TED2008
Philip Zimbardo: The psychology of evil
Philip Zimbardo: Kako obični ljudi postaju čudovišta ... ili junaci
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Philip Zimbardo zna koliko lako dobri ljudi postaju zli. U ovom govoru podijelio je svoje uvide i neviđene fotografije iz Abu Ghraib suđenja. Nakon toga govori i o drugoj strani: koliko je lako postati junakom i kako svi mi možemo prihvatiti izazov.
Philip Zimbardo - Psychologist
Philip Zimbardo was the leader of the notorious 1971 Stanford Prison Experiment -- and an expert witness at Abu Ghraib. His book The Lucifer Effect explores the nature of evil; now, in his new work, he studies the nature of heroism. Full bio
Philip Zimbardo was the leader of the notorious 1971 Stanford Prison Experiment -- and an expert witness at Abu Ghraib. His book The Lucifer Effect explores the nature of evil; now, in his new work, he studies the nature of heroism. Full bio
Double-click the English transcript below to play the video.
00:13
Philosophers, dramatists, theologians
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Filozofi, dramaturzi, teolozi
00:16
have grappled with this question for centuries:
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stoljećima se bore s pitanjem:
00:18
what makes people go wrong?
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Što tjera ljude da krenu krivim putem?
00:20
Interestingly, I asked this question when I was a little kid.
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Postavio sam si to pitanje još dok sam bio dječak.
00:23
When I was a kid growing up in the South Bronx, inner-city ghetto
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Kad sam bio dječak, odrastajući u južnom Bronxu, središnjem i siromašnom getu
00:25
in New York, I was surrounded by evil,
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u New Yorku, bio sam okružen zlom,
00:28
as all kids are who grew up in an inner city.
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kao i svi klinci koji su odrasli u siromašnom dijelu grada.
00:30
And I had friends who were really good kids,
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Imao sam prijatelje koji su bili jako dobra djeca,
00:32
who lived out the Dr. Jekyll Mr. Hyde scenario -- Robert Louis Stevenson.
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a živjeli su pravim doktor Jekyll i gospodin Hyde životom -- Robert Louis Stevenson.
00:36
That is, they took drugs, got in trouble, went to jail.
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Odnosno, drogirali su se, upadali u nevolje i bili u zatvoru.
00:40
Some got killed, and some did it without drug assistance.
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Neki su ubijeni, a nekima je to uspjelo bez pomoći droge.
00:44
So when I read Robert Louis Stevenson, that wasn't fiction.
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I kada sam pročitao Roberta Louisa Stevensona, to za mene nije bila fikcija.
00:47
The only question is, what was in the juice?
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Jedino pitanje je, što je bilo u napitku?
00:48
And more importantly, that line between good and evil --
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I još važnije, da granica između dobra i zla --
00:53
which privileged people like to think is fixed and impermeable,
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za koju privilegirani ljudi misle da je fiksna i neporozna,
00:56
with them on the good side, and the others on the bad side --
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s njima na strani dobra, i drugim ljudima na strani zla --
00:59
I knew that line was movable, and it was permeable.
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znao sam da ju je moguće pomaknuti i da jest porozna.
01:02
Good people could be seduced across that line,
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Dobre ljude moguće je zavesti da prijeđu tu granicu,
01:05
and under good and some rare circumstances, bad kids could recover
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a u dobrim i rijetkim okolnostima loša djeca mogu se oporaviti
01:08
with help, with reform, with rehabilitation.
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uz pomoć, reforme i rehabilitaciju.
01:12
So I want to begin with this this wonderful illusion
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Zbog toga želim započeti s ovom divnom iluzijom
01:14
by [Dutch] artist M.C. Escher.
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[nizozemskog] umjetnika M.C. Eschera.
01:17
If you look at it and focus on the white,
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Ako ju gledate i usredotočite se na bijele dijelove,
01:18
what you see is a world full of angels.
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ono što vidite je svijet pun anđela.
01:20
But let's look more deeply, and as we do,
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Ali pogledajmo dublje, i kako gledamo,
01:23
what appears is the demons, the devils in the world.
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pojavljuju se zlodusi, demoni svijeta.
01:27
And that tells us several things.
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A to nam govori nekoliko stvari.
01:28
One, the world is, was, will always be filled with good and evil,
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Prvo: svijet jest, uvijek je bio i uvijek će biti ispunjen i dobrom i zlom
01:31
because good and evil is the yin and yang of the human condition.
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jer dobro i zlo su Yin i Yang ljudskog stanja.
01:34
It tells me something else. If you remember,
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Govori mi i nešto drugo. Ako se sjećate,
01:36
God's favorite angel was Lucifer.
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Božji omiljeni anđeo bio je Lucifer.
01:39
Apparently, Lucifer means "the light."
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Navodno, Lucifer znači "svjetlo".
01:42
It also means "the morning star," in some scripture.
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A prema nekim zapisima također znači i "jutarnja zvijezda".
01:44
And apparently, he disobeyed God,
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A navodno on nije bio poslušan prema Bogu,
01:47
and that's the ultimate disobedience to authority.
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što je najveće moguće nepoštivanje autoriteta.
01:50
And when he did, Michael, the archangel, was sent
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A kad je to učinio, arhanđeo Mihael je poslan
01:54
to kick him out of heaven along with the other fallen angels.
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da ga izbaci iz raja zajedno s drugim palim anđelima.
01:57
And so Lucifer descends into hell, becomes Satan,
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I tako Lucifer silazi u pakao, postaje Sotona,
02:01
becomes the devil, and the force of evil in the universe begins.
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postaje vrag i počinje sila zla u svemiru.
02:03
Paradoxically, it was God who created hell as a place to store evil.
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Paradoksalno, upravo je Bog stvorio pakao kao mjesto za smještanje zla.
02:09
He didn't do a good job of keeping it there though.
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Doduše, nije dobro obavio posao držanja zla tamo.
02:10
So, this arc of the cosmic transformation
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Dakle, ova linija kozmičke pretvorbe
02:13
of God's favorite angel into the Devil,
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omiljenog Božjeg anđela u vraga,
02:15
for me, sets the context for understanding human beings
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za mene postavlja kontekst za razumijevanje ljudi
02:19
who are transformed from good, ordinary people
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koji se iz dobrih, običnih ljudi, pretvaraju
02:22
into perpetrators of evil.
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u počinitelje zla.
02:24
So the Lucifer effect, although it focuses on the negatives --
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Tako me Luciferov efekt, iako se usredotočuje na negativnosti --
02:28
the negatives that people can become,
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negativnosti koje ljudi mogu postati,
02:31
not the negatives that people are --
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a ne negativnosti koje ljudi jesu --
02:32
leads me to a psychological definition. Evil is the exercise of power.
