TEDxRiodelaPlata
Dan Ariely: What makes us feel good about our work?
Dan Ariely: Što nas čini sretnim oko našeg posla?
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Što nas motivira na rad? Suprotno od konvencionalne mudrosti, nije samo novac. Ali nije niti samo radost. Čini se da većina nas napreduje sa stalnim napredkom i osjećajem svrhe. Bihevioralni ekonomist, Dan Ariely, predstavlja dva prosvjetiteljska eksperimenta koja otkrivaju naše neočekivane i postepene stavive o značenju posla. (Snimljenu u TEDxRiodelaPlata.)
Dan Ariely - Behavioral economist
The dismal science of economics is not as firmly grounded in actual behavior as was once supposed. In "Predictably Irrational," Dan Ariely told us why. Full bio
The dismal science of economics is not as firmly grounded in actual behavior as was once supposed. In "Predictably Irrational," Dan Ariely told us why. Full bio
Double-click the English transcript below to play the video.
00:12
I want to talk a little bit today
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Pričat ću vam danas malo
00:14
about labor and work.
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o radu i poslu.
00:18
When we think about how people work,
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Kada razmišljamo kako ljudi rade,
00:21
the naive intuition we have
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naša naivna intuicija je
00:23
is that people are like rats in a maze --
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da su ljudi kao štakori u labirintu --
00:25
that all people care about is money,
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da je novac sve o čemu ljudi brinu
00:28
and the moment we give people money,
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i u trenutku kada ljudima damo novac,
00:29
we can direct them to work one way,
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možemo ih usmjeriti prema radu u jednom smjeru,
00:31
we can direct them to work another way.
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možemo ih usmjeriti prema radu u drugom smjeru.
00:33
This is why we give bonuses to bankers and pay in all kinds of ways.
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Zato dajemo bonuse bankarima i plaćamo ih na razne načine.
00:36
And we really have this incredibly simplistic view
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I imamo stvarno nevjerojatno pojednostavljen pogled
00:40
of why people work and what the labor market looks like.
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na to zašto ljudi rade i kako izgleda tržište rada.
00:44
At the same time, if you think about it,
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U isto vrijeme, ako malo razmislite,
00:47
there's all kinds of strange behaviors in the world around us.
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postoje svakojake vrste čudnih ponašanja u svijetu oko nas.
00:50
Think about something like mountaineering and mountain climbing.
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Razmislite o nečemu poput planinarenja i alpinizma.
00:53
If you read books of people who climb mountains, difficult mountains,
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Ako čitate knjige ljudi koji planinare, na teške dionice,
00:58
do you think that those books are full of moments of joy and happiness?
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mislite li da su te knjige pune trenutaka radosti i sreće?
01:03
No, they are full of misery.
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Ne, pune su jada.
01:05
In fact, it's all about frostbite and difficulty to walk
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Zapravo, pišu o ozeblinama i poteškoćama pri hodanju
01:09
and difficulty of breathing --
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i poteškoćama pri disanju --
01:11
cold, challenging circumstances.
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o hladnim, izazovnim okolnostima.
01:14
And if people were just trying to be happy,
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I da su ljudi samo pokušavali biti sretni,
01:16
the moment they would get to the top,
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u trenutku kada bi došli do vrha
01:18
they would say, "This was a terrible mistake.
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rekli bi, "Ovo je bila grozna pogreška.
01:20
I'll never do it again."
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Nikada ovo neću ponoviti."
01:21
(Laughter)
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(Smijeh)
01:23
"Instead, let me sit on a beach somewhere drinking mojitos."
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Umjesto toga, pustite me da sjedim negdje na plaži i pijem mojitose."
01:27
But instead, people go down,
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Ali umjesto toga, ljudi se spuste,
01:30
and after they recover, they go up again.
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i nakon što se oporave, ponovo se penju.
01:33
And if you think about mountain climbing as an example,
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I ako razmislite o planinarstvu kao primjeru
01:36
it suggests all kinds of things.
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ono sugerira razne stvari.
01:38
It suggests that we care about reaching the end, a peak.
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Sugerira da nam je stalo da dođemo do kraja, do vrha.
01:42
It suggests that we care about the fight, about the challenge.
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Sugerira da nam je stalo do borbe, do izazova.
01:46
It suggests that there's all kinds of other things
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Sugerira da postoje svakakve druge stvari
01:48
that motivate us to work or behave in all kinds of ways.
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koje nas motiviraju da radimo ili se ponašamo na razne načine.
01:53
And for me personally, I started thinking about this
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Ja sam osobno počeo razmišljati o tome
01:56
after a student came to visit me.
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nakon što me posjetio jedan od studenata.
01:59
This was a student that was one of my students a few years earlier.
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Bio je to jedan od mojih studenata nekoliko godina ranije.
02:03
And he came one day back to campus.
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I jednog se dana vratio na kampus.
02:05
And he told me the following story:
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I ispričao mi je slijedeću priču:
02:08
He said that for more than two weeks, he was working on a PowerPoint presentation.
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Rekao mi je da je više od dva tjedna radio na Power Point prezentaciji.
02:13
He was working in a big bank.
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Radio je u velikoj banci.
02:15
This was in preparation for a merger and acquisition.
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Radilo se o pripremama za pripajanje i kupnju.
02:19
And he was working very hard on this presentation --
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I uložio je puno truda u tu prezentaciju --
02:21
graphs, tables, information.
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grafovi, tabele, informacije.
02:23
He stayed late at night every day.
