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Johann Hari: Everything you think you know about addiction is wrong
Johann Hari: Všetko, čo viete o závislosti, je omyl
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Čo vyvoláva závislosť? Všetko od kokaínu po smartfóny. Ako sa dá závislosť prekonať? Johann Hari pochopil, že súčasné metódy zlyhali, keď videl svojich milovaných bojovať so závislosťou. Začal sa pýtať, prečo sa k závislým správame tak, ako sa správame... a či sa naše správanie dá zlepšiť. V tejto veľmi osobnej reči nám rozpráva, ako ho tieto otázky viedli po svete, aby objavil niektoré prekvapujúce a nádejné spôsoby myslenia o tomto dávnom probléme.
Johann Hari - Journalist
Johann Hari spent three years researching the war on drugs; along the way, he discovered that addiction is not what we think it is. Full bio
Johann Hari spent three years researching the war on drugs; along the way, he discovered that addiction is not what we think it is. Full bio
Double-click the English transcript below to play the video.
Jedna z prvých vecí,
na ktoré sa pamätám, je,
na ktoré sa pamätám, je,
00:12
One of my earliest memories
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00:14
is of trying to wake up
one of my relatives and not being able to.
one of my relatives and not being able to.
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keď som sa snažil zobudiť člena
rodiny a nepodarilo sa mi to.
rodiny a nepodarilo sa mi to.
00:17
And I was just a little kid,
so I didn't really understand why,
so I didn't really understand why,
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Bol som iba dieťa, nerozumel som prečo,
00:20
but as I got older,
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potom som vyrástol
a všimol som si v rodine
závislosť na drogách,
závislosť na drogách,
00:21
I realized we had
drug addiction in my family,
drug addiction in my family,
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00:23
including later cocaine addiction.
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vrátane závislosti na kokaíne.
V poslednej dobe som na to veľa myslel,
z časti lebo práve uplynulo 100 rokov
z časti lebo práve uplynulo 100 rokov
00:25
I'd been thinking about it a lot lately,
partly because it's now exactly 100 years
partly because it's now exactly 100 years
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od zákazu užívania drog
v USA a Veľkej Británii
v USA a Veľkej Británii
00:30
since drugs were first banned
in the United States and Britain,
in the United States and Britain,
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a neskôr aj na celom svete.
00:33
and we then imposed that
on the rest of the world.
on the rest of the world.
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Uplynulo storočie odkedy sme
urobili nešťastné rozhodnutie
urobili nešťastné rozhodnutie
00:36
It's a century since we made
this really fateful decision
this really fateful decision
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00:39
to take addicts and punish them
and make them suffer,
and make them suffer,
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potrestať závislých, nech trpia,
00:43
because we believed that would deter them;
it would give them an incentive to stop.
it would give them an incentive to stop.
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lebo sme verili, že ich to odradí
a povzbudí k náprave.
a povzbudí k náprave.
00:48
And a few years ago, I was looking at
some of the addicts in my life who I love,
some of the addicts in my life who I love,
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Pred pár rokmi som pozoroval niekoľkých
závislých v mojom okolí, ktorých mám rád,
závislých v mojom okolí, ktorých mám rád,
00:53
and trying to figure out
if there was some way to help them.
if there was some way to help them.
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a snažil som sa zistiť,
či by sa im dalo nejako pomôcť.
či by sa im dalo nejako pomôcť.
00:56
And I realized there were loads
of incredibly basic questions
of incredibly basic questions
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Uvedomil som si, že som
nepoznal odpoveď na veľa
nepoznal odpoveď na veľa
00:59
I just didn't know the answer to,
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úplne základných otázok,
napríklad, čo vyvoláva závislosť?
01:01
like, what really causes addiction?
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Prečo neupustíme od tohto prístupu,
ktorý zjavne nefunguje,
ktorý zjavne nefunguje,
01:04
Why do we carry on with this approach
that doesn't seem to be working,
that doesn't seem to be working,
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neexistuje snáď lepší spôsob,
ktorý by sme mohli skúsiť?
ktorý by sme mohli skúsiť?
01:07
and is there a better way out there
that we could try instead?
that we could try instead?
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Veľa som toho o tejto téme prečítal
01:10
So I read loads of stuff about it,
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a nenašiel som hľadané odpovede,
01:12
and I couldn't really find
the answers I was looking for,
the answers I was looking for,
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rozhodol som sa teda
stretnúť sa s ľuďmi z celého sveta,
stretnúť sa s ľuďmi z celého sveta,
01:14
so I thought, okay, I'll go and sit
with different people around the world
with different people around the world
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ktorí závislosťou prešli alebo ju skúmali,
01:18
who lived this and studied this
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porozprávam sa s nimi a uvidím,
či sa od nich niečo dozviem.
či sa od nich niečo dozviem.
01:20
and talk to them and see
if I could learn from them.
if I could learn from them.
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Nevedel som, že budem
musieť precestovať 30 000 km,
musieť precestovať 30 000 km,
01:22
And I didn't realize I would end up
going over 30,000 miles at the start,
going over 30,000 miles at the start,
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ale odhodlal som sa
a spoznal rôznych ľudí,
a spoznal rôznych ľudí,
01:26
but I ended up going and meeting
loads of different people,
loads of different people,
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od tranzvestitného predajcu kreku
v Brownsville v Brooklyne
v Brownsville v Brooklyne
01:29
from a transgender crack dealer
in Brownsville, Brooklyn,
in Brownsville, Brooklyn,
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po vedca, ktorý venoval veľa času
01:31
to a scientist who spends a lot of time
feeding hallucinogens to mongooses
feeding hallucinogens to mongooses
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kŕmeniu mangúst halucinogénmi,
lebo chcel zistiť, či im chutia...
lebo chcel zistiť, či im chutia...
01:35
to see if they like them --
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a áno, chutia im,
ale iba za určitých podmienok...
ale iba za určitých podmienok...