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vodi u psihološku definiciju: zlo je upotrebljavanje moći.
02:38
And that's the key: it's about power.
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I to je ključ: radi se o moći.
02:40
To intentionally harm people psychologically,
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Namjerno psihički naškoditi ljudima,
02:44
to hurt people physically, to destroy people mortally, or ideas,
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tjelesno ozlijediti ljude, ubiti nekoga, ili ubiti ideje,
02:47
and to commit crimes against humanity.
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i počiniti zločine protiv čovječnosti.
02:51
If you Google "evil," a word that should surely have withered by now,
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Ako u Google unesete "zlo", riječ koja je do sada trebala nestati,
02:54
you come up with 136 million hits in a third of a second.
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dobiti ćete 136 milijuna rezultata za trećinu sekunde.
02:58
A few years ago -- I am sure all of you were shocked, as I was,
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Prije nekoliko godina -- siguran sam da ste svi vi bili šokirani, kao što sam i ja bio,
03:02
with the revelation of American soldiers
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s otkrićem o američkim vojnicima
03:05
abusing prisoners in a strange place
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koji zlostavljaju zarobljenike na čudnom mjestu
03:08
in a controversial war, Abu Ghraib in Iraq.
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u kontroverznom ratu: Abu Ghraibu u Iraku.
03:11
And these were men and women
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A ovo su muškarci i žene
03:12
who were putting prisoners through unbelievable humiliation.
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koji su tjerali zarobljenike na nevjerojatna poniženja.
03:18
I was shocked, but I wasn't surprised,
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Bio sam šokiran, ali ne i iznenađen,
03:19
because I had seen those same visual parallels
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jer sam iste vizualne usporedbe vidio
03:22
when I was the prison superintendent of the Stanford Prison Study.
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dok sam bio upravnitelj zatvora tijekom studije Stanfordskog zatvora.
03:25
Immediately the Bush administration military said ... what?
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Busheva vojna administracija odmah je objavila ... što?
03:28
What all administrations say when there's a scandal.
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Ono što svaka vlada objavi nakon što se dogodi skandal.
03:30
"Don't blame us. It's not the system. It's the few bad apples,
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"Nemojte kriviti nas. Nije sustav kriv. Razlog je nekoliko pokvarenih jabuka,
03:34
the few rogue soldiers."
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nekoliko odmetnutih vojnika."
03:35
My hypothesis is, American soldiers are good, usually.
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Moja pretpostavka je da su američki vojnici uglavnom dobri.
03:38
Maybe it was the barrel that was bad.
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Možda je posuda koja drži jabuke bila pokvarena.
03:40
But how am I going to -- how am I going to deal with that hypothesis?
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Ali kako ću - kako ću se ja pomiriti s tom hipotezom?
03:43
I became an expert witness
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Postao sam vještakom
03:44
for one of the guards, Sergeant Chip Frederick,
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za jednog od čuvara, narednika Chipa Fredericka,
03:46
and in that position, I had access to the dozen investigative reports.
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i na tom sam položaju imao pristup desecima istražnih izvješća.
03:50
I had access to him. I could study him,
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Imao sam pristup do njega. Mogao sam ga proučavati,
03:54
have him come to my home, get to know him,
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dovesti ga u svoj dom, upoznati ga,
03:55
do psychological analysis to see, was he a good apple or bad apple.
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i napraviti psihološku analizu da vidim je li on dobra ili pokvarena jabuka.
03:59
And thirdly, I had access to all of the 1,000 pictures
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I treće, imao sam pristup do svih 1000 fotografija
04:03
that these soldiers took.
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koje su vojnici napravili.
04:05
These pictures are of a violent or sexual nature.
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Ove su slike nasilne ili seksualne prirode.
04:07
All of them come from the cameras of American soldiers.
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Sve fotografije su uslikali američki vojnici.
04:11
Because everybody has a digital camera or cell phone camera,
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Budući da svatko ima digitalni fotoaparat ili fotoaparat u mobitelu,
04:13
they took pictures of everything. More than 1,000.
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fotografirali su sve.Više od 1000 fotografija.
04:16
And what I've done is I organized them into various categories.
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A ono što sam ja napravio je razvrstao ih u različite kategorije.
04:18
But these are by United States military police, army reservists.
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Ali ove su napravili pripadnici američke vojne policije, vojni rezervisti.
04:24
They are not soldiers prepared for this mission at all.
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Oni nisu vojnici koji su bili pripremljeni za ovu misiju.
04:27
And it all happened in a single place, Tier 1-A, on the night shift.
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I sve se to dogodilo na jednom mjestu, razini 1A, tijekom noćne smjene.
04:32
Why? Tier 1-A was the center for military intelligence.
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Zašto? Razina 1A bila je središte vojne inteligencije.
04:35
It was the interrogation hold. The CIA was there.
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To je bio prostor za ispitivanje zarobljenika. CIA se nalazila tamo.
04:39
Interrogators from Titan Corporation, all there,
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Ispitivači iz tvrtke Titan, svi su bili tamo,
04:41
and they're getting no information about the insurgency.
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i nisu uspijevali dobiti bilo kakve informacije o pobuni.
04:45
So they're going to put pressure on these soldiers,
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Stoga su odlučili napraviti pritisak na te vojnike,
04:46
military police, to cross the line,
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vojnu policiju, da prijeđu granicu,
04:49
give them permission to break the will of the enemy,
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i dati im dopuštenje da slome volju neprijatelja,
04:52
to prepare them for interrogation, to soften them up,
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da ih pripreme za ispitivanja, da ih omekšaju,
04:54
to take the gloves off. Those are the euphemisms,
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da skinu rukavice.To su izrazi koje su koristili,
04:56
and this is how it was interpreted.
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a ovako su bili protumačeni.
05:00
Let's go down to that dungeon.
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Idemo dolje do tamnice.
05:01
(Camera shutter)
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(Blenda fotoaparata)
05:38
(Thuds)
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(Lupanje)
05:45
(Camera shutter)
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(Blenda fotoaparata)
05:59
(Thuds)
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(Lupanje)
06:09
(Breathing)
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(Disanje)
06:17
(Bells)
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(Zvona)
06:49
So, pretty horrific.
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Dakle, prilično grozno.
06:52
That's one of the visual illustrations of evil.
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To je jedna od vizualnih ilustracija zla.
06:55
And it should not have escaped you that
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I trebali ste primijetiti
06:56
the reason I paired the prisoner with his arms out
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da je razlog zbog kojeg sam upario sliku zarobljenika raširenih ruku
07:00
with Leonardo da Vinci's ode to humanity
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s Da Vincijevom Odom čovječnosti,
07:03
is that that prisoner was mentally ill.