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Svakog je dana ostajao do kasno u noći,
02:27
And the day before it was due,
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I dan prije roka za predaju,
02:29
he sent his PowerPoint presentation to his boss,
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poslao je svoju Power Point prezentaciju svome šefu,
02:32
and his boss wrote him back and said,
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i njegov mu je šef odgovorio,
02:35
"Nice presentation, but the merger is canceled."
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"Lijepa prezentacija, ali pripajanje je otkazano."
02:40
And the guy was deeply depressed.
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I mladić je bio strašno deprimiran.
02:42
Now at the moment when he was working,
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Ali u trenutku kada je radio
02:44
he was actually quite happy.
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zapravo je bio jako sretan.
02:46
Every night he was enjoying his work,
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Svake je večeri uživao u svom poslu,
02:48
he was staying late, he was perfecting this PowerPoint presentation.
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ostajao je do kasno, usavršavao je tu Power Point prezentaciju.
02:53
But knowing that nobody would ever watch that made him quite depressed.
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Ali saznanje da ju nitko nikada neće vidjeti ga je učinilo depresivnim.
02:58
So I started thinking about how do we experiment
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I tako sam počeo razmišljati o tome kako da eksperimentiramo
03:01
with this idea of the fruits of our labor.
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sa idejom o plodovima našeg rada.
03:05
And to start with, we created a little experiment
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I za početak, stvorili smo mali eksperiment
03:09
in which we gave people Legos, and we asked them to build with Legos.
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u kojem smo ljudima dali Lego kockice, i zamolili smo ih da grade tim Lego kockicama.
03:15
And for some people, we gave them Legos and we said,
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I nekim smo ljudima dali Lego kockice i rekli,
03:19
"Hey, would you like to build this Bionicle for three dollars?
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"Hej, bi li htio izraditi ovu Lego Bionicle igračku za tri dolara?
03:24
We'll pay you three dollars for it."
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Platit ćemo ti tri dolara za nju."
03:26
And people said yes, and they built with these Legos.
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I ljudi su rekli da bi, i gradili su tim Lego kockicama.
03:29
And when they finished, we took it, we put it under the table,
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I kada su završili, uzeli smo je, stavili ispod stola,
03:33
and we said, "Would you like to build another one, this time for $2.70?"
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i rekli, "Bi li htjeli izraditi drugu, ovog puta za 2.70 dolara?"
03:38
If they said yes, we gave them another one.
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I ako su rekli da bi, dali smo im drugu.
03:40
And when they finished, we asked them,
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I kada su završili smo ih pitali,
03:41
"Do you want to build another one?" for $2.40, $2.10, and so on,
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"Bi li htjeli izraditi drugu?" za 2,40, 2,10 dolara, i tako dalje,
03:46
until at some point people said, "No more. It's not worth it for me."
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dok u jednom trenutku nebi rekli, "Više ne. Nije vrijedno mog truda."
03:51
This was what we called the meaningful condition.
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I to smo nazvali smislenim uvjetom.
03:54
People built one Bionicle after another.
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Ljude izgrađuju jednu igračku Bionicle za drugom.
03:57
After they finished every one of them, we put them under the table.
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I kad svaku završe, mi ih stavimo ispod stola.
04:00
And we told them that at the end of the experiment,
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I rekli smo im da ćemo na kraju eksperimenta
04:03
we will take all these Bionicles, we will disassemble them,
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uzeti te igračke i rastaviti ih,
04:06
we will put them back in the boxes, and we will use it for the next participant.
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stavit ćemo ih natrag u kutije i iskoristiti za slijedećeg učesnika.
04:11
There was another condition.
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Postojao je i drugi uvjet.
04:13
This other condition was inspired by David, my student.
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Inspiracija za drugi uvjet je bio David, moj student.
04:17
And this other condition we called the Sisyphic condition.
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I taj smo drugi uvjet nazvali Sizifov uvjet.
04:21
And if you remember the story about Sisyphus,
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I ako se sjećate priče o Sizifu,
04:23
Sisyphus was punished by the gods to push the same rock up a hill,
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Sizifa su kaznili bogovi na način da je morao gurati isti kamen uz brijeg
04:28
and when he almost got to the end,
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i kada bi bio blizu vrha,
04:30
the rock would roll over, and he would have to start again.
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kamen bi se otkotrljao natrag i on bi morao početi ispočetka.
04:33
And you can think about this as the essence of doing futile work.
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I možete o tome razmišljati kao o srži uzaludnog rada.
04:38
You can imagine that if he pushed the rock on different hills,
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Možete zamisliti ako bi gurao kamen uz druge brežuljke,
04:41
at least he would have some sense of progress.
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da bi barem imao nekakav osjećaj napretka.
04:44
Also, if you look at prison movies,
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Također, ako se osvrnete na filmove o zatvorima,
04:46
sometimes the way that the guards torture the prisoners
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ponekad način na koji stražari muče zatvorenike
04:50
is to get them to dig a hole
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je natjerati ih da iskopaju rupu
04:52
and when the prisoner is finished, they ask him to fill the hole back up and then dig again.
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i kada je zatvorenik pri kraju, zatraže ga da natrag napuni rupu i ponovo je iskopa.
04:56
There's something about this cyclical version
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Ima nešto u toj cikličkoj verziji
04:59
of doing something over and over and over
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ponavljanja nečeg ispočetka i opet i opet
05:01
that seems to be particularly demotivating.
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što se čini posebno demotivirajućim.
05:04
So in the second condition of this experiment, that's exactly what we did.
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Znači u drugom uvjetu ovog eksperimenta, točno smo to učinili.
