ABOUT THE SPEAKER
Ilona Szabó de Carvalho - Policy reformer
Ilona Szabó de Carvalho leads the Igarapé Institute in Rio de Janeiro, which focuses on security and development policy.

Why you should listen
Ilona Szabó de Carvalho is a drug policy and public security specialist with experience from Brazil and around the world. A founder of the Igarapé Institute, a think-and-do tank, she also coordinates the international Global Commission on Drug Policy.

Over the past decade, Ilona has played a central role in triggering debate on progressive approaches to preventing violence, advocating gun control and police reform, and dealing with drugs, pushing for a radical re-examination of key policies. In particular, recognizing that drug prohibition has done little to slake demand for drugs or to reduce profit margins for the cartels (and the armed violence to which they are inexorably linked), de Carvalho believes we should shift the control of drugs from organized crime to governments -- and view abuse as a health problem, not as a criminal offense.
More profile about the speaker
Ilona Szabó de Carvalho | Speaker | TED.com
TEDGlobal 2014

Ilona Szabó de Carvalho: 4 lessons I learned from taking a stand against drugs and gun violence

Filmed:
1,211,496 views

Throughout her career in banking Ilona Szabó de Carvalho never imagined she'd someday start a social movement. But living in her native Brazil, which leads the world in homicidal violence, she realized she couldn't just stand by and watch drugs and guns tear her country apart. Szabó de Carvalho reveals four crucial lessons she learned when she left her cushy job and took a fearless stand against the status quo.
- Policy reformer
Ilona Szabó de Carvalho leads the Igarapé Institute in Rio de Janeiro, which focuses on security and development policy. Full bio

Double-click the English transcript below to play the video.