01:36
it turns out they do, but only
in very specific circumstances --
in very specific circumstances --
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navštívil som jedinú krajinu,
ktorá dekriminalizovala všetky drogy,
ktorá dekriminalizovala všetky drogy,
01:39
to the only country that's ever
decriminalized all drugs,
decriminalized all drugs,
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od marihuany po krak, Portugalsko.
01:42
from cannabis to crack, Portugal.
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01:45
And the thing I realized
that really blew my mind is,
that really blew my mind is,
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A uvedomil som si niečo,
čo ma naozaj prekvapilo,
čo ma naozaj prekvapilo,
01:47
almost everything we think
we know about addiction is wrong,
we know about addiction is wrong,
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že skoro všetko,
čo si o závislosti myslíme, je omyl
čo si o závislosti myslíme, je omyl
01:51
and if we start to absorb
the new evidence about addiction,
the new evidence about addiction,
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a keď pochopíme nové
zistenia o závislosti,
zistenia o závislosti,
01:54
I think we're going to have to change
a lot more than our drug policies.
a lot more than our drug policies.
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mali by sme zmeniť
viac než len drogovú politiku,
viac než len drogovú politiku,
01:58
But let's start with what we think
we know, what I thought I knew.
we know, what I thought I knew.
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Začnime tým, čo si myslíme, že vieme,
tým, čo som pokladal za fakt.
tým, čo som pokladal za fakt.
Tento rad v strede,
02:01
Let's think about this middle row here.
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02:03
Imagine all of you, for 20 days now, went
off and used heroin three times a day.
off and used heroin three times a day.
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predstavte si, že by ste užívali heroín
3-krát denne počas 20 dní.
3-krát denne počas 20 dní.
02:07
Some of you look a little more
enthusiastic than others at this prospect.
enthusiastic than others at this prospect.
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Niektorí prejavujú viac nadšenia ako iní.
02:10
(Laughter)
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(smiech)
Nebojte sa, je to iba teoretický pokus.
02:11
Don't worry,
it's just a thought experiment.
it's just a thought experiment.
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Predstavte si to, dobre.
02:14
Imagine you did that, right?
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Čo by sa stalo?
02:16
What would happen?
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Poznáme sto rokov starý príbeh o tom,
čo by sa stalo.
čo by sa stalo.
02:17
Now, we have a story about what would
happen that we've been told for a century.
happen that we've been told for a century.
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Myslíme si, že pre chemické
návykové látky v heroíne,
návykové látky v heroíne,
02:21
We think, because there are
chemical hooks in heroin,
chemical hooks in heroin,
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ak ho užívame po určitý čas,
02:23
as you took it for a while,
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naše telo sa na nich stane závislé,
02:25
your body would become
dependent on those hooks,
dependent on those hooks,
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začne ich fyzicky potrebovať
02:28
you'd start to physically need them,
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a po 20 dňoch všetci
skončíte závislí na heroíne.
skončíte závislí na heroíne.
02:29
and at the end of those 20 days,
you'd all be heroin addicts. Right?
you'd all be heroin addicts. Right?
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To som si myslel.
02:33
That's what I thought.
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Na tomto príbehu mi
po prvýkrát niečo nesedelo hneď,
po prvýkrát niečo nesedelo hneď,
02:34
First thing that alerted me to the fact
that something's not right with this story
that something's not right with this story
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keď som ho počul.
02:38
is when it was explained to me.
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Ak by ma po tejto konferencii TEDu
prešlo auto a zlomilo by mi bedro,
prešlo auto a zlomilo by mi bedro,
02:40
If I step out of this TED Talk today
and I get hit by a car and I break my hip,
and I get hit by a car and I break my hip,
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odviezli by ma do nemocnice
a podávali by mi veľa diamorfínu.
a podávali by mi veľa diamorfínu.
02:43
I'll be taken to hospital
and I'll be given loads of diamorphine.
and I'll be given loads of diamorphine.
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Diamorfín je heroín.
02:47
Diamorphine is heroin.
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02:48
It's actually much better heroin
than you're going to buy on the streets,
than you're going to buy on the streets,
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Dokonca oveľa lepší heroín
ako ten, čo by ste kúpili na ulici
ako ten, čo by ste kúpili na ulici
pretože ten, čo kúpite
od dílera, je kontaminovaný.
od dílera, je kontaminovaný.
02:52
because the stuff you buy
from a drug dealer is contaminated.
from a drug dealer is contaminated.
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Len veľmi málo z neho je naozaj heroín.
02:55
Actually, very little of it is heroin,
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Heroín na lekársky predpis je čistý.
02:57
whereas the stuff you get
from the doctor is medically pure.
from the doctor is medically pure.
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Predpíšu vám ho na dosť dlhý čas.
02:59
And you'll be given it for quite
a long period of time.
a long period of time.
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V publiku je veľa ľudí,
03:02
There are loads of people in this room,
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ktorí si nie sú vedomí,
že požili veľa heroínu.
že požili veľa heroínu.
03:04
you may not realize it,
you've taken quite a lot of heroin.
you've taken quite a lot of heroin.
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A toto sa deje na celom svete.
03:07
And anyone who is watching this
anywhere in the world, this is happening.
anywhere in the world, this is happening.
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Ak je pravda to,
čo si myslíme o závislosti...
čo si myslíme o závislosti...
03:10
And if what we believe
about addiction is right --
about addiction is right --
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všetci ľudia sú vystavení
návykovým látkam...
návykovým látkam...
03:13
those people are exposed
to all those chemical hooks --
to all those chemical hooks --
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Čo by sa malo stať?
Mali by byť závislí.
Mali by byť závislí.
03:15
What should happen?
They should become addicts.
They should become addicts.
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Dôkladne sa to skúmalo.
03:18
This has been studied really carefully.
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A nedeje sa to. Keď vašej babke
voperujú umelý bedrový kĺb,
voperujú umelý bedrový kĺb,
03:20
It doesn't happen; you will have noticed
if your grandmother had a hip replacement,
if your grandmother had a hip replacement,
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nevyjde z nemocnice závislá.
(smiech)
(smiech)
03:23
she didn't come out as a junkie.
(Laughter)
(Laughter)
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Toto som vedel a pripadalo
mi to veľmi zvláštne,
mi to veľmi zvláštne,
03:26
And when I learned this,
it seemed so weird to me,
it seemed so weird to me,
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veľmi odlišné od toho, čo mi povedali,
a čo som si myslel, že viem,
a čo som si myslel, že viem,
03:29
so contrary to everything I'd been told,
everything I thought I knew,
everything I thought I knew,
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myslel som si, že to nemôže byť pravda,
až kým som nespoznal
až kým som nespoznal
03:33
I just thought it couldn't be right,
until I met a man called Bruce Alexander.
until I met a man called Bruce Alexander.
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Bruca Alexandra,
učiteľa psychológie z Vancouru,
učiteľa psychológie z Vancouru,
ktorý urobil úžasný pokus,
03:36
He's a professor
of psychology in Vancouver
of psychology in Vancouver
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ktorý nám, myslím,
pomôže závislosť pochopiť.
pomôže závislosť pochopiť.
03:39
who carried out an incredible experiment
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Profesor Alexander mi vysvetlil,
03:41
I think really helps us
to understand this issue.
to understand this issue.
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že naša predstava závislosti
03:43
Professor Alexander explained to me,
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sa odvíja z časti od rady pokusov
03:45
the idea of addiction we've all
got in our heads, that story,
got in our heads, that story,
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zo začiatku 20. storočia.
03:48
comes partly from a series of experiments
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Boli to veľmi jednoduché pokusy.
03:50
that were done earlier
in the 20th century.
in the 20th century.
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Môžete si ich vyskúšať dnes večer doma,
ak máte sadistickú náladu.
ak máte sadistickú náladu.
03:52
They're really simple.
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03:54
You can do them tonight at home
if you feel a little sadistic.
if you feel a little sadistic.
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Pohľadajte potkana, zavrite ho do klietky
a dajte mu 2 fľašky vody.
a dajte mu 2 fľašky vody.
03:57
You get a rat and you put it in a cage,
and you give it two water bottles:
and you give it two water bottles:
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V jednej bude čistá voda a v druhej
voda s heroínom alebo kokaínom.
voda s heroínom alebo kokaínom.
04:00
One is just water, and the other is water
laced with either heroin or cocaine.
laced with either heroin or cocaine.
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Potkan si skoro vždy
vyberie vodu s drogami,
vyberie vodu s drogami,
04:04
If you do that, the rat will almost always
prefer the drug water
prefer the drug water
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a potom sa celkom rýchlo zabije.
04:07
and almost always
kill itself quite quickly.
kill itself quite quickly.
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Presne tak, však?
Myslíme si, že takto to funguje.
Myslíme si, že takto to funguje.
04:09
So there you go, right?
That's how we think it works.
That's how we think it works.
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V 70. rokoch sa profesor Alexander
bližšie pozrel na tento experiment
bližšie pozrel na tento experiment
04:12
In the '70s, Professor Alexander comes
along and he looks at this experiment
along and he looks at this experiment
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a niečo si všimol.
04:15
and he noticed something.
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Povedal: „A!
Potkan je v prázdnej klietke.
Potkan je v prázdnej klietke.
04:17
He said ah, we're putting
the rat in an empty cage.
the rat in an empty cage.
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Požiť drogy je to jediné, čo môže robiť.
04:19
It's got nothing to do
except use these drugs.
except use these drugs.
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Skúsme niečo iné.“
04:21
Let's try something different.
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Tak profesor Alexander zostrojil klietku,
ktorú nazval Potkaní park,
ktorú nazval Potkaní park,
04:23
So Professor Alexander built a cage
that he called "Rat Park,"
that he called "Rat Park,"
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hotový potkaní raj.
04:26
which is basically heaven for rats.
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04:28
They've got loads of cheese,
they've got loads of colored balls,
they've got loads of colored balls,
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Bola plná syru, farebných loptičiek
a tunelov.
04:31
they've got loads of tunnels.
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Najdôležitejšie je, že mali veľa
kamarátov. Mohli mať veľa sexu.
kamarátov. Mohli mať veľa sexu.
04:33
Crucially, they've got loads of friends.
They can have loads of sex.
They can have loads of sex.
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V klietke boli aj 2 fľaše s vodou,
s čistou vodou a s vodou s drogami.
s čistou vodou a s vodou s drogami.
04:36
And they've got both the water bottles,
the normal water and the drugged water.
the normal water and the drugged water.
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04:41
But here's the fascinating thing:
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A teraz príde prekvapenie:
04:44
In Rat Park, they don't
like the drug water.
like the drug water.
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V Potkaňom parku potkanom
voda s drogami nechutila.
voda s drogami nechutila.
04:47
They almost never use it.
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Skoro nikdy ju nepili.
04:49
None of them ever use it compulsively.
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Žiadny potkan nemal nutkanie dať si ju.
04:51
None of them ever overdose.
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Žiadny sa nepredávkoval.
04:53
You go from almost 100 percent overdose
when they're isolated
when they're isolated
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Predávkovalo sa takmer
100 % izolovaných potkanov
100 % izolovaných potkanov
04:56
to zero percent overdose when they
have happy and connected lives.
have happy and connected lives.
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a 0 % šťastných potkanov s kamarátmi.
04:59
Now, when he first saw this,
Professor Alexander thought,
Professor Alexander thought,
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Keď to profesor Alexander
po prvýkrát spozoroval, pomyslel si:
po prvýkrát spozoroval, pomyslel si:
05:03
maybe this is just a thing about rats,
they're quite different to us.
they're quite different to us.
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„Možno sa to deje iba u potkanov,
nie sú ako my.
nie sú ako my.
05:06
Maybe not as different as we'd like,
but, you know --
but, you know --
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Možno sa od nás nelíšia až tak,
ako by sme chceli.“
ako by sme chceli.“
05:09
But fortunately, there was
a human experiment
a human experiment
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Našťastie sa v tom obodbí uskutočnil
05:11
into the exact same principle happening
at the exact same time.
at the exact same time.
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podobný pokus na ľuďoch.
05:14
It was called the Vietnam War.
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Nazvali ho Vojna vo Vietname.
05:16
In Vietnam, 20 percent of all American
troops were using loads of heroin,
troops were using loads of heroin,
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Vo Vietname užívalo heroín
20 % amerických vojakov
20 % amerických vojakov
05:20
and if you look at the news
reports from the time,
reports from the time,
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a ak ste videli správy z toho obdobia,
05:23
they were really worried, because
they thought, my God, we're going to have
they thought, my God, we're going to have
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vyjadrovali obavy, lebo sa predpokladalo:
„Preboha, keď sa vojna skončí,
v uliciach USA budú státisíce
v uliciach USA budú státisíce
05:27
hundreds of thousands of junkies
on the streets of the United States
on the streets of the United States
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drogovo závislých.“ Dávalo to zmysel.
05:30
when the war ends; it made total sense.
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Tí vojaci, ktorí užívali heroín,
boli odprevadení domov.
boli odprevadení domov.
05:32
Now, those soldiers who were using
loads of heroin were followed home.
loads of heroin were followed home.
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Archív všeobecnej psychiatrie
uskutočnil veľmi dôslednú štúdiu
uskutočnil veľmi dôslednú štúdiu
05:35
The Archives of General Psychiatry
did a really detailed study,
did a really detailed study,
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a čo sa s nimi stalo?
05:38
and what happened to them?
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Nezúčastnili sa odvykacej kúry.
Nemali abstinenčné príznaky.
Nemali abstinenčné príznaky.
05:40
It turns out they didn't go to rehab.
They didn't go into withdrawal.
They didn't go into withdrawal.
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95 % prestalo brať heroín.
05:44
Ninety-five percent of them just stopped.
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Ak veríte v návykové látky,
05:47
Now, if you believe the story
about chemical hooks,
about chemical hooks,
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nedáva to zmysel a
profesor Alexander začal tušiť,
profesor Alexander začal tušiť,
05:49
that makes absolutely no sense,
but Professor Alexander began to think
but Professor Alexander began to think
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že existuje iný príbeh o závislosti.
05:53
there might be a different
story about addiction.
story about addiction.
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Povedal: „A ak závislosť nesúvisí
s návykovými látkami?
s návykovými látkami?
05:55
He said, what if addiction isn't
about your chemical hooks?
about your chemical hooks?
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Čo ak závislosť súvisí s klietkou?
05:58
What if addiction is about your cage?
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Čo ak závislosť súvisí so schopnosťou
prispôsobiť sa prostrediu.“
prispôsobiť sa prostrediu.“
06:01
What if addiction is an adaptation
to your environment?
to your environment?
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Pozrime sa na to takto,
06:04
Looking at this,
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iný profesor, Peter Cohen z Holandska,
06:05
there was another professor
called Peter Cohen in the Netherlands
called Peter Cohen in the Netherlands
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povedal: „Možno by sme to
ani nemali volať závislosť.
ani nemali volať závislosť.
06:08
who said, maybe we shouldn't
even call it addiction.
even call it addiction.
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Možno by sme to mali volať vzťahy.“
06:11
Maybe we should call it bonding.
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06:12
Human beings have a natural
and innate need to bond,
and innate need to bond,
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Človek má prirodzenú
vrodenú potrebu vzťahov
vrodenú potrebu vzťahov
06:15
and when we're happy and healthy,
we'll bond and connect with each other,
we'll bond and connect with each other,
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a keď sme šťastní a zdraví,
nadväzujeme vzťahy s ostatnými,
nadväzujeme vzťahy s ostatnými,
06:19
but if you can't do that,
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ale ak sa to nedá,
06:22
because you're traumatized or isolated
or beaten down by life,
or beaten down by life,
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lebo sa cítite traumatizovaní, izolovaní
alebo vám život udelil silný úder,
alebo vám život udelil silný úder,
06:25
you will bond with something
that will give you some sense of relief.
that will give you some sense of relief.
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nadviažete vzťah s niečím,
čo vám prinesie istý pocit úľavy.
čo vám prinesie istý pocit úľavy.
06:29
Now, that might be gambling,
that might be pornography,
that might be pornography,
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Môžu to byť hazardné hry, pornografia,
06:31
that might be cocaine,
that might be cannabis,
that might be cannabis,
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kokaín alebo marihuana,
06:33
but you will bond and connect
with something because that's our nature.
with something because that's our nature.
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nadviažete s niečím vzťah,
lebo to je naša prirodzenosť.
lebo to je naša prirodzenosť.
06:37
That's what we want as human beings.
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Je to naša ľudská potreba.
06:40
And at first, I found this quite
a difficult thing to get my head around,
a difficult thing to get my head around,
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Na začiatku mi to nešlo do hlavy,
06:43
but one way that helped me
to think about it is,
to think about it is,
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ale niečo mi pomohlo pochopiť to.
06:46
I can see, I've got over by my seat
a bottle of water, right?
a bottle of water, right?
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Na sedadle mám fľašu vody, však?
06:49
I'm looking at lots of you, and lots
of you have bottles of water with you.
of you have bottles of water with you.
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Vidím, že mnohí máte so sebou fľašu vody.
Zabudnite na drogy a boj proti nim.
06:53
Forget the drugs. Forget the drug war.
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06:55
Totally legally, all of those bottles
of water could be bottles of vodka, right?
of water could be bottles of vodka, right?
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Legálne by v tých fľašiach
mohla byť vodka, však?
mohla byť vodka, však?
06:59
We could all be getting drunk --
I might after this -- (Laughter) --
I might after this -- (Laughter) --
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Všetci by sme sa mohli opiť,
ja sa možno aj opijem neskôr, (smiech)
ja sa možno aj opijem neskôr, (smiech)
07:03
but we're not.
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ale neurobíme to.
07:04
Now, because you've been able to afford
the approximately gazillion pounds
the approximately gazillion pounds
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Keďže si môžete dovoliť
zaplatiť kopec peňazí
zaplatiť kopec peňazí
za vstupenku na TED,
myslím, že si môžete dovoliť
myslím, že si môžete dovoliť
07:08
that it costs to get into a TED Talk,
I'm guessing you guys could afford
I'm guessing you guys could afford
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aj piť vodku počas najbližšieho polroka.
07:11
to be drinking vodka
for the next six months.
for the next six months.
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Neskončíte na ulici.
07:13
You wouldn't end up homeless.
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07:15
You're not going to do that,
and the reason you're not going to do that
and the reason you're not going to do that
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Nie a nie preto,
07:19
is not because anyone's stopping you.
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že by vás niekto zastavil, ale preto,
07:21
It's because you've got
bonds and connections
bonds and connections
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že máte vzťahy a kontakty,
ktoré chcete zachovať.
07:23
that you want to be present for.
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07:25
You've got work you love.
You've got people you love.
You've got people you love.
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Máte prácu, ktorú milujete.
Osoby, ktoré milujete.
Osoby, ktoré milujete.
07:27
You've got healthy relationships.
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Máte zdravé vzťahy
07:29
And a core part of addiction,
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a základom závislosti,
07:32
I came to think, and I believe
the evidence suggests,
the evidence suggests,
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podľa mňa a podľa dôkazov,
je naša neschopnosť
byť prítomní v našom živote.
byť prítomní v našom živote.
07:34
is about not being able to bear
to be present in your life.
to be present in your life.
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Toto má naozaj vážne dôsledky.
07:38
Now, this has really
significant implications.
significant implications.
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07:41
The most obvious implications
are for the War on Drugs.
are for the War on Drugs.
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Najzjavnejšie sa to prejavuje
v boji proti drogám.
v boji proti drogám.
07:44
In Arizona, I went out
with a group of women
with a group of women
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V Arizone som si vyšiel so skupinou žien,
07:47
who were made to wear t-shirts
saying, "I was a drug addict,"
saying, "I was a drug addict,"
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ktoré prinútili nosiť tričká s nápisom
„Bola som drogovo závislá“,
„Bola som drogovo závislá“,
07:51
and go out on chain gangs and dig graves
while members of the public jeer at them,
while members of the public jeer at them,
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chodiť spútané reťazami a kopať hroby,
kým sa im obecenstvo posmievalo,
kým sa im obecenstvo posmievalo,
07:56
and when those women get out of prison,
they're going to have criminal records
they're going to have criminal records
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a keď vyjdú z väzenia,
dostane sa to do ich registra trestov,
dostane sa to do ich registra trestov,
08:00
that mean they'll never work
in the legal economy again.
in the legal economy again.
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čo znamená, že nikdy
nebudú môcť legálne pracovať.
nebudú môcť legálne pracovať.
08:02
Now, that's a very extreme example,
obviously, in the case of the chain gang,
obviously, in the case of the chain gang,
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Toto je extrémny príklad,
čo sa týka reťazí,
čo sa týka reťazí,
ale takmer na celom svete
08:06
but actually almost
everywhere in the world
everywhere in the world
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sa nejako takto správame k závislým.
08:08
we treat addicts to some degree like that.
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Trestáme ich, zahanbujeme,
zapisujeme do ich registra trestov.
zapisujeme do ich registra trestov.
08:10
We punish them. We shame them.
We give them criminal records.
We give them criminal records.
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Vytvárame prekážky,
aby nemohli znovu nadviazať vzťahy.
aby nemohli znovu nadviazať vzťahy.
08:13
We put barriers between them reconnecting.
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Jeden kanadský doktor, Gabor Maté,
veľký človek, mi povedal,
veľký človek, mi povedal,
08:16
There was a doctor in Canada,
Dr. Gabor Maté, an amazing man,
Dr. Gabor Maté, an amazing man,
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že ak by sme chceli navrhnúť
systém zhoršujúci závislosť,
systém zhoršujúci závislosť,
08:19
who said to me, if you wanted to design
a system that would make addiction worse,
a system that would make addiction worse,
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navrhli by sme práve tento.
08:23
you would design that system.
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Na jednom mieste sa rozhodli
urobiť presný opak
urobiť presný opak
08:24
Now, there's a place that decided
to do the exact opposite,
to do the exact opposite,
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a išiel som sa pozrieť, ako to funguje.
08:27
and I went there to see how it worked.
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V roku 2000 malo Portugalsko
obrovský podiel drogovo závislých.
obrovský podiel drogovo závislých.
08:29
In the year 2000, Portugal had
one of the worst drug problems in Europe.
one of the worst drug problems in Europe.
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1 % obyvateľstva bolo závislých
na heroíne, čo je strašne veľa,
na heroíne, čo je strašne veľa,
08:33
One percent of the population was addicted
to heroin, which is kind of mind-blowing,
to heroin, which is kind of mind-blowing,
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a rok čo rok stále viac
uplatňovali americkú metódu.
uplatňovali americkú metódu.
08:36
and every year, they tried
the American way more and more.
the American way more and more.
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Ľudí trestali, stigmatizovali
a zahanbovali
a zahanbovali
08:39
They punished people and stigmatized them
and shamed them more,
and shamed them more,
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a problém sa z roka na rok stupňoval.
08:42
and every year, the problem got worse.
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Jedného dňa sa stretli premiér
a líder opozície a povedali si,
a líder opozície a povedali si,
08:44
And one day, the Prime Minister and
the leader of the opposition got together,
the leader of the opposition got together,
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nemôžeme takto ďalej pokračovať,
08:48
and basically said, look, we can't go on
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máme čoraz viac ľudí závislých na heroíne.
08:50
with a country where we're having
ever more people becoming heroin addicts.
ever more people becoming heroin addicts.
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Zostavme tím vedcov a lekárov,
ktorí nájde skutočné riešenie.
08:53
Let's set up a panel
of scientists and doctors
of scientists and doctors
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Zostavili tím pod vedením
úžasného človeka, doktora Joãoa Goulãoa,
úžasného človeka, doktora Joãoa Goulãoa,
08:56
to figure out what would
genuinely solve the problem.
genuinely solve the problem.
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08:58
And they set up a panel led by
an amazing man called Dr. João Goulão,
an amazing man called Dr. João Goulão,
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ktorý mali preštudovať nové dôkazy,
09:01
to look at all this new evidence,
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a po stretnutí vyhlásili:
09:03
and they came back and they said,
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„Dekriminalizujte všetky drogy,
od marihuany po krak, ale“...
od marihuany po krak, ale“...
09:05
"Decriminalize all drugs
from cannabis to crack, but" --
from cannabis to crack, but" --
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a teraz príde zásadný krok...
09:09
and this is the crucial next step --
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„vezmite všetky peniaze,
ktoré míňate na izoláciu
ktoré míňate na izoláciu
09:11
"take all the money we used to spend
on cutting addicts off,
on cutting addicts off,
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a odlúčenie závislých
09:15
on disconnecting them,
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a investujte ich do zapojenia
závislých do spoločnosti.
závislých do spoločnosti.
09:16
and spend it instead
on reconnecting them with society."
on reconnecting them with society."
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Takú liečbu závislosti na drogách v USA
09:20
And that's not really what we think of
as drug treatment
as drug treatment
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a Veľkej Británii nepoznáme.
09:25
in the United States and Britain.
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Využili rehabilitačné zariadenia,
09:26
So they do do residential rehab,
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psychoterapiu, ktorá má istý účinok.
09:28
they do psychological therapy,
that does have some value.
that does have some value.
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To najdôležitejšie, čo urobili,
bol úplný opak toho, čo robíme my:
bol úplný opak toho, čo robíme my:
09:31
But the biggest thing they did
was the complete opposite of what we do:
was the complete opposite of what we do:
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hromadný program na tvorbu
pracovných miest
pracovných miest
09:34
a massive program
of job creation for addicts,
of job creation for addicts,
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a minipôžičiek na zakladanie
malých firiem pre závislých.
malých firiem pre závislých.
09:37
and microloans for addicts
to set up small businesses.
to set up small businesses.
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Ak ste boli napr. automechanik,
po uzdravení pôjdete do servisu,
po uzdravení pôjdete do servisu,
09:39
So say you used to be a mechanic.
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09:41
When you're ready, they'll go
to a garage, and they'll say,
to a garage, and they'll say,
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ktorému povedia:
„Keď mu dáte prácu na rok,
zaplatíme vám polovicu jeho platu.“
zaplatíme vám polovicu jeho platu.“
09:44
if you employ this guy for a year,
we'll pay half his wages.
we'll pay half his wages.
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Cieľom v Portugalsku bolo dať
každému závislému
každému závislému
09:47
The goal was to make sure
that every addict in Portugal
that every addict in Portugal
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dôvod vstať ráno z postele.
09:50
had something to get out
of bed for in the morning.
of bed for in the morning.
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Keď som v Portugalsku spoznal závislých,
09:52
And when I went and met the addicts
in Portugal,
in Portugal,
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zverili sa mi, že keď
znovunadobudli svoj cieľ,
znovunadobudli svoj cieľ,
09:55
what they said is,
as they rediscovered purpose,
as they rediscovered purpose,
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znovuzískali spoločenské
kontakty a vzťahy so spoločnosťou.
kontakty a vzťahy so spoločnosťou.
09:57
they rediscovered bonds
and relationships with the wider society.
and relationships with the wider society.
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Tento pokus začali pred 15 rokmi
10:01
It'll be 15 years this year
since that experiment began,
since that experiment began,
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a mám tu výsledky:
10:03
and the results are in:
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Užívanie drog injekčnou formou
v Portugalsku
v Portugalsku
10:05
injecting drug use is down in Portugal,
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podľa časopisu
British Journal of Criminology
British Journal of Criminology
10:07
according to the British
Journal of Criminology,
Journal of Criminology,
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kleslo o 50 %.
10:09
by 50 percent, five-zero percent.
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Medzi závislými klesol
počet predávkovaní a výskyt AIDSu.
počet predávkovaní a výskyt AIDSu.
10:12
Overdose is massively down,
HIV is massively down among addicts.
HIV is massively down among addicts.
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V každej štúdii je počet
závislých výrazne nižší.
závislých výrazne nižší.
10:16
Addiction in every study
is significantly down.
is significantly down.
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10:18
One of the ways you know it's worked
so well is that almost nobody in Portugal
so well is that almost nobody in Portugal
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O efektívnosti tohto opatrenia svedčí to,
že v Portugalsku sa skoro nikto
že v Portugalsku sa skoro nikto
10:22
wants to go back to the old system.
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nechce vrátiť k starému systému.
Má to politické dôsledky.
10:24
Now, that's the political implications.
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10:26
I actually think there's a layer
of implications
of implications
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Celý tento výskum
má celý rad politických dôsledkov.
10:29
to all this research below that.
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V našej kultúre sa ľudia
cítia čoraz náchylnejší
cítia čoraz náchylnejší
10:30
We live in a culture where people
feel really increasingly vulnerable
feel really increasingly vulnerable
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na rôzne závislosti, od smartfónu
10:33
to all sorts of addictions,
whether it's to their smartphones
whether it's to their smartphones
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po nákupy alebo jedlo.
10:36
or to shopping or to eating.
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Pred touto prednáškou vám povedali...
10:38
Before these talks began --
you guys know this --
you guys know this --
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že je tu zakázané mať zapnuté mobily
10:40
we were told we weren't allowed
to have our smartphones on,
to have our smartphones on,
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a poviem vám, že mnohí ste
sa zatvárili rovnako ako závislí,
sa zatvárili rovnako ako závislí,
10:43
and I have to say, a lot of you
looked an awful lot like
looked an awful lot like
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keď im povedia, že im díler nebude
10:46
addicts who were told their dealer
was going to be unavailable
was going to be unavailable
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pár hodín k dispozícii.
(smiech)
(smiech)
10:49
for the next couple of hours. (Laughter)
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Mnohí sme sa tak pocítili
a môže to vyznieť zvláštne,
a môže to vyznieť zvláštne,
10:51
A lot of us feel like that,
and it might sound weird to say,
and it might sound weird to say,
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poviem vám, že izolácia
je hlavný motor závislosti
je hlavný motor závislosti
10:53
I've been talking about how disconnection
is a major driver of addiction
is a major driver of addiction
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a naberá na sile,
10:57
and weird to say it's growing,
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lebo spoločnosť ešte nikdy nebola
taká prepojená ako v súčasnosti.
taká prepojená ako v súčasnosti.
10:58
because you think we're the most connected
society that's ever been, surely.
society that's ever been, surely.
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Stále viac som presvedčený,
že kontakty, ktoré máme
že kontakty, ktoré máme
11:02
But I increasingly began to think
that the connections we have
that the connections we have
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alebo veríme, že máme,
sú niečo ako paródia kontaktov naživo.
sú niečo ako paródia kontaktov naživo.
11:05
or think we have, are like a kind
of parody of human connection.
of parody of human connection.
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Ak prechádzate životnou krízou,
niečo si uvedomíte.
niečo si uvedomíte.
11:08
If you have a crisis in your life,
you'll notice something.
you'll notice something.
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Nebudú pri vás stáť
fanúšikovia z Twitteru.
fanúšikovia z Twitteru.
11:11
It won't be your Twitter followers
who come to sit with you.
who come to sit with you.
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11:14
It won't be your Facebook friends
who help you turn it round.
who help you turn it round.
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Nepomôžu vám priatelia z Facebooku,
11:17
It'll be your flesh and blood friends
who you have deep and nuanced
who you have deep and nuanced
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ale priatelia s mäsa a kostí,
s ktorými máte hlboké
usporiadané vzťahy zoči voči.
usporiadané vzťahy zoči voči.
11:20
and textured, face-to-face
relationships with,
relationships with,
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11:22
and there's a study I learned about from
Bill McKibben, the environmental writer,
Bill McKibben, the environmental writer,
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Spisovateľ a aktivista
pre životné prostredie Bill McKibben
pre životné prostredie Bill McKibben
ma upozornil na štúdiu,
v ktorej sa o tom veľa hovorí.
v ktorej sa o tom veľa hovorí.
11:27
that I think tells us a lot about this.
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Zisťovali v nej počet blízkych priateľov,
ktorým môže údajne priemerný
ktorým môže údajne priemerný
11:29
He looked at the number of close friends
the average American believes
the average American believes
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Američan zavolať, keď sa ocitne v kríze.
11:32
they can call on in a crisis.
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Ich počet od roku 1950 postupne klesal.
11:34
That number has been declining
steadily since the 1950s.
steadily since the 1950s.
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11:37
The amount of floor space
an individual has in their home
an individual has in their home
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Rozloha osobného priestoru
doma postupne rástla.
doma postupne rástla.
11:40
has been steadily increasing,
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11:42
and I think that's like a metaphor
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Myslím si, že je to ako metafora
rozhodnutí, ktoré sme
ako komunita spravili.
ako komunita spravili.
11:44
for the choice we've made as a culture.
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11:46
We've traded floorspace for friends,
we've traded stuff for connections,
we've traded stuff for connections,
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Vymieňame kamarátov za priestor
a vzťahy za veci
a vzťahy za veci
11:51
and the result is we are one of the
loneliest societies there has ever been.
loneliest societies there has ever been.
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a výsledkom je, že sme jedna
z najsamotárskejších spoločností
z najsamotárskejších spoločností
v dejinách ľudstva.
11:54
And Bruce Alexander, the guy who did
the Rat Park experiment, says,
the Rat Park experiment, says,
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Bruce Alexander,
ktorý vytvoril potkaní park, hovorí:
ktorý vytvoril potkaní park, hovorí:
11:58
we talk all the time in addiction
about individual recovery,
about individual recovery,
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„Vždy hovoríme o závislosti
ako o vyzdravení u jednotlivca
ako o vyzdravení u jednotlivca
12:01
and it's right to talk about that,
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a je to v poriadku,
12:03
but we need to talk much more
about social recovery.
about social recovery.
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ale mali by sme viac hovoriť
o uzdravení v spoločnosti.
o uzdravení v spoločnosti.
12:06
Something's gone wrong with us,
not just with individuals but as a group,
not just with individuals but as a group,
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Niečo s nami nie je v poriadku, s nami
ako jednotlivcami aj ako so skupinou.
ako jednotlivcami aj ako so skupinou.
12:09
and we've created a society where,
for a lot of us,
for a lot of us,
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Vytvorili sme spoločnosť,
v ktorej sa život
v ktorej sa život
mnohých podobá skôr na prázdnu klietku
12:12
life looks a whole lot more
like that isolated cage
like that isolated cage
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12:14
and a whole lot less like Rat Park.
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ako na potkaní park.
12:16
If I'm honest, this isn't
why I went into it.
why I went into it.
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Pravdu povediac, nezahĺbil
som sa do štúdia závislosti,
som sa do štúdia závislosti,
12:19
I didn't go in to the discover
the political stuff, the social stuff.
the political stuff, the social stuff.
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aby som skúmal
politické či sociálne aspekty,
politické či sociálne aspekty,
12:23
I wanted to know how to help
the people I love.
the people I love.
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chcel som zistiť, ako pomôcť ľuďom,
ktorých mám rád.
ktorých mám rád.
12:25
And when I came back from this
long journey and I'd learned all this,
long journey and I'd learned all this,
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Keď som sa vrátil z tej dlhej cesty
a naučil som sa toto všetko,
a naučil som sa toto všetko,
12:28
I looked at the addicts in my life,
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pozrel som sa na závislých v mojom živote
12:31
and if you're really candid,
it's hard loving an addict,
it's hard loving an addict,
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a, pravdu povediac,
je ťažké závislých milovať
je ťažké závislých milovať
a mnohí v tejto sále to vedia.
12:36
and there's going to be lots of people
who know in this room.
who know in this room.
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Väčšinu času sú nahnevaní
12:39
You are angry a lot of the time,
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a táto prednáška je
taká kontroverzná aj preto,
taká kontroverzná aj preto,
12:41
and I think one of the reasons
why this debate is so charged
why this debate is so charged
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12:45
is because it runs through the heart
of each of us, right?
of each of us, right?
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že preniká do sŕdc všetkých, však?
Všetci majú kúsok z nich,
keď si pri pohľade na závislého pomyslia:
keď si pri pohľade na závislého pomyslia:
12:48
Everyone has a bit of them
that looks at an addict and thinks,
that looks at an addict and thinks,
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„Kiežby ťa niekto dokázal zastaviť.“
12:51
I wish someone would just stop you.
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Postupy, ako si poradiť
so závislými v našom živote,
so závislými v našom živote,
12:52
And the kind of scripts we're told for how
to deal with the addicts in our lives
to deal with the addicts in our lives
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môžeme vidieť
v americkej reality show Intervention,
možno ste ju videli.
možno ste ju videli.
12:56
is typified by, I think,
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12:57
the reality show "Intervention,"
if you guys have ever seen it.
if you guys have ever seen it.
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Celý náš život objasňujú reality show,
13:00
I think everything in our lives
is defined by reality TV,
is defined by reality TV,
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ale to je ďalšia prednáška pre TED.
13:03
but that's another TED Talk.
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Ak ste videli program Intervention,
13:04
If you've ever seen
the show "Intervention,"
the show "Intervention,"
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má jednoduchý dej.
13:07
it's a pretty simple premise.
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Hľadajú závislého a všetky osoby
v jeho živote, zhromaždia ich,
v jeho živote, zhromaždia ich,
13:08
Get an addict, all the people
in their life, gather them together,
in their life, gather them together,
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vysvetlia im situáciu a tie mu povedia,
keď sa nedáš dokopy,
keď sa nedáš dokopy,
13:11
confront them with what they're doing,
and they say, if you don't shape up,
and they say, if you don't shape up,
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nepočítaj s nami.
Závislého pripravia o vzťahy,
13:15
we're going to cut you off.
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13:16
So what they do is they take
the connection to the addict,
the connection to the addict,
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vyhrážajú sa mu a nútia ho k správaniu,
13:19
and they threaten it,
they make it contingent
they make it contingent
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ktoré si oni želajú.
13:21
on the addict behaving the way they want.
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13:24
And I began to think, I began to see
why that approach doesn't work,
why that approach doesn't work,
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Začal som premýšľať a pozorovať,
prečo tento postup nefunguje,
prečo tento postup nefunguje,
13:27
and I began to think that's almost like
the importing of the logic of the Drug War
the importing of the logic of the Drug War
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a napadlo mi, že je to ako
preniesť logiku boja proti drogám
preniesť logiku boja proti drogám
13:32
into our private lives.
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do nášho súkromného života.
13:34
So I was thinking,
how could I be Portuguese?
how could I be Portuguese?
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Pomyslel som si,
aké by bolo byť Portugalcom?
aké by bolo byť Portugalcom?
13:37
And what I've tried to do now,
and I can't tell you I do it consistently
and I can't tell you I do it consistently
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Pokúsil som sa o to,
nemôžem povedať, že by som to robil stále,
nemôžem povedať, že by som to robil stále,
13:41
and I can't tell you it's easy,
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a nemôžem povedať,
že by to bolo jednoduché,
že by to bolo jednoduché,
13:43
is to say to the addicts in my life
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ale závislým v mojom živote hovorievam,
že chcem prehĺbiť náš vzťah,
13:45
that I want to deepen
the connection with them,
the connection with them,
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13:48
to say to them, I love you
whether you're using or you're not.
whether you're using or you're not.
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povedať im „Mám ťa rád,
či už užívaš drogy alebo nie.
či už užívaš drogy alebo nie.
13:51
I love you, whatever state you're in,
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Mám ťa rád nezávisle od tvojho stavu
13:54
and if you need me,
I'll come and sit with you
I'll come and sit with you
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a ak ma budeš potrebovať,
prídem a pobudnem s tebou,
prídem a pobudnem s tebou,
13:57
because I love you and I don't
want you to be alone
want you to be alone
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lebo ťa mám rád a nechcem, aby si bol sám
13:59
or to feel alone.
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alebo sa cítil sám.“
14:01
And I think the core of that message --
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Myslím si, že hlavná správa
14:03
you're not alone, we love you --
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„nie si sám, máme ťa radi,“
by mala byť súčasťou
každej interakcie so závislými,
každej interakcie so závislými,
14:06
has to be at every level
of how we respond to addicts,
of how we respond to addicts,
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sociálnej, politickej či osobnej.
14:09
socially, politically and individually.
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14:12
For 100 years now, we've been singing
war songs about addicts.
war songs about addicts.
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100 rokov sme o závislých
spievali vojnové piesne.
spievali vojnové piesne.
14:16
I think all along we should have been
singing love songs to them,
singing love songs to them,
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Myslím si, že by sme im všetci
mali spievať piesne lásky,
mali spievať piesne lásky,
14:20
because the opposite of addiction
is not sobriety.
is not sobriety.
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lebo opakom závislosti nie je triezvosť.
14:24
The opposite of addiction is connection.
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Opakom závislosti sú vzťahy.
14:28
Thank you.
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Ďakujem.
(potlesk)
14:30
(Applause)
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ABOUT THE SPEAKER
Johann Hari - JournalistJohann Hari spent three years researching the war on drugs; along the way, he discovered that addiction is not what we think it is.
Why you should listen
British journalist Johann Hari is the author of the New York Times best-selling book Chasing The Scream, from which his talk on addiction was adapted and for which he spent three years researching the war on drugs and questioning the ways in which we treat addiction.
He has written for many of the world’s leading newspapers and magazines, including The New York Times, Le Monde, The Guardian, New Republic, The Nation, Slate.com, and The Sydney Morning Herald. He was a columnist for the British newspaper The Independent for nine years.
Hari was twice named National Newspaper Journalist of the Year by Amnesty International, was named Gay Journalist of the Year at the Stonewall Awards -- and won the Martha Gellhorn Prize for political writing.
Johann Hari | Speaker | TED.com