05:07
We asked people, "Would you like to build one Bionicle for three dollars?"
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Pitali smo ljude, "Bi li htjeli izgraditi jednu igračku Bionicle za tri dolara?"
05:12
And if they said yes, they built it.
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I ako bi rekli da žele, sagradili bi ju.
05:14
Then we asked them, "Do you want to build another one for $2.70?"
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Onda bi ih pitali, "Želite li sagraditi drugu za 2.70 dolara?"
05:18
And if they said yes, we gave them a new one,
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I ako bi rekli da žele, dali bi im drugu,
05:21
and as they were building it,
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i dok bi je sastavljali,
05:23
we took apart the one that they just finished.
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oduzeli bi im onu koju bi bili završili.
05:26
And when they finished that,
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I kad bi završili tu,
05:29
we said, "Would you like to build another one, this time for 30 cents less?"
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rekli bi, "Bi li htjeli sastaviti drugu, ovog puta za 30 centi manje?"
05:32
And if they said yes, we gave them the one that they built and we broke.
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I ako bi rekli da bi htjeli, dali bi im onu koju su sastavili i koju smo rastavili.
05:36
So this was an endless cycle
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I to je bio beskonačan ciklus
05:39
of them building and us destroying in front of their eyes.
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u kojem su oni gradili, a mi uništavali pred njihovim očima.
05:44
Now what happens when you compare these two conditions?
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I što se dogodi kada se usporede ta dva uvjeta?
05:48
The first thing that happened
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Prva stvar koja se dogodila
05:49
was that people built many more Bionicles -- they built 11 versus seven --
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je da su ljudi sastavili puno više igračaka Bionicle --- sastavili su 11 nasuprot 7 ---
05:53
in the meaningful condition versus the Sisyphus condition.
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u značajnom uvjetu nasuprot Sizifovog uvjeta.
05:56
And by the way, we should point out that this was not a big meaning.
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I usput, trebali bi istaknuti da se ovome ne pridodaje veliko značenje.
05:59
People were not curing cancer or building bridges.
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Ljudi nisu liječili rak ili gradili mostove.
06:02
People were building Bionicles for a few cents.
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Sastavljali su igračke Bionicle za nekoliko centi.
06:06
And not only that, everybody knew that the Bionicles would be destroyed quite soon.
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I ne samo to, svi su znali da će igračke biti uskoro uništene.
06:11
So there was not a real opportunity for big meaning.
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I nije bilo stvarne prilike za veliko značenje.
06:14
But even the small meaning made a difference.
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Ali čak je i malo značenje bilo značajno.
06:18
Now we had another version of this experiment.
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Imali smo i drugu verziju tog eksperimenta.
06:20
In this other version of the experiment,
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U toj drugoj verziji eksperimenta,
06:22
we didn't put people in this situation,
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nismo ljude stavili u tu situaciju,
06:24
we just described to them the situation, much as I am describing to you now,
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samo smo im opisali situaciju, kao što je ja sada opisujem vama,
06:28
and we asked them to predict what the result would be.
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I zamolili smo ih da predvide koji bi bio rezultat.
06:31
What happened?
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I što se dogodilo?
06:33
People predicted the right direction but not the right magnitude.
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Ljudi su predvidjeli pravi put ali ne pravu magnitudu.
06:37
People who were just given the description of the experiment
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Ljudi kojima smo samo opisali eksperiment
06:41
said that in the meaningful condition people would probably build one more Bionicle.
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su rekli da bi u smislenom uvjetu ljudi najvjerojatnije sagradili još jednu igračku Bionicle.
06:45
So people understand that meaning is important,
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Dakle ljudi razumiju da je značenje važno,
06:47
they just don't understand the magnitude of the importance,
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samo ne razumiju magnitudu značajnosti,
06:50
the extent to which it's important.
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opseg važnosti.
06:52
There was one other piece of data we looked at.
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Postoji drugi podatak koji smo sagledali.
06:55
If you think about it, there are some people who love Legos and some people who don't.
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Ako bolje razmislite, postoje ljudi koji vole Lego kockice i ljudi koji ne vole Lego kockice.
07:00
And you would speculate that the people who love Legos
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I možete nagađati da bi ljudi koji vole Lego kockice
07:02
will build more Legos, even for less money,
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sagradili više legosa, čak i za manje novaca,
07:05
because after all, they get more internal joy from it.
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jer, nakon svega, dobivaju više unutarnje radosti iz toga.
07:08
And the people who love Legos less will build less Legos
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I ljudi koji manje vole Lego kockice će sagraditi manje legosa
07:11
because the enjoyment that they derive from it is lower.
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jer zadovoljstvo koje dobivaju iz njega je manje.
07:14
And that's actually what we found in the meaningful condition.
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I to je zapravo ono što pronalazimo u smislenom uvjetu.
07:17
There was a very nice correlation between love of Lego
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Postojala je krasna povezanosti između ljubavi prema Lego kockama
07:20
and the amount of Legos people built.
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i količine Lego kockica koju su ljudi sagradili.
07:22
What happened in the Sisyphic condition?
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Što se dogodilo u Sizifovom uvjetu?
07:25
In that condition the correlation was zero.
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U tom je uvjetu povezanost bila na nuli.
07:28
There was no relationship between the love of Lego and how much people built,
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Nije postojala nikakva veza između ljubavi prema Lego kockicama i količini sagrađenih legosa,
07:32
which suggests to me that with this manipulation
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što mi predlaže da sa tom manipulacijom
07:35
of breaking things in front of people's eyes,
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uništavanja stvari pred tuđim očima,
07:37
we basically crushed any joy that they could get out of this activity.
