TED2017
Robert Sapolsky: The biology of our best and worst selves
Robert Sapolski (Robert Sapolsky): Biologija našeg najboljeg i najgoreg sopstva
Filmed:
Readability: 4.6
1,818,106 views
Kako ljudska bića mogu da budu toliko saosećajna i altruistična - a takođe tako brutalna i nasilna? Kako bismo razumeli zašto radimo to što radimo, neuronaučnik Robert Sapolski posmatra ekstremne kontekste, istražujući postupke, u vremenskim razmerama od nekoliko sekundi do miliona godina pre nego što su se desili. U ovom opčinjavajućem govoru, deli sa nama svoje revolucionarno istraživanje biologije koja pokreće naša najgora i najbolja ponašanja.
Robert Sapolsky - Neuroscientist, primatologist, writer
Robert Sapolsky is one of the leading neuroscientists in the world, studying stress in primates (including humans). Full bio
Robert Sapolsky is one of the leading neuroscientists in the world, studying stress in primates (including humans). Full bio
Double-click the English transcript below to play the video.
00:12
Chris Anderson: So Robert
spent the last few years
spent the last few years
0
760
2696
Kris Anderson: Robert je proveo
poslednjih nekoliko godina
poslednjih nekoliko godina
00:15
think about how weird human behavior is,
1
3480
2336
razmišljajući koliko je čudno
ljudsko ponašanje
ljudsko ponašanje
00:17
and how inadequate most
of our language trying to explain it is.
of our language trying to explain it is.
2
5840
4216
i koliko je nepodesan
naš jezik u pokušaju da to objasnimo.
naš jezik u pokušaju da to objasnimo.
00:22
And it's very exciting to hear him
explain some of the thinking behind it
explain some of the thinking behind it
3
10080
4376
Te je veoma uzbudljivo slušati ga
kako objašnjava rezonovanje iza toga
kako objašnjava rezonovanje iza toga
00:26
in public for the first time.
4
14480
1656
prvi put u javnosti.
00:28
Over to you now, Robert Sapolsky.
5
16160
2096
Prebacujemo na tebe, Roberte Sapolski.
00:30
(Applause)
6
18280
2960
(Aplauz)
00:35
Robert Sapolsky: Thank you.
7
23040
1616
Robert Sapolski: Hvala vam.
00:36
The fantasy always runs
something like this.
something like this.
8
24680
2480
Fantazija se uvek odvija na sledeći način.
00:39
I've overpowered his elite guard,
9
27960
2176
Savladao sam njegovu elitnu stražu,
00:42
burst into his secret bunker
10
30160
1935
upao sam u njegov tajni bunker
00:44
with my machine gun ready.
11
32119
1817
sa puškom na gotovs.
00:45
He lunges for his Luger.
12
33960
1896
On se baca po svoj luger.
00:47
I knock it out of his hand.
13
35880
1816
Izbijam mu ga iz ruke.
00:49
He lunges for his cyanide pill.
14
37720
2336
Baca se na pilulu cijanida.
00:52
I knock that out of his hand.
15
40080
1736
Izbijam mu je iz ruke.
00:53
He snarls,
16
41840
1296
On reži,
00:55
comes at me with otherworldly strength.
17
43160
2216
napada me nadljudskom snagom.
00:57
We grapple, we fight,
18
45400
1696
Rvemo se, tučemo,
00:59
I manage to pin him down
19
47120
1896
uspevam da ga oborim
01:01
and put on handcuffs.
20
49040
1560
i stavim mu lisice.
01:03
"Adolf Hitler," I say,
21
51480
2016
"Adolfe Hitleru", kažem,
01:05
"I arrest you for crimes
against humanity."
against humanity."
22
53520
2840
"Hapsim te zbog zločina
protiv čovečnosti."
protiv čovečnosti."
01:10
Here's where the Medal of Honor
version of the fantasy ends
version of the fantasy ends
23
58000
2976
Ova verzija fantazije se završava ovde
sa ordenom časti
sa ordenom časti
01:13
and the imagery darkens.
24
61000
1856
i prizor tamni.
01:14
What would I do if I had Hitler?
25
62880
1719
Šta bih uradio kad bih imao Hitlera?
01:17
It's not hard to imagine
once I allow myself.
once I allow myself.
26
65160
2760
Nije teško zamisliti,
čim budem pripravan na to.
čim budem pripravan na to.
01:20
Sever his spine at the neck.
27
68720
2136
Prekinem mu kičmu u vratu.
01:22
Take out his eyes with a blunt instrument.
28
70880
2376
Izvadim mu oči tupim predmetom.
01:25
Puncture his eardrums. Cut out his tongue.
29
73280
2776
Probijem mu bubne opne. Odrežem jezik.
01:28
Leave him alive on a respirator,
30
76080
2136
Ostavim ga da živi na respiratoru,
01:30
tube-fed, not able to speak
or move or see or hear, just to feel,
or move or see or hear, just to feel,
31
78240
5296
jede na cevčicu, bez mogućnosti gvora ili
kretanja ili vida ili sluha, samo oseća,
kretanja ili vida ili sluha, samo oseća,
01:35
and then inject him
with something cancerous
with something cancerous
32
83560
3256
a potom mu ubrizgam nešto kancerogeno
01:38
that's going to fester and pustulate
33
86840
2256
što će da se gnoji i pupi
01:41
until every cell in his body
is screaming in agony,
is screaming in agony,
34
89120
3936
sve dok svaka ćelija
u njegovom telu zavapi u agoniji,
u njegovom telu zavapi u agoniji,
01:45
until every second
feels like an eternity in hell.
feels like an eternity in hell.
35
93080
3240
sve dok svaki sekund
ne bude odavao utisak večnosti u paklu.
ne bude odavao utisak večnosti u paklu.
01:49
That's what I would do to Hitler.
36
97680
1840
To bih uradio Hitleru.
01:53
I've had this fantasy since I was a kid,
37
101920
2016
Maštam o tome otkad sam bio dete,
01:55
still do sometimes,
38
103960
1496
još uvek ponekad maštam,
01:57
and when I do, my heart speeds up --
39
105480
2656
a kada se to desi, srce mi ubrza -
02:00
all these plans for the most evil,
wicked soul in history.
wicked soul in history.
40
108160
4880
svi ti planovi za najzlobniju,
najopakiju dušu u istoriji.
najopakiju dušu u istoriji.
02:05
But there's a problem,
41
113840
1256
Međutim, ima jedan problem,
02:07
which is I don't actually believe
in souls or evil,
in souls or evil,
42
115120
2896
a to je da zapravo ne verujem
u duše, niti u zlo
u duše, niti u zlo
02:10
and I think wicked belongs in a musical.
43
118040
2536
i mislim da je opačini mesto u mjuziklu.
Ali postoje neki ljudi
koje bih voleo da vidim mrtve,
koje bih voleo da vidim mrtve,
02:12
But there's some people
I would like to see killed,
I would like to see killed,
44
120600
2416
02:15
but I'm against the death penalty.
45
123040
1816
ali sam protiv smrtne kazne.
02:16
But I like schlocky violent movies,
46
124880
2096
Međutim, volim niskobudžetne
nasilne filmove,
nasilne filmove,
02:19
but I'm for strict gun control.
47
127000
1776
ali sam za strogu kontrolu oružja.
02:20
But then there was a time
I was at a laser tag place,
I was at a laser tag place,
48
128800
3056
Ali onda onaj jedan put
kad sam bio u lasertag igraonici
kad sam bio u lasertag igraonici
02:23
and I had such a good time
hiding in a corner shooting at people.
hiding in a corner shooting at people.
49
131880
3880
i proveo sam se tako dobro,
skrivajući se u uglu i pucajući u ljude.
skrivajući se u uglu i pucajući u ljude.
02:28
In other words, I'm your basic
confused human when it comes to violence.
confused human when it comes to violence.
50
136360
4800
Drugim rečima, kada se radi o nasilju
ja sam vam obično zbunjeno ljudsko biće.
ja sam vam obično zbunjeno ljudsko biće.
02:33
Now, as a species, we obviously
have problems with violence.
have problems with violence.
51
141760
3336
Sad, kao vrsta, očigledno
da imamo problem s nasiljem.
da imamo problem s nasiljem.
02:37
We use shower heads to deliver poison gas,
52
145120
3056
Koristimo tuševe
da isporučimo otrovni plin,
da isporučimo otrovni plin,
02:40
letters with anthrax,
airplanes as weapons,
airplanes as weapons,
53
148200
3096
pisma s antraksom, avione kao oružje,
02:43
mass rape as a military strategy.
54
151320
1856
masovna silovanja kao vojnu strategiju.
02:45
We're a miserably violent species.
55
153200
2280
Užasno smo nasilna vrsta.
02:47
But there's a complication,
56
155920
1496
Međutim, u tome je složenost,
02:49
which is we don't hate violence,
57
157440
2376
mi ne mrzimo nasilje,
02:51
we hate the wrong kind.
58
159840
1856
mrzimo pogrešan vid nasilja.
02:53
And when it's the right kind,
59
161720
1456
A kad se radi o odgovarajućem,
02:55
we cheer it on, we hand out medals,
60
163200
2496
navijamo za njega, dodeljujemo odličja,
02:57
we vote for, we mate with
our champions of it.
our champions of it.
61
165720
3136
glasamo, parimo se sa šampionima nasilja.
03:00
When it's the right kind of violence,
62
168880
1816
Kada je odgovarajući vid nasilja,
03:02
we love it.
63
170720
1200
volimo ga.
03:04
And there's another complication,
64
172520
1656
A tu je nova složenost,
03:06
which is, in addition to us
being this miserably violent species,
being this miserably violent species,
65
174200
4056
a to je, uz to što smo
užasno nasilna vrsta,
užasno nasilna vrsta,
03:10
we're also this extraordinarily
altruistic, compassionate one.
altruistic, compassionate one.
66
178280
3800
takođe smo i izvanredno
altruistična, saosećajna vrsta.
altruistična, saosećajna vrsta.
03:15
So how do you make sense
of the biology of our best behaviors,
of the biology of our best behaviors,
67
183520
3296
Pa, kako da shvatite
biologiju našeg najboljeg ponašanja,
biologiju našeg najboljeg ponašanja,
03:18
our worst ones and all of those
ambiguously in between?
ambiguously in between?
68
186840
4016
našeg najgoreg i svih tih
dvosmislenih ponašanja između?
dvosmislenih ponašanja između?
03:22
Now, for starters,
69
190880
1256
Sad, za početak,
03:24
what's totally boring is understanding
the motoric aspects of the behavior.
the motoric aspects of the behavior.
70
192160
4296
potpuno je dosadno razumevanje
motoričkih aspekata ponašanja.
motoričkih aspekata ponašanja.
03:28
Your brain tells your spine,
tells your muscles
tells your muscles
71
196480
3176
Vaš mozak saopšti vašoj kičmi,
saopšti vašim mišićima
saopšti vašim mišićima
03:31
to do something or other,
72
199680
1256
da urade ovo ili ono,
03:32
and hooray, you've behaved.
73
200960
1936
i, ura, ispoljili ste ponašanje.
03:34
What's hard is understanding
the meaning of the behavior,
the meaning of the behavior,
74
202920
3656
Teško je razumeti značenje ponašanja
03:38
because in some settings,
pulling a trigger is an appalling act;
pulling a trigger is an appalling act;
75
206600
3816
jer u nekim okolnostima
je pritisnuti obarač odvratan čin;
je pritisnuti obarač odvratan čin;
03:42
in others, it's heroically
self-sacrificial.
self-sacrificial.
76
210440
2976
u drugim je herojski samopožrtvovan.
03:45
In some settings, putting your hand
one someone else's
one someone else's
77
213440
2936
U nekim okolnostima,
staviti ruku na nečiju drugu
staviti ruku na nečiju drugu
03:48
is deeply compassionate.
78
216400
1456
je duboko saosećajan čin.
03:49
In others, it's a deep betrayal.
79
217880
1896
U drugim, radi se o istinskoj izdaji.
03:51
The challenge is to understand
80
219800
1536
Izazov je razumeti
03:53
the biology of the context
of our behaviors,
of our behaviors,
81
221360
3256
biologiju konteksta našeg ponašanja,
03:56
and that's real tough.
82
224640
1600
a to je zaista teško.
03:59
One thing that's clear, though,
is you're not going to get anywhere
is you're not going to get anywhere
83
227040
3176
Jedno je jasno, ipak,
a to je da nećete nigde stići,
a to je da nećete nigde stići,
04:02
if you think there's going to be
the brain region or the hormone
the brain region or the hormone
84
230240
4416
ako mislite da postoji
deo mozga ili hormon
deo mozga ili hormon
04:06
or the gene or the childhood experience
85
234680
2736
ili gen ili iskustvo iz detinjstva
04:09
or the evolutionary mechanism
that explains everything.
that explains everything.
86
237440
3080
ili evolutivni mehanizam
koji sve objašnjava.
koji sve objašnjava.
04:13
Instead, every bit of behavior
has multiple levels of causality.
has multiple levels of causality.
87
241040
5120
Umesto toga, svaki delić ponašanja
ima višestruke nivoe uzročnosti.
ima višestruke nivoe uzročnosti.
04:18
Let's look at an example.
88
246800
1400
Pogledajmo jedan primer.
04:20
You have a gun.
89
248840
1200
Imate pištolj.
04:22
There's a crisis going on:
90
250720
1576
U toku je kriza:
04:24
rioting, violence, people running around.
91
252320
2576
nemiri, nasilje, ljudi jurcaju okolo.
04:26
A stranger is running at you
in an agitated state --
in an agitated state --
92
254920
3176
Stranac trči ka vama
u stanju uzrujanosti -
u stanju uzrujanosti -
04:30
you can't quite tell if the expression
is frightened, threatening, angry --
is frightened, threatening, angry --
93
258120
5096
ne možete da odlučite da li izgleda
uplašeno, preteće, ljutito -
uplašeno, preteće, ljutito -
04:35
holding something
that kind of looks like a handgun.
that kind of looks like a handgun.
94
263240
3216
drži nešto što nekako liči na pištolj.
04:38
You're not sure.
95
266480
1216
Niste sigurni.
04:39
The stranger comes running at you
96
267720
1896
Stranac trči ka vama
04:41
and you pull the trigger.
97
269640
1736
i vi povlačite obarač.
04:43
And it turns out
that thing in this person's hand
that thing in this person's hand
98
271400
2936
A ispostavlja se da je ova osoba
držala u ruci
držala u ruci
04:46
was a cell phone.
99
274360
1200
mobilni telefon.
04:48
So we asked this biological question:
100
276200
2216
Te postavljamo ovo biološko pitanje:
04:50
what was going on
that caused this behavior?
that caused this behavior?
101
278440
3176
šta se dešavalo
što je uzrokovalo ovo ponašanje?
što je uzrokovalo ovo ponašanje?
04:53
What caused this behavior?
102
281640
1896
Šta je uzrokovalo ovo ponašanje?
04:55
And this is a multitude of questions.
103
283560
2296
A to je mnoštvo pitanja.
04:57
We start.
104
285880
1216
Počinjemo.
04:59
What was going on in your brain
one second before you pulled that trigger?
one second before you pulled that trigger?
105
287120
4416
Šta se dešavalo u vašem mozgu
sekund pre nego što ste povukli obarač?
sekund pre nego što ste povukli obarač?
05:03
And this brings us into the realm
of a brain region called the amygdala.
of a brain region called the amygdala.
106
291560
3696
A to nas vodi u oblast dela mozga
koji se naziva amigdalom.
koji se naziva amigdalom.
05:07
The amygdala, which is
central to violence, central to fear,
central to violence, central to fear,
107
295280
3936
Amigdala, koja je centar za nasilje,
centar za strah,
centar za strah,
05:11
initiates volleys of cascades
108
299240
2696
započinje bujicu mentalnih procesa
05:13
that produce pulling of a trigger.
109
301960
2256
koji rezultiraju povlačenjem obarača.
05:16
What was the level of activity
in your amygdala one second before?
in your amygdala one second before?
110
304240
3680
Koji je nivo aktivnosti
u vašoj amigdali sekund pre čina?
u vašoj amigdali sekund pre čina?
05:20
But to understand that,
we have to step back a little bit.
we have to step back a little bit.
111
308880
3376
Ali da bismo razumeli to,
moramo još malo da se vratimo.
moramo još malo da se vratimo.
05:24
What was going on in the environment
seconds to minutes before
seconds to minutes before
112
312280
3576
Šta se dešavalo u okruženju
sekundama i minutima ranije
sekundama i minutima ranije
05:27
that impacted the amygdala?
113
315880
1736
što je uticalo na amigdalu?
05:29
Now, obviously, the sights,
the sounds of the rioting,
the sounds of the rioting,
114
317640
3096
Sad, očito, prizor, zvuci nemira,
05:32
that was pertinent.
115
320760
1216
to je bilo značajno.
05:34
But in addition,
116
322000
1216
Ali uz to,
05:35
you're more likely to mistake
a cell phone for a handgun
a cell phone for a handgun
117
323240
3456
veća je verovatnoća da pomešate
mobilni telefon za pištolj,
mobilni telefon za pištolj,
05:38
if that stranger was male
118
326720
2256
ako je taj stranac muškarac
05:41
and large and of a different race.
119
329000
2600
i ako je visok i druge rase.
05:44
Furthermore, if you're in pain,
120
332360
2136
Dodatno, ako osećate bol,
05:46
if you're hungry, if you're exhausted,
121
334520
2176
ako ste gladni, ako ste iscrpljeni,
05:48
your frontal cortex
is not going to work as well,
is not going to work as well,
122
336720
2536
vaš prednji korteks
neće tako dobro da funkcioniše,
neće tako dobro da funkcioniše,
05:51
part of the brain whose job it is
to get to the amygdala in time
to get to the amygdala in time
123
339280
3656
a to je deo mozga čiji je posao
da na vreme stigne do amigdale
da na vreme stigne do amigdale
05:54
saying, "Are you really sure
that's a gun there?"
that's a gun there?"
124
342960
3280
govoreći: "Da li si zaista sigurna
da je to pištolj?"
da je to pištolj?"
05:58
But we need to step further back.
125
346800
2136
Ali moramo još da se vratimo.
06:00
Now we have to look
at hours to days before,
at hours to days before,
126
348960
3176
Sad moramo da posmatramo
sate i dane ranije,
sate i dane ranije,
06:04
and with this, we have entered
the realm of hormones.
the realm of hormones.
127
352160
2976
a time ulazimo u oblast hormona.
06:07
For example, testosterone,
128
355160
2136
Na primer, testosteron,
06:09
where regardless of your sex,
129
357320
1736
gde bez obzira na rod,
06:11
if you have elevated
testosterone levels in your blood,
testosterone levels in your blood,
130
359080
2856
ako su vam povišeni
nivoi testosterona u krvi,
nivoi testosterona u krvi,
06:13
you're more likely to think
a face with a neutral expression
a face with a neutral expression
131
361960
3376
skoniji ste da mislite
kako lice s neutralnim izrazom
kako lice s neutralnim izrazom
06:17
is instead looking threatening.
132
365360
2056
zapravo izgleda preteće.
06:19
Elevated testosterone levels,
elevated levels of stress hormones,
elevated levels of stress hormones,
133
367440
3856
Povišeni nivoi testosterona,
povišeni nivoi hormona stresa
povišeni nivoi hormona stresa
06:23
and your amygdala
is going to be more active
is going to be more active
134
371320
2296
i vaša amigdala će da bude aktivnija,
06:25
and your frontal cortex
will be more sluggish.
will be more sluggish.
135
373640
2480
a vaš prednji korteks će da bude tromiji.
06:29
Pushing back further,
weeks to months before,
weeks to months before,
136
377200
2856
Pomerajući se nazad još više,
nedeljama i mesecima ranije,
nedeljama i mesecima ranije,
06:32
where's the relevance there?
137
380080
1456
šta je tu relevantno?
06:33
This is the realm of neural plasticity,
138
381560
2536
Ovo je oblast nervne plastičnosti,
06:36
the fact that your brain
can change in response to experience,
can change in response to experience,
139
384120
3936
činjenice da se vaš mozak
može promeniti, reagujući na iskustvo,
može promeniti, reagujući na iskustvo,
06:40
and if your previous months
have been filled with stress and trauma,
have been filled with stress and trauma,
140
388080
4176
a ako su vam prethodni meseci
bili ispunjeni stresom i traumama,
bili ispunjeni stresom i traumama,
06:44
your amygdala will have enlarged.
141
392280
1856
vaša amigdala će da bude uvećana.
06:46
The neurons will have become
more excitable,
more excitable,
142
394160
2216
Neuroni će da postanu više nadraženi,
06:48
your frontal cortex would have atrophied,
143
396400
2336
vaš prednji korteks je atrofirao,
06:50
all relevant to what happens
in that one second.
in that one second.
144
398760
2800
a sve je to važno za ono
što se dešava u toj jednoj sekundi.
što se dešava u toj jednoj sekundi.
06:54
But we push back even more, back years,
145
402320
2656
Ali odlazimo još više unazad,
godinama unazad,
godinama unazad,
06:57
back, for example, to your adolescence.
146
405000
2496
nazad, na primer, u vašu adolescenciju.
06:59
Now, the central fact
of the adolescent brain
of the adolescent brain
147
407520
2496
Sad, ključna činjenica
za mozak adolescenata
za mozak adolescenata
07:02
is all of it is going full blast
148
410040
2736
je da sav treperi
07:04
except the frontal cortex,
149
412800
1696
osim prednjeg korteksa,
07:06
which is still half-baked.
150
414520
1736
koji je i dalje polugotov.
07:08
It doesn't fully mature
until you're around 25.
until you're around 25.
151
416280
3176
Ne sazreva u potpunosti do vaše 25 godine.
07:11
And thus, adolescence and early adulthood
152
419480
3216
I stoga su adolescencija i rano zrelo doba
07:14
are the years where environment
and experience sculpt your frontal cortex
and experience sculpt your frontal cortex
153
422720
5136
godine kada okolina i iskustvo
oblikuju vaš prednji korteks
oblikuju vaš prednji korteks
07:19
into the version you're going to have
as an adult in that critical moment.
as an adult in that critical moment.
154
427880
3800
u verziju koju ćete da imate
kao odrasli, u tom kritičnom trenutku.
kao odrasli, u tom kritičnom trenutku.
07:24
But pushing back even further,
155
432800
1776
Ali vraćajući se još više unazad,
07:26
even further back
to childhood and fetal life
to childhood and fetal life
156
434600
3456
čak još više do detinjstva i fetusa
07:30
and all the different versions
that that could come in.
that that could come in.
157
438080
2816
i svih različitih verzija
koje su mogle da nastanu.
koje su mogle da nastanu.
07:32
Now, obviously, that's the time
that your brain is being constructed,
that your brain is being constructed,
158
440920
3256
Sad, očito da je to razdoblje
kada je izgrađen vaš mozak,
kada je izgrađen vaš mozak,
07:36
and that's important,
159
444200
1216
a to je važno,
07:37
but in addition,
experience during those times
experience during those times
160
445440
3296
ali uz to, iskustvo u tom periodu
07:40
produce what are called
epigenetic changes,
epigenetic changes,
161
448760
2976
proizvodi nešto što se naziva
epigenetičkim promenama,
epigenetičkim promenama,
07:43
permanent, in some cases,
162
451760
1656
trajnim, u nekim slučajevima,
07:45
permanently activating
certain genes, turning off others.
certain genes, turning off others.
163
453440
4336
trajno aktivirajući određene gene,
isključujući druge.
isključujući druge.
07:49
And as an example of this,
164
457800
1496
A kao primer za ovo,
07:51
if as a fetus you were exposed to a lot
of stress hormones through your mother,
of stress hormones through your mother,
165
459320
5016
ako ste kao fetus bili izloženi gomili
hormona stresa preko vaše majke,
hormona stresa preko vaše majke,
07:56
epigenetics is going to produce
your amygdala in adulthood
your amygdala in adulthood
166
464360
3416
epigenetika će da iznedri
da amigdala kad odrastete
da amigdala kad odrastete
07:59
as a more excitable form,
167
467800
1936
bude u nadraženijem obliku,
08:01
and you're going to have
elevated stress hormone levels.
elevated stress hormone levels.
168
469760
2640
i imaćete povišene nivoe hormona stresa.
08:04
But pushing even further back,
169
472960
1896
Ali idući još više unazad,
08:06
back to when you were just a fetus,
170
474880
1696
nazad do kad ste bili tek fetus,
08:08
back to when all you were
was a collection of genes.
was a collection of genes.
171
476600
2816
nazad kada ste bili zbirka gena.
08:11
Now, genes are really
important to all of this,
important to all of this,
172
479440
2376
Sad, geni su zaista važni za sve ovo,
08:13
but critically, genes don't
determine anything,
determine anything,
173
481840
2736
ali ključno je da geni
ne određuju bilo šta
ne određuju bilo šta
08:16
because genes work differently
in different environments.
in different environments.
174
484600
3640
jer geni različito deluju
u različitim sredinama.
u različitim sredinama.
08:20
Key example here:
175
488640
1256
Ovde imamo ključni primer:
08:21
there's a variant of a gene called MAO-A,
176
489920
3136
imamo varijantu gena pod nazivom MAO-A,
08:25
and if you have that variant,
177
493080
1656
a ako imate tu varijantu,
08:26
you are far more likely
to commit antisocial violence
to commit antisocial violence
178
494760
4656
skloniji ste izvršenju
asocijalnog nasilja,
asocijalnog nasilja,
08:31
if, and only if,
you were abused as a child.
you were abused as a child.
179
499440
3976
ako, i samo ako,
ste zlostavljani kao dete.
ste zlostavljani kao dete.
08:35
Genes and environment interact,
180
503440
2376
Geni i okolina interaguju
08:37
and what's happening in that one second
before you pull that trigger
before you pull that trigger
181
505840
3616
i ono što se dešava u toj sekundi
pre nego što pritisnete obarač
pre nego što pritisnete obarač
08:41
reflects your lifetime
of those gene-environment interactions.
of those gene-environment interactions.
182
509480
4240
odražava životni vek
interakcije između gena i okoline.
interakcije između gena i okoline.
08:46
Now, remarkably enough,
we've got to push even further back now,
we've got to push even further back now,
183
514679
3617
Sad, još je neverovatnije,
moramo da se vratimo još dalje unazad,
moramo da se vratimo još dalje unazad,
08:50
back centuries.
184
518320
1376
vekovima unazad.
08:51
What were your ancestors up to.
185
519720
2336
Čime su se zanimali vaši preci.
08:54
And if, for example,
they were nomadic pastoralists,
they were nomadic pastoralists,
186
522080
3176
A ako su, na primer,
bili nomadski stočari,
bili nomadski stočari,
08:57
they were pastoralists,
187
525280
1256
bili su stočari,
08:58
people living in deserts or grasslands
188
526560
2576
ljudi koji su živeli
u pustinjama ili na pašnjacima
u pustinjama ili na pašnjacima
09:01
with their herds of camels, cows, goats,
189
529160
2656
sa svojim stadom kamila, krava, koza,
09:03
odds are they would have invented
what's called a culture of honor
what's called a culture of honor
190
531840
4056
sve su prilike da su izmislili
nešto što se naziva kulturom časti,
nešto što se naziva kulturom časti,
09:07
filled with warrior classes,
191
535920
2216
ispunjenom klasom ratnika,
09:10
retributive violence, clan vendettas,
192
538160
2696
osvetoljubivog nasilja,
klanskih krvnih osveta
klanskih krvnih osveta
09:12
and amazingly, centuries later,
193
540880
2256
i, neverovatno, vekovima kasnije,
09:15
that would still be influencing
the values with which you were raised.
the values with which you were raised.
194
543160
3680
to bi i dalje uticalo
na vrednosti na kojima ste vaspitani.
na vrednosti na kojima ste vaspitani.
09:19
But we've got to push even further back,
195
547800
2136
Ali moramo da se vratimo još dalje,
09:21
back millions of years,
196
549960
1736
milionima godina unazad
09:23
because if we're talking about genes,
197
551720
2056
jer ako govorimo o genima,
09:25
implicitly we're now talking
about the evolution of genes.
about the evolution of genes.
198
553800
3656
implicitno sad govorimo o evoluciji gena.
09:29
And what you see is, for example,
199
557480
2216
A ono što vidite, na primer,
09:31
patterns across different primate species.
200
559720
2496
su obrasci širom različitih vrsta primata.
09:34
Some of them have evolved
for extremely low levels of aggression,
for extremely low levels of aggression,
201
562240
4416
Neki su evoluirali da imaju
izuzetno niske nivoe agresivnosti,
izuzetno niske nivoe agresivnosti,
09:38
others have evolved
in the opposite direction,
in the opposite direction,
202
566680
2536
drugi su evoluirali u suprotnom smeru,
09:41
and floating there in between
by every measure are humans,
by every measure are humans,
203
569240
3896
a negde između, prema svim merenjima,
lebde ljudska bića,
lebde ljudska bića,
09:45
once again this confused,
barely defined species
barely defined species
204
573160
3896
opet, ova zbunjena, jedva definisana vrsta
09:49
that has all these potentials
to go one way or the other.
to go one way or the other.
205
577080
3240
koja ima sav potencijal
da ide u bilo kom smeru.
da ide u bilo kom smeru.
09:53
So what has this gotten us to?
206
581560
1816
Pa, dokle nas je ovo dovelo?
09:55
Basically, what we're seeing here is,
207
583400
1976
U suštini, ovde vidimo sledeće,
09:57
if you want to understand a behavior,
208
585400
1896
ako želite da razumete ponašanje,
09:59
whether it's an appalling one,
a wondrous one,
a wondrous one,
209
587320
2856
bilo da se radi
o užasavajućem ili čudesnom
o užasavajućem ili čudesnom
10:02
or confusedly in between,
210
590200
1736
ili zbunjujućem između,
10:03
if you want to understand that,
211
591960
1536
ako želite to da razumete,
10:05
you've got take into account
what happened a second before
what happened a second before
212
593520
3456
morate da uzmete u obzir
šta se desilo sekund ranije
šta se desilo sekund ranije
10:09
to a million years before,
213
597000
1456
do milionima godina ranije,
10:10
everything in between.
214
598480
1656
sve između toga.
Pa, šta možemo da zaključimo
u ovom trenutku?
u ovom trenutku?
10:12
So what can we conclude at this point?
215
600160
1976
10:14
Officially, it's complicated.
216
602160
2296
Zvanično, složeno je.
10:16
Wow, that's really helpful.
217
604480
1616
Ala je to od pomoći!
10:18
It's complicated,
218
606120
1256
Složeno je
10:19
and you'd better be
real careful, real cautious
real careful, real cautious
219
607400
3576
i bolje da budete oprezni,
krajnje obazrivi
krajnje obazrivi
10:23
before you conclude
you know what causes a behavior,
you know what causes a behavior,
220
611000
3336
pre nego što zaključite
da znate šta uzrokuje ponašanje,
da znate šta uzrokuje ponašanje,
10:26
especially if it's a behavior
you're judging harshly.
you're judging harshly.
221
614360
2760
naročito ako se radi o ponašanju
koje strogo osuđujete.
koje strogo osuđujete.
10:30
Now, to me, the single most important
point about all of this
point about all of this
222
618600
3976
Sad, meni je najvažnija svrha svega ovoga
10:34
is one having to do with change.
223
622600
2376
ona koja ima veze s promenom.
10:37
Every bit of biology I have mentioned here
can change in different circumstances.
can change in different circumstances.
224
625000
6376
Svaki deo biologije koji sam ovde pomenuo
može se izmeniti u različitim okolnostima.
može se izmeniti u različitim okolnostima.
10:43
For example, ecosystems change.
225
631400
2816
Na primer, ekosistemi se menjaju.
10:46
Thousands of years ago,
the Sahara was a lush grassland.
the Sahara was a lush grassland.
226
634240
4416
Hiljadama godina ranije,
Sahara je bila bujan pašnjak.
Sahara je bila bujan pašnjak.
10:50
Cultures change.
227
638680
1616
Kulture se menjaju.
10:52
In the 17th century, the most terrifying
people in Europe were the Swedes,
people in Europe were the Swedes,
228
640320
4336
U XVII veku su najstrašniji ljudi
u Evropi bili Šveđani,
u Evropi bili Šveđani,
10:56
rampaging all over the place.
229
644680
1736
pustošili su svuda.
10:58
This is what the Swedish
military does now.
military does now.
230
646440
2176
Evo šta švedska vojska trenutno radi.
11:00
They haven't had a war in 200 years.
231
648640
1840
Nisu ratovali 200 godina.
11:03
Most importantly,
232
651280
1456
Najvažnije,
11:04
brains change.
233
652760
1616
mozgovi se menjaju.
11:06
Neurons grow new processes.
234
654400
2016
Neuroni razvijaju nove procese.
11:08
Circuits disconnect.
235
656440
1456
Sinapse se prekidaju.
11:09
Everything in the brain changes,
236
657920
1656
Sve se u mozgu menja,
11:11
and out of this come extraordinary
examples of human change.
examples of human change.
237
659600
5200
i iz ovoga prozilaze neverovatni
primeri ljudske promene.
primeri ljudske promene.
11:17
First one:
238
665400
1616
Prvi primer:
11:19
this is a man named John Newton,
239
667040
1696
ovo je čovek po imenu Džon Njutn,
11:20
a British theologian
240
668760
1336
britanski teolog
11:22
who played a central role in the abolition
of slavery from the British Empire
of slavery from the British Empire
241
670120
4736
koji je odigrao ključnu ulogu u ukidanju
ropstva od strane Britanskog carstva
ropstva od strane Britanskog carstva
11:26
in the early 1800s.
242
674880
2016
ranih 1800-ih.
11:28
And amazingly, this man
spent decades as a younger man
spent decades as a younger man
243
676920
4736
I začuđujuće, ovaj čovek
je proveo decenije kao mlađi čovek
je proveo decenije kao mlađi čovek
11:33
as the captain of a slave ship,
244
681680
2136
kao kapetan na brodu robova,
11:35
and then as an investor in slavery,
245
683840
2936
a potom kao investitor u robovlasništvo,
11:38
growing rich from this.
246
686800
2136
bogateći se time.
11:40
And then something changed.
247
688960
2656
A potom se nešto promenilo.
11:43
Something changed in him,
248
691640
1536
U njemu se nešto promenilo,
11:45
something that Newton himself celebrated
in the thing that he's most famous for,
in the thing that he's most famous for,
249
693200
5256
nešto što je sam Njutn proslavio
u onome po čemu je najčuveniji,
u onome po čemu je najčuveniji,
11:50
a hymn that he wrote:
250
698480
1616
himni koju je napisao:
11:52
"Amazing Grace."
251
700120
1400
"Prekrasna milost".
11:55
This is a man named Zenji Abe
on the morning of December 6, 1941,
on the morning of December 6, 1941,
252
703040
4896
Ovo je čovek po imenu Zenđi Abe
u jutro 6. decembra 1941,
u jutro 6. decembra 1941,
11:59
about to lead a squadron of Japanese
bombers to attack Pearl Harbor.
bombers to attack Pearl Harbor.
253
707960
4976
sprema se da predvodi japansku bombašku
eskadrilu u napadu na Perl Harbor.
eskadrilu u napadu na Perl Harbor.
12:04
And this is the same man
50 years later to the day
50 years later to the day
254
712960
3536
A ovo je isti taj čovek
50 godina nakon tog dana,
50 godina nakon tog dana,
12:08
hugging a man who survived
the attack on the ground.
the attack on the ground.
255
716520
3576
grli čoveka koji je preživeo napad na tlu.
12:12
And as an old man,
256
720120
1416
A kao starac,
12:13
Zenji Abe came to a collection
of Pearl Harbor survivors
of Pearl Harbor survivors
257
721560
4416
Zenđi Abe je došao na skup
preživelih iz Perl Harbora,
preživelih iz Perl Harbora,
12:18
at a ceremony there
258
726000
1416
na njihovu ceremoniju
12:19
and in halting English apologized
for what he had done as a young man.
for what he had done as a young man.
259
727440
4320
i na kolebljivom engleskom se izvinio
za ono što je uradio kao mladić.
za ono što je uradio kao mladić.
12:24
Now, it doesn't always require decades.
260
732760
1896
Sad, nisu uvek potrebne decenije.
12:26
Sometimes, extraordinary change
could happen in just hours.
could happen in just hours.
261
734680
3696
Ponekad izvanredna promena
može da se desi za svega nekoliko sati.
može da se desi za svega nekoliko sati.
12:30
Consider the World War I
Christmas truce of 1914.
Christmas truce of 1914.
262
738400
4376
Setite se Prvog svetskog rata
i Božićnog primirja iz 1914.
i Božićnog primirja iz 1914.
12:34
The powers that be
had negotiated a brief truce
had negotiated a brief truce
263
742800
3136
Tadašnje sile su se dogovorile
o kratkom primirju
o kratkom primirju
12:37
so that soldiers could go out,
264
745960
1616
kako bi vojnici mogli da izađu,
12:39
collect bodies from no-man's-land
in between the trench lines.
in between the trench lines.
265
747600
3896
sakupe tela iz ničije zemlje,
između redova rovova.
između redova rovova.
12:43
And soon British and German soldiers
266
751520
2936
I uskoro su britanski i nemački vojnici
12:46
were doing that,
267
754480
1456
počeli to da rade,
12:47
and then helping each other carry bodies,
268
755960
2456
a potom su pomagali
jedni drugima da nose tela,
jedni drugima da nose tela,
12:50
and then helping each other
dig graves in the frozen ground,
dig graves in the frozen ground,
269
758440
3656
a potom su međusobno pomagali
u kopanju grobova u smrzloj zemlji,
u kopanju grobova u smrzloj zemlji,
a potom su se zajedno molili,
12:54
and then praying together,
270
762120
1256
12:55
and then having Christmas together
and exchanging gifts,
and exchanging gifts,
271
763400
2816
a potom su slavili Božić zajedno
i razmenili su poklone,
i razmenili su poklone,
12:58
and by the next day,
they were playing soccer together
they were playing soccer together
272
766240
3216
a već sledećeg dana
su zajedno igrali fudbal
su zajedno igrali fudbal
13:01
and exchanging addresses
so they could meet after the war.
so they could meet after the war.
273
769480
3376
i razmenjivali adrese
kako bi se sreli nakon rata.
kako bi se sreli nakon rata.
13:04
That truce kept going
until the officers had to arrive
until the officers had to arrive
274
772880
3976
Primirje se nastavilo
sve dok oficiri nisu morali da stignu
sve dok oficiri nisu morali da stignu
13:08
and said, "We will shoot you
275
776880
1496
i kažu: "Upucaćemo vas,
13:10
unless you go back
to trying to kill each other."
to trying to kill each other."
276
778400
2496
ako se ne vratite međusobnom ubijanju."
13:12
And all it took here was hours
277
780920
2136
A ovde su jedino sati bili u pitanju
13:15
for these men to develop
a completely new category of "us,"
a completely new category of "us,"
278
783080
4336
da bi ovi muškarci razvili
novu kategoriju "nas",
novu kategoriju "nas",
13:19
all of us in the trenches here
279
787440
1896
svi mi u ovim rovovima,
13:21
on both sides, dying for no damn reason,
280
789360
2776
na obe strane, umiremo
bez ikakvog prokletog razloga,
bez ikakvog prokletog razloga,
13:24
and who is a "them,"
those faceless powers behind the lines
those faceless powers behind the lines
281
792160
3656
i ko su "oni",
ta bezlična sila iz pozadine
ta bezlična sila iz pozadine
13:27
who were using them as pawns.
282
795840
1600
koja ih koristi kao pione.
13:30
And sometimes,
change can occur in seconds.
change can occur in seconds.
283
798680
3200
A ponekad se promena desi
za nekoliko sekundi.
za nekoliko sekundi.
13:34
Probably the most horrifying event
in the Vietnam War
in the Vietnam War
284
802720
3336
Verovatno je najužasniji događaj
u Vijetnamskom ratu
u Vijetnamskom ratu
13:38
was the My Lai Massacre.
285
806080
1896
bio Masakr u Mi Laju.
13:40
A brigade of American soldiers
286
808000
2016
Brigada američkih vojnika
13:42
went into an undefended
village full of civilians
village full of civilians
287
810040
3016
je ušla u nebranjeno selo puno civila
13:45
and killed between 350 and 500 of them,
288
813080
3536
i ubila između 350 i 500 Vijetnamaca,
13:48
mass-raped women and children,
289
816640
2856
masovno su silovali žene i decu,
13:51
mutilated bodies.
290
819520
1576
kasapili su tela.
13:53
It was appalling.
291
821120
1216
Bilo je užasno.
13:54
It was appalling because it occurred,
because the government denied it,
because the government denied it,
292
822360
4256
Bilo je užasno zato što se desilo,
zato što je vlada to poricala
zato što je vlada to poricala
13:58
because the US government eventually
did nothing more than a slap on the wrist,
did nothing more than a slap on the wrist,
293
826640
4376
zato što je vlada SAD-a na kraju
samo blago kaznila prestupnike
samo blago kaznila prestupnike
14:03
and appalling because it almost certainly
was not a singular event.
was not a singular event.
294
831040
4256
i užasno zato što gotovo izvesno
ovo nije bio izolovan događaj.
ovo nije bio izolovan događaj.
14:07
This man, Hugh Thompson, this is the man
who stopped the My Lai Massacre.
who stopped the My Lai Massacre.
295
835320
5096
Ovaj čovek, Hju Tompson, ovo je čovek
koji je zaustavio Masakr u Mi Laju.
koji je zaustavio Masakr u Mi Laju.
14:12
He was piloting a helicopter gunship,
296
840440
2616
Pilotirao je helikopterom
koji je nosio municiju,
koji je nosio municiju,
14:15
landed there, got out
297
843080
1816
sleteo je tamo, izašao
14:16
and saw American soldiers shooting babies,
298
844920
3056
i video američke vojnike
kako pucaju u bebe,
kako pucaju u bebe,
14:20
shooting old women,
299
848000
1376
pucaju u starice,
14:21
figured out what was going on,
300
849400
1896
shvatio je o čemu se radi,
14:23
and he then took his helicopter
301
851320
2096
a potom je uzeo helikopter
14:25
and did something that undid
his lifetime of conditioning
his lifetime of conditioning
302
853440
3976
i uradio je nešto što je izbrisalo
njegovo celoživotno uslovljavanje
njegovo celoživotno uslovljavanje
14:29
as to who is an "us" and who is a "them."
303
857440
2056
u smislu ko smo "mi", a ko su "oni".
14:31
He landed his helicopter
304
859520
1856
Sleteo je helikopterom
14:33
in between some surviving villagers
and American soldiers
and American soldiers
305
861400
3616
između nekolicine preživelih seljana
i američkih vojnika
i američkih vojnika
14:37
and he trained his machine guns
on his fellow Americans,
on his fellow Americans,
306
865040
3656
i naciljao je svoje mitraljeze
u svoju braću Amerikance
u svoju braću Amerikance
14:40
and said, "If you don't stop the killing,
I will mow you down."
I will mow you down."
307
868720
3880
i rekao: "Ako ne prekinete s ubijanjem,
sve ću da vas pokosim."
sve ću da vas pokosim."
14:46
Now, these people
are no more special than any of us.
are no more special than any of us.
308
874560
2976
Sad, ovi ljudi nisu nešto posebno
u odnosu na bilo kog od nas.
u odnosu na bilo kog od nas.
14:49
Same neurons, same neurochemicals,
309
877560
2576
Isti neuroni, iste neurohemikalije,
14:52
same biology.
310
880160
1320
ista biologija.
14:54
What we're left with here
is this inevitable cliche:
is this inevitable cliche:
311
882400
3376
Ovde nam preostaje
samo taj neizbežni kliše:
samo taj neizbežni kliše:
14:57
"Those who don't study history
are destined to repeat it."
are destined to repeat it."
312
885800
2736
"Oni koji ne izučavaju istoriju,
osuđeni su da je ponove."
osuđeni su da je ponove."
15:00
What we have here is the opposite of it.
313
888560
2176
Ovde imamo suprotno tome.
15:02
Those who don't study the history
of extraordinary human change,
of extraordinary human change,
314
890760
4256
Oni koji ne izučavaju istoriju
neverovatnih ljudskih promena,
neverovatnih ljudskih promena,
15:07
those who don't study the biology
of what can transform us
of what can transform us
315
895040
3536
oni koji ne izučavaju biologiju
onoga što može da nas preoblikuje
onoga što može da nas preoblikuje
15:10
from our worst to our best behaviors,
316
898600
2496
od najgoreg do najboljeg ponašanja,
15:13
those who don't do this
are destined not to be able
are destined not to be able
317
901120
3056
oni koji to ne urade
su osuđeni da ne budu u stanju
su osuđeni da ne budu u stanju
15:16
to repeat these incandescent,
magnificent moments.
magnificent moments.
318
904200
3880
da ponove ove prosvetljujuće,
veličanstvene trenutke.
veličanstvene trenutke.
15:20
So thank you.
319
908480
1200
Zato, hvala vam.
15:22
(Applause)
320
910040
4080
(Aplauz)
15:32
CA: Talks that really give you
a new mental model about something,
a new mental model about something,
321
920040
3496
KA: Govori koji vam zaista pružaju
novi mentalni model o nečemu,
novi mentalni model o nečemu,
15:35
those are some of my favorite TED Talks,
322
923560
1936
to su mi među omiljenim TED govorima,
15:37
and we just got one.
323
925520
1720
a upravo smo čuli takav.
15:39
Robert, thank you so much for that.
Good luck with the book.
Good luck with the book.
324
927960
2856
Roberte, mnogo ti hvala za to.
Srećno s knjigom.
Srećno s knjigom.
15:42
That was amazing,
325
930840
1256
Ovo je bilo prekrasno
15:44
and we're going to try and get you
to come here in person one year.
to come here in person one year.
326
932120
3176
i pokušaćemo da te ubedimo
da jedne godine lično budeš tu.
da jedne godine lično budeš tu.
15:47
Thank you so much.
327
935320
1216
Mnogo ti hvala.
15:48
RS: Thank you. Thank you all.
328
936560
1480
RS: Hvala vam. Hvala vam svima.
ABOUT THE SPEAKER
Robert Sapolsky - Neuroscientist, primatologist, writerRobert Sapolsky is one of the leading neuroscientists in the world, studying stress in primates (including humans).
Why you should listen
We all have some measure of stress, and Robert Sapolsky explores its causes as well as its effects on our bodies (his lab was among the first to document the damage that stress can do to our hippocampus). In his research, he follows a population of wild baboons in Kenya, who experience stress very similarly to the way humans do. By measuring hormone levels and stress-related diseases in each primate, he determines their relative stress, looking for patterns in personality and social behavior that might contribute. These exercises have given Sapolsky amazing insight into all primate social behavior, including our own.
He has been called "one of the best scientist-writers of our time" by Oliver Sacks. Sapolsky has produced, in addition to numerous scientific papers, books for broader audiences, including A Primate’s Memoir: A Neuroscientist’s Unconventional Life Among the Baboons, Why Zebras Don’t Get Ulcers: Stress Disease and Coping, and The Trouble with Testosterone.
His latest book, Behave: The Biology of Humans at Our Best and Worst, examines human behavior in search of an answer to the question: Why do we do the things we do?
Robert Sapolsky | Speaker | TED.com