TED2016
Linus Torvalds: The mind behind Linux
林纳斯•托瓦兹: Linux 操作系统之父
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林纳斯•托瓦兹带来了两次技术革新——第一次是开发出Linux内核，驱动了因特网，第二次是开发出Git，一种源代码管理系统，被全世界开发者广泛使用。在这次难得的演讲中，TED策展人克里斯•安德森采访了托瓦兹，后者非常开诚布公地讨论了自己的性格特点，以及由此形成的独特哲学，无论是对工作、对工程学还是对人生。“我不是个有远见的人，我是一名工程师，”托瓦兹说，“我非常乐意跟梦想家在一起，他们行走四方，仰望苍穹……但我是低头看路的那种人，我只想填好眼前这个坑，不让自己掉进去。“
Linus Torvalds - Software engineer
In 1991, Linus Torvalds shared the Linux kernel with a few computer hobbyists. The operating system they built reshaped the software industry. Full bio
In 1991, Linus Torvalds shared the Linux kernel with a few computer hobbyists. The operating system they built reshaped the software industry. Full bio
Double-click the English transcript below to play the video.
00:13
Chris Anderson: This is such
a strange thing.
a strange thing.
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克里斯•安德森：有件事情很奇怪。
你的软件，Linux，
运行于数百万计算机中，
运行于数百万计算机中，
00:15
Your software, Linux,
is in millions of computers,
is in millions of computers,
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00:18
it probably powers much of the Internet.
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可以说是它驱动了网络。
00:22
And I think that there are, like,
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我想，全世界正在使用
00:24
a billion and a half active
Android devices out there.
Android devices out there.
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将近15亿台的安卓设备。
00:27
Your software is in every
single one of them.
single one of them.
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每一台里都有你的软件。
00:30
It's kind of amazing.
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这非常了不起。
00:31
You must have some amazing
software headquarters driving all this.
software headquarters driving all this.
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你肯定有一个特别高大上的
总部来实现这一切。
总部来实现这一切。
00:37
That's what I thought -- and I was shocked
when I saw a picture of it.
when I saw a picture of it.
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我以前真这么想——
直到我看到这张照片，我被震惊了。
直到我看到这张照片，我被震惊了。
00:40
I mean, this is --
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真的惊了——
00:41
this is the Linux world headquarters.
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这就是Linux的总部。
00:43
(Laughter)
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（笑声）
00:45
(Applause)
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（掌声）
00:49
Linus Torvalds: It really
doesn't look like much.
doesn't look like much.
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林纳斯•托瓦兹：好吧，让大家失望了。
00:52
And I have to say,
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我不得不说，
00:53
the most interesting part in this picture,
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这张照片里最有意思的地方，
00:57
that people mostly react to,
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被最多人问起的地方，
00:59
is the walking desk.
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就是那张会动的办公桌。
01:00
It is the most interesting
part in my office
part in my office
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这是我办公室最有趣的部分
01:03
and I'm not actually using it anymore.
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虽然我现在不怎么用它了。
01:05
And I think the two things are related.
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我觉得两者是有联系的。
01:09
The way I work is ...
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我的工作方式……
01:13
I want to not have external stimulation.
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我不想要有太多的外来刺激。
01:18
You can kind of see,
on the walls are this light green.
on the walls are this light green.
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大家能看到，我的墙是淡绿色的。
01:23
I'm told that at mental institutions
they use that on the walls.
they use that on the walls.
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据说精神病医院的墙就是这种颜色。
01:27
(Laughter)
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（笑声）
01:29
It's like a calming color,
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这种颜色能让你平静，
01:30
it's not something
that really stimulates you.
that really stimulates you.
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不会刺激到你。
01:35
What you can't see is the computer here,
you only see the screen,
you only see the screen,
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其实大家看不到我的电脑（主机），
只能看到显示器，
只能看到显示器，
01:39
but the main thing I worry
about in my computer is --
about in my computer is --
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我对电脑最主要的要求——
01:42
it doesn't have to be big
and powerful, although I like that --
and powerful, although I like that --
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并不是性能强劲，尽管我也爱——
01:46
it really has to be completely silent.
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就是它必须没有任何声音。
01:49
I know people who work for Google
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我认识一些在谷歌工作的人，
01:52
and they have their own
small data center at home,
small data center at home,
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他们在家里都有小型数据中心，
01:55
and I don't do that.
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我可没这习惯。
01:56
My office is the most
boring office you'll ever see.
boring office you'll ever see.
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我的办公室也许是你见过最无聊的一个。
02:00
And I sit there alone in the quiet.
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我喜欢独自一人，享受安静。
02:04
If the cat comes up,
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如果有猫进来，
02:06
it sits in my lap.
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它会坐在我大腿上。
02:08
And I want to hear the cat purring,
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我喜欢听猫打呼噜，
02:10
not the sound of the fans in the computer.
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而不是听特烦的电脑风扇的声音。
02:13
CA: So this is astonishing,
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CA：太了不起了，
02:14
because working this way,
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你的这种工作方式，
02:17
you're able to run this vast
technology empire --
technology empire --
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才能让你运行如此庞大的一个技术帝国——
02:20
it is an empire --
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确实是一个帝国——
02:21
so that's an amazing testament
to the power of open source.
to the power of open source.
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这是开源（软件）强大力量的一个最好例证。
02:25
Tell us how you got
to understand open source
to understand open source
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请告诉我们你是如何理解开源的，
02:29
and how it lead
to the development of Linux.
to the development of Linux.
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和它又是如何一步一步发展成Linux的。
02:33
LT: I mean, I still work alone.
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LT：我现在还是独自工作。
02:35
Really -- I work alone in my house,
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真的，我独自一人在家工作，
02:38
often in my bathrobe.