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načelno uništavamo bilo kakvu radost koju bi oni mogli dobiti iz tog rada.
07:42
We basically eliminated it.
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U stvari smo ju eliminirali.
07:45
Soon after I finished running this experiment,
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Ubrzo nakon što sam završio s provođenjem tog eksperimenta,
07:49
I went to talk to a big software company in Seattle.
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otišao sam na razgovor sa velikom software kompanijom u Seattleu.
07:53
I can't tell you who they were, but they were a big company in Seattle.
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Ne mogu vam reći tko su bili, ali se radi o velikoj kompaniji u Seatlleu.
07:56
And this was a group within this software company that was put in a different building.
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I radilo se o grupi unutar te softwarske kompanije koja je bila smještena u drugu zgradu.
08:01
And they asked them to innovate and create the next big product for this company.
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I zamolili su ih da inoviraju i osmisle slijedeći veliki proizvod za tu kompaniju.
08:06
And the week before I showed up,
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I tjedan dana prije nego sam ja stigao,
08:08
the CEO of this big software company went to that group, 200 engineers,
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glavni izvršni direktor te softwarske kompanije je otišao u tu grupu, 200 inžinjera,
08:12
and canceled the project.
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i otkazao projekt.
08:15
And I stood there in front of 200 of the most depressed people I've ever talked to.
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I ja sam stajao ispred najviše depresivnih 200 ljudi s kojima sam ikad razgovarao.
08:20
And I described to them some of these Lego experiments,
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I opisao sam im neke od tih eksperimenata Lego kockicama,
08:23
and they said they felt like they had just been through that experiment.
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i odgovorili su da se osjećaju kao da su upravo prošli kroz taj eksperiment.
08:28
And I asked them, I said,
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I pitao sam ih, rekao sam,
08:30
"How many of you now show up to work later than you used to?"
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"Koliko vas sada dolazi na posao kasnije nego prije?"
08:33
And everybody raised their hand.
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I svi su digli ruku.
08:35
I said, "How many of you now go home earlier than you used to?"
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Rekao sam, "Koliko vas sada odlazi kući ranije nego prije?"
08:38
And everybody raised their hand.
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I svi su digli ruku.
08:40
I asked them, "How many of you now add not-so-kosher things to your expense reports?"
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I pitao sam ih, "Koliko vas sada dodaje ne toliko dobro pripremljene stvari u izvješćima o izdatku?"
08:46
And they didn't really raise their hands,
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I zapravo i nisu digli ruke,
08:48
but they took me out to dinner and showed me what they could do with expense reports.
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ali su me odveli na večeru i pokazali su mi što bi mogli učiniti sa tim izvješćima o izdatku.
08:53
And then I asked them, I said,
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I nakon toga sam ih pitao, rekao sam,
08:55
"What could the CEO have done to make you not as depressed?"
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"Što bi glavni izvršni direktor mogao učiniti da ne budete toliko depresivni?"
09:00
And they came up with all kinds of ideas.
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I došli su do puno različitih ideja.
09:02
They said the CEO could have asked them to present to the whole company
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Rekli su da ih je glavni izvršni direktor mogao pitati da naprave prezentaciju za cijelu kompaniju
09:05
about their journey over the last two years and what they decided to do.
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o njihovom putu u protekle dvije godine i o svemu što su odlučiti učiniti.
09:09
He could have asked them to think about which aspect of their technology
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Mogao ih je zatražiti da razmisle o tome koji bi aspekt njihove tehnologije
09:12
could fit with other parts of the organization.
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mogao odgovarati drugim dijelovima udruženja.
09:16
He could have asked them to build some prototypes, some next-generation prototypes,
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Mogao ih je zamoliti da izrade nekoliko prototipa, nekoliko prototipa slijedeće generacije,
09:19
and seen how they would work.
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i vidjeti kako rade.
09:21
But the thing is that any one of those
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Ali stvar je u tome da bilo koji od tih
09:23
would require some effort and motivation.
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zahtjeva napor i motivaciju.
09:26
And I think the CEO basically did not understand the importance of meaning.
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I mislim da glavni izvršni direktor zapravo nije razumio važnost značenja.
09:30
If the CEO, just like our participants,
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Da je glavni izvršni direktor, baš kao i naši sudionici,
09:33
thought the essence of meaning is unimportant,
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smatrao da bit značenja nije važan,
09:36
then he [wouldn't] care.
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onda mu nebi bilo stalo.
09:37
And he would tell them, "At the moment I directed you in this way,
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I rekao bi im, "U ovom vas trenutku usmjeravam na ovaj put,
09:40
and now that I am directing you in this way,
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i sada kada vas usmjeravam tim putem,
09:42
everything will be okay."
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sve će biti u redu."
09:44
But if you understood how important meaning is,
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Ali ako ste razumjeli kako je važno značenje nečeg,
09:46
then you would figure out that it's actually important
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onda ste shvatili da je zapravo važno
09:49
to spend some time, energy and effort
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provesti neko vrijeme, potrošiti energiju i uložiti trud
09:50
in getting people to care more about what they're doing.
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u tjeranju ljude da im je više stalo do onog čime se bave.
09:54
The next experiment was slightly different.
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Slijedeći je eksperiment bio malo drugačiji.
09:57
We took a sheet of paper with random letters,
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Uzeli smo list papira sa nesumičnim slovima,
09:59
and we asked people to find pairs of letters that were identical next to each other.
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i zamolili ljude da pronađu parove slova identične onima pokraj istih.