00:12
About 12 years ago,
0
817
2176
00:14
I gave up my career in banking
1
2993
2252
00:17
to try to make the world a safer place.
2
5245
3111
00:20
This involved a journey into
national and global advocacy
3
8356
4209
00:24
and meeting some of the most
extraordinary people in the world.
4
12565
4823
00:29
In the process, I became
a civil society diplomat.
5
17388
5178
00:34
Civil society diplomats do three things:
6
22566
3506
00:38
They voice the concerns of the people,
7
26072
2531
00:40
are not pinned down by national interests,
8
28603
3088
00:43
and influence change
through citizen networks,
9
31691
2837
00:46
not only state ones.
10
34528
2556
00:49
And if you want to change the world,
we need more of them.
11
37084
4599
00:53
But many people still ask,
12
41683
2507
00:56
"Can civil society really
make a big difference?
13
44190
4551
01:00
Can citizens influence and shape
national and global policy?"
14
48741
5271
01:06
I never thought I would ask
myself these questions,
15
54012
2949
01:08
but here I am to share some lessons
16
56961
3250
01:12
about two powerful civil society
movements that I've been involved in.
17
60211
5016
01:17
They are in issues
that I'm passionate about:
18
65227
3808
01:21
gun control and drug policy.
19
69035
4179
01:25
And these are issues that matter here.
20
73214
3645
01:28
Latin America is ground zero
for both of them.
21
76859
5394
01:34
For example, Brazil --
22
82253
2043
01:36
this beautiful country hosting TEDGlobal
has the world's ugliest record.
23
84296
6254
01:42
We are the number one champion
in homicidal violence.
24
90550
5898
01:48
One in every 10 people killed
around the world is a Brazilian.
25
96448
6116
01:54
This translates into over 56,000 people
26
102569
5109
01:59
dying violently each year.
27
107678
3483
02:03
Most of them are young, black boys
dying by guns.
28
111161
5921
02:09
Brazil is also one of the world's
largest consumers of drugs,
29
117082
5131
02:14
and the War on Drugs
has been especially painful here.
30
122213
4853
02:19
Around 50 percent of the homicides
in the streets in Brazil
31
127066
3273
02:22
are related to the War on Drugs.
32
130339
3437
02:25
The same is true for about
25 percent of people in jail.
33
133776
5688
02:31
And it's not just Brazil that is affected
by the twin problems of guns and drugs.
34
139464
5132
02:36
Virtually every country and city across
Central and South America is in trouble.
35
144596
7024
02:43
Latin America has nine percent
of the world's population,
36
151620
4249
02:47
but 25 percent
of its global violent deaths.
37
155869
5061
02:52
These are not problems
we can run away from.
38
160930
3042
02:55
I certainly could not.
39
163972
2299
02:58
So the first campaign I got involved with
started here in 2003
40
166271
4876
03:03
to change Brazil's gun law
41
171147
2043
03:05
and to create a program
to buy back weapons.
42
173190
3088
03:08
In just a few years,
43
176278
1579
03:09
we not only changed national legislation
44
177857
2438
03:12
that made it much more difficult
for civilians to buy a gun,
45
180295
3738
03:16
but we collected and destroyed
almost half a million weapons.
46
184033
5650
03:21
This was one of the biggest
buyback programs in history --
47
189683
4579
03:26
(Applause) --
48
194262
2659
03:28
but we also suffered some setbacks.
49
196921
3621
03:32
We lost a referendum to ban
gun sales to civilians in 2005.
50
200542
5782
03:38
The second initiative was also home-grown,
51
206324
3273
03:41
but is today a global movement to reform
the international drug control regime.
52
209597
5550
03:47
I am the executive coordinator
53
215147
1791
03:48
of something called
the Global Commission on Drug Policy.
54
216938
4478
03:53
The commission is a high-level group
55
221416
2438
03:55
of global leaders brought together
to identify more humane
56
223854
3901
03:59
and effective approaches
to the issue of drugs.
57
227755
4156
04:03
Since we started in 2008,
the taboo on drugs is broken.
58
231911
4568
04:08
Across the Americas, from the US
and Mexico to Colombia and Uruguay,
59
236479
4952
04:13
change is in the air.
60
241431
2148
04:15
But rather than tell you the whole story
about these two movements,
61
243579
3802
04:19
I just want to share with you
four key insights.
62
247381
3808
04:23
I call them lessons to change the world.
63
251189
3599
04:26
There are certainly many more,
64
254788
2229
04:29
but these are the ones
that stand out to me.
65
257017
3297
04:32
So the first lesson is:
66
260314
2182
04:34
Change and control the narrative.
67
262496
3274
04:37
It may seem obvious,
68
265770
1834
04:39
but a key ingredient
to civil society diplomacy
69
267604
3042
04:42
is first changing and then
controlling the narrative.
70
270646
4087
04:46
This is something that veteran
politicians understand,
71
274733
3157
04:49
but that civil society groups
generally do not do very well.
72
277890
4923
04:54
In the case of drug policy,
73
282813
2345
04:57
our biggest success has been
to change the discussion
74
285158
3460
05:00
away from prosecuting a War on Drugs
75
288618
2809
05:03
to putting people's health
and safety first.
76
291427
3971
05:07
In a cutting-edge report
we just launched in New York,
77
295398
3436
05:10
we also showed that the groups benefiting
most from this $320 billion market