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taj da je zatočenik psihički bolestan.
07:05
That prisoner covered himself with shit every day,
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Taj zarobljenik mazao se izmetom svaki dan,
07:07
and they used to have to roll him in dirt so he wouldn't stink.
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i vojnici su ga morali uvaljati u blato da ne bi smrdio.
07:10
But the guards ended up calling him "Shit Boy."
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Ali stražari su ga na kraju zvali Posranko.
07:12
What was he doing in that prison
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Kako se on našao u tom zatvoru,
07:14
rather than in some mental institution?
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a ne u nekoj instituciji za mentalne bolesti?
07:17
In any event, here's former Secretary of Defense Rumsfeld.
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U svakom slučaju, ovdje bivši ministar obrane Rumsfeld
07:20
He comes down and says, "I want to know, who is responsible?
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dolazi i kaže - Želim znati tko je odgovoran
07:22
Who are the bad apples?" Well, that's a bad question.
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Tko su pokvarene jabuke? - To je krivo pitanje.
07:25
You have to reframe it and ask, "What is responsible?"
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Morate pitanje preoblikovati i pitati: "Što je odgovorno?"
07:28
Because "what" could be the who of people,
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Budući da "što" mogu biti ljudi,
07:30
but it could also be the what of the situation,
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ali također može biti i situacija,
07:32
and obviously that's wrongheaded.
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i očito je upravo to krivo.
07:34
So how do psychologists go about understanding
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Kako onda psiholozi pristupaju razumijevanju
07:36
such transformations of human character,
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takve pretvorbe ljudskog karaktera,
07:38
if you believe that they were good soldiers
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ako vjerujete da su oni bili dobri vojnici
07:40
before they went down to that dungeon?
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prije nego što su otišli dolje u tamnice?
07:42
There are three ways. The main way is -- it's called dispositional.
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Postoje tri načina. Osnovni način je promatranje unutarnjih čimbenika ponašanja.
07:44
We look at what's inside of the person, the bad apples.
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Promatramo što je unutar osobe, onih pokvarenih jabuka.
07:48
This is the foundation of all of social science,
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Upravo to je osnova svih društvenih znanosti,
07:51
the foundation of religion, the foundation of war.
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osnova religije, osnova rata.
07:55
Social psychologists like me come along and say, "Yeah,
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Društveni psiholozi poput mene kažu - Da,
07:57
people are the actors on the stage,
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ljudi su glumci na pozornici,
07:59
but you'll have to be aware of what that situation is.
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ali morate biti svjesni i situacije.
08:01
Who are the cast of characters? What's the costume?
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Tko su glumci uloga? Koje kostime nose?
08:04
Is there a stage director?"
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Postoji li redatelj?
08:05
And so we're interested in, what are the external factors
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Nas zanima koji su vanjski čimbenici
08:08
around the individual -- the bad barrel?
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oko pojedinca, odnosno pokvarena posuda
08:10
And social scientists stop there, and they miss the big point
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I sociolozi se tamo zaustave i propuste najvažniju poantu
08:13
that I discovered when I became an expert witness for Abu Ghraib.
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koju sam ja otkrio kada sam postao vještakom za Abu Ghraibu.
08:16
The power is in the system.
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Moć se nalazi u sustavu.
08:18
The system creates the situation that corrupts the individuals,
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Sustav stvara situacije koje kvare pojedince
08:21
and the system is the legal, political, economic, cultural background.
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i sustav je pravna, politička, ekonomska i kulturna pozadina.
08:26
And this is where the power is of the bad-barrel makers.
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I ovdje se nalazi moć ljudi koji proizvode pokvarene posude.
08:29
So if you want to change a person, you've got to change the situation.
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Dakle, ako želite promijeniti neku osobu morate promijeniti situaciju.
08:32
If you want to change the situation,
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Ako želite promijeniti situaciju,
08:33
you've got to know where the power is, in the system.
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morate znati gdje se u sustavu nalazi moć.
08:35
So the Lucifer effect involves understanding
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Na taj način Luciferov efekt uključuje razumijevanje
08:37
human character transformations with these three factors.
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transformacije ljudskog karaktera primjenom ova tri čimbenika.
08:43
And it's a dynamic interplay.
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Osim toga, to je dinamična veza.
08:44
What do the people bring into the situation?
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Što ljudi donose u situaciju?
08:46
What does the situation bring out of them?
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Što situacija izvlači iz njih?
08:48
And what is the system that creates and maintains that situation?
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I kakav sustav stvara i održava tu situaciju?
08:52
So my book, "The Lucifer Effect," recently published, is about,
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Moja se knjiga, Luciferov efekt, nedavno objavljena, bavi time
08:54
how do you understand how good people turn evil?
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kako shvatiti kako dobri ljudi postaju zli?
08:57
And it has a lot of detail
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U knjizi ima puno detalja
08:58
about what I'm going to talk about today.
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u vezi toga o čemu ću danas pričati.
09:01
So Dr. Z's "Lucifer Effect," although it focuses on evil,
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Dakle, "Lucifer efekt", iako fokusiran na zlo,
09:04
really is a celebration of the human mind's
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ustvari je slavljenje
09:06
infinite capacity to make any of us kind or cruel,
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beskrajnog kapaciteta ljudskog uma da bilo koga od nas učini ili dobrim ili okrutnim,
09:10
caring or indifferent, creative or destructive,
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brižnim ili ravnodušnim, kreativnim ili destruktivnim,
09:13
and it makes some of us villains.
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i pretvara neke od nas u zločince.
09:15
And the good news story that I'm going to hopefully come to
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Priča o dobroj vijesti do koje se nadam da ću doći
09:18
at the end is that it makes some of us heroes.
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na kraju govora je da neke od nas pretvara u junake.
09:20
This is a wonderful cartoon in the New Yorker,
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Ovo je prekrasan strip u časopisu New Yorker,
09:23
which really summarizes my whole talk:
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koji jako dobro rezimira moj cijeli govor:
09:25
"I'm neither a good cop nor a bad cop, Jerome.
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"Ja sam ni dobar ni loš policajac, Jerome.
09:27
Like yourself, I'm a complex amalgam
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Kao ti, i ja sam složen spoj
09:29
of positive and negative personality traits
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pozitivnih i negativnih osobina ličnosti
09:32
that emerge or not, depending on the circumstances."
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koje se ili pojavljuju ili ne, ovisno o okolnostima."
09:35
(Laughter)
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(Smijeh)
09:37
There's a study some of you think you know about,
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Postoji studija za koju neki od vas misle da ju znaju,
09:40
but very few people have ever read the story. You watched the movie.
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ali vrlo je malo ljudi koji su pročitali priču. Gledali ste film.