10:04
That was the task.
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To je bio zadatak.
10:05
And people did the first sheet.
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I ljudi su ispunili prvi list papira.
10:06
And then we asked them if they wanted to do the next sheet for a little bit less money
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I nakon toga smo ih pitali bi li htjeli raditi i na drugom listu papira za malo manje novaca
10:09
and the next sheet for a little bit less money, and so on and so forth.
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i slijedeći list papira za malo manje novaca, i tako dalje, i tako dalje.
10:12
And we had three conditions.
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I postavili smo tri uvjeta.
10:14
In the first condition, people wrote their name on the sheet,
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U prvom uvjetu, ljudi su napisali svoje ime na papir,
10:18
found all the pairs of letters, gave it to the experimenter.
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pronašli sve parove slova, dali ih zaduženoj osobi za eksperiment.
10:22
The experimenter would look at it, scan it from top to bottom,
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Zadužena bi ga osoba pogledala, detaljno istražila od početka do kraja,
10:25
say "uh huh" and put it on the pile next to them.
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rekla "aha" i stavila na hrpu pokraj sebe.
10:30
In the second condition, people did not write their name on it.
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U drugom uvjetu, ljudi nisu stavili svoje ime na papir.
10:33
The experimenter looked at it,
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Zadužena ga je osoba pogledala,
10:36
took the sheet of paper, did not look at it, did not scan it,
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uzela list papira, nije pogledala, nije detaljno istražila,
10:39
and simply put it on the pile of pages.
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i jednostavno ga stavila na hrpu s drugim papirima.
10:42
So you take a piece, you just put it on the side.
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Znači uzmete dio, jednostavno ga stavite na stranu.
10:45
And in the third condition,
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I u trećem uvjetu,
10:46
the experimenter got the sheet of paper and directly put it into a shredder.
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zadužena je osoba uzela list papira i stavila ga direktno u sjeckalicu.
10:54
What happened in those three conditions?
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Što se desilo u tih tri uvjeta?
10:57
In this plot I'm showing you at what pay rate people stopped.
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Kroz ovaj prikaz vam želim prikazujem na kojem su stupnju plaćanja ljudi prestali.
11:02
So low numbers mean that people worked harder. They worked for much longer.
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Znači manji brojevi znače da su ljudi radili više. Radili su puno duže.
11:06
In the acknowledged condition, people worked all the way down to 15 cents.
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U priznatom uvjetu, ljudi su radili sve do 15 centa.
11:11
At 15 cents per page, they basically stopped these efforts.
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Na 15 centa po stranici, zapravo su se prestali truditi.
11:15
In the shredder condition, it was twice as much -- 30 cents per sheet.
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U uvjetu sa sjeckalicom, bilo je dva puta više -- 30 centa po stanici.
11:20
And this is basically the result we had before.
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I to je zapravo rezultat koji smo dobili prije.
11:22
You shred people's efforts, output,
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Sameljete ljudski trud, proizvod,
11:25
you get them not to be as happy with what they're doing.
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i dođete do toga da nisu baš toliko sretni s onim što rade.
11:28
But I should point out, by the way,
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Ali trebao bih istaknuti, usput,
11:29
that in the shredder condition, people could have cheated.
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da su u uvjetu sa sjeckalicom ljudi mogli varati.
11:32
They could have done not so good work,
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Mogli su odraditi ne tako dobar posao,
11:34
because they realized that people were just shredding it.
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jer su shvatili da ih ljudi jednostavno uništavaju.
11:37
So maybe the first sheet you would do good work,
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Pa znači na prvom papiru bi vjerojatno odradili dobar posao,
11:39
but then you see nobody is really testing it,
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ali onda bi vidjeli da ih nitko zapravo ne provjerava,
11:41
so you would do more and more and more.
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pa bi radili više i više i više.
11:43
So in fact, in the shredder condition,
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Pa zapravo u situaciji sa sjeckalicom,
11:45
people could have submitted more work and gotten more money
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ljudi su mogli predati jedan rad i dobiti više novca
11:47
and put less effort into it.
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ali uložiti manje truda.
11:50
But what about the ignored condition?
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Ali što sa uvjetom koji smo ignorirali?
11:52
Would the ignored condition be more like the acknowledged or more like the shredder,
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Bi li taj ignorirani uvjet bio više kao onaj priznati ili kao onaj sa sjeckalicom,
11:55
or somewhere in the middle?
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ili bi bio negdje između?
11:58
It turns out it was almost like the shredder.
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Ispada da je bio skoro kao onaj sa sjeckalicom.
12:01
Now there's good news and bad news here.
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Dakle imamo ovdje dobru i lošu vijest.
12:04
The bad news is that ignoring the performance of people
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Loša vijest je da ignoriranje dostignuća ljudi
12:08
is almost as bad as shredding their effort in front of their eyes.
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je skoro toliko loše kao uništavanje njihovog truda pred njihovim očima.
12:13
Ignoring gets you a whole way out there.
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Ignoriranjem dobivate cijeli novu sliku svega.
12:17
The good news is that by simply looking at something that somebody has done,
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Dobra vijest je da kroz jednostavno naziranje na nešto što je neki drugi napravio,
12:21
scanning it and saying "uh huh,"
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pogledati i reći "aha",
12:23
that seems to be quite sufficient
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je čini se prilično dovoljno
12:25
to dramatically improve people's motivations.
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da dramatično poveća ljudsku motivaciju.
12:28
So the good news is that adding motivation doesn't seem to be so difficult.
