TEDxPhoenix
Brenda Romero: Gaming for understanding
Filmed:
Readability: 2.8
564,560 views
It's never easy to get across the magnitude of complex tragedies -- so when Brenda Romero's daughter came home from school asking about slavery, she did what she does for a living -- she designed a game. She describes the surprising effectiveness of this game, and others, in helping the player really understand the story.
Brenda Romero - Game designer
Brenda Romero designs games that turn some of history's most tragic lessons into interactive, emotional experiences. Full bio
Brenda Romero designs games that turn some of history's most tragic lessons into interactive, emotional experiences. Full bio
Double-click the English transcript below to play the video.
00:12
When we think of games, there's all kinds of things.
0
467
2031
00:14
Maybe you're ticked off, or maybe you're looking forward
1
2498
2498
00:16
to a new game. You've been up too late playing a game.
2
4996
1732
00:18
All these things happen to me.
3
6728
2168
00:20
But when we think about games, a lot of times we think
4
8896
1763
00:22
about stuff like this: first-person shooters, or the big,
5
10659
2263
00:24
what we would call AAA games,
6
12922
2115
00:27
or maybe you're a Facebook game player.
7
15037
1256
00:28
This is one my partner and I worked on.
8
16293
1868
00:30
Maybe you play Facebook games, and that's what we're
9
18161
1795
00:31
making right now. This is a lighter form of game.
10
19956
2707
00:34
Maybe you think about the tragically boring board games
11
22663
2748
00:37
that hold us hostage in Thanksgiving situations.
12
25411
3221
00:40
This would be one of those tragically boring board games
13
28632
2104
00:42
that you can figure out.
14
30736
2093
00:44
Or maybe you're in your living room, you know,
15
32829
2013
00:46
playing with the Wii with the kids, or something like that,
16
34842
2770
00:49
and, you know, there's this whole range of games,
17
37612
1903
00:51
and that's very much what I think about.
18
39515
1489
00:53
I make my living from games. I've been lucky enough
19
41004
1770
00:54
to do this since I was 15, which also qualifies
20
42774
2414
00:57
as I've never really had a real job.
21
45188
2762
00:59
But we think about games as fun, and that's completely
22
47950
2521
01:02
reasonable, but let's just think about this.
23
50471
2744
01:05
So this one here, this is the 1980 Olympics.
24
53215
2728
01:07
Now I don't know where you guys were, but I was
25
55943
1599
01:09
in my living room. It was practically a religious event.
26
57542
2844
01:12
And this is when the Americans beat the Russians,
27
60386
3398
01:15
and this was -- yes, it was technically a game.
28
63784
2110
01:17
Hockey is a game. But really, was this a game?
29
65894
3012
01:20
I mean, people cried. I've never seen my mother cry
30
68906
3149
01:24
like that at the end of Monopoly.
31
72055
3026
01:27
And so this was just an amazing experience.
32
75081
2860
01:29
Or, you know, if anybody here is from Boston --
33
77941
2271
01:32
So when the Boston Red Sox won the World Series after,
34
80212
3386
01:35
I believe, 351 years,
35
83598
3926
01:39
when they won the World Series, it was amazing.
36
87524
2374
01:41
I happened to be living in Springfield at the time,
37
89898
1753
01:43
and the best part of it was -- is that --
38
91651
2466
01:46
you would close the women's door in the bathroom,
39
94117
2925
01:49
and I remember seeing "Go Sox," and I thought, really?
40
97042
2432
01:51
Or the houses, you'd come out, because every game,
41
99474
3193
01:54
well, I think almost every game, went into overtime, right?
42
102667
2555
01:57
So we'd be outside, and all the other lights are on
43
105222
2362
01:59
on the whole block, and kids, like, the attendance was down
44
107584
3811
02:03
in school, and kids weren't going to school.
45
111395
2007
02:05
But it's okay, it's the Red Sox, right?
46
113402
2013
02:07
I mean, there's education, and then there's the Red Sox,
47
115415
2488
02:09
and we know where they're stacked.
48
117903
1514
02:11
So this was an amazing experience, and again, yes,
49
119417
2646
02:14
it was a game, but they didn't write newspaper articles,
50
122063
2723
02:16
people didn't say -- you know, really, "I can die now
51
124786
2824
02:19
because the Red Sox won." And many people did.