09:44
This is Stanley Milgram, little Jewish kid from the Bronx,
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Ovo je Stanley Milgrom, židovski dječak iz Bronxa,
09:47
and he asked the question, "Could the Holocaust happen here, now?"
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i on je postavio pitanje, "Bi li se holokaust mogao dogoditi ovdje, sada?"
09:51
People say, "No, that's Nazi Germany,
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Ljudi kažu: "Ne, to je bilo u nacističkoj Njemačkoj,
09:52
that's Hitler, you know, that's 1939."
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to je Hitler, znaš, to je 1939. godina."
09:54
He said, "Yeah, but suppose Hitler asked you,
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A on je rekao, "Da, ali pretpostavimo da je Hitler pitao vas,
09:56
'Would you electrocute a stranger?' 'No way, not me, I'm a good person.' "
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'Biste li ubili stranca strujom?''Nema šanse, ne ja, ja sam dobra osoba.'
10:00
He said, "Why don't we put you in a situation
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On je rekao: "Zašto vas ne bismo stavili u situaciju
10:01
and give you a chance to see what you would do?"
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i dali vam priliku da vidite što ćete učiniti?"
10:03
And so what he did was he tested 1,000 ordinary people.
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I tako je proveo ispitivanje nad 1000 običnih ljudi.
10:07
500 New Haven, Connecticut, 500 Bridgeport.
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500 u New Havenu, Connecticut; 500 u Bridgeportu.
10:10
And the ad said, "Psychologists want to understand memory.
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Oglas je glasio, "Psiholozi žele razumjeti pamćenje,
10:14
We want to improve people's memory,
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želimo poboljšati pamćenje ljudi,
10:15
because memory is the key to success." OK?
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jer pamćenje je ključ uspjeha." U redu?
10:18
"We're going to give you five bucks -- four dollars for your time."
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"Dati ćemo vam pet dolara - četiri dolara za vaše vrijeme."
10:24
And it said, "We don't want college students.
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I dalje glasi: "Ne trebamo studente;
10:25
We want men between 20 and 50."
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trebamo muškarace između 20 i 50 godina"
10:27
In the later studies, they ran women.
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-- u kasnijim studijama proveli su ispitivanja i na ženama --
10:28
Ordinary people: barbers, clerks, white-collar people.
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"obične ljude: brijače, trgovce, ljude koji rade u uredima."
10:32
So, you go down, and one of you is going to be a learner,
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I tako se javite na oglas i netko od vas bit će učenik,
10:35
and one of you is going to be a teacher.
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a drugi će biti učitelj.
10:36
The learner's a genial, middle-aged guy.
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Učenik je srdačan, srednjovječan muškarac.
10:38
He gets tied up to the shock apparatus in another room.
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Njega vežu na aparat za elektrošokove u drugoj sobi.
10:41
The learner could be middle-aged, could be as young as 20.
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Učenik bi mogao biti srednjovječan, a mogao bi biti i u dvadesetima.
10:44
And one of you is told by the authority, the guy in the lab coat,
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Jednom od vas osoba s autoritetom, osoba u laboratorijskoj kuti, kaže
10:48
"Your job as teacher is to give this guy material to learn.
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"Vaš posao kao učitelja je da ovom čovjeku date sredstvo za učenje.
10:51
Gets it right, reward him.
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Ako napavi dobro, nagradite ga.
10:52
Gets it wrong, you press a button on the shock box.
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Ako pogriješi, pritisnite tipku na kutiji za upravljanje šokovima.
10:54
The first button is 15 volts. He doesn't even feel it."
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Prva tipka je 15 volti. On to niti ne osjeća. "
10:58
That's the key. All evil starts with 15 volts.
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I to je ključ. Svako zlo počinje s 15 volti.
11:01
And then the next step is another 15 volts.
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A onda slijedi još 15 volti.
11:04
The problem is, at the end of the line, it's 450 volts.
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Problem je što, na kraju priče, to bude 450 volti.
11:06
And as you go along, the guy is screaming,
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I kako se sve odvija, čovjek počne vrištati
11:09
"I've got a heart condition! I'm out of here!"
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"Imam srčanu bolest! Ja odlazim! "
11:11
You're a good person. You complain.
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A vi ste dobra osoba. Prigovarate.
11:13
"Sir, who's going to be responsible if something happens to him?"
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"Gospodine, tko će biti odgovoran ako mu se nešto dogodi?"
11:15
The experimenter says, "Don't worry, I will be responsible.
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Izvođač eksperimenta kaže: "Ne brinite, ja ću biti odgovoran.
11:18
Continue, teacher."
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Nastavite, učitelju. "
11:19
And the question is, who would go all the way to 450 volts?
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I pitanje je, tko će ići sve do 450 volti?
11:24
You should notice here, when it gets up to 375,
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Treba napomenuti da kada se dođe do 375 volti,
11:26
it says, "Danger. Severe Shock."
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na uređaju piše, "Opasnost: ozbiljan elektrošok".
11:28
When it gets up to here, there's "XXX" -- the pornography of power.
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Kada dođe do ove razine, to je "XXX": pornografija moći.
11:31
(Laughter)
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(Smijeh)
11:32
So Milgram asks 40 psychiatrists,
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I onda Milgrom pita 40 psihijatara,
11:33
"What percent of American citizens would go to the end?"
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"Koji postotak američkih građana će ići do kraja?"
11:37
They said only one percent. Because that's sadistic behavior,
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Oni su rekli samo 1 posto. Budući da je to sadističko ponašanje,
11:40
and we know, psychiatry knows, only one percent of Americans are sadistic.
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a znamo, psihijatrija zna, da su samo 1 posto Amerikanaca sadisti.
11:44
OK. Here's the data. They could not be more wrong.
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U redu. Evo podataka. Nisu mogli više promašiti.
11:48
Two thirds go all the way to 450 volts. This was just one study.
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Dvije trećine idu sve do 450 volti. A to je bila samo jedna studija.
11:53
Milgram did more than 16 studies. And look at this.
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Milgram je proveo više od 16 studija. I pogledajte ovo.
11:56
In study 16, where you see somebody like you go all the way,
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U studiji 16, gdje vidite nekoga poput vas kako ide do kraja,
12:00
90 percent go all the way. In study five, if you see people rebel, 90 percent rebel.
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90 posto ispitanika ide do kraja. U petoj studiji, ako vidite ljude da se pobune, 90 posto ih se pobuni.
12:06
What about women? Study 13 -- no different than men.
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Što je sa ženama? Studija 13: ne razlikuju se od muškaraca.
12:10
So Milgram is quantifying evil as the willingness of people
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Tako je Milgrom kvantificirao zlo kao spremnost ljudi
12:13
to blindly obey authority, to go all the way to 450 volts.