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Znači dobra vijest je da dodavanje motivacije ne treba biti toliko teško.
12:33
The bad news is that eliminating motivations
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Loša vijest je da se eliminacija motivacije
12:36
seems to be incredibly easy,
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čini nevjerojatno laganom,
12:37
and if we don't think about it carefully, we might overdo it.
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i ako ne razmišljamo pažljivo o njoj, možemo pretjerati.
12:41
So this is all in terms of negative motivation
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Znači sve je ovo u smislu negativne motivacije
12:45
or eliminating negative motivation.
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ili eliminacije negativne motivacije.
12:47
The next part I want to show you is something about the positive motivation.
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Slijedeće što bih vam htio pokazati ima veze s pozitivnom motivacijom.
12:52
So there is a store in the U.S. called IKEA.
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Postoji robna kuća u SADu koji se naziva IKEA.
12:56
And IKEA is a store with kind of okay furniture that takes a long time to assemble.
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I IKEA je robna kuća sa prilično u redu namještajem za koji treba puno vremena da se sastavi.
13:03
(Laughter)
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(Smijeh)
13:05
And I don't know about you, but every time I assemble one of those,
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I ne znam za vas, ali za svaki put kada sastavim jedan od njih,
13:08
it takes me much longer, it's much more effortful, it's much more confusing.
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treba mi sve više, potrebno je više truda, više je zbunjujuće.
13:12
I put things in the wrong way.
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Sastavim stvari na krivi način.
13:15
I can't say enjoy those pieces.
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Ne mogu reći da uživam u tim dijelovima.
13:17
I can't say I enjoy the process.
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Ne mogu reći da uživam u postupku.
13:21
But when I finish it, I seem to like those IKEA pieces of furniture
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Ali kada završim, čini se da mi se sviđaju ti dijelovi IKEA namještaja
13:24
more than I like other ones.
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više nego mi se sviđaju ostali.
13:27
And there's an old story about cake mixes.
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I postoji stara priča o mješavini za kolače.
13:31
So when they started cake mixes in the '40s,
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Znači kada su krenuli sa mješavinama za kolače u četrdesetima
13:34
they would take this powder and they would put it in a box,
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uzeli bi taj prašak i stavili bi ga u kutiju,
13:38
and they would ask housewives to basically pour it in, stir some water in it,
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4439
i zamolili bi domaćice da ga jednostavno sipaju, dodaju vodu,
13:42
mix it, put it in the oven, and -- voila! -- you had cake.
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promiješaju, stave u pećnicu i -- voila! -- imate kolač.
13:47
But it turns out they were very unpopular.
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Ali ispada da su bili jako nepopularni.
13:49
People did not want them.
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Ljudi ih nisu željeli.
13:51
And they thought about all kinds of reasons for that.
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I razmišljali su o svim mogućim razlozima za to.
13:53
Maybe the taste was not good.
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Možda nije bilo ukusno.
13:55
No, the taste was great.
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Ne, bilo je jako ukusno.
13:56
What they figured out was that there was not enough effort involved.
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I došli su do zaključka da nije bilo uloženo dovoljno truda.
14:01
It was so easy that nobody could serve cake to their guests
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Bilo je toliko lako da nitko nije mogao ponuditi kolač svojim gostima
14:05
and say, "Here is my cake."
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i reći, "Ovo je moj kolač."
14:07
No, no, no, it was somebody else's cake.
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Ne, ne, ne bio je to kolač od nekog drugog.
14:08
It was as if you bought it in the store.
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Bilo je kao da ste ga kupili u prodavaonici.
14:10
It didn't really feel like your own.
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Niste osjećali da je vaš.
14:13
So what did they do?
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I što su učinili?
14:15
They took the eggs and the milk out of the powder.
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Maknuli su jaja i mlijeko iz praška.
14:18
(Laughter)
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(Smijeh)
14:20
Now you had to break the eggs and add them.
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Sada ste trebali razbiti jaja i dodati ih.
14:23
You had to measure the milk and add it, mixing it.
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Morali ste odmjeriti mlijeko i dodati ga, mješajući ga.
14:26
Now it was your cake. Now everything was fine.
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Sada je to vaš kolač. Sada je sve u redu.
14:29
(Applause)
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(Pljesak)
14:39
Now I think a little bit like the IKEA effect,
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Sada razmišljam pomalo kao i IKEA efekt,
14:42
by getting people to work harder,
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u kojem se tjera ljude da rade više,
14:44
they actually got them to love what they're doing to a higher degree.
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zapravo su ih naveli da vole ono što rade na višoj razini.
14:47
So how do we look at this question experimentally?
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Kako gledamo na to pitanje pokusno?
14:50
We asked people to build some origami.
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Zamolili smo ljude da slože origami.
14:53
We gave them instructions on how to create origami,
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Dali smo im upute o tome kako složiti origami,
14:56
and we gave them a sheet of paper.
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i dali smo im list papira.
14:57
And these were all novices, and they built something that was really quite ugly --
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I svi su bili početnici, i složiti su nešto što je bilo zapravo jako ružno --
15:02
nothing like a frog or a crane.
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ništa kao žaba ili ždral.
15:04
But then we told them, we said, "Look, this origami really belongs to us.
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Ali onda smo im rekli, kazali smo, "Gledaj, ovaj origami zapravo pripada nama.
15:08
You worked for us, but I'll tell you what, we'll sell it to you.
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Radio si za nas, ali znaš što, mi ćemo ti ga prodati.
15:11
How much do you want to pay for it?"
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Koliko želiš platiti za njega?
15:13
And we measured how much they were willing to pay for it.
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I mjerili smo koliko su bili spremni platiti za njega.
15:16
And we had two types of people.
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1973
I imali smo dvije vrste ljudi.
15:18
We had the people who built it,
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Imali smo ljude koji su ih složili,
15:20
and we had the people who did not build it and just looked at it as external observers.
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i imali smo ljude koji ih nisu slagali i gledali na njih kao vanjski promatrači.
15:25
And what we found was that the builders thought
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I doznali smo da su sastavljači mislili
15:27
that these were beautiful pieces of origami,
292
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3514
da su to predivni uzorci origamija,
15:30
and they were willing to pay for them five times more
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i da su bili spremni platiti pet puta više
15:33
than the people who just evaluated them externally.
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od ljudi koji su ih vanjski procijenili.
15:36
Now you could say, if you were a builder,
295
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3025
Mogli bi reći, da ste sastavljač,
15:39
do you think that, "Oh, I love this origami, but I know that nobody else would love it?"
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6439
da mislite, "Oh, volim taj origami, ali znam da ga nitko drugi ne bi volio?"
15:46
Or do you think, "I love this origami, and everybody else will love it as well?"
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Ili mislite, "Volim taj origami, i svi će ga ostali također voljeti?"
15:51
Which one of those two is correct?
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Koje je od tog dvoje točno?
15:54
Turns out the builders not only loved the origami more,
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Ispada da sastavljači ne samo da vole origamije više,
15:57
they thought that everybody would see the world in their view.
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nego su mislili da bi svi vidjeli svijet njihovim očima.
16:00
They thought everybody else would love it more as well.
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Mislili su da bi ih svi ostali također voljeli više.
16:03
In the next version we tried to do the IKEA effect.
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U slijedećoj verziji smo isprobali IKEA efekt.
16:06
We tried to make it more difficult.
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Pokušali smo ga učiniti težim.
16:08
So for some people we gave the same task.
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I nekim smo ljudima dali isti zadatak.
16:11
For some people we made it harder by hiding the instructions.
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4022
Nekima smo otežali i sakrili im upute.
16:15
At the top of the sheet, we had little diagrams of how do you fold origami.
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Na vrhu papira, imali smo male prikaze o kako složiti origami.
16:19
For some people we just eliminated that.
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Nekim smo ljudima taj dio izbrisali.
16:22
So now this was tougher. What happened?
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I sada je bilo teže. Što se dogodilo?
16:25
Well in an objective way, the origami now was uglier, it was more difficult.
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Pa objektivno govoreći, origami je bio ružniji, bio je teži.
16:31
Now when we looked at the easy origami,
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I kada smo pogledali laki origami,
16:33
we saw the same thing: Builders loved it more, evaluators loved it less.
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vidjeli smo istu stvar: sastavljači su ih voljeli više, promatrači manje.
16:38
When you looked at the hard instructions,
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Kada pogledate teže upute,
16:40
the effect was larger.
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učinak je bio veći.
16:43
Why? Because now the builders loved it even more.
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Zašto? Zato jer su ga sada sastavljači voljeli još više.
16:48
They put all this extra effort into it.
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U njega su uložili sav taj dodatan trud.
16:50
And evaluators? They loved it even less.
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I promatrači? Oni su ga voljeli čak i manje.
16:55
Because in reality it was even uglier than the first version.
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Zato jer je zapravo bio ružniji nego u prvoj verziji.
16:59
Of course, this tells you something about how we evaluate things.
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Naravno, to vam govori nešto o tome kako ocijenjujemo stvari.
17:04
Now think about kids.
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Sada razmislite o djeci.
17:06
Imagine I asked you, "How much would you sell your kids for?"
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Zamislite da sam vas pitao, "Za koliko biste prodali vašu djecu?"
17:11
Your memories and associations and so on.
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Vaša sjećanja i asocijacije i tako dalje.
17:13
Most people would say for a lot, a lot of money --
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Većina bi ljudi rekla za puno, puno novaca --
17:17
on good days.
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na dobre dane.
17:19
(Laughter)
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(Smijeh)
17:20
But imagine this was slightly different.
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Ali zamislite da je ovo malo drugačije.
17:22
Imagine if you did not have your kids,
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Zamislite da nemate vlastitu djecu,
17:23
and one day you went to the park and you met some kids,
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i jednog dana odete u park i upoznate neku djecu,
17:26
and they were just like your kids.
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i oni su baš kao vaša djeca.
17:28
And you played with them for a few hours.
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I igrate se s njima nekoliko sati.
17:29
And when you were about to leave, the parents said,
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I kada ste već na odlasku, njihovi roditelji kažu,
17:32
"Hey, by the way, just before you leave, if you're interested, they're for sale."
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"Da, usput, prije nego što odete, ako vas zanima, na prodaju su."
17:36
(Laughter)
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(Smijeh)
17:38
How much would you pay for them now?
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Koliko biste platili za njih?
17:41
Most people say not that much.
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Većina bi ljudi rekla da ne puno.
17:43
And this is because our kids are so valuable,
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Iz razloga što su nam naša djeca dragocjena,
17:48
not just because of who they are,
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ne samo iz razloga tko su,
17:50
but because of us, because they are so connected to us
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nego zbog nas, zbog toga jer su povezani s nama
17:54
and because of the time and connection.
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i zbog vremena i povezanosti.
17:56
And by the way, if you think that IKEA instructions are not good,
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I usput, ako smatrate da Ikeine upute nisu dobre,
18:00
think about the instructions that come with kids.
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razmislite o uputama koje dolaze s djecom.
18:02
Those are really tough.
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Te su stvarno teške.
18:03
(Laughter)
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(Smijeh)
18:04
By the way, these are my kids, which, of course, are wonderful and so on.
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Usput, ovo su moja djeca, koja su, naravno, krasna i tako dalje.
18:08
Which comes to tell you one more thing,
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Što se svede na još jednu stvar,
18:10
which is, much like our builders,
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koja je, kao i naši sastavljači,
18:13
when they look at the creature of their creation,
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koji kada pogledaju stvorenje svog stvaranja,
18:16
we don't see that other people don't see things our way.
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ne prepoznajemo da ljudi ne vide stvari na naš način.
18:21
Let me say one last comment.
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Dopustite mi da dodam i zadnji komentar.
18:24
If you think about Adam Smith versus Karl Marx,
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Ako razmislite o Adamu Smithu nasuprot Karlu Marxu,
18:28
Adam Smith had the very important notion of efficiency.
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Adam Smith je imao vrlo važnu ideju o efikasnosti.
18:32
He gave an example of a pin factory.
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Dao je primjer tvornice pribadača.
18:35
He said pins have 12 different steps,
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Rekao je da za pribadače postoji 12 različitih koraka,
18:38
and if one person does all 12 steps, production is very low.
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i ako jedna osoba napravi svih 12 koraka, proizvodnja je vrlo niska.
18:42
But if you get one person to do step one
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Ali ako navedete jednu osobu da napravi prvi korak
18:45
and one person to do step two and step three and so on,
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i drugu osobu da napravi drugi korak i treći korak i tako dalje,
18:47
production can increase tremendously.
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proizvodnja se može strahovito povećati.
18:50
And indeed, this is a great example and the reason for the Industrial Revolution and efficiency.
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I doista, ovo je odličan primjer i razlog Industrijske Revolucije i korisnosti.
18:55
Karl Marx, on the other hand,
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Karl Marx je, s druge strane,
18:57
said that the alienation of labor is incredibly important
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rekao da je otuđenost rada vrlo važna
19:01
in how people think about the connection to what they are doing.
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u načinu razmišljanja ljudi o povezanosti s onime što rade.
19:04
And if you make all 12 steps, you care about the pin.
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I ako napravite svih 12 koraka, stalo vam je do pribadače.
19:08
But if you make one step every time, maybe you don't care as much.
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Ali ako napravite jedan korak svaki put, možda vam i nije toliko stalo.
19:11
And I think that in the Industrial Revolution,
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I mislim da je u Industrijskoj Revoluciji,
19:14
Adam Smith was more correct than Karl Marx,
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Adam Smith bio više u pravu od Karla Marxa,
19:18
but the reality is that we've switched
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ali u stvarnosti je zamijenjeno
19:20
and now we're in the knowledge economy.
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i sada smo u ekonomiji znanja.
19:23
And you can ask yourself, what happens in a knowledge economy?
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I možete se zapitati, što se događa u ekonomiji znanja?
19:26
Is efficiency still more important than meaning?
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Je li efikasnost i dalje važnija od značenja?
19:29
I think the answer is no.
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Mislim da je odgovor da ne.
19:31
I think that as we move to situations
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Mislim da kada krenemo u situacije
19:33
in which people have to decide on their own
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u kojima ljudi trebaju sami odlučiti
19:36
about how much effort, attention, caring, how connected they feel to it,
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o koliko truda, pažnje, brige, koliko se povezanim osjećaju,
19:39
are they thinking about labor on the way to work and in the shower and so on,
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razmišljaju li o radu na putu prema poslu i pod tušem i tako dalje
19:44
all of a sudden Marx has more things to say to us.
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i odjednom nam Marx ima puno više za reći.
19:48
So when we think about labor, we usually think about motivation and payment as the same thing,
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I kada razmišljamo o radu, obično razmišljamo o motivaciji i radu na isti način
19:53
but the reality is that we should probably add all kinds of things to it --
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ali u stvarnosti bi vjerojatno trebali dodati svakojake stvari --
19:57
meaning, creation, challenges, ownership, identity, pride, etc.
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značenje, stvaranje, izazov, posjed, identitet, ponos itd.
20:01
And the good news is that if we added all of those components and thought about them,
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I dobra vijest je da ako smo dodali sve te elemente i razmislili o njima
20:05
how do we create our own meaning, pride, motivation,
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kako stvaramo svoje vlastito značenje, ponos, motivaciju,
20:09
and how do we do it in our workplace and for the employees,
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i kako to radimo na radnom mjestu i za zaposlenike,
20:12
I think we could get people to both be more productive and happier.
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smatram da bi mogli ljude dovesti da budu i produktivniji i sretniji.
20:16
Thank you very much.
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Puno vam hvala.
20:18
(Applause)
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(Pljesak)
ABOUT THE SPEAKER
Dan Ariely - Behavioral economistThe dismal science of economics is not as firmly grounded in actual behavior as was once supposed. In "Predictably Irrational," Dan Ariely told us why.
Why you should listen
Dan Ariely is a professor of psychology and behavioral economics at Duke University and a founding member of the Center for Advanced Hindsight. He is the author of the bestsellers Predictably Irrational, The Upside of Irrationality, and The Honest Truth About Dishonesty -- as well as the TED Book Payoff: The Hidden Logic that Shapes Our Motivations.
Through his research and his (often amusing and unorthodox) experiments, he questions the forces that influence human behavior and the irrational ways in which we often all behave.
Dan Ariely | Speaker | TED.com