TEDGlobal 2013
Lesley Hazleton: The doubt essential to faith
Lesley Hazleton: Dvom, ključen za vero
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Ko je Lesley Hazleton pisala Mohamedovo biografijo, jo je nekaj presenetilo: tisto noč, ko je Mohamed prvič prejel razodetje Korana, je bil, sodeč po zgodnjih zapisih, njegov prvi odziv dvom, strahospoštovanje, celo strah. A vendar je ta izkušnja postala temelj njegove vere. Hazletonova poziva k novemu spoštovanju dvoma in preizpraševanja kot osnove vere - in h koncu vseh vrst fundamentalizma.
Lesley Hazleton - Writer, psychologist
Writer, psychologist and former Middle East reporter Lesley Hazleton explores the vast and often terrifying arena in which politics and religion intersect. Full bio
Writer, psychologist and former Middle East reporter Lesley Hazleton explores the vast and often terrifying arena in which politics and religion intersect. Full bio
Double-click the English transcript below to play the video.
00:12
Writing biography is a strange thing to do.
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Pisati biografijo je čudno.
00:18
It's a journey into the foreign territory
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To je potovanje v neznano deželo
00:20
of somebody else's life,
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življenja nekoga drugega,
00:24
a journey, an exploration that can take you places
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potovanje, raziskovanje,
ki te lahko popelje tja,
ki te lahko popelje tja,
00:26
you never dreamed of going
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kamor si nikoli nisi mislil, da boš šel,
00:29
and still can't quite believe you've been,
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in še vedno ne moreš verjeti,
da si bil tam,
da si bil tam,
00:31
especially if, like me, you're an agnostic Jew
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še posebej, če si kot jaz agnostični žid,
00:34
and the life you've been exploring
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in je življenje, ki ga raziskuješ,
00:36
is that of Muhammad.
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Mohamedovo.
00:41
Five years ago, for instance,
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Pet let nazaj
00:44
I found myself waking each morning in misty Seattle
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sem se vsako jutro zbujala v meglen Seattle
00:47
to what I knew was an impossible question:
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z nemogočim vprašanjem:
00:50
What actually happened
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Kaj se je dejansko zgodilo
00:54
one desert night,
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neko noč v puščavi,
00:55
half the world and almost half of history away?
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pol sveta in skoraj pol
zgodovine daleč stran?
zgodovine daleč stran?
00:59
What happened, that is,
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Kaj se je zgodilo
01:00
on the night in the year 610
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v noči leta 610,
01:03
when Muhammad received the first revelation of the Koran
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ko je Mohamed prejel prvo razodetje Korana
01:06
on a mountain just outside Mecca?
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na gori nad Meko?
01:11
This is the core mystical moment of Islam,
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To je ključni mistični moment islama
01:15
and as such, of course,
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in se kot tak seveda
01:17
it defies empirical analysis.
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izmika empirični analizi.
01:20
Yet the question wouldn't let go of me.
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A vendar mi vprašanje ni dalo miru.
01:24
I was fully aware that for someone as secular as I am,
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Dobro sem se zavedala, da je za nekoga
tako nevernega, kot sem sama,
tako nevernega, kot sem sama,
01:27
just asking it could be seen
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že samo postaviti to vprašanje izgledalo
01:29
as pure chutzpah.
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kot dejanje predrznosti.
01:32
(Laughter)
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(smeh)
01:35
And I plead guilty as charged,
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Priznam krivdo,
01:37
because all exploration, physical or intellectual,
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saj je vsako raziskovanje,
fizično ali intelektualno,
fizično ali intelektualno,
01:41
is inevitably in some sense an act of transgression,
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neizogibno neke vrste prestopek,
01:45
of crossing boundaries.
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prestopanje meja.
01:49
Still, some boundaries are larger than others.
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A vendar so nekatere meje večje od drugih.
01:55
So a human encountering the divine,
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Človek, ki se sreča z božanskim,
01:58
as Muslims believe Muhammad did,
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kot muslimani verjamejo, da se je Mohamed,
02:01
to the rationalist, this is a matter not of fact
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za racionalneža ni dejstvo,
02:04
but of wishful fiction,
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temveč le pobožna želja,
02:05
and like all of us, I like to think of myself as rational.