78
298834
7569
05:18
are criminal gangs and cartels.
79
306403
3321
05:21
So in order to undermine
the power and profit of these groups,
80
309724
3738
05:25
we need to change the conversation.
81
313462
2972
05:28
We need to make illegal drugs legal.
82
316434
6292
05:34
But before I get you too excited,
83
322726
2833
05:37
I don't mean drugs
should be a free-for-all.
84
325559
3135
05:40
What I'm talking about, and what
the Global Commission advocates for
85
328702
4125
05:44
is creating a highly regulated market,
86
332827
4527
05:49
where different drugs would have
different degrees of regulation.
87
337354
5225
05:54
As for gun control,
we were successful in changing,
88
342579
4040
05:58
but not so much
in controlling, the narrative.
89
346619
2925
06:01
And this brings me to my next lesson:
90
349544
2856
06:04
Never underestimate your opponents.
91
352400
3924
06:08
If you want to succeed
in changing the world,
92
356324
2229
06:10
you need to know who you're up against.
93
358553
2369
06:12
You need to learn their motivations
and points of view.
94
360922
3668
06:16
In the case of gun control,
95
364590
2206
06:18
we really underestimated our opponents.
96
366796
3553
06:22
After a very successful
gun-collection program,
97
370349
2925
06:25
we were elated.
98
373274
1344
06:26
We had support from
80 percent of Brazilians,
99
374618
2836
06:29
and thought that this could help us
win the referendum
100
377454
2881
06:32
to ban gun sales to civilians.
101
380335
2412
06:34
But we were dead wrong.
102
382747
3181
06:37
During a televised 20-day public debate,
103
385928
3321
06:41
our opponent used
our own arguments against us.
104
389249
3854
06:45
We ended up losing the popular vote.
105
393103
2229
06:47
It was really terrible.
106
395332
2345
06:49
The National Rifle Association --
yes, the American NRA --
107
397677
6159
06:55
came to Brazil.
108
403836
1759
06:57
They inundated our campaign
with their propaganda,
109
405595
3100
07:00
that as you know,
110
408695
1543
07:02
links the right to own guns
to ideas of freedom and democracy.
111
410238
4343
07:06
They simply threw everything at us.
112
414581
3877
07:10
They used our national flag,
113
418458
1927
07:12
our independence anthem.
114
420385
1695
07:14
They invoked women's rights
115
422080
1835
07:15
and misused images of Mandela,
Tiananmen Square, and even Hitler.
116
423915
5387
07:21
They won by playing with people's fears.
117
429302
3970
07:25
In fact, guns were almost completely
ignored in their campaign.
118
433272
4644
07:29
Their focus was on individual rights.
119
437916
3297
07:33
But I ask you,
120
441213
1579
07:34
which right is more important,
121
442792
2229
07:37
the right to life
122
445021
1811
07:38
or the right to have a gun
that takes life away?
123
446832
3065
07:41
(Applause)
124
449897
4253
07:46
We thought people would vote
in defense of life,
125
454150
3822
07:49
but in a country with a recent past
of military dictatorship,
126
457972
4784
07:54
the anti-government message
of our opponents resonated,
127
462756
4271
07:59
and we were not prepared to respond.
128
467027
3599
08:02
Lesson learned.
129
470626
2089
08:04
We've been more successful
in the case of drug policy.
130
472715
3290
08:08
If you asked most people 10 years ago if
an end to the War on Drugs was possible,
131
476005
4714
08:12
they would have laughed.
132
480719
2012
08:14
After all, there are huge
military police prisons
133
482731
3498
08:18
and financial establishments
benefiting from this war.
134
486229
4096
08:22
But today, the international drug
control regime is starting to crumble.
135
490325
5772
08:28
Governments and civil societies
are experimenting with new approaches.
136
496097
4829
08:32
The Global Commission on Drug Policy
137
500926
2322
08:35
really knew its opposition,
138
503248
2067
08:37
and rather than fighting them,
139
505315
1834
08:39
our chair -- former Brazilian President
Fernando Henrique Cardoso --
140
507149
4644
08:43
reached out to leaders
from across the political spectrum,
141
511793
4272
08:48
from liberals to conservatives.
142
516065
2810
08:50
This high level group
agreed to honestly discuss
143
518875
4876
08:55
the merits and flaws of drug policies.
144
523751
1950
08:57
It was this reasoned, informed
and strategic discussion
145
525701
4760
09:02
that revealed the sad truth
about the War on Drugs.
146
530461
3761
09:06
The War on Drugs has simply failed
across every metric.
147
534222
6316
09:12
Drugs are cheaper
and more available than ever,
148
540538
2902
09:15
and consumption has risen globally.
149
543440
2787
09:18
But even worse,
150
546227
2182
09:20
it also generated massive
negative unintended consequences.
151
548409
6571
09:26
It is true that some people
have made these arguments before,
152
554980
3646
09:30
but we've made a difference
153
558626
1740
09:32
by anticipating the arguments
of our opponents
154
560366
3012
09:35
and by leveraging powerful voices
155
563378
2106
09:37
that a few years ago
would probably have resisted change.
156
565484
4890
09:42
Third lesson: Use data
to drive your argument.
157
570374
4087
09:46
Guns and drugs are emotive issues,
158
574461
2995
09:49
and as we've painfully learned
in the gun referendum campaign in Brazil,
159
577456
3901
09:53
sometimes it's impossible