52
127610
3178
02:22
So games, it means something more to us.
53
130788
3381
02:26
It absolutely means something more.
54
134169
1371
02:27
So now, just, this is an abrupt transition here.
55
135540
2457
02:29
There was three years where I actually did have a real job, sort of.
56
137997
2891
02:32
I was the head of a college department
57
140888
2131
02:35
teaching games, so, again, it was sort of a real job,
58
143019
2611
02:37
and now I just got to talk about making as opposed to making them.
59
145630
2913
02:40
And I was at a dinner. Part of the job of it, when you're
60
148543
2160
02:42
a chair of a department, is to eat, and I did that very well,
61
150703
3286
02:45
and so I'm out at a dinner with this guy called Zig Jackson.
62
153989
3609
02:49
So this is Zig in this photograph. This is also one of Zig's
63
157598
2657
02:52
photographs. He's a photographer.
64
160255
1644
02:53
And he goes all around the country taking pictures
65
161899
3025
02:56
of himself, and you can see here he's got
66
164924
4129
03:01
Zig's Indian Reservation. And this particular shot, this
67
169053
4693
03:05
is one of the more traditional shots. This is a rain dancer.
68
173746
3485
03:09
And this is one of my favorite shots here.
69
177231
2261
03:11
So you can look at this, and maybe you've even seen
70
179492
2113
03:13
things like this. This is an expression of culture, right?
71
181605
3075
03:16
And this is actually from his Degradation series.
72
184680
2473
03:19
And what was most fascinating to me about this series
73
187153
2538
03:21
is just, look at that little boy there.
74
189691
1502
03:23
Can you imagine? Now let's, we can see that's a traditional
75
191193
2893
03:26
Native American. Now I just want to change that guy's race.
76
194086
2700
03:28
Just imagine if that's a black guy.
77
196786
2098
03:30
So, "Honey, come here, let's get your picture with the black guy."
78
198884
2407
03:33
Right? Like, seriously, nobody would do this.
79
201291
2297
03:35
It baffles the mind. And so Zig, being Indian,
80
203588
3098
03:38
likewise it baffles his mind. His favorite photograph --
81
206686
2447
03:41
my favorite photograph of his, which I don't have in here is
82
209133
2584
03:43
Indian taking picture of white people taking pictures
83
211717
2715
03:46
of Indians. (Laughter)
84
214432
2802
03:49
So I happen to be at dinner with this photographer,
85
217234
1920
03:51
and he was talking with another photographer
86
219154
1861
03:53
about a shooting that had occurred,
87
221015
2052
03:55
and it was on an Indian reservation. He'd taken his camera
88
223067
2714
03:57
up there to photograph it, but when he got there,
89
225781
2250
04:00
he discovered he couldn't do it. He just couldn't capture
90
228031
1766
04:01
the picture. And so they were talking back and forth
91
229797
4256
04:06
about this question. Do you take the picture or not?
92
234053
2911
04:08
And that was fascinating to me as a game designer,
93
236964
2239
04:11
because it never occurs to me, like, should I make
94
239203
1578
04:12
the game about this difficult topic or not?
95
240781
2945
04:15
Because we just make things that are fun or, you know,
96
243726
2126
04:17
will make you feel fear, you know, that visceral excitement.
97
245852
3318
04:21
But every other medium does it.
98
249170
2285
04:23
So this is my kid. This is Maezza, and when she was
99
251455
2801
04:26
seven years old, she came home from school one day,
100
254256
2190
04:28
and like I do every single day, I asked her,
101
256446
1922
04:30
"What'd you do today?"
102
258368
1080
04:31
So she said, "We talked about the Middle Passage."
103
259448
2116
04:33
Now, this was a big moment. Maezza's dad is black,
104
261564
3436
04:37
and I knew this day was coming. I wasn't expecting it
105
265000
3522
04:40
at seven. I don't know why, but I wasn't.
106
268522
2081
04:42
Anyways, so I asked her, "How do you feel about that?"
107
270603
3345
04:45
So she proceeded to tell me, and so any of you
108
273948
2561
04:48
who are parents will recognize the bingo buzzwords here.