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in kot vsi, se imam tudi jaz
za racionalno osebo.
za racionalno osebo.
02:09
Which might be why when I looked at the earliest accounts
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Kar je lahko razlog, da ko sem se
poglobila v zgodnja pričevanja,
poglobila v zgodnja pričevanja,
02:12
we have of that night,
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ki jih imamo o tisti noči,
02:14
what struck me even more than what happened
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me je bolj kot kaj se je zgodilo,
02:17
was what did not happen.
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presenetilo tisto, kar se ni.
02:22
Muhammad did not come floating off the mountain
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Mohamed se ni vrnil z gore
02:25
as though walking on air.
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plavajoč na oblaku.
02:28
He did not run down shouting, "Hallelujah!"
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Ni pritekel navzdol vpijoč: "Aleluja!"
02:31
and "Bless the Lord!"
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in "Hvaljen Bog!"
02:33
He did not radiate light and joy.
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Ni izžareval svetlobe in veselja.
02:37
There were no choirs of angels,
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Niso ga spremljali zbori angelov,
02:38
no music of the spheres, no elation, no ecstasy,
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bilo ni nobene nebeške glasbe,
nobene vznesenosti, nobene ekstaze,
nobene vznesenosti, nobene ekstaze,
02:42
no golden aura surrounding him,
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ni ga obdajal zlati sij,
02:45
no sense of an absolute, fore-ordained role
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ni ga preveval občutek
vzvišenosti in posvečenosti
vzvišenosti in posvečenosti
02:50
as the messenger of God.
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glasnika Boga.
02:53
That is, he did none of the things
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Naredil ni nobene od stvari,
02:56
that might make it easy to cry foul,
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ki bi olajšale ljudem,
da ga označijo za prevaranta
da ga označijo za prevaranta
02:58
to put down the whole story as a pious fable.
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in zavržejo celotno zgodbo
kot versko pripovedko.
kot versko pripovedko.
03:03
Quite the contrary.
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Nasprotno.
03:06
In his own reported words,
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Po svojih lastnih besedah
03:10
he was convinced at first
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je bil sprva prepričan,
03:12
that what had happened couldn't have been real.
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da kar se je zgodilo,
ni moglo biti resnično.
ni moglo biti resnično.
03:18
At best, he thought, it had to have been a hallucination --
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V najboljšem primeru je bila halucinacija -
03:20
a trick of the eye or the ear, perhaps,
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mogoče trik očesa ali ušesa,
03:22
or his own mind working against him.
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ali njegov lastni um,
ki je deloval proti njemu.
ki je deloval proti njemu.
03:24
At worst, possession --
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V najslabšem primeru, obsedenost -
03:27
that he'd been seized by an evil jinn,
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obsedel ga je zlobni duh,
03:29
a spirit out to deceive him,
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duh, ki ga je želel zavesti,
03:31
even to crush the life out of him.
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iztisniti življenje iz njega.
03:34
In fact, he was so sure that he could only be majnun,
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Bil je tako prepričan, da je bil Majnun,
03:37
possessed by a jinn,
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obseden od zlobnega duha,
03:38
that when he found himself still alive,
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da je ob spoznanju, da je še vedno živ,
03:40
his first impulse was to finish the job himself,
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najprej hotel sam dokončati delo,
03:45
to leap off the highest cliff
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se vreči z najvišje pečine
03:48
and escape the terror of what he'd experienced
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in ubežati strahotam, ki jih je doživel,
03:52
by putting an end to all experience.
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ter tako končati svoje življenje.
03:59
So the man who fled down the mountain that night
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Moža, ki je tisto noč pritekel iz gore,
04:02
trembled not with joy
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ni prevevalo veselje,
04:04
but with a stark, primordial fear.
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temveč globok, prvobitni strah.
04:09
He was overwhelmed not with conviction, but by doubt.
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Bil je preplavljen ne z odločnostjo,
temveč z dvomom.
temveč z dvomom.
04:15
And that panicked disorientation,
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In ta panična zmedenost,
04:18
that sundering of everything familiar,
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ta razdvojenost vsega poznanega,
04:20
that daunting awareness of something
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ta zastrašujoča zavest nečesa,
04:24
beyond human comprehension,
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kar presega človeški razum,
04:27
can only be called a terrible awe.
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je lahko le hudo strahospoštovanje.
04:34
This might be somewhat difficult to grasp
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To je morda težko razumeti,
04:37
now that we use the word "awesome"
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ko danes besedo 'hudo'
04:39
to describe a new app or a viral video.
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uporabljamo za novo mobilno aplikacijo
ali viralni video.
ali viralni video.
04:44
With the exception perhaps of a massive earthquake,
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Z morebitno izjemo obsežnega potresa
04:47
we're protected from real awe.
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smo zaščiteni pred resnično hudimi stvarmi.
04:49
We close the doors and hunker down,
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Zapremo vrata in se pritajimo,
04:51
convinced that we're in control,
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prepričani, da imamo nadzor,
04:54
or, at least, hoping for control.
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ali vsaj upamo na nadzor.
04:57
We do our best to ignore the fact that
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Po svojih najboljših močeh
ignoriramo dejstvo,
ignoriramo dejstvo,
04:59
we don't always have it,
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da ga vselej nimamo
05:01
and that not everything can be explained.
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in da se ne da vsega pojasniti.
05:04
Yet whether you're a rationalist or a mystic,
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A vendar ne glede na to ali ste
racionalna ali mistična oseba,
racionalna ali mistična oseba,
05:08
whether you think the words Muhammad heard that night
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ali mislite, da so besede, ki jih je
Mohamed slišal tisto noč,
Mohamed slišal tisto noč,
05:10
came from inside himself or from outside,
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prišle iz njega ali od zunaj,
05:15
what's clear is that he did experience them,
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je jasno, da jih je doživel
05:19
and that he did so with a force that would shatter
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in da jih je doživel s silo, ki je porušila
05:22
his sense of himself and his world
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njegov občutek sebstva in razumevanje sveta
05:24
and transform this otherwise modest man
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ter preoblikovala drugače skromnega moža
05:27
into a radical advocate for social and economic justice.
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v radikalnega zagovornika družbene
in gospodarske pravičnosti.
in gospodarske pravičnosti.
05:34
Fear was the only sane response,
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Strah je bil edini razumen odziv,
05:39
the only human response.
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edini človeški odziv.
05:44
Too human for some,
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Za nekatere celo preveč človeški,
05:47
like conservative Muslim theologians who maintain that
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kot na primer za konzervativne
muslimanske teologe, ki vztrajajo,
muslimanske teologe, ki vztrajajo,
05:49
the account of his wanting to kill himself
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da njegova želja, da bi se ubil,
05:51
shouldn't even be mentioned, despite the fact
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ne bi smela biti niti omenjena, kljub temu
05:54
that it's in the earliest Islamic biographies.
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da je zapisana v zgodnjih
muslimanskih biografijah.
muslimanskih biografijah.
05:58
They insist that he never doubted
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Vztrajajo, da Mohamed ni dvomil
06:01
for even a single moment, let alone despaired.
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niti za trenutek, kaj šele obupal.
06:08
Demanding perfection, they refuse to tolerate
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Zahtevajoč popolnost zavračajo
06:11
human imperfection.
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človeško nepopolnost.
06:16
Yet what, exactly, is imperfect about doubt?
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In vendar, kaj natančno je
nepopolnega na dvomu?
nepopolnega na dvomu?
06:23
As I read those early accounts, I realized it was
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Ko sem brala zgodnje pripovedi,
sem doumela,
sem doumela,
06:26
precisely Muhammad's doubt that brought him alive for me,
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da je bil prav Mohamedov dvom tisto,
kar ga je oživilo v mojih očeh,
kar ga je oživilo v mojih očeh,
06:30
that allowed me to begin to see him in full,
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kar mi je dovolilo,
da sem ga videla v celoti,
da sem ga videla v celoti,
06:33
to accord him the integrity of reality.
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da sem mu priznala integriteto resničnosti.
06:36
And the more I thought about it,
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In bolj ko sem razmišljala o tem,
06:38
the more it made sense that he doubted,
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bolj se mi je zdelo smiselno, da je dvomil,
06:41
because doubt is essential to faith.
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saj je dvom bistvo vere.
06:48
If this seems a startling idea at first,
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Če se to sprva zdi presenetljiva ideja,
06:51
consider that doubt, as Graham Greene once put it,
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pomislite, da je dvom, kot je nekoč
rekel Graham Greene,
rekel Graham Greene,
06:54
is the heart of the matter.
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srčika stvari.
06:58
Abolish all doubt, and what's left is not faith,
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Če odpravite ves dvom, vam ne ostane vera,
07:03
but absolute, heartless conviction.
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temveč vzvišena, brezsrčna odločnost.
07:08
You're certain that you possess the Truth --
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Prepričani ste, da poznate Resnico -
07:12
inevitably offered with an implied uppercase T --
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neizogibno ponujeno z
implicitno veliko začetnico -
implicitno veliko začetnico -
07:16
and this certainty quickly devolves
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in to se zagotovo prav hitro preoblikuje
07:19
into dogmatism and righteousness,
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v dogmatizem in pravičništvo,
07:22
by which I mean a demonstrative, overweening pride
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s čimer mislim odkrit, aroganten ponos
07:26
in being so very right,
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absolutne pravilnosti,
07:30
in short, the arrogance of fundamentalism.
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na kratko, aroganco fundamentalizma.
07:38
It has to be one of the multiple ironies of history
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Najbrž je ena izmed
mnogih ironij zgodovine,
mnogih ironij zgodovine,
07:42
that a favorite expletive of Muslim fundamentalists
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da je najljubša psovka
muslimanskih fundamentalistov
muslimanskih fundamentalistov
07:45
is the same one once used by the Christian fundamentalists
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enaka tisti, ki so jo nekoč uporabljali
krščanski fundamentalisti,
krščanski fundamentalisti,
07:49
known as Crusaders:
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poznani kot križarji:
07:51
"infidel," from the Latin for "faithless."
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"infidel" izpeljana iz
latinske besede za "nevernika."
latinske besede za "nevernika."
07:57
Doubly ironic, in this case, because their absolutism
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V tem primeru dvojno ironično,
saj je njihova vzvišenost
saj je njihova vzvišenost
08:01
is in fact the opposite of faith.
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pravzaprav nasprotje vere.
08:06
In effect, they are the infidels.
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V bistvu so oni neverniki.
08:11
Like fundamentalists of all religious stripes,
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Tako kot fundamentalisti
vseh religijskih barv
vseh religijskih barv
08:14
they have no questions, only answers.
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tudi oni nimajo nobenih vprašanj,
samo odgovore.
samo odgovore.
08:18
They found the perfect antidote to thought
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Našli so popoln protistrup mišljenju
08:21
and the ideal refuge of the hard demands of real faith.
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in idealno zatočišče
težkih zahtev prave vere.
težkih zahtev prave vere.
08:25
They don't have to struggle for it like Jacob
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Ni se jim treba boriti zanjo,
kot se je Jakob,
kot se je Jakob,
08:27
wrestling through the night with the angel,
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ki se je vso noč boril z angelom,
08:29
or like Jesus in his 40 days and nights in the wilderness,
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ali kot Jezus v svojih
40 dneh in nočeh v divjini,
40 dneh in nočeh v divjini,
08:32
or like Muhammad, not only that night on the mountain,
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ali kot Mohamed, ne le tiste noči na gori,
08:35
but throughout his years as a prophet,
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temveč tudi vsa leta kot prerok,
08:38
with the Koran constantly urging him not to despair,
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ko ga je Koran nenehno pozival,
naj ne obupa,
naj ne obupa,
08:42
and condemning those who most loudly proclaim
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in obsojal tiste,
ki so najglasneje vztrajali,
ki so najglasneje vztrajali,
08:45
that they know everything there is to know
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da vedo vse, kar se da vedeti,
08:49
and that they and they alone are right.
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in da imajo le oni prav.
08:56
And yet we, the vast and still far too silent majority,
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In vendar smo mi, obsežna in
še vedno veliko pretiha večina,
še vedno veliko pretiha večina,
09:03
have ceded the public arena to this extremist minority.
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prepustili javno prizorišče tem
ekstremističnim manjšinam.
ekstremističnim manjšinam.
09:09
We've allowed Judaism to be claimed
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Prepustili smo, da si judaizem prilaščajo
09:11
by violently messianic West Bank settlers,
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nasilni mesijanski prebivalci
Zahodnega brega,
Zahodnega brega,
09:15
Christianity by homophobic hypocrites
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krščanstvo homofobni hinavci
09:18
and misogynistic bigots,
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in šovinistični nestrpneži,
09:21
Islam by suicide bombers.
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islam samomorilski napadalci.
09:26
And we've allowed ourselves to be blinded to the fact that
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In dovolili smo si spregledati dejstvo,
09:28
no matter whether they claim to be Christians,
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da ne glede na to ali trdijo,
da so kristjani,
da so kristjani,
09:31
Jews or Muslims,
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judje ali muslimani,
09:32
militant extremists are none of the above.
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militantni ekstremisti niso
nič od naštetega.
nič od naštetega.
09:38
They're a cult all their own, blood brothers
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So svojevrsten kult, krvni bratje
09:44
steeped in other people's blood.
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prežeti s krvjo drugih.
09:49
This isn't faith.
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To ni vera.
09:51
It's fanaticism, and we have to stop confusing the two.
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To je fanatizem in moramo ju
prenehati zamenjevati.
prenehati zamenjevati.
09:56
We have to recognize that real faith has no easy answers.
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Moramo spoznati, da resnična vera
nima enostavnih odgovorov.
nima enostavnih odgovorov.
10:01
It's difficult and stubborn.
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Je težavna in trmasta.
10:06
It involves an ongoing struggle,
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Vključuje stalen boj,
10:08
a continual questioning of what we think we know,
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nenehno preizpraševanje tega,
kar mislimo, da vemo,
kar mislimo, da vemo,
10:11
a wrestling with issues and ideas.
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spopad z vprašanji in idejami.
10:13
It goes hand in hand with doubt,
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Gre z roko v roki z dvomom
10:17
in a never-ending conversation with it,
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v neskončnem pogovoru z njim
10:20
and sometimes in conscious defiance of it.
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in z občasnim zavestnim kljubovanjem dvomu.
10:26
And this conscious defiance is why I, as an agnostic,
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In prav zavestno kljubovanje je razlog,
da imam kot agnostik
da imam kot agnostik
10:31
can still have faith.
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še vedno lahko vero.
10:35
I have faith, for instance, that peace in the Middle East
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Imam vero, denimo,
da je mir na Bližnjem vzhodu
da je mir na Bližnjem vzhodu
10:38
is possible despite the ever-accumulating mass of evidence
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možen, kljub čedalje
večjemu številu dokazov
večjemu številu dokazov
10:43
to the contrary.
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o nasprotnem.
10:46
I'm not convinced of this.
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Tega ne vem zagotovo.
10:48
I can hardly say I believe it.
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Komajda lahko rečem, da verjamem.
10:50
I can only have faith in it,
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Imam lahko le vero,
10:52
commit myself, that is, to the idea of it,
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to je, da se zavežem ideji miru
10:56
and I do this precisely because of the temptation
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in to storim ravno zaradi skušnjave,
10:59
to throw up my hands in resignation
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da bi dvignila roke
11:01
and retreat into silence.
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in se umaknila v tišino.
11:05
Because despair is self-fulfilling.
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Kajti obup je samoizpolnjujoča prerokba.
11:09
If we call something impossible,
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Če nekaj označimo kot nemogoče,
11:12
we act in such a way that we make it so.
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delujemo tako, da to naredimo takšno.
11:16
And I, for one, refuse to live that way.
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In jaz, za začetek, nočem živeti tako.
11:21
In fact, most of us do,
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Pravzaprav nas večina noče.
11:24
whether we're atheist or theist
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Ali ste ateisti ali teisti
11:27
or anywhere in between or beyond, for that matter,
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ali kjerkoli vmes ali izven,
kar se tega tiče,
kar se tega tiče,
11:31
what drives us is that, despite our doubts
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kar nas žene, je dejstvo,
da kljub našim dvomom
da kljub našim dvomom
11:36
and even because of our doubts,
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in celo zaradi njih,
11:38
we reject the nihilism of despair.
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zavračamo nihilizem obupa.
11:42
We insist on faith in the future
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Vztrajamo pri veri v prihodnost
11:46
and in each other.
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in v drug drugega.
11:50
Call this naive if you like.
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Recite temu naivnost, če hočete.
11:54
Call it impossibly idealistic if you must.
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Recite temu nemogoč idealizem,
če že morate.
če že morate.
11:57
But one thing is sure:
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A nekaj je gotovo:
11:59
Call it human.
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recite temu človeško.
12:03
Could Muhammad have so radically changed his world
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Ali bi lahko Mohamed tako radikalno
spremenil svoj svet
spremenil svoj svet
12:06
without such faith, without the refusal
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brez takšne vere, ne da bi zavrnil
12:09
to cede to the arrogance of closed-minded certainty?
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aroganco gotovosti omejenega duha?
12:13
I think not.
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Mislim, da ne.
12:17
After keeping company with him as a writer
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Po tem, ko sem mu delala
družbo kot pisateljica
družbo kot pisateljica
12:19
for the past five years, I can't see
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zadnjih pet let, ne morem reči,
12:22
that he'd be anything but utterly outraged
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da bi bil karkoli drugega
kot skrajno ogorčen
kot skrajno ogorčen
12:27
at the militant fundamentalists who claim to speak
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nad militantnimi fundamentalisti,
ki trdijo, da danes govorijo
ki trdijo, da danes govorijo
12:30
and act in his name in the Middle East and elsewhere today.
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in delujejo v njegovem imenu
na Bližnjem vzhodu in drugod.
na Bližnjem vzhodu in drugod.
12:36
He'd be appalled at the repression of half the population
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Bil bi zgrožen nad zatiranjem
polovice prebivalstva
polovice prebivalstva
12:40
because of their gender.
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zaradi njihovega spola.
12:43
He'd be torn apart by the bitter divisiveness of sectarianism.
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Bil bi užaloščen zaradi
grenkih sporov sektaštva.
grenkih sporov sektaštva.
12:51
He'd call out terrorism for what it is,
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Terorizem bi označil za tisto,
kar dejansko je,
kar dejansko je,
12:54
not only criminal but an obscene travesty
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ne le kriminalno, ampak tudi
nespodobno popačenje
nespodobno popačenje
12:59
of everything he believed in and struggled for.
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vsega, v kar je verjel in
za kar se je boril.
za kar se je boril.
13:03
He'd say what the Koran says: Anyone who takes a life
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Rekel bi, kar pravi tudi Koran:
Vsakdo, ki vzame eno življenje,
Vsakdo, ki vzame eno življenje,
13:09
takes the life of all humanity.
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vzame življenje celotnemu človeštvu.
13:12
Anyone who saves a life, saves the life of all humanity.
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Vsakdo, ki reši eno življenje,
reši življenje celotnemu človeštvu.
reši življenje celotnemu človeštvu.
13:19
And he'd commit himself fully
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In globoko bi se zavezal
13:22
to the hard and thorny process of making peace.
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težki in trnovi poti do miru.
13:29
Thank you.
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Hvala.
13:31
(Applause)
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(Aplavz)
13:35
Thank you. (Applause)
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Hvala. (Aplavz)
ABOUT THE SPEAKER
Lesley Hazleton - Writer, psychologistWriter, psychologist and former Middle East reporter Lesley Hazleton explores the vast and often terrifying arena in which politics and religion intersect.
Why you should listen
Lesley Hazleton has traced the roots of conflict in several books, including compelling 'flesh-and-blood' biographies of Muhammad and Mary, and casts "an agnostic eye on politics, religion, and existence" on her blog, AccidentalTheologist.com.
Her newest book, Agnostic: A Spirited Manifesto, celebrates the agnostic stance as "rising above the flat two-dimensional line of belief/unbelief, creating new possibilities for how we think about being in the world." In it, she explores what we mean by the search for meaning, invokes the humbling perspective of infinity and reconsiders what we talk about when we talk about soul.
Hazleton's approach has been praised as "vital and mischievous" by the New York Times, and as "a positive orientation to life, one that embraces both science and mystery ... while remaining intimately grounded and engaged."
Lesley Hazleton | Speaker | TED.com