして幸福の水準は上がるものの
14:10
but you lose those transcendent moments.
瞬間的なすばらしい経験は逃すのです
14:13
AV: Yeah, and then you have your first child,
AV:そうして第一子をもうけると
14:15
and then you really resubmit yourself
こういった高揚や落胆を再び
14:18
to these highs and lows --
甘んじて受けるのです
14:20
the highs being the first steps, the first smile,
高揚は 子供の初めての一歩 初めての笑顔
14:22
your child reading to you for the first time --
自分に初めて本を読んでみせる時
14:25
the lows being, our house, any time from six to seven every night.
落胆は 毎晩6〜7時には一家で就寝することなどです
14:27
But you realize you resubmit yourself
しかしその中で 自分がすばらしい意味で
14:32
to losing control in a really wonderful way,
再びハメを外すようになっていると気づきます
14:34
which we think provides a lot of meaning to our lives
これは 私たちの人生に大きな意味を
14:37
and is quite gratifying.
そして喜びを もたらしてくれます
14:39
RG: And so in effect,
RG:それは
14:41
we trade average happiness.
幸福の平均値と引き換えで
14:43
We trade the sort of security and safety
ある程度の満足感を維持することの
14:45
of a certain level of contentment
保証や安心感と引き換えに
14:47
for these transcendent moments.
これらの素晴らしい瞬間を得るのです
14:49
So where does that leave the two of us
では 3人の男の子を抱える
14:52
as a family with our three little boys
私たちは どうすればいいのでしょう?
14:54
in the thick of all this?
私たちの場合
14:56
There's another factor in our case.
もう一つ要素があります
14:58
We have violated yet another taboo
私たちはさらにもう一つタブーを
15:00
in our own lives,
犯しました
15:02
and this is a bonus taboo.
おまけのタブーです
15:04
AV: A quick bonus taboo for you, that we should not be working together,
AV:私たちは一緒に働いてはいけない 特に3人の子持ちでは
15:07
especially with three children --
というタブーですが 実際
15:10
and we are.
私たちは働いています
15:12
RG: And we had reservations about this on the front end.
RG:仕事の準備段階から すでに逆風に遭いました
15:14
Everybody knows, you should absolutely not work with your spouse.
配偶者とは絶対に働かない方が良いと考えていて
15:17
In fact, when we first went out to raise money to start Babble,
実際 Babbleの資金集めにベンチャー・キャピタルへ赴いた際も
15:20
the venture capitalists said,
彼らに言われました
15:23
"We categorically don't invest
「夫婦で始めた企業には
15:25
in companies founded by husbands and wives,
投資しないことにしてるんですよ
15:27
because there's an extra point of failure.
失敗する確率が高いから
15:29
It's a bad idea. Don't do it."
やめて忘れなさい」と
15:31
And we obviously went forward. We did.
でも私たちは 実際に前に進みました
15:33
We raised the money, and we're thrilled that we did,
儲けを生むことができたし 本当にうれしいです
15:35
because in this phase of one's life,
人生のこの時期というのは
15:38
the incredibly scarce resource is time.
とにかく時間が貴重ですから
15:40
And if you're really passionate about what you do every day -- which we are --
そして毎日の営みに本当に情熱を燃やすことができていて
15:43
and you're also passionate about your relationship,
二人の関係にも情熱をもっているのならば
15:46
this is the only way we know how to do it.
成功の方法はこれしかないでしょう
15:48
And so the final question that we would ask is:
では 最後にお聞きしたいのですが
15:51
can we collectively bend that happiness chart upwards?
皆の幸福水準を上昇させることはできるしょうか?
15:53
It's great that we have these transcendent moments of joy,
超絶的な喜びの瞬間があるのはすばらしいことですが
15:56
but they're sometimes pretty quick.
たいてい一瞬で過ぎてしまいます
15:59
And so how about that average baseline of happiness?
そこで幸福の平均的水準はどうでしょう
16:02
Can we move that up a little bit?
少々上げることはできるでしょうか?
16:05
AV: And we kind of feel that the happiness gap, which we talked about,
AV:先ほどお話ししたように 思うにこの幸福の落差を生むのは
16:07
is really the result of walking into parenting --
誤った期待を抱いて 子育て
16:10
and really any long-term partnership for that matter --
あるいはあらゆる長期の人間関係に
16:12
with the wrong expectations.
足を踏み入れることでしょう
16:14
And if you have the right expectations and expectation management,
もし正しい期待を抱き 期待の制御を行うことができれば
16:16
we feel like it's going to be a pretty gratifying experience.
子育ては非常に楽しい経験になると思うのです
16:19
RG: And so this is what --
RG:わたしたちの場合も
16:22
And we think that a lot of parents,
当てはまりますが
16:24
when you get in there -- in our case anyway --
多くの親にとって 子育てはこんな感じでしょう
16:26
you pack your bags for a trip to Europe, and you're really excited to go.
ヨーロッパ旅行に向けて荷づくりし とてもウキウキしていたのに
16:28
Get out of the airplane,
飛行機を降りてみると
16:31
it turns out you're trekking in Nepal.
そこはネパールだった
16:33
And trekking in Nepal is an extraordinary experience,
もし適切な荷造りをし 何をするか分かっていて
16:35
particularly if you pack your bags properly
はり切っていれば ネパール旅行は
16:38
and you know what you're getting in for and you're psyched.
素晴らしい経験になるでしょう
16:40
So the point of all this for us today
従って今日お伝えしたかったことは
16:42
is not just hopefully honesty for the sake of honesty,
ただ単に真実を話せばそれで良いというのではなく
16:44
but a hope that by being more honest and candid about these experiences,
こういった経験についてもっと正直かつ率直に話をすることで
16:47
that we can all collectively
皆で集合的に幸福水準を
16:50
bend that happiness baseline up a little bit.
上げることが きっとできるということです
16:52
RG + AV: Thank you.
RGとAV:ありがとう
16:55
(Applause)
(拍手)
16:57
Translator:Hikari Banshoya
Reviewer:Shogo Kobayashi

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Rufus Griscom + Alisa Volkman - Website co-founders
Rufus Griscom and Alisa Volkman co-founded Babble, a website for parents. He’s the CEO, she’s the VP of sales strategy and brand development, and they have three sons.

Why you should listen

Alisa Volkman co-founded Babble with her husband, Rufus Griscom, in December 2006, and has spent the past four years growing the site to attract more than 4 million parents a month. As VP of Sales Strategy and Brand Development, Volkman oversees design, influences product development, and creates and sells custom ad programs.

Griscom serves as Babble’s CEO. He was co-founder of the pathbreaking Nerve.com in 1997, as the website’s founding editor and CEO. In the decade that followed, Griscom grew Nerve Media into a profitable website and online dating business, in the process spinning off Spring Street Networks. He serves as an advisor to several New York-based internet companies. Volkman and Griscom have three sons, Declan, Grey and the brand-new Rye.

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