109
276509
2745
04:51
So the ships start in England, they come down
110
279254
1642
04:52
from England, they go to Africa, they go across the ocean --
111
280896
2286
04:55
that's the Middle Passage part — they come to America
112
283182
1865
04:57
where the slaves are sold, she's telling me.
113
285047
2297
04:59
But Abraham Lincoln was elected president, and then he
114
287344
2548
05:01
passed the Emancipation Proclamation, and now they're free.
115
289892
2846
05:04
Pause for about 10 seconds.
116
292738
2570
05:07
"Can I play a game, Mommy?"
117
295308
1290
05:08
And I thought, that's it? And so, you know,
118
296598
4543
05:13
this is the Middle Passage, this is an incredibly significant
119
301141
2998
05:16
event, and she's treating it like, basically some
120
304139
3597
05:19
black people went on a cruise, is more or less
121
307736
1704
05:21
how it sounds to her. (Laughter)
122
309440
2526
05:23
And so, to me, I wanted more value in this, so when
123
311966
3261
05:27
she asked if she could play a game, I said,
124
315227
2397
05:29
"Yes." (Laughter)
125
317624
1866
05:31
And so I happened to have all of these little pieces.
126
319490
2308
05:33
I'm a game designer, so I have this stuff sitting around my house.
127
321798
2666
05:36
So I said, "Yeah, you can play a game," and I give her
128
324464
1825
05:38
a bunch of these, and I tell her to paint them
129
326289
1539
05:39
in different families. These are pictures of Maezza
130
327828
1658
05:41
when she was — God, it still chokes me up seeing these.
131
329486
2703
05:44
So she's painting her little families.
132
332189
2324
05:46
So then I grab a bunch of them and I put them on a boat.
133
334513
2991
05:49
This was the boat. It was made quickly obviously. (Laughter)
134
337504
4972
05:54
And so the basic gist of it is, I grabbed a bunch of families,
135
342476
2521
05:56
and she's like, "Mommy, but you forgot the pink baby
136
344997
2036
05:59
and you forgot the blue daddy
137
347033
979
06:00
and you forgot all these other things."
138
348012
1364
06:01
And she says, "They want to go." And I said,
139
349376
1913
06:03
"Honey, no they don't want to go. This is the Middle Passage.
140
351289
1786
06:05
Nobody wants to go on the Middle Passage."
141
353075
2116
06:07
So she gave me a look that only a daughter
142
355191
2468
06:09
of a game designer would give a mother,
143
357659
2038
06:11
and as we're going across the ocean, following these rules,
144
359697
2676
06:14
she realizes that she's rolling pretty high, and she says
145
362373
3188
06:17
to me, "We're not going to make it."
146
365561
2632
06:20
And she realizes, you know, we don't have enough food,
147
368193
2595
06:22
and so she asks what to do, and I say,
148
370788
2732
06:25
"Well, we can either" -- Remember, she's seven --
149
373520
1832
06:27
"We can either put some people in the water
150
375352
1912
06:29
or we can hope that they don't get sick
151
377264
1592
06:30
and we make it to the other side."
152
378856
2123
06:32
And she -- just the look on her face came over
153
380979
2623
06:35
and she said -- now mind you this is after a month of --
154
383602
2374
06:37
this is Black History Month, right?
155
385976
2161
06:40
After a month she says to me,
156
388137
1357
06:41
"Did this really happen?"
157
389494
2133
06:43
And I said, "Yes." And so she said, "So, if I came
158
391627
2874
06:46
out of the woods" — this is her brother and sister — "If I came
159
394501
1905
06:48
out of the woods, Avalon and Donovan might be gone."
"Yes."
"Yes."
160
396406
2992
06:51
"But I'd get to see them in America."
"No."
"No."
161
399398
3156
06:54
"But what if I saw them? You know, couldn't we stay together?"
"No."
"No."
162
402554
2824
06:57
"So Daddy could be gone."
"Yes."
"Yes."
163
405378
2250
06:59
And she was fascinated by this, and she started to cry,
164
407628
2377
07:02
and I started to cry, and her father started to cry,
165
410005
2461
07:04
and now we're all crying. He didn't expect
166
412466
1152
07:05
to come home from work to the Middle Passage,
167
413618
1757
07:07
but there it goes. (Laughter)
168
415375
2332
07:09
And so, we made this game, and she got it.