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da se slijepo pokore vlasti, da idu sve do 450 volti.
12:16
And it's like a dial on human nature.
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A to je poput upravljača ljudske prirode.
12:18
A dial in a sense that you can make almost everybody totally obedient,
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Upravljača u smislu da gotovo svakoga možete napraviti potpuno poslušnim
12:23
down to the majority, down to none.
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od većine do nikoga.
12:25
So what are the external parallels? For all research is artificial.
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Ali koje su vanjske usporedbe? Jer svako je istraživanje umjetno.
12:29
What's the validity in the real world?
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Koja je valjanost u stvarnom svijetu?
12:30
912 American citizens committed suicide or were murdered
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912 američkih građana počinilo je samoubojstvo ili su ih ubili
12:34
by family and friends in Guyana jungle in 1978,
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članovi obitelji i prijatelji u džungli u Gvajani 1978.
12:37
because they were blindly obedient to this guy, their pastor --
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zbog slijepe poslušnosti prema ovom čovjeku, svojem pastoru.
12:40
not their priest -- their pastor, Reverend Jim Jones.
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Ne svojem svećeniku. Svojem pastoru, velečasnom Jimu Jonesu.
12:42
He persuaded them to commit mass suicide.
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Na njegov nagovor počinili su masovno samoubojstvo.
12:46
And so, he's the modern Lucifer effect,
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I tako je upravo on protagonist suvremenog Luciferovog efekta.
12:47
a man of God who becomes the Angel of Death.
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Božji čovjek koji je postao anđeo smrti.
12:52
Milgram's study is all about individual authority to control people.
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Milgramova studija govori upravo o moći pojedinca da upravlja ljudima.
12:56
Most of the time, we are in institutions,
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Većinu vremena provodimo u institucijama,
13:00
so the Stanford Prison Study is a study of the power of institutions
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stoga je studija o stanfordskom zatvoru zapravo studija o utjecaju institucija
13:03
to influence individual behavior.
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na ponašanje pojedinca.
13:05
Interestingly, Stanley Milgram and I were in the same high school class
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Zanimljivo je da smo Stanley Milgrom i ja bili u istom razredu
13:08
in James Monroe in the Bronx, 1954.
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u srednjoj školi James Monroe u Bronxu, 1954.
13:13
So this study, which I did
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Ovo istraživanje na kojemu sam radio
13:14
with my graduate students, especially Craig Haney --
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sa svojim studentima, posebno Craigom Haneyjem,
13:16
we also began work with an ad.
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također je započelo oglasom.
13:17
We didn't have money, so we had a cheap, little ad,
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Nismo imali novca pa smo postavili jeftini maleni oglas,
13:19
but we wanted college students for a study of prison life.
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a željeli smo studente koji bi sudjelovali u istraživanju o zatvorskom životu.
13:22
75 people volunteered, took personality tests.
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75 ljudi se dobrovoljno javilo i ispunilo testove osobnosti.
13:25
We did interviews. Picked two dozen:
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Intervjuirali smo ih. Izabrali smo dvadeset četvero ljudi,
13:27
the most normal, the most healthy.
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najnormalnijih, najzdravijih.
13:29
Randomly assigned them to be prisoner and guard.
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Nasumično su im dodijeljene uloge zatvorenika i čuvara.
13:31
So on day one, we knew we had good apples.
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Tako smo prvog dana znali da imamo dobre jabuke.
13:33
I'm going to put them in a bad situation.
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Dovest ćemo ih u lošu situaciju.
13:35
And secondly, we know there's no difference
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Drugo, poznato je da nema razlike
13:38
between the boys who are going to be guards
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između mladića koji će biti čuvari
13:39
and the boys who are going to be prisoners.
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i mladića koji će biti zatvorenici.
13:41
The kids who were going to be prisoners,
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Mladićima koji će biti zatvorenici
13:42
we said, "Wait at home in the dormitories. The study will begin Sunday."
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rekli smo: "Čekajte kod kuće u spavaonicama.Studija će započeti u nedjelju."
13:45
We didn't tell them
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Nismo im rekli
13:46
that the city police were going to come and do realistic arrests.
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da će doći gradska policija i izvršiti realistična uhićenja.
14:22
(Video) Student: A police car pulls up in front, and a cop comes to the front door,
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[Čovjek na snimci] policijski automobil zaustavlja se ispred ulaza i policajac dolazi do prednjih vrata
14:28
and knocks, and says he's looking for me.
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i pokuca i kaže da traži mene.
14:30
So they, right there, you know, they took me out the door,
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Tako su, na licu mjesta, znate, odveli me van,
14:33
they put my hands against the car.
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prislonili mi ruke na auto.
14:36
It was a real cop car, it was a real policeman,
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Policijski auto je bio stvaran, policajac je bio stvaran,
14:39
and there were real neighbors in the street,
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i na ulici su bili stvarni susjedi
14:40
who didn't know that this was an experiment.
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koji nisu znali da se radi o eksperimentu.
14:44
And there was cameras all around and neighbors all around.
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Svuda su uokolo bili fotoaparati i susjedi.
14:47
They put me in the car, then they drove me around Palo Alto.
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Posjeli su me u auto i zatim vozili po Palo Altu.
14:52
They took me to the police station,
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Odveli su me u policijsku postaju,
14:55
the basement of the police station. Then they put me in a cell.
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u podrum policijske postaje. Tada su me zatvorili u ćeliju.
15:05
I was the first one to be picked up, so they put me in a cell,
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Bio sam prvi kojega su doveli pa su me zatvorili u ćeliju
15:07
which was just like a room with a door with bars on it.
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koja je bila poput obične prostorije i imala vrata s rešetkama.
15:12
You could tell it wasn't a real jail.
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Moglo se vidjeti da to nije bio pravi zatvor.
15:13
They locked me in there, in this degrading little outfit.
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Zaključali su me tamo, obučenog u neku ponižavajuću odoru.
15:19
They were taking this experiment too seriously.
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Preozbiljno su shvatili eksperiment.
15:21
Philip Zimbardo: Here are the prisoners who are going to be dehumanized.
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Evo zatvorenika koji će biti dehumanizirani.
15:23
They're going to become numbers.
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Postati će brojevi.
15:24
Here are the guards with the symbols of power and anonymity.
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Ovo su čuvari sa simbolima moći i anonimnosti.
15:27
Guards get prisoners
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Čuvari tjeraju zatvorenike
15:28
to clean the toilet bowls out with their bare hands,
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na čišćenje WC-a golim rukama i
15:30
to do other humiliating tasks.
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na druge ponižavajuće zadatake.
15:32
They strip them naked. They sexually taunt them.
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Skidaju ih gole. Izlažu ih spolnim uvredama.