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经常穿着浴袍干活。
02:40
When a photographer shows up, I dress up,
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当一个摄影师来的时候，我才会穿戴整齐，
02:42
so I have clothes on.
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所以（这张照片里）我是穿着衣服的。
02:43
(Laughter)
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（笑声）
02:45
And that's how I've always worked.
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我一直以来就是这样工作的。
02:47
I mean, this was how I started Linux, too.
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Linux也是这样诞生的。
02:49
I did not start Linux
as a collaborative project.
as a collaborative project.
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Linux并不是一个合作的产物。
02:53
I started it as one
in a series of many projects
in a series of many projects
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它是我一系列项目中的一个，
02:57
I had done at the time for myself,
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纯粹出于自己当时的需要，
03:01
partly because I needed the end result,
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部分原因是我需要得到结果，
03:03
but even more because I just
enjoyed programming.
enjoyed programming.
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但更重要的原因是我享受编程。
03:06
So it was about the end of the journey,
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这段旅程的终点，
03:10
which, 25 years later,
we still have not reached.
we still have not reached.
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在25年后的今天，我们仍未达到。
03:13
But it was really about the fact
that I was looking for a project on my own
that I was looking for a project on my own
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当年我只是想做一个
完全属于自己的项目，
完全属于自己的项目，
03:17
and there was no open source,
really, on my radar at all.
really, on my radar at all.
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我压根就没想过开源这件事。
03:21
And what happened is ...
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但在那之后，
03:24
the project grows and becomes something
you want to show off to people.
you want to show off to people.
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随着项目越来越大，
你会开始想让别人知道。
你会开始想让别人知道。
03:30
Really, this is more of a, "Wow,
look at what I did!"
look at what I did!"
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感觉就像“哇，快来看看我的成果！”
03:34
And trust me -- it was not
that great back then.
that great back then.
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但说实话，最开始并没这么好。
03:38
I made it publicly available,
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我把它放到网上供人下载，
03:40
and it wasn't even
open source at that point.
open source at that point.
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当时甚至还不是开源的。
03:42
At that point it was source that was open,
but there was no intention
but there was no intention
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当然，所有代码都是开放的，
但我并没有想过
但我并没有想过
03:47
behind using the kind of open-source
methodology that we think of today
methodology that we think of today
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要用我们今天所熟知的开源方法
03:52
to improve it.
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来改进它。
03:53
It was more like,
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我当时想的是，
03:54
"Look, I've been working
on this for half a year,
on this for half a year,
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“看，这是我折腾了半年的成果，
03:58
I'd love to have comments."
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我想听听大家的意见。”
04:00
And other people approached me.
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有人来找过我。
04:03
At the University of Helsinki,
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在赫尔辛基大学，
04:04
I had a friend who was one
of the open source --
of the open source --
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我有个朋友是做开源软件的——
04:08
it was called mainly
"free software" back then --
"free software" back then --
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当年还叫“免费软件”——
04:12
and he actually introduced me
to the notion that, hey,
to the notion that, hey,
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他让我了解到，“嘿，
04:16
you can use these open-source
licenses that had been around.
licenses that had been around.
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你可以用那些已有的开源许可证。”
04:24
And I thought about it for a while.
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我考虑了一段时间。
04:26
I was actually worried about the whole
commercial interests coming in.
commercial interests coming in.
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我其实有点担心商业利益牵涉其中。
04:29
I mean, that's one of the worries
I think most people who start out have,
I think most people who start out have,
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我想，很多人一开始会跟我一样，
04:34
is that they worry about somebody
taking advantage of their work, right?
taking advantage of their work, right?
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担心自己的工作成果会被人利用，不是吗？
04:39
And I decided, "What the hell?"
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于是我决定，“不管了。”
04:43
And --
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然后……
04:44
CA: And then at some point,
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CA：然后某一天，
04:46
someone contributed
some code that you thought,
some code that you thought,
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一些人对你的代码提出了些建议，你觉得
04:48
"Wow, that really is interesting,
I would not have thought of that.
I would not have thought of that.
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“哇哦，真是不错，
我都没想到这一点。
我都没想到这一点。
对改进软件很有帮助。”
04:51
This could actually improve this."
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LT：其实最开始没有多少人直接改代码，
04:53
LT: It didn't even start
by people contributing code,
by people contributing code,
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04:56
it was more that people
started contributing ideas.
started contributing ideas.
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而是提出了很多想法。
04:59
And just the fact that somebody else
takes a look at your project --
takes a look at your project --
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让别人看一下你所做的项目——
05:03
and I'm sure it's true
of other things, too,
of other things, too,
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我想在其他行业也是这样——
05:05
but it's definitely true in code --
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但在编程的时候就更是如此——
05:07
is that somebody else
takes an interest in your code,
takes an interest in your code,
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有人对你的代码感兴趣，
05:10
looks at it enough to actually
give you feedback
give you feedback
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仔细研究过，能给你反馈，
05:13
and give you ideas.
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给你建议。
对我而言是非常重要的一件事。
05:15
That was a huge thing for me.
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05:17
I was 21 at the time, so I was young,
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当时我21岁，还很年轻，
05:20
but I had already programmed
for half my life, basically.
for half my life, basically.
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但在那之前，我人生的一半时间都在敲代码。
05:24
And every project before that
had been completely personal
had been completely personal
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之前的每一个项目，
我都是独自完成的，
我都是独自完成的，
05:28
and it was a revelation when people
just started commenting,
just started commenting,
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有人开始评论我的代码，
05:31
started giving feedback on your code.
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给予反馈，真是头一遭。
05:34
And even before they started
giving code back,
giving code back,
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他们甚至还没开始改代码，
05:38
that was, I think, one of the big
moments where I said,
moments where I said,
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但对我来讲已经足以载入史册，
因为我觉得，
因为我觉得，
05:41
"I love other people!"