to cut through the emotions
160
581357
3065
09:56
and get to the facts.
161
584422
2090
09:58
But this doesn't mean
that we shouldn't try.
162
586512
3088
10:01
Until quite recently,
163
589600
1651
10:03
we simply didn't know
how many Brazilians were killed by guns.
164
591251
4014
10:07
Amazingly, it was a local soap opera
called "Mulheres Apaixonadas" --
165
595265
5515
10:12
or "Women in Love" --
166
600780
1718
10:14
that kicked off Brazil's
national gun control campaign.
167
602498
3912
10:18
In one highly viewed episode,
168
606410
2462
10:20
a soap opera lead actress
was killed by a stray bullet.
169
608872
4202
10:25
Brazilian grannies
and housewives were outraged,
170
613074
4296
10:29
and in a case of art imitating life,
171
617370
3274
10:32
this episode also included footage
of a real gun control march
172
620644
5294
10:37
that we had organized right here,
173
625938
2484
10:40
outside in Copacabana Beach.
174
628422
2833
10:43
The televised death and march
had a huge impact on public opinion.
175
631255
5444
10:48
Within weeks, our national congress
approved the disarmament bill
176
636699
4784
10:53
that had been languishing for years.
177
641483
3088
10:56
We were then able to mobilize data
178
644571
3015
10:59
to show the successful outcomes
of the change in the law
179
647586
3300
11:02
and gun collection program.
180
650886
2121
11:05
Here is what I mean:
181
653007
1762
11:06
We could prove that in just one year,
182
654769
3524
11:10
we saved more than 5,000 lives.
183
658293
4806
11:15
(Applause)
184
663099
3763
11:18
And in the case of drugs,
185
666862
2414
11:21
in order to undermine this fear
and prejudice that surrounds the issue,
186
669276
5294
11:26
we managed to gather and present data
that shows that today's drug policies
187
674570
5108
11:31
cause much more harm than drug use per se,
188
679678
3871
11:35
and people are starting to get it.
189
683549
4133
11:39
My fourth insight is:
190
687682
2136
11:41
Don't be afraid to bring
together odd bedfellows.
191
689818
4226
11:46
What we've learned in Brazil --
192
694044
1974
11:48
and this doesn't only
apply to my country --
193
696018
2345
11:50
is the importance of bringing diverse
and eclectic folks together.
194
698363
4632
11:54
If you want to change the world,
195
702995
2136
11:57
it helps to have a good cross-section
of society on your side.
196
705131
4296
12:01
In both the case of guns and drugs,
197
709427
2600
12:04
we brought together
a wonderful mix of people.
198
712027
3436
12:07
We mobilized the elite
and got huge support from the media.
199
715463
4204
12:11
We gathered the victims,
human rights champions, cultural icons.
200
719667
4457
12:16
We also assembled
the professional classes --
201
724124
2577
12:18
doctors, lawyers, academia and more.
202
726701
2996
12:21
What I've learned over the last years
203
729697
2740
12:24
is that you need coalitions of the willing
and of the unwilling to make change.
204
732437
5900
12:30
In the case of drugs,
205
738337
1867
12:32
we needed libertarians,
anti-prohibitionists, legalizers,
206
740204
3587
12:35
and liberal politicians.
207
743791
2345
12:38
They may not agree on everything;
208
746136
2461
12:40
in fact, they disagree
on almost everything.
209
748597
4249
12:44
But the legitimacy of the campaign
is based on their diverse points of view.
210
752846
5769
12:51
Over a decade ago,
211
759521
2241
12:53
I had a comfortable future
working for an investment bank.
212
761762
4458
12:58
I was as far removed from the world
of civil society diplomacy
213
766220
4272
13:02
as you can imagine.
214
770492
2276
13:04
But I took a chance.
215
772768
2159
13:06
I changed course,
216
774927
1997
13:08
and on the way, I helped
to create social movements
217
776924
3360
13:12
that I believe have made
some parts of the world safer.
218
780284
4720
13:17
Each and every one of us
has the power to change the world.
219
785004
5174
13:22
No matter what the issue,
and no matter how hard the fight,
220
790178
4612
13:26
civil society is central
to the blueprint for change.
221
794790
4714
13:31
Thank you.
222
799504
2311
13:33
(Applause)
223
801815
4017

▲Back to top

ABOUT THE SPEAKER
Ilona Szabó de Carvalho - Policy reformer
Ilona Szabó de Carvalho leads the Igarapé Institute in Rio de Janeiro, which focuses on security and development policy.

Why you should listen
Ilona Szabó de Carvalho is a drug policy and public security specialist with experience from Brazil and around the world. A founder of the Igarapé Institute, a think-and-do tank, she also coordinates the international Global Commission on Drug Policy.

Over the past decade, Ilona has played a central role in triggering debate on progressive approaches to preventing violence, advocating gun control and police reform, and dealing with drugs, pushing for a radical re-examination of key policies. In particular, recognizing that drug prohibition has done little to slake demand for drugs or to reduce profit margins for the cartels (and the armed violence to which they are inexorably linked), de Carvalho believes we should shift the control of drugs from organized crime to governments -- and view abuse as a health problem, not as a criminal offense.
More profile about the speaker
Ilona Szabó de Carvalho | Speaker | TED.com