15:34
They begin to do degrading activities,
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Počinju s ponižavajućim aktivnostima,
15:36
like having them simulate sodomy.
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poput tjeranja zatvorenika na simuliranje sodomije.
15:38
You saw simulating fellatio in soldiers in Abu Ghraib.
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Vidjeli ste simuliranje oralnog seksa kod vojnika u Abu Ghraibu.
15:41
My guards did it in five days. The stress reaction was so extreme
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Mojim je čuvarima za to trebalo pet dana. Reakcija na stres je bila toliko ekstremna
15:46
that normal kids we picked because they were healthy
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da su normalni mladići koje smo izabrali jer su bili zdravi
15:48
had breakdowns within 36 hours.
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doživjeli živčani slom za manje od 36 sati.
15:50
The study ended after six days, because it was out of control.
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Istraživanje je završilo nakon šest dana jer je izmaklo kontroli.
15:54
Five kids had emotional breakdowns.
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Petero ljudi doživjelo je emocionalni slom.
15:58
Does it make a difference if warriors go to battle
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Je li svejedno mijenjaju li ratnici koji idu u bitku
16:00
changing their appearance or not?
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svoj izgled ili ne?
16:02
Does it make a difference if they're anonymous,
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Utječe li njihova anonimnost
16:03
in how they treat their victims?
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na način na koji postupaju sa svojim žrtvama?
16:05
We know in some cultures, they go to war,
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Znamo da ljudi u nekim kulturama pri odlasku u rat
16:06
they don't change their appearance.
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ne mijenjaju svoj izgled.
16:07
In other cultures, they paint themselves like "Lord of the Flies."
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U drugim kulturama ljudi koriste boje poput likova iz Gospodara muha.
16:09
In some, they wear masks.
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U nekim kulturama nose maske.
16:11
In many, soldiers are anonymous in uniform.
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U mnogima, vojnici su anonimni u uniformama.
16:14
So this anthropologist, John Watson, found
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Tako je antropolog John Watson izdvojio
16:17
23 cultures that had two bits of data.
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23 kulturne skupine i dvije informacije o svakoj od njih.
16:19
Do they change their appearance? 15.
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Mijenjaju li izgled? 15.
16:21
Do they kill, torture, mutilate? 13.
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Ubijaju li, muče, sakate? 13.
16:23
If they don't change their appearance,
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Od skupina koje ne mijenjaju svoj izgled
16:25
only one of eight kills, tortures or mutilates.
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samo jedna od osam ubija, muči ili sakati.
16:27
The key is in the red zone.
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Ključ je u crvenoj zoni.
16:29
If they change their appearance,
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Ako mijenjaju izgled,
16:30
12 of 13 -- that's 90 percent -- kill, torture, mutilate.
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12 od 13 -- to je 90 posto -- ubija, muči, sakati.
16:35
And that's the power of anonymity.
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To je moć anonimnosti.
16:36
So what are the seven social processes
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Kojih je to onda sedam društvenih procesa
16:38
that grease the slippery slope of evil?
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koji podmazuju sklisku padinu zla?
16:40
Mindlessly taking the first small step.
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Bezumno poduzimanje prvog malenog koraka.
16:42
Dehumanization of others. De-individuation of Self.
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Dehumanizacija drugih. Deindividualizacija sebe.
16:45
Diffusion of personal responsibility. Blind obedience to authority.
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Raspršenje osobne odgovornosti. Slijepa poslušnost autoriteta.
16:49
Uncritical conformity to group norms.
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Nekritično prihvaćanje grupnih normi.
16:50
Passive tolerance to evil through inaction or indifference.
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Pasivno toleriranje zla nedjelovanjem ili indiferentnošću.
16:54
And it happens when you're in a new or unfamiliar situation.
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A to se događa u novim ili nepoznatim situacijama.
16:56
Your habitual response patterns don't work.
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Uobičajeni uzorci reagiranja ne djeluju.
16:59
Your personality and morality are disengaged.
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Vaša ličnost i moral se razdvajaju.
17:01
"Nothing is easier than to denounce the evildoer;
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"Ništa nije lakše nego osuditi onoga koji čini zlo,
17:04
nothing more difficult than understanding him," Dostoyevksy tells us.
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ništa teže nego razumjeti ga", govori nam Dostojevski.
17:07
Understanding is not excusing. Psychology is not excuse-iology.
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Razumijevanje nije opravdavanje. Psihologija nije "izgovorologija".
17:12
So social and psychological research reveals
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Društvena i psihološka istraživanja otkrivaju
17:13
how ordinary, good people can be transformed without the drugs.
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kako je obične dobre ljude moguće transformirati bez utjecaja droge.
17:17
You don't need it. You just need the social-psychological processes.
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Nepotrebna je. Potrebni su samo socio-psihološki procesi.
17:20
Real world parallels? Compare this with this.
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Usporedbe sa stvarnim svijetom? Usporedite ovo sa sljedećim.
17:26
James Schlesinger -- and I'm going to have to end with this -- says,
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James Schlesinger -- morati ću završiti s ovime -- kaže:
17:28
"Psychologists have attempted to understand how and why
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"Psiholozi su pokušavali shvatiti kako i zašto
17:31
individuals and groups who usually act humanely
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pojedinci i grupe koje obično djeluju čovječno
17:33
can sometimes act otherwise in certain circumstances."
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mogu ponekad, u drugačijim okolnostima, djelovati drugačije."
17:37
That's the Lucifer effect.
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To je Luciferov efekt.
17:38
And he goes on to say, "The landmark Stanford study
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Nastavlja: "Značajna stanfordska studija
17:40
provides a cautionary tale for all military operations."
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predstavlja opomenu za sve vojne operacije."
17:44
If you give people power without oversight,
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Ako ljudima date moć bez nadzora,
17:47
it's a prescription for abuse. They knew that, and let that happen.
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to je recept za zlostavljanje. Oni su to znali i dopustili da se dogodi.
17:50
So another report, an investigative report by General Fay,
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Još jedno izlaganje, istražni izvještaj generala Faya,
17:55
says the system is guilty. And in this report,
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okrivljuje sustav, a u ovom izvješću
17:57
he says it was the environment that created Abu Ghraib,
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Fay govori da je okruženje koje je nastalo u Abu Ghraibu
18:00
by leadership failures that contributed
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zbog neuspješnog vodstva bilo to što je doprinijelo
18:02
to the occurrence of such abuse,
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nastanku takvog zlostavljanja,
18:03
and the fact that it remained undiscovered
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to i činjenica da je ono dugo ostalo neotkriveno
18:05
by higher authorities for a long period of time.
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od strane vlasti.
18:07
Those abuses went on for three months. Who was watching the store?
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Zlostavljanja su trajala tri mjeseca. Tko je pazio na njih?
18:11
The answer is nobody, and, I think, nobody on purpose.
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Odgovor je - nitko, i ja mislim - namjerno.
18:14
He gave the guards permission to do those things,
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"Nitko" je dao čuvarima dopuštenje da čine sve one stvari,
18:15
and they knew nobody was ever going to come down to that dungeon.
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a oni su znali da se nitko nikad neće spustiti dolje u tamnicu.
18:18
So you need a paradigm shift in all of these areas.
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Zato je potreban pomak paradigme u svim ovim područjima.
18:21
The shift is away from the medical model
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Pomak koji je udaljen od medicinskog modela,
18:23
that focuses only on the individual.
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a koji se usredotočuje samo na pojedinca.
18:25
The shift is toward a public health model
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Pomak prema modelu javnog zdravstva
18:28
that recognizes situational and systemic vectors of disease.
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koji prepoznaje situacijske i sustavske čimbenika bolesti.
18:31
Bullying is a disease. Prejudice is a disease. Violence is a disease.
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Zadirkivanje je bolest. Predrasue su bolest. Nasilje je bolest.
18:35
And since the Inquisition, we've been dealing with problems
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Još se od inkvizicije problemima bavimo
18:37
at the individual level. And you know what? It doesn't work.
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na individualnoj razini. I znate što? To ne funkcionira.
18:40
Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn says, "The line between good and evil
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Aleksandar Solženjicin rekao je da linija koja dijeli dobro od zla
18:43
cuts through the heart of every human being."
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zarezuje kroz srce svakog ljudskog bića.
18:45
That means that line is not out there.
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To znači da granica nije negdje vani.
18:47
That's a decision that you have to make. That's a personal thing.
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To je nešto što morate odlučiti. To je osobna stvar.
18:50
So I want to end very quickly on a positive note.
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Zato želim brzo završiti pozitivnom idejom
18:53
Heroism as the antidote to evil,
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junaštva kao protuotrova za zlo.
18:56
by promoting the heroic imagination,
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Promičući junački način razmišljanja,
18:57
especially in our kids, in our educational system.
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posebice kod djece, u obrazovnom sustavu
19:00
We want kids to think, I'm the hero in waiting,
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želimo da djeca razmišljaju - Ja sam budući junak,
19:02
waiting for the right situation to come along,
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čekam da naiđe prava situacija
19:05
and I will act heroically.
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i ja ću se ponijeti junački.
19:06
My whole life is now going to focus away from evil --
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Cijeli moj život sada će se odmaknuti od zla
19:08
that I've been in since I was a kid -- to understanding heroes.
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u kojem sam bio od djetinjstva i okrenuti prema razumijevanju junaka.
19:11
Banality of heroism
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Njihovo poimanje junaštva
19:13
is, it's ordinary people who do heroic deeds.
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su obični ljudi koji čine junačka djela.
19:15
It's the counterpoint to Hannah Arendt's "Banality of Evil."
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To je suprotnost Hannah Arendtinoj Banalnosti zla.
19:18
Our traditional societal heroes are wrong,
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Junaci naših tradicionalnih društava su pogrešni
19:21
because they are the exceptions.
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jer su iznimke.
19:22
They organize their whole life around this.
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Organiziraju cijeli svoj život oko toga.
19:24
That's why we know their names.
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Zato znamo njihova imena.
19:25
And our kids' heroes are also wrong models for them,
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A junaci naše djece istovremeno su im i uzori
19:27
because they have supernatural talents.
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jer imaju nadnaravne moći.
19:30
We want our kids to realize most heroes are everyday people,
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Želimo da naša djeca shvate da su većina junaka obični ljudi,
19:32
and the heroic act is unusual. This is Joe Darby.
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a da je junaštvo neobičan čin. Ovo je Joe Darby.
19:36
He was the one that stopped those abuses you saw,
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On je taj koji je zaustavio zlostavljanja koja ste vidjeli,
19:38
because when he saw those images,
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jer kada je vidio one slike,
19:40
he turned them over to a senior investigating officer.
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predao ih je nadređenom istražitelju.
19:43
He was a low-level private, and that stopped it. Was he a hero? No.
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On je bio običan vojnik i to što je napravio bilo je dovoljno da zaustavi zlostavljanja. Je li bio junak? Nije.
19:47
They had to put him in hiding, because people wanted to kill him,
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Morali su ga skrivati, jer su ga ljudi htjeli ubiti,
19:50
and then his mother and his wife.
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zatim njegovu majku i njegovu suprugu.
19:51
For three years, they were in hiding.
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Tri godine bili su u bijegu.
19:53
This is the woman who stopped the Stanford Prison Study.
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Ovo je žena koja je zaustavila studiju Stanfordskog zatvora.
19:56
When I said it got out of control, I was the prison superintendent.
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Kad sam rekao da je izmakla kontroli, ja sam bio upravitelj zatvora.
19:59
I didn't know it was out of control. I was totally indifferent.
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Nisam znao da je izvan kontrole. Bio sam potpuno ravnodušnan.
20:02
She came down, saw that madhouse and said,
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Ona je sišla, vidjela cijelu ludnicu i rekla:
20:04
"You know what, it's terrible what you're doing to those boys.
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"Znaš što, grozno je to što radiš onim mladićima.
20:07
They're not prisoners, they're not guards,
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Oni nisu zatvorenici, oni nisu čuvari,
20:08
they're boys, and you are responsible."
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oni su mladići, a vi ste odgovorni."
20:11
And I ended the study the next day.
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I sutradan sam prekinuo studiju.
20:13
The good news is I married her the next year.
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Dobra vijest je da sam se oženio njome sljedeće godine.
20:15
(Laughter)
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(Smijeh)
20:18
(Applause)
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(Aplauz)
20:25
I just came to my senses, obviously.
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Očito sam se opametio.
20:27
So situations have the power to do, through --
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Dakle, situacije imaju moć da, putem --
20:31
but the point is, this is the same situation
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no to je ista situacija
20:32
that can inflame the hostile imagination in some of us,
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koja može potaknuti neprijateljske misli u nekima od nas,
20:36
that makes us perpetrators of evil,
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koja nas čini počiniteljima zla,
20:38
can inspire the heroic imagination in others. It's the same situation.
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može nadahnuti junačke misli u drugima. To je ista situacija.
20:42
And you're on one side or the other.
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A vi ste ili na jednoj ili na drugoj strani.
20:43
Most people are guilty of the evil of inaction,
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Većina ljudi kriva je za zlo pasivnosti,
20:45
because your mother said, "Don't get involved. Mind your own business."
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jer vam je majka rekla: "Nemoj se uplitati, gledaj svoja posla."
20:48
And you have to say, "Mama, humanity is my business."
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A vi morate reći: "Mama, čovječnost jest moj posao."
20:51
So the psychology of heroism is -- we're going to end in a moment --
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Psihologija junaštva je -- uskoro ćemo završiti --
20:53
how do we encourage children in new hero courses,
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kako potaknuti djecu u novim programima junaštva,
20:57
that I'm working with Matt Langdon -- he has a hero workshop --
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na kojima radim sa Mattom Langdonom -- on vodi radionicu junaštva --
21:00
to develop this heroic imagination, this self-labeling,
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da razviju ove junačke misli, to samo-označavanje,
21:03
"I am a hero in waiting," and teach them skills.
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"Ja sam budući junak", te ih učimo vještinama.
21:06
To be a hero, you have to learn to be a deviant,
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Da bi ste postali junakom morate naučiti ponašati se devijantno,
21:09
because you're always going against the conformity of the group.
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jer ćete uvijek ići protiv očekivanja grupe.
21:11
Heroes are ordinary people whose social actions are extraordinary. Who act.
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Junaci su obični ljudi čije su društvene radnje izvanredne. Oni djeluju.
21:15
The key to heroism is two things.
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Ključ junaštva su dvije stvari.
21:17
A: you've got to act when other people are passive.
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A: Morate djelovati kada su drugi ljudi pasivni.
21:20
B: you have to act socio-centrically, not egocentrically.
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B: Morate djelovati sociocentrično, a ne egocentrično.
21:23
And I want to end with the story that some of you know,
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Želim završiti pričom koju neki od vas znaju,
21:25
about Wesley Autrey, New York subway hero.
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o Wesleyu Autreyu, junaku njujorške podzemne željeznice.
21:27
Fifty-year-old African-American construction worker.
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50-godišnji afroamerički građevinski radnik.
21:29
He's standing on a subway in New York.
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Stoji na stanici podzemne željeznice u New Yorku;
21:31
A white guy falls on the tracks.
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bijelac pada na tračnice.
21:32
The subway train is coming. There's 75 people there.
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Podzemni vlak dolazi. 75 ljudi je tamo.
21:35
You know what? They freeze.
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Znate što se dogodilo? Svi su se skamenili.
21:36
He's got a reason not to get involved.
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On ima razlog da se ne uplete.
21:38
He's black, the guy's white, and he's got two little kids.
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On je crnac, čovjek u nevolji je bijelac, a uz to on ima i dvoje male djece.
21:41
Instead, he gives his kids to a stranger,
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Umjesto toga, on predaje djecu strancu,
21:42
jumps on the tracks, puts the guy between the tracks,
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skače na tračnice, stavlja čovjeka između tračnica,
21:45
lies on him, the subway goes over him.
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legne na njega, i vlak prelazi preko njih.
21:47
Wesley and the guy -- 20 and a half inches height.
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Wesley i on zajedno su visoki 20.5 inča.
21:51
The train clearance is 21 inches.
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Vlak je na visini od 21 inča.
21:53
A half an inch would have taken his head off.
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Još pola inča i odrezao bi mu glavu.
21:56
And he said, "I did what anyone could do,"
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On kaže: "Napravio sam ono što bi svatko mogao napraviti,
21:59
no big deal to jump on the tracks.
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nije velika stvar skočiti na tračnice."
22:00
And the moral imperative is "I did what everyone should do."
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A moralni imperativ je "Ja sam napravio ono što bi svatko trebao napraviti."
22:04
And so one day, you will be in a new situation.
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I tako jednog dana, naći ćete se novoj situaciji.
22:07
Take path one, you're going to be a perpetrator of evil.
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Odaberite prvi put, i bit ćete počinitelj zla.
22:09
Evil, meaning you're going to be Arthur Andersen.
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Zlo, što znači da ćete biti Arthur Anderson.
22:12
You're going to cheat, or you're going to allow bullying.
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Varat ćete ili ćete dopustiti nasilje.
22:14
Path two, you become guilty of the evil of passive inaction.
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Drugi put: bit ćete krivi za zlo pasivnog nedjelovanja.
22:17
Path three, you become a hero.
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Treći put: postat ćete junak.
22:18
The point is, are we ready to take the path
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Poanta je u tome jesmo li spremni poći putem
22:21
to celebrating ordinary heroes,
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slavljenja običnih junaka,
22:23
waiting for the right situation to come along
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čekajući pravu situaciju
22:25
to put heroic imagination into action?
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kako bismo pokrenuli svoje junačke misli?
22:27
Because it may only happen once in your life,
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Jer to vam se može dogoditi samo jednom u životu,
22:31
and when you pass it by, you'll always know,
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a ako propustite priliku, uvijek ćete znati -
22:32
I could have been a hero and I let it pass me by.
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Mogao sam biti junak, a propustio sam priliku.
22:35
So the point is thinking it and then doing it.
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Dakle, poanta je zamisliti to, a onda i napraviti.
22:37
So I want to thank you. Thank you. Thank you.
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Zato vam želim zahvaliti. Hvala vam. Hvala vam.
22:40
Let's oppose the power of evil systems at home and abroad,
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Suprostavimo se moći zlih sustava u domovini i inozemstvu,
22:43
and let's focus on the positive.
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i usredotočimo se na pozitivno.
22:45
Advocate for respect of personal dignity, for justice and peace,
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Zalažite se za poštivanje osobnog dostojanstva, za pravdu i mir,
22:48
which sadly our administration has not been doing.
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što, nažalost, naša vlada ne radi.
22:50
Thanks so much.
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Puno vam hvala.
22:51
(Applause)
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(Aplauz)
ABOUT THE SPEAKER
Philip Zimbardo - PsychologistPhilip Zimbardo was the leader of the notorious 1971 Stanford Prison Experiment -- and an expert witness at Abu Ghraib. His book The Lucifer Effect explores the nature of evil; now, in his new work, he studies the nature of heroism.
Why you should listen
Philip Zimbardo knows what evil looks like. After serving as an expert witness during the Abu Ghraib trials, he wrote The Lucifer Effect: Understanding How Good People Turn Evil. From Nazi comic books to the tactics of used-car salesmen, he explores a wealth of sources in trying to explain the psychology of evil.
A past president of the American Psychological Association and a professor emeritus at Stanford, Zimbardo retired in 2008 from lecturing, after 50 years of teaching his legendary introductory course in psychology. In addition to his work on evil and heroism, Zimbardo recently published The Time Paradox, exploring different cultural and personal perspectives on time.
Still well-known for his controversial Stanford Prison Experiment, Zimbardo in his new research looks at the psychology of heroism. He asks, "What pushes some people to become perpetrators of evil, while others act heroically on behalf of those in need?"
Philip Zimbardo | Speaker | TED.com