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“我爱世人！”
05:43
Don't get me wrong --
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别误会我，
05:44
I'm actually not a people person.
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其实我并不合群。
05:46
(Laughter)
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（笑声）
05:49
I don't really love other people --
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我并不爱世人。
05:52
(Laughter)
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（笑声）
05:53
But I love computers,
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我爱电脑，
05:54
I love interacting with other
people on email,
people on email,
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我喜欢通过发邮件互动，
05:57
because it kind of gives you that buffer.
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因为这样能给你缓冲。
06:00
But I do love other people who comment
and get involved in my project.
and get involved in my project.
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但我真正喜欢的是
人们给出评论，参与我的项目。
人们给出评论，参与我的项目。
06:06
And it made it so much more.
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这样能让我的项目快速成长。
06:09
CA: So was there a moment
when you saw what was being built
when you saw what was being built
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CA：有没有那样一个时间点，
你发现自己一直在做的项目
你发现自己一直在做的项目
06:12
and it suddenly started taking off,
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突然开始成型了，
06:14
and you thought, "Wait a sec,
this actually could be something huge,
this actually could be something huge,
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你对自己说，
“等一下，这事儿也许能做成，
“等一下，这事儿也许能做成，
不单单是一个我能得到良好反馈的个人项目，
06:17
not just a personal project
that I'm getting nice feedback on,
that I'm getting nice feedback on,
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而是能在整个科技界掀起轩然大波的大事”？
06:20
but a kind of explosive development
in the whole technology world"?
in the whole technology world"?
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06:25
LT: Not really.
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LT：还真没有。
06:27
I mean, the big point for me, really,
was not when it was becoming huge,
was not when it was becoming huge,
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对我而言，最重要的时刻
并不是它变大的那一天，
并不是它变大的那一天，
06:30
it was when it was becoming little.
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恰恰是在它还不够大的时候。
06:33
The big point for me was not being alone
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对我而言，当我不再独自工作，
06:37
and having 10, maybe 100
people being involved --
people being involved --
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有10个人，或者100个人加入进来——
06:40
that was a big point.
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这才是一种突破。
06:42
Then everything else was very gradual.
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之后事情就顺其自然了。
06:45
Going from 100 people to a million people
is not a big deal -- to me.
is not a big deal -- to me.
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对我来说，从100人到100万人，
并不是那么重要。
并不是那么重要。
06:49
Well, I mean, maybe it is if you're --
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其实我的意思是，如果你……
06:51
(Laughter)
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（笑声）
06:52
If you want to sell your result
then it's a huge deal --
then it's a huge deal --
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如果你是想把自己的成果卖掉，
那确实就很重要——
那确实就很重要——
06:55
don't get me wrong.
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别误解我的意思。
06:56
But if you're interested in the technology
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如果你感兴趣的是科技本身，
06:58
and you're interested in the project,
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是这个项目本身，
07:00
the big part was getting the community.
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那么最重要的就是找到志趣相投的人。
07:02
Then the community grew gradually.
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之后这个群体会自发壮大。
07:04
And there's actually not
a single point where I went like,
a single point where I went like,
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并没有一个特别明显的时间点，我会觉得
07:08
"Wow, that just took off!" because it --
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“哇哦，这事儿快成了！”因为——
07:10
I mean -- it took a long time, relatively.
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这个时间非常漫长。
07:13
CA: So all the technologists
that I talk to really credit you
that I talk to really credit you
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CA：所有我采访的技术专家们
都对你赞不绝口，
都对你赞不绝口，
07:16
with massively changing their work.
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说你极大改进了他们的工作。
07:19
And it's not just Linux,
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不光是Linux，
07:21
it's this thing called Git,
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还有Git，
07:22
which is this management system
for software development.
for software development.
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是一种软件开发管理系统。
07:26
Tell us briefly about that
and your role in that.
and your role in that.
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简单介绍一下它以及你在其中扮演的角色。
07:30
LT: So one of the issues we had,
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LT：我们遇到的问题之一，
07:32
and this took a while to start to appear,
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（在项目开始后）一段时间后才开始显现，
07:35
is when you ...
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就是当你……
07:37
When you grow from having 10 people
or 100 people working on a project
or 100 people working on a project
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从10个或者100个人参与一个项目，
07:43
to having 10,000 people, which --
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增长到1万人的时候，而这——
07:45
I mean, right now we're in the situation
where just on the kernel,
where just on the kernel,
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关于（Linux）内核，我们碰到的问题是，
07:48
we have 1,000 people involved
in every single release
in every single release
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每次更新都有1000人参与，
07:52
and that's every two months,
roughly two or three months.
roughly two or three months.
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而更新频率是每两、三个月一次。
07:56
Some of those people don't do a lot.
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这其中有些人作用不大。
07:58
There's a lot of people
who make small, small changes.
who make small, small changes.
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有很多人能做出小小的改进。
08:01
But to maintain this,
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但要进行维护，
08:03
the scale changes how
you have to maintain it.
you have to maintain it.
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所需要的工作量就会大大增加。
08:06
And we went through a lot of pain.
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我们吃尽了苦头。
08:10
And there are whole projects
that do only source-code maintenance.
that do only source-code maintenance.
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有时候甚至整个程序
都仅仅是为了对源代码进行维护。
都仅仅是为了对源代码进行维护。
08:17
CVS is the one that used to be
the most commonly used,
the most commonly used,
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CVS曾经是最流行的，
08:20
and I hated CVS with a passion
and refused to touch it
and refused to touch it
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我恨透了它，连碰都不想碰，
08:24
and tried something else
that was radical and interesting
that was radical and interesting
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我喜欢更基础、更有趣的方法，
08:27
and everybody else hated.
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但其他人又不喜欢。
08:31
CA: (Laughs)
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CA：（笑声）
08:32
LT: And we were in this bad spot,
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LT：我们陷入了僵局，
08:34
where we had thousands of people
who wanted to participate,
who wanted to participate,
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成千上万的人想参与进来，
08:37
but in many ways,
I was the kind of break point,
I was the kind of break point,
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但很多时候，我成为了那个断点，
08:42
where I could not scale to the point
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我无法让自己跨出那一步，
08:44
where I could work
with thousands of people.
with thousands of people.
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同上千人合作。
08:47
So Git is my second big project,
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因此Git是我的第二个大项目，
08:50
which was only created for me
to maintain my first big project.
to maintain my first big project.
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它存在的意义就是维护我的第一个大项目。
08:55
And this is literally how I work.
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事实上这就是我的工作方式。
08:57
I don't code for --
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我编程并不是为了……
09:00
well, I do code for fun --
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我编程是因为好玩，
09:01
but I want to code
for something meaningful
for something meaningful
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但我也想做一些有意义的事情，
09:04
so every single project I've ever done
has been something I needed
has been something I needed
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因此我设计每一个程序
仅仅是因为我自己需要
仅仅是因为我自己需要
09:08
and --
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而且……
09:09
CA: So really, both Linux
and Git kind of arose
and Git kind of arose
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CA：因此，实际上，Linux和Git的出现，
09:13
almost as an unintended consequence
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都是意外的收获，
09:15
of your desire not to have
to work with too many people.
to work with too many people.
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仅仅因为你不想跟太多人一起工作。
LT：千真万确。没错。
09:18
LT: Absolutely. Yes.
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09:19
(Laughter)
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（笑声）
09:20
CA: That's amazing.
LT: Yeah.
LT: Yeah.
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CA：太牛了。
LT：可不是吗。
LT：可不是吗。
09:22
(Applause)
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（掌声）
09:23
And yet, you're the man
who's transformed technology
who's transformed technology
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你带来了技术革新，
09:27
not just once but twice,
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不是一次，而是两次，
09:28
and we have to try
and understand why it is.
and understand why it is.
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我们试图去探寻背后的原因。
09:31
You've given us some clues, but ...
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你给了我们一些线索，但是……
09:32
Here's a picture of you as a kid,
with a Rubik's Cube.
with a Rubik's Cube.
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这是一张你小时候的照片，
你手里拿着魔方。
你手里拿着魔方。
09:37
You mentioned that you've been
programming since you were like 10 or 11,
programming since you were like 10 or 11,
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你刚才提到，你从10岁、
11岁就开始编程了，
11岁就开始编程了，
09:41
half your life.
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人生的一半，
09:43
Were you this sort of computer
genius, you know, übernerd,
genius, you know, übernerd,
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你是那种电脑天才，技术宅吗？
09:46
were you the star at school
who could do everything?
who could do everything?
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你在学校里是无所不能的明星吗？
你是个什么样的孩子？
09:49
What were you like as a kid?
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09:52
LT: Yeah, I think I was
the prototypical nerd.
the prototypical nerd.
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LT：没错，我觉得自己就是宅男的原型。
09:54
I mean, I was ...
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我是说，当年……
09:57
I was not a people person back then.
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我并不喜欢跟人打交道。
09:59
That's my younger brother.
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那是我弟弟。
10:01
I was clearly more interested
in the Rubik's Cube
in the Rubik's Cube
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显然我对魔方更有兴趣，
10:04
than my younger brother.
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完全无视我弟弟。
10:06
(Laughter)
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（笑声）
10:07
My younger sister,
who's not in the picture,
who's not in the picture,
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我还有个妹妹，她不在照片里，
10:10
when we had family meetings --
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当我们全家聚在一起的时候——
10:12
and it's not a huge family, but I have,
like, a couple of cousins --
like, a couple of cousins --
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我家人不算多，但我有好几个侄子侄女——
10:16
she would prep me beforehand.
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她会事先给我打预防针。
10:19
Like, before I stepped
into the room she would say,
into the room she would say,
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在我进屋之前，她会说，
10:22
"OK. That's so-and-so ..."
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“好的，你要注意什么什么……”
因为我其实……
10:25
Because I was not --
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10:28
I was a geek.
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我是个技术宅。
10:29
I was into computers,
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我喜欢电脑，
10:30
I was into math,
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喜欢数学，
10:31
I was into physics.
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喜欢物理。
10:33
I was good at that.
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我擅长这些。
10:34
I don't think I was
particularly exceptional.
particularly exceptional.
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但也没到出类拔萃的地步。
10:37
Apparently, my sister said
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就像我妹妹说的，
10:39
that my biggest exceptional quality
was that I would not let go.
was that I would not let go.
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我最突出的品质就是不放弃。
10:47
CA: OK, so let's go there,
because that's interesting.
because that's interesting.
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CA：好的，那我们就来聊聊这个，
这很有意思。
这很有意思。
10:50
You would not let go.
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你不轻言放弃。
10:51
So that's not about being
a geek and being smart,
a geek and being smart,
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也就是说，不是因为技术宅或者聪明，
10:54
that's about being ... stubborn?
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而是因为……固执？
10:57
LT: That's about being stubborn.
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LT：没错，就是固执。
10:58
That's about, like,
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就像，
11:01
just starting something
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我开始做一件事情，
11:03
and not saying, "OK, I'm done,
let's do something else --
let's do something else --
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我不会说，“好的，我不干了，
我要去干点别的……
我要去干点别的……
11:08
Look: shiny!"
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看，比如那个！”
11:10
And I notice that in many
other parts in my life, too.
other parts in my life, too.
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我发现我在做其他事情的时候也会这样。
11:15
I lived in Silicon Valley for seven years.
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我在硅谷生活了7年。
11:18
And I worked for the same
company, in Silicon Valley,
company, in Silicon Valley,
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一直在同一家公司上班，
那可是在硅谷哦，
那可是在硅谷哦，
11:22
for the whole time.