169
417707
2882
07:12
She got it because she spent time with these people.
170
420589
2780
07:15
It wasn't abstract stuff in a brochure or in a movie.
171
423369
3269
07:18
And so it was just an incredibly powerful experience.
172
426638
3092
07:21
This is the game, which I've ended up calling
173
429730
1983
07:23
The New World, because I like the phrase.
174
431713
1955
07:25
I don't think the New World felt too new worldly exciting
175
433668
2816
07:28
to the people who were brought over on slave ships.
176
436484
2500
07:30
But when this happened, I saw the whole planet.
177
438984
2412
07:33
I was so excited. It was like, I'd been making games
178
441396
1851
07:35
for 20-some years, and then I decided to do it again.
179
443247
3599
07:38
My history is Irish.
180
446846
1198
07:40
So this is a game called Síochán Leat. It's "peace be with you."
181
448044
2897
07:42
It's the entire history of my family in a single game.
182
450941
2492
07:45
I made another game called Train.
183
453433
1705
07:47
I was making a series of six games
184
455138
2508
07:49
that covered difficult topics, and if you're going to cover
185
457646
2313
07:51
a difficult topic, this is one you need to cover,
186
459959
2025
07:53
and I'll let you figure out what that's about on your own.
187
461984
3065
07:57
And I also made a game about the Trail of Tears.
188
465049
3913
08:00
This is a game with 50,000 individual pieces.
189
468962
2478
08:03
I was crazy when I decided to start it,
190
471440
1795
08:05
but I'm in the middle of it now.
191
473235
1876
08:07
It's the same thing.
192
475111
988
08:08
I'm hoping that I'll teach culture through these games.
193
476099
2505
08:10
And the one I'm working on right now, which is --
194
478604
1979
08:12
because I'm right in the middle of it, and these for some reason choke me up like crazy --
195
480583
2861
08:15
is a game called Mexican Kitchen Workers.
196
483444
2175
08:17
And originally it was a math problem more or less.
197
485619
2714
08:20
Like, here's the economics of illegal immigration.
198
488333
2639
08:22
And the more I learned about the Mexican culture --
199
490972
2183
08:25
my partner is Mexican — the more I learned that,
200
493155
2091
08:27
you know, for all of us, food is a basic need, but,
201
495246
2894
08:30
and it is obviously with Mexicans too, but it's much more than that.
202
498140
3476
08:33
It's an expression of love. It's an expression of —
203
501616
2825
08:36
God, I'm totally choking up way more than I thought.
204
504441
3050
08:39
I'll look away from the picture.
205
507491
1707
08:41
It's an expression of beauty. It's how they say they love you.
206
509198
3355
08:44
It's how they say they care, and you can't hear somebody
207
512553
1973
08:46
talk about their Mexican grandmother
208
514526
1568
08:48
without saying "food" in the first sentence.
209
516094
3029
08:51
And so to me, this beautiful culture, this beautiful expression
210
519123
4332
08:55
is something that I want to capture through games.
211
523455
3138
08:58
And so games, for a change, it changes how we see topics,
212
526593
3077
09:01
it changes how our perceptions about those people
213
529670
2812
09:04
in topics, and it changes ourselves.
214
532482
2836
09:07
We change as people through games,
215
535318
2105
09:09
because we're involved, and we're playing,
216
537423
2047
09:11
and we're learning as we do so. Thank you. (Applause)
217
539470
3441
ABOUT THE SPEAKER
Brenda Romero - Game designerBrenda Romero designs games that turn some of history's most tragic lessons into interactive, emotional experiences.
Why you should listen
For decades, Brenda Romero has been a major figure in the field of game design. Famous for her work on the role-playing series Wizardry, she’s also known for her work on Def Jam: Icon, Playboy: The Mansion, and Dungeons & Dragons: Heroes. Inspired by her daughter in 2008, she began work on her non-digital series, The Mechanic Is the Message, dedicated to expressing difficult subjects through interactive media. Train, a game derived from the events of the Holocaust, won the Vanguard Award at Indiecade in October 2009.
Read TED's interview with Brenda Romero: "To understand inequality, let's play a game."
Brenda Romero | Speaker | TED.com