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从未换过。
11:24
That is unheard of.
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这简直闻所未闻。
11:27
That's not how Silicon Valley works.
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尤其在硅谷这个地方。
11:28
The whole point of Silicon Valley
is that people jump between jobs
is that people jump between jobs
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硅谷最大的特点就是，人们总在跳槽，
11:32
to kind of mix up the pot.
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一会这一会那。
11:35
And that's not the kind of person I am.
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而我不是这样。
11:37
CA: But during the actual
development of Linux itself,
development of Linux itself,
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CA：但在Linux系统发展的过程中，
11:39
that stubbornness sometimes brought
you in conflict with other people.
you in conflict with other people.
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这种固执有时会让你和别人产生冲突。
11:44
Talk about that a bit.
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给我们讲讲这个。
11:46
Was that essential to sort of maintain
the quality of what was being built?
the quality of what was being built?
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维持已有成果的质量是不是非常必要？
11:51
How would you describe what happened?
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你会如何来形容之后发生的事情？
11:54
LT: I don't know if it's essential.
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LT：我不确定这是不是非常必要。
11:57
Going back to the "I'm not
a people person," --
a people person," --
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还是说回到“我并不合群”这一点，
12:00
sometimes I'm also ...
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有的时候我还……
12:04
shall we say,
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可以说，
12:05
"myopic" when it comes
to other people's feelings,
to other people's feelings,
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不太理解他人的感受，
12:09
and that sometimes makes you
say things that hurt other people.
say things that hurt other people.
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经常会说话伤到别人。
12:14
And I'm not proud of that.
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对此我感到很抱歉。
12:18
(Applause)
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（掌声）
12:19
But, at the same time, it's --
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但与此同时，
12:22
I get people who tell me
that I should be nice.
that I should be nice.
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有人告诉我，我应该友善一些。
12:26
And then when I try to explain to them
that maybe you're nice,
that maybe you're nice,
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然后我会跟他们说，可能你是友善，
12:32
maybe you should be more aggressive,
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但你应该更加富有侵略性一些，
12:34
they see that as me being not nice.
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他们会把这个当成我的不友善。
12:38
(Laughter)
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（笑声）
12:40
What I'm trying to say
is we are different.
is we are different.
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我想说的是我们是不同的。
12:42
I'm not a people person;
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我不是个合群的人，
12:44
it's not something
I'm particularly proud of,
I'm particularly proud of,
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对此我并不感到骄傲，
12:46
but it's part of me.
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但这就是我。
12:48
And one of the things
I really like about open source
I really like about open source
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而我喜欢开源软件的一点就是，
12:50
is it really allows different
people to work together.
people to work together.
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它能让形形色色的人在一起合作。
12:56
We don't have to like each other --
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我们不必相互喜欢——
12:58
and sometimes we really
don't like each other.
don't like each other.
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有时候我们甚至互相讨厌。
13:00
Really -- I mean, there are very,
very heated arguments.
very heated arguments.
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是真的，我们经常吵得不可开交。
13:04
But you can, actually,
you can find things that --
you can find things that --
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但是你会，你会发现许多事情——
13:08
you don't even agree to disagree,
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甚至都没法同意保留不同意见，
13:10
it's just that you're interested
in really different things.
in really different things.
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因为大家的兴趣点真的不一样。
13:13
And coming back to the point
where I said earlier
where I said earlier
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回到我刚才说过的，
13:16
that I was afraid of commercial people
taking advantage of your work,
taking advantage of your work,
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我担心商人们利用我们的劳动成果，
13:20
it turned out, and very
quickly turned out,
quickly turned out,
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但没过多久，我发现，
13:23
that those commercial people
were lovely, lovely people.
were lovely, lovely people.
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这些商人都是非常非常好的人。
13:26
And they did all the things that I was not
at all interested in doing,
at all interested in doing,
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3706
他们做那些我不感兴趣的事，
13:30
and they had completely different goals.
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关注点与我完全不同。
13:32
And they used open source in ways
that I just did not want to go.
that I just did not want to go.
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他们使用开源软件的方法跟我不一样的。
13:37
But because it was open
source they could do it,
source they could do it,
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但正因为是开源的，他们可以这么干，
13:39
and it actually works
really beautifully together.
really beautifully together.
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2352
而且实际上效果很好。
13:42
And I actually think
it works the same way.
it works the same way.
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2024
我甚至认为跟我使用的效果一样好。
13:44
You need to have the people-people,
the communicators,
the communicators,
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我们需要合群的人，需要能与人交流的人，
13:47
the warm and friendly people
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需要温暖友好的人
13:49
who like --
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1722
就像……
13:50
(Laughter)
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1442
（笑声）
13:52
really want to hug you
and get you into the community.
and get you into the community.
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喜欢拥抱你，带你走进这个圈子。
13:55
But that's not everybody.
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1571
但不是每个人都能做到。
13:56
And that's not me.
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1432
比如我就做不到。
13:58
I care about the technology.
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1457
我关注的是技术。
13:59
There are people who care about the UI.
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1881
有的人关注用户界面。
14:01
I can't do UI to save my life.
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我死也做不来用户界面。
14:04
I mean, if I was stranded on an island
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3021
举个例子，如果我被困在一个孤岛上，
14:07
and the only way to get off that island
was the make a pretty UI,
was the make a pretty UI,
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3400
逃出生天的唯一办法
是设计一个漂亮的用户界面，
是设计一个漂亮的用户界面，
14:11
I'd die there.
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1163
我宁愿死在岛上。
14:12
(Laughter)
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1151
（笑声）
14:13
So there's different kinds of people,
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2139
人跟人是不一样的，
14:15
and I'm not making excuses,
I'm trying to explain.
I'm trying to explain.
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2865
我并不是在找借口，
只是想解释给大家听。
只是想解释给大家听。
14:18
CA: Now, when we talked last week,
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CA：我们上周见面的时候，
你聊到自己的一些其他特点，
14:20
you talked about some
other trait that you have,
other trait that you have,
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2485
14:22
which I found really interesting.
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我觉得很有意思。
14:24
It's this idea called taste.
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是关于品味的。
我这里有一些图片。
14:25
And I've just got a couple of images here.
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2002
14:28
I think this is an example of not
particularly good taste in code,
particularly good taste in code,
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我觉得这一段代码就没什么品位，
14:32
and this one is better taste,
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而这一段要好一些，
14:35
which one can immediately see.
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2063
相信大家一看便知。
14:37
What is the difference between these two?
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这两段代码有什么不一样？
14:40
LT: So this is --
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1182
LT：这是……
14:41
How many people here actually have coded?
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2677
在座的有哪些人编过程？
14:45
CA: Oh my goodness.
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CA：我的天啊。
14:47
LT: So I guarantee you,
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1155
LT：我敢保证，
14:48
everybody who raised their hand,
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1545
刚刚举手的每一位，
14:49
they have done what's called
a singly-linked list.
a singly-linked list.
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2621
肯定做过单向链表。
14:52
And it's taught --
311
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2009
它是在……
14:55
This, the first not very
good taste approach,
good taste approach,
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3591
这个，第一段不怎么漂亮的代码，
14:58
is basically how it's taught to be done
when you start out coding.
when you start out coding.
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基本上是在你刚开始学编程的时候学到的。
15:02
And you don't have to understand the code.
314
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2044
你不需要真的理解这段代码。
15:04
The most interesting part to me
315
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我觉得最有意思的
15:06
is the last if statement.
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是最后一个“if”语句。
15:10
Because what happens
in a singly-linked list --
in a singly-linked list --
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因为在单向链表中——
15:13
this is trying to remove
an existing entry from a list --
an existing entry from a list --
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这里是试图将一个已存在的入口移出链表——
15:16
and there's a difference
between if it's the first entry
between if it's the first entry
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不同之处在于这是第一个入口
15:20
or whether it's an entry in the middle.
320
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1999
还是一个位于中间的入口。
15:22
Because if it's the first entry,
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如果是第一个入口，
15:24
you have to change
the pointer to the first entry.
the pointer to the first entry.
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你需要将指针改向第一个入口。
15:27
If it's in the middle,
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而如果位于中间，
15:28
you have to change the pointer
of a previous entry.
of a previous entry.
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你需要将指针改向上一个入口。
15:31
So they're two completely different cases.
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这是两种完全不同的情况。
15:33
CA: And that's better.
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CA：这一个比较好。
15:34
LT: And this is better.
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LT：这一个比较好。
15:35
It does not have the if statement.
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它没有if语句。
15:38
And it doesn't really matter --
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这完全不影响——
15:40
I don't want you understand
why it doesn't have the if statement,
why it doesn't have the if statement,
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你不必了解这里为什么没有“if”语句，
15:44
but I want you to understand
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你需要了解的是
15:45
that sometimes you can see
a problem in a different way
a problem in a different way
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有时候你可以换个角度看问题，
15:48
and rewrite it so that
a special case goes away
a special case goes away
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重写代码，排除特例，
15:51
and becomes the normal case.
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完美覆盖所有情况。
15:53
And that's good code.
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这就是好的代码。
15:55
But this is simple code.
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同时也很简单。
15:56
This is CS 101.
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1349
这是最基本的原则。
15:58
This is not important --
although, details are important.
although, details are important.
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其实这都不重要——
当然，细节非常重要。
当然，细节非常重要。
16:01
To me, the sign of people
I really want to work with
I really want to work with
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对我来说，我愿意与之共事的人，
16:05
is that they have good taste,
which is how ...
which is how ...
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2673
必须有好的品位，这就是如何……
16:09
I sent you this stupid example
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1597
我举的这个例子很傻，
16:10
that is not relevant
because it's too small.
because it's too small.
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2344
没什么意义，因为实在太短。
16:13
Good taste is much bigger than this.
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2142
好的品位体现在更长的代码里。
16:15
Good taste is about really
seeing the big patterns
seeing the big patterns
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4021
好的品位体现在能看清全局
16:19
and kind of instinctively knowing
what's the right way to do things.
what's the right way to do things.
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4458
甚至有一种直觉，
知道怎么把事情做漂亮。
知道怎么把事情做漂亮。
16:24
CA: OK, so we're putting
the pieces together here now.
the pieces together here now.
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CA：好的，让我们来总结一下。
16:27
You have taste,
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1467
你有品位，
16:30
in a way that's meaningful
to software people.
to software people.
348
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2337
当然是对于程序员们而言，
16:32
You're --
349
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1151
你很有品位——
16:33
(Laughter)
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1816
（笑声）
16:35
LT: I think it was meaningful
to some people here.
to some people here.
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2561
LT：对在座有些人而言，是这样。
16:39
CA: You're a very smart computer coder,
352
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2917
CA：你是个非常有才华的电脑程序员，
16:42
and you're hellish stubborn.
353
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1697
你异常固执。
16:45
But there must be something else.
354
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1586
但肯定不止这些。
因为你是改变了未来的人。
16:47
I mean, you've changed the future.
355
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1623
你一定有实现未来宏伟愿景的能力。
16:48
You must have the ability
of these grand visions of the future.
of these grand visions of the future.
356
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2963
你是个有远见的人，是吗？
16:51
You're a visionary, right?
357
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1261
16:53
LT: I've actually felt slightly
uncomfortable at TED
uncomfortable at TED
358
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2591
LT：其实在过去两天里，我在TED大会
16:55
for the last two days,
359
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2160
觉得不太自在 ，
16:57
because there's a lot
of vision going on, right?
of vision going on, right?
360
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2595
因为有很多关于未来的想象，对吧？
17:00
And I am not a visionary.
361
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1697
我并不是一个有远见的人。
17:02
I do not have a five-year plan.
362
1010290
2229
我没有制定未来五年的计划。
17:04
I'm an engineer.
363
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1358
我是一名工程师。
17:05
And I think it's really --
364
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1260
而且我觉得，真是——
17:07
I mean -- I'm perfectly
happy with all the people
happy with all the people
365
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2319
我是说——我非常乐意跟梦想家在一起
17:09
who are walking around
and just staring at the clouds
and just staring at the clouds
366
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2751
他们行走四方，仰望苍穹，
17:12
and looking at the stars
and saying, "I want to go there."
and saying, "I want to go there."
367
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2851
看着满天星辰说，“我想到那儿去。”
17:15
But I'm looking at the ground,
368
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1452
但我是低头看路的那种人，
17:16
and I want to fix the pothole
that's right in front of me
that's right in front of me
369
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2855
我只想填好眼前这个坑，
17:19
before I fall in.
370
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1360
不让自己掉进去。
17:20
This is the kind of person I am.
371
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1619
我是这样的人。
17:22
(Cheers)
372
1030584
1111
（欢呼）
17:23
(Applause)
373
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1312
（掌声）
17:25
CA: So you spoke to me last week
about these two guys.
about these two guys.
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3611
CA：上周你跟我聊过他们俩。
17:29
Who are they and how
do you relate to them?
do you relate to them?
375
1037358
2435
他们是谁？你跟他们有什么关系？
17:32
LT: Well, so this is kind
of cliché in technology,
of cliché in technology,
376
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3602
LT：这其实是技术界的一个老故事了，
17:35
the whole Tesla versus Edison,
377
1043865
2007
特斯拉和爱迪生之争，
17:37
where Tesla is seen as the visionary
scientist and crazy idea man.
scientist and crazy idea man.
378
1045896
4941
特斯拉被认为是一名有远见的科学家，
总是有疯狂的想法。
总是有疯狂的想法。
17:42
And people love Tesla.
379
1050861
2782
大家都爱特斯拉。
17:45
I mean, there are people who name
their companies after him.
their companies after him.
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2987
你看，还有人把自己公司也叫这个名字。
17:48
(Laughter)
381
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1150
（笑声）
17:51
The other person there is Edison,
382
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2612
另一个人是爱迪生，
17:54
who is actually often vilified
for being kind of pedestrian
for being kind of pedestrian
383
1062001
3507
经常被嘲讽说他是一个单调乏味的人，
17:57
and is --
384
1065532
1921
而且——
17:59
I mean, his most famous quote is,
385
1067477
2722
他最有名的一句话就是，
18:02
"Genius is one percent inspiration
and 99 percent perspiration."
and 99 percent perspiration."
386
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4714
“天才是1%的灵感加上99%的汗水。”
18:07
And I'm in the Edison camp,
387
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1453
而我是爱迪生一派的，
18:08
even if people don't always like him.
388
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2184
尽管人们经常讨厌他。
18:11
Because if you actually compare the two,
389
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3019
如果你比较一下这两位，
18:14
Tesla has kind of this mind
grab these days,
grab these days,
390
1082122
4533
特斯拉很能抓眼球，
18:18
but who actually changed the world?
391
1086679
1999
但真正改变世界的是谁？
18:21
Edison may not have been a nice person,
392
1089853
3382
爱迪生也许不是个讨喜的人，
18:25
he did a lot of things --
393
1093259
3132
但他做了很多事——
18:28
he was maybe not so intellectual,
394
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2429
他也许没那么天才，
18:30
not so visionary.
395
1098868
2227
不是那么有远见。
18:33
But I think I'm more
of an Edison than a Tesla.
of an Edison than a Tesla.
396
1101119
3661
我觉得自己更像爱迪生而不是特斯拉。
18:37
CA: So our theme at TED
this week is dreams --
this week is dreams --
397
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2438
CA：TED大会这一周的主题是梦想——
18:40
big, bold, audacious dreams.
398
1108131
1347
宏伟、大胆的梦想。
18:41
You're really the antidote to that.
399
1109502
1802
而你却像碎梦人。
18:43
LT: I'm trying to dial it down a bit, yes.
400
1111328
2109
LT：我会试着收敛一些。
18:45
CA: That's good.
401
1113461
1151
CA：太好了。
18:46
(Laughter)
402
1114636
1080
（笑声）
18:47
We embrace you, we embrace you.
403
1115740
1605
我们接受你，我们爱你。
18:51
Companies like Google and many
others have made, arguably,
others have made, arguably,
404
1119046
2749
谷歌和其他许多公司
使用你的软件，
使用你的软件，
18:53
like, billions of dollars
out of your software.
out of your software.
405
1121819
2206
挣了非常多的钱。
18:56
Does that piss you off?
406
1124049
1151
你会觉得不爽吗？
18:57
LT: No.
407
1125224
1151
LT：不会。
18:58
No, it doesn't piss me off
for several reasons.
for several reasons.
408
1126399
2634
原因有很多，
19:01
And one of them is, I'm doing fine.
409
1129057
2010
其中一个原因是，我过得不错。
19:03
I'm really doing fine.
410
1131091
1296
真心不错。
19:04
But the other reason is --
411
1132942
1584
另一个原因就是——
19:06
I mean, without doing the whole
open source and really letting go thing,
open source and really letting go thing,
412
1134550
5327
如果我不将它开源，而过于纠结的话，
19:11
Linux would never have been what it is.
413
1139901
2226
Linux就不会发展成今天这样。
19:14
And it's brought experiences
I don't really enjoy, public talking,
I don't really enjoy, public talking,
414
1142151
5096
而且Linux让我有了许多经历，
尽管我不喜欢，比如在公开场合讲话，
尽管我不喜欢，比如在公开场合讲话，
19:19
but at the same time,
this is an experience.
this is an experience.
415
1147271
2151
但同时，这也是一种历练。
19:21
Trust me.
416
1149446
1280
相信我。
19:23
So there's a lot of things going on
that make me a very happy man
that make me a very happy man
417
1151238
5143
很多事情让我成为了一个快乐的人，
19:28
and thinking I did the right choices.
418
1156405
2529
我觉得当初的选择没有错。
19:30
CA: Is the open source idea --
419
1158958
1912
CA：开源软件这个想法——
19:32
this is, I think we'll end here --
420
1160894
1636
我想这是最后一个话题——
19:34
is the open source idea
fully realized now in the world,
fully realized now in the world,
421
1162554
4054
开源软件这个想法已经在全世界实现了吗？
19:38
or is there more that it could go,
422
1166632
3018
还是说还有潜力可挖，
19:41
are there more things that it could do?
423
1169674
2015
还有很多可以做的？
19:44
LT: So, I'm of two minds there.
424
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2234
LT：我有两个想法。
19:46
I think one reason open source
works so well in code
works so well in code
425
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4486
我认为开源软件如此成功的原因之一
19:51
is that at the end of the day,
426
1179506
2409
在于归根结底，
19:53
code tends to be somewhat black and white.
427
1181939
3246
代码是一个非黑即白的事情。
19:57
There's often a fairly good way to decide,
428
1185209
4157
我们有非常明确的方法来分辨，
20:01
this is done correctly
and this is not done well.
and this is not done well.
429
1189390
3946
一段代码是行还是不行。
20:05
Code either works or it doesn't,
430
1193360
2378
代码要么运行成功，要么失败，
20:07
which means that there's less
room for arguments.
room for arguments.
431
1195762
4608
这就意味着没什么可争议的。
20:12
And we have arguments despite this, right?
432
1200394
3631
我们有很多争议，不是吗？
20:16
In many other areas --
433
1204049
1915
在其他许多领域——
20:17
I mean, people have talked about
open politics and things like that --
open politics and things like that --
434
1205988
3741
人们探讨过公开政治和其他类似的事情——
20:21
and it's really hard sometimes to say
435
1209753
2949
有时候真的很难去说，
20:24
that, yes, you can apply the same
principles in some other areas
principles in some other areas
436
1212726
3757
没错，你可以在其他领域也采取同样的原则，
20:28
just because the black and white
turns into not just gray,
turns into not just gray,
437
1216507
5439
因为在那些地方不是非黑即白的，有灰色，
20:33
but different colors.
438
1221970
1603
也有其他颜色。
20:36
So, obviously open source in science
is making a comeback.
is making a comeback.
439
1224339
4366
因此，科学界的开源显然是一种回归。
科学最初是开源的。
20:40
Science was there first.
440
1228729
1634
20:42
But then science ended up
being pretty closed,
being pretty closed,
441
1230387
2667
但之后变得越来越封闭，
20:45
with very expensive journals
and some of that going on.
and some of that going on.
442
1233078
3624
只存在那些昂贵的科学期刊上。
20:48
And open source is making
a comeback in science,
a comeback in science,
443
1236726
3836
开源让科学回归了，
20:52
with things like arXiv and open journals.
444
1240586
4147
我们有了arXiv和开放期刊。
20:59
Wikipedia changed the world, too.
445
1247262
1953
维基百科也改变了世界。
21:01
So there are other examples,
446
1249239
1454
还有其他许多例子，
21:02
I'm sure there are more to come.
447
1250717
1633
我觉得未来还会有更多。
21:05
CA: But you're not a visionary,
448
1253660
1567
CA：但你不是个有远见的人，
21:07
and so it's not up to you to name them.
449
1255251
1953
这些事跟你没啥关系。
21:09
LT: No.
450
1257228
1159
LT：当然。
21:10
(Laughter)
451
1258411
1048
（笑声）
21:11
It's up to you guys to make them, right?
452
1259483
1964
得靠你们去实现了，对吗？
21:13
CA: Exactly.
453
1261471
1263
CA：没错。
21:14
Linus Torvalds,
454
1262758
1158
林纳斯·托瓦兹，
21:15
thank you for Linux,
thank you for the Internet,
thank you for the Internet,
455
1263940
2245
谢谢你的Linux，谢谢你为互联网做的一切，
21:18
thank you for all those Android phones.
456
1266209
1865
谢谢你为安卓手机做的一切。
谢谢你来参加TED大会，
让我们更加了解你。
让我们更加了解你。
21:20
Thank you for coming here to TED
and revealing so much of yourself.
and revealing so much of yourself.
457
1268098
3197
LT：谢谢。
21:23
LT: Thank you.
458
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1152
21:24
(Applause)
459
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4440
（掌声）
ABOUT THE SPEAKER
Linus Torvalds - Software engineerIn 1991, Linus Torvalds shared the Linux kernel with a few computer hobbyists. The operating system they built reshaped the software industry.
Why you should listen
Fascinated by the economy and elegance of experimental operating system Minix, computer scientist Linus Torvalds wrote an operating system kernel and shared it with independent programmers. The system that they fleshed out and released in 1994 -- Linux -- was remarkable not only for its utility and efficiency but also for the collaboration of its community.
Now enjoying mainstream respectability (and the support of the computer industry), Linux runs on the servers of Amazon, Google, and much of the wired world. As the sole arbiter of code for the Linux Foundation (which he characteristically downplays by saying “the only power I have is to say ‘no’”), Torvalds quietly inspires open-source projects worldwide.
Linus Torvalds | Speaker